Standing Up When It’s Not Easy - Mark Meyer Appel- S2-Ep16

that rabbis are still obstructing prosecution of child abuse cases. And they started telling me the abuse. It was unbelievable. I said, "Listen, you guys don't have a spokesman. >> I'll be a spokesman." And these the a full-time job of covering up abuse. Why would they do that? The biggest problem facing the Jewish community is tuition. Like, what are you I asked him, "Why are you looking at me? Am I a monkey? Why are you looking at me? just do the right thing. It's not normal. The 63% of hate crimes are against Jews. >> The campaign that I started, it's called unity not hate. There's some kabong and you see black people, people, Jewish people, Muslim people dancing together. >> What price did you pay uh personally? Did you lose good friends or relationships? Okay, my guest today is Mark Mayor Appel. Mark is an advocate who spent years speaking up when staying silent would have been easier and safer. He was also the founder of a special ed school, early intervention years ago. Mark doesn't sugarcoat things. He doesn't. soften on the truth. He doesn't soften on the emis. This is just who Mark is. Mark, welcome to the struggle. >> Thank you. Nice to be here. See you in person. >> Thank you. Thank you so much for coming in. So, before we even start, we're going into uh the depth of who Mayor Appel is. I want to know uh where did you grow up? >> We grew up in Crown Heights. My father came here after the after the war. He lost his wife and four children during World War II. >> Then he married my mother who was a cousin. And we lived in cride like everybody else lived in the lower east side. And then we moved to Crown Heights where we spent a considerable amount of time. We dedul on Crown Street. That's Bianca Vas. And then we moved later in the years we moved to Burough Park. Man, how did you get involved with um standing up for abused children? You're known for this. And uh >> yeah, I had no I had never met any anybody that was abused or neither was I and my family, anybody that was abused. But I was living in Manhattan and my townhouse >> and I went out to the street on Rashishana and there was like 20 boys that came to Tash on the on the west side on the highway by the river by the Hudson. They were all from very prominent family. I asked him, "What's your family name?" I knew his father. I do his father, one was a sab, one was labe and I sort of adopted this whole group and they would come every Thursday night to my house. I'd serve him cho and teugu they weren't religious at all. I asked them where they ded. They said they stopped off at St. Patrick's Cathedral to pray. I'm still very good friends with these with this whole group, you know, and one by one, you know, I got close to them, you know, we we we hung out together, went to restaurants together, and they started telling me their abuse. It was unbelievable. I said, "Listen, you guys don't have a spokesman. >> I'll be your spokesman." So, every every year for 13 years, I traveled to Albany. I took a van, two vans. I took a rabbi tennib who was the head of the rebbitical alliance of America passed away passed away it's already 10 years I think 10 years >> he passed away and uh he would drive us and we would go to Albany we would lobby assembly people the assembly woman at that time who sponsored the bill the the marquee bill which was later changed to the child victims act I never in my life thought that this bill was going to pass >> and this is the moving the statute of limitations >> it's removing the statute of limitations is only for one year >> that you can go back and sue your rebi for 50 years. >> Problem with the rabbis today, the problem with the rabbis today, people ask me, you criticize rabbis. The problem is is is they're in a conflict of interest, >> you can't have a a monitor. You can't have somebody working for less tuition or less less tuition or for to help out people if you own the institution. If you're from the inside, >> if you're from the inside, right, you need, you know, there's a there's so much, by the way, there's so much good done in the community. The reason why I have a good report today with the black and Hispanic community is because I tell them and I explain to them between Hollah and Tom Shabas, the services that we deliver that the government should be delivering amounts to billions of dollars. >> Yeah. If we gave the mayor of the city of New York $1 billion or $5 billion, start a hot network, can he do that? >> No. >> I had surgery in March. After surgery, I had some complications. Four times I went with Hatsella to to an emergency room. Once on Friday night and three times in during the week. I mean, this organization, nobody in the world can do that. >> No. So instead of highlighting on the good stuff, you know, some people, some rabbis for some reason or another became involved in coverups, including right here in in Muny, >> right? >> The two prominent rabbis in Muny that make a living. It's not it's not like a part-time job. It's a full-time job >> covering up >> covering up abuse. They get paid from the perpetrator. They get paid money. >> Yeah. I know them. One of them is a distant relative of mine >> and they're prominent rabbis here. They have the mayor comes here, the governor comes to their houses when they have a tragedy. I don't want to name the names, but you could probably figure it out, you know? And these the a full-time job of covering up abuse. Why would they do that >> right >> now? The Child Victims Act that passed, it already paid millions of dollars to to victims. had it already paid out. But it's a bill. I'm not saying the bill was perfect. You know, uh people said, "Well, why go back 50 years?" You know, the yeshiva 50 years ago, they had a different board, different >> Yeah. >> Most yeshivas have assurance today, but it put the it put the rabbis in place. It put them in place. It put them in a way that it's out of your control. It's now in the control of the people. You know, you had people like Rosenberg, they got hell from the community. He paid a dear price. >> I can tell you one thing about Rabbi Rosenberg. I haven't spoken to him for a while. But Pesak Purim Sukus Rashim Kipper. I would personally pick him up by car because he didn't drive. He didn't have a car and deliver packages in Williamsburg and Burough Park to families that were abused. Deliver food parcels. Sadic. >> Yeah. >> But why is it so important the compensation for the victims? Because is it giving them u closure? Closure >> glossure is giving them peace knowing that uh they're heard and understood >> and and and uh >> gives it a sort of it's a closure. A lot of a lot of the a lot of lot of victims have told me they've taken most of the money and and and put it back into education. >> Wow. >> They put me >> Wow. >> And look at look what happened with the trial. You know, there still it's still an ongoing u it's still an ongoing saga, you people still talking about it >> and all of a sudden everybody wants him out, you know. >> Yeah. >> I know the Brooklyn District Attorney gave a letter and I'm close to the Brooklyn District Attorney. He's been he comes to all of my events and um I uh it's it's not nobody nobody except the close people of the family know what the crime that he committed was much much worse than sexual abuse. H >> I can't get it on on camera, but the abuse that he did was mental >> cruel and physical physical harm. >> All of a sudden, everybody cares about about justice and equal justice. We're not equal. We don't compare ourselves to to criminals in the in in other communities. We care about protecting our community. >> And you were involved oneonone with the victims, right? >> Yeah. Yeah, I know. >> You were standing over there and uh supporting them when it wasn't popular. When it was it was >> No, it wasn't popular. I was at the trial, you know, and uh the family went through a lot. They went through so much and thank God they have two children now, healthy children. They live in the area and they're happy, you know. >> Wow. Now, you during the years you did you make a lot of enemies because of what you're standing up for? >> Of course. Of course. So when you go on the radio and you mention the rabbi's name and I used to I'm trying not to mention it today people you mention them one by one and say their goals and their objectives and you know what you know what they're really after you know really what what they you don't make too many friends but I didn't care I didn't care about that you know I didn't care about that because eventually eventually >> they all know they have a serious problem and you know what the biggest rebas in the world today the biggest reb including here in in in Muny, including Burough Park, Williamsburg, the biggest rabbists today >> all had children or grandchild. >> Yeah. Yeah. Nobody is uh >> Nobody's immune to this. >> Yeah. >> Now, what kind of push back do you remember that you got? Was it sometimes real that it made you think twice of what you >> No. No. I never thought twice. There was nothing for them to say. They didn't have a ground. As a matter of fact, all these organizations, they do wonderful work when it comes to dafay, when it comes to this, they do good work, but they should stay out of politics. Really that I can say on the air. I promise to behave and not to really criticize, but they should stay out of politics. Started for day to increase learning the Torah to increase learning learning the rashi and kish and and the pisk and everything. That's what they should be. They should not be involved in politics. The people that are involved over there are worthless. The biggest problem facing the Jewish community is tuition, right? >> Yeah. >> And those phony those phony uh schools in Israel, right? What do they call them? Seminaries, right? The phony seminaries. >> People pay $25,000 to to send their daughter to a seminary to be locked in a building. >> I don't know if you know if you read the paper three months ago, they locked these girls in a building in a fire broke out. and they couldn't get out. >> Mhm. >> Luckily, a neighbor broke the lock and got them out. You know, she paid for $25,000, you can take your wife and four kids, go to Israel, rent an apartment, rent a car, and have a good time, >> right? So, where are they? Where are people paying to regular people that live in Burough Park at Flatbush Crown Heights? Where they getting $15,000 a year tuition? Where are they getting their money from? >> It's mindboggling. So where is the voices? There should be an outrage in the community at these rabbis. Why they don't open their mouths? >> Yeah. So what you're saying is that they're from the inside. >> They're from the inside. >> It's their institutions. It's their moistas and it all boils down to uh what is it in for me? >> Yeah. Exactly. >> What you're saying is there's no there's no honesty. There's no there's no backbone. There's no they're not standing up for what's right, for the truth. This is generations. This is people's lives. >> And that's why that's why you have communities throughout New York and Long Island where I live in Long Island >> in five towns in burough parking. Slowly shoes are shoes are springing up all over. >> Yeah. >> Like I don't know that you have a shul in your house, right? >> Small communities of 20 30 uh young families get together and start their own minion. They don't need a big rabbi to to to cover up their crimes. They they're happy. You know what I mean? They go to a shir. You have a guy like Rabbi Elli Stfensky. >> Sure. He's thousands of people. >> Thousands of people every day listen to his program. Other people that give lectures that are are are exceptional. You have this new organization called which is not so new. It's like five years old. Uh Daru. Yeah. Rabbi Hoffstead from Canada. Yeah. He had an event at the White SH in Farakawway two weeks ago. It was unccredible. Young people just interested in honesty and truth. >> They're not into political stuff. >> What you're saying is that people young people are waking up. >> Oh, waking up. Absolutely. >> They want to connect to Hashem. They want to connect. >> They want to connect. Yeah. >> And they're they're sick. They're like tired of the system. >> They're tired of the old system. The old system doesn't work. I was just reading a book about Yil Weinberg who was you know he was he was a big good he he died he died like I think 1967 he died weinberger and he was a big he he was the big he was accepted by everybody every Russa in the world accepted him but he started like a little bit of the modernization he gave an okay to make a bas mitzvah stuff like that no we need people like that Because every generation changes its level of of observance and it level of mismus. >> Every generation has to be has to be >> fitted into the right category you know. So how do you see uh when the difference when you grew up with your father and with the shs and today's young kids the way they're you know they're going about >> it's much much the reb first of all when I went to yeshiva the rebies were always Awitz survivors you know what I mean they had they let out all their energy they let out on us you know including including hitting us and smacking us around you know what I mean >> today's generation by young people that are really energized and motivated. Every block has a a new a new organization to help people out. Food pantries, clothing pantries, you know. >> Yeah. >> You see the positive in it that the What do you think about the technology? >> Technology is good. Technology, you know, if you use it the right way, it's it's a >> I go on I go on I go on on the internet twice, three times a week to listen to Rabbi Stfansky. He has all the this the props and the TV and he's and he's motivating young people. >> This Torah any time if someone wants to learn there's so much good stuff >> where you can use where if you channel it right >> it can be utilized for good stuff you know. >> Yeah. Now as far as um did you ever approach the institutions and the mois or rebas um personally you went down and you you you spoke to them and try to get a handle of what is going on. I mean >> I many moist principles because my family is from Mach and right >> we come from Dion and Rabon you know we a lot of institutions have called me privately >> and made sure don't you ever mention my name but what you're doing is the right thing to do >> but if you go to any yes yeshiva in Brooklyn to Turadas Veritzki right >> other yes flat but you'll see they have >> windows in the classroom they have a much better communic communication between the student and the principal. When I was young, you couldn't talk to the principal. If you talk to if you had to talk to the principal, you were in big trouble really, right? >> Yeah. >> So, you But today's is a new generation of young people that are committed. They don't have to do it and they do it, >> right? And um what surprised you the most when you saw that um you're not getting um you know the support like where were you shocked? You remember a story where you know you were advocating for something and and you were like I can't believe that this is happening. >> It happened by other trials I went to the rabbis I would speak to him directly. >> That's what I'm asking. >> I would speak to them directly. >> I said if this was your child what would you do? >> Yeah. >> And then just give me a blank steer till today. I could tell today is we're up. We're year 2026 already. Right. >> Yeah. I can tell you straight out right on this on this podcast that rabbis are still obstructing prosecution of child abuse cases >> because >> a major rabbon a respected rabbon >> yeah because of image and and then protecting families >> I met one of them at a wedding a few weeks ago and I said rabbi it's I knew your father I told the rabbi Davin with his father spinker I said I knew your father your father wouldn't appreciate appreciate that stuff. And he looks at me, he gives me that look like, you know, like, "What are you?" I asked him, "Why are you looking at me?" >> Yeah. >> Why are you looking at me? Am I a monkey? Why are you looking at me? Just do the right thing. >> Right. >> There's still an obstruction. There still a severe obstruction of cases, you know. Wow. >> That's behind the scenes that nobody knows. Now, was there ever a time that you uh you wanted to um quit? >> No. Somebody calls me up about a case. I said either go to psychologist or go to Amudim or go to other organizations that help. I mean, I I go to Albany a lot >> because I do I still do a lot of lobbying, multicultural lobbying, you know, that we'll talk about soon. I do a lot I do a lot of that stuff, too. So when I do, I mention it, but I I mention what's going on. Uh and I could tell I could tell you on the podcast, I'll be the first one to tell you there'll be one day when the child victims act will be for lifetime. >> Wow. >> Not for one year, >> right? >> I'm too busy with other things to be getting involved with that, but it's going to happen one day. >> What price did you pay uh personally? Did you lose good friends or relationships? >> No, there was double talking. I mean, you know, behind the scenes they would say one thing, but to me in my face they would say, you know, you're doing the right thing. >> Who was a prominent guy in the community um that gave you that was behind that that that you can feel that he you he had the head of he gave me >> he was a special man. >> Yes. And he was, you know, when he passed away, a good friend of mine, I'll talk to you about later, Mandy Morazzik, >> a rabbi from Staten Island, he became the the head of the >> right, but he was one person that did not was not afraid to stand up and put his name. >> Not only not only did he put his name, but he was the RV of the shul on 9th Avenue, Lynon Heights, young uh I think it was called Young Israel of Lynen Heights. He was the rabbi of the Shul. and he opened his door and we had for a couple of years we had a pistol seder for survivors. Now the second seder that we had was covered by the New York Times and New York Times had a picture of the seder on the front cover. >> Wow. >> So that was you know we had we had proclamations from elected officials. We had over a hundred people showed up for dinner. Had a full dinner. The New York Times was there. Uh other newspapers were there. And once once the New York Times and the New York Post were picking up the stories like on a daily basis, you know, it was history. >> Wow. And how was that cider that these these kids were getting together these >> there's a video of it, you know, >> and it's a >> there's a video of the safer on YouTube. You have a video of the >> because they they they I don't they're not going they're still with their families, but still there was a community of people who needed the special support, the special uh to feel seen. >> Yeah. And that was happening over there in his place. >> Yeah. I mean it was a beautiful it was a beautiful event. You know you have in order to get something done you have to get a media involved unfortunately you know. >> Yeah. Yeah. So what you're saying is that uh if someone was listening to this and he has a heart and he has a fire and he wants to be an Oscar and you're saying that one person you don't have to have a background and you don't have to be a professional. Um if you believe in something and if you have a passion for something you should get up. >> Absolutely. Absolutely. >> You should do it a one-man show. Absolutely. And then pinks are going to because what you guys did I remember for years ago at that time there was you and a few others who were the only ones. Everybody was sitting and watching and people could quietly tell you you know Mark you're doing a great job but you were the one who was standing over there and taking the heat with with with with no Rosenberg and a bunch of them. Yeah. >> When and why made you become an advocate as a young person um for the things you're doing? In the beginning, we were saying before that you had this um early intervention. >> I had an educational institution that serviced children that were born with developmental disabilities. >> Right. >> That was before they had early intervention. It was a court program, family court program. So every child that needed services they I would go to court. In 1985 the federal government the Congress passed the law the 19 extension of the special education law 1985 part H made it an entitlement. Entitlement means that the early intervention costs in every state across the country 50% of the of the costs are picked up by federal government and 25% by the state. So the city of New York that would spend 500 million would only have to spend 125 million. So that was a a big accomplishment you know but early intervention so that the viewers understand a child gets born cereable pulsy autistic or other developmental problems and if you don't let's say the child is born his legs are twisted you know he can't walk if you don't have early intervention this child is going to be in bed the rest of his life >> if you start at at birth which is early intervention starts at with you stretch out his leg, you have good physical therapy, occupational therapy, the child will be able to walk at least function as a human being and not be a burden on the family, >> right, >> to shle around. >> Now, you uh lobbyed for uh to change um plenty bills. >> The intervention bill was my first was my first bill. It was uh the federal government gave gave the states five years to come up with the plan. It was five years and New York didn't have a plan. So I called my my assemblyman at that time was dove hiken. He he connected me with Steve Sanders who was the chairman of the education committee in Albany and I told him I want to help him and he said glad. I said what's going on? He said I don't know I can't write the bill. And then we had testimony with at NYU. Uh and what I did I instead of making it a Jewish issue because unfortunately a lot of Bashkinazi Jews we have a higher rate of dis disabled infants. Instead of making it a Jewish issue, make it a general issue for everybody. >> Right? >> So I contacted at that time one of the most prominent black women in America, Mother Hail. President Reagan brought her to the state of the city state of the union message. She was sitting right next to him. >> I bought her. We had hearings at um New York University on Second Avenue, Manhattan. I testified. I came home. I was living in Brooklyn. I was living on East 10th Street and Avenue H. I took out a manual typewriter and I typed a bill. Wow. >> And that bill today, today hundreds of thousands of kids in New York State are getting early intervention because of that. >> Wow. >> And I still speak to Assemblyman Miss Sanders who was there who, you know, who retired from the state assembly. >> And I realized from this whole early intervention business that everybody has a knack for something. You know, you have a knack for doing the podcast, right? >> Yeah. >> People know you. I see a lot of people listen to you, right? >> Yeah. >> But I had a knack of be able to communicate. >> Yeah. >> Ideas only ideas I believe in. Something I don't believe in, I can't sell it. I can't passion. I can't sell it. I had a passion for it. >> So I no professional experience. I mean, you just sit down. >> No, it's not it's not something you pick up from school, you know. It's >> But where did you get that drive? The Askunas. This was always in your blood. I think my parents my father was at Oscan you know >> he was completely devoted to the community my mother was also very involved very very involved volunteering everywhere that's the message that I would like to get out today that >> you as one person you're living in Burough Park you're living in Flatbush you're living in five towns living in Lakewood one person if you sit down by a table take a pad a notepad >> right >> and target your audience and target your elected officials embarrass them. >> Yeah. >> Then you can get anything done. Advocacy can be done by one person. It doesn't have to be the head of a nonprofit organization >> or have connections. >> If you really if you really really keep fighting on it, you'll get to where you are. I run a nonprofit organization called the bridge >> multicultural and advocacy project. >> Right. >> But I do lobby and I advocate. >> Now, let's talk about this organization that you created. Um the bridge um what is this all about? Explain it a little bit. The multicultural >> 13 years ago after I got a little bit after we got the child victims act passed. >> Yeah. >> I realized that I have a strength. I know how to talk to politicians. I know how to talk to elected black or Latino or or Asian politicians. I have a good I have God gave me that that ability that I can communicate with them. Yeah. Yeah, >> in a good way. So I said, you know what? This is ridiculous. You know, we're living in a world of anti-semitic attacks. >> Not normal. >> It's not normal. The 63% of of of of hate crimes are against Jews >> and it's getting worse. It's getting worse by the day. Yeah. >> It's getting worse by the day. I said, why don't I start an organization and bring them together? You can't bring our children together. uh you know kasides guy that's living in burough park or even a more modern guy living in five towns doesn't want his children hanging out on Sunday with a Muslim brother or black brother right >> but there must be some way so I say why don't we just do informal events so I started 13 years ago the bridge it's a beautiful building that I own I I don't charge the organization rent so they have a head start uh it's a nice beautiful uh hall with uh offices and basement. We have our own television studio in the basement. We have a clothing pantry. We give out free clothing. >> And we do events during the year. We do a lot of events. We do like 12 15 major events during the year. The event could be anywhere from a blood drive or it can be health screening, mimography screening, uh estate planning, uh uh education pro educational programs and these programs are all designed multicultural. So when I do an event, I did my last event was two weeks ago. It was the 21st of December. There was my annual end of the year event. We had people with beards people. >> Yeah. >> We had immans and we had elected officials. All the elected officials, the whole Brooklyn Democratic Party there. We had the mayor of North Miami Beach who is uh one of the leading black leaders in America today fighting against anti-semitism. um Mayor Alex from North Miami. >> He was one of the honores and the chairman of the Brooklyn Democratic Party was the other honore and it was just an incredible event to see. And at the end of the at every event that we have at the end of the event we have we started with the music starts playing some and you see black people, people, Jewish people, Muslim people dancing together. Now, every culture is welcome. >> Every culture is welcome. And we had we had uh the Haitian council general and the Israeli council general and Israel and Haiti are close and Brooklyn has a lot of Haitians, right? >> Me and the two people, you can go on the YouTube channel. We're singing and dancing together. Havana. >> Yeah. >> So, what's the purpose? >> The purpose is that we know each other and there's less tension. There's no hate crimes. And if there's a hate crime, believe me, I'm connected to every single elected official in Brooklyn is a friend of mine, >> right? >> I'll call them 4:00 in the morning, get over here, >> right? >> You know, and and I do a lot of meetings with very high government officials. Uh, and we we're trying our best. We're trying our best, you know, >> to live in peace. At least we're living with our neighbors. and and your idea is that there shouldn't be such a divide and people it's because we don't know what is going on with each other. So what did you learn in the last 13 years looking at different cultures of course the Yisha culture you know and now you know what >> I could tell you one thing I could tell you one thing that for October 7th which was broke the heart of every Jew right broke broke our hearts will never be the same again after October 7th there's not one Pakistanian group from Coney Island Avenue from Pik Park to Brighton Beach that said a word against Israel >> I'll take some of the credit. >> Wow. >> I won't take all the credit, but I'll take some of the credit. >> Wow. >> Now, one of them, you go on Facebook, go on Twitter account. There was one lady who I knew did a protest outside Israel account. Other other than her, nobody, everybody kept their mouth shut because of the respect. not only myself, but you had people like Rabbi Kaplan from the JCRC and other rabbis and Rabbi Morazznik and other people that would come to events and to to share to share a little bit what's happening. Uh but it's a tremendous thing what you're doing because you're bringing together in a dangerous world, you're bringing together people who are like-minded. uh although they're different than us but at least the relationship to build the relationship of one day you need it or you can save a world >> who you who you going to call good who you going to call you know >> wow it's amazing stuff this this is some accomplishment um how are they dealing with sexual abuse is that ever coming up >> different you know I mean don't forget when besides the rabbis opposing the child victims act. The Catholics were also opposed to it. >> Mhm. >> The Catholics were opposed because they have tremendous amount of abuse in the Catholic community. >> Right. >> And so far, I think the this the amount of damages that uh people assess on them is about over $2 billion. >> Yeah. So, >> they got they got the $2 billion from the governor somehow. I don't want to talk about on the air, but they made some deal with the government. So the so the governor was signed a bill. I mean, Governor Cuomo who signed the Child Victims Act, he was he was reluctant to sign it, but he had no choice because he would have been they would have vetoed it. They would have, you know, overridden his veto. But so you're you're making sure that this bridge multicultural project uh is staying an outside organization. And it's not becoming an inside organization that fits the community in a certain way that you should be you should have pressure >> or have your own agendas. >> Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. It's a it's driven. There's a young couple from Flatbush, a young from couple who lost their child, 11mon year old baby because a radiator exploded in the apartment. Hm. >> They reached out to all the Jewish organizations of Flatbush. They didn't even get a return call. But it took me to call a black council woman of Haitian descent, Councilwoman Farah Lewis, who came to the house immediately said this was a this was a problem that the landlord should have addressed to. just like you have a problem with asbestos as a lead. and she introduced a bill in the city council >> called the Zevy bill. It's called after the boy the boy's name was Binyam, >> right? >> And they named the bill after the boy. And now a bill in the city of New York that children have to be that buildings that have children, the radies have to be examined every two years. >> Wow. So this you're working for the people. >> Yeah. >> You're working for everybody. >> Yeah. >> And that earns your respect. >> Yeah. >> Because what you're doing is you're you're you're looking at everybody as human beings. >> I think we need more. >> I think we need more the professional people out there, the people that are smart and able to capable of doing things get nervous. They don't want to be involved in a political mess, you know, with they don't want to get involved. >> So, you have a bunch of amateurs out there in the Jewish community advocating and lobbying, you know, it's incredible. I mean, the stories the stories are so horrific. You have organiz Jewish organizations that the head of them are lobbyists. God bless you. You be a lobbyist, make money. I have nothing against it, you know. I have nothing against it. God bless you. But how could you represent the community if you're representing your own interests, you know? >> What do you think that uh schools and parents should teach their children safety? >> Every parent has to talk to their own child >> in the in the right time >> and you consult a good psychologist on how to do it. You know, there's a lot of parenting programs out there, you know, that that uh that are out there. >> And you feel that the schools are uh doing more than they used to. I mean, there's there's a major awareness now. >> Of course, there's an awareness. All classrooms have windows in it. The the principal is >> cameras and there's a whole different world right now. So, the >> remember when the the scandal started with toim, you remember that? It's outrageous. I mean everybody everybody knew it was coming around and nobody did anything you know >> right now in the last 13 years since you have this organization did your world view change like in uh what did you learn uh from from these other cultures as far as politics and did you change >> what I learned what what I learned is what I knew a long time ago >> that what we forget we're an incredible we're incredible culture incredible religion the Jewish religion you know we're the chosen people, right? >> Right. >> But one thing we forget, one thing we forget, we're in Golas. >> Mhm. >> We're in Gulas. And when you're in Golas, you have to be as a Jew, especially if you're wearing a yarmaka, you're wearing a bed, you have to be more careful. There's no excuse saying, "Well, they do it, so we do it. We have some criminal." That's not an excuse. We have to be better than everybody. We have to be better than them. We have to show an example to the world that if we have a complaint that if we object if we don't like a political candidate if we don't like a rabbi or something we can do it respectfully. When I was you asked me earlier what changed over the years. >> Yeah. >> You know years ago if you asked the rebi a question that he didn't like you just got slapped. >> Yeah. today. He puts his arms around you, walks walks you to the park and said, "Let's tell me what the problem is." >> Right. But what you're saying is that um >> we have to wear this Yiddish kite as a badge of honor. >> Yeah. >> And when we walk the streets or when we talk or when we behave, >> we have we cannot be like anybody else. There's a certain approach that we have to take, >> you know, we're still a yeet. >> Yeah. >> With a tremendous insight. What do you think about the president with Donald Trump about you know it's a he's a visual he's a he pardoned a nice couple of people and what do you think about him? >> I don't know. I met him once many years ago when Giuliani was the mayor in the city of New York. >> Yeah. >> I mean listen he could be sitting home and relaxing, you know, with all his money that he has. Right. >> Right. And he's working. >> There's no question that he's motivated. He wants to do something. He wants to he wants to do something. I mean, it's one year. >> He hasn't done anything really worse than previous presidents. Obama deported a million over 1 million people. Uh Trump only deported this year like about 550,000. >> Right. >> So, I I was watching a videotape this morning of a YouTube of Bernie Sanders screaming and yelling that we should get all the illegal migrants out of the country. You know, there's a change, you know. a change, you know. >> Do you have a relationship with the mayor of New York City, Mandani? >> Oh, well, I got I got into a little bit of a little bit of hot water. I mean, not I didn't It didn't bother me. I I went to an event. He they the the uh Cojo Flatbush invited him to come to their breakfast. They invited him. >> Yeah. >> He comes to the breakfast and he he's outside in the hallway, you know, leading into the main ballroom, right? I didn't even know who he was. I shook his hand. Right? They get up there at the days and they start screaming, yelling at him, you know, calling him every name in the book. So he left, right? I got hell. I got hell for it. Why are you shaking hands for that? They said, first I didn't know who he was, you know. Second of all, I don't see any any problem in shaking his hand and talking to him. I met him another time and I met him another time. And what I told him both times I met him, I says, you know, you got to do one thing, Mr. uh Mr. Madame, I called him. You got to do one thing that should satisfy people a little bit. So why don't you start saying that you're going to protect the synagogues. You're not going to have one police car there. You'll have two police cars. And he listened to me. >> Yeah. >> I don't know if I had an effect on him, but maybe it did, you know. >> Yeah. >> I still think we have to have a relationship with him. There's a lot of serious a lot of serious uh uh concerns about him and the people that he hired in this administration. I'm slowly starting to meet with them, but uh I didn't invite him to my holiday party. Um maybe next year. >> But but that's your philosophy, communication, bringing in other people. I mean, uh to have a war. >> I mean, the guy is the mayor. What what's the point of having a war against him? You know what I mean? >> I mean, it's like you said before, we're Eden. We can't win this war because this anti-Semitic thing is not in New York. It's all over the world, you know. I mean, President Trump said yesterday uh something that that really got to me and he said that he'll give he'll give refugee status to any Jew that wants to live Great Britain. I mean, Europe is lost. >> Yeah. Completely. >> Europe is lost >> completely. Which part of Europe uh was your father in? >> Father was a little village called Bisovitz. It's about a half hour from Moonkach by car. It's a little village of like uh at one time it was 100 families. Now it's up to two 300 families. I went back there twice. >> Wow. >> And then when Hungary came into to acquire that area before the World War II for three years, they drafted my father in the army. And when they drafted my father into the army, the Hungarians and the Ukrainians, which are now it's now Ukraine, they cooperated with the Germans, they rounded up the Jews and they delivered him to Germans. >> So, how old was your father when he came here and started again? >> He started, he was like 43, 44. >> Wow. survived the Holocaust, was aided, very warm person, but a little bit I have I take after him that he was also a straight emiss. He would say it he would say it like it is, you know, >> like it is. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Um, how would you describe the home? What kind of person, what kind of home did he lead your father? >> Well, it was a kidish home, you know, but it wasn't Williamsburgish. It was Bur Kasidesh. It was basically he didn't wear he wore a becker at later years >> but he was a very warm person and he d we dab by a spin from Bianca who who he adored and I adored spinkerba was a person who came from Romania came from >> Salish >> and but the speakerba I was as close to him as his children were >> because my father was his gabi and I was with him I traled with him to Israel later on. I was very very close to him. The thing about the Spinkerba was that people don't know he spoke about 10 different languages for my Bitzvah. I went to Israel for Yant for Shaim Kipper with my father and we we stopped off in Rome and then we went to Israel. And in Rome, we get into a taxi and he's speaking Italian and I was impressed. I said, "I know you know Spanish. I know you know Hebrew, but he spoke Italian. Then we go into another cab and he's speaking a different language. I said, you know, he says, "You don't understand something. It's like New York. In the south, they speak a different kind of English. In the north, they speak." So, he was fluent in so many languages. Such an educated man. And if anybody knew how to sing a song, if he met you once, you your whole life changed. when he sang whether it's Friday night the tish or he sang it it it it was unbelievable like a masterpiece like a masterpiece was an incredible warm person you know >> wasn't close to s that was probably his downfall he wasn't close to s but he was a good man you know he whatever he had any money that he had despite the fact that some of the people that didn't like him, accused him of having nursing homes. He died. I can tell you for a fact because I helped him out with his financial stuff. He died penniless, giving everything away and housing people that came from Israel, getting them jobs. I mean, he did a lot of lot a lot of a lot of >> Wow. And then he moved to Bar Park. >> Then he moved to Bor Park, 56th Street >> with you guys. >> And then he got sick. He was sick for a long time and then he passed away and my father passed away a few months afterwards. What what schools did you attend? I went to as a child I went to the Boston Reba had a yeshiva next to Bill Babashreby's house on President Street >> Barahurowitz and he had like the first grade the second grade the third grade I had the same same rebby rabbelman you know how many years ago this is this is you're talking about 65 years ago 65 years ago the rebi that I had 65 years ago is still alive today and I met him last year in Israel Schulam Halevi Kouglman. >> He lives in the Bela community. Every Friday night before Shabas, he takes a cab to the Kis Marovi and he walks back 45 minutes to an hour to get back home. Es I I I surprised him. I just showed up at his house and I have a a little tillum that uh that he gave me as a as I was the the best booker of the of the week. I still have it in my house. It's on my table, you know. M >> now then you went to yeshiva >> I went to >> Mhm. >> I don't really have I don't really have a strong impression about him. It was a nice yeshiva was alive. He was a nice man. His son who passed away the last couple of years was a you know pious man guy straight guy. >> But I I I wasn't really inspired there you It wasn't. It wasn't liter park, >> right? >> They had Burough Park in the Lower East Side. So, first I went to Burough Park. When I went to Burough Park, I was the only kid in the whole high school with Pis. >> I had Pis behind my ear. >> Yeah. >> So, I I was very uncomfortable. I asked my father, I said, "I'll go to the Lower East Side to go from Crown to Lower East Side. This is, you know, like going to Bor Park." So in the in the lower side I had two boys in my class with with with Pis right >> Abbe Eisner Abraham Eisner Daskkin the chairman of H and Rab Shfeld's son he had Pis and a beard >> what memories do you have like you have special memories as a Bah like were you what kind of >> For some reason for some reason my personality I reflect every moment of my life I can't forget anything any visualization anytime I met a rebber or a good or anybody I remember it but like I don't know they those yeshiva days were like you know I was a good student in I was a better student in Yiddish studies than English studies >> right >> I I studied Gabbor I was good uh my last rebi there was Rabbi turned hour >> that was the shabas >> he mashba to me because I'm a wife and so is his his mother his family is also so I was the best boy in the class you know >> now who had an influence on you as a young boy is it the spinarba >> had an influence because his nagginina was unbelievable you know I mean I tell people you know I've been fighting with rabbis all my life you know I tell people you know what you dab three times a day did you ever stop to think of the words that you're saying >> right >> so who which which personality besides put the music and the words together >> right >> so when I then I moved to Manhattan I got married I moved to Manhattan when I lived in Manhattan I dedu >> and Schlom Kalbach to me was everything I ever dreamed of you know he was warm caring smart. He knew how to talk to people and in Isul I can tell you I dabed there for many years whether there were 10 people in shul or a thousand people he acted the same way and he connected the words of the song with the words they were connected >> you could almost >> you can almost feel the words he was touching the words while he was singing >> he changed the world I mean you go today to any wedding whether it's aided sar wedding >> a ga wedding or a modern wedding. When that music starts playing his song, right? As soon as the music starts playing, people's feet get off the floor. >> Yeah. He was something special. You had a personal relationship with >> I used to drive him around and this man never he every time he was in my car or anytime he was anywhere, he always had a safer in his hand. So if you if you told him the Salem Maru he would tell you the the theorum of the Salem Maru if you the guy was an ill you know he was a genius one day he was telling me that at the when he lost his brother Alim who wrote the encyclopedia he was sitting Shiva and it's the first time I heard him cry really cry he was telling a story he says listen I was in Lakewood I didn't even read a newspaper for seven years while I was in Lakewood I learned in Torah 24 hours a day. But me and my brother, we're like oddballs. Why? Here we come from a background, right? But nowadays the story at Shiva in Manhattan the synagogue. He says, "I was sitting matzah shabas." I said, "We have to do lava mala ma." So they broke into the into the kitchen, took out a piece of bread and some some orange juice to drink and they sat down. Well, this is during the Shiva. He starts breaking out and saying I started singing started crying like a baby, you know, remembering his his young early years, you know, >> he was something else. He made an impact on a lot of people's lives even today. >> Yeah. My great-grandfather from my mother's side, my mother and my father are related. So my mother's side my grandfather was the rash basin in time of the dark his name was >> his father wasabul died and is buried at >> so we have in our family and so if I'm connected to them and I'm not really connected to them but um you know a lot of warm feelings. >> Yeah. But you're very positive. It's not You see what happens is with an advocate like you that sometimes people will put on a cap on you and saying you're you're bashing the community. You're bashing Rabun. You b But it's the opposite. You love the community. You see the beauty in it. You you love it. >> And because you love it, you're fighting for it. >> There isn't a Jew in the world come to me for help them. >> Even Even if I don't like you, I'll help you. >> Yeah. >> Every day working. I just came this morning to this to be on your program an hour late because I dropped off food on a on Pacific Street downtown Brooklyn. Somebody sick. They have no relatives, no family. I went to Gourmet Glatt today 7:00 in the morning. I was at Gourmet Glock. See theirs. >> They didn't have the the chicken that I wanted. >> The guy needed chicken without any sugar on it. >> So I went to the other store, Seasons, >> right? I was there 8:00. I bought the chickens and I went to downtown Brooklyn to deliver it. >> Wow. So, this is what you think matters in life most is what you can give. >> Yeah. >> Is this your motto? Is this something that you live by every >> The motto that I'm working on the last 6 months at the bridge. >> Yeah. >> Is a campaign that I started. It's called unity not hate. >> Wow. >> These these things were distributed in public schools. >> Yeah. and a lot of uh even the Muslim uh centers. >> Yeah. >> And it's being distributed in all schools. This goes along with a curriculum. So I created a curriculum u and I explained to the the people in the in the city hall and the administration the board of education that every time something happens something happens in my somebody gets stabbed. Something happens in Burough Park, somebody gets run over or something. All of a sudden, everything everybody talks about anti-semitism. It's a press conference. >> Yeah. >> A week later, everybody forgets about it. Now, you have children and you know very well that if you want to teach your children love, unity, not hate, right? You can't only say and don't don't don't if you see another Jew, don't spit on him. You know, you can't do that. You just got to say you got to be nice to everybody, >> right? >> So that's my campaign. I have a if anybody's interested, they can contact me. Um I have a a curriculum that covers a little bit about Yiddishkite. It tells about the history. It even talks about Pis, why people wear Pis. Don't get scared if you see. >> And it's it's a curriculum that's available. Anybody that wants it can contact me and I can show them the curriculum. But the bottom line is that again I want to repeat that because that's very very important. We're living in golas. Mashia is not here. We don't have the ability to build a ba mdash even though some people are trying to build it. Right. Right. >> We don't have that ability. So we're in golas. So we have to we have to be a role model. >> We have to be better than the rest of the world and show that we that people could work with us. >> Right. What you're saying is something very profound because >> you're saying that we can't go around teaching in a public schools love every Jew. >> Yeah. >> That's why what you're doing with the bridge project is that you want to bring unity, not hate. You want to explain to them the tolerance. There should be a tolerance between all between all of them. Automatically it's going to bring down a little bit of anti-semitism. Nobody is doing that. We're just sitting secluded and yelling and screaming that we have rights and for anti-semitism was around for I don't know how many years and it's always going to be and always was but what you're doing is you're becoming creative with this and you're saying let me get into the public schools let me bring together different cultures which is new if someone would say what do we need that for we we're staying away from them but you're saying you see the bigger picture you're saying let's make an effort small effort in one little corner of the world and maybe it's going to catch on fire. Unity not hate. And on top of everything the if we think about it that unity has to start by us first. >> We have to start loving each other also the community. >> There's a lot of hate in our community. I mean it's not nice to say >> but everybody has different agendas and every different um >> unity should start by us and then it should radiate into other um cultures. I think it's a tremendous accomplishment and it's tremendous vision that you have of bringing people together because th this world is where's this world going? >> What one of the things that I avoid is using the word tolerance. Mhm. >> I always say, people laugh all the time when I say this, tolerance. You know who you tolerate? >> Yeah. Someone get >> your mother-in-law. >> Your mother-in-law, you tolerate, right? You have no choice because if you don't tolerate your mother-in-law, you're not getting you're not getting a cooked dinner tonight. Right. >> Right. >> It has to be understanding each other. So, when you come to the bridge at any day, any day, I have clothing drives in two locations. Right. You come in, you see a picking up socks, you see a Muslim picking up a dress. And this way we talk to each other. There's nothing more that stronger that unites people than conversation. Good conversation, healthy conversation. You know, >> look what's going on in Israel. the the rabbis who screaming uh uh against certain laws and then young people going out and demonstrating and every week there's another tragedy. kid a kid gets bo two kids die in a daycare center boy gets run over by bus that's just this week you know >> hundreds of kids get trampled in I run why we live in a society >> we should be happy we should be so happy we're living in the United States of America and appreciating the freedom and democracy that we can practice our religion we can walk around we can be a commissioner we can be a judge and walk growing a yamak bed. We should be proud of it. >> We should be proud of it and we should >> I don't know if we are proud of it but I don't know if we are >> unbelievable message. >> Let me ask you a question. How does one overcome challenges in life? Whatever you see, whatever you saw in your life till now and you dealt with so many um problems and difficulties as far as you saw people, you saw broken people, you saw poverty, you saw how does a person overcome challenge? What gives a person a kickstart going? >> Yeah. >> Well, first of all, you have to you have to know and understand the problem. And then you have to be willing to to resolve the problem, right? If you don't admit the problem, you can't resolve the problem. >> Right? >> You have to admit I know I had a weakness when I was young. When I would talk to somebody like I'm talking to you now, right? >> I would not look you in the eye. >> It had nothing to do with that you're not good-looking enough or anything like that. What it had to do with is I have one eye has the strongest uh stigmatism. >> Mhm. >> And one side and one eye is of of good vision. >> Yeah. >> So if I look at you straight sometimes I get dizzy. >> Mhm. >> And I have to take my dizzy pills. My my right. >> So I train myself. But you know, people started telling my family is that, you know, your your your brother, your husband, >> he's not looking at me when he's talking to you and they're explaining to him, but he listens to every word you're saying, you know, so I you have to admit that this is your weakness. I'm I'm admitting that I love to eat bread five times a day, >> right? >> And I'm 300 lb, >> right? >> And that's why when you go to a diet doctor and you're paying him $100 a visit, right? He's not doing anything for you, >> right? But you know that you have to come back Monday next week, pay another $100, you better lose two pounds otherwise you're not going back, right? >> So you got to admit you got a problem. >> Yeah. >> The rabbis when it came to sexual abuse, they never admitted there was a problem. >> They say there's no problem. It's only small percentage and the small percentage is okay. You know what I mean? >> Right. >> You know, >> all these years looking back, would you do anything different in your life if you can start over again? >> I wish I was a little bit younger. I would tackle I would go after the the seminary in Israel that charge charge your daughter $25,000. >> It's outrage. It's it's disgusting and it should be the top of the agenda of every rabbitical conference should be talking about. And if you have six six children at home and you you don't send your children, you how could you not send your daughter when the whole class is going? You know, my my own thing is if I had to do my life over, I'd live in Israel, you know. Yeah. I'm not embarrassed to say that, you know. >> Yeah. >> What legacy do you want to leave? >> I don't have to leave anything. I just have to I don't have to leave anything. I'm not leaving it. First of all, not leaving it, >> right? >> Second of all, I don't have to leave a legacy, you know. Uh people know that what I've done, >> I want other people to do it as well. There are other people that doing in I know so many so many incredible people that are doing such powerful things incredible like like unprecedented in history. An organization of Flatbish called the Flatbish Foundation these like 20 millionaires got together very wealthy people and they give out food and clothing and money for your wedding and it's just incredible work. So there are a lot of there's a lot of support out there. Just have to tap into it. >> Wow. >> And determine that you want to move on. >> It seems like you have a special heart. Special heart to help other people and you have that empathy. If you see a child on the street or if you see a poor person or you see a sick person, there's something that comes out. I have a final question for you. Who is your role model? It's a good question. A good question. Um, I don't know if I should say it. I had a couple of role models like as far as uh as far as uh Israel is concerned. >> Mhm. >> I've learned a lot. I've gotten to know Shiman Paris, >> the premier >> and his children. I've gotten to know them over the years. I mean he passed on already but when he built the atomic bomb uh the stories about his life I was just reading a book about his stories that he himself told me personally it's an amazing story by the way was the prime minister of Israel Shiman Paris was one of his right-hand people right and Shiman Paris was the person who he delegated the responsibility to deal with France So France had a a prime minister, I think Mui or something. I forgot the guy's name. He was the prime minister. He gave Israel, I think, $und00 million loan to build the first atomic bomb. It was done in secret, right? And Shiman Paris would travel back and forth with France. And one day Begorian calls him and says, "Get on the plane, go to France right away cuz your friend in who's the prime minister of France, his government is going to collapse." He got there and he met the guy and he said uh the guy said, "Yeah, I'm in trouble. You know, I may not be here by the end of this week." So he gave him an agreement they should sign so it become permanent rel a contract between the two countries between Israel and France. An hour later the government collapsed and the paper wasn't signed. Shiman Paris went back the next day. He met him in the hallway cleaning out his office and he signed it a day before he backdated it. And then when when the new prime minister and then then then Charles de Gaul came along and they didn't want to honor the commitment. He said you want to honor the commitment then France did not want the Arab countries to know about this deal. He said if you don't honor your commitment we're not going to honor our commitment. That's the story. So Shiman Paris is like a big uh also Jebatinsky. >> I don't know people are not aware that Jebatinsky came to Moonach came to Moonkatch. And the monkbi said no go to listen to him because I'll throw you out of the yeshiva he spoke at Mr. Fixler the head of boragum his father Jebetinski stood there there's a YouTube of it >> and he's saying Jews from Monach leave go to Israel get out of here so there are heroes there were a lot of heroes I grew up going to camp yes campaign was there >> yeah you remember him well >> I remember very well every day he would come dab there >> he had he had tremendous tremendous good leaders Byron Carter was a build up Lakewood today which is incredible community. You know you have a guy like Rabbi Hsteada one person build this major major organization. >> Yeah. >> You should see the event at the White Street show two weeks ago like a wedding. Everybody was dancing. Everybody was enjoying themselves having a meal. It wasn't like other organizations that go on they go on the on the radio Saturday night and complain about different things. It was all positive. All positive. Rabbi Halstead. He's the man. >> He's the future. And he doesn't have a whole convention Thanksgiving in in a hotel. He doesn't have that. He doesn't have he doesn't have a precidium of 100 rabbis. He has he brings two good island to to America and they speak and they speak from their heart and he does amazing thing. >> Wow. Amazing. Mark Mayor, I want to thank you not only for coming in to the podcast, but for the courage it takes to keep showing up with the emis. You're standing up for what's for what's what's what's Emma. That's that's the most important. Even when it's uncomfortable. Even when it's uncomfortable. I'm grateful for your honesty. Conversations like this is very very important. We want to hear we want to hear a flavor. We want to hear creativity um that you're bringing to the table. Hashem should give you co should give you a lot of strength to continue doing what you're doing to continue doing the great work. >> Right. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you for coming. Yes. >> Thank you so much for having me. It's a pleasure. I know you have a lot of viewers also. Keep going from strength to strength. >> Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it.