WHY PEOPLE SAY YES | Episode 3 with Meny Hoffman & Pinchus Shiff

Welcome to the Let's Talk Business podcast, a project of the PEX Group. Gain valuable, actionable ideas from the world's top business leaders to help you take the next step in your business journey. And now, here is your host, Manny Hoffman. >> Okay, Penas, you believe it. We're back to episode number three. >> And and this is amazing. Bashem, thank you everybody that's sending in feedback. It's appreciated because we keep on recording these episodes and we are going to address all these topics that actually are being brought to our attention. Thank you for that and I appreciate it. If you're listening this on on on any of the platforms that you could leave a like, a comment, please do so because those comments are actually helping us fill up the content for the remaining episodes to make sure that we cover everything that the salesperson would need. >> Support the channel. >> Absolutely. So today we are going to discuss something I know you're very passionate about because I've seen some of your statuses. I've seen you talking. Usually those conversations are in the dark car like on the way at the end of the day that you sharing. But what is the topic? The topic is what triggers a person to buy. Now, why it's so important is because sometimes salespeople are so focused on perfecting their sales pitch, perfecting how they sell, their sales process, the sales system, which is all very important. We'll get to that as well. They forgot to put themselves into the mindset of how does a person make a decision? Why does a client actually buy? What triggers a person to say yes, where do I sign my name? And today's topic I'm so excited about because we're going to dive into the nitty-gritty of the technicals of it. We're going to dive into the nitty-gritty of the human psychology behind it. And guess what? As we said in the in the previous episode, we're not touching manipulation over here. We're we're assuming you have a great product. We're assuming you have a great uh company you work for. We're assuming you're a great salesperson and you just have to connect to the right buyer. So with that, I want to start with a story and I think that's going to shape this episode and the conversation where we want to go. I spoke to a very successful salesperson. This goes back a couple of years ago and he shared with me the following story and I asked him like what was some of the pivotal moments in your career that you s started shifting the way you think, the way you do? He told me exactly I know there I remember the story and he told me the following. I was a young salesperson. I I I sold software and you know the company supported me but I was on my own and I was trying starting to close sales. I had this big enterprise fish that I I was after like this was my northstar. I want to get some one of those clients. He's working with the client. He's going through the step, the first step, the second step, and then finally the, you know, he's making progress and he's reporting back to sales manager, reporting back to the company that I think we're getting this guy warming up, warming up, whatever the conversation went. One day, the guy sent gets an email that our company's looking to move forward. We want to have a call with our full team, >> your full team, >> your tech guys, and this and that, the whole spiel. He is so excited. Can you imagine such a day? He runs back to his team. We got to set it up as soon as possible. We're just about closing the sale. He has that call um and they asked the most brilliant questions. The question about exactly what your process is, how the system works, all these questions that he's loving it. Not only he's loving it, he's going like thumbs up like from his side. It wasn't a Zoom call at that time. It was a phone call. It resonates. It was a phone call. Like he's asking exactly the questions. we have all the answers and this is like the best best partnership ends up happening. The call goes for 45 minutes like a real in-depth call. Everybody's answering. Everybody's communicating. He puts down the the call ends. Okay, we'll get back to you. We'll make a decision. We'll get back to you. By mistake, he did not put down the phone. He hears on the other side. They're starting to laugh. All of them are laughing. And one of the guys says, "This young fellow thinks we're going to be buying from him. He didn't realize he was that we just wanted all the information. So, we're going to be we're going to give it for our developers to build." This was obviously a shocker for him. And at that point, he said, "Something I'm doing wrong not to understand the client. How could I go so far and be in delusional thinking this guy is buying for me >> without even knowing that >> knowing that he's just extracting information because they want to build it in house and then he went on to his career to really grab grasp the the concept of how a person makes a decision what are the triggers when do you see the person's interest is is really serious or not so I think I think just to frame this conversation I think is just to get us lead us right in I want take it away just Just from your mindset asking again the question, how do people misunderstand about how decisions are made or what triggers a person to buy or not to buy? >> Loaded question. We're going to dive back. I I want to know what is sales >> exactly >> and then what does it take to get started? The first question I always ask and when I train or anything, >> what is the first thing that comes to your mind when you think about sales people? I know you talk to a lot of sales people. Let's take me and you out of the picture. What do people in general believe about salespeople? And it's not the nicest things. In most cases, they think they're peasants, pests, manipulators, liars, they're stealing. They >> do whatever it takes to get get a sale. >> The first thing gaining trust is you have to prove them wrong and very, very quickly. Otherwise, you're just another salesperson. >> This episode of the Let's Talk Business podcast is sponsored by Flow Digital and Pipe Drive. Sales is the lifeblood of every business. No sales means no revenue and no business. So, if you are a business owner or in sales, you already know how important it is to have a proper CRM. A good CRM helps you manage your sales process and keeps leads from falling through the cracks and make sure you have the proper reporting so you could analyze what's happening every single day. If the CRM is too complicated or not set set up properly, the team just won't use it. 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As a listener to the show, you can sign up for a free Pipe Drive trial at flow.digitalb digitalb where you'll get a 45day trial of pipe drive plus you'll be able to get a 45minute consultation to get your CRM set up the right way. Once again that's flow.digitalttb. So you get the best of both worlds. You get the easiest CRM out there which is pipe drive and you get flow digital to help you set it up. Remember, your business and your sales team will always thank you for setting the right system so they could focus on closing more sales. >> What is sales? Who cares? What does it take a person to buy from you? Okay, so the first thing is a problem. You got to identify that person has to identify by themselves or you have to help them identify a problem that they currently have and it's always starts with the problem. The next step would be connecting or you understanding the problem. The next step is a solution. You have to gain trust that whatever is going to happen, they can trust you and rely on you. And if you have a right solution, bring it to them and get them to trust and finally make that decision to move forward with you. It's sounds so easy. The first thing is problems. And I most salespeople just call people and say, "Hey, can I offer you XY and Z without understanding why should you can offer it? Why should I take it?" So the first thing is a problem. Hey, I'm sure you're already using apparel company. Many. >> Are you happy? >> Yes, extremely happy. Based on my knowledge, I have to ask my team. >> Is it Are you against me talking to your team about this? >> No. That's all I want. Getting the right people. That's number one. If you don't talk to the right people, we're not even in a sale. Once you talk to the right people, my question will start again. Are you happy? Now you're the decision maker. Are you happy >> currently? Absolutely. >> Okay. If they will reach out to you and for your advice and they will offer you a year free if you can help them become even better. Do you think there's anything for them to become better at? >> Um probably you can pick up a couple of things that uh every company >> and and from there I go to seeing if the person is really happy or they're covering it up because they're not interested in giving you their problems because they're afraid you'll manipulate them into switching. So get them extremely comfortable. They say yes because people like to be smart and say sure they can have better customer support. What do you mean by that? You have a problem with customer service. So and I realized it's so you're like walking on a tight rope and you have a problem with customer service. Ah no we don't have a problem. So always is like is customer support a problem? Yes. Is it affecting you in any way? Diving really deep until you understand the problem. It's very similar to a doctor. Let's pretend you go to the doctor. You say, "I'm having terrible headaches the past few weeks." The doctor says, "Sure. I know exactly what it is. Here's a prescription." You say, "Are you crazy or what?" So, you're the same thing. The doctor will have to ask a lot of questions. When did it start? Where is it hurting? What happened? What does your diet look like? Your lifestyle. So many questions. And then at some point like I think X Y and Z is happening. And then you gain trust and you would go for help. The same as with the sale. Gaining trust is first. So when I will tell you, hey, are you happy? The first thing you will know for me is if you're extremely happy with where you are, I will not take you on as a client. I don't think I ever took a client that was happy from a different company. I think it's bad business. They'll forever be ungrateful. Every single little thing that will go a bit different than what they expect. They a little bit different from what they expected will be brutal. They'll challenge you. They'll be upset at you. Like the color of the check, like who cares? Like there's no reason they switched. They want their comfortability. When a person has a problem, for example, they need customer support and that cl that product is not providing customer support. Or if they need a simple product and that product is over complicated, they're ready to sacrifice for simplicity. They're ready to sacrifice for great customer service. They're ready to pay triple the price because someone understands them. And that's where they become a happy client. My father doesn't use me for payroll. And people don't know this, but he offers me every half a year. Like, when am I switching to Friday? I'm like, you're happy with this? I've been there 10 years. Nothing really changed. like perfect why change and I really believe in that philosophy. >> So, >> so, so you're let's let's let's confirm. So, you're talking about the problem solution which means is >> without a problem. So, either >> you you create either that person has the problem when you start talking to that person or sometimes you make the person aware of because the problem doesn't have to be a technical problem could be an enhancement to what they're currently having. >> A problem could be something that they want to avoid. >> Exactly. So if someone doesn't use a product at all yet and they're not aware that they want one, you'll, for example, an IT company, for a company that does not have an IT, >> I was the first thing, how important is it for you to not get hacked? Very important. What would a hack look like if if someone breaches your product or platform or computer? What would that look like for your business? A nightmare. A nightmare. What will your clients look what what will happen to your clients? Will you lose any business over this? Will you lose any sleep over this? And at some point if the client realizes that this is really a risk that they want to avoid then if you gain trust you become their solution. >> Got it. I don't think you'll find any reason for people to buy beside without having a problem. For example, buying a Rolex solves a problem >> for the person that needs >> 100%. Why does he need a Rolex? Why would you spend $25 to $100,000 on a watch? >> It has a same question. Why do you need a Rolex? >> I first of all I don't have a Rolex. >> Yeah, >> I know you like watches. I love watches. >> Okay. >> But um someone buying a Rolex, it's a certain they're buying status. They're buying, >> of course, >> they're filling some hole that they have from being a kid and being bullied. They want to show the world they're successful or they just appreciate, for example, they have a need to appreciate certain things in this world and therefore they want to have certain things that are rare. It always solves something for them. So, so let's let's talk about the the problem solution because I've seen salespeople that create a problem >> that doesn't exist. >> Doesn't exist. Meaning to say they're trying to We're not talking about bad mouthing existing vendor, which that's terrible business uh business ethics and there's no place for that. >> Let the client do that if they're not happy. >> Exactly. What I'm saying is if only you use us and we could do this, we could do that. How big of a problem does it need? A salesperson should be comfortable enough to try to get the business. >> A problem that's worth switching. If you wouldn't switch for that, why would you make someone else switch for that? >> Got it. So I would ask if and if someone is extremely happy I really believe it's bad business. >> Okay. So let's talk about the second thing you mentioned is trust. Um I know it's obviously it's everybody understands that in order to make a decision in order to want to work with you there needs to be a trust factor. How do you gauge if you already established that? >> You have to feel but have you done anything to gain their trust? Do they know that if they're not a good fit you'll move on? >> And not just you can say it verbally but they have to really feel it. And for example, if someone says, "Hey, I would love to sign up." Most sales people just sign them up. Even when someone says, "Hey," and sometimes people call in the office, they say, "I'm ready to sign up. Who can I talk to?" Like, "Thank you so much for reaching out. I would love to ask you a couple of questions to see if we're a good fit." And I've trained the salesperson, they're like, "Are you crazy about this guy?" Literally called them signing up. But imagine if they sign up and then say, "Okay, there's a different vendor in the meantime that also speaks to them." or you you want them to buy from you and from you only and you want to find that problem even if they're ready to make that decision. So I would say is it the first time you're having payroll? Yes. Okay. So sometimes it's harder. The problem doesn't have to be so big. For example, if someone has their first employee, they need payroll. They have a problem. They need someone to do their taxes. So you can talk about it like what do you look for? So you can't ask what would it look like if you don't have Don't be stupid. Yeah. >> But I would ask what do you look for in apparel company? I know it's the first time you never tried payroll before. Well, in best case scenario, what do a payroll company look like? And if they tell me the best case scenario, we can fax in hours and someone just we're not a good fit. They say something easy to use, great support, that we're a fit. So, it always goes like that. Problem, solution. If there's no problem, you don't want to have that person as a client. >> And the more solutions you have for their problems, the more they'll buy in and like your company and use you and refer you and recommend you. It takes losing a lot to gain a lot and we lost a lot of leads especially in the beginning we didn't have XY andZ features features the client even didn't think about and I would ask is this something you would need ah yes I'm sorry I don't think we're a good fit at this point and we lost a lot but then we gain a lot so being focused being niche know exactly what you which problem you solve get to know your competitors a little bit not because you're going to bash them you never do that but if someone says I'm using XYZ I'm not happy you know exactly where to go, which questions to ask. >> So, we spoke about problem, we spoke about trust. Um, you mentioned that trust is something that you start feeling. Um, at which point do you feel that that it's my duty, it's my responsibility to get the person to make a decision. I I think every industry is different and every call and every person is different. Did they call just to ask for pricing? What do you do? Like, hey, how much do you charge? People just give price. They call five companies, they get five pricing. What do you think they do? >> They'll go for the cheapest if all of them are the same. >> If it looks the same, they have no idea. Or if some guy was very smart and said, "I can give you a price, but I don't even know if we're a good fit. What are you looking for?" And then goes into conversation and connects with them. They say, "You have X, Y, and Z. We have X, Y, and Z. We connect it." Then they'll pay more because you're a better fit. Most people miss on that on that part. What was your question again? >> What comes out? Like how do you know at at which point >> which part do you have to push for a decision? It really depends on the conversation. If someone says I need to start payroll this week, I want to know X Y and Z. You go into the conversation and there's any question. By the way, my favorite closing line I never ask people do you are you ready to sign up? People hate that any questions before signing up. If the conversation goes well, if they have a problem that I can solve, I feel trusted and I will say look and I always summarize it after going through an entire conversation. Tell them look from what I am hearing you used X Y and Z you then switched to that company the first company you didn't like this you loved that second company based and if we're a good fit I would tell them so based on that I believe you'll like we're a good fit because we align on this we have that feature that you mentioned we also have that that you didn't even think about that we can do let's talk pricing and they're like you're too expensive then objections most people have objections because the client controls the conversation. Sometimes you control the conversation. I I interview my clients and then I say, "Let's talk pricing. Is that too expensive?" I once had a client that I asked, "How much do you pay?" Said, "400." My price was a,000. It was a bigger client. I don't know why they paid so little. And they were extremely unhappy. They asked, "What does your pricing look like?" I said, "How much do you pay?" And I said, "Ah, I don't think we're going to be a good fit." She's like, "Why not?" It's like, "You're currently paying 400. Our pricing is more than double. I I will assume this is not something you want to move forward." She said, "Look, for a reason, we're on the call. I hate them. So, of course, I'm going to have to pay something more." But I said, "Two and a half times more or three times more." And she's like, "For the perfect solution?" Yes. And I'm like, "This is our pricing. Am I crazy?" And then we move forward. So, it's always about understanding and don't play with them, but be in control. Know exactly what's going on. Be extremely be there. You know, some people just take calls on the fly. focus and I'm so trained, my brain is so trained these days to find problems. I'll talk on a call and my brain like literally has this red light going off of like I'm listening and this is this is a problem. Hey, stop a second. This morning a person called into the office. I was sitting with Chulum, one of my salespeople and I pick up the call. She actually signed put in the first of information show. I got it signed up. But then she's like I'm using a different company. How much do you charge? I don't think there's a what I assumed it's already she's signed up and she is like ah for so much little for so little in savings I don't think it's worth switching I said absolutely not I don't think anyone ever switched for that amount of price but you know why people did switch do you have xyz problem she's like yes and she's like no and then I go I ask my questions and at one place she was unsure I'm like let's talk about this and that company doesn't have technology so I said what happens if you have to process payroll after 5 o'clock when no one is in the She's like, "Oh, that's a nightmare. It can never happen." How many times did it happen? Four times this year. Back and forth the closing was. She said, "It's going to take me I don't know how much time to switch. I don't think it's worth the time." I said, "Look, all I need from you maximum is one hour. How much headaches and time do you think it's smart for the one hour to save five times a year that you forget to process payroll and you're just anxious about it? Should that one hour it's definitely worth it?" >> That's it. That's the close. So making them realize you're not manipulating. Manipulating is when you manipulate your kid to do something because they don't want but you want it. If the client if this is the client's best interest, you just ask them what do you want? Because you can't tell a client sign up because that's what I want. That would be extremely stupid. So you got to figure out what does the client want. And if the client doesn't want to switch, if they're happy where they are, don't be stupid. Don't take them on. It reminds me another point uh we've been we've been doing for the last I don't remember how many years is you control the narrative mean to say yes as as said before we're not manipulative but clients need to make decisions and we need to understand where they are in the process so I remember years ago we had an issue we had a closing issue used to send proposals this and our proposal is in marketing so it's a lot of back and forth we have to understand the scope of work and all of a sudden we saw a huge drop in in in conversion. And we were debating back and forth, back and forth until we saw two main reasons. One is people don't understand our proposal, they'll take our proposal and now match it up with three other people, but the same line item could mean different things for different people. Second of all, sometimes the person that we're talking to and presenting the proposal and sending the proposal is not even the right decision maker. So the boss >> forward >> got us five proposals of redoing our brand or whatever it is. the last I don't remember if it's five years or more than that. We've never emailed a proposal without a presentation of a proposal. It's a full presentation. It's the first step the person could see what we do now goes in a lot of work on it. So we would have a conversation you know tentatively to speak about a pricing so they get a just an idea of what they're getting. They're looking for something for $1,000 and you're batch. >> But as soon as they say, you know, yeah, we were somewhat in that range. Let me let me prepare full proposal, all details, everything included, our process, everything in that document. >> And that's a conversation >> and that's always a presentation. And in that presentation, we'll always say, are you the final decision maker? No. So, let's schedule all three of them at the same call. Or if they can't make it, after you're happy with the proposal, we want to present it to the other two people in the company. What does it take to get the decision maker on this call? >> It's such a fair question to ask. >> Yeah. And >> I love what you're saying. I met this construction company. They send out over 100 proposals a month. They get around 20 jobs. >> And I said, how much time do you spend on each proposal? They're full-time people working on proposals. So, I'm like, let's pretend you only have to send 30. Said, if I send 30, I'll only get three clients. I I think sending proposals just because a contractor wants to get seven proposals. I I wouldn't do that. If you asked me, hey, I need a proposal. I would say look last job you used that competitor of mine two jobs before you used a different guy why do you want me to send you a proposal I would love to understand it a little bit more >> yeah so so it really without triggering them in a very nice way >> that's what I'm saying it's it's it's a it's it's a fine line because I've seen some of your lines how you use in sales and I think it's Charlie has a lot of those those >> Charlie my sales is my sales >> yeah so it's so so not every but I will say this >> the same way that not every client is the same not every salesperson is the same you You have to know who you're dealing with. Which lines will trigger them negatively or favorably? >> I I think certain lines always works for everyone. >> So, one of the lines that I think >> some people are not some people are just not worth to have as a client. >> But let me let me park back let me go back to a second to the proposal part because I think this is very important for sales people. A lot of sales people get very excited about the activity by sending out proposals and then all of a sudden the the month passed and they don't have enough sales. Yeah. Zoom in a little bit. Ask yourself, maybe I I I sent proposals to people that are not ready to buy and and maybe you have to redo some of your sales process to qualify better your people to make sure they're ready for proposals. So now you're you're you're going around um all upset that I'm sending proposals, I'm not closing anything. You're not sending proposals. You're just being busy. Those people are not ready for proposal. In order to send a proposal, somebody's actually needing a proposal. So that's that's a very important point. But I do want to go back to the style. Um, like I know that you mean to say I want to ask you a very could I ask you a very personal question >> about Friday? >> So you have a great team of salespeople. Shout out to your great team. Um, do you see that you could create systems and processes on sales across the board with every salesperson? >> Absolutely. >> And and or some sales people have a different way of selling and closing >> the people that work on my team. I think most of the most of them adapted and this is Charlie's credit. I think Charlie he transformed the way I do sales and with them and obviously every single person will always have their own flavor their own spice and some people use a 20% 30% 50% >> but does it need to be that way like for people listening to this does it need to be >> something works for you go ahead mean to say is one of the things you're looking for when you're hiring new salespeople that they have to fit the culture that they could not coachable obviously we're talking about those those basic terms need to be there but I'm I'm say I'm saying that if they say you know what I like to sell differently. I'll bring you the results. Is this something that you say, "No, in this company, in order to hold you accountable, in order to make sure that we reach our goals, we have to be cookie cutter. Everybody doing the same type of selling the same way." >> Great question. If someone produces the results, use your way, your style. Do it your way. And if you're successful with something, go ahead, continue. Why should I change the way I do sales? Who said you should? Are you successful? And people always challenge, why should I go to this seminar? who said you should. So if someone has the way but if someone will bring on clients that are happy somewhere else which automatically it's not a method I know for a fact they'll be upset then no please don't do that if you bring if you convince every single client to sign up with Friday no matter their size what they're looking for you're you're messing up my company so no the answer will be no >> to certain things so you don't have to copy everything you can have your own channels sales channels your own style and talking everything stays the same but certain things I think is in the essence and the core of the company we do not take clients that are happy somewhere We do not force people or convince people to sign up. >> That's a company value and and they have to match it. If they bring on clients no matter what, you know how chaotic. >> But what do the sales process the sales process? >> Give me an example. Uh typical example is let's say hire a salesperson says you know what don't tell me to present proposals. It's too much time. I'm going to email it. I I'll bring you the sale. Do you want >> it's possible to do sales that way? So personally based on my experience will be happy. Exactly. No because we'll find ourselves later on in a process that that's not working >> then it's a no. >> Got it. >> But but if if I can see it happen and it doesn't mess me up. Be my guest. I don't care. I think Charlie did something and and he proved it to me that you can charge more than everyone else. You can be like and some people will say I can't close. My company is very expensive. And that's the most common one, right? I I think that's why they hire salespeople and that's your job. Obviously they need to provide more value. You have to find clients that have a problem that you actually solve. But that's what it is. >> Okay. There's so much more to cover, but let me fire around a couple of questions >> and and then we'll wrap this episode. So, what is one or two things you've seen as a deal breaker why a person decided the last minute not to buy and in in the on the flip side, one or two things you that you've seen a person that you actually signed up as a customer and them being upset because it wasn't the right fit or whatever. So deals going sour, it's because you manipulate them. You didn't gain trust. >> So they feel that. >> They feel that at some point they're like, I don't want to deal with this guy. Um clients that did sign up and became unhappy is people that got manipulated at some point. They signed up because with the different you didn't set the expectations correctly, then they signed up. They're like, I don't know like why I even signed up. >> Okay. Um do you have to become friends with your clients? >> Absolutely no. >> Okay. So how do you define relationship when it comes to clients? I can become extremely close to certain clients, but it's still a client relationship. And certain clients became personal friends. It doesn't really matter. I don't think it's either or. It can be both. And in a business relationship, you have to be professional. Communicate effectively. Set expectations. Deliver what you promise. That's it. I I don't think people buy from you because you go to their son's wedding or what. They'll rather buy from you if you deliver what you promise them. What is one or two things you would tell your team that even if they're pursuing a lead, just let it go? >> So the obvious, if we're not a good fit, that's already unqualified. >> Sometimes you see people, it's just not worth working with them. Edgy people who control a very manipulative relationship with you. They ignore you when they want and then they come back. Sometimes I I I just tell such a person and I just helped one of my sales people write a very nice message to someone. They took him on a ride for six months and then they said, "We're signing up next week and then we get a he gets a message. Sorry, I don't think we'll make a switch for now." And then comes the manipulative message, but it might still happen. Let's be in touch. >> Oh wow. >> So like I helped him write a beautiful message that he's actually relieved. He felt that the process throughout the way they communicated, they would ignore him for three weeks and then say, "We need to hop on a call now." Like this felt like I wasn't sure the words have to be calculated. I I remember writing it down but but basically I'm relieved. I don't think this is a good business relationship. >> I believe a business relationship means you know if you ask me like what is how do I define business relationship? Mutual respect. People have to understand that as much as you're the vendor >> needs to be mutual and respect. So the second you feel that this is a one-sided relationship that's where where everything gets lost. >> And it's also totally okay to walk away at some point and just say I don't think at this point it makes sense for us to do business together. And it's totally okay if you become not the perfect solution for their growing problems. It's time for us to part ways and we stay friends. I have people that I've sent away that are or became my best friends. >> It just businesswise by the way I'll set it say it on the air. Um I remember the first time I asked you should I switch over to Friday you says you're not on a target market. >> Maybe I'll have to have that conversation again but it totally makes sense especially then. >> Let me ask you something related to Friday as we close this episode. Do you have some sort of bell or some sort of uh way of celebrating every time you get a client? >> No, but we do have a group and we have custom links. Every salesperson has their own link and I would post every single time there's a sign up would be new signup via Buddham Joel Yehuda and every single time I would post it and that I think it drives momentum also celebrate great months or milestones. For example, for a thousand clients we did a full trip with the sales team. uh we already went to Dominican Republic last year um for celebrating last year's year end season. So yes, I I believe you should celebrate and uh work with it. >> I know you speak very many times about you know, we've spoke about before as well like that a client that's not qualified fitting your criteria, you actually um actually are very um you know confident in telling them that we're not the right fit. >> Sure. >> Do you celebrate uh leaving letting those people go as well? >> Great question. But we should I don't think there's a way like hey I just let this lead go. I think it's actually an awesome way of celebrating because that's that's playing the game enjoying the process. >> I was thinking you have to have two bells. One bell gets ring you ring when you celebrate a success. A client signed up and the other bell gets ring when we actually help the client. >> I will need hearing aids. If I had that many bells per day about Burkash and the team signs up and we have >> this was awesome. Thank you. And just to recap for our sales people following this series of uh episodes related to sales, this one we spoke about understanding the client, understanding what what type of component you play with the relationship. Of course, there's so much more to discuss and of course every scenario is a little different, but this is overall topics we're trying to cover. In our next episodes, we will cover something that I know Pas you're going to enjoy, >> but you gota you gotta >> get some energy before the next episode. How do you as a salesperson, how do you get confidence? How do you deal with rejection? >> And ultimately, how do you identify if you're doing a great job in sales? So, I'm looking forward for that episode. Before that, >> I want to thank you for the feedback and again, keep the feedback coming. If you want to watch one of the past episodes, go to pasgroup.commpodcast where you'll see the sales series, everything related to those episodes. Thank you. Appreciate it. This episode of the Let's Talk Business podcast is sponsored by Flow Digital and Pipe Drive. Sales is the lifeblood of every business. No sales means no revenue and no business. So, if you are a business owner or in sales, you already know how important it is to have a proper CRM. A good CRM helps you manage your sales process and keeps leads from falling through the cracks and makes sure you have the proper reporting so you could analyze what's happening every single day. If the CRM is too complicated or not set set up properly, the team just won't use it. When that happens, leads get lost, follow get missed, and ultimately deals stall. That's where Piperive comes in. Pipe Drive is an easytouse CRM designed to make tracking and sales process simple. You can see your pipeline at a glance, move deals forward, and make sure you never miss a follow-up. And with built-in AI, get insights to help you close more deals. But that's not all. Easy to use doesn't always mean efficient. That's where Flow Digital steps in. I'm personally a Flow Digital client that helped me set up the pipe drive at PEX. Speaking from personal experience, I could attest they're the best in the business at setting up CRM and automating the sales workflow. 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