The Custom of the Wife of Rabbi Yaakov Emden - The Unknown Halachic Status of Shavuos

this store class is brought to you by torahanytime.com we're in Queens Kew Garden Hills New York um very holding the days of Swiss Army and we're going to learn today about a unique aspect of us and no other Yantis enjoys and it's a very unknown it's a halacha that applies to shibuous that no other yamzif has and I bet no one ever heard it before I'm willing to bet that this is one difference between that applies that doesn't apply and that you never heard before they never heard but I'm willing to bet you never heard this before okay so first we have to know about a very interesting Minogue that women have that when they light The Narrows of yomptif [Applause] and then they do something very unusual and that is they make why in the world are they making us what's wrong with her husband what are they doing well they have some patience we don't when we come to show a little do we get started that's what we do Yom Kippur do we do that on yamtips now we have patience we don't do that on Yom Kippur because in Yom Kippur there's no choice right there is no kid there shall beam kippers you have to make it and sure but on a regular yump before we have Kiddush so you don't make the shakyanu in show you make the shakyanu Al I like ice so why do nausea make when they light candles now did they always do this no way they didn't always do this do they do this in the times of uh the mid bar no sometimes the mid bar they didn't do this they do this time's the bat is three Shine by shiny no way they did not start doing this it's only the last few hundred years now it is older than schless that I'll tell you but it is relatively new in uh it's relatively new in uh Judaism and Moshe Feinstein in the egress it's ready hundreds of years not thousands of years only a few hundred years is this correct is this good not really no it would be better he says that if they don't make a shot because we know whenever you could put brojos this is always better games I don't necessarily endorse this and I'm not complementary of this Minogue but what could we do he's just reporting the facts are for hundreds of years women are making of yeah the unmarried man did not make us only for women who did not make Kiddush what right so he's mentioning so oh there's no Minogue for men to uh make the shakiano on the neros only the women okay now cry correct now who's the first to observe this custom of women the first movement to observe this custom was none other than the Great Akron who the Sam Cipher calls a novice by the way you should know there's only one person that some Cipher ever called a navi and that is a react of emden some service said about him that he's a navi okay very interesting the he writes over here in the Shayla the ivitz to my beloved friend hagavir foreign I think right great minds think alike I think though just like you know I would have liked to protest on women make sure the other one they like the narrow the the candles why the noise of and you have good times it's not mentioned in any postgame that women should do this whoa so now let's stop we could give a Shear on this line in other words what are women allowed to do well what's wrong why can't I do it it doesn't say anywhere I'm not allowed to no that's not what we do we see we're in the post game does it say you can see that sort of London writes you have a good taina because it doesn't say in the play skin that women can make this doesn't say they can't no we don't Judaism doesn't work that way we need precedent we need precedent okay now that he brings but there is precedent ah Rak the kid sir in the safer it says that women can make is not a reliable safer it's not a reliable say so now the shla of course but the kids are something else another reason now that's the reason number one reason number one why women should not make this because it doesn't say that villain the cancer right here right you get the argument is it's not brought down that they can and number two void foreign so in other words then if even when the Shah says you can make we wait then we make it on kiddish so certainly in this case where there's no Macar for women to make rice what do we do we we should certainly not allow it and we should certainly they should wait to make the on kiddish and you should know my dear friend I swear says as soon as my senses kicked in this was very strange and I wanted to protest against my wife mitanza see he wanted to he wanted to the Apple P Kane nevertheless I didn't act I didn't tell her to stop and I let her do her thing why why what about the fact isn't it no it's not a Brussels now he's pointing out the questioner who's asking of Jacob and thought it was you know why because let's say if in middle of kiddish when the husband's saying shafiano the wife chimes in no if she chooses not to be yoitza with her husband and chooses to make her own because not the hate she's allowed to do that right no one would stop her from making a brother that she certainly because women are obligated in right and women therefore are obligated look in the parenthesis the haninashi women they have the positive commands of so if she would choose the middle of Kiddush to go like this and her husband might not appreciate it but she's entitled to ignore not only that even a woman who doesn't like candles for whatever reason if she wanted to make the shaggiano as soon as yantev started wonderful she's allowed to you know why they came along is [Music] you don't need anything you can make it in the street Nami there's no Barack obatala if she would choose to make her own the day causes right so if a woman wanted let's say if a woman wanted as soon as started to walk out into the street and to say shagriano what do you mean we're gonna make it later so the fact that attaching it The Shopper dummy is the first Mitzvah that she performs so therefore says then it's not the end of the world if a woman chooses not only right if a woman would choose to ignore her husband she could make her own and therefore in this case it's not so terrible for her to make the shakiano on the back is and therefore when I see my wife making even though would it be better for her not to and wait for me yes but is it worth being mosha now you see over here there's no the issues of Shalom bias are not playing a role in this his decision should he protest you not right we're assuming they you know they have a good uh they have good communication over here you know if he would tell her something she would listen right that's not the issue the issue is should he be my friend something she's been doing for a long time so he says like this I'll let her do her minute which she Arches from her her parents and she has been doing this Minogue and her parents have been doing this minute before Gregor ithm and especially my wife and your wife he says the question are who are the Lord had they not seen great good Island do this they would never do this even though I have no idea why my father-in-law let her do this in the first place but that's a different story he writes in the parentheses by the way Rebecca vemden was married to the daughter of remember he says I have no idea foreign therefore it is very hard in my eyes to allow women to do this without any basis if you decide to move out to some new community and start a new neighborhood women should not be saying when they light their young my high time we do not allow women to make when they light in a place where there's no Minogue and you're right it's not any different than the fact that the gemara says to make when you make it and we wait for the kais certainly we should not allow women to develop this minute but a woman who claims her grandmother and her great-grandmother has been doing it fine you know you don't have to uh you don't have to turn over the world to stop the minute but to to start this minute 18 minutes they're my kind of well first they're making the uh so that's their Mercado yamtiff and once they say that they can make it okay we're not here to start up with this by the way very interesting you know who reacted was there any more anyone ever more outspoken against any deviants than Rebecca and then any slight right or left turn that had his own printing press in his house and he would publish Forum right against but when it comes to his wife you know he's he's careful you know you know but it doesn't matter who Godzilla but nevertheless this sort of put his hands back and said well let it continue so then if you know we'll make a Cavachon and stop it what could we say so we're gonna take it well this is a minute I mean there's something in Cuba but it's not the right thing to do so once we came into it no no so again he points out that they're not violating anything by making the shakriano that's what he said it's not a broker because if you want to start the yamta by stam's making a woman would be allowed to If a woman would want to ignore her during Kiddush her husband she could ignore it and make her own so there's no she's not doing anything wrong it's just preferable to hear the case but there's no isser or even that a woman is violating by making the shakyanu on if it's just it would have been better had she waited okay if she wouldn't with the status that it has is like what moisha says it's already 100 years hundreds of you that they've been doing this that's the status it's something I've been doing for hundreds of years remote doesn't stamp it with the endorsements he just says it's been hundreds of years you know you have you have often you know Rebecca Kaminsky writes about certain things if I would have the strength that would be movable not everything that's not perfect you're movato it doesn't mean it's it's wonderful it's great it's tolerated exactly that's a reactance say no because because grandfathered in exactly right so now we're going to for granted Rabbi Sai that this is what women do that when they lied to know yumped if women make shaggiano as far as I know all women do this you'll correct me if I'm wrong the case if she answers so that's what we're going to talk about today now but they lightening up their friends okay so slide them you have them now here's the question If a woman does make a shakiranu when she likes the candles and for some reason the husband's not home and she has to make Kiddush should she make sheffiano again certainly not for her to make yourself again would definitely be abras right when women go to show the roughly specifically announced they don't make that they don't correct right right they're good right so if someone's almond rice look number three made says it in a certain tone that she shouldn't do it but if Sternberg goes a little further that not only should she not do it says like this look at number four in the hagada on certain things we'll see we'll see we'll see okay um so it's worse than she shouldn't do it she does it ah now here's the big sugya and I venture to say that I am going to surprise you with what the is because I think most people are under a certain impression and that is the impression that we're going to start with and says Revolution stormbow can she answer a mean to her husband she should not answer them in why because for her kiddish her Kiddush doesn't neither shakiana so when she hears the husband saying shafiano that's an extraneous thing in the Kiddush so for her to answer a main for example let's say your middle of saying kiddish right and somebody comes out of the uh somebody who's passing by and he says and middle rights and middle of you hearing kid this from somebody a guy on the outside makes a heart the answer on Mains of course not it would be a half SEC so for you to answer a man for the woman to answer Amen to the husband in her kiddish and therefore she should not answer I mean this is a have itself he writes that women who make shaggiano when they light the Nay rice and she should also not answer a maid because then her amane is going to be half sick between the boy Priya goffen and the tiima and therefore says of strombach women should not answer I mean comes along the heart speed he broke itself that the husband is making yeah that's not a half sucker for her because he's not drinking after the Kiddush he's he's speaking Europe talking forget about the amane she's hearing Kiddush from somebody that in terms of her Cube this person is being map sick between the Kiddush and the drinking why because as far she's concerned shakiano is completely unnecessary okay so the heart city wants to say even further maybe a woman can't be you I'd say kiddish with a man on Lillian why because the man needs to say she doesn't need to say shakyan so as far as she's concerned the guy who's making Kiddush imagine if you heard Kiddush from somebody right and the guy started making you know boy right pretty hot AIDS and then he said you know and then he said you know he made all kinds starts making brachas on a rainbow no so you're not going to kill this you can't start making outside Brussels some other kids that's the one who's making for him it's requirements the famous Shyla is that a man when he comes home he died and the woman didn't die then right right so he's his kiddish obligation is the rabbana hers is the rice so he says good job is they say Good Shabbos to each other so now the ones that you said good job is her requirement is downgraded so so here also his request he's the one who's making kiddish so even though he has a high requirement yeah but his higher requirement is inserting something that as far as she's concerned is extraneous but it's relevant not for her not for her so I shouldn't concerned this guy's talking about you know the the weather in Japan is irrelevant to her okay well we'll see we'll see but more than the amane maybe the Shema Coyne itself is a have sex because we know what's the halacha if a person's way and they hear the schlesibor saying Kadesh or kadusha so what do you do so the shita of Rashi is you stop and listen and listening is not a heftic listening is good enough it's like you answered but it's not a headset but Tyson sushita is what that if stopping and listening is like answering then it's also like a headset and you know twice is paskins you cannot stop and listen because if stopping and listening is like answering then it's like being mastic also but toaster says the Min hug is nevertheless to stop and listen until she says okay which implies that even though his arm is being Twisted even though he feels that listening really is a half sick but since that's what people do it's makubal so therefore we'll accept it we'll tolerate it says that the only reason why tysus is willing to accept it is only because the guy has no other option the guys right he's going to miss out on kadusha so he stops to listen but let's say for example a guy is putting on film show Yad so if the Sheltie was up to kadusha so he has no choice he'll stop and listen he has to hear kadusha but let's say a guy knows that if he's gonna start to put on Phila now he's gonna be in a massive where he'll have to stop and listen between so then we should tell him wait a minute Isis is only willing to tolerate that it's not a happy but don't put your where are you gonna have to stop and listen and it might be a F6 so this is too pissed around we would tell the guy don't start to put on the pill in yeah so therefore in this case there's a two-person Frank why put the woman in a massive where she's gonna have to stop and listen to shakyanu which is a hep stick for her better for her make her own Kiddush once you're allowing women's live and letting her make the shakiano on this so gonna make her own kid-ish because don't put her in this massive but then Frank says maybe you could say like this when is it when is it that Rabino Tam has to tolerate that's stopping will say you know what it's not a half sick that's only for kadusha where the guy who is the most he has to hear kadusha so for him it's not so great for him to have to stop and listen to kadusha management essay because this is something he needs to listen to so he has to come on to Sharma time feels if you're gonna have to come on to kaina then maybe it's a half stick but the woman in the middle of kidish she doesn't need the sheikhiana in fact she doesn't want it so when it comes to shakiano she'll listen but she won't listen to kind of because listening she'll sort of be listening but not trying to have the credit to her account so this is a debate that the hearts he has with himself so to speak this is he's vacillating as to whether it's appropriate for a woman once she's made the shekiano to even hear kiddish from her husband the night of yanto let's take a look quickly number six he says this is the issue in your side since women have to drink their own kais maybe women should make her own Kiddush through the husband because since she was already here to the shakiano so her on Main is going to be a half sick yeah look in the last uh line of the Bold so she is maybe the eights is let the woman not answer a main successful Frank just to tell a woman not to answer I mean it's not going to correct the issue you could still look into it the listening alone should be a half stick like the paskins that if you hear kaddish between shelyan and you don't be mastic to answer but be quiet why like the bay series explains because we paskin that is regarding responding but it's not a heptic and the source is from rashim SEPTA that if somebody's diving in here you're not a stop and answer but you should be quiet and listening then it's a have sick and the words of toy um instead of soup has said Frank I feel that the language of Texas is nashma that God of America has only been the event and that is if someone's the middle essay what could he do he has no atsa so he stops and is quiet and listens right stop drop and roll stop drop and listen to kadish right you need to be conscious not to put yourself in a massive we're gonna have to stop and listen because maybe that's a half sick and therefore maybe this woman we should tell her make your own Kiddush why before before that much love we're not giving her you know we'll let the husband make the first one no she could do it quietly herself yeah I don't know emotional woman still be part of that foreign okay but then he says on the other hand you could say as Farah that maybe Rabino Tam in the real are only saying is a have sex if it's something that you need to hear like kadusha in other words if you remember you need to hear kadusha every day so what could you do you need to stop and listen but your listening is in a way where you want to be I'd say if you want to be yitza then it's like you said it it's a heftic if you're listening to the woman who's listening to her husband's kiddish she doesn't need the shekiano so she's not gonna listen in a way of show me a kind of okay so this is one extreme of the issue this is the shita uh Sternberg and the Hearts 3 that even just answering on Main to the husband would constitute a half stick to the point where two pasta Frank is thinking maybe she can't even listen to her husband's Kiddush altogether [Applause] revolutionizes the sugya and I don't know why there's such a big misconception a lot of people are hoistes for this says no problem she can answer on me no problem why what's this why foreign the reason he's not protesting is not because he's afraid of his wife or he's afraid to rock the boat the reason he says why he didn't protest he's not protesting because the one the women who make the shakriano Alanis they're not doing anything wrong there's nothing there's no avla in making is it's just would have been preferable had they waited says of Moshe if you're gonna tell a woman yeah you can make rice but then when your husband makes kiddish don't answer them in that's an avla that's an Avila how could you tell somebody not to answer I mean you're Michael you have to answer amen whenever first of all the Matthias says reality is who's going to remember women aren't gonna answer on me you could tell them a thousand times don't remember they're gonna answer on me you could tell them before Kish listen here's the halaka you already made don't answer and you know what's gonna happen they're gonna answer them in and you say but I just told you and I also just told you to do something right so they're not gonna listen they're not gonna live and I can remember they're not gonna remember so it's an avla to have a woman make rice if you're gonna say the halacha is that you can't answer I mean on the husband's kiddish then you this minnow gives a minog batas that this is a bad minute because what you can tell if the woman's not answering she's gonna make a mistake and answer our main and even if she's gonna remember it's still an avla to tell somebody not to answer a man out of Brasa because we know the Torah tells us tells us whenever you hear Abraham to say Amen so to have a Min hug where you're putting a woman in a matzov where she can't answer a man that is a terrible Minogue and raviak of emden says should have protested and destroyed the Minogue didn't protest because she makes the sheikhiana and she answers Amen to her husband in other words I feel that if a woman would not be allowed to answer a name to her husband's Kiddush that should have been enough of a reason for abiak of emden to tell his wife it's over no more that's enough of a reason is it such a big Avila to have a Minogue we are the only bad ramification of the Minogue is you're just not going to answer them into one bro yeah so if you want to know what kind of Minogue is considered a mini batas if the Minogue even makes a person Overlook one Sif in any other it's a bit not a good minute that's what Amisha says says ramasha he says like this let's now let's see uh look at number eight but there oh is can she answer our main but he quotes the meaning of the Rebecca and then brings down that Freddy for hundreds of years women have been making now look about 12 lines down first word online is virac by the dance is if a woman was not allowed to answer I mean this would be enough of a reason to consider it a minute the foreign you're not allowed to have any minute or do anything to cause someone not to answer a man to heal God all lanais a main even if you don't need the bracha if you hear a bracha there's a tremendous heal to answer me so how could you have a Minogue that puts a woman in a massive well she can't answer them in and he brings many proofs to answer number one is the Russian of the rush does anyone know who wrote the kitsapisque arush the son of the rush the tour wrote it he says like this and you hear kids learning you don't have to answer I mean now if in general there's never a Kiev to answer I mean why would the kids of pisgara say you don't have to answer a man to kids you don't have to answer me to anybody it must be in general and in this massive and this matzov in otherwise if there was never then the tour should have wrote you know then we don't answer okay what's this pharah says this woman already made so she doesn't need her husband what's the slaughter that she should answer a main to her husband as far as like this maybe if Stephen was saying this before but as far as like this yeah that's a very interesting case if is being quite Saya for everybody over here he has two big shallots he takes the peace he takes a bite out of the piece now he's giving out loud to talk before you eat your peace no no no right you're allowed to grandma says you're allowed to we don't pass in like drama all the aquarium argue that one is everyone else could talk why because whenever you're being from somebody you are tough El and secondary to them and as long as he's good to go you're good to go now we pass now mostly almost yeah but it's not better than if you would be making the bracha yourself and if you would be making the roughly yourself you can't talk before you eat but Ramos says it is better than if you'd be doing it yourself because someone's doing it for you and you are secondary to him you shouldn't grab the collar before he eats the college maybe that's how social so what would be the case because he's the one who's making the problem no but after he is you're hungry okay he grabs the brother he grabs the column before he eats it isn't that a problem everyone else could talk without eating without eating why that luck is not like that okay what I said now look it's not like the Ramon but let's understand the sheets of the Rama the shitarama is like this that once the main person did what he needs to do everyone else is secondary everyone else is subsumed if he's going to go they're good to go everyone else is sort of hanging on to him now why do most argue only because it's not any better than if you would be making the brother yourself and if you'd be making the broccoli yourself you couldn't talk before you ate so now also you can't talk before you eat since ramasha finds and you see from this Rama a very important you saw it and that is the one being might see others is the primary and everyone else is secondary so therefore it says if the mavarik making kids he needs a shakiano then it's not considered extraneous for everybody else why because everyone else is only secondary to them but I don't need it who are you you're a nobody you're just hanging on to the leg of the the one who's being my team from the takana that in kiddish we make the bracha says that you make the brachov and the balabayas is making condition and he might see his wife and his family and he makes um the bracha of leisure vasaka now there are many reasonable hold namely rambam and Rashi that a woman does not make Alicia now ashkenazm do and if I'm not mistaken side of them do not right is that correct right vivavadya has a very big shuva he says you want to send your daughters to Ashkenazi school's fine but why are you having them being corrupted by the ashkenazim and having them making right I think he even says they should make if I'm not mistaken that women should not make um red rose fire them do not make breakfast um right something so a sphardic woman who hears her husband saying and the husbands making but how could she be located with that kiddish her husband is saying a bracha that for her is a half stick well now she's asking us oh she's married to Spazzy she's mad that's funny she's learning Society concept that you said so beautifully before okay so no so what do you see from here now does the gemara say the gemara says clearly you may clean on the kiddish what do you mean but what what about your wife how's your wife supposed to be does the gemara say she shouldn't answer I mean to his does it when it says you should make Glacier basuka and the kid they're safe but your wife shouldn't answer amen and what about the fact that the the clown is that if you haven't left the Suka what if you spend the whole circus in the sukkah you don't keep on making another Leisure vasaka so what if somebody's might see you in in kiddish he's making Alicia the Circa and you don't need Alicia basaka does the gemara say you don't answer I mean to his because I don't need it from here at any time you're being used from someone else you're secondary you're you're subsumed you're hanging on to him whatever he needs is not considered extraneous for you Caesar Masha Feinstein be it be it be it circus despite the fact that the woman already made us nevertheless if she heroes shafiana from her husband she should answer on Main because if the halacha is Amin would be a heftic then rebiakov and then should have spoke out against this minute and abolished it why put someone in a massive where they cannot answer on me sir emotion Ramos Therma said it's a half sick the Hearts 3 says maybe she can't even be able to kill this from her husband Maisha says no she should answer I mean also she should answer uh main look at number nine which is why because since this bracha is part of the cedar akiddish therefore our main is not a half stick okay that's that's what I would normally suggest to follow uh that it's not it's not a hexic but so we started off this year I was teasing you a little bit that there's no other enjoys and that is I want to tell you and in between cheetah of the house he has a very nice cup he says like this and I'll introduce it with the following foreign it's positive there's things to do because you take down medium there's nothing to do there's no doubt I mean him and the key of sukkah is only Medina so what is the answer is it's not Saras it's a day that you're at in other words a day that has no quality other than the Cantu malatha is called serious means the only quality uh the seventh day of pesach matzah is over without the going let's say Mara is over what do you do what is something a PESA it's not serious the only thing you can't do is you can't do Malachi there's something positive that you do but there are no more carbonis so what's your voice it's not your mabikuram anymore it's also at Saras so keep in mind that Bismarck has no Mitzvahs other than NATO beautiful crap really I agree tour of sternbuck but when a woman is making what does she have in mind the shakyan is going on she has a mind that's going on the yomptif but what about the fact besides going on the umptive there are a lot of Mitzvahs that we're doing for the first time matzah um and so forth she's not thinking about that she's just only thinking about the yanta so when her husband says she should have in mind that that was also covering all the Mitzvahs of Lao seder so heroine is not a half sick because she could use the additional of the husband for the added midsize so her answering on Main could also include all the additional Miss voice that her her original Sheffield where there are no Mitzvahs so when she said already covered everything it needs to and her husband is not adding anything then answering a man is a have sex with cesra bosner and in between cheetah on pesach and sukis Amin is not a heptic and on spoos it is absolute so if you want to know what's the one that applies to Swiss that doesn't apply to anywhere else according to reposner a Mane on the shakiranu and then a woman hears from her husband is a half stick by schmutus but not the other but again Reb Maisha holds it's never a hepsic and give you something to think about until the great day of you've just experienced another Torah class brought to you by torahanytime.com