Ten Minute Halacha - Which Date to Observe the First Yahrtzeit (Yom Misah or Yom Kevurah)

day. Someone asked me about when uh someone dies and they're buried on a different day than the day that they died on when do we observe the yard site and particularly when do they observe the first yard site. So the truth is this is really uh three different shilas. Shila number one is just in general how do we how are we convey the yard site is the yard site determined by yameis or is it determined by yakvura? Second part of the question is maybe the first year is different. Maybe uh the first year is different than all the rest of the years. That in the first year maybe it would be determined one way and in the other years another way. And then the third part of the sh is even if the first year is not different maybe if there's enough of a discrepancy between the yam and yakura maybe maybe if it's a larger than normal discrepancy that would uh make the first year different than the other years. So let's start with the first things first. when is the yard site? It's the trust writes in gimmel where he discusses this very issue whether the ya or the yakura determines the yard site and he says it's among the gdim that there are those that assume ya there are those that assume and he says I think it's ya and he says I'll bring you a there's a that tells us that if a person takes that the is going to be that if a person takes a that he's not going to eat like on a day that He has a yard site like on the day that his father died then the doesn't say it says so apparently says you see that it's based on and not on the other hand he says maybe one would bring a from the gar where the garra talks about the kur of yakinu that as didn't want to allow him to be buried in and then bend came and he took and he knocked off as head until as of as head rolled around and the gumar of there says that that was a kum of the nova of Rifka that she was going to be bere beereft of both of her sons on y on the same day now their misa was not on the same day the mis of Jacob was earlier Jacob was slept all the way from Mitim to the marasah and as just died on this day but the misa was not was not the same day so uh but but the kura was on the same day so maybe the fact that the kurra is on the same day means that she feels this sense of mourning and pain and suffering over the loss and not the yamisa which would mean that the yardite which represents a a sense of pain and suffering and loss should really be on the yakura and not the yam misa but then the true says I'm not convinced by that raya at all because what the gumra over there over there says is that the garra says that even though yakovu had died previously in mitzim but still at least the kafuru was on the same day which means that the garra is acknowledging that really really had the nvua been fully misgayim it would have been that they both would have died the same day. It was a partial kum of the nvoa that uh that there was a day of of suffering and loss for Rifka uh on the fact by on the same day uh when she when both sons were buried on the same day. So therefore the discussion says that when in general when determining a yard site we want to determine based on the yisa and not based on the yom. This may relate to why there is a muk to fast on the yard site often points out the mut always was to fast on the yard site came and changed and instead they made a party on the yard site and you know everyone says and but really the mig was to fast on the yard that's so why is there a m to fast on the yard site is very clear what it's about he says that it's a day of suffering it's a day of pain. It's a day of remembering that pain. So whatever day is the more painful day is that and that's what the assumes whichever day Rifka would have identified as the more painful day would be the day to observe the yard site in chuvous marin which is quoted in the bach ina in the end of sim tough days he writes no the minute of fasting on the yard site is as a way of a person to do chuva because on a day that they lost a parent it's a day of bad mazle for them and in order to uh to better their mazle they do chuva and try to achieve the kapara for themselves on that day. The sha quotes this reason in tat in the name of the he quotes from the rama that if an was not there bisha he was only there bishas kav that he should fast on the yom not yamisa and the says that according to this reason that the yums relates to chuva and kapara because that's the day of bad maz it shouldn't matter where you were or weren't on the day of the misa that's the day of the bad mazle that's the day the masle turned that's the day that something terrible happened. Mari mints in chuva's in in in a chuva has quotes the reason of the mari brin but then he gives another reason that yes it's for kapara but not for kapara of the child not for kapara of the living but for the kapara of the mace that that was obviously a day that didn't work out so well for that uh for that mace so dava that and that's part of hari kaparas mishkavo that the child is doing fasting to be a kapara for the mace that would make sense that the yamisa as would be the uh the day of the yard that's bay that one should fast on the yoma not on the yomakura. So that's when everything is normal that the yam misa and the yakura um throughout the rest of uh of of of all your of all one's years when they're going to be observing a yard site. You choose the yam misa to observe the uh the yard site not the yakura. The question is is the first year any different? So there's a chuva in the masa in where he says in the first year they should do it and not be misa and it's only after the first year that you shift to the ya the inim disagrees and he says no no no when says y misa it's always ya it's ya the first year it's ya every subsequent year the quotes the and he says that anyone is between the first year and subsequent years he says except except if it's three or four days apart from each other then we'll distinguish then we'll say that the first year you should follow the yom hakura and and the reason seems to be because the aos certainly goes by yakura so we're afraid if you can observe a yard site and there's still three or four more days of aos people are going to be misal in the aos you don't have to worry about that with a one day discrepancy because mixium culo on the aveos anyway so there aren't any more days of aos after the art site Even if you observe the yard site from the Yamaha Misa and the Yomakura was a was a day later but it's three or four days later better that the first yard site says the be observed based on the and the subsequent yard sites based on the ham like the however many others say like the many many others. So you have this major among the postkin whether to ask him like the shak or the how do we ask him? So we would want to look is see if the mission says anything see if rabisha says anything see if raash says anything they all do and they all say different things. So uh so what does say writes that like the says and not only if it was only a one day discrepancy between that we observe the even if there's a two or three day discrepancy where the aus is going to continue after the uh for for 12 months after the we still are the site will continue after you observe the yard site he says there's not that way that that the first year is going to be different but he only quotes that as the is what he says initially that it should always always always be the ham which which is like the said the when he has the whole about who has preceded forades so he writes you count and even and he's not between the two-day difference three-day difference 4 day he just says it's always the misa so mish seems pretty clear that it's always always the yisa quotes the he quotes the and he writes when it's a one day discrepancy he quotes the you do the Ra Mosha says like the sh that if it's a three-day discrepancy so then the first year you do the and subsequent years you do the ya reash is quoted in page was very delayed responded every other year besides for the But on the first year it's going to be so people not make a mistake about the when the concludes site because generally ends on the yard site certainly goes based on if it's a one day discrepancy then you stick with because that's not going to be because it's the last and it's the last day of the so seems to say two day discrepancy or more then you follow the yom on the first year and not the yisa I did not have a chance to ask to see what they what they hold if anyone knows anyone know what will hold about this no okay so we got to ask them but again to make a long story short The TA says that it's always always always yisa like the Rama says. The uh the the shak says that it uh that it depends if it's one day discrepancy that it's ya. If it's more than a one day discrepancy then it's a ya kura. And uh while the pas like the taz ravosha and ravel pascin like the shak. Okay, everyone have a wonderful