Zevachim 80

We've all learned Kish, maybe even thought we understood. But now with his trademark depth and clarity and his signature uptempo daffomi style, Repsuri Bournestein uncovers the layers beneath the words, revealing a world of meaning, relevance, and beauty in every line. Where the deraim of the bass medish meets pushup shot. Discover the shear that's redefining how people learn Kumish. Reprly Bournestein's Kumishar. Find it on the Lakewood Dafyomi app or wherever this shear is being heard. Today's is and we are at the 10 lines from the bottom of today's being learned. So we're moving along in the ethic of continuing to discuss we are meets specifically where the dam of a carbon was with something that's not to be put on the so this part of the discussion began with the Mishna on the bottom of the Mishna over there discussed Dam that was with D that was with D that was with the D of the D of that was D that was with and D that was with the different is some is whenever it comes to au of dam which is not something that people eat and something else. There's an idea that you don't go a but rather you go a so really either way is going to continue on this theme again discussing different where was with other in the event that of a carbon that was aim was with of that were bal says the it doesn't matter what the proportion is between the damos and the dam is always going to be that you pour it down the meaning you send it out in the drain in the this is not that you're allowed to put on the now it's interesting that it's that in the there was a very similar case. So the obvious question is how come you don't have over here that's at first glance it would seem that it should be if you remember held that was with the last two cases of the Mishna where it was and in both cases and in both cases says says, "No, it's cautious to put on the because said that the reason didn't say, but rather it set it apart is one case and says is the second case is because is really only on the second case. He's not on the first case. So really at first glance the fact that is not mentioned in this Mishna that's giving an example of Damash that was within a very specific example where would seem to support I saw the on this he says and how come the ones the right before this Mishna when it debated the between didn't say this Mishna that seems to be a case of and it says without any mention of that would seem to be a tremendous a little bit of a terrorist iron. Either way, moving along a similar case. What would be if but not rather meaning it's not that the dams became one dam where they're actually mixed with each other but rather the coen had a few kis of dam and he can't remember which kis what says the mission in the event that of the kis were good kis and there was one kis that was not good then karis In the event that one of these coes already, one of them is that you can be of all the other even if the would go and he would put macro already all the with the exception of one that one you still have to be concerned maybe is going to be from the you're going to have to pour it in the soar in the case where it was meaning there's one bad and a bunch of goodis as long as one of them was already put on the which you weren't supposed to do but as long as one was ready put on the at that point you're allowed to go and be of all the reason is because holds that we have a right to be that want that one who's not on the was the say that you have no right to be have no right to be but even if all of them are already wet on the with the exception of one you have to assume that Maybe that one that's remaining is the bad one. And as a result, that one is. Now, if this is the sound familiar, it should be. It's because we had a Mishna that was almost an identical argued this point not regarding not where the but rather regarding a where the different were. It's the same exact say even if there's only one remaining you have to assume that it's a bad one. In fact, the very first that we're going to learn the Gmorra is going to ask that it seems that this is redundant. If I had it already on why do I need it again here on another what would be so we know that there were certain dams that went mean and there were certain dams that went. So just as an example When you're learning the parag, you know, it reverses itself. But just to keep it simple, is an example of a carbon that goes is an example of a carbon that goes. So what would be if the meaning of an with the that is supposed to go meaning the rebel says you're allowed to take from this and you're allowed to do I when you do inevitably you're taking and you're putting is not supposed to go I have a right to view the dam of the as if it's so I'm spritzing a little bit of water, meaning I'm spritzing ditzing that has a den that it's supposed to go. But in this situation where I'm stuck, I have a right to say that and like this it's going to be okay. Afterwards, as afterwards, you're going to go and you're going to put the so like this, you'll end up doing and you're going to end up doing the mat. So just two things. First of all, this idea of who's the one talking in the mission of this is also this is where we had almost the identical case albeit not with but with and what happens if so could you do a could you not do an and it's even more complicated because over there you're running into a of stating that rebel held that you have a right to put on. So it's the same rebel and the truth is just like Rashi explained that it works with you have you have to put it not you have to put it here too you're going to have and you're going to put it and also just like the spoke out that we're only being on this okay it's the same over here that's the first obvious that Rashi speaks out here that's very that if you look carefully at Rebel's rebel said when you have this dam that was so meaning you can't just put all the because you're putting the hold you could do such a thing that's how it's going to work then says when he said he didn't say that I'm putting And says the reason is very it's because what are you putting now? So for that you don't need a why would you need the for the damas? It's not true because once you put the you already did the once you do the now you have anoid of belongs. So Rashi says it's very that when you're going there you need a because how you putting but when you're going you actually don't need that's and even now that's the but either way that's only the is not something that's going to be okay let's say nobody asked any shas and they went ahead and they did Then everybody's going to be ask so you ended up being it's going to be another not the case. So now we're talking about again that's the theme of the but over here the is not amongst that are supposed to be put on different parts of the but that had have a different minion. So we know that not all carbonas were created equally as it relates to this and also a lot of just technical in terms of the basic laws of how is took place but as it relates to our Mishna is talking about that required and that required. So it says the gives examples going that's also so they were mixed up. So what do you do? It's very simple. So what you do is you do one and if you do one you're going to be let's say you had two each one that requires and they were so what's the example over here? says so they're both because they both require of fame but they're both so here too is very simple you know what would be if you have a that's a that's a this is and I believe in the world of between andua this is one of the more famous ones says What you should do is you should do foru says no in a situation like this you do what toldu how could you go ahead and do a matanas with a carbon that's a that one carbon whose dam requires a matan if you're going to do a mat well it's going to come out that you say in the not right you can't put one parish in the instead Therefore, I shouldn't be able to do it with a carbon that requires four and according to you it's better that it's true. is a concept of balt is only if it's meaning if I have the dam of a carbon that's and I decide to be instead of doing what I do for so that's going to be told him well is only when it's added to that he said when you went ahead and you did a meaning on the one that requires well you and that's bad because you did a however you would do a then you would it was done without a and that's this is that involves a versus an is that doesn't involve a miser what's exhibit A for that malus you get malus so you don't get malus throughout Right. There's so many between Yeshua. To me, if you're going to go ahead and try to rank versus Baltigra, the only ranking I can come up with is that it's better to do Baltigra than Maltto because if you're always doing a Misa, Baltigra, you're not doing a miser. Either way, there's so much to unpack over here. We're going to dive right into the Gara. So the Mishna said that in the event that it was naros. So there was one of a carbon that was a balas that was nar with carbon that were kosher and now all of a sudden we don't know what now the case is where the co went and he did a with one of the kises. So one of the kis already out of the equation. Now what says in that situation was you could call itis because at this point we could assume that the one that you did this with was the bad one whatever you have left are good ones and as a result it's going to be okay is always going to be said that what that once you do one now the only time it's Okay. Is if at least right now when you're going to take from theis you're going to do two at a time. But one at a time not what's the is because if you're doing one at a time if you're doing two well you know one of them for sure is good because there was only one bad one and that you have a good for the good one. So then it's going to somehow along the one that's a bad one as well. Now if this Sounds familiar because we had the identical comment that said it's the same. the same rebels on when we were talking about but as by the way sounds familiar because this was an identical that the only difference is over there was here but regardless even if all of them were already put on the all the except for one that one that's not on the you have to put on the what's the it sounds like only according to that last one would be but a coin would be okay. I thought you said he called him by his name. Let me explain this to you. You want to know what means means one. If there was only one left over, it wouldn't be good according to and it wouldn't be good according to either. What the saying is that even if there was one zoo left over, it would be okay. And that's what is going to be like because according to if there would be one in that situation then would be okay. Incidentally there's I think two ways you could read this because that's his name. Let me explain it to you or that's also his name. Not sure what the right way is but either way he says that we have here this is with the same comment of in two places regarding regarding the need. So the says the answer to that lies in the fundamental difference between the role of the of the role of the of course and I only had on regarding I would maybe it's only says over there there was for sure where did the mixup happen it happened by so mock to say that being that the carbon was already brought back. So now we're ready. We're going to allow you to go and just fear and just finish the job even though you're doing the right thing. But when it comes to a mix up with I never had a to use this to give me a maybe it's not okay. Okay. So if you want to tell me the biggest tell me that's true but I had only had I would have told maybe the only because you don't have the carbon but when it comes to where I already brought the carbon I already got the for that reason I need with regards to that's the with regards to the that's The Mishna ones on midday's exhale. So now the gumar is going to pivot. The garra is going to begin its pivot with a tanh aishna over there. Where's there? It's always somewhere else over here. And this that's mentioned in this Mishna in the Hassim that the Gmorra is about to introduce is really something that's not related at first glance to anything that we're talking about right now. Stating that as we're going to see the Gmorra is going to do a very very deep dive discussion of this. It's a dive that's going to take us to the end of today's daf and really through the first part of tomorrow's daf. And in that discussion, the primary mak the primary comparable to what is going on is going to be the sug that we're learning right now where it was nar of all the different. So first we're going to have to take a little bit of a step back. We're going to have to be introduced to a completely different then will tie it all together. So the Mishna as we said is in the ninth par this shouldn't come as a shak. It deals with the laws of specifically the laws of the so we're somewhat familiar with they would burn it at the end of everything take the ashes and mix it together with and then spritz the water onto the person that was up to so the had a jug and inside the jug there was a little bit of water fell fell into the says that in this case what the should do is when he spritzes on the person that's he shouldn't do one which is usually enough but in this case he should do two being that there's water so now there's a so it's not enough to just go ahead and do one in this case you do two say the minute a little bit of water falls in the whole thing is going to be possible now obviously you have to know what exactly is the shil why would say albe it two and why according to just because a little bit of water fell in all of the whole thing is knocked out. I mean at first glance it sounds like this is related to right there's a lot of things you would think you need to understand before we have a good handle on this and the is really going to work through all of it says the like this I understand in fact the is going to say that the is predicated on three we have to come additionally the hold and number three and hold number one. Number two, number three. So what do these three things mean? Means that in the event you have a like in this case, a little bit of may just regular water mixed up with the we assume that every drop of water that you have in this tar is going to have a little bit of both. That's the mitz. So we don't say that the drop of water is in the southwestern corner of this. No, it got completely intermingled so that this little bit of water just made a roim on every single drop of matas that you have. Now what percentage of the taras is going to be the water? Whatever the ratio is between the water and the matas. So it could be it's going to be a lot, could be it's going to be a little depends on how much was there in the and how much water fell in. But the point is anytime water mixes to together with or really anytime two things that mix together the assumption is they're completely intermingled as opposed to where we assume that they're not necessarily intermingled which would mean that if I took a little bit of this it's very possible all I got was water or it's very possible that all I got was so the first says the is the rabb. We'll explain in a second. The second you have to assume is that whole there's a share of haz. What's the share? So presumably it's the would take whatever you use to be maza. He would dip it into the water do a haha. That is the shah. And if you're going to go ahead and do a hah and you're going to be lacking a little bit in the amount of that you need for the shah then it's going to be a pos. And finally they start from you can't go ahead and two two and say that the two together are going to combine they're going to give me the if you understand these three says you understand how so every single time you're going to do you're going to have a little bit of if you can have a little bit of inevitably you're going to be missing from the share because every little bit of may you have takes away from the theas now if a didn't require a share who cares but being and now it's lacking. Okay, go ahead and do two. Well, that's not going to be an option either. So, because they hold that's why there's no way to make this work. So, the says I understand it's very posh. I mean, it's not but once you know these three then it's very what does he hold and the does all the math for us. are if holds a let's just uh use every possibility as being open for discussion right so let's say with regards to the first let's say holds well if holds that would explain why you can't be with one right because maybe that one is 100% May but then why by the second is it going to be okay maybe the second was also Maybe they were both mine. Okay, must be there's no choice. You have to say hold because again if it's then there's no reason two should automatically be enough. So must be hold doesn't require. Why would you need to means you're for sure going to have and if you're going to tell me that there's no okay I for sure have a little bit of so let it be okay. You have to say right that meaning it has to be that he holds because otherwise why are two is enough and it has to be that he has because otherwise one should be enough. So for sure now what was the last open discussion then why enough he show like the that was the so if was saying and he also then he's the so how could he hold that two are going to be enough you'll tell me he also holds, right? So he holds he holds but he holds. So being that he holds, oh, so now it's good. Now I understand why if you do a second, it's going to be fine. But the says even with the second a maybe she need a third a maybe she need a fifth a. I mean what should you depend on? It should depend on the ratio between the water and the says it should work with two. So the says I understand the rabon must hold and check check everything is going to work. But what does reba hold? He has to hold because otherwise why are two is enough? He has to hold that because otherwise one a should be enough. So he holds and he holds well if he holds then it should be possible like the in fact that is the and even if he holds the two should be enough. Maybe you should need more than that. So in the we understand it in we seem to be stuck over here and the is going to bring three from and respectively had to make sense had to make the of work says goes first like we thought like we thought. What was the problem? We got stuck. Then he shows and why if you do two is it enough maybe you should have to have three. The case is where was such where an equal amount of was or even to keep it more simple there was one share of may that was with one share of so like this if you go ahead and you do two you're going to be good because between the two you're going to end up getting the one share of meatas end up getting the one she share meas everything is going to be fine what was the problem. The problem was that if you hold and you hold then even if you hold but maybe you need three what we say it should be it should be totally in the proportions must be where the proportions were if it's by the time you do two then you know for sure it's going to be okay like we thought and really doesn't require a share. Now, if haz doesn't require a shar, what was the kasha? Then you should be able to do just one haz that should be enough. That's good because that means that every single haz that you're going to do is going to have a little bit of in it. It's going to also have a little bit of m, but it's going to have a little bit of meat. The problem was that if then who says you have the share? So we assumed that uh right then if then why do you have to do a second just do one that was the problem must be says if that's the case why do you have to do two it's only and it makes sense make such because concern was a very very right it was a and we're worried that A person might take his matas add a little bit of water and like this he just got twice the amount of so to prevent that from happening we say if a little bit of may is even though based on the everything should play itself out the same way but because of it's not going to be fine but according to we have to hold a is the third said that that holds if you take a look at Rashi Rashi says that that really the what exactly is was very very mish so it's dropped confusing and Rashi says that's a good thing it means you're holding because the gears is really a little bit mish but the way we have it in theashi says that really that really according to rebel. So what's the cash if according to rebel then why is it that two in of itself is going to be enough. So Rashi adds that you have to say that it's talking about where the amount of water that fell in was a very very little amount of water. So the minute you go ahead and the minute you do two at that point we know for sure that you knocked it out and like this everything is going to be okay. And the truth is that was the if you go back to the so it sounds already like it was a little bit of water that's always soashi is going to tell you the mission is actually like me because the says that it was a little bit of why do we say it was a little bit of because that is the way to understand the being that there was a little bit of may so therefore if I do two everything is going to be okay and again according to the rebel is even more positive. He holds a law. So if he holds then we never have to be worried that there's necessarily a taruist. Now that could go to your benefit. It can go against you. Right? The assumption was if you hold maybe even even if I do 10 it's not going to be okay. Well again that depends on the ratios. It depends on the proportions. According to Raashi the ratio the proportion is such where there was a little bit of may which is actually the was a little bit of may. So it's for that reason it's for that reason that the is that once you do a second everything is going to be okay. So again the case is talking about where somebody had and there was in the a little bit of fell going to it's game over there's nothing you can do with this anymore is finished there is something you can do two not one not three two you do two everything's going to be fine at first glance the said the raon is very very obvious theanita must be predicated on three number one thean hold number Number two, hold number three. So every you're going to do is going to have a little bit of also hold which is a proper which means that every you're going to do is not going to have the proper and they all start from you can't do two to make it work. One plus one will not equal two. So if it's for that reason you're going to be out. But the coin anywhere you go it doesn't seem to add up. And the garb came out this three mahwish raashi said the rebel holds rebza also holds that sh. So according to we assume in every there's going to be a little bit of whatever is in the he also holds that but whereas the holds what's the even if he holds maybe you should have to do multiple but if you want to know what is this is what we have to zero in for as the prelude now to the next part of holds and was the second said that holds butzah holds and being that he holds that's why That's why even one should be enough. So for sure you have a little bit of this anyways. If that's the case, why do you have to do two? But if you want to know what the is and it's by the way it doesn't matter from it's not applicable. It's na right. It's a moot point because anyways it's never going to be negiashi came with a blitz raashi said that really is and being ashita is so really every time you do you do you have to be concerned that maybe you got nothing but here's the good news like there was only a culture of mayan and being that all there was was a culture of mayan so it's for that reason as long as you do a second, it's going to be okay. I'll do two. Either I got it right the first time or I got it right the second time. And just to be clear, this has nothing to do with could tell you. That's not the point. The point is I for sure got a proper the first time or I for sure got it the second time. You know why? Cuz he so either the first one was and the second one was meas and the second one was or maybe they were both meatas. That's even better. But the bottom line is as long as I do a second one. So then I know that even on that the first one was regular I know for sure the next one was going to be okay. So again what exactly holds in the world of it depends on the threeash specifically specifically as it relates to the sh of because that's really the part of the is going to get into right now as it relates to that is very very Now if this sounds familiar because we had it already. So said that according to that holds that in the event that there's a between you two and everything is going to be okay. So rebues a little bit of is always and the reason is because it's clear that the of is that ain't it's clear that that's a and a and you're a h that is and apostle and that's the of rebel who holds that if you to it's going to be okay. The just wants one line from what Rebi said and that is that rebi understood the rebel holds that haz is kashir. Now according to rebel held he just held was the one that said that according to it's and certainly who holds then you could hold that but it's a rebi that rebi learned up in that sheet is and if that's the case it's a me on which it's a me on the sheet of that's the first second kasha says the gar is the Tanya, we learned in a Bryce. Now this Tanya, this Bryce that the Gomorra is about to bring is what's going to bring us right back to the clutch part of the now it's going to sound a little bit like the Gumar is asking from not a Tanya Tan. In fact, not only any from the Gumar sounds like it's going to loop us into our now, but really the right gear from the Gumra is it's a it's a that's eerily similar eerily similar to the Mishna. And this is going to take us now to the of now you're going to ask me how are we going to go now from the sug of specifically the to the specifically the answer is very simple because if you remember in the Mishna we're going to have a brace that's going to those talk about where different dams were and exactly how you're supposed to treat the of all these dams that were right a lot of rebels are in these last But here's the point. It could be that this should be told you whether you hold whether you hold might make a very very big and that is exactly where the is going with this right now. So says, "We learned in that such as what you should do is you should do the so we know we look at and like this is going to be fun. What's the cash? If you're going to tell me that if now who said that holds that was the third that's talking to if you're going to tell me that is that then why is it going to be okay if you go ahead now and you do maybe when you went ahead and you did this it could be there was no dam that even went there could be all you got was meaning If so then for sure when you went ahead and you did the law you got it right you put I also put good that is it's going to be okay but if you're going to tell me that is that so when you go ahead and you do the maybe all you got was and if that's the case you didn't get any so it's going to have to make the it's going to have to say that it's talking about the case is talking about where most of the dam was really. And when he went ahead and he did the first, there was enough dam to cover all the amount of dam that there could have been. So let's say there was an ounce of dam. You put an ounce and a half of dam. So even if the full ounce of dam is there, but you anyways got the half ounce of damas. So that you for sure got the share of the included that's why we know but the Garra says what did the Mishna say? The Mishna said that that if after you went ahead and you put the dam you then went and you put the dam. So just like you were now you were also cash is what does it mean? It means that you were the d that's supposed to go which is supposed to go ma it's supposed to go. Now if you hold and you're talking about where you put the sheer plus so could be you put everything ready which means there's no anymore. So now again if you hold it's very good you always got a little and you always got a little could you do it or not you could but at the end of the day you did everything you're supposed to do you checked off all the boxes like this if you're going to tell me that is that so if that's the case you always have to be concerned maybe now the made to get out of why I'm not worried with that concern and The reason is because it's talking about where you put the full sheer plus. Okay. So that means for sure you got but when you now go maybe you didn't get any and it's in that what does sound like it means it sounds like it means that when you went says no says when it says it doesn't mean that for sure you got you're going to have to go bring another to the extent that you know what it means it means is which is supposed to go that's from the what would be in the event if the went and he took this again it was and instead of putting first you went and you went first so is if he was and he didn't ask any meaning you should have asked the but if you didn't ask anybody says after you went you can go ahead and you can go again the same that the is going to be what's the is that why do we assume when you went and you put that it's for sure okay and now it's even we should be concerned that maybe you went and You put the same so you have nothing to worry about. We know you got it right because for sure you put a little bit of everything a little bit of everything. But if you're going to tell me that is that in so why then is it that we're going to assume that it's all going to be okay going to be okay. But the gamarra says but this case was a little bit different because in this case first you put the then you went right if first you went the question is why are you maybe the only thing that you put was the and you just made it worse because you basically just told me that maybe it's talking about was so for sure if you hold it's that I didn't get any so says in this case how it work just to write highlight the difference between the two cases. In the first case you went and then you went. So we said when you went for and then when you was how do you know you were when you went maybe you only said the was and you added a little on top of that. know for sure even if all of the amount of oil was there but you got anyways more than that I mean that you anyways got more than that it's like this you know for sure that you're going to be like this everything is going to be okay but according to the next case you went first and then you went and is making that it's talking about where what there was more than the question is that why would you be The when you went we should assume that maybe it was meaning is good for when you afterwards go when you afterwards go I understand why you were but the is how were you how were you so says a little bit of a says that even when we say doesn't mean you're going to be what it means is if after you go you go again that next is going to be and that's how you're going to be because it's impossible it's impossible to say that if I go a little bit and I go a little bit I'm for sure going to be that's impossible you're going to have to pick and choose you're going to make an akima one of them was a lot more than the other I'm going to get that one right now the reason the world's picking the it's making is because it's in the that The the only way that can work is is if you got the right that's the and then the would if you made the in the reverse where there was more than there was so that would be good and how the would be but in terms of how you would get the that's already not something that would work either way the says even though at first glance it would seem to be to understand but at the end of the day there's no rea could really be a the way Raashi understood it. Stating that stating that we're going to make a in terms of how to understand as it relates to where all the dinners are. So we're stopping over here in the middle of the suga really goes knee deep into tomorrow's daf in tomorrow's we will begin with a little bit of an introduction which will also serve as a recap for today's but just where we're in holding in the world right now the to the of the day which is where a very interesting is where the with regular and what emerges is that there seems to be a discussion in whether holds or and that's a very foundational principle that would have tentacles in other areas of shas specifically our area in where you have the inside of if you hold every mat that you put on the is going to have a little and a little bit of oil if you hold they always have to be concerned that maybe the maton that I'm putting is only an oil did a lot of talking in the which would then make it a very relevant and probably shed a tremendous amount of light in terms of what rebashita really was. We started this will be