Was Ben-Gurion Halachically Allowed to Declare the State of Israel?

Good morning everyone. Ba and forun for of the week sponsored by Yudik honor of Shai's birthday in honor and memory of Yudi's grandmother's in memory of my our grandfather. >> What's which what date? What's the date today? >> 24th test. We know, we know, we know, we know >> Michael and Cindy Leafy >> in memory of Leora Bzel. >> He literally killed you with his eyes. >> The fins. I gave love with my eyes. >> Uhhuh. >> The if were coming out of a uh a cave right now, it would be very dangerous. >> And by the for >> okay this is a new topic that we're doing today we pass these around and yeah today will be the last learning that we're having for this man in this safer and the last share we'll do is this going to be this this Friday okay so this is A fascinating topic very very interesting one everyone has. >> Yeah. >> Let's look inside. >> Do you have you have it? Okay. So the this is a uh if you look at the quote it's page 100. Page 100. Matsi. Matsi is a uh warlord meaning the matsb the the head of the of the how do you approach means a risk are you allowed to take risks in war so we have to what we're going to be seeing this obviously through aik frame and through a hashkovic frame as well because this is very much kash to our to our inyan very much kur to everything that we've been learning but it really goes to the beginning because this is dealing with the roots of why there's opposition to zionism and just brushing it off like we've learned already will lead you nowhere and it doesn't bring to any a and incorporating into our into our uh looking at am you have to we must understand why it's whether you even if you hold obviously that the foundation and the proclamation of the of the founding of the state of Israel is a part of the guula and everything there's a huge chunk in amra that does not see it like that right now who is included amongst those that don't see it like that >> many many people that we learn from and that we we there there are massive inspirations I mean I'll just give a very I'm just going to say it right now because I don't want to shy from it. Um, Lubavich, tell me something about Kabad. Are they Are they Zionists? >> No. >> Absolutely not. Are they the biggest Are they the biggest lovers of Erit Israel >> and of Ami Israel? Absolutely. Are they going against the government against the Medina? No. There are those that hold that like like Lavich that it's this is not the head this beginning of the there's a a famous letter from the furbi that refers to the proclamation of the state as absolute darkness because when you think that something is that it's not that's very that that's when it becomes very dangerous >> and it's it boiled down to this thing of like um such uch a divide. But I want us to I want us to get out of the divide and realize it does it really matter if I call it a certain name or not? like do it does it how much does it matter >> that I title something this is the actual beginning of gula versus I don't know if I have the the shoulders to to I I can I really say this is the beginning of redemption and but yet I feel that this is a massive massive jump towards the gula does it how much does it mamish matter and I think we get stuck in these things way too much way too much about saying is it or isn't it like I don't know to me the healthiest approach is not make not getting stuck in taking aside on saying it is or it isn't but just looking at am and looking at Israel and with our hearts and with our love and I see your faces you all want to throw a chair at me right now I don't you know I don't really care but >> a stool >> a stool okay but um this is these are important in yanim but it it boils down to this was it mutar for Bengurian to to to declare that to declare a a state so even like you say what do you mean was it mutar or not like why wouldn't it be mutar and how what would be if he didn't right let's learn instead of just having our opinions and our blood boiling the whole purpose of these sharim is again to learn these things inside everyone's okay it's like and we've done we've done heavier things Huh? Is everyone okay? >> Not that much. >> Shocker, Stephan. Shocker. >> On a on a bright note, I spoke to Roshiva yesterday. >> Say it again. >> I spoke to C H A. >> No, he spoke to a Roshiva yesterday. >> It's amazing. No, no, but it's amazing. Do you see like >> But we can't use that word. >> No, no, no, no. Whatever he's gonna say now is all is all will all be through this lens of what of how he defined the Roshi Shiva. >> It's true. But yes, two days ago you were talking about sing not like not not like sing like a not not like a misnag. So what is >> no that's different because there's no >> because there's no heter to be a misnag. >> Pardon? >> There's no heter to be a misnag. >> Okay very good. But there's a heter to be a >> in the wisdom of Solomon. Thank you. >> Um, >> we all see things through our lenses. >> Yeah. But but but that but but but the problem is is that >> he may have something very much that may speak to our right now but because he said >> but it's true if the person defines as if somebody self-def >> you're going to shut up now right? >> Hold on. Hold on. >> No. But you have to come to for Shabas to understand why I don't because I'm talking about this on Shabas every shabas. Now >> every shabas it's the root of the root of it >> the root of mlo is is not >> opinions it's division it's division and somehow because we live in the world if I walked into a yeshiva and I said I want to tell you I spoke to a Zionist rabbi and they said avort >> they throw you out. Not that they throw me out, they won't hear. They they shut down. >> I ever meant quote Russ. They look at me like a >> I crazy. >> Okay. But you know what? I'm you want me to play devil's advocate and if I said other names of Rabbim that you for you are you can't handle you can't stomach but that's not true. My house is filled with representative. >> I'm just saying it's Steve. Steve >> the label >> deep breath >> enoughali this better be good >> it's >> this if this is like it's so >> but it reminds me of one other thing that happened >> okay >> anyways the small anecdote was that this this rusha from America was >> oh from America no I'm kidding I'm kidding I'm kidding fine go >> that's completely that's completely No, it's not. >> Look at this. No, no, we're not going off the rails. Look at us. >> No, no, but >> this is exactly what I'm talking about. This is right. This is exactly what I'm talking about. >> It's exactly what I'm talking about in a different way. >> That's why you have to be of the Rebi and just say a rabbi said a Roshiva said z in my opinion. Yes. >> No, no. I'm saying the important thing came to me after this whole but he was saying how this big half gut today. They're doing they're doing chro of of of protest going on. >> Right. You you just showed me >> 19. >> He was actually telling me he said he said the beautiful thing is at least all these different you never go to get to go out together. There's already >> cuz they're neg but I realized I was I was with Rabbi Norman Lamb Sham's son yesterday upstairs. He was here. >> He was one of the >> Yeah, he was one of the people >> which one >> really? >> Yeah. So he so he was here yesterday and I remember growing up in these yeshivas and his father was considered >> the worst like >> the first thing you said to him >> cuz just I don't know anything >> your >> your father was I grew up your father was a was a >> first of all we just finished interviewing a vegan so having a guy named lamb right off the bat was it was Mitsu no but I realized how am I strugg I I I didn't grow up in the wu world so to me all I heard was I didn't know if this guy was from I just knew this guy no for me that was like the ultimate that's unfortunately but I realized talk because when I was in that room with in between that I was messaging with this and Rab was saying how he grew up with like death threats in his house like his father was like under vicious and gifter and this and that came out against him and I realized that the I'm speaking to was a commodifter and I realized that beneath all the headlines and politics and this is really loves each other. Bet they do on on a human on a personto person level. I was speaking to the source of Shiva who was a gift gifter and I was in a room with Rabbi with Rabbi Lamson and I realized that >> we're all bet underneath everything we're all one and all this politics and all this >> be the other story that came up you mentioned the American rabbi that Jen's Jen brought up and like she out of her also she didn't want to mention this but she said >> yeah see not everyone watches podcast. I don't know. >> Yeah, we're trying to get numbers. Uh yeah, back. But uh she said that it took a while to find her son Binyam's fillin in Gaza and had it and they finally ended up getting the tillin back weeks later and her other son was becoming bar mitzvah. Ah, here's the til they're going to give. And they're at the placeel, you know, because putting the filling on the there was an American rub there. And so she she was saying this the difference between your shamani and and an American and Bavi she said he came over he goes is that is that you know this thin and she goes yeah you know >> who who asked that >> this this American Rob she wouldn't say this American ra was there she just defined it as that and yeah so he said yeah >> it's nothing forget it she's like what do you mean forget it like you know so finally like like a bother like a week or two she goes what do you mean goes well you how the Yemens was his brother. He was killed in the Gaza and the like I don't know it probably reminds him all the time of like of of of it and like I just I don't I'm just a little surprised that you would have him wear it. She was by Raasher Weiss and she says you know like uh we have the film and now God lives and he's wearing it and he's the holiest that's an aliyah. She stopped me when I said fallen soldier. She was stopped, >> right? She It's not a name she and so and she the way she interpreted it was that this is just like like the Tom the the the harasha that it it that you were showing me babbling. So even when you do say American there there's there's something >> there. There's something there. There's something there. >> It's a huge just a huge difference. See >> there is though even >> but we're even even the Torah that's passed obviously. >> I know but we're trying to find what's not different. You know yesterday >> my dear friend Yam Shakar he told me in a gal thing that he wrote up for for giml how it came out in it's a sorry but it came out in paras not like by right >> you just did it yourself. No, no. I'm I did it to point out how it's it doesn't even matter sometimes. MTor, >> you said a beautiful thing. He said that thing was it's so easy to gather people together to form a neg to form something that's that's against it's that that's not a that's not a like the fact that there's a today because all these different groups are forming together to go against something and it's not so beautiful the whole anti-semitism of course the whole the whole the depth is what the rebi formed people to be together for not against things. That'sma that's the greatness of the rebi of the rebi >> to gather people together to be four. That's that I I hope that the bottom line of what we're doing here um is the same thing is maven to the same thing. It's not an in of trying to convince the convinced. It's not the the Indian to try to make sure that we are stronger in our life's choices. But it's tapa to see when we learn inside a si like this and we ask a question. Was it right that Bengurian was it okay that Bengorian proclaimed a a a a country a state? We're not doing it to show more divide. We're doing it to understand how people could be against it and not just brush them off as mug because they don't believe like us because it doesn't work. Nothing comes out of just showing how we're right. It doesn't help anybody. Okay. But we're right. Kidding. So the question is asking the question is when do we say um don't be don't be frightened don't be scared you're a little bit of people but go out against the masses. says, "You don't have that much weaponry, but don't worry, there'll be a miracle." And when do we say like the Rambam Baskins, you don't rely on miracles, and you avoid going out to war, not because you don't think the enemy needs to be wiped out, but because practically in a mitzious level and down to earth on a realistic level, it seems that this is not the right thing to do. Obviously, I know what you're all thinking. If that was the approach then we should have never even come here because and our existence even today is completely anace. It doesn't add up. It doesn't make sense that uh you know Lebanon, Syria, Turkey, Iraq, Jordan, Iran, Egypt. Sorry. No, there's peace accords, right? Yeah. It's very >> who we have the Yemen like it doesn't make sense. How about resistance during the holocaust? They should have. So this was the question of and his sons also right. This is also the question that's in front of all the eyes of those that are elect are you know our officials that are elected officials. when got up in Tel Aviv, right? What what was he thinking? Like you're you're you're you're proclaiming there's there's a state here, right? Is that in some is that is that is that relying on a miracle or was there was actual like tactic involved there analyzing the situation and saying I think it could work. So to any bardaz you have to understand that that proclamation is much more like matia ubanav like the story of kaneka then or like you could say like nakshon >> um you know the only thing is non believed in god so there's a little bit of a difference going on over there but we'll get back to that later >> call was that wasn't exactly Bengurian's call unfortunately >> we laugh no >> but then when we think about why it's not so pushet for many people to accept what he did. You can't just brush it off. And malas, of course, we'll still hold what we're holding, but you can't just brush off the fact that so many Jew god-fearing Jews who were dinging for 2,000 years that the return to Israel is a godly movement. And the person that's leading it, it's I I don't want to say bad things about him. It's not my Indian either, but it's when we for 2,000 years when we said, >> it didn't exactly pan out the way that it's come about. That's all I'm going to say for now. I'm going to be pushing your buttons the whole Shia today. It's fine. >> Come about the way that we anticipated him to come out. >> Did come about the same way we anticipated him to come out? I'm saying like >> was there even anticipation in the time of David? >> The way and did it work? Wait a second. Did it work out? Did it work out the sh the way Hashem wanted? I don't know. Did do you think Hashem wanted to build the B mdash? >> Well, it worked out the way to it down. We're not in >> chill. Chill. >> This is me. Chill. >> I know. the same way that you >> I love you. >> I'm angry with just one message. >> I'm not angry. I'm >> passionate. >> My my passion is Mr. Guys. Guys, this is my This is one of my Reb is talking. I It's okay. That That question is a very loaded question. Did it pan out the way Hashem wanted? You want to go through Dame's life and answer that question? It it did because it happened. >> Oh, so did the disengagement and so did Oslo, >> right? >> Does it mean it was the right thing to do? >> Does that mean it's the right thing to do? >> It it happened. So, >> does it mean it's the right thing to do? >> It happened. >> Maz. We don't act like that. >> So, >> we don't act like we don't live like that since happened. That wasn't the >> right, but it happened. Of course, you could say everything's after the ma. >> Um, but but we're not acting like let's see how we could the brains out of ourselves. Wouldn't it be nice once in our lifetime to actually live a life or at least attempt to? >> Do you have any example of that? >> The fact that it's now doesn't mean that >> um have we ever lived a life? What if maybe there's that small window there really we were on top of the world? >> Um just a moment 50 m >> wives horses come on >> and even then >> maybe there was a couple golden years >> there was >> other than have we ever >> and we're the ones that are going to do >> to continue our conversation from yesterday. Yes. There's no stereo. Whatever was was doesn't m Why should that Why should it be that even if it never was the way that I'm we're describing it right now? That means that that means that it shouldn't be. I don't know. I don't understand. >> I can only look to history to see how it doesn't mean I need to keep doing the same things, but the the way our history is is bitty at it. >> It's just the way it is. >> Break the cycle. No, no, he he's it's he'd rather hold on to the galus mentality because it's safer. I understand. >> Our history is because there's never been we're not so obviously everyone's made mistakes in the course of history. >> Shil do I choose to live or not since that's the truth. So do I choose to live in even the say would say it's and he's like the of right we don't ever have a certainty that's part of our problem we're no longer living in days of where if the said do this and we don't we can easily say we did not do the which is to follow the noi without >> let's say like this >> all we can do is what we think at the moment to be correct and hopefully listening to thumb and we choose which godle somehow pierces our hearts. >> Let's let let's say like this. How about we choose one area of life that we're going to live and let's see if it works. Okay. Now, what's the one one one place I'm choosing to to to guide direct us towards that every yid wants is shine. that every yid wants the best and every yid in his heart like you were saying before is I'm gonna work from that. How's that threatening? >> Sounds great. >> Yeah. >> Can we start from there? Yeah. That's how the rebi lived. That's lived like level and and that's what I'm trying to do with with the way that we're going through this. >> Can we exclude driving? >> Excuse me. >> Can we exclude driving? Paul, we've waited. We've waited for the revelation. Yes. Yes. We can exclude drivers. Yes. Okay. Let's go back into this very simple text that we're that we're learning today. Again, second paragraph. He barely had soldiers. >> They weren't even trained. They were, you know, >> three years three years uh post Ashwit. So it may have taken a few minutes to get, you know, to get to get strong again. He had we just we have no of this. The amount of enemies that were so much more powerful than we were back then. How could you even have had religious ministers, observant Orthodox ministers voting in favor of proclaiming that there's a there's a new entity. It's called Medinat Israel. Meaning the question that revel is is asking which is a gav one. He's saying based on how we hold that we don't rely on miracles. It's not the way we rely. It's not it's not how we live. How could it be that they were so much in favor for it's a very interesting he's talking right now. It's a very interesting question. >> Is that okay with everyone so far? >> No. I I just want to draw a parallel. Yeah. Mohera Rabenu took Amish out from Adusu Awitz of of hundreds of years >> to believe that they could go out and do what they had to do. They were being and they only got the nissim after they had where what am I going to eat brought didn't promise them and we expect them throughout and there are kajbar who gets upset with him and moa for sure gets upset with them because they're not ming how can you expect so there's a parallel when we went out of Awitz into somehow create a state what was the alternative for the Jewish No, mana was falling down from heaven when we came out of Ashwitz. >> No. No. >> You mean your you had a consistent well of water nourishing you while you came out of Ashwitz? >> I'm not saying that. >> You drew you drew a parallel to a time where these things were happening. >> There wasn't a consistent well of water until after they had they went out and after they were supposed to believe that they were going >> and since 1948 there's been >> lots of Nissim lots of Nissim. We've had we've had infinite amount. We've spoken about it all the time. None of them are like the nissim gluim that took place when in the era that you're describing. >> The nissim gluim around us daily. But you believe it. I know you've made that Steve. I I'm the big I'm the biggest proponent of it. But I'm trying to >> but we're looking at people again again Steve to try to push that right. That doesn't work. It doesn't work. So you'll you'll go home and you'll be much more confident in Yeah, exactly. It works for you >> that we are doing what we have to do. >> You say there but I'm trying to >> we could keep on saying that which we already convinced of and that which works for us. But that that's not why we get together and sit and learn. I know. I I'm I'm sorry. It's not it's not what I it's not what interests me. to hear and learn the different >> we haven't even gone through >> I know >> so far we've we've barely gotten through two paragraphs that the shila we're putting a shila out there the shila is is it is it mutar was it mutar for religious >> right to vote in favor of the proclamation of the medina at a time at a time where that seemed insane Now all of us are beneficiaries of the fact that they did right but that still doesn't take away from us we need to ask that that's all we're doing >> the same shila is was it mut for many raon at the time to say better you should give up your physical life but your should live on and don't go to that accursed he hasn't he hasn't asked that question yet >> both of those >> I'm learning from a safer he hasn't asked then >> okay >> cuz we don't have a nave we have to follow >> yeah but that actually proves their point even more >> of course we don't know >> the fact that there is no nvas that's what I'm saying we just need to let him ask a question I'm trying to explain it that's it yeah >> out of total ignorance when Bengurian made the declaration yeah >> the these were already living in Israel and he made um he made al not allocations. He made He made it so that they would want to support him. >> Did they Did he >> do you know who all these Do you know who all the the the anti It's amazing. Do you know who really all the people that are suffering from the fact that there's a problem with the draft? Who really they should blame? All of them. Not not I'm saying from the the Zionist parties. >> Bengurian >> Bengurian. It's it this did not start in the 80s with the rise of ultraorththodoxy in the 70s. >> Yes. This was rooted this is rooted >> in the foundation of the state of Israel. This is not a kdushesh. >> No, that that's exactly what I'm saying that they supported him because of the of what he allowed them to do. >> I don't know if they It's hard to say they supported him. >> They acquies, >> right? That that's a better >> but as Rash was saying the at that time they did they did >> included >> included god-fearing people >> so I'm not as ignorant as I thought that >> I don't know no okay obviously the question we took it to a completely different area which I guess Hashem wanted to cuz it happened >> however I will try to Take I'm going to try to take the No, I'm I'm actually not today either. I'm trying to take the wheel back. >> Oh, >> I'm trying to take the wheel back. Now, the question obviously comes >> over the >> Huh. >> Me too. Me too. >> That's why we're all acting up. We don't want to let you >> I know. I know. I know. I know. This all boils down to the Shila. >> Should we bomb with >> Okay. Now we all know that Nissim Ven flows took place with the with the attack and we we don't have the kalin to we have zero kalin to really comprehend what happened um with with all these attacks that we've done in Iran. It doesn't anything you say anything you say does not add up. It doesn't add up. None of it none of it adds up. >> This was written before that correct? Mhm. >> This was writt in I'll tell you why I'm conf I'm not sure because this what we're learning from is a edited version of the first version that came out which was definitely before. I don't know. We'll have to see based on how he how he brings it out. You know, my wife was speaking about this all the time that the first time we bombed Iran, there was this huge like this like ana. Why? Because growing up here in this country, whoever grew up here, as you know, I've been here from fourth grade, Iran, even saying that word, your body shook. There was a fear. You're you're you were raised with this crazy fe intense scary like vicious fear. Just mentioning their name and even thinking of messing with them would cause you to what's that >> with the big bad wolf. >> Like so then when we then when we we took over their airspace in about 35 seconds >> what what is that exactly? Right. And on the other hand, they are pretty powerful because they're still not, you know, after everything they they went through, they're still around like and they're vodk around. So it's very very it's very weird. So the shila he has here is like okay with that promise. So is it mut to go and bomb Iran if you're if you're working alim because that's that that seems to be there's no shave shave over here going on. You know how I told you what happened with I bought a globe. Did I tell to you guys? I think it was women she I bought a little globe in in Muldova. I couldn't find anything else to buy for my kids coming home from from Ukraine. So I I found a little globe. I love globes. I I love globe. I always I always loved playing with globes and mama like learning the you know the the countries and everything. So I was showing them and it's a little globe and it's from Aldova. So there's not even really a mention of is of Israel. a dot, an orange dot on it. Then Nah, he asked me, "Where's Iran?" >> So I showed him and he saw how big Iran was. And I'm like, "How come I'm not freaking out from the fact that it really is like that?" Cuz I got used to living in a in a state of of of miracles. That's it. That's the only difference. Because when you look at it, it What does the say? What how did it guide and his sons in the time of the story of Kaneka? And how does it guide us today with questions that if there's a you're saving hundreds of thousands of lives and if there's a kishalon if there's a god forbid a failure you're bringing upon what you're bringing upon is >> it similar to what am struggling with during the just before the role in kurban we were divided should we be fighting should we be accepting >> could Ah, now he's asking even a better question. How could it be that there were that told their students to vote for or against the Oslo Accords? So against the Oslo Accords, we could understand our could totally understand this. Um against O but you all know how Oslo pulled through, right? Like how how did how were they able to get the Oslo courts to be voted in? >> People switched >> it's it's scary. And it's also one member of he was the last the guy that a year later got caught smuggling bunch of ecstasy pills from Amsterdam into into the country. You guys don't remember this. You weren't around. Mama crazy. >> They got a spike for Iran also. >> That's something else. That's something else. >> No, they bought off of one. So he asks here are these should these questions just should just be asked to you know asked uh proposed as questions to the strategic minds to the to theistim what's called you know every single person who's a betist it's like everyone knows exactly what to do because they have this rich um you know security uh this rich history of being a top general in some area of uh you know Medina or should you invite involved or should a Jew does a Jewish state need to incorporate the council of Talm in these matters? Now, if you say yes, then you'll say, well, that they did that with Oslo and then you got the Oslo Accord signed, which can make you insane. That's what they'll say. Shiloh, we have to ask really is how do you go about asking these questions? And I I'm say something because you look like you're gonna not just throw a chair at me after this year. You you look like you're going to move to Florida right now or or or or move to Bethlehem. I don't even know which one. >> I was there too >> because I know what you're thinking and I'll say that I dig I dug deep into this right now. Ravoia was fooled. Okay. That's a deep heart supposed to be full. >> Take that up with him. I'm I'm not that's I I can't go into there right now. Of course, they're not supposed to, but he was take they they they pulled one on him that afterwards we have documentation of him saying basically dwelling. >> He was screaming saying had I known that it was X Y and Z >> of dual never >> like in a >> just to put things into context. No, but you have you will have to deal with Y's statement afterwards. I'm not I'm not dealing with it right now. >> So >> now we're saying we're saying let's go deep into the into the practical question and we're going to end with this. This is like a very this last piece. This is very he's saying that about his father. You know, I had I'm telling you I'm a little bit traumatized and I don't take talk about this too much, but this is something that I I I don't I haven't really dealt with. I was on stage with Rav Morai summer yalim >> my guitar >> 21 years ago >> with your guitar with Kip. Yes, I was there. I was mamish. Right next to the gon at saddic of it was yu shalim. There's 100,000 people in the crowd. That was that year was the year of the girush which was about to happen. So the whole crowd I'm seeing a sea of orange cuz everyone was wearing the orange bands and you felt very much at home that year. >> So happy to be here. >> The orange cuz Yeah. Were you you were there that year? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You were here. I met you right before then. Right. And and Raa got up on the stage and I'll never forget this because we're freaking out. It's like, "Oh my god, this is actually happening. We're two months away from two months away when it's supposed to happen. The country is on fire." Okay, the country is on fire. Fire. And uh confusion. And he got on stage he said he said it won't be it won't it won't happen. and the crowd. I'll never forget this. Wow. Shaga loy. And that was the only way that, you know, I felt like I could continue playing. You know, I I cuz cuz it was crazy. You know who else was up there also? The person that's trying to run again to become prime minister. >> He was right there next to him. >> NB. >> Huh? Yeah. Right there. at the time the head of Moh was already in he was already coming into politics it was I I couldn't believe this stuff it was crazy the he would always say the order of how you pass regarding it's true the Torah takes into consideration specialists in certain areas but they always have different agendas as well. There are different other agendas. every time before David went out to wage war that's what the says there were three categories there happening meaning that would counsel with the first one was he was an he's very interesting because when you learn you see he also was the y of of sha meaning his he was a mum Okay, he was a but it wasn't just that. Then he says after you heard what they have to say the was there and they had to give their guidance and counsel and also you ask the so so it's not just like strategic it's both with with it has to be with and even when the weren't there already even. So now what are we doing? It's straight bamish like like even if you want to say that what you you it's everything is Torah Torah Torah and nothing else matters. Well even the time no you actually have to have strategic minds giving you an assessment of the situation. But the thing is is that if you want to say that, you also have to say, but you also need meaning you can't have one without the other. It has to be both. Which brings us exactly to the situation that we're in today. When we go out and wage war when we do these things, who's basically sitting there at around that table? Not only the military supposedly and and let's say it's called the right. It's like a smaller cabinet, right? >> So you may say, listen, there's sitting on the Indian of Sanin dealer, right? What we're trying to show here is that maybe up until now we've gotten to a lot of messes because we haven't acted like this yet. But I think rely is always pushing us to look an an to a way forward and a way forward means that we have to dream of a yes situation is both the all those of Ginsburg we're dreaming of a of establishing a situation which we can't give up on. The point of what we're trying to see to sing today and we'll end with this. The point of what we're trying to show us today is that it's not so pash either way. You're we're forced into a into av mitus of clearly almost total annihilation of all European jury which at that time was what percentage of the Jewish population of the world? >> Does anyone know? >> One third. >> A third >> European jury were only one third. >> I thought it was one. Yeah, I think it was like 7%. >> I thought it was more. Okay, whatever whatever it was a substantial substantial amount, right? So, we're coming and we're saying, listen, if we don't get our acts together somehow, it's be the end of the story. Anyone that can't hear that wants to choose to live a life of if you can't hear that, then you really just saying, "Okay, so everything's we we have to just live like a nice all the time." That doesn't that's not our shittita either. But proclaiming a state could also be looked at as if you're just building on a miracle as well. Yeah. Right. Also the ko like we saw who are you fighting against? Who who's against who in the time of Bengurian? So all these shilas are good to ask. You have to ask these questions and realize the reality we're in is very but it doesn't exempt us from trying to create a situation of and Sanhedrin and of course the bumin that is what we need to go for and that is baserem what we will be going for because there is no other way nothing it won't work any other way that's for sure it won't work any other way there's a lot a lot a lot more to learn a lot more to learn I give us a to learn for from for many more years this and all the things pertaining to where we're at right now in life and razor hem we should continue to witness nim flow without relying on them >> and pes wants to say something >> yeah on a practical level just taking what we've been working on these last number of weeks uh and you know talking about how it's not going to it's not going to come from from from the top down. >> Bottom up, >> bottom up, >> bottom up. >> And so, and so I what I've really been asking myself is, well, well, what's what's the way forward with it from that from that place that starts with each one of us? And what's really been I've been hearing it very clearly is you know what everybody's saying, but uh how much can we really call out if we don't also have that as a father, what's more important? That I have a great relationship with my own kids. That's wonderful. But does it really does it bother me when I see my own kids don't get along? Isn't that what's really that's what's more important to me is that my own kids should get along. I can only take from that that I I believe that more important than that wants to hear more and that is something that I believe can only happen from the bottom up that if we're if we're walking away from from from these last few weeks of learning that it starts with each one of us to see it from that place to create that as the frame >> that regardless just get being free of all the bonus of why is he doing that and what and all the we have about everybody else's uh just that's the only thing and maybe that's ignorance I don't know but at the very least >> that creates some sense of saying you know what what's best for us what does really want for us to that we should all be getting along So maybe we should say instead of >> that's what I'm getting from what you're saying >> or to say with >> as long as God is only bashim I could afford to like not get along with each other. >> That that brings up a beautiful thing. I heard the end of the famous thing at the end of talks about how the end of days this is going to happen this is going to happen and we read it like and I heard an explanation that that's actually one of the things that the end of the days people oh it's all up to God in heaven like that's what's >> oh not as if like >> not as if it's a good thing it's one of the negative things all we're doing is relying on God and not actually doing on us Kazaki