The Truth About Jewish Motherhood No One Talks About

Our first caller is on the line. Adena, are you with us? >> Yes. >> Hi. >> Hello. >> Thank you for calling in. I always am grateful that people choose to to do this and it and it generally benefits a lot of people. >> Thank you for that opportunity. >> Well, okay. All right. So, we're both thankful to each other that we're here and I'm sure the listeners are all thankful. And what are we talking about tonight? >> Um, neurode divergence for a change. >> For a change. Okay. You're joking because you're you're saying I' I've been talking about that a lot lately, right? >> Well, I guess we both have. >> Okay. All right. So, why is it coming up so often? >> And myself. >> Yes. Well, it's coming up a lot because as a neurode divergent um mother with um at least one neurode divergent children um it it comes up because it's related to everything. >> Yeah. Um it comes out in everything and presents challenges that I mean of course the gifts as well but it presents also the challenges that are mostly unseen to the outside world or to the neurotypical world and um often has me um even though I think I've come a long way but has me kind of questioning you know how much of this can I handle? That's interesting. Were you listening before you uh before I picked up your call? >> No. >> Somebody was asking me about how come different people have different degrees of challenges in life. And I and I said, you know, we believe that the camel is loaded according to its strength and the the donkey is loaded accord gets a burden according to its capacity and that everybody is given what they can handle. And then I mentioned as an aside, I said, you know, somebody once told me, God will never give you anything he doesn't think you can't handle, but I wish he would stop thinking so highly of me. >> Right. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So God's been thinking highly of you lately. >> Yeah. >> I don't know. >> I mean, apparently if you've been given greater challenges, then that's a recognition that you were given a greater capacity. I mean, that's a fundamental belief. >> Yeah. I think for the my I feel like my my question is really seeing myself as being the one of the bigger challenges the way that I operate and the way that I think about things and the way that I and sort of process information differently. >> Yes. >> Um as being a you know sometimes feeling like my my own biggest obstacle. Yeah. >> Well, you know, that's interesting. Basically, what you're saying is, >> look, there are different types of challenges in life. Like some challenges are you objectively have a problem. There's this issue in your life that's outside of you and you have to either, you know, get around it or or go through it or get away from it. But what you're saying is your problem is not something outside of you. It is not and not only is it inside of you, it is you. It's like it's a part of you. Uh maybe it's not even a part of you because like to say it's a part of you implies like you could like section it off and put it somewhere like it is you. It is Yeah. It is who you are. It's your wiring. >> And when you know the problem is in a particular area when you could point at it and say that's the problem. So then you could also say okay so like don't go there right? But when you're saying, "No, my problem is the way that my brain is wired." >> There's an expression where wherever you go, there you are. >> Right. So the the problem is is everywhere you go. >> Yeah. >> And you get no rest from >> I think. Right. And I think also um maybe on a more specific level because I didn't really articulate this, but as a Jewish female, I feel like there are certain expectations um as far as you know, I guess executive functioning and >> yeah, >> skills that we are assumed to have that are things that these are just areas that I feel like I always fall short in even though I know that this is how I was, you know, this is sort of it's like me by design. So I I know that I have strengths in other areas and I can connect to my kids in in in very I think interesting ways. Um, so I'm not downplaying that. It's just more like practically, you know, especially with like like with each kid that I've had. Thank god it's like more stuff to juggle. >> Yeah. >> Um, so I'm wondering kind of what is Rabbi Tub's >> Okay. thought on that >> just to fill everybody in because I just want to translate it a little bit for you. >> When you're talking about the expectations of a Jewish woman, talking about being a balabosta, you're talking about being able to somehow >> um make shabas every It's Thursday night, by the way. And uh you know, prepare shabas meals. No stress. It's okay. Don't worry. prepare Shabas meals and to have your kids dressed nice and cute with matchy outfits for Shabas and to have guests and to have family come for Pes and and and to stay over and to entertain. >> You're getting stressed. I hear I hear it. I feel the stress just talking about it. >> Yeah, just breathe. Just breathe. It's okay. It's not really happening. I'm just talking about it. >> Okay. So, let let's talk. I am having guests for Chabus and I do >> for you. >> I just >> All right. >> Yeah. But it's it's not what it looks like in someone else's house. I know this is not this is not okay to talk like that. >> No, it is okay. >> It's just not. I'm >> Why is it not okay? >> It's just not It's not the way. >> No, we're we're going to do Can you do something with me tonight? Can we start something? >> Can we do something that will be a boon for the mental health of Jewish women? Oh, >> we are going. Yeah. >> Okay. We're going to break We're going to start to break a stigma >> because >> Yeah, we are. We're going to start to break that stigma because feeling the pressure to live up to a very particular image of what being a barabusta looks like is choking people to death. We're going to break that stigma and we're going to say it is okay to talk the way you're talking. It is okay to feel the way you're feeling. It is okay for your home to look however it looks and you're doing your best and as long as your children feel loved. Do your ch Do your children feel loved? >> I think so. >> Okay. That's huge. That's everything. That's everything. Got it. >> That's everything. That's everything. >> Well, yeah, but I can't focus on both. So, I just do one. >> Okay. And when you have to pick one or the other, which one do you pick? >> I know. Well, that's why I'm doing it. make the hearts of palm avocado salad uh with the with the or do you you know play with your kid? >> No, I just I I I play with them. >> Good. That's the right choice. >> That's the right choice. And you go >> thanks to Rabbi Tab. >> You're giving me credit. Why do I get credit? >> Oh, because because that Thanks to Rabbi Ta. I know. No, I know. I know that that's what I'm supposed to be doing. You go to the grocery store and you go get yourself some hummus >> and some Spanish eggplant and uh some herring >> and uh yeah, that's it. Everything's fine. >> But the guilt that comes with I did I bought takeout. It's I'm so guilty this week. >> Take out >> and I usually don't. It's so not okay. >> It is okay. It's 100% okay. Where does it say in Where does it say in the code of Jewish law? You're supposed to honor Shabas. You are honoring Shabas. You You eat some You eat something nicer than you would normally eat, something different than you normally eat. Where does it say you have to slave away and and make yourself uh exhausted and not take care of your kids? >> I don't know. >> Where does it say that? These are all cultural things. Let's talk. Okay, this is inside baseball. I don't know. I don't know who my audience is. Like a lot of people listening are not necessarily Jewish, let alone like part of this Orthodox community, but I I'm gonna go on a soap box for a minute and unless you're part of the Orthodox Jewish community, you probably won't relate to this, but there are a lot of standards that people feel intense pressure to live up to. And those standards have nothing to do with Torah. They're not even, forget about being hala, they're not even minhug. They're literally just cultural things that have zero value in terms of to seams. I know I'm speaking very yeshivish, very inside baseball. Anybody who's not part of this community is completely lost. But you know what? If this saves one uh one Jewish mother from feeling like a failure because she doesn't have the uh broccoli salad with the cashews and the purple onions in it, you know that salad, right? If you don't have that, you're a failure, right? I'm glad at least somebody's laughing. Okay? You are a good Jew. I want to tell you something. God loves you even if you don't have the uh what the the sushi salad, the five layer sushi salad. Hashem still loves you even if you don't have uh so what what are all the other showoffy uh salads? What >> carrot chips? >> Pistachio salmon. You don't have to have pistachio salmon to be loved by Hashem. You know what I'm talking about. The whole the whole side of the salmon is like covered in pistachio crunchy crust. You don't need that. Hashem will still love you. You don't What else? So, give me some more ideas. Open up one of these uh like cookbooks, one of these from cookbooks, and just start whipping out recipes. What else? So, what? Give me another one. You have another You're trying to think ramen noodle salad. Oh, spinach. You don't, Hashem will still love you if you don't have a baby spinach salad with crunched up ramens and soy sauce and honey. And Hashem will still love you. Even if you don't have that, Hashem will love you if you take a bag of Bodic lettuce and pour it in a bowl and squirt some Thousand Island on top and Hashem will still love you. I what I'm enjoying right now is that you're cracking up because literally no one else listening is enjoying there's like what is he talking this is the most this is bizarre I'm not following this whatsoever but you know what if one person and in this case I know who the one person is it's you so that's it I'm glad you're enjoying but can you think about how ridiculous that is that like the pressure to create these really really like highly culturally specific dishes. Like, by the way, I I could just illustrate to you how specific this stuff is. Your grandmother never heard of these salads. I don't know if she was neurody diver or not neurody diver. Did she ever hear of these salads? They never heard of this. They never heard of it. Like the the the the pressure to conform to these really super specific cultural standards. This was the these these are completely fabricated madeup things. So listen, I can't help you that like being in school was probably torture for you because that's what school is. School is, >> you know, don't be never be resentful at school because school is an institution. What did you expect? You expected more from school. So if you tell me that school was absolute torture for you, I get it because that's a whole thing. It's designed to be torture, but you're an adult. You can do whatever you want. I want to tell you something. I'm I'm 100% serious right now. If tomorrow, if your husband's cool with it, tomorrow night you want to eat cereal, you want to eat Fruity Pebbles at your Shabas table, it's 100% fine. Okay. Now just to make sure that you don't think I'm I'm I'm like not religious or something you you make kesh okay and your that means you have to actually have a meal that means you have to wash you have to wash you have to haveishna is a real thing some people even say it's aa so I'm not joking around with things that are real yeah okay you're gonna wash and you have okay no it doesn't have to be sourdough bread with the with the whole granola thing smeared to the side it can just be regular You'll be a box of manachese matzas and then you want to go serve fruity pebbles. You can serve fruit. Oh, fish and flesh. Okay, that's if that's shabas for you. It's only shabas then you could do it. But you want to serve everyone's going to eat Fruity Pebbles. Be my guest. I think that you should actually, you know what I I think you should do, not that you should be on social media or anything, but I think if you are already on social media, I think you should um take a picture right before candle lighting, obviously before candle lighting, you can't take a picture after candle lighting of your Shabas table with milk and fruity pebbles and post it on Instagram and say like This is my and just do it just to break the stigma to shatter that those those superimposed artificial expectations that have nothing to do with anything that matters. How you like that? >> Well, I'm just imagining my mother-in-law's reaction. Okay, let's talk about it. Your mother-in-law doesn't have a sense of humor. >> Um, >> not about those things >> for that. >> Okay. Those things are very serious. >> I'm not Yeah, I'm not so sure. >> Okay. So, she takes those things very seriously. >> Yeah. Also, >> you can you can respect that about her. Like if she's a real balusta, you can compliment her and say, "Yeah, >> you're amazing. Like what you do, you're so it's it's so amazing." Like, and you can it's okay to genuinely be impressed with and admire people for qualities that that you don't yourself value having yourself. Everyone can be different. So, I do I do and I think I'm pretty expressive about it, but there's a lot of there's a lot of um a lot of sophisticated um the sophisticated shabas tables in the family. >> Yeah. >> Um and maybe that's where some of the >> You said sophisticated shabas table. >> Yeah. You're saying like the level >> sophisticated menus, the menus and the presentations and the it's like maybe on the, you know, more extreme side of higher than average level of culinary focus and culinary impressiveness >> like chuderi boards. >> Um, >> no, not that not that type. Just really involve >> intricate >> recipes with presentation and hard work. Handmade strudel. >> Steps. Just lots and lots. >> All I see is steps. >> Yeah. >> I just They make me think of steps. >> Yeah. >> Right. And that makes your brain melt. >> I'm just confused. I just can't I can't wrap my head around how anybody follows Adam. >> Yeah. >> What do you do that's special? like what do you do as specifically as as a Jewish mother that you know is special meaning it's not common like what do you bring I don't want to say bring I don't want to say bring to the table because I want to get away from the table no shabas or anything like tell me about your special qualities that you excel in as far as just anything that you do in your home for your family that that you're proud of, that you think you do well, and that you know not everybody does. Um um probably the probably like the the I mean I try I try really hard to put a lot of time and effort into you know my relationship with my kids. >> Tell me about that. Um, I think I'm very deliberate about, you know, >> your interactions with them. >> Yeah. Just like interactions and and really trying to trying to do it um trying to break some pretty bad cycles. >> Yeah. Um and um >> so so you're saying you're you're very careful about how you interact with your children. >> You're watching yourself. >> Like I really I'm put a lot of I put a lot of energy into like >> Yeah. >> Um regulating like self-regulation and um just trying to like like I I take it, you know, I take like the job pretty seriously. So, >> so you're talking about >> I feel like >> you're you're on top of your game or you try to be on top of your game as far as like not only avoiding the negative stuff like snapping at your kids or whatever, taking out your stress on them, but even trying to focus on the positive stuff like having um connecting with them in a way that that makes them feel cared for and shows them that you understand >> like trying to spend a lot one-on-one time. >> Yeah. >> As much as I can, obviously. Um, and paying attention to the things that are important to them and trying to remember the little things that they told me and trying to um, >> yeah, >> you know, if they really like something to remember to they really want a certain things, you know, to eat a certain thing on Chabas, either to make that the thing that I prioritize making or um, you know, if it's like a candy or something to try to pick it up before, you know, all that type of thing. >> So, in other words, not to just make a dish that's fancy and impressive, but to go out of your way to get the dish that will be meaningful to a particular member of your family. >> Um, yeah. I mean, I try. >> You try. Okay. By the way, somebody's writing in the chat, and I want to push back very hard. Someone wrote in the chat, "The challenge is when you value tradition so much, and it's hard to let go." Were you listening to anything I said? I said, "This is not tradition. This has nothing to do with tradition. These dishes were all made up 10 years ago. Your Bubby never heard of these things. Why is this guy telling me tradition? Go talk to your fiddler on the roof with your tradition. I don't want to hear about it." All right. Someone wrote in the chat, by the way. Uh, sounds like you're a wonderful mother. I agree. I concur. >> Oh, >> yes. I mean, some internet stranger. You have no idea. This could be some creep, by the way. Don't get too flattered, but okay. But I say you're a wonderful mother and I I think I'm a normal person. So I think my compliment should mean something. Okay. All right. No, but really, I mean, let's be serious. What you're talking about here what you're and I'm taking your words at face value and and it has a ring of truth to it. I It doesn't sound like you're you're making this up. It sounds like something that really you have put a lot of effort into. Listen, I pick things up, okay? I I I don't know you, but I can pick some stuff up here. Okay. You have made you made a decision. I don't know if it was like there was a turning point in your life where you made this decision or it was a gradual thing, but you made a commitment. Your children are going to be raised with a certain amount of love and security and safety, emotional safety, and and you've been living up to that commitment that you made to yourself. And I want to tell you, any parent who actually takes parenting seriously would consider that incredibly successful and and and would have a great deal of admiration for you. So, you know, I really think that you need to give yourself permission to stop worrying about all of the um artificially constructed social pressure and continue to focus your energy where you've chosen to put it, which I think is the best investment, the best possible area in which you can invest your energy is in forging a meaningful bond with your children. And not only should you give yourself like an exemption and forgive yourself and say you're okay, but I think yes, it would be actually appropriate for you to be proud of yourself and to say, you know what, I'm a great mom. I could be better. I could be even better. Could always grow. We could always be even better. But I'm a great mom. I'm not I'm not second best. I'm not I'm not some type of uh Nabak. I'm I'm actually very proud of myself and and and if you can't do it for yourself, do it because by divine providence you are on a public forum and people are listening and I don't know how old you are, but for the 25year-old girl who is just starting to realize what she got herself into and is feeling over her head and overwhelmmed mom and she hears you say with sincerity, you know what? I I ordered takeout for Shabas, but you know what? My kids feel loved and I'm a great mom. And you can say that with sincerity, even if you can't do it for yourself, but say it for that young woman who may be listening >> right now. >> Well, yeah, because people are listening. I mean, if you say it after you hang up, then won't really have the same effect. I mean, you don't have to say it if it's like forced. If you're not feeling it, you don't have to say it. >> Um, I think I need to sit with it. >> Okay, fair enough. I hope that you will take it seriously that that's something you know we do need to break a stigma. It's a not a joke. This this pressure is causing a lot of unwarranted grief, a lot of unnecessary grief. And if we can push back against it as a as a society, as a community, it'll make life a lot better for our kids. You're already a cycle breaker. >> You know, you're a cycle breaker already, right? I know that. So, I want to give you a promotion that not only should you be a family cycle breaker, but you could be a cycle breaker on an even larger scale, on a community scale. You can start to show yourself as a model for others of what a a loving, devoted Jewish wife and mother looks like. Wait, what? So, I have to say it on air. >> No, no, no, no. I'm going to make it even harder for you. You don't have You said you have to sit with it. You're not ready to say it on the air right now. What? But what you do, what you should do in my humble opinion is start to be a little bit um well start to consider yourself as a as a as a role model. I don't mean that you have to go take out a billboard and advertise how you live, but I mean if by divine providence there are people that you cross paths with, talking about other women and you can set an example for them that would be liberating for them. I think you should feel a duty to do that. In other words, instead of bemoning the pressures that exist, fight back against those pressures for the sake of other women. >> You know, how do you do that with relatives though? >> That's a delicate issue >> when everybody's everyone in study Crocker, everyone. I mean, I don't want to I'm very hesitant to get into this, you know, a live call on the air, but I mean, is your husband okay with the fact that you're not Betty Crocker? >> Yeah. >> So, that's all that matters. Betty Crocker. >> Yeah, Betty Crocker. Guess is Betty Crocker a real person? Hey, so this is an excerpt from the Thursday night live call-in show where people call me up with their real life issues and we try to work it out together. If you want to watch the full episode of the full call-in show with all of the spontaneous stuff, uh, click here, right here.