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Kashrus Conundrums & Myths -Ben Yomo Episode #6
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Ki Heim Chayeinu has teamed up with STAR-K to produce a series of videos exploring the practical halachos derived from the sugya of Hagalas Keilim, discussed in Pesachim, Daf Lamed.
Categories:Torah/Halacha
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Transcript
Auto-generated transcript. Not time-synced to the video.
[Music]
in this episode of enyoma we're going to
talk about castro's conundrums and myths
all those things that you've asked
you've wanted to ask or you've been
scared to ask
in today's world the average kosher
kitchen has two point three seven ovens
milkhikes flagships para pesos upstairs
downstairs
next door and we automatically assume
that you need to have a separate oven
for
every different kinds of baking the
truth is is that it's not so simple in
fact
many years ago more than one oven in the
kitchen was extremely rare
how do we manage the use of one oven in
a kosher kitchen
the oven that has to be designated for
either milks or flakes so
the way that we had to do it was to make
sure that the oven is clean
make a single designation of either milk
or meat that could be done
uncovered and the other designation and
then when you go to go ahead and to cook
the
milks if you had a if your oven was
considered to be designated flashes
it has to be clean anything was cooked
dry
can be left uncovered anything that had
a milk
sauce had to be covered
[Music]
lately people have stoned countertops
granite or marble everybody wants to
know can i stop covering my countertop
for pesach can i just casher it and of
course you can cash your countertop
we discussed that in another beniomo
episode people want to make it a little
bit easier for themselves they don't
like the idea of pouring boiling water
it gets on the floor it gets in your
drawers let me just use a steamer
so we decided that we're going to buy a
steamer on amazon and see if it works
it's a quite an expensive steamer it's a
super pro heavy duty steamer
so i'm going to ask everybody tendler
to see if he can cash or something with
it let me just point out that a steamer
is can be very very hot but in order to
cash her we're going to need
ricegum we're going to need boiling
water and we're going to need water
steam is not enough let's take let's
take a look and see if this will make it
happen
steam is water that becomes a gas after
it gets over boiling temperature of 212
degrees
however it's not water it's a gas and
therefore you can't caution with gas you
need to caution with actual water
so although this machine is a steamer
which means it has super hot water
inside it and is shooting out
liquid or gas at super hot temperatures
that does not necessarily translate into
water
actually touching the countertop all
right so let's see how hot this thing
actually is
okay starting to get hot so in order to
cash you need to have water
and not steam so let's see if there's
any water actually coming out of this
thing although it's coming out hot as
rabbi holland just demonstrated let's
see if it's actually water
water is a liquid liquid that goes up
must come down so let's see if there's
anything coming down as opposed to steam
which will just dissipate into the air
too much water
let's see if it's hot
now steam is super hot and we got
over 300 degrees but that's not enough
to caution it has to be water
so the theory is is that steam
eventually when it cools down will turn
to water
so let's see if we can try this by
shooting
steam on it having it turned to water on
the cold countertop
and then trying to heat up that water
with the steam
even though the steam does condense on
the countertop
but it's at a temperature that's nowhere
near a caution temperature it's not even
the odds the lettuce bowl
so everybody tyler is there any machine
out there that can efficiently capture a
countertop
in a holographically correct way so we
tested dozens of models
of type different types of steering
machines that you know under ten
thousand dollars
obviously there are industrial machines
that can actually shoot boiling water
but those are usually diesel powered
and cost tens of thousands of dollars
range using industrial cleaning systems
so
for home purposes it's not so practical
we did find one machine
that actually will fit the bill in the
sense that it shoots boiling water
boiling water that is at temperatures
that can actually contour a countertop
the tornado vs4 is the only machine that
we found that actually works
let's show you how it operates now is
this an expensive item
this little machine over here cost over
a thousand dollars but it does
accomplish the job
for those of us in the cautious industry
we use this machine hundreds of times a
year
let's give it a shot and see how it
works first let's see if it's hot
that's perfect boiling water this
machine
allows you to mix water into the steam
flow
which makes it possible to cash
according to let's see how this machine
shoots
steam mixed with hot water
and there you have it water could you
show us what catching with the tornado
looks like
sure so this shoots out a jet of water
probably about this long after that
we're it's a very narrow stream
so i do is i hold it on an angle against
the counter and you get about
a wide swath about that much that's
actually me hit by the water every time
i move the nozzle
and that's how you could properly
caution your countertops
with the machine that shoots boiling
water another advantage of a machine
like this is that it makes it very easy
to capture a sink with a direct stream
of boiling hot water
so let's see if this machine suits steam
or water
let's try the other machine
so you're staying at a hotel somewhere
on a business trip
and you come downstairs in the morning
and have a breakfast buffet how do you
figure out what you could have for
breakfast
so let's think about cereal the cereal
looks like kosher cereal but you don't
know where it came from
it could be cheerios or some off-brand
maybe it has a hamster maybe it doesn't
have a hamster
bottom line you need to go back and look
the same would go for bagels
they'll have bagels there that may not
have come into any contact with
non-kosher and
very likely might be kosher you need to
go in the back and take a look and see
if there's a hacksaw
i've never had a problem generally hotel
staff is very accommodating
they'll show you their cut fruit they'll
show you the cereals
they'll show you the baked goods and
very often you'll be able to have
quite a nice breakfast in the non-kosher
hotel i
cannot tell you how many times we've got
the question in the star k
they have a waffle iron there that's
brought by a company
that is dedicated to waffles and they
have a waffle batter
that comes from a kosher company can i
use that waffle iron the answer is
no unfortunately you cannot use the
waffle iron is is that caleb that are
used for hot could potentially have been
used for things that are not kosher and
therefore the aloha is that stamp
calendar and roshus
that are used for hot may not be used
unless you know for a fact that they are
100 kosher
which is impossible to know in any hotel
and therefore a waffle iron or an
oatmeal machine or an oatmeal cooker
in a hotel may not be used i'll add on
top of that is that anyone who lived in
a bahrain dealer in arizona
knows for certain all kinds of items
that you can cook with waffle irons that
are not just waffles so therefore
i would beware in a cold environment
we're not worried about
cross-contamination unless there was
physical
contact so as long as you see things
that are separated and they're not dirty
and they haven't come to
contact with the other foods there if
you could go in the back and confirm
that they're crushed
you could eat them you're going to hotel
breakfast bar and they have cut up fruit
there many times
an industry secret is that that fruit is
actually not cut up in the hotel that
comes pre-cut
from an industrial facility and
industrial facilities that produce cut
up fruit
all they do is fruit and nothing else
and there's almost no cautious concerns
with such items
if they're saying i don't know there's
no say in the oven
it's a it's it's a fact
either there is or there isn't it's not
up that's
him if there's uh it was in heaven now
today
we have ovens with a window in the oven
so when you bake in the oven you see the
window gets steamed up
so you see there's air in the oven
but i say that it's uh
it's a right the opposite way from that
window that's themed up you see that
there is
no there in oven
how is that because
why does the the the reason to think
there's no there in an oven is because
the water vapor
will only condense on a
on a cold surface and so there's water
vape in the air all the time
so when it gets cold it rains because
it condenses in the on the coal on the
coal there
so in the oven the coldest place in an
oven is by the window because in the
rest of the oven there's insulation
between the two walls of the oven which
keeps
all the heat in but by the window
there's no
there's two panes there's a paint on the
inside there on the outside
but there's no insulation in between for
some reason or another
so you should be able to see in and
that's why
there's steam there you see because it's
the coldest place
but in the rest of the oven there's no
there's no steam
there's no and if you open up the oven
and you try to because it's too hot for
any steam to attach itself so
if you cook in the oven there probably
is steam the chocolate
has usually done where you're baking in
an oven didn't usually cook in an oven
you know you could cook but they didn't
i think they're mostly baked when you
bake even though
that there's water vapor that get that
that is coming off the baked item
but the ovens had a chimney and the
chimney was open so the air
had to flow through every oven if you
don't have air flowing through it
it'll burn everything will burn so
that's the whole concept
making an oven to the air flow should be
even
that one part shouldn't get more hot
than the other that's why so many people
are not much clearer from pesach when
they have these inserts
that to get a good baked product over
there because
depending on the oven it's not that one
insert can work for every
for every other so ovens
they used to have a chimney
in the back of the in the back of the
of the range they used to be a place
where the hot air used to come out from
the oven
they later changed that
and they made the hot air come out of a
back
burner from through back this is in a
gas oven through a back burner so the
heat goes through the oven comes out to
a back burner
and that was a big shiloh over there
because if you you um
you will have flashings in the oven
cooking
is in the oven and then you had a milky
pot sitting
on the back burner cold
sitting there no fires on
but the the heat of the of the oven
first of all all the water from the from
the
uh from from this meat that was coming
off from the cooking of the meat
uh condensed on this pot and
it got really hot from all the heat
going through the oven
so we made a big shower on this part
whether you could use it anymore for
for milks anyway all for fresh
so the um today
a lot they have a new thing that the
heat of the oven and a lot of ovens
comes out through the top of the door
you see on the top of the door like 10
or 12 holes with
some they very often have
some netting in that hole and that's
where the hot air comes out you have to
have a place
for hot air to flow through otherwise
it's not going to work
you