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The Italian Jews and their Wine
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Last night,
we discussed the censored chuva in the
Shilus Haru
Daled where he was asked about the
minute in Marin Moravia where it seems
that Jews were misal very very malle and
drinking wine from Gentiles, drinking
what we know as stamina And Drama was
asked if there's any cool law, is there
any loophole? Is there anything that
these Jews have? Now, at first glance,
you would think that the conversation is
dead on arrival. We're learning. Now
we've seen Mishnas, we've seen Gumaras,
we've seen where it's very very clear
that
be it real be it that was produced by or
be it even
we are merely it was
not only is that wineer but
additionally we saw that that wine is
user because of ideas related to
meaning ideas related to avoid des which
would make it not only user but it would
upgrade it to the level of potentially
avoid which gets into a world of maybe
not only is it user but it's
additionally we saw that the isert to
drink is related to the where the says
these were not just rabbitic decrees but
would not have the ability to be
so at first glance this minute would go
down is one of the strangest menhagum of
all time and would seem to be
axiomatically categorically positively
incorrect. stating that
nunb
brings a fascinating discussion that the
French Bali tofus already had which
seemed to suggest a little bit of a kula
in what at first glance would seem to be
this para kamura and really it began
with something that the rean said he
heard from Rashi the Rashbam said he
heard it from Rashi where Rashi said
that he found
that the
are no longer
on doing.
Now to be clear, this conversation that
Rashi and the are talking about has
nothing to do what we spoke about at
length several times in the beginning of
the and that is
let them all bear.
The point is that there was a certain
pagan custom where once upon a time that
was left in a state of in the same room
with a glass of wine had this impulse to
with the flick of a wrist go and be a
little bit of that wine. That's
something Rashi said already. The said
was no longer pre prevalent in their
times. Certainly Rashi said in our times
it's not prevalent. And if that's the
case today, when a guy engages with
wine, we have to look at him as if he's
a guy obviously, but at the same time,
not one that is a quote unquote
or to quote the
he's not
okay. So how would treat him? It would
treat him like and we know that a who
touches the it's not so posit that that
would even be a problem. fact was
said,
but that only means that it's
hold
which means that not only is it going to
be
it's going to be as well but regardless
today Rashi already suggested and this
goes back to the times of the a who
engages in wine we have to look at him
like which means it's not going to have
the of the over here in a what does that
mean? In the worst case scenario today,
if a guy would touch wine said,
you would think there's a to say that
would be
in fact
right in the beginning brings this. If
you were to be so brazen and to suggest
that
which by the way is the
well then it would be m to drink it even
that is not the
but at the very least a strong deis in
the that would open up the door to maybe
be on a m additionally stamina
which is
only like says
because of its nex
to the extent there's no manu soam would
be maybe
so the rishum already opened up the door
of fascinating I mean this is like a top
five of all time in terms of what's
going on there and a discussion that
could be
was already very different than the that
was discussed in the gar.
All of this is fine and vile and it
helps you maybe with regards to
it helps you maybe for having but to
drink or to drink
and in fact that's not even related to
that's related to
it's related to
and if that's the case there's no
question in the world that should be a
problem and it's for that reason the
question was sent to the Ram. You have
these Moravian Jews there being they're
being mal do they have what to beh or do
they not have to so last night we went
through the Jew from the his incredible
he said number one being that it was
and it's
to drink wine again something that is
hard for us to appreciate but it's to
drink wine could be it's like pass and
just like in pass you find because of
these two pieces so could be when it
comes to be the same way additionally
on the days where was also forbidden
because of yet you see that hel that is
with beer would only be true if you sat
in their pubs and their taverns and
their living rooms and you drank
together with them but if you took it to
quote unquote go well then maybe it
would be different so the said you can
make the argument what's the difference
between beer and wine I mean if there's
any ever been two beverages that are
they are the two right so when it comes
to the ismus is only a problem if your
mom is drinking with them. Then you can
argue as it relates to
it would be the same. But the Raos said
in so many different ways everything I'm
saying now is just to be it's just to be
a little bit but you want to know if
this is what I believe
and any person that drinks he's
stating that you want to know if there's
some avenue of
said there is and this was really a
brief recap of what we talked about last
night but as relates to today's raid
we're going travel from Prague to Italy
and visit a little bit what the custom
was amongst the Italian Jews as it
relates to Stamen. And just as an
introduction to this raid bite, I want
to give a a thank you and a shout out to
Naki Weinstein who is our in-house
Italian scholar. We know that already.
But um I really worked through this
Indian very much together with him and
he shared with me a couple of incredible
marchus as we're going to see. But
either way, # the swarm chatter very
much has his fingerprints on this raid
bite. But regardless,
there's a safer that's called safer
noise. This safer was written by Rabul
Abuhav
was the of Bezden of Venice circa 1600s.
He's also the noted author of the Shiloh
one of the
of the 17th century. So
writes this safer called safer
and the purpose of the safer is to
address the ills of society. So he's
looked around and he's noticed a lot of
things that are not okay and he wants to
address them and be moderate that has to
be mazic in certain areas.
ing dalid the fourth thing that he gives
a mention to and this is the most famous
of all the things that are mentioned in
this safer is the fact that there are
people that drink
and to him it's a
and he feels that this is something that
requires a significant portion of this
safer to address because this notion
that you could have Jews drinking stam
to him is mindboggling now if you go
through zincandal and by the way it's an
easy read Italian poets and the Italian
authors they wrote so beautifully who's
the exhibit a for that right but the
point is that it's a very very easy read
you can go through it especially now
we're learning all these gamaras so for
sure it's a page turner but the point is
in the beginning of the safe of this
zikarin so the way he sets it up is he
said if people were having from
being
mock to
What's the
with all the raid? But the problem is
they're drinking and drinking again is
related to
and a thousand years ago versus today.
The demographics from that perspective
have not changed and sociological
differences are not going to impact this
in any way. And if that's the case, at
first glance, it's a See, he said he
investigated this Indian a little bit.
And what he discovered is eight
different tino, eight different reasons
that people suggested why maybe it's
okay
in 17th century Italy to be drinking
stam. And I think it's to mention all
eight of them very very briefly. The
first one is that people say
anymore which is essentially what Rashi
said
and he deflects this like he did in the
introduction to this said that would
help you for no that would help you
maybe for
if you want to tell me that is like so
maybe you'd be able to drink it but it's
not going to help you for the
so that is really coming from a place
where you didn't learn these sug
properly very easy to say, "Oh, what's
the problem today of drinking wine?" But
not
yeah that's amazing if you don't know
the
but if you know the says there's aan
problem there's a problem there's aud
problem well this doesn't really get too
far and again this is really everything
that we talked about the second that
said that he saw as it relates to this
Indian is that the isser to drink
albeit mishnos would only be a problem
if you're drinking it in the house or
maybe even in a tavern and a pub
together with an but to the extent that
you're taking it to go then already
maybe you wouldn't be sure and the
precedent for that is
well you see by which according to many
was also
felt that there's no problem if you're
not drinking it together with them now
this tina if it sounds familiar this was
the ra second argument right this is the
t of again he didn't say but at the very
least He threw it out there but says
again not quoting anybody but says this
is not a good at all and the reason this
is not a good is very very simple he
said because we know there's a lot of
things that said areas
said that is they also said is they said
is
so I want to ask you a question you ever
hear anyone say that is mut as long as
you don't sit and eat together with the
guy what do you mean is because if a go
is going to prepare a meal for you, you
might become his right. That's what
we're worried about. But that's
something that's always a problem. You
can't ever eat from anything that was by
a guy
says,
"You have to say that we have no right
to pick and choose and be madame." When
it came to
dear said that it's only going to be a
problem if you're drinking it with them.
when it comes to bishop kas their kazal
didn't make that distinction. He says
regarding pass I never heard such a
distinction either. So Kazal knew with
their incredible wisdom when to make
this distinction and when not to make
this distinction. But in terms of us
going ahead and being
is like maybe is like maybe it's like
maybe it's like one of the other things
that are so we have no right to go ahead
and to address it. Now there who used
this as a big in his probably agreed
and say it he's coming to so really
depends on how you want to approach
this. If you want to approach it, it's
wrong.
If you want to approach it, let's be
maybe we can say that is like right. So
it depends on how you want to approach
it. But this is a mus and in this he
says what I saw this argument as that
this is what they want to rely on.
There's no way that this is something
that you'd be able to rely on. The third
Tina that he brings is that people that
says God's
right more clarified exactly how that
evolved but they put them all together
right clearly put them together
said
I saw some wanted to say that it sounds
like
it's all the same so what so they were
which we know right
they were
So once she is motor is going to be
motor as well. As if to say these were
three takas that were all put together
and once one domino falls they all fall.
So they were mount everything is going
to be motor and said that's ridiculous.
First of all second of all said it by
she never applied it to everything else.
It sounds like it was meant by shem.
What do you mean the the shemen domino
fell in the terms of kazal? They didn't
make any deal about oh well that affects
pass and that affects the and he says
besides if you go through the mas of the
way the garra comes out is god
and what do you see from there you see
in the is one step closer to
and says because wine brings to bad
things sometimes
certainly can bring so if that's the
point just because they were
in act. He said that if they would have
been and you wanted to tell me now is oh
that's a good argument because God
so if well then they should be as well
but that's not what Kazal said. It was
just the opposite. It was
and now they were number one. Who said
the three have anything to do with each
other? If anything it's in the reverse
order. You see that never even mentioned
regarding pass. He says as far as that
goes to him that's ridiculous.
The fourth hater that he saw is aa aa.
He said the fact that Jews don't drink
wine together with some people are
arguing it just brings to animosity and
to bad feelings amongst the gentiles and
we find that and they will matter a lot
of things and based on a I think this is
something that should be mutter. So the
first thing says is that we have no
right to be mad. We're mad. He brings
the truth already said this. We can't go
ahead and decide what's ava. He brings
where am thought something should be and
then they were told that they were
wrong. But the point is we are
definitely not now in the 17th century
to say that something that said is
something that's brought down as being
we're going to go ahead and we're going
to be misha. He says besides did you
ever feel this ava because you don't eat
non-coosher meat? where anyways not
eating and mingling in a proper way
together with because of the laws of so
this is where everything is going to
fall apart says I don't believe that and
then he says something very interesting
he says that there are a lot of Jews
that are for sure on it's not everyone
that's being misal
and some aren't he says you know what I
think is the in the world he says when
the see that there's no amongst the Jews
That's what causes Ava. He said, if the
Jews are unified, he said, then there's
no AA. That's what he says. He says, but
when we're in a mat where we're not
getting along,
that creates it creates a it looks like
the Jews don't know what they're doing.
And if we don't have our act together,
how do we expect anyone else to respect
us if we can't respect ourselves?
Fascinating idea. But he says the a is
going to come foret from be mazo. He
says cuz he never going to get the and
the to go ahead and to be mazo. And the
fact that this Jew does and that Jew
doesn't it and makes us look like a
joke. And when WE LOOK LIKE A THAT
CREATES THE greatest anti-semitism in
the world. This is like a fascinating
little nugget tucked away over here in
the middle of
but either way that was number four.
Number five, this one's great. And
really, you know, before last night's
rabbi, you would say come again. But uh
you have to rewind it. But I think after
last night's rabbite, we could at least
appreciate it. He said, "I've heard
people say that if a Jew doesn't drink,
it's
impossible. Can't make it through your
day without a glass of wine." And
because really sometimes the only wine
that's available. So it's a question of
nephesh now he says could be when you're
home you know you have your local wine
guys that you can go to #iff etc. over
there maybe it's not nefes but when
you're on the road then it's for sure
and if it's nef it's going to be a
problem and he writes back he says
listen I understand that you know wine
is very important but it's notes and
because it's not he says go on you ever
saw somebody die cuz he didn't have a
glass of wine it never happened so it's
not but it's definitely not and as a
result that's not something you can say
the sixth tina that he brings which I'll
be honest I don't understand but the
sixth argument is that being that so
many people were
if Jews are then you have to be now it's
amazing
even gave this a little bit of air time
because what would then say when he
hears this
right you know that there was a he once
asked
it says in the he said most people in
the world are not Jews so why are you
following your religion aren't you
supposed to go busy so told him it's
true it says
What does that mean? It means when
there's a suffic
but if you know the MS if there's a vi
of roy is a tool that the dian uses in a
suffic
but is a garnish. So,
what do you mean it's very nice so many
people are doing it but if it's also
it's also but either way this is what
said was an argument and obviously this
was something he really didn't like the
seventh which we're not going to go into
is there was a from a chuva that was
written by the
this is in his sim and from that it
sounds a little bit like he was in fact
it sounds a lot like maybe he was and
this was something argument seven that
the safe house was coming to address and
he says that you know as it relates to
that don't make a big deal about that
because the truth is there are other chu
that were written
where it's clear that he was very mmed
and he goes on this whole this is
probably the longest part of this
chapter where he says people they take
chas out of context and they take quotes
and and he did say it he didn't say it
he meant it he didn't mean it he says if
you're going to tell me what the re's
position was when it comes to go through
every single chuva you didn't I did and
I'm telling you right now he was a big
mah this Indian I that online it's a
kasha but either way there's no question
in the world
that that's the way it is and then
finally the last thing he says that
people China is this has been says I
don't know I was born in Italy Padua in
the year 1640 my father told me that he
used to buy wine here and his father
used to buy wine there and his father
used to buy this has been going on for
generations and if it's been going on
for generations he says that you know I
don't know what to tell you this is the
way we've always been doing it and this
is the way we've always been doing it so
there has to be some merit to it so to
that said what do you mean your father
did it I mean your father it's very nice
he did it but doesn't make it right he
says if they were that did it but they
weren't these were people that were
making the same mistake that you were
making
but they have a drinking I mean that's
not what we call not
right I mean that that's not for that
reason that's not going to be regardless
here in perim of he goes through eight
different
maybe what he calls
and he categorically dismisses all eight
of them but one thing is clear you see
from this whole Indian and that is that
in Italy in the 1600s this was a major
problem this was a major major Truth is
there's more evidence that this was a
major problem in Italy circa the 1600s
and that's from another safer this safer
was called Yan Hamash you can find it
safer is called Yan Hamash and it was
written by Hagyen Hameobel
Shapiro now not to be confused with the
Bal Malamukas who had the same name but
this is Ramnos Shapiro who is a big
Makobel and he wrote a safer called Yin
Hammer and the purpose of the safer
is to again address this issue and that
is there are Jews in Italy that are
drinking sam it's wrong and I have to
address it now if you look at the cafer
which I did you'll see the safer is made
up of two parts the first part of the
cafer is a bunch of and all different
that are on board 100% that this is a
terrible terrible thing now it's a
little ironic and the reason it's ironic
is because the husk that shap brings
when that has on his own safer in fact
his safer itself has No husk but there's
30 pages of husk that were getting given
in friodus
to similar
or mak meaning different letters that
were written related to the fact that
people are drinking when they're not
supposed to be drinking and he's being
mitar them to his own caf that's the
first part of the cafer the second part
of the cafer is his argument of why it's
wrong and if you take a look at it
inside you'll see the whole is kabal it
wasn't a that was written
not was a big and this safer that he
wrote was alab and really it comes from
where says that any person that's not
will not merit to drink from the y when
mashia is going to come hence the name
of the safer yamash and the two are
related to each other you drink stam
you're going to lose out on the yamash
and he works with that zy and other
cababalistic sources and really what
comes out is that in the world of kabala
stam is from the worst things a person
could possibly
which means that the transcends the of
the bal in the
11 and 1200s in France. It transcends
all this rate. There's a cabalistic
component and that was the point that
the
Shapiro was commun to make. By the way,
from these two swarms, which was written
by Abu and which was written by N
Shapiro, both addressing the Italian
Jews, it's very very clear that this was
an issue not only in Moravia, but this
was a major major issue in Italy as
well.
There's a journal that's put out by
Rabakov Hel's Mat Shalom. It's called
Minhagen. They're already holding by
volume 19. I think that's the most
recent one that came out. It's a hard
cover glossy pictures fascinating
journal name. They're taking things out
of Genea uncovering different that were
forgotten about and different that never
saw the light today. In volume
and this is page
there's an article that was written by a
professor a tremendous guy whose name is
Rabyakov Spiegel and the purpose of this
it's a contress on stamenum
Italy circa the era that we're
discussing right now specifically there
was an Italian godle whose name was reb
mahal hallelujah that was his name rebah
Hallelujah. Incidentally, he has an
entry in the sham mahal hallelujah had
written was a ro in Italy in the 1600s.
He had written swarim. One of the swarim
that he wrote is shil such hal gummer.
Not surprising but that's the name of
the cafer shil such hal gummer. It has
65 chuvas in it. Gimatria of IN THE BACK
OF shila halgmer there are three chuvas
that he wrote about this issue of stam
bismano and thiserigel
is printing for the first time these
three chu on stam from hallelujah. and
this is what it is. So he prints it with
footnotes and the in the introduction to
this presentation, he talks a little bit
about what was going on in Italy at that
time. Just as an interesting aside, the
first footnote that he has in his own
piece is I want to give a big
who helped me write this article. So he
gives a big alter to helping him with
this article. But either way, just to
get a little sense of where this title
is coming from. But regardless, so he
goes through what was going on in Italy
and he quotes the
and he quotes the from these are the
famous that were written on this topic
and he says a few interesting things
that I want to mention. Number one, so
it's clear from these that there was a a
problem in Italy, right? Where people
are drinking sam. So here's the first
question I think you would want to ask
yourself right the curious listener
would want to know and that is who
exactly was being this is the that are
not you know the that are necessarily
behaving the way they're supposed to
behaving mean the people that the is
getting up and shring about or were
these actually it's the like who is it
right who are the people that are
drinking stamina right every society has
its ills usually they're associated with
a certain fringe of this society who in
Italy was drinking Samy when you see an
drinking Samy I'm under the premise that
this is okay so here's two mus that if
you're a little bit familiar with
Italian history is absolutely
mind-blowing the first thing that
uncovered is that when wrote his
and he talks about eight different
arguments that he saw that it should be
mut so he didn't write where he saw
these arguments right makes no mention
of it. But he says it's posit where he
got this from. He said because there was
a safer that was written around that
time and in that safer all eight of
these arguments are there. And he says
no sh in my mind. It's partial. It's
beyond a reasonable doubt that this is
what he was referring to. Now that safer
is a safer called
that's the name of the safer and it was
written by Yed whose name was Rebalion
Roig. Right. He was the Rav of Roigo and
he went ahead and he writes this called
and it's from there that it's coming. So
we track down the cafer and if you take
a look at the cafer it's very very small
but this is what he writes here in the
beginning. I'm just going to read a few
excerpts. He says
someone that's very very good
and I'm very people that are
but I feel it's very hard today to be in
the
and the reason it felt that way is
because it was it was just too hard to
produce your own kosher wine. It's very
very hard.
So I decided that this is not something
that I'm going to get involved.
He said but I want you to know that even
though what I'm doing is aesh but I have
to rely on
who that it's
nowuden
was one of the raon in Venice around
this time. He was the son of the padawa
ramy pad was the god of bait. This is
the padawa son who was also a god
beyond reproach not negotiable. All
theim that we're quoting from now are
100% beyond reproach. He says as follows
he was not careful IN
I was fighting with him. I said what are
you doing?
He said the B of the he said if I was
drinking wine with them
I don't think this is
so I'm going in the footsteps of My rebi
I saw my rebi be and if I saw my rebi be
m something I could be m as well. The
mur of these eight kindness that was
addressing was really if you trace it
back it was
which if you know you know was a son of
one of the most respected
of that era. This is where it traced
itself back to which is absolutely
fascinating. I'll tell you something
that's even more mind-blowing. If you're
sitting be careful hold on to your chair
and that is that spiggel quotes here in
this article that the zachuva in the shu
is be as
written by beer. He was also uh
Italian gudle in the latter half of the
17th century and he was discussing a
very nuance shila in the world of sta
and in the middle of the truth he goes
off a little bit on a digression and he
says quote
That's what he writes. He says
he brings that to mommy drink.
Now, why is this so interesting? I mean
first of all this is what it doesn't
even make sense right but I'll tell you
why it's even more interesting than that
because if you remember not so long ago
in the beginning of when we did the
rabbite about the beard and it's that
brings in his tru about that he was
clean shaven he calls him who was
right he didn't have one facial hair on
his face because he used to shave his
beard what's the martyer
comes from the beer As that's where it
comes from and if you remember we
mentioned then
and others said that the beac was
misinformed AND THEY CAME SO YOU'RE
saying that the pano DID HAVE A BEARD
HAD A BEARD IT'S THE bare it's
fascinating the bear as said pan was the
one who was like that's IN
he's saying that he drank this is a ple
in his go if there's ever been one but
this is what he brings by the way just
to give you an appreciation who's the
bear as His chas were reprinted recently
you know reprinted them
reprinted his chas
and this is what he brings the two chas
in one ch didn't have a beard and so
says we know that of the
was very much contested people said he
was misinformed that it wasn't true
how people came out strongly now brings
it in but we know how strongly people
came out against it and here again this
time talking about
what's even more interesting is if you
look at the
so we mentioned what was right what was
the eighth argument the eighth argument
maybe to to be the eighth argument was
that this is what the zas did right this
EVERYONE GREW UP LIKE this so if
everyone grew up like this based on that
should be okay and he writes back what
do you mean you saw your father and your
za do was was THE SAME SHAKE AS YOU ARE
I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO TELL US YOUR SHAKE
IT'S RIGHT. IT'S BASICALLY WHAT HE SAYS.
HE SAYS, "If you saw by the be one
thing, but you didn't see by the and
then he SAYS, "LET ME TELL YOU WHAT I
SAW by the and he starts listen. He
mentions the marik and he mentions the
pad." He starts going through some of
the big Italian. And then he says as
follows
the true voice of
even though all the troubles that we
have from him he never said a word about
this.
Everyone knew how he was when it comes
to
Either
WAY HE SAYS THE PANO THIS SADDIC THIS
KADESH everyone knows that he was very
when it comes to so was the paniz was he
not did he have a beard or did he not
have a beard why we talking about this
it's all this is all in the it's coming
up in these ra bites this is absolutely
fascinating but al one thing for sure
you see that there were real rabinan
There were real Rabonim that
seemingly were behind this this mic.
Here's another good one. Ramosha
Proello. Sounds familiar, right? So is
the one that wrote the chuva about
playing tennis in 15th and 16th century
Italy on Chavis. So inv
So he has uh he has a chuva about a
certain type of cheese and this is the
way the chuva begins
for the people that are
so it seems they used to put a little
bit of wine so someone that's niser
someone that's niserin Stameno someone
that's who's not Nisar and Stameno it's
it's like gross I eat gros I don't eat
gros I put a canadal in my soup I don't
put a canal in my soup THIS IS NOT OPEN
FOR DEBATE what's this negotiation over
here the ter is because in Italy there
were people that were narim there were
people that were not nisarim by the way
this whole
was written really asma as we mentioned
there were mahal hallelujah three chuvas
that he wrote on this topic so what did
he himself write so if you take a look
at his chuvas so he writes as follows
seems that somebody tells him that it's
very hard for me by not drinking.
So he goes with it's amazing he says
that
or that whole of that's not an issue
anymore
already addressed that. So that's off
the table. What we're left with is the
problem of the problem of he said that's
and this precedent where you could be
and today for a person not to be able to
drink wine he's going to be in an
enormous amount of pain and based on
that he wants to be I mean these are
incredible kisters they're I mean you
talk about these are incredible culin
because of these reasons
when it comes
It's
there's a little bit of annoyance
meaning you're uncomfortable. You're
this is the poetry is just ridiculous.
The was given
this is what he writes
was also from the Minim. But here's the
bottom line. The bottom line is this was
not just a ka that was prevalent amongst
this was a a ka that seems made it to
the rabbitic level and it was a real
thing. Now if you go through the in it's
categorically awesome. I mean after you
mention some of these things we have to
make this very clear in there's no
question in the world this is asser
there's no sh in the world in the only m
there is to be is when it comes to
touching wine if you want to have enough
from it or if you want to have enough
but when it comes to drinking
even though there's very much
it's not true And when it comes to
drinking that's not even and even that
wrote his tru only said it to be he says
in his own words I'm being
that's what he says he's literally being
but really it's something that he
believes is 100% someone drinks he's
and if you look in the
shap that we mentioned earlier the grace
of he brings from different sadikim that
came up very very strong by far by far
the most important one of those quote
unquote hamas is that was written first
by Cairo
himself and then afterwards a kyra that
was put out to address this interesting
mic that signed off by all the rabbon of
that famous
and included in that is the mid and the
and of course the so it came from
all army held that this is something
that without a question is going to be
assa stating that there were times in
Jewish history where people were make
and it seems like maybe even had signed
off on this kula. Now when you go
through it you know sometimes you go
through these you hit it a little bit
and you struggle more to understand you
know the bff component of it this is a
pelad okay there's words there's
rationale and it seems like the
signed off on it one thing is clear that
when you go through it the only reason
the ones that were make or were even
makeel was related to the world that
they live in it's a world that we don't
live in today so today for someone to
walk into a store and buy stamenum or if
someone's on vacation in a sitting in a
hotel and they offer him a non-cosher
glass of wine or he's sitting on a plane
or wherever he might be you know he's
going to say it's stam I heard some ra
bites I mean that's a pirate scar on the
highest level because when you go
through the Indian even the saddakula is
related to the fact that there was a
time it was there was a time you
couldn't survive today yontiff will sell
you the best kosher wine you could
possibly buy and if that's the case
there's no question in the world this is
not something That's nego. You want
French, you want Italian, you want
mushul, whatever you want, we'll sell it
to you at good prices. And the bottom
line is whatever you want today, you're
able to get. So even that was going on
in that time is is not something is not
something that was relevant to but at
the same time from a historical
perspective as
amazing as it may sound once upon a time
this was a real thing. I just want to
end with one thing and that is that one
of the maras I came around about just
going through this Indian a little bit
was the moral the maral mi prag gave a
fiery dr this is one of the printed dras
from the moral where he talks about how
the is drinking sam and the truth is
that
it's notes with the tr from the raos
says in moravia this is a problem and
bra is practically the capital of
moravia so it makes a lot of sense that
this is a problem and is very very very
distraught and my was the is screaming
about what's going on and the
right both are right who's going to pick
and choose between the ra and the moral
right what the is the
so I don't know but I think the mahalak
the mahalik just the hash is what I
think moral was the r when you're the rv
you have to be miaak
sees his I don't know talking during he
has to get up he has to say something
what are you supposed to DO
HE'S not
and
but it's so fascinating came from one
angle he's giving my how can I not give
them they're drinking I believe it's
wrong
it's coming from a different vantage
point he's coming from the vantage point
and I like in that beautiful trit
even to be I can't get over that truth
from the Rama by the way. I know it was
censored
was uncensored you know obviously at
some point as well but the bottom line
is the way he was
absolutely incredible because he doesn't
like it. It's clear he doesn't like it.
And again, you know, we're going to
censor the you might as well censor the
right because I mean there's the I mean
the IS THE BUT THE BOTTOM line is this
is what he felt. He felt very strongly
there's a tremendous mus in there BUT
THE MOROUS THEREOF THEREOF
it's not a at all. But I'll tell you one
other thing I came around and that is
there's actually a a Misha that was
composed by the Mari Prague and they
would say this in the Shul and this I
guess the out right I didn't see it on
the wall the last time I was there but I
guess that's what this was said and this
is a
in Moravia you ready this is the we're
going to end with
forch.
be strong.
The
woman.