Zevachim 44

Today's daf is working daf mem daled and we will begin 10 lines from the top of daf mem daled on the amud. So, the Mishnah on the bottom of daf mem days amud bais until daf mem gimmel amud daled continue to discuss the halachos of piggul. And the Mishnah said he is soreid and that is the only time somebody is chayav kares if he eats from a korban that a kohen had a machshavah of chutz l'zmaneh while he was doing one of the avodos is if the thing that he ate has a matter. So, if the thing that the person ate was something that was once assur and avodah of some sort took place that was mattered then the halacha is he's going to be chayav kares. If however somebody eats a cheilek of a korban piggul but it's a cheilek of the korban that had no matter the halacha is he's not going to be chayav kares. So, for example basar of a korban has a matter. Before the zrikah you now let me eat the basar. For that reason if somebody eats a k'zayis basar of a korban piggul he's going to be chayav kares. The dam of a korban doesn't have a matter. Nothing has to happen to be mattered the dam on the mizbei'ach. There's a sayder. You don't do zrikah until you do shchitah, kabbalah, and holacha but there's no matter per se and as a result if somebody would eat dam of a korban piggul he wouldn't be chayav kares. Regardless the Mishnah went into some detail to discuss the halacha and the Gemara is now going to bring a very very long-winded braisa that essentially is just an elaboration of what the Mishnah already said. Tonu Rabbanan oy einoy mayvi el kayotzei b'shlamim. We know that the halacha of piggul is mentioned in the Torah twice. At both times the Torah mentions halacha of piggul it says it regarding the korban shlamim. So, since the braisa begins with oy einoy the would have been a chiddush to think that the only time there is a halacha of piggul is if the korban that the kohen was doing or was being makriv while he had the machshavah of chutz l'zmaneh is is doimeh to shlamim. How it's a carbon whose boss it could be eaten for two days and a night. The is that there's piggle naturally in the Bible and I had you know that if the carbon is not it's natural only the that there to do a piggle it says mid Tsar. I would like to know if I could have that person in the piggle and we learn from there kosher any carbon who has meat that's eaten any carbon has a look of it that's natural is included in the piggle says the English in what about a carbon that's cool that wasn't natural at all. How do you know that an oiler to a subject of the laws of piggle Tom Boy it says that the Tsar is marble anything that's natural is marble even that's not natural and I would say it's not. How about an and a that's completely not like a and how do I know even the salmon and how do I know even the salmon is going to discuss later in great detail that's the salmon that the used to bring when he did his how do you know that if there was a piggle done in the of the tire of the again elaborate this on this a little bit later that how do you know then if somebody would eat a little bit of that salmon. You would be Tom and it says that in the partial of so on the partial of carbon Tom there's an idea of which is marble that any of the carbon that's Tom if somebody eats he's going to be kind of nicer Tom and there's a shovel between nicer and Tom once I know nicer from Tom I can learn piggle from nicer bottom line is is that even though at first glance there would have been a have a minute to think that the only time there's a lot of pigel is if the carbon that's being brought was dum ya the shlamim, but if it's not dum ya the shlamim, maybe not. Stating that, we have ribui after ribui after ribui, the psak, and then it says zevach asher he makdishim by tumah, I learn nicer from tumah and pigel from nicer to teach me that everything is included, that any chelek of a carbon is technically shiyach to the laws of pigel. Says the braisa that the rabbeim called over and shlamim. So if everything is included, why did the Torah say it by shlamim? It must be coming to teach me something. Kaim locha it is teaching me something. Mash shlamim yuchad sheish matirin, bein adam bein adam bein mizbei'ach, af kol sheish matirin, bein adam bein adam bein mizbei'ach. Just like the basar of a shlamim, which is what the Torah focuses on when it mentions the halacha of pigel, is a davar she'yeish lo matirin, it has a matter. The basar is made up of two parts, it's made up of the chelek that was nachal and the chelek that went legavaya. The chelek that was nachal was asur bachilo until his zrika. The chelek that went legavaya, that's the imurim that you would make out of the misach ketara with, was asur bachaktara until you did his zrika. So it has matirin, his zrika is matter all the basar. Some of it will adam and some of it lemizbei'ach. But the bottom line is, dum ya the shlamim, just like a shlamim, all the basar has matirin, it's only there that chayavin alayim mishum pigel, so too we learn that every time a carbon is dum ya the shlamim, af kol she'yeish lo matirin, bein adam bein adam bein mizbei'ach, chayavin alayim mishum pigel. And then the braisa continues and gives examples. Oila adam amatas basar lemizbei'ach, oila his zrika dam amatas basar lemizbei'ach. Thus, the basar of an oila has matirin. Va'oil kayanim is also matter, va'oil kayanim. At first glance it would seem then that if somebody would eat the oil of an oila, there too he would be chayav kares. Stating that, the shnayim say that's not true, because oil is any oil achila. I mean that oil is any oil achila. So vad if you would eat the oil of an oila, you wouldn't be chayav kares. We're just giving oil as an another example of a yesh le matirin. Oil is It possible also goes on the and it needs the of the in order for it to be able to go on the way. Bottom line is the bottom line is anything that has a yesh le matirin is going to be subject to the laws of pigul. What's excluded? The mission already mentioned all these things. The minchas kainam and minchas kainam mashiach and minchas nesachim and dam. So that's a list of parts of a korban where if somebody would eat a of it after a pigul took place, he would not be kores. Again, we're discussing the kores for eating a of a korban pigul. Not discussing the pigul now. We're discussing after the pigul took place, it was how pigul on this korban. Now if somebody eats a of it, he's kores. What part of the korban? A part of the korban that has materium. Whether it's materium whether it's materium I don't care about that. It has to be materium. But if it's a of a korban that has no materium such as kainam and kores and kainam and mashiach and nesachim and dam. Over there, it's not going to be pigul. How do I know that? I know that because the Torah mentioned the of pigul by so it has to be just like the of a has materium some of it has that's for the Adam. Some of it has that's for the so too the bottom line is has a different way. From the bottom line. says the Torah mentioned the pigul by not just to teach me of materium. To teach me something much more fundamental. Much more CD and that just like the was brought in the and the was done in the way. So too the only time there's pigul is if it's a carbon that was brought in the misbe'ah achitzon as opposed to what? Yotzei pare min ha'aretz, the si'ur min ha'aretz, the ein olah min ha'aretz achitzon k'shlamim ein chayav an olah mishum pigel. So all the chatas and mincha'os are going to be excluded according to Rav Shimon from the halachos of pigel. This is Rav Shimon's shitah that's mentioned throughout shas. It comes from the Mishnah on daf mem gimmel amud aleph. It's this braisa right here that Rav Shimon holds that dumi d'shlamim teaches me not just the detail but a very important you say this thing halacha that davka korbanos that were brought in the misbe'ah achitzon not korbanos that were brought in the misbe'ah p'nimi. Oh my my, the braisa began with a hava mina. So the braisa said that maybe the Torah mentioned the halachos of pigel by shlamim they'd be mokem to think that the only time there's a halacha of pigel is if the carbon is similar to shlamim and then the Gemara brought drasha after drasha after drasha so to teach me not that way. Says the Gemara, "K'yeitzei b'shlamim mai in hu?" In the hava mina of the Gemara that the Gemara thought that the only carbon that's included is something similar to shlamim. What's similar to shlamim? Says the Gemara, "B'chor and ne'echeles l'shnei yamim v'lailah." The braisa said any carbon that's ne'echeles l'shnei yamim v'lailah. So for example, a b'chor. A b'chor is kodesh kodashim. It's ne'echeles l'shnei yamim v'lailah. So without all these drashos I would have said not only shlamim anything similar to shlamim anything like shlamim that's also ne'echeles l'shnei yamim v'lailah such as b'chor. But the Gemara says "B'mai osi?" How can I learn b'chor from shlamim? "Eilu b'mamotzinu v'eilu b'mamotzinu." Which is one of the yomim v'sh'tarim drashos that they could have learned from shlamim she'eintam donin smicha v'nisucha v'nisuchim v'truvas shlamim has a whole list of things that a b'chor doesn't have. If you remember from the very beginning of the maseches it's very hard to learn halachos from one carbon to another carbon. There's a hekeish, zeh istirah but it's very hard generally to learn with a mamotzinu because each carbon has its unique characteristics which suggests that from a mamotzinu perspective it's going to be very hard to learn something. Bottom line is it's very hard to learn b'chor from shlamim because shlamim has a lot of things that a [ __ ] doesn't have. So, I would think that [ __ ] that has a mitzvah of smicha [ __ ] that you had to bring the sakan together with it. There was a mitzvah of tanufas chazal and maybe there is a halacha pigul. Maybe not maybe achal and now I would learn it. I would learn it because it says in the parsha of pigul im achal ye achal. And therefore, achal and ye achal are two klals. Achal was a klal, anything you eat. Ye achal was another klal. And then the Torah says achal of [ __ ] So, [ __ ] is a prat. I would make a klal prat to klal. So, it's not mamatzinu. You're right. Mamatzinu has to be very, very similar. But when you have a klal prat to klal, it just has to be good enough prat. So, can't be learned out from [ __ ] with mamatzinu because [ __ ] has things that doesn't have. But if you want to learn it from a klal prat to klal, it's a much more liberal understanding. Meaning, ain prat that already would be enough. So, says the Gemara, the have a minah would have been to learn achal from [ __ ] Not from mamatzinu but from klal prat to klal. But the Gemara says is that a klal prat to klal how do you trade klal with smicha klal prat to klal is is self-explanatory. Klal, then you have a prat, then you have a klal. Here you have klal klal prat. Achal klal, ye achal klal, mitzvah of [ __ ] is a prat. Klal prat may not have a klal prat. Rabba says that this brice is going like they learned in Eretz Yisrael from Rabba that klal klal prat is treated like a klal prat. A klal bottom line is the have a minah would have been without all these drashas that not only [ __ ] but anything similar to [ __ ] What's similar to [ __ ] Achal. I would have thought achal should be learned out from [ __ ] with a klal prat to klal. Kamashma lon, basar and then zebach and then asher makdishin me noiser mitom pigul minoiser. But the bottom line is is that according to the Tanna Kamma the brice and the Tanna Kamma in our Mishnah anything is every single carbon not only do we just love him is included in the of prices continued and the prices said even the even that is going to have pickles. So really in order to to properly understand the next tomorrow we have to be a little bit familiar with the tires on the tire. So the when he completed his used to bring one of the that he brought was a carbon additionally there was that was brought. Some of the was brought as a there was actually an that was done with the some of the was eaten. So says the that if somebody would eat the after place that that being that has a so in that sense it's similar to the is he's going to be now first glance the understanding of the more is going to be that where was the pig or that took place with the it happened while the was bringing the so the was bringing the and while he was bringing the was doing the the he had in mind that the would be eaten in an improper way close to his mind. So that would be a classic example of where there was a pig or in the context of the being that the was but it required the or the of the in order to be able to eat it so the that's why it's going to be included but the says if this price is says that this pig or on the it must be now we had in the mission but the doesn't bring in the mission or the brings in a price but it's almost exactly what the mission says. The time of the price of the all of the pig or the very as I have now who argues with the common argument the reason I get because the common told that you're assuming that the has a is a double station material what was matter it the awesome that that if the light wasn't brought on the same day as the awesome it was okay meaning the awesome didn't have to be brought together with the you could bring the awesome today and you could bring the awesome You have 10 days to bring it if that's the case kind of the bottom there's no way that you could do a nice on Sunday and then something else on Wednesday and say that what you did on Sunday was matter what happened on Wednesday so from the fact that you could bring it on another day that's a riot that the awesome is not matter and being that the rule of thumb is that the only time you are chorus by your carbon people is if it's a double station material light doesn't have matter what would be the matter that from the fact that the two things don't have to happen simultaneously It could happen that's the right the mayor agrees the mayor agrees the mayor however holds that when they're brought together then the is matter so it's true if the brought separately in that case the is not being matter but they could have been brought together there's a mission to bring it together and if it was brought together over there would be matter so the bottom line is there's a big high government when the was brought together with the awesome And it was people a club of the that's the passion right now if somebody would eat a little bit of this would be course or not according to the mayor yeah the mayor says being that they're being brought together the awesome is matter that is it's a double station material this could be a clear of course according to the bottom line the bottom line is that being that they don't have to be brought together and when they're not brought together the awesome is not matter to so even when they're they brought together we don't look at the awesome is being matter to the way it's shaming. Thus it's a double shame in the matter. Remainder says I agree when they're not brought together. But when they're brought together now what is the price to say? The price is said actually matter to the way it's shaming so I'm saying that if the coin would eat or anybody would eat a way it's shaming so I'm saying that look at the way it's shaming so clearly we're going according to Remainder. It's talking about when they were brought together and it was a matter of pig or we look at the way it's shaming as a double shame in the matter. Thus you got to be happy. When the price of went through a whole list of things that are excluded from the way it's shaming it said in the way it's shaming in the house and so on and so forth. They had that. Now in mention in the way it's shaming so awesome in the way it's shaming and so on that only stems with the way it's shaming and so on. The time you do it in the price of in the way it's shaming and so on. The way it's shaming and so on in the way it's shaming and so on. The way it's shaming and so on in the way it's shaming and so on. The way it's shaming and so on. Remainder says the reason is is because the way it's shaming and so on only allowed to be poured on them is there after the time was brought. Meaning it's a double shame in the matter. On the way it's shaming and so on. Remainder and all the other maybe it's my own way and so on. On the way it's shaming and so on. You don't have to bring them together. On the way it's shaming and so on. Remainder said I hear I find the way it's shaming and so on. I hold this is true. I'll go upon them when they're brought together. Meaning the same exact this is all in the mission by the way. So if you're going to shaming and so on you know this already. The same exact way it's shaming that we have regarding the way it's shaming and so on. It's the same way it's shaming and so on. Remainder and we have regarding the way it's shaming and so on. The way it's shaming and so on was something that was brought together with the carbon. But it didn't have to be brought together with the carbon. We learn in the way it's shaming and so on. I feel in the way it's shaming and so on. I feel in the way it's shaming and so on. There too we have the same way it's shaming and so on. Remainder says that when the way it's shaming and so on were brought together with the carbon together is the carbon being matter to the way it's shaming when they're not brought together. True you can't do something on Sunday and be matter to something else that's been done on Wednesday. The way it's shaming and so on. It's not going to be matter. The way it's shaming and so on doesn't make sense to look at it that way. Once you see that the way it's shaming and so on don't need the matter of the carbon in order to be poured on the way it's shaming even when they're brought together there's way to look at it as is as if they're not being mattered. I'll go part in the same exact shilo when the nisachim were brought together with the carbon. According to our mayor, the nisachim are looked at as a davar she yesh bo matirin. Thus, it's subject to the laws of pigul. Whereas according to rabbonon, being that they don't have to be brought together, even when they're brought together, we don't look at it as a davar she yesh bo matirin. So the same machlokes is whether there's pigul by lechem shamem usoya is whether there's pigul by nisachim. According to our mayor, in both cases, yeah, when they're brought together. According to the chachamim, never, even when they're brought together. But the problem is the braisa, cuz the braisa says lechem shamem usoya there is pigul, and nisachim there's no pigul. And what is the shaka? Is the braisa our mayor or the braisa our rabbonon? Reisha our mayor, seifa our rabbonon. That's the chul what's coming out. Cuz the reisha says lechem shamem usoya, yeah, obviously because I got them when they're being brought together. The seifa says nisachim not, it's mashma even when they're brought together not. Why? Probably because we're going according to rabbonon. So how do you make that work? Our rebbi Yosef, rebbi Yosef heard this exchange, and rebbi Yosef said I'm going to be rebbi. You want to know who the owner of the mishna is? The owner of the mishna is not our mayor, it's not our rabbonon, it's rebbi. Our mayor who holds like lechem shamem usoya matanosav shari lei. Umid dematanosav shari lei, matanosav mefas. It's going according to rebbi that holds that until the matanos were done with the actual lechem shamem usoya, it was assur to eat the lechem shamem usoya. And if somebody would eat the lechem shamem usoya, he would be over the issur me'ila. So being that you see that what's matter the issur me'ila of the lechem shamem usoya, now I need to get my is the matanos shemen. So too as it relates to pigul, we're going to view the matanos shemen as if they are matter the lechem shamem usoya, so that the lechem shamem usoya is vaiter going to be a davar she yesh bo matirin. Meaning, until now we understood that the reason lechem shamem usoya is a davar she yesh bo matirin, or is maybe a is maybe a double chesh of material is because the double was matter. That's really totally It's true according to It's not true according to the and even according to it's only true if they're being brought together. Rabbi has a new patent. Rabbi says there's another shape of the shape of Rabbi Rabbi and Rabbi was discussing after it was a piggle he was discussing the laws of and Rabbi said that there's an issue of in the salmon even after you brought the carbon ocean even after you did this until you macro the owners of the material that was done with the salmon itself. He said it was an avoida that was done with the salmon. So until you do that avoida there's still going to be an issue of kindness of Rabbi if the of the salmon take off the issue of so it's mash matter because by definition before you did the salmon it was awesome it was an issue of and now that you did the salmon it became water. Now there's no issue of anymore. So you see that the salmon are matter. So kindness of Rabbi you want to know why it's piggle by salmon not because we're going according to Rabbi. We're going according to the and that's why the mission said there's no there's no piggle by the mission because being that you can bring it on different days that's a riot that the carbon is not matter the mission and from that standpoint it's clear the time of the price is going to hold that the ocean was a matter of I think piggle. If there's piggle by salmon that's what the ratio of the price is said. That's a clear riot that the salmon has a matter has a matter. You know what the matter is? Not the it's the salmon and it's going according to Rabbi. Who is this Rabbi the tiny salmon use of music women and women the issue of on the salmon is true up until this week. Once you do this week there's no That's the past Rabbi enters Rabbi and he says no wait actually eating there's an issue of until you do the salmon. It's the salmon that takes off the shabbos by the way also by the matzah shabbos. Everyone agrees that it's going to be also until you do everything. But as it relates to the it's that's totally the matzah shabbos. So again, if the matzah shabbos is what takes off the then what? Then the matzah shabbos is the matter. If the matzah shabbos is the matter, it comes out to like is vital not because of Rav That's why there's no cuz the whole price is really the it's not but because of the Rav you heard this of Rav and he commented. He said I can't believe a like Rav is the and the end of this this is what he had to say. I really like and it's true this is Rav who said until when there's an with the but this is only if the was brought together with the but as we've mentioned they didn't have to be brought together. They could have been brought on different days. In the event that they were brought on different days, everybody agrees that there's an until you do the matzah shabbos. The only sad that the goes off the with this of the if they're being brought together. But if one is being brought on Sunday and one is being brought on Wednesday, then everybody agrees there's still an on the up until you do the matzah shabbos. Which means based on Rav methodology, if if the if the is not being brought together with the carbon, everybody should agree that this of the shabbos. But what's the the is the the price is that even Rav who said in our even Rav who holds that the has it's only when it's brought together cuz the is matter. But if it's not brought together not there's no far the world to say that the madness chamber is not the kosher. So said how could such a mistake the madness chamber was not the everybody else is no see in that case there's no way that the being not the I don't know what I'm going to say I find the lawyer magnet even though it's only true it's so what do you see from there that you can't look at the other than that they were brought together with the chamber if that's the case what's the duration of the prices says this is everybody the same as there's no under the that were brought together with the carbon if we're going to go into a mayor who holds that even though the two things didn't have to be brought together but when they're brought together we look at one as being not the other the there should be side by the and side by the and if we're going to go into that hold that being that they don't have to be brought together that's a right even when they're brought together one is not being not the other that's only matter it's not and that's why there's no then there should be no by the the price of picks the and the abundance in the safe says the of who knocked out said I'll tell you my own but the whole price is the easiest answer take the word the easiest answer take the word out of the safe of the price of price of never said doesn't have really there is by the that the first time that is going to be by the I'm going to buy you a buy you a like the sound no you don't start making noise words from braces. That's not the It's a rather the killer between the ratio and the safe is the tunnel like a boy in my ocean for a dinner in the second a bomb in a second. You have to add words meaning don't erase words, add words. Just add a little commentary that you could do. The breath ratio that mentions like a boy in my ocean, we have to add a little commentary. What's the commentary? That's the boy in my second. And then you know if it's boy in my second who I did in the second but the tunnel in the second and then braces says in the second a bomb in front of me at the moment. That's the key word. The word in my ocean in front of me at the moment. In other words, the killer between the ratio and the safe is not like Shem and Shell mid-century and the second. The killer is is a boy in my second or is a boy in front of me at the moment. We're going according to our mayor. So, if it's the boy in my second, it's going to be pigel. In the ratio, it was discussed boy in my second. The safe was discussing where it was boy in front of me at the moment. And that concludes the really hard part of the day. The rest is just a little hard. Right. There's something in the matter. This is a dumb matter as the sort of the kind of the price of the mission mentioned as an example of something that's a double gesture matter. Have to say if the flesh of the kind of the sort of the kind of the right eat. The kind of the sort of the dumb matter is the sort of the kind of the dumb matter sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the matter we know really. How do you know that? And the matter is going to bring a price of a long price. One excerpt of the price is going to address this question. The attorney Levy Levy said Moses said in partial credit. Let's just read the partial. The say you have a lot of credit in the ocean in the ocean. So, Shem is talking to Aaron the kind of the kind of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the kind of the sort of the extra it's the rubbish something says the brightest lady said call carbon is the rubbish like sham and show material that the white sham and show material who got it the coyote and got it why would you think not if they get cotton why do you need a special review of call carbon so good I think I mean I would have thought me no itch I would have thought that the only time the coyote and I was like commander school now is if it's me no itch but being that the high love my cinnamon nation like sham and show material is not me no itch so I would have thought that maybe not come out that even though it's sham and show material home and costume and the plastic says home and costume that's the rubbish not an ordinary min home and ordinary min home we know the coyote gets it's the rubbish min home I mean home and costume two specific types of min homes the min homes that was the carbon that was not the two had a show that was brought on the Zion Nissan first day home and min homes is the min home that the site that used to break so those two min homes that the coyote gets is a dish and I need a special plastic in the title of home and costume to tell me they get it why is it a dish why would you think otherwise I mean I would have thought the home and costume that's the plastic that describes the mix for a home and costume the plastic that we talked a lot about show is not the home and costume so I would have thought that the only time the coyote and I was like in cotton is if it's related to copper if the carbon is is a but min homes but min homes is not my copper it's my copper the ratio it's coming to be matter that's for her you couldn't eat hard dish until the min homes I was brought home and costume and why did the site to bring her carbon it was also not my copper it's not to be my copper for the king in the stereo it's the home and costume to be my varied to tell us did you do the other did you not do the other so being that these things are not related to copper so they don't fit so well with the home and costume so so good I think I would have thought that there's no mix to give it to the coyote and come out with a whole of rubbish that's what we need the whole of my love That the coin gets to eat both of the even from the hottest life. What's the so good that I mean I would have thought I would have thought that why is it available because had it the coin killed the hottest life not with the miracle now a coin or an ordinary person you make chicken and the does miracle it's going to be in a veil it's a that the way that the shape so to speak was done with the in the base of was I think but the bottom line is we know that there was no you would have thought no one maybe it should be treated as an available commercial one that the coins already eat it the coin gets a show awesome why would you think it's different so good that I would have thought those things too they're not coming to be coming the Nazarite brought a carbon was this expiration when did the Nazarite bring a carbon he became in order for him to start counting his the zeros again he had to bring carbon one of the carbon bonus that he brought was a carbon so that you say that the that the Nazarite brought was to be matter him the minute he has zeros again it was so loud and to start doing this is zeros the Nazarite brought his carbon to be matter him to eat but awesome Nazarite and awesome again are both not even though awesome is usually but these are examples of awesome that's not it's so you would have thought it's not included in the commercial but the commercial says awesome Nazarite I don't know awesome Nazarite awesome but it's possible that the coin gets it awesome Nazarite awesome not awesome Nazarite and awesome but rather awesome Nazarite kill awesome awesome what's that coming to teach me that it's coming to teach me that the coin gets the gear dies and somebody stole from him partial Gazelle he has no there's no craving who are you supposed to give it to the coin gets who the coin has a in these things giving me the issue with it like bottom line is is that one detail that we needed was is that the mission of the price dimension as double how do you know that double is okay? How do you need a special person? Why do you need a special person? Because you would have thought that being that is Malika. So maybe the coin is not in it because maybe it's the way of maybe no one's allowed to eat it. That even though the way that was killed was Malika. The Malika blinds like a in and it's okay. It's not treated as an available the coins already I'll tell you something interesting. I'll says that I'll say that why was it that uh was brought Malika and not Schita. And if you think about it from a Gothic standpoint from a standpoint, it's actually a fascinating idea because Schita we know is Schita Malika was Malika is Schita bizarre. Malika is a full fledged that means that when an brought a carbon, his carbon required only three of the Schita itself wasn't a real Schita day. When an brought a carbon who else brought the was the dollars some of that couldn't afford to bring a regular carbon. So his carbon seemed to have more his carbon already needed Malika. It had to be done and says it's because really and it's he says the walks into the walks into the it's it's hard for him sometimes to humble himself even while he's bringing a carbon. But an he comes and being that the thought is as there's more laid with the carbon of the then there is in the carbon of the it's for that reason his carbon is considered more his carbon is Malika. It's not enough to do a he actually needs a a real Malika. I was thinking the says in that all carbon mincha all are Kadashim. So when it comes to a regular some are catching some are catching and then which is catching and then you have which is catching and then all men are not like each other. Says the you know why because who brought a and only was he says the of the from the HOW MUCH HEARTS THE PERSON is putting into the says an only comes in front of he comes his carbon is always going to be catching The yes sometimes yes sometimes not but the carbon is going to be called just one other interesting thing we mentioned gets carried just to mention the the that is the it's in it's in brother common he says it always bothered him he to he know is the says he only thinks the was from the of from this concept that if somebody steals from the and the dies there's no you know who to give it to Give it to the what do you mean there's no why doesn't he have you should have from somewhere the says very simple because it's like as soon as he was he's a new person he loses his entire relationship with his father and his mother and the and the and the anymore so if he started his own family and but if he didn't start his own family he doesn't HAVE SO IT'S POSSIBLE for there to be a person with the fact that the said that goes the it's from this right here I should bring this from the says he says he never understood he has a different the you know we spoken a lot but they either way a real festive that really is going to lend itself to a lot a lot of people bigger The So the we had and Sheeth is of the Sheeth that we have to be very familiar with as we go through say the culture and that is that although there's a lot of people being that the Torah wrote the partial people by carbon [ __ ] and the [ __ ] was born in the Misbech Chitzon the only time you have people is if you were mefagel in a carbon that was born in the Misbech Chitzon. If however somebody is mefagel in a carbon that was born in the Misbech Pnimi you don't have the halachas of people. Some would argue the Chacham said true the Torah said it by [ __ ] and it has to be done with the [ __ ] that is done with the [ __ ] and the material but it doesn't have to be done with the [ __ ] that has to be in the Misbech Chitzon. That means you go with the Chacham. If a Cohen was bringing one of the Chataos Pnimios and he had a Machsheves Pigul it's going to be Pigul. Stating that Rabba Lo Azar said in the name of Rabbi Azar Agrippa that it's not always true. There are times where Chataos Pnimios you could be mefagel but there are also times where you can't be mefagel in Chataos Pnimios. How so? Pigul Bedavar Hanaseh Bachutz Pigul Bedavar Hanaseh Lifnim Lo Yikatz. Hoyo Omed Bachutz if the Cohen was standing Bachutz meaning outside of the Heichal the Omed and he said already Shochech Lo Hazeh Midameh Lo Macher and he had in mind to do the Hazah in the Heichal Chutz L'Zmano Lo Pigul. That's not going to be Pigul. She Machshevo Bachutz Bedavar Hanaseh Lifnim Lo Pigul cuz even though he was standing outside of the Heichal but his Machshevo was to do something in the Heichal Chutz L'Zmano and if the Machshevo was to do something Lifnim that's a Megareya in Machsheves Pigul. Hoyo Omed Lifnim what about in the reverse if he was standing inside the Heichal he was doing this Zriko Lo Omed and he said already Mazal Manasech Temunah Vilishbech Shirain V'Ocher and he had in mind to do an Avodah Bachutz Chutz L'Zmano Lo Pigul. That's also not Pigul. She Machshevo Lifnim cuz if being that he was inside Bedavar Hanaseh Bachutz even though he had in mind the subject of the Machshevo was an Avodah Bachutz it's Hoyo Omed Bachutz if he was standing outside of the Heichal Lo Omed and he said already Shochech Lo Hazeh Shirain V'Ocher Lo Achto Temunah Lo Macher Pigul. In that case it's going to be Pigul because he's standing outside of the Heichal and his Machshevo is to do something outside of the Heichal She Machshevo Bachutz Bedavar Hanaseh Bachutz and over there it's going to be Pigul. What does this all mean? What this means is that even the carbon is not the entire avoida was done inside the it was the that was done in the and the up until the market that was done in the the wasn't done in the the wasn't done in the the wasn't done in the that wasn't in the the wasn't done in the that wasn't in the so there was a carbon that was done in the but there was a carbon that wasn't done in the come to and should have been even though it's true that this pig according to the even though it's but it's only going to be true with the that was done but not outside of the outside of the meaning not and only if you to do something but outside of the so for example the was doing the of the carbon in the and he had a mind to be in the that's cuz he's doing something but is in the it's from the and he has a mind to do which is also from the that's if however he was doing the which is in the he's standing and he has a mind to do or if he was doing the and he had a mind to do the but both of which are technically pig but being that he's either or the was that's a the is there's going to be no pig I'm not sure if I'm right or wrong my car how do you know this cuz it says regarding the which is one of the carbon is you you should have done the then when you do the you should be the same that you by meaning just like the Torah outlines what exactly they are so to when it comes to this it's the same thing says the those words are extra you know why it's extra says cuz if you go through the of the Torah says exactly what they are so why do I need after the Torah already told me what they are to tell me oh it's the same as the schlammen, know what they Torah says what they are and can match it up with the schlammen, I'll know it's the same as the schlammen. There's nothing being learned out from schlammen. So no, there is something. Not you my son Joseph by the schlammen. Obviously the avoid that the coin was doing while he had big. And the subject of the was all goods. There was nothing cuz the schlammen has no of it that was brought in the hey ho. As part of actually voice of my son is big and even though it's true the abundant argument of schimmen you could have a big old by the of it has to be my son that was done by and the subject of the has to also be something that was done by over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of that said that even according to the comment that it but only if he was standing and he was being without doing that avoid the so it's the over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of OVER OF OVER OF OVER OF OVER of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over said that if that's the case which we should skip the whole thing and right we've been going about so we'd be there AGAIN WHY WE CUT the whole THING IS TECHNICALLY OVER OF over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of over of in the in the spirit of learning the subject, you want to know that that's the halacha. So, the Gemara says that Rava told him, "I understand, Abaye. Abaye coming in halacha means it's halacha l'maaseh. But, dafka paskening in halacha means we can learn in the halacha is to keep us scared, close to the Torah like we learn etc. etc. But, halacha l'maaseh halacha l'maaseh means halacha l'maaseh coming in halacha l'maaseh that it's in the stance of of the Brisker Rav. They bring that the Brisker Rav was very very bothered with this Gemara. The Gemara says that why is it necessary to tell me halacha with regards to pigul? Their Rambam sheet is in perek vav halacha bet hamikdash that even though it's only in the kitchen of the like kitchen of the like that's only with regards to the like kitchen of the like but it relates to the like kitchen of the like bet hamikdash it's the like kitchen of the like kitchen of the like with also love and the Rambam says my cream alpha p shame base. The halacha is you can bring a carbon in his mind as that even if there's no bet hamikdash. So, it means if somebody would go today on the Har Habayit, he would build a mizbeach, he would be able to bring a carbon. My cream alpha p shame base. So, they asked the Brisker Rav, "Why does the Gemara say that it's the like kitchen of the like kitchen of the like kitchen of the like alpha p shame base?" And the Brisker Rav said a beautiful thing. In the stance of they bring it but I saw Rav Dovid in the room, he says in the like kitchen of the like kitchen of the like beautiful. He says it's true. The Rambam sheet is my cream alpha p shame base. You can bring a carbon technically even though there's no bet hamikdash. But, this halacha that Rav Lazer said in the like kitchen of the like was a halacha specifically with regards to the like kitchen of the like we're discussing how you can have a pigul when it comes to the like kitchen of the like Now, there were five types of the like kitchen of the like the par the the par and the like kitchen of the like things already. Said the Brisker Rav, "All five of these carbons are not shiyach b'zman hazeh. The par kohen mashiach, if you remember from Seder Olam Rabbah, is brought if the kohen gadol that was mashuach b'shemen hamishchah didn't have a very good shiyich. There's no shemen hamishchah and there's not going to be shemen hamishchah until mashiach comes. So, it's not possible b'zman hazeh to go bring the par kohen mashiach. The par ha'elem davar shel tzibur is when rov of Klal Yisrael doesn't have a very good shiyich al pi shigegas Torah, but they rov the Beis Din Hagadol. In order to have the Beis Din Hagadol, you need musmachim shmiya u'piya going back to Moshe Rabbeinu. We don't have musmachim. And being that we don't have musmachim, it's for that reason it's not possible to have a par ha'elem davar shel tzibur. The same is true for the se'ir avodah zarah. The se'ir avodah zarah was brought when the par ha'elem davar shel tzibur was brought in the event that it was avodah zarah. By the way, by the way, Rav Dovid said that all three of these carbonos, the par kohen mashiach, the par ha'elem davar shel tzibur, and the se'ir avodah zarah were also all carbonos yachid or carbonos tzibur. Ein hazman kavua. And any korban ein hazman kavua, the halachah is you can't be mevi b'tumah. We're all tumes and we're going to be tumes until we have the parah adumah, which isn't going to happen until mashiach comes. So, by the these three carbonos are not shiyach to bring b'zman hazeh. The other two, the chamishah chatos u'p'nimiyos, whether it's the par Yom HaKippurim and the se'ir l'Azazel, those were carbonos tzibur. For those, you can't have the halachah of tumah d'chuyah b'tzibur like the Rambam paskens, tumah d'chuyah b'tzibur. But, those carbonos were brought in Yom Kippur. Who did the avodah in Yom Kippur? The kohen gadol did the avodah in Yom Kippur. Now, it's true, you could be a kohen gadol without the shemen hamishchah. You could be a kohen gadol that's mu'av u'gadol. But, the Mishnah says in Sanhedrin that Beis Din Hagadol ein mamidin kohen gadol ela al pi Beis Din shel 71. The only way you can have a kohen gadol is if you have the Beis Din Hagadol. And being that we don't have the Beis Din Hagadol, cuz we don't have musmachim, so these five carbonos are not shiyach. But, the Brisker Rav g'zak "Ani ch'nami, it's true makrivin avodah b'Sheini Bayis, avodas chatos u'p'nimiyos." And And the halachah that Rav Elozar said b'shem Rav Meir b'Rebbi Meir was halachah l'ma'aseh. that's why ordinarily if it was regarding but that's going to be so I just thought in the interest of a of a hashtag Sunday style bath just to talk about something that that really will come up over and over and over again. It's a it's a something that we've referenced many times and over the really over the years but being that we're learning now it's to go through it and you know maybe piece by piece the will get to go through a little bit of the Indian. One of the themes of the raid since we started coming in was the and the idea of whether it would be theoretically hypothetically okay for a person to bring a carbon so as promised I think it's maybe just take a few steps backwards won't take that long and just to go through the Indian a little bit about the turmoil that took place in the 19th century as it relates to bringing as promised I think it's maybe The story begins with a whose name was was born in the city of was the of was born in the year 1795 and he passed away in the year 1874. When he was very young he learned by the he said the and he got a little older he left he went to and he became a of eager. The was born had this dream of having go to settle the land and maybe even bring and this is something that he wanted to do very very badly. And he started tumbling and writing and corresponding with the at the time and to see if he can try to get them to garner support. It's like this this is something that he'd be able to do. Now, just one disclaimer. It's important to note that Kalischer wasn't the first person in Jewish history that made this tummel after Beis Hamikdash and tried bringing carbonas the most notable before Kalischer was in the times of the one of the French Tosafos that I think I would say and that was Paris. And Paris was one of the he was from Paris. He made he went there to Israel and his dream was to bring carbonas. He worked it out and he felt that this was something that he'd be able to do. And there was a safer called it was written by a year whose name was Parhi. That name may sound a little familiar. Parhi was the author of the safer of the and he chronicled his dream and the trials and tribulations and some of the nukudis of him trying to go and and bring a carbon several hundred hundred years later and this is he wrote a regarding what the had written about Paris's his vision and his dream to try to bring a carbon and in that he discussed a lot of the of whether or not you would be able to bring carbonas but it's important just to understand that even though is often quoted in this tummel and in this discussion but was decades before Kalischer was born. So tummel was not written related to the big tummel that happened in the 19th century but it was more of an abstract tummel that was written with regards to a piece of history and that is there was a year once who wrote about Paris who wanted to bring carbonas bizmanas and he just discussed did they ever bring carbonas after the carbon the event of that was the one of the rebates that we spoke about but the point is is that wasn't opining on this discussion. The discussion happened several several several decades after the of but either way of very much wanted to do this and he started corresponding with the now it's important to understand where was coming from. The reason he felt that he wanted to reinvigorate carbonas bizmanas there is because he felt that this was a very important step in the acid and he felt that is going to marry the when they go to and they make a to try to acting as if the is going to come and it's when we established the initial and we show how badly we want it that's going to be then eventually the the is going to come down the and then we're going to have the the base all over again and he proved from many sources really really early sources that this is the way the is going to happen just to mention a few. He quoted the in the how will we see the says the even the tell him and of quote because of course because of course I even the even the show the show is going to come from the even it's not coming from the it's going to come from the however listen to the show who is the even the even even the even brings the he's going to bring it through the even the even to go even the show just like the after the when they came back to the show and they rebuilt the second base show how did they rebuild the second base show the split the seed and split the way they rebuilt the second base show with Cyrus the Great Cyrus the who was the son of Ahasuerus and Esther, gave you the permission to go build a a second base hamikdash. The also says the The is going to come through the Achaemenid Empire that the lift is giving the guise of these big ministers and these very powerful people and he's going to give them the inspiration to give the Jews permission to go build the base hamikdash. So it says it's in the first Rashi that the way the is going to come is is by lobbying the powerful people in the world and we have to begin. This is what we This is our business. We have to make a business also and this is something that we have to do. Another one of the that Rashi quoted was the in his Rashi. It's on the It's on the It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the Rashi. It's on the of course of the base and the third base but the third base so you would think the third base it's going to I see the Adam is going to build so the is there a way this what the means when it says the official ruler with the same guns guide that Rome used to destroy the second base and they're going to be the ones that are going to rebuild the base so instead of Kalischer I have a I have a they said that the way the base is going to be built it's going to happen through all the government so we have to make our stablish let's get moving let's start lobbying and let's start doing what it is that we have to do and then he said and then he said that in fact that if you really want to bring out the point he said it's a the passage says the Russia and the Shama says this the Russia he's supposed to you should want to help him so the wait for right that's usually what we think the is going to show up it's sight and let's go do what we need to do the Russia you first do what you need to do afterwards it's a embarrassing since the Kalischer that I think this is what you're supposed to do so this is what Kalischer did he sat down and wrote a safer the name of the safer is and was made up of three parts the first part in was more the more the background to understand where he was coming from he felt that this was the right thing to do because ultimately this is going to bring the so what we need to do is we have to understand that the is going to come via not just but also stablish this is what he felt second part of this safer was he spoke about my love of Eretz Yisrael, that we have to understand what Eretz Yisrael is. And then the third part of the safer was that if we all go to Eretz Yisrael, we'll even be able to bring carbonas. And he said if we can bring carbonas, that's g'val. That's already taking it to another level. And this was something that he felt he can do. So Tvi Hirsch Kalischer writes the safer Tries Hashiin and he sends it to his rebbe, Rav Kivek. And Rav Kivek looked at it and Rav Kivek responded. And then Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer responded to Rav Kivek. And Rav Kivek responded back to Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer. We don't have all the responses, but we have a lot of it. It's printed in the Tries Hashiin and it's printed in the Chelek K of the Shalos Tshuvas Rav Kivek. But Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer didn't stop there. He sent it to the Chasam Sofer. He sent it to Rav Yaakov Ettlinger. The first siman in Shalos Tshuvas Binyan Tziyon that was written by the Baal Orach L'Ner Rav Yaakov Ettlinger, one of the great goanim of the 19th century, was written to Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer. It was on this topic, on this noise say. Is he right in his thought that it's possible to be able to bring bring carbonas b'zman hazeh. He wrote letters to the Machzios. He wrote letters to Rav Eliyahu Gutmacher. And really the whole Galicia and Hungary, everybody was talking, everybody was tumbling. This wasn't just let's bring carbonas. This was a movement. This was a shkofa. This was a whole different mindset. This was an idea of maybe the Yidden can go ahead and and can go to Eretz Yisrael. I discussed this tumble, more the historical aspect of it, with the rabbi historian Rabbi Dovid Katz. And he told me you just have to understand a little bit where Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer was coming from. He said at that time there was an unbelievable feeling of of nationalism in the world. Like the the patriots had just received the American Revolution, 1776. Ukraine said there were countries no one ever heard of that had just gained independence. And Rav Tvi Hirsch Kalischer believed everything's for Klal Yisrael. B'reishis b'shvil Torah, sh'b'reishis. B'shvil Yisrael, sh'b'reishis. So if there's such a ruach in the the right now of nationalism and of countries being able to leave their bondage and suddenly be free and be able to express themselves the way historically they have. Why shouldn't the Jews be able to do it? But more than that, it must be for the Yidden. What else is it for? For the French? It's for us. Of course that's what it's about. And he believed very very deeply that this is what this That's what motivated him. This is where he was coming from. And as a result, this was something that he wanted to do. So, I thought just to discuss the super high level rapid-fire bullet point style the some of the halachic issues that are pretty obvious. And I want to touch on the Sugyas that we've been learning as it relates to is it theoretically possible today to bring a carbon. So, the first issue is there's no base on mikdash. So, if there's no base on mikdash, how are you going to be able to bring carbonos? So, the answer to this question starts with a Gemara in Maseches Megillah. And it's really a Gemara in many places. But the Gemara says "Shamati she makrivin af al pi she ein bayis." There's a Mussak that you can bring carbonos even though there's no base on mikdash. Now, the truth is that Gemara says that that Memra of "Shamati she makrivin af al pi she ein bayis" is really totally an age-old Machlokes. One of the biggest Machlokes in the Shas. And that is Kdusha Rishona Kidesha Leshaita vekidesha Leshavoi or Kdusha Rishona Kidesha Leshaita velo Kidesha Leshavoi. Kdusha Shniya Kidesha Leshaita vekidesha Leshavoi or Kdusha Shniya Kidesha Leshaita velo Kidesha Leshavoi. When Yehoshua bin Nun conquered Eretz Yisrael to make it them all, he was mekadesh Eretz Yisrael. He was mekadesh Yerushalayim. He was mekadesh the Makom Hamikdash. Then the base on mikdash was destroyed. What happened to that Kdusha? Did it go away together with the Churban or it was Kidesha Leshaita and it was Kidesha Leshavoi? In the times of Ezra when the Yidden went to Eretz Yisrael for the second time, again they were mekadesh Eretz Yisrael. What happened to that Kdusha? Did that Kdusha go away or was it Kidesha Leshaita velo Kidesha Leshavoi? So, if you hold Kdusha Rishona Kidesha Leshaita vekidesha Leshavoi or Kdusha Shniya Kidesha Leshaita vekidesha Leshavoi, then theoretically even though there's no base hamikdash, but you have the kedusha of the base hamikdash. You don't need the walls of the base hamikdash. You need the kedusha of the base hamikdash. So, kedusha of Yerushalayim is kedusha kedusha I think kedusha can give and it'll be an answer. If you hold kedusha of like kedusha of Yerushalayim then it would be a problem. Okay, so what's the halacha? So, the first college said open up a Rambam. And the Rambam in Hilchos Beis Habechirah perek vov halacha tes vov halacha tes zayin one of the most famous Rambams in yad chazaka paskins that kedusha of Yerushalayim is kedusha of like kedusha of Yerushalayim. It still doesn't have kedusha nowadays. That's why there's no kedusha of Yerushalayim as going to Rambam as mana zeh. However, kedusha of Yerushalayim and the base hamikdash is different. That's kedusha of Yerushalayim. Why? The fear says the Rambam should kedusha of the base hamikdash of Yerushalayim with pnei hashchina. Because kedusha of Yerushalayim and the base hamikdash is because of the shchina. That's what gives it its kedusha. The shchina ain't batel. And they do it [ __ ] Hamelech. They only do it with Noach and with Ezra. They only do it through Bavel. They only do it with Koresh. And that's to do with the shchina. The shchina is there. You go to the place of our Rabbis today is the shchina. And if the shchina is there, then says the Rambam even though there's no kedusha of Eretz Yisrael, but kedusha of Yerushalayim and the base hamikdash there will be. The Raavad argues. The Raavad says I I Raavad say I disagree. There's no kedusha of Yerushalayim as mana zeh. And then the Rambam says then the Raavad says something that's been quoted where the Raavad says the fifa. I believe anichnas atar sham. If somebody would enter the Har Habayis today, even though he's tamei because he doesn't have the parah adumah, inevitably he's tamei and he'll be kores. He won't be chayav kores, but that's a whole 'nother conversation for a whole 'nother day. But I think this is enough for one But that's So, the center of Torah scholars are So, in the final analysis machlokes is Rambam Raavad. According to the Rambam, Yerushalayim has kedusha. The base hamikdash has kedusha. According to the Raavad it doesn't. According to the Rambam, you can bring korbanos as mana zeh. According to the Raavad, you can't bring korbanos as mana zeh. Okay, so what's the conclusion? It's a problem. According to the Rambam, you could do it. According to the Raavad, you can't. But today it's kosher, it's possible. If the Raavad's right that that Jerusalem doesn't have any So, you know what you can do? You build a bama, and you can bring the carbon on a bama. What would prevent you today from going to an animal, saying "Pesach, chata'os, olah" and slaughtering it? You can't slaughter Can't slaughter outside the Beis Hamikdash. There's no Beis Hamikdash. What's outside the Beis Hamikdash? So, if you have Beis Hamikdash as a scenario, you can't slaughter. You can't slaughter. If there's no Beis Hamikdash as a scenario, you can't slaughter. You know who makes this the Gemara? Sort of does. So, if that's the case, remember you could do it. According to the Rambam, that Jerusalem is allowed to be eaten. So, go slaughter, bring a carbon. And according to the Raavad, okay, so you didn't do anything wrong anyways. You are allowed to bring a carbon on a bama. And there's no bama if there's no because there's no because there's no inside. So, you can't have an outside. So, he's If this is what I think, this is something you should be able to do. So, he said even though at first glance, the first issue that you're going to throw out is Beis Hamikdash. There's no Beis Hamikdash. How could you do it? But really, it's not a problem because like the Rambam, you theoretically have a Beis Hamikdash. And even like the Raavad even like the Raavad, there's a bonus. So, based on that it wouldn't be a problem. The second issue is tumah. We're all tamei. And we're all tamei. How are you going to go to the Beis Hamikdash? How are you going to start bringing carbons? So, it's said that's true. I'll have to concede part of that point. That is, we'll have to limit what we do to carbon By a carbon we have tumah we have You could bring it tumah. And as a result, it won't be And if someone was to slaughter and because of the Beis Hamikdash, I'll be He's not ready for that. We don't even have Beis Hamikdash yet. We don't have the parah adumah. When you want to go ahead and bring a carbon that's something you can bring to tomorrow. So that's something you be able to do. There's another obvious problem. What about you know you say what do you mean of course you have but the truth is right at least look at me. So of course we have but do we have you have some? So the truth is even a doesn't matter if your name is cats or but at the end of the day you're only going to consider yourself a there's no such thing as being a so for example a doesn't matter if you're a a won't go into a even if his name is not right don't do that but at the same time you know what kind of it's all of So if a woman is not we used to do the so we give it to him the one brings from a that don't eat but no one does no it's also it's all why not because they maybe the is not a good and because maybe the is not a good so based on that it should be a problem. If we don't trust the as it relates to eating you would think you can't trust the as it relates to bringing so if you have a whole to answer this seemingly very difficult question and he said a very big his in short without going through the whole tomorrow because that's a onto itself but his basically was that today being that there's no way to be who's a and who's not a so it's for that reason you could be a you could be what's right? Right is right and as a result you assume going back that really you probably are a and this is as well and he worked it all out and he said based on you could do it. Now to eat you don't have to eat so we're not going to be we'll burn it but if you could bring a carbon maybe you have to bring a carbon and if you have to bring a carbon and you have a to be maybe you should be and even though he says that the says in different places they won't some of a con this and these types of things when it came to Kahuna. He said that's cuz they didn't need to because the only time you will go with a con and arrive is where it's impossible to be where it's where it's impossible to be in a van. They had ability to be in a van. They had that you didn't have to come on to all these hoops in order to establish as a result. Why should you be some of a con but as a matter of that we don't have any other there's no one has anymore. So based on that look this is something you should be able to do. With today gave us a very hard time on this point. They went back and forth in the Jewish community said the is we don't have you can kiss and it was basing it on a mission by the way. It came from a mission a mission of the day fascinating. But either way wasn't so comfortable with that. But that wasn't the reason ultimately rejected but his college is idea. The reason he rejected was because of the next issue. So again we discuss this what happened to Toma? You don't have you can kiss but there's a bigger problem and this ultimately sealed the fate of colleges ideas with Vegas concern and that is we need bigger day Kahuna. It's very interesting. So you need bigger day Kahuna. So you can have a is you're going to say his name is cats. He could do the okay. You have to show up with your with the dollar right you going to have to show up with your bigger day Kahuna. The problem is the had trailers inside of it. It had it had when and that's easy. What's trailers? What's trailers? Right? It's a big enough when it comes to this. So so today said time it was before there was he didn't have any trailers. He said where you going to find trailers? So he said I'm not in this ball. He said why not? Cuz the truth is the is that the trailers of the bigger day Kahuna was not the same trailers of the trailers of the has to come from the and we don't know what the is but the is the trailers of the bigger day didn't come from the so they if it didn't come from the kilazon, so it's not really going to be a problem. So Vegas said I could live with that. I could live with that because I know say I could live with the fact that we can be on the and we could say that table just means blue wool. So make blue wool even if it's not from the kilazon it's going to be okay. But you know what Vegas problem was? His problem was our gammon. What's our gammon? So they said when I was in purple wool and I went to but purple wool. Right, so that's what it was. It's purple. But the truth is we shine. Not all the shine and say it's purple. Some say it's red. And it's whether the gammon is red or the gammon is purple. So Vegas said at the end of the day he told Kalisher told more base mikdash they had to be again he wasn't that thrilled with all these ideas but at the same time maybe he said to gave him. But he said at the end of the day the last gammon. We don't know our gammon and if we don't know our gammon then how in the world are we going to go ahead and do the in other words Vegas said was you know what you can't do the today because we don't have a couple. That's what he said. So just imagine you're going to do the other That's like my father always says that the like they say that somebody once said how come by the there's no mix of I cannot do. So he said he said how you going to do the kind of kind of So that's what it boiled down to. That's what sealed the fate. Vegas said there's no there's no twice to know our because you need to get what that is. Need our gammon. That's the trick. And he says if we don't know what it is we don't know if it's red if it's purple. So we're going to go ahead and we're going to be That's what Vegas said. But truly there were other issues as well. Another issue is master and that's what master is. But told me how to but at the end of the day how would the people paid for? It was it was all through the checker. We don't have the checker. You can get the whole thrown out to figure out a way to do it. So that's a a bit of an issue. So the truth is, Reb Yaakov Emden had already addressed this in his true in the Shailos Yaavetz when he discussed what the Ksav Sofer and the Sdei Chemed spoke about. And he said that really for the Machatzis Hashekel, there's one of two ways to do this. One way to do this is you can have somebody maybe sponsor the Machatzis Hashekel on behalf of the oilam. Now, the truth is, Machlokes in the Gemara if it works. Reb Yosi holds it works. Reb Yosi is in the Mukei Eimai, and you for sure Reb Yaakov Emden felt could be some of the shitos Reb Yosi, and somebody will give it over for the oilam. As long as he does it b'nadvah sh'libo, it works. And and we can be some of the shitos Reb Yosi, and maybe that's going to be the answer. The other answer is you bring a Korban Pesach. At least the Korban Pesach you're going to have. Korban Pesach doesn't require Machatzis Hashekel. So, Korban Pesach without Machatzis Hashekel, that's something you'd be able to do. So, there was another big problem. And that's what Pesky was asking. What about the Mizbei'ach? Right? You need a Mizbei'ach. You don't need a Beis Hamikdash. Fine. You can make that work. But you need a Mizbei'ach. And the Mizbei'ach has to be in its in its proper place. And it's even more than that. It's What's that? No, but Don, that's how that Rabbi Shimon Shimon ben Gamliel had a Mizbei'ach. And the truth is, it's even more than that. Because you're going to start bringing Korbanos We know that when the Beis Hamikdash was built originally, the pasuk says "Al kol bigsot miyado Hashem Elokei Yisrael." It's a pasuk in Yechezkel. It was done al pi nevi'im. Even by the Sheini, when it was built the second time, nevi'im had to come. Nevi'im had to tell the Yidden how to build the second Beis Hamikdash. Who were the nevi'im? Chaggai, Zecharyah, Malachi. Right? The stor- all the nevu'os of the Bayis Sheini are written in Sefer Chaggai. As in Chaf Dalet Kislev, I think. Right? So, it's written in Sefer Chaggai. But but here's kind of the irony. But the it that that that's where all these nevu'os are written. But the point is is that it had to be done al pi nevu'ah. But there's no nevi'im. So, if there's no nevi'im, we don't know where the Mizbei'ach is supposed to go. So, if we don't know where the Mizbei'ach is supposed to go, how are we going to go ahead and do this? So, Reb Tzvi Hirsch Kaddish said something fascinating, something brilliant. This is what he said. He said that once upon a time, when the first Beis Hamikdash was built, how are you supposed to know where to build the Beis Hamikdash? So, they had to go ahead, and you needed a navi to tell us where to build the base hamikdash. Second base hamikdash, the same thing. He says, "You know why? Because we say in Al Hanisim that when the Babylonians destroyed the base hamikdash, it was They ripped out the foundation. There was no remnant of the base hamikdash. And because there was no remnant of the base hamikdash, so how are you supposed to know where to put the mizbeach? We're back to square one. We have no idea where it goes. So, they needed nevi'im to come. Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi were the nevi'im that they told them what to do." He said, "But today you can work it out. You know why? Because today we have a remnant of the base hamikdash. So, we have the Kotel Hama'aravi. And the Kotel Hama'aravi was was one of the walls, the Western Wall of the Har Habayit. So, he said, "Open up Maseches Middos, and open up the Rambam in Yad Hachazakah, and we're writing teshuvos." He said, "In Yoreh De'ah and Choshen Mishpat let's write a teshuvah in Maseches Middos. Why not? Tyra hi. And let's sit down and figure out where the mizbeach is supposed to go." So, Rav Tzvi Hirsch Kalischer said, "By your shaini they needed nevi'im cuz it was But Hank, we have the Kotel Hama'aravi. It's not a Yoreh De'ah. So, he said, "Go ahead, work with the Kotel Hama'aravi and figure out where it's supposed to go." Givaldig. Some had a problem with him because others felt, if you look at the Rambam's lashon in Hilchos Beit Hamikdash, the Rambam says like this, "Mizbeach mikuyam mechuban beyoser." The Rambam says, "Mizbeach mikuyam in the machon mizbeach is mechuban beyoser." You can't get it like approximately right. It has to be mechuban beyoser. "De'in meshaneh acharei min mikuyam v'eilu." The Rambam was a whole mush of was about all the things that happened in that place. That's where the Akeidah happened. That's where the Mishkan was created from in Adam. That's when Noach brought his korbanos. But he said, "Everything happened Everything That's That place is so mechuban." He said, "You're going to go ahead and return it, and you're going to make it mechuban beyoser?" He said, "That's something that's impossible." He said, "I don't believe you're going to be able to do this." Rav Chaim Kanievsky asked me last night another kashya. He said, "I don't understand. We pasken tum'as cheil betzibbur." Right? We're learning this shita now. Since the machlokes is in Shas, tum'as cheil betzibbur or tum'as cheil betzibbur? The Rambam said, is tomorrow the holy table. Now, the said the main after me know if tomorrow I go to the table tomorrow I go to the table. So there's nothing to me but a big one is if you all tomorrow I go to the table, you have to come on to the six. So if you have to come on to the six, you would need a kind God though. I doubt that's right. So that you should be able to have it six. You can find the kind to be this is mom is not a guy. Kind God though. Right? Yeah, I even see that. So So how you going to find a kind God though? So now we already need a kind God though with the six. So this is already command impossible. It's It's a kind of dish to me. I mean it's such a kind of wild kind of cash. I found this cash in the base of Israel. Rabbi Shmelke asks this cash. But obviously that kind of muscle everybody handled this. So everyone knew the ram down. So that's why I missed the best of them. Why that kind of one bothered by this? But I was on the shika. Oh, that's also. Right, because you need the shika also which is part of the problem having a kind God though. And it's part of the problem with his bear. So what happened to the shika? That's going to be That's going to be another issue. Either way we're cutting this a little bit short. We do have Needless to say many many a lot of issues as it relates to this. The bottom line is from college it was my fault. He went back and forth with the only one. And at at the end of the day with college though he was holding his own and this was something that he was going to do. At one point during his correspondence with Rabbi Kivega writes back to college he says I'll tell you the truth I'm old. I'm not so I'm not feeling so well right now. And from the college he said this guy is already So he said what I would what I've done is I forwarded this discussion to my son-in-law the son of the fresh bird. You know this is where this is going to end. And he said I asked him I asked him to please take over from here and see what you can do. The son of the fresh bird took this very very seriously. Very very very seriously. And what he did was he asked of a kid that he knew was going to Israel. He said do me a favor, go to Eretz Yisrael and do a little due diligence. Find out if it's even a geiyah. Find out if it's shayah. Meaning, is this something that's possible?" And this shliach, there were two shluchim that came back to the Chasam Sofer, and they both came back with the same report. They said that the sar in Yerushalayim, the person that calls the shots, who captain godol, is a big captain, "V'amar l'vayaakov shom misha ein emunah sh'smol." And he said, "You want to bring carbonos? That was not a Muslim. But otherwise, you can't, it's not shayah." "K'shom nivneh beis avodah sh'lachem, v'oimem dei shayah sh'even sh'siyah b'emtza hakipah hee." That the even sh'siyah is in the middle of their dome. So, Chasam Sofer writing, "V'lo yikrov l'vayi korov shom ish zar sh'ein emunah sh'smol." And if someone doesn't believe in their faith, he's not going to allow them to come, and as a result, it's not going to be okay. What's fascinating is is that if you go through the hemshech of the true of the Chasam Sofer, it's clear that the Chasam Sofer was willing to go forward with it. He was willing. Halachically, he was okay. Listen to his loshon in the end. "Okay, I think you don't need the itai. This is mamish an excerpt. You have to really see the whole thing to appreciate this. Like "Shnei Amudai Kohanim Yochas." He said, "You don't need a Kohanim Yochas." "D'noichal shom min ap'sukim al kol panim sh'lo t'mei'ah b'tzibur." "I'm okay, at the very least, you can eat a korban Pesach in shul b'dei'as tomei'ah sh'chutah b'tzibur." "V'lo l'tzorech l'sholom." And then he threw in very cryptically, "V'lo l'Kohanim Gedolim." "Ein oin Kohanim Gedolim." He was bar verning maybe you need a Kohanim Gadol. But he threw in you don't need a Kohanim Gadol. And the question is why? Rebbe Yitzchak Shmelkes is kasha. But either way, this is what he throws in that you wouldn't even need a Kohanim Gadol. But the point is that it's not What's that? But the Ram Shita is tomei'ah b'tzibur. Oh, his loshon is tomei'ah b'tzibur, very good. "Al kol panim sh'lo tomei'ah b'tzibur." Cuz at least tomei'ah b'tzibur. All right, very good. So, he was going tomei'ah b'tzibur, and that's why you need Kohanim Gedolim. Possible, right? That's what he meant. Cuz he was taking on the position tomei'ah b'tzibur, and as a result, if tomei'ah b'tzibur, that's his hemshech, then you don't need Kohanim Gedolim. Shkoyach sh'mi. But either way, but either way, so the Chasam Sofer was theoretically willing to go along with this. But he said, "Practically speaking, it's not l'maaseh." Why is it not l'maaseh? Cuz at the end of the day, you're not going to be able to You're not going to be able to make those interesting. This teshuvah This teshuvah of the Chasam Sofer is a teshuvah that the Chasam Sofer wrote to Reb Akiva Eiger. Right? So, you know, what happened? Reb Akiva Eiger told Reb [ __ ] Eiger "I'm forwarding the response the correspondence to the Chasam Sofer." But he didn't like pass over the the discussion. Reb Akiva Eiger Akiva was was going in between. So, that he wrote a letter to the Chasam Sofer. The Chasam Sofer wrote back to Reb Akiva Eiger. And then Reb Akiva Eiger wrote back this letter to the to Reb [ __ ] Eiger. That's the the galgal That's the way this worked. It's interesting that if you look in the teshuvahs This teshuvah is written in teshuvahs Chasam Sofer. It's Yoreh De'ah teshuvah Responsa By the way, you know, location, location, location. But if you go through these teshuvahs in Chasam Sofer, these are all the teshuvahs he talks about are Responsa Gimel is a is the teshuvah that he wrote to this Talmud Chassida where he encouraged them to leave Tveria and he should go settle in Yerushalayim. Responsa Dalet, Responsa Hey, a teshuvah that he wrote to Reb Ephraim Zalman Margolies. That's what he talks about Meron and these famous, famous teshuvahs. In Chasam Sofer, he's talking building up, you know, the ma'aleh of living in Yerushalayim, etc., etc. And then Responsa Vav, he talks about bringing korbanos b'zman hazeh. Right? You you have to be very smooth in here in teshuvahs Chasam Sofer. But this is already pushing it, I think. Kli Yakar and in the Simanim of teshuvahs Chasam Sofer, Reb Chaskel is even not He said the wrong way. But this But if you look, this same teshuvah is printed in teshuvahs Reb Akiva Eiger. And in teshuvahs Reb Akiva Eiger, it doesn't have the end of the teshuvah. I don't know. But I'll go with the the teshuvah written in teshuvahs Chasam Sofer. And in the teshuvah of Reb Akiva Eiger, in teshuvahs Reb Akiva Eiger, it's the cheder of Reb Akiva Eiger tells Reb [ __ ] Eiger that it's not a gezeirah. That that my Adam Reb Chasam Sofer told me it's not going to be a gezeirah. But there's a fascinating postscript and we're going to end with this. And that is Reb [ __ ] Eiger didn't stop. Reb [ __ ] Eiger was going to make this happen. He really wanted this. He thought this was 100% the right thing to do. So, this is what Reb [ __ ] Eiger did. Came up with an idea. He wrote a letter to Baron Asher Anschel Rothchild. He wrote a fascinating letter and he tells Baron Rothchild, "I'm about to make you an offer you can't refuse. I'm going to give you the greatest business opportunity that I'll be able to have a good song." Now this is a facsimile of the actual letter that he wrote. This is the letter. This isn't the real letter. It is not the real one. That would be in a safe. But this is a But this is the This is the letter that Schmier's Kalisher wrote to Baron Rothchild and he told him that I believe that there's a war in the world right now Messiah is supposed to come. And but we need to make a start for Messiah to come. And he in the letter he clearly told Baron Rothchild to be a learned fellow cuz he discussed a lot of this letter. And he he tells him the and the and he and he gave he made his case as free that this is what you're this is what you're supposed to do. And we have to go to to we go to Israel and the is going to is going to ultimately bring the He says, "However, I understand it's practically it's not going to be so easy." He said, "Here's my idea. Buy the country." So he told him, he said, "Buy the country. Buy Israel." He said, "I can't believe it's not for sale." He says, "It's got to be for sale at a certain price. Go buy the country." He says, "THEN IT'S OVER. It's game over. You buy it." And then he said, "You'll tell me maybe it's too expensive. Buy I am. We don't need all of them so it's good. Give them the Golan Heights. Half of we need Jerusalem. If we have Jerusalem we'll be able to start bringing and he and he said I think it's a good investment. He says, "Cuz can you imagine now if belongs to all the are going to come there. You're going to have the number one economy in the world. You can start selling developments of parcels of land. He said it's going to be the best investment you ever made in your life." And he said, "Not just that you're going to be and he writes him the ocean timely." He got He got He said, "In history there was never a class of that had such power and such influence. And if you're in such a position, how do you know that they didn't give you everything he gave you for you to be able to pull off this move? This is what he told them. And Reb Dovid Katz told me that if you want to really appreciate it, he says you have to understand that that time Eretz Yisrael was being controlled by the Turks, the Ottoman Empire, and they were bankrupt, and they had no money, and that's why Reb Tzvi Hirsch Kalischer knew there was an opportunity for Lloyd Lloyd. He said there were a lot of countries that were suffering terribly, and Rothschild, everybody knows, besides for, you know, producing good wines, but that's not how he made his money. No, but the Rothschild was in the banking business, and he was lending money to countries. He was floating countries. There were countries that were literally turning on the lights in the morning because of the ashiras of Baron Rothschild. And And Reb Tzvi Hirsch Kalischer felt that he can use that influence that he has over the Turks, and he said, "Buy them a small land somewhere, Uganda, and put them there." He says, "Let the Yidden have Yerushalayim." He says, "I think this is going to work." So I asked Reb Dovid Katz, I said, "Is there Is there an ending to the story?" "Well, the only part of the ending I know is that Rothschild, obviously, for whatever reason didn't take him up on the offer." You know, he said something interesting that, you know, so much of the turmoil that came about, you know, with the Sam Rov and the Shalei Shvuos and Shalei Al Hachaim, it would have all been prevented. Right? You have the oness of what he was saying. You Why do you have to be Al Hachaim? You don't have to fight a war. He said, "Just buy it. You can walk into Rav Amram Avinu did." Rav Amram Avinu said, "I'll buy them a peleh." He said, "Give me the toyches. I have the rights to it. I don't have the rights to it. What's the difference?" Yeah, Rav Meir said, "Kful Kessef bein uvein Chamai. Let me go ahead and it's And let me just buy it." And that was That was what he was going to do. He says the Rambam, when he describes the difference between Kedushah Rishonah and Kedushah Sheniyah, the Rambam says Kedushah Rishonah was like the Kibbush. Kedushah Sheniyah was like the Chazakah. It was like the Chazakah. They just came in, they made a Chazakah, they paid for it, and they made a Chazakah. So he said, "That's what you should be able to do." The time wasn't right for it, and obviously that's the real reason that it didn't happen, and we should all be zocheh with some neichum and some nachum and some nachum, to be a skoyach tzedek from here to now on.