Why Are Kiddush Clubs So Bad?

Hi, this is Rabbi Wolasky with our question-and-answer series. Somebody asked, "Why are kiddush clubs so bad?" Really? >> [laughter] >> Let's get this straight cuz it could be that I'm missing something here. In the middle of Krias HaTorah, a bunch of people leave shul. They miss Krias HaTorah. They miss answering amen to all of those brachos. They miss the mitzvah d'rabbanan of Krias HaTorah. They miss the haftorah. And they go downstairs and they drink. And they come back up, maybe, in Mussaf. And uh I'll tell you a story in uh one of my brother's shuls. A guy came up from the kiddush club and he had had too much to drink. And uh they gave him hagbah. He almost dropped the Torah. He was stumbling. So, okay. So, what we have to do is when people leave the kiddush club, put a little sign around their neck, you know, "I went to the kiddush club. Don't offer me anything because I'm I'm wasted." >> [laughter] >> I guess you could do that. But what is wrong with us? You can't sit through a davening? What is wrong with you? I have ADD and I sit through a davening. No, you you can't you can't manage? It's it's it's such a destruction of what davening was supposed to be. And then they stay down there and of course and then they miss the drasha and they you know, and uh uh it was Rabbi and they come back up and it's like a whole balagan and and then it encourages other people who might otherwise have stayed and listened to Krias HaTorah and uh drasha where maybe they'll hear something meaningful. And you pull those people out, too. Those poor suckers cuz you make it look like wow, this is so exciting. We go downstairs. And sometimes they make sure that they have all kinds of fancy treats, all kinds of nice things. You can't wait another half an hour? Have a regular kiddush afterwards? So uh it's it's momish a destruction it's a korban. And uh the fact that we even ask the question is a problem. What's wrong with it? What's right about it? Tell me what's right about it. Say, "Hey Rabbi, I have an idea. Let's pull together a bunch of people and pull them out of davening so that they miss laining, miss haftorah, and miss the drasha. And instead they'll go downstairs and fress and drink, you know, until they have drunk." Does that sound like a good approach to our voters Hashem? What do you think? It's all allowed. So our rabbonim don't know how to stop it. Why? Because people don't care, that's why. Cuz anyone who goes to a kiddush club doesn't care about God and Torah. Period. Period. I don't care who you are. I'm telling you straight. If you cut out of davening and miss laining and miss haftorah and miss the drasha so you can go downstairs and fress and drink and speak about inappropriate things, at least from my experience what I was able to see when I'd go to an early minyan and I'd see the kiddush club, you know? So that is as that and you think you believe in God and Torah? You're not. You're an atheist. Just come out and say it. Why do you even bother going? I was by a shul once and these guys are sitting in the back. They're talking, they're talking, you know. No davening. And you know, people shush him and that. But then the davening I came over to them and I said, "I really I'm not I'm not attacking you. I'm not questioning you. I just want to understand. Why come to show and talk? So, one of them, of course, get defensive and says, "Oh, and you're so do do do." I said, "No, no, no, I'm not attacking you. I'm really serious. If I was you, I would not want to come to show and sit here through something that I'm clearly not enjoying and not getting anything out of. Why don't you just have everybody over your house, you know, put out some food and drinks, you know, and have a nice time?" So, one guy said, "My wife won't let me. My wife makes me come to show." And somebody else said something very interesting. They said, "I want to go to show, I just don't want to daven." An amazing concept. Means I want to come to show. I want to I want there to be davening and krias haTorah and kiddush and all these things. I don't know why I don't want to participate. But if there was no show, cuz what I said is, I think a show with this all this talking, they should just get rid of the bema, put in a big table, put out coffee and cake, and let everybody come and sit in show all the whole morning. Let the rav make a hashkama minyan for anyone who wants to daven, then he could sit up there, you know, wish mazel tov to anybody who's got a simcha, you know, make a few show announcements, and let everybody eat and drink. And this guy says, "No, no, I come and I When I come, the early minyan's already having their kiddush. I could just go down to the kiddush. I want to come to show." So, the people in the kiddush club don't even want to come to show. They don't even have that. I don't want to be in davening. I don't want to be in layning. I don't want to hear divrei Torah. I want to go downstairs and fresh and drink, cuz I don't believe in God and I'm an Epicurean. Otherwise, there's no explanation. Like, no one can give me any explanation for a kiddush club. No one can tell me what the positive aspects of a kiddush club, what's gained by that. So, like I say, I don't even understand the question. And uh anyone who goes to a kiddush club, I say good riddance. I'm glad you're not in shul. Stay downstairs, frass, drink, speak lashon hara, tell dirty jokes, do whatever you do. Stay out of shul. There are people there who are ovdei Hashem who actually want to daven and learn and and and be mekadesh shem shamayim, and you don't. So, good. I'm glad we pulled you out of that and put you into a place where you belong. Remember, gehennam doesn't have to be fire and whips. It could be a kiddush club. You'll go to olam haba where everybody else is up in shamayim getting close to Hashem. You'll be frassing, having all the alcohol you want, sit there and have a great time, and that's you. That's your your gehennam. That's It doesn't need fire and pitchforks. It's great. You're in gehennam now. You left olam haba and you went to gehennam. Instead of being in shul where you could listen to divrei Torah and hear the kriat ha Torah and all these things, you decide to put yourself down in gehennam and eat and drink. So, good riddance. So, I don't know how anyone can justify it. Anyway, I hope that didn't sound too harsh. But I you may have picked up I have some strong feelings about this. And this is David Wolpe with that question and answers.