How to Retire Comfortably Without Making Millions

I think people get a little ahead of themsel. They they they [music] go crazy trying to go ahead and figure out how much money they should, you know, leave their kids. It's important. It's very very nice as much as you can, but don't think that you're going to work [music] till 80 or whatever you're going to just to give money away to your kids. Keep to your lifestyle. Hopefully, there's going to be money left because everybody wants to leave something [music] for your kids. I think you being with them and help helping them out now wherever you possibly can if they want to buy houses and if you could go ahead and afford it. I don't plan on taking the [music] money with me. So, uh whatever we could help them now and whatever we have all this [music] not taking anything with me. >> Welcome to the middle class podcast. Uh I guess I can say friend. >> Yes. >> And maybe mentor as well. Rabbid Goltharb um who I've known for many years. You probably seen me grow up since I was a little boy. Uh Davin in the same shel in the community. And today um from feedback from our listeners, I wanted to focus on planning for retirement. Reason being because David, you are retired. I mean, we never ever retire. Of course, we're always working and doing something. But um in the uh literal sense, you're retired and um I'm sure you've planned um accordingly to get to that point. And I want our listeners to be educated on how to be able to plan safely for retirement and how you got to where you are today. So that's the focus. It's going to be about retirement and how to get there. And I wanted to start with David. What do you do on a daily basis um today cuz I know you're not working. So what uh what is the life that you're living? >> Uh so I'm learning practically the entire day. I learn myself in the morning. I have a kusa from 11 to 2, another from 4 to 6 and learning again at night from 8 to 10. >> Okay. So um you're not an old person but as we say it's um so that's your full-time occupation now. Let's call it learning. when you were working did that was that your vision for retirement what were you planning for when you were saving for retirement? >> So the first day that I I remember when I started working practicing law I always wondered what the last day of working was going to look like and uh I had the vision I had the vision for over 40 45 years >> and this was my heart's dream to really be able to go ahead and do this. >> Wow. Because I tell all my clients that when they want to think about retirement, you have to have something that you're planning towards. Is [snorts] it spending your life visiting the Great Wall of China or is it [laughter] La Havdil or learning? Um, so it's important to know what you're planning for, but let's take a step back. Um, so you said you were working. When did you start working and uh we'll start from there. >> Um, I graduated college with a degree in accounting. I went to law school, practiced law for about four or five years, >> uh, a large law firm. I realized I was not going to get to heaven from the corner office of a large law firm. And I decided to go ahead and join a couple of other people in business. Um, the business grew tremendously over about 40 years that I was there. And, um, I was in the food business for most of the time. And um at the end I I said I think it's time to step away and I actually did it on my terms and I said time to move on. >> Mhm. So you started off in a more corporate >> correct corporate environment. >> Right. >> Um so how old were you then when you started working? >> I probably started working about 26 after I graduated law school. Mhm. >> Um again as I said working a number of years in a law in in a law firm then moving into business and [clears throat] um from there the company grew by leaps and bounds >> and so did I. Um the two owners of the company who were exquisite people to work for extremely honest people and um that's where my career was basically at >> pretty much working at the same company for that many years. >> Mh. uh when things go well for Hashem, you continue to stay. No reason to leave. And um that's what I kept on going. >> Mhm. Yeah. I mean, it it doesn't hurt to get some good business advice tangentially. Um so, you know, when I work with people, it's an all gamut of ages. >> So, you were 25 26. Do you were you married? Were you learning at that point or straight from law school? What was the uh backdrop to that? >> Straight from law school, I uh I I I joined a very large law firm. So, I got a feel of what that was all all about. >> Um family grew together with that. >> Have a number of children. They're all married at this time. But yes, definitely was a challenge to go ahead and try to balance, you know, the work at a law firm or any any large company that you work with together with family life. But I think I I put in a a pretty good uh balance to be able to go ahead and do it. >> So So you're you're going straight from school. Um did you learn in coal at that point or >> No. [clears throat] No, I didn't. >> But now you're learning in coal, so it [laughter] doesn't matter. >> Um Yeah. So So beginning from the beginning, like you were literally starting from the bottom, let's call it, >> right? >> Um and how did you get by in those formative years? Was it a struggle? Was it easy? Was it hard? How did you get by? >> Um, I was earning a very good salary. But, um, one thing I learned from my father and when it comes to spending, if you can't, uh, if you can't afford to pay the bill at the end of the month, don't go ahead and buy it at the beginning of the month. I was always had my eye on making sure not spending more than you're earning. I think very important together with that is a very supportive wife which I'm very lucky to have who um you know grew up in the same background and we were very very careful how we spent. We had lived in a very a nice house still the same house that we live in but you have to be very very cautious on how you spend money. Some people have a tendency to figure out that they want to spend more than they earn. And I think if you start from the beginning during your working years and you keep your eye on that, you can continue to grow. Your expenses are only going to get higher. Hopefully, your salary is going to go ahead and increase at the same time. But it's being very very cautious on the amount of money that you're spending and of course saving. Um I had a financial adviser at that time. We built it slowly but surely making sure that you don't overspend. And I think anybody that's going to look to retire 45 years later, it starts from the early days, right from the beginning. If you have a plan and you have support, again, I say a supportive wife, you're going to be able to go ahead and do it. If you step out of the game and you want to go ahead and live a life that's going to be keeping up with everybody else, you're going to run into trouble right from the beginning. Wow. So you had that discipline from the beginning, >> right, >> to live uh what you based on what you could afford. >> Correct. >> So um when did you buy a house at which at what point in time? >> I was probably married 3 4 years. This is I I live in Far Rockway. So this is the first house and only house so far that I own. Um I didn't want to move up. uh you know or again keeping in line with budgets and keeping in line with what we could afford. Eventually we extended the house so we we needed more room but everything was within our budget >> and um like the neighbor love the neighbor the neighborhood continued to grow. Anybody knows Farakaway so it's been a great neighborhood a great place with a great r and uh I have no reason to go ahead and move anywhere. Okay. So already you're stemming the tide from how other people are the direction they move. >> Correct. >> And you're you're staying strong to your strategy which is so important for our listeners to hear in our generation, my generation, let's call it. Uh it's very expensive and people are doing a lot of I don't know if you want to call it extracurricular but it's expensive. >> Yes. and you were able to stay the course and uh stay affordable within the affordable range. Um but how did you buy the house? Did you save up money for that? How did you cuz a lot of our audience are in that, you know, situation of buying houses. So how did you do it? >> Basically my wife and myself all on our own. Nobody gave us a house. Nobody gave us money for the house. We bought the house that we can afford. And together we we everything that we did we grew together. >> So you did you save for the house? You saved for the house? >> I was able to save for the house as well. Right. [clears throat] >> Wow. And you put down going very nitty-gritty. You put down 20% on on your down payment. Like you put down the full amount to get the 20% down payment or put down the full amount. This was back in the days. Everybody's worried about interest rates. 40 odd years ago the interest rate was 16%. We were fortunate fortunate to get a Sunny May mortgage which landed up to be 13%. >> It was [clears throat] uh somebody the government was giving out these Sunny May mortgages. Funny story, I think the first 50 people that got to this um closing office were able to get the mortgage. So all of the people on our block, we literally had to sleep in our cars uh the night before this office opened and the first 50 people got the mortgage. [laughter] >> And again, I'm saying 13 to 16%. Obviously, [clears throat] the price of houses were a lot less than they are now. >> What was the price of your house? >> Our house my house was $150,000. But on the other hand, people are not getting salaries as they are today. So everything is relative. you have to match your salary against, you know, what the cost of the house. Tuitions were not there, but they caught up pretty quickly. So, I was fortunate enough to go ahead and my income was staying ahead, not tremendously ahead. You know, if I would have spent a lot more on a house, I would have been, you know, in a bad shape right from the beginning. Mhm. >> So once again, if if you work with, you know, your accountant and a financial advisor from the beginning to say, "Listen, this is what you can afford, if you're going to go over, you're going to be behind the eightball right from the beginning." Not a good place to be. So I want to ask you a very personal question. In those formative years, um, how were you able to withstand the pressure? Was there pressure internally in your family to spend more than what you could afford and and externally as well? Were you was there pressure? Was there pressure for that? >> There wasn't any pressure on my part. Again, I'm a very lucky person to have a wonderful wife and she also does did not have any pressure. A lot of times people feel that's where the pressure comes. Everybody else is buying a bigger house. She didn't grow up that way. I didn't grow up that way. >> What about your kids? My kids bought exactly the same whatever houses they could go ahead and afford. [clears throat] >> I learned discipline from my father and hopefully my kids learned discipline from me. >> Did they pressure you though your kids to live a more I don't know lavish way or >> not at all. Not at all. I was I was but I was very very lucky. >> That's the kind of life that we set up for ourself. We didn't go on lavish vacations because we had to pay tuitions. >> And [clears throat] you're right. I was able to withstand although the people that I associate with didn't have didn't didn't live the same life that I do. >> So I think that's very very important besides your wife and children. It's the people you surround yourself with as well. If you're going to associate with those people, they're going to go ahead and put pressure on you. I never I never felt the pressure whatsoever. >> Wow. So you had that discipline. Let's go back to um when you were working. When did you start saving for retirement? Was it right away? And how did you if you did start? >> I think for the first day that I started working, my wife was working at the time as well, right when we got married. What we worked out right from the beginning is that we would live off hopefully on her salary, which was the lower of the two, and save on my salary. As time went on, obviously kids came. She didn't work anymore. She hasn't worked all the years that the kids have been uh uh you know, been around. Only afterwards, after everybody was in school, she started working. So, right from the beginning, if if [clears throat] I had a $1.50, you know, went for a savings or something like that. >> But I again, it's how you start and how you put down the foundation right from the beginning. It's just a basic basic rule. Don't look around too much. Look at what you have. Try to go ahead and say that, you know, that rainy day is going to come one day and in in the long run, you're able to go ahead and do what you want. >> Mhm. So when you were working and you saved, >> right, >> I'm assuming the vehicle that you used was the company either 401k like you had a 401k plan that had let's say a match. Was that how you save for retirement mainly or was it other ways? >> Mostly 401k but uh in addition to that I work with a financial advisor and they set up a plan that this is the amount of money that you should work out and save every single year. and he is amazed because I still have that same financial advisor. And I asked him, "How did I put all this money together?" And he laughed and he said that from the beginning he had clients that were young married people that they were married two years and they used to come to him crying that they're $40,000 in debt. Fancy vacations, fancy lifestyle, everything that goes with it. and he said you were one of the few that you followed my advice and that's why you are where you are and you are fortunate enough to be able to do it. >> Okay. So um what were the numbers that you were saving let's say for retirement and with the financial advisor? What are the numbers? What were you saving? The amount of money >> I was saving at least $25,000 a year if not more. >> What was your salary at that point in time? M probably I was earning I would say close to $100,000. >> So 25,000 25 you were saving 25% right. >> And your wife when she was working what was her income? >> Um probably about uh 3540,000. >> What did what did she do? Your wife >> she worked for she was uh in computers. She worked for a number of companies. She didn't work that many years, >> but uh for those years that she worked, she earned a good salary, worked very hard, and uh we try to put away completely on her salary >> uh probably another at least off of her salary, maybe another at least 10 $15,000. >> Mhm. So, um important to again point out, we want to thank our wives, myself included, for their support in the household finances, >> right? uh never really mentioned that in a podcast but it's a personal thank you and our audience and our listeners and our people that we interview our interviewees um all thank our wives for uh being the uh support that they are >> right >> okay so you're saving 25% maybe even more um so let's move on as you're you know moving along so you you went out of law and then you were working in the food business can you tell tell us like what that was like, what what was that industry that you were in and what did you do? >> So the company that I worked for, we packaged meals for schools, hospital, airlines. When I started with the company was the early stages of the company. Uh we had a uh production facility in Brooklyn, a very large one. Over the years, we purchased a number of companies. uh one in Chicago, one in California and um my responsibility was I oversaw all the purchasing for the company. Um the company grew very very quickly. My responsibility grew very quickly as well. Uh every other week I was traveling to different parts of the world. I had staff in each one of these offices very responsible and very very time consuming. Um but I always make time for the important things. you know, my kids got a little older and um I learned with each one of my kids uh every single night and it was a joke. One of the offices I always used to travel to was Chicago, they knew every night 7:00, which is 7:00 uh Chicago time, David had to learn with his kids and I, you know, went into a conference and I and I and I learned with them >> and uh on the phone on the phone >> on the phone. Correct. You know, I used to bring a stack of firm along together with me. I could be sitting in an airport and one of my kids if they're going to hear this, they're going to laugh. I'd be sitting with a Yoshua or something else that they were learning or if not a Gumar and uh if you're not there, you know, I always say that raising children is not a spectator sport. You have to go ahead and be present in their lives in a very very big way. >> And whatever's whatever's on their mind and whatever they're involved in, you have to be involved with as well. Um, but as time went on, you know, more responsibility, more travel. I was away usually every other week for about uh 25, 30 years. Um, >> how long were your trips? Um, >> usually I left on a Monday and I usually came back either Wednesday or Thursday. >> Um, I'm looking outside of the snow. Most of the time I travel to Chicago. This is nothing compared to what I [laughter] have. Every Monday was a challenge traveling. So I let me ask you because again your uh mentor uh teaching me some life lessons here. You had a very busy job, >> right? [clears throat] >> And it kept you occupied and traveling. You found time to learn in a very practical way. How did that help you in your business when you when you were able to learn? Did that sort of I know for myself but a lot of people say of course that it gives you perspective. How did that affect your career? Like um I'm very disciplined in my time. Um [clears throat] when I'm here I have very disciplined uh you know what I'm doing every single day. I didn't change that schedule no matter where I was. Now, it may have gotten a little later, but I made sure that every night, you know, I try to learn at least two hours a night. And uh that's no matter what time I'm going to finish working, that has to go ahead and be part of your day. And if that's the first thing that's going to go, you're not going to work very well. Um I was able to go ahead and most trips to make sure that I dabbing three times a day with a minion. Sometimes it happened, sometimes it didn't. But the day has to start early and end late if you want to accomplish everything. If you're going to start cutting ends, you know the first thing that's going to go because you're going to say you're too tired. It doesn't work. Don't give up and change. >> So, you can be successful, you can retire, right? >> Even Even I should say learning a couple of hours a night in the morning. Um traveling, it's a it's an inspiration. Um okay but moving back to the career so you were um you what was your s once you moved on from um corporate law I wanted to understand how you structured your contract let's go back there did you have equity in your company or how did you because I know a lot of clients are it's hard for them to or they never were taught how to structure a contract in the business so you came in early right you came in How did you structure your contract? Did you just say I want X salary or we're going way back, but how did you uh come up with your cuz you grew with the company. So, how did how did you set that up from the beginning? >> I was fortunate enough to worked with uh two really wonderful people. I did not have equity in the company, but my salary grew as the company grew >> and my responsibility as my responsibility grew so did my salary. Um, we negotiated sometimes. It was, you know, they they understood that I'm not home and I'm and I'm going to go ahead and have all this responsibility. Every time we bought a company, I just inherited their their purchasing department. >> And um, it became to be a lot of people that I was responsible for. You have to go ahead and hopefully you're working for people that are fair. If you're working for people that are fair, they're going to compensate you accordingly. they're going to understand your value and they're not going to come to, you know, hopefully you're not going to have to come to them. They're going to come to you. Uh what what an employee wants sometimes doesn't match necessarily what the employer wants and sometimes, you know, you run into run into uh problems. Don't stay too long and don't leave too early. You know, sometimes somebody wants to become the, you know, head of the company within 5 years that they're there. It doesn't work that way. You have to work hard. You have to show your value to the company and hopefully they're going to compensate you and see your see your worth. [clears throat] >> Gotcha. Um Okay. So at that point you were growing with the company, >> right? >> How old were your kids um at that point in time when you were let's say moving up in that company. Were there any large expenses at that point in time? You said you were paying full tuition, >> correct? And that's So you always paid full tuition. always paid full tuition plus gave some extra besides the full tuition. >> Wow. Full tuition, a mortgage on a house. So really all the expenses. >> Camps. >> Camps. You paid full for camps. >> And um so really were there large when did the large expenses come up? Let's say for your children. >> Um let's say was the bar mitzvah a large expense for you? [laughter] >> No. Each we had three bar mitzvah. Each one of them was a shabas only bar mitzvah. We had the family But we didn't make any big affair. Once again, in line with everything else that we live with, we made up our mitzvah that we wanted. We have a particular lifestyle to keep it under the radar or nice, but you know, very very balabatish. We didn't have any big affair only because that was our lifestyle. >> And I'm not sure if you know your your salary or the amount of money that you have matches your lifestyle or is it the other way around? Maybe it's your lifestyle and therefore the kids always went to camp. We took some vacations. We didn't take any lavish vacations. All in line with doing that. >> Um >> that's it. There's these >> simple very very simple. It's well simple is not so simple, >> right? >> Simple but not easy. I think >> that's correct. That's correct. You have to work at it. You really have to work >> disciplined to be uh >> um what did the bar mitzvah what did the bar mitzvah cost [laughter] back? I can't remember. Um, my youngest son is close to 30, so it's been a couple of years. >> Not a fortune of money, but enough money. But if you're saving, you should be able to go ahead and do it. Again, if you're going to have a lavish bar mitzvah or you're going to make a lavish wedding, okay, it's going to cost. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> But everybody, I'll say it the way it is. If you want to keep up with everybody around you, you know, just make sure that you have enough money in the bank account. >> Mhm. >> If you can't pay for it at the end of the month, don't spend it at the beginning of the month. >> Okay. So, you were able to pay for the Bitzvas, >> correct? >> And their weddings without going into debt, >> correct? >> Did you ever have to borrow against your house or >> No, >> never. >> Never. >> Uh-huh. Wow. Okay. [laughter] It's already like a a bombshell. um for a lot of us. >> Yeah. >> Um so what was the uh what was your salary like when you were in your top earning years? What was uh you know what were your numbers at that point in time? >> Um not tremendous probably uh 350 400 maybe some years it went higher than that. [clears throat] >> Mhm. >> And and if you keep within your lifestyle you should be able to go ahead and do it. So, I made a I said a line when I introduced the podcast that you might know this, you might not, but um the middle class income range for us is between 250 to $350,000, >> right? >> So, you were not at any point making a lot more than that, >> right? So, you were you are a middle a middle class uh you know representative. Um, to be honest, while I was talking to you, I thought you made a million dollars a year. I'm being honest with you. [laughter] >> That's good. >> That's You give off that impression. >> That's very, very good. That's just what I want. >> I thought it would, you know, um, but that's, you know, middle class salary, nothing extraordinary, and able to cover all those large expenses, >> um, and put away as well, right? Uh, so as as you're moving along, you're always con saving for retirement using your 401k. Did your company ever give you like a bonus or anything that for your retirement or was all funded from it was all from funded from your salary? >> And they matched it, but it was not uh it was really nothing much. >> They didn't really do a large match. >> You know, in in in defense of all the people today, these things cost a lot more money than when I was doing it. You have to be fair to them. Okay. But I think that the um the affairs or the bar mitzvah or the weddings that people are making is is is really you know higher than a lot of people could actually afford. >> Mhm. >> Again you know it's not fair to uh compare what was done 101 15 years ago when the salary and what the costs of things are. But even even within that range, if the salaries went up and the and the costs went up, it's just doing the same amount of budgeting and just seeing what you could afford and stay within those those those ranges. >> Mhm. >> I think [clears throat] that people are getting uh a little carried away, >> getting out of hand a little bit. >> You know, every magazine is now in the last couple of weeks, one magazine in particular is having article after article about spending and spending and spending. Is anybody listening? I hope so. [laughter] >> Yeah. Well, I say the same thing. I don't know people listen to me, but uh um uh so okay. So, you're putting away money for those. Okay. So, I just wanted to understand what you were geared towards at that point in time. So, you're making let's call it, you know, you bring up a good point that it's, >> you know, $350,000 in previous correct dollars. So that is a little bit higher than regular middle class, let's call it, but it's still not something out of the ordinary. Um, did you ever use credit cards? >> Sure. >> You never got into credit card debt, though, right? >> No, I don't believe I don't believe in debt. If you can't afford it, don't buy it. That's all. >> No, I I didn't get into credit card debt. Uh people use that uh whichever way they want to because they figure they're going to get the money somewhere. >> It's it's it's just a gamble. >> It really really is just a gamble and the interest rates are just >> huge to go ahead and do it. They got to be better ways to go in and get money, >> right? Cuz that's the the reserve that people use um today when they can't find the money for it. They go into their credit cards and there's a lot of credit card debt. So the only thing that I had in reserve which I have and I still don't use is just a line of credit on the house. >> You know, one of these [clears throat] line lines of credit if you really need to. >> But once you take the first step into that, you know, you're going to get comfortable borrowing against that, >> you're going to get into trouble. That's it. You know, every financial advisor is going to tell you the same thing. [clears throat] >> Live whatever you can within. I you know that's that's the message you keep on and that's the message I kept on telling to my kids as well. I don't think any of them are in debt. They're not living in houses that they can't afford. Um you know sometimes it gets a little tight but as soon as you step out of that your comfort zone, you're going to run into problems. >> Mhm. I I want to bring up one other topic that um comes into planning that I brought up in previous podcasts and it's a big important push that I'm always bringing up now at least. um having insurance policies. >> Sure. >> Mainly life insurance starting with that. What is your take on thoughts on that? Did you get it and when did you if you did when >> what are your thoughts on it? >> Um I don't know if it was two weeks after I got married or 3 weeks after [laughter] someone sold it to you, right? >> No, I said my my father said to me, make sure that you have life insurance. >> Um I had a lot more life insurance when my kids were younger. I was a little crazed on insurance. Maybe because even some people that we domin with you saw passed away young did not have any life insurance and life just spirals out after that right >> and I was very very you know uh strict in buying life insurance as well sometimes it was expensive but I just felt like it's just a a responsibility that you have and a cost of living that you have to just add on you know as you get older you maybe want to ease up a little on the amount of life insurance that you have because you have other savings but at the beginning when you're young I think it's a necessity and each one of my kids you know if they're in yeshiva or otherwise some yeshivas offer you know even term life insurance very very cheap I think it's a must I think again it's irresponsible not to have it not that I'm giving a plug for selling insurance >> but I think it's just something that somebody should really have >> so um so life insurance is a big thing have you seen you you've seen stories like personal stories >> of people that have not had and the it was >> yes unfortunately the person he was not well he was a child diabetic he was not able to get insurance his uh he passed away it was very it was very very difficult for his wife his family I'm sure >> it's not all the answers but it surely makes uh things easier >> so you made it a point to to take care [laughter] >> um another like for people more towards the retirement age >> right >> um tell me what your thoughts are on this long-term care insurance. Everyone has a story, but what's your uh >> My story was that somewhere along the line, I actually bought long-term health insurance for my mother, and she was in an assisted living for a number of years. And for a good number of years, we were able to pay for her stay over there because I bought the long-term health insurance for my mother, my wife, and myself also. a number of years ago. I also took out long-term health insurance. Um, nobody knows what the future's going to go ahead and bring. Getting AIDS, even if you're on Medicare or something, it's very, very expensive. It's not going to solve all the problems. Hopefully by then you put away enough money, but the money goes very very quickly having a uh an aid come in 24/7. >> I think it's a necessity. Have a good insurance person. And um a couple of years ago, we signed up uh and get long-term health insurance. >> So, just to educate everyone, long-term care insurance is um an insurance policy that covers someone an insured who needs um an aid. >> Um my grandfather, case in point, um he took care of himself, but he used his own assets, um used his own money, and it's extremely expensive. Correct. Everyone has a story. I say with this um with long-term care, it's extremely expensive. It's important. Um the age of recommendation [snorts] is 55 to 65 years old to get a plan or a policy. There's a lot of different ways to do it. You can put a rider on life insurance. You can get a long-term care policy that has cash value to it. There's a lot of sticks, uh you know, kosher sticks, um that you can do with with long-term care. That's important that uh you know you stress that. Curious to know in the 401k planning that you did the money I'm assuming was invested in that [clears throat] 401k. Do you know how was invested? Do you know like what specific investments it was in and how much it grew percentage-wise per year or? Um, any investments that I put that I invested in, most of them were mutual funds, >> and I tried to at least match the S&P for the year. That's the way I um I I gauge it. If if you're savvy and you want to go ahead and invest in particular your own stocks, be my guest. I'm not savvy enough to do that. And I, you know, if I wanna if I want to bet money, I'll go to I'll go to the races. I that's not my business to go ahead and do that. Most of them were stock funds. Um they were pretty aggressive, right? When you fill out your form, you say, "Do you want to be uh you know aggressive? Do you want to be mid?" I was always aggressive, but again, you need a financial advisor that has a good handle on what's going on in the markets and um actually to go ahead and shift things around after you're done. I hope after this podcast to review the uh the >> right view over here what I have what I have over here >> it's convenient. >> Yes. >> Um so that's you know that's very important because I tell people when they have a long time frame to save be more aggressive be more aggressive because that's going to give you the most money and you don't have to worry so much about short-term ups and downs. Um, it's good to hear from someone on the other side that you were able to invest aggressively, but I'm also hearing that you had an advisor helping you through that. >> Sure. [snorts] >> You know, right? >> I [clears throat] I know the food business. If you ask me about peaches, I could tell you about peaches. I'm not in investments. Go to professionals. That's what they do for a living. You have to trust the people that you're actually going to put your money with. But don't make a mistake and just let it sit there. I had more than one one time that I was not happy with them. I said, "Thanks for the time." I picked up and I moved the money. Um, you you just you can't be an absentee landlord. You need to watch your money like you watch your kids. Okay. And uh >> that's part of the responsibility. >> I think that a financial advisor, right, >> who gets paid. >> Sure. >> Um but ultimately earns you more money through the relationship, right? >> 100%. >> It's worth the uh >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean that's a self- pitch in a way, >> right? >> But, you know, I bring people on that they should say from the other side how important it is >> to have that advisor, the planner. And you were always aggressive. Wow. Because I know a lot of people in their 401k, I don't know if it's familiar, but they're in something we call target date funds, which take the day of your retirement, and they adjust the portfolio as you get closer to that. But a lot of times they underperform >> right >> significantly what more aggressive investments can get. >> And if you need a planner to help you do that, then you're saying it's worth it. >> My advice is always go to a professional. So whatever you're doing, go to a professional. That's what they do for a living. You have to trust them >> and you know, and I'm sure you find people that trust them and they'll advise you because that's what they do for a living. Sometimes a person thinks he's smarter than the financial adviser. So I said, "No problem. you hang out a shingle, become a financial advisor. >> And and you the same thing with taxes. You're you're CPA. What >> a lot of online softwares now, but what do you say? >> My my cousin is my accountant has been for all the years. Um I just said to them very very simple. You're straight as an arrow just like I am. I don't want to get any fan mail from the IRS. You know, you don't call me, I won't call you. Um, and uh, I don't want to find out to do whatever anybody wants to do. It's not in my nature to do it. Go straight. You'll get to the end and you'll be very very happy. That's all. Don't Don't [clears throat] try to do any Don't try to outsmart it. Sooner or later, it's going to catch up with you. >> Going to catch up to you, >> right? >> Um, okay. So, at this point that you're retired, >> right? I don't want you don't have to answer what you're not comfortable with, but are you living the same standard of living that you had while you were working? Yes. >> Basically. >> Yes. >> Same. >> Same. Get up the same 5:00 a.m. every morning. Do what I have to do. Don't live outside your means. And you'll hopefully stay healthy and you'll just keep on enjoying doing what you want to do. >> And and you feel secure in what you saved up in retirement to continue. You're not worried about running out of money? >> No. >> Or anything like that? And do you have also enough, do you think, to, you know, save to give to your children? Also, >> I think people get a little ahead of themsel. They they they go crazy trying to go ahead and figure out how much money they should, you know, leave their kids. It's important. It's very, very nice. As much as you can, but don't think that you're going to work till 80 or whenever you're going to just to give money away to your kids. keep to your lifestyle. Hopefully, there's going to be money left because everybody wants to leave something for your kids. I think you being with them and help helping them out now wherever you possibly can if they want to buy houses and if you could go ahead and afford it. One of them is making if somebody is making a wedding to be able to help them financially as well. That's what the money is there for. Um I don't plan on taking the money with me. So uh whatever we could help them now and whatever we have all this not taking anything with me. >> Do you help your kids you support them like you uh >> each one of the kids after they if after they got married I helped them for a number of years gave them monthly amounts um still helping one but for all the kids everybody was helped for at least uh four or five years if not longer. >> Wow. And and I I'm assuming based on your approach you you set rules for that right? you said like like you I don't know how it worked like I'm going to support you for 5 years and then >> depends on the particular yeah pretty much I I set the rules if somebody wanted to do something uh different the other side it's totally up to them this is what I could afford and I thought I was always very generous and whatever I had to do uh I'm here to help my kids it's not your kid market it's our kids together >> so don't step out and do more than you can but it's your kids you want to help them as much as you possibly can. >> Mhm. >> Okay. So, so tell us more a little bit about retirement planning and your thoughts on it. Um, you know, since you're there. >> So, I have a lot of friends who are getting into the same or are in the same boat as I am. I think before somebody retires, at least on male, I don't know about the females, they really know have to have some kind of plan of how they want to spend their time. The last thing and the first thing that every wife is worried about is they say, "Uh oh, are you gonna be you're gonna be following me to Costco every single day?" They don't want that. Okay? [laughter] Not the way to go. You need to go ahead just like just as you were had was successful or had a plan or had some idea while you were working. You need to figure out a different plan, another plan as well of how you're going to spend your time. I don't mean the first month or two when your wife says to you, you know, clean up the basement. You could figure that out. But afterwards, how do you want to feel, you know, um, successful in retirement, however it is. If you want to learn or you want to do or you want to, did you have a passion while you were alive? Well, you while you were working, now's the time to go ahead and do it. I believe that there's tons of organizations that could use people to volunteer their time. These are people that were experts hopefully and what they did and didn't make a difference or whatever it is. But just think through very clearly and smartly how you want to spend the time. >> Um you know president of the company who was not Jewish um he came in one day he and he he said he was going to retire. Everybody asked him what are you going to do what are you going to do when retire and he said I love to play golf. Well he says well you live in Chicago what are you going to do? He said 6 months a year I'll be in Florida. The other six months I'll play golf in Chicago. That was his life dream. I think he's still playing golf 10 years later. I would hope that by now people in our community are not that's what they want to do. That's not to say you can't play part-time, but really think how you want to go ahead and be successful in in your retirement. It's your time. You know, we all worked hard. We got to a certain point. It's a time to give back. Okay? Your time is what you have. give back to other people, help other people out, see what you can do to go ahead and, you know, give over to other people what you've learned through the years. >> Mhm. >> So, you're saying that's this is a new thing to me. I >> never thought about it >> that someone should think about the vision that they have to keep them, I don't want to say occupied, but fulfilled >> correct >> in retirement because it just comes up on you, >> right? I mean, you're preparing for it, but this piece is not. You're thinking about the financial piece, but you're saying someone should think about what they want to do in retirement because what are you going to do? You're not working. What do you I know my father-in-law, [snorts] he's retired, but he's he's just working more on his own terms. That's that's how I phrase his retirement. >> It's it's a big problem. It's a big problem on your family life. and uh >> you're going to get depressed if you're not going to go have a full day. Before you retire, think about after the first two months when you're cleaning up and you've gone on all your vacations that you want. What is your day actually going to look like for when you get up to when you go to sleep? >> If you could figure that out, you're going to be happy, your family's going to be happy, and the world out there is going to be happy because you're going to be able to give back everything that you learned and everything you did. What are some Can you give some examples of what someone can do in retirement that's fulfilling? You said some organizations. What do you know? Yeah. What do you know? I don't know of any particular but I'm positive that if somebody was an expert if he was an accountant I am positive that each one of the yeshivas would would welcome people coming you know being being very careful but coming in and helping them out even if it is in fundraising. Okay, nothing wrong with sitting down and trying to call people to raise money. other organizations could use tremendous amount of organizational skills. Every organization has organization that we have here in the community positive they can go ahead and and volunteer their time. Um if they had accounting experience of some sort, every yeshiva is putting up a building or doing something financial. Again, you have to find the right the right spot. Not every place is be willing to go ahead and have a volunteer come in. But I know one person in particular person is retired. He's busier than anything and then there was ever before >> volunteering his time. Even if it means if people just need on a daily basis somebody to talk to. I have a problem. Can I talk to somebody about it? I don't mean a personal problem a financial problem uh like that. If you could reach out and help these people just you'd be surprised how many people would really really appreciate it. >> Mhm. Uhhuh. So very specific question. Sure. >> As part of your retirement plan, social security, is that a big piece of it or is that like an extra thing for you at this point? >> So, I did not take social security at 65 or 66 at the advice of my accountant. I was 70 this past summer. I started taking now. Uh so did my wife. It's a nice chunk of change every single month if you've worked, you know, uh at a good salary. It's a nice amount of money. Anybody knows exactly what it is. It could be close to $5,000 a month if you worked, you know, a decent job. >> It definitely helps. It definitely helps. Depends on how much money you had you put away over the years, but it definitely could go help, you know, in in living the lifestyle that you wanted to. It's not going to be as much. So once again, you have to be careful when you retire as well not to go ahead and run through your money the first three years. So be cautious. You're hope you're going to live a long time. Your house is the biggest value that you have. So, you may want to sell that and move to another place. Um, but hopefully your spending after you retired is not going to be more than before you retired >> because they're not going to fill that up again. >> So, Social Security Go ahead. Sorry. >> I said that boat came and went. Those the the years of of uh high salaries, you know, you're just going to live off off your investments unless you're still involved in some kind of business. >> Mhm. So, so you have some social security. you waited till age 70 just to give a quick education to our listeners. >> Sure. >> Someone could claim social security when they're 62. If it depends when someone's born, but we'll use the rough ages. 62, but it's a significantly lower amount when they're 62. Full retirement age is between depending again on when you're born, 65 to 67, that's when you get the full amount of social security. But if you wait till age 70, you get an even higher amount, >> right? Um I believe it's 8% per year additional of um what you're going to get. So I don't know exact math. Don't quote me on that. But um so Rev Dovet here waited till 70 to claim uh social security because I guess you know you didn't need it until right >> or you wait you um so from your retirement nest egg how mainly are you getting income from it? Is it interest from bonds, dividends from stocks? Are you selling stocks? Do you have a pension? How do you receive your income? >> Um, at this point it was strictly savings. I have not sold off anything as far as any of my IAS. I think at 7273 there's a mandatory amount that you have to go ahead. Um, but I did have, you know, a nice amount of savings that I was able to live off. I'm now retired two years, 2 and 1/2 years. So, I was able to do that. Social Security kicked in, which was good. Um, in another two years, you'll have a mandatory ret mandatory amount that you have to take out. Again, if you live the same way you lived your entire life, your expenses should not be as much as when you were uh working. >> Wow. >> Again, but if you if you want to travel, you want those additional things that you could figure out. But on the dayto-day living, you should go ahead and be able to make it. Again, it all depends on how you set up your lifestyle. >> So, savings, you mean a savings account, like cash in a savings account? >> Cash savings account, right? Wow. So, but that money is you've saved up or you've sold stocks to get to the s >> no saved up >> save savings account. >> A certain amount I always kept in cash and the rest is invested. >> I have this thing always to have money available so there was cash in accounts. >> Um my mother passed away so there was some retirement there was some you know over there >> right. >> Um but uh yeah savings. >> Mhm. So do you find do you have enough let's say to take extra like if you want to go away you feel flexible [clears throat] in that you're not just uh >> no still eating three meals a day um still buying a pair of shoes still buying suits if I have to >> no we'll see we'll see how it works for but I I don't foresee any problem >> again all depends on the lifestyle [clears throat] >> um so we're going to wind down the podcast a wealth of information here um things that are life lessons for myself and a lot of the audience and I think um fellow retirees or people becoming uh retired. Um what is a final thought that you want to give as a message to our listeners when it comes to specifically retirement planning and how you got to where you are today? >> I think it's discipline. Something that starts from the beginning from the first day you start working. I think you have to set up a lifestyle that's going to match your income, whatever you're going to have. Uh, great wife is the way to go. Um, but if you're going to look outside where your life is and it's you're not matching your lifestyle to what you're earning, you're going to get into trouble early on. Stay away from it. You'll enjoy it maybe 40, 50 years later, but it's definitely worth it. And it's a very nice message to send your family as well. If you live a particular lifestyle, hopefully your children will follow in the same lifestyle and you'll have a beautiful life. >> So yes, so very much thank you for coming on, but if anyone has any comments, feedback, questions, we'd love to hear them. Our podcast feeds off of it and we look forward to hearing from you. Thank you very much.