Snapshots: Avraham & Family | Rabbi Shmuel Goldin | November 4th

Thank you very much. Okay. Uh we're going to a bit of a change of pace today and I'm going to put you guys to work. What we're going to do is generally we take one particular issue or theme and trace it through the text. This time what we're going to do is what I call snapshots. We're going to take specific points in the career of Abraham and his family and we're going to try to understand those snapshots. It's sort of short brief dra to on particular moments in Abraham's life and we're going to take those moments from the last para and from the coming para particularly from Vera right so let's start let's take a look at the first text before us and this is the text that begins a career God says to Abraham, "Go from your land, from your birthplace, from the home of your father to the home to the land that I will show you." And then the Torah continues in When you take a look at those two texts, what questions immediately arise in your mind? Like I said, I'm putting you to work. Yes. >> Why does it repeat that he left? That's not a repetition. He's commanded to go and then he goes. So that's not a repetition necessarily. >> First time around it says lot and then at the next say >> okay excellent. Why does it describe lotus veniv in the in the second time in the all right actually no no it only says it in the second time because that's when he goes. It doesn't mention load because load is not commanded to go in the first section. The first section God says to and he doesn't mention anything about los it says in that Abraham decides to take load. It doesn't say that God commands to take load. Take a look at Puk Olive. Doesn't mention it there. >> Yeah. >> Oh, Kimmel is not there. All right. [laughter] All right. What is it saying? Pu Kimmel. Remind me. I don't have the text in front of me. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Okay. So it in the in that sentence it's describe it's describing them leaving and therefore it includes load because they're leaving. But here it indicates that it is Abraham's idea to take load. And why is it Abraham's idea to take load? Because it's lo in other words giving you the therefore and we'll see that that's important later. Yes. Right. That when they left they already knew. >> Okay. Good question. Here we go. What? And not that that wasn't a good question. That was a good question, too. All right. [laughter] All right. But how do they know that they're supposed to go to Ka? What does Hashem say? I would assume then that Abraham is going somewhere. And then when God gets to Cananan or travels to Cananan, Hashem will say this is the land. How does he know from the start to travel towards Cananan? Now I'm also going to make it diff I'm going to exacerbate the problem or underscore the problem by asking you to take a look at the next text which happens before Aram is told to leave. Veram's father. So what do we see happening in that text? Before Abraham leaves, before God says to Abraham leave, what does Terak do? He goes on a journey and where is he going? >> To Cananan, right? But what happens is he gets to and he stops. So what what might be emerging from this text on one level is that Abraham is really completing the journey what that his father began. But where's where's the >> No, it doesn't. It says, >> but the first >> first it doesn't say can >> That's right. No, correct. Correct. But what I'm saying is what I'm saying is that one reason that perhaps Abraham knew to travel to Cananan was because his father was already doing that. Why was >> ah and why was his father going to Cananan? Excellent question. We don't know. There are those who say that Cananan had a reputation of being a land where spiritual growth could occur and therefore Aram says to himself, "My father was looking for this. I'm looking for this. I suppose that's where God wants me to go." But he it's not clear. One thing that becomes clear is that finishing the journey is very important and Terra leaves his life with an unfinished journey. And for those of us who live here, we are finishing the journey. For those of us who still have to come, you you haven't finished yet. and and the difference between a tra and an aim is that aim completes the journey. All right, that that emerges from the text. Now why terra is going toan is not clear. As I said there are various interpretations. There are those who say that cananan had this reputation of being a place where you would and kak therefore emerges according to that explanation. Not the way we saw him in in in our childhood where we he was an idol worshipper and a destroys the idols etc etc. Terra emerges as someone who may have been searching for a spiritual growth as well according to the text >> because had just died. His other son had already died. He didn't take him. He took Lo the son of Orurin. Right. >> So after the whole >> the Okay then. Right. Why did Haron die? That's Medish. Correct. Medish says that Haron died because he was thrown into the furnace because Right. But >> could be. Could be. That's another explanation. But the text doesn't say that, right? Yes. >> The ter has already described as an idol worship in the footage itself. It's not just mid >> the uh >> uh in the what? Oh, later on later on. Yes. Not not not when the text first introduces him. So we don't know. Maybe after he went to Karan he became an Irish worshipper. Maybe in the beginning he was searching and going to Kanan. We don't know. Right. It mentions yes that that terra was but that's in retrospect. Yes. If that Abraham knew that he just read that he they were on their way to why does say >> okay good question the answer would be if if the question did everyone hear it if if Abraham knew to travel to Cananan in the first place because his father was traveling there why does God say lash echo and the answer seems to be that Hashem is not telling him that Terra's goal was is his goal. He wants him to understand it himself from the journey that began. But he's going to but he's saying to him, I'm going to I'm going to tell you when you get there. And there are those also who say, why doesn't he say it outright? Why doesn't he say go to Eritz Cananan? And they answered to give Abraham greater reward for being willing to travel to the land that God will show as opposed to being traveling to Cananan. How does he know it's Cananan? I'm supposing from the text because that's where his father was going, but it's not necessarily so. It may be because other of other reasons, but clearly Abraham into it without God telling him where am I supposed to go? supposed to go to Kanan. That's where that's where we're going. Okay. Yes. Uh now we'll take questions very quickly because we got a lot to do. Uh I'll save them for the end. Okay. Jot them down, please, and save them for the end because some people actually complain to me that I'm taking too many questions. So I won't do that. All right. Next. All right. So that now one other thing we see from this text which is very interesting. Look at Hashem's commandment to Abraham. What's strange about that? >> It's it's backwards, right? Right. First you leave, right? First you leave the home of your father, then you leave your birth. First you leave your birthplace, then the home of your father, then your land. Right. That's how you're going. Why does God command it in the reverse? Because it's not a physical journey. That's the most important thing here. Most important thing here is the philosophical journey. And when you are leaving philosophically, when you are leaving spiritually, it's easier to leave your land, it's harder to leave your birthplace and it's even hardest to leave the home of your father. Baraku is saying that in ascending order recognizing and teaching us that this isn't just a journey to Israel as much as that is appropriate but it is a journey that Aram is spiritually and philosophically taking. And we said by the way that there's a two there's a really a two-pronged message here which doesn't emerge from the text but kazal say it and and they actually does emerge from the text. I think I'll tell you why. We said if you'll remember when we spoke about Aram's journey we said that the commandment of was two proud. It is number one to be apart from and number two to be a part of. Number one to be apart from the land you you born in your home of your father etc etc but be a part of where you're going. make a difference because I'll say that it's like a small cruise of oil or perfume that's in the corner of a room, right? Which doesn't do anybody any good, but if you take it and you move it around, then everyone will benefit. Was saying to Abraham, travel in the world, make a difference. And I believe that's hinted to when in not in the text before you but in the other which say when it says that you all the nations be involved and if you'll remember just um I'm summarizing something we spent a lot of time on that there is a beautiful circle to Aram's journey if this is correct. Aram is told to be apart from and apart of and when you get to paras how does he describe himself vtov I'm a straight so by the time you get to that moment and we said it may have been because of the ao in vro the rashbam's explanation that that that the aedo in this week's para was a step too far he was willing to endanger his child the rashbam said I'm going to teach you what it would mean to lose that child the a that's one level of the a by the time to get he's only concerned and dealing with his family and and his selfdefin is very important I am a gto they try to suck him in he resists and that's why we're here today very important [laughter] a conflict taking place beneath the surface of the beginning of parasuro in the aftermath of the Okay, let's go down to the next next section. Okay, now the next section is no sooner does Aram get to the land of Cananan than what happens? Anybody know? >> Very often there's a famine. You he gets to the land. God says to him apparently, "This is the land I want you to go to." And no sooner does he get there than there's a famine. And what happens? What does he do? >> He leaves. He goes down to Mitraim. And in Mitraim, he endangers his wife Sora by by saying, "You're my sister or protecting himself." It would seem if you look at the text that So there are very serious questions about what's happening here. The first question is, was he right to leave? >> No. >> All right. So interesting. We can take a vote. >> What? Huh? >> He didn't have permission. >> He didn't have permission to leave. So you shouldn't have left. Okay. Others will say what? >> Right. God promised him those things, right? God promised him that he would have uh he would have material, but you're allowed to leave. You're saying you're allowed to leave for and for Okay. But that again, that's which we learn much later. Ara doesn't Aram's [snorts] making his decisions based upon what he feels he needs to do. All right. So do you what do you do? Do you stay in Israel and rely oneshu to take care of you or do you leave? So the answer is it's a mlo right and and it's a math locus because it's a different because why? Because the truth is that we will encounter events like this where both pathways are potentially right and we will have to decide between the two. So first take a look at the Ramban. The Ramban's fascinating because the Ramban says the section that I told you on page two that I copied for you. Look what the Ramban says. All right. He sinned a great sin. Now, what's bishko? What's shogi? >> All right. Not quite. Not quite. By mistake, but >> in >> he inadvertently he should have known better. What do I mean by that? There is a spectrum of guilt when it comes to Jewish law. The top of the spectrum is mazed. What's the bottom of the spectrum? Oness. Oness is totally by mistake, totally an error. I couldn't have done better. Show gig is you shouldn't you could have you could have been more careful. Show is you you you know you you should have onus is you check your brakes and the vase tells you they're fine and then they fail and you hit somebody, god forbid. That's onus. I I show gig is I should have checked my brakes, right? I didn't check my brakes for the last few years. Maybe I should check my brakes. It's I'm not mazy. I'm not doing it on purpose, but it's shake. So, the Ramban is saying he's bish he should have known better. And not only does he say that, but keep going. He says, etc., etc. And then he says, where is it? there at the bottom etc. is is going to be played out generations later and also says the Ramban it was a sin for him to tell Sora say you're my wife now my sister he says the Ramban says that was also a sin now it's amazing when you think about it isn't it we're talking about Abraham au and yet what the Ramban is telling us which I believe is a very very important message that will keep repeating and that is the heroes of the Bible were people. They were not gods. They were not angels. And potentially they may at times have made missteps may hard for us to say it. Ramban says it so I feel more comfortable. But uh the very fact that we could potentially admit fault in our heroes is a very important point. Why? Because if your heroes are gods, you cannot be like them. You can be you could try to say the attributes of Hashem, but I can't really be. But if our heroes are people facing real issues, then we can aspire to be like them. In other words, isn't >> why didn't Gitzk repeat the why didn't he learn from >> Why didn't he learn? Good question. We're not up to that yet. All right, good question. Why didn't Yitzk repeats? If you look at his life, he repeats a lot of things. But what the story if you have your if your heroes are people, you can have hero emulation. If you're heroes or gods, you can only have hero worship. Really? And look at what happens. Pagans had hero worship. They they made everything a god. The Jews come along and we say our heroes are people. And what did the Christians do? They come along and say our heroes are God. Again, right? In other words, you deify. when you deify your hero then you're you're you're taking away much of the lessons that can emerge now. Okay. So the Ramban says yes >> that's a excellent point. I think the Ramban would agree with you. What you're saying is that Aram's on a learning curve and that his amuna has to be he has to learn more stronger amuna according to the Ramba. Now let's take a look at the swarno. The swarno does not really comment on whether it's right or wrong. But the swarno just simply says one thing. Take a look at page number three lost. It says he went down lagore. Remember I told you there are two different ways you could describe someone living in a particular place. Generally it's lagore or lash. Lagore means temporary. Sarno says note the Torah is telling us that this he wasn't planning to stay there. So it's sort of giving you an indication maybe the sarno thinks he may not have been wrong. If you read the next paragraph and I'm not going to go into it in depth. Sarno comes up with a whole explanation of why Avam does what he does visa visor and how it wasn't really that bad. What does he say? He says just as a summary, he says Aram turns to Sar and says if I say you're my sister then they're all going to be vying for your hand. And while they're vying for your hand, I'll get the food. I'll do what I need. and we'll have that that time where they're struggling and then we'll leave. We'll get out, says the Sarna. We we'll get out in time and won't be a problem. What happened was if you look at the text is that when they got there, the the nation saw her and wanted her as Aram said, but then Parro's advisors took a look and they said, "Oh, forget it. None of these guys. She belongs with the king." And that was unexpected to Abraham and therefore it it destroyed his plan. That's the son and he bases it on text basically saying if you look carefully the nation saw and then all of a sudden the officers of parro are in the scene and and he says it's really a two-stage event. First the people wanted her and then the officers wanted her. Okay. Now let's go on. Take a look at number number three. Roman numeral number three. No, bars. Now, we looked at this once before. I'm testing your memory. All right. What's strange about that poke? >> What the What does What does it have to do with the Brooklyn Bridge? Right. What does what does the end of the pus have to do with its beginning? In other words, there what's the key of the puzzle? Kusk is telling me that there was a dispute between Lot Shepherds and Aram shepherds and therefore they had to part ways. What is ovaris? What does that have to do with? So I'll teach you medish and this is a perfect example of the difference between medish and chant. Medish is that the se shepherds very famous medish that the shepherds of lot were allowing their cattle to graze on the land belonging to the canananim and the priest. And what were they saying? They were saying this land's going to become ours, right? Because it's going to go to Abraham. Ara doesn't have any kids. It's going to be ours. So, we can we can do what we want now. And along comes the come the shepherds of Araham. And they say, "No, it's not ours yet. We don't have a right to take it yet." And we'll see that in in an even clearer fashion in just a moment. And therefore, what? Therefore, we can't take this. And that caused the riv and that's why it says vakaniar as it belonged to them at this point. But on the other hand, on the other hand there's another explanation and this one is suggested by the Sarno and the Sarno says Pashup Sha there was a dispute between the shepherds and it was made even more dangerous because the Canananim and the prism saw what was happening and they would say to themselves if they can't get along with each other right? >> Then then then they're vulnerable. Then they're vulnerable. Also, if they can't get along with each other, they won't get along with us. Now, when we first learned this and I repeat it, this this particular learning has a very st very powerful resonance to our tone. Right? In other words, what we're saying is that, >> you know, we become weak when we can't get along with each other. And there are clear March Republic, >> right? >> Well, and there are clear reports that the attack on October 7th took place because Kamas thought we were vulnerable because we were we were arguing with each other concerning uh legislative matters. Yes. >> Why was the why were the shepherds not already separate from it implies almost that they've already had some of agreement and their separation got into groups. I I suppose that that you know they were they were traveling together and that he had Araman had his cattle and load had his cattle. Why are they separate? Because they were separate I separate families. I you know I I think probably maybe it's teaching us maybe that that you have when you travel when you have relationships they have to be as we've said before aerdo you have to be a together and apart right and you can't totally submerge one in the other all right next take a look we're going to go now to four next two things statements are are again invo Take a look at Roman numeral number four. Vavo. What's the What's the case here? The case is that Lo is in stone, right? Remember Lo started off outside stone, then in stone, then the gates of stone. We we spoke about that. He's taken captive. He's taken captive. and during the war and Aon hears about this and the Torah tells us the following. Vavo the fugitive came and it's a very strange statement. I'm not going to spend time on it because there are all sorts of different interpretations. What do you mean the the fugitive? You're you're indicating that it's a particular fugitive. Medra says it's oabash earlier but there a fugitive cause and they he tells a vushi he is living in ashes onair is the brother of eshk and onair the ba Allay Brris Abraham and they are uh holders of a covenant with Ara. What strikes you about that? >> So elaborate much >> too much information. Look at the title. What it what what's the purpose of the sentence? Purpose of the sentence is what pallet comes and tells me tells a what's happening to Lo. Why does the text then go on to say why do I know where he's living? Why do I know he's an i? What? And this is by the way the only place where the Torah actually calls him an iy a Hebrew, right? Coming from the word of ours coming from somewhere else. Yes, you have an answer. >> Establish credibility for this rumor for this. >> Okay, good. Good. She's saying that that in order to get people to fight with him, he had to estab he had to establish his own credibility first. That's possible. But I think there's an even more powerful answer. The next puk says hears that what his brother was taken captive. Is this his brother? Load his brother. No, it's not his brother, but it is his brother. Right. And what does he do? He immediately runs to save him. This puk is telling you that he had every reason not to do that. He was not in the fray. He was living in a place and a situation where he was particularly comfortable and he wasn't which means what? I'm not involved in this political dispute here. He had every reason to say lo went his way. Goodbye. He hears his brother is taken captive. That's it. >> What? >> That's right. I'm saying correct. He hears that his brother Aiv is taken captive. That's And again, resonance to our time. Amazing how the country rallied around the the hostages and and and you didn't feel you didn't feel that things were right as long as they were still there and and they've emerged as heroes. I mean, when you hear the stories of their standing strong um actually having a birth of a religious fervor in in the darkness of those tunnels, it's just unbelievable. It's just unbelievable. Yeah. Comment. >> Yeah. Who says that was >> the medish? Yeah. >> 318 1039 103. >> What? Uh 319. >> Yeah. That comes from Yeah. Voric is it's not this puzz and they learn it from from the word somehow with the letters. It's real med. Therefore, they he should he had a peace. >> He had he had or right. He is living he is an iy. He came here. He has no business getting involved. He's living in a secure place with secure friends with allies. What do I what do I have to put myself into that into that trouble? >> The comes from the medish from [snorts] where am I? Yeah, correct. I remember what I'm what I was going to say. It's all right. It says he has all of those people. The medish says he had only Eleazar and that if you take the the the numerical value of Eleazar, it comes out to that. But but Pashupshot Yes. which underscores her suggestion which was that if you take that that in order to get those 318 he had to what? He had to establish his own credibility and that may be what the puss is saying. So that's another explanation. Okay. wasn't not uh an orphan. was kind of adopted as a >> yeah it would seem that lo was was was adopted by Avam but they then parted ways and they parted ways because they couldn't get along right so again a has no reason to get involved next one last one last thing in then we're going to go to vo this this puk I believe is one that nobody pays attention to it's the bottom of the page that I think is is so powerful in its message and unsettling in its message. Hashem is conducting the britar the covenant between the pieces. In other words, he's between the covenant that he's making with and in that covenant during that covenant says to Abram, "Know full well that your children are going to go down to an erit lhem to a strange land. They're going to be they're going to be uh tortured. Things are going to be bad, but they will come out, right?" And then the Torah says, Hashem says, The fourth generation will come back to this land. Aon what is she? >> To fill to fulfill shalom to complete. The aon of the amorim will not be complete until then. What is God saying? They're going to come back when these guys deserve to get kicked out. But before they deserve to get kicked out, you're not going to come in. In other words, what is a kesh is saying [clears throat] all human beings have rights. These people have rights. You can't. So you're going to wait till you're fourth generation of you're not going to be able to come back earlier because they have rights. Wh why why does it say iniquity of the IR? >> What? >> Why does it say the iniquity of the >> Because what it's saying is the ini their their sin will not be complete until then. Iniquity is a sin. >> The Marites, right? >> They can stay in cananan until such time as I they deserve to get kicked out. That's what he's saying. Only the fourth generation will come back because the iniquity the sin of the Amorites will not be complete until then. >> What? >> No. No. Then then the door the door of the E is the he is the Ben Israel. Bene Israel will not be able to enter Erit Israel until the inhabitants who are there deserve to be expelled. That's what the puss is saying. And that's an amazing amazing statement because it underscores how we as Jews believe and should believe and we we sometimes forget this that all human beings have rights. everyone, but how you do what how you use them and what you do with them and and how you claim them and how you fight for them. All sorts of things that that determine who you are. But but do does a kesh relate to all individuals? The answer potentially yes. Let's hold up to the ego. So Yako made a mistake and thought that his children were join. So when he went down, he thought that was it. So where did the dorine really start? >> It's where does the dark he is saying that the bristen absorum is saying that the fourth generation from Abraham >> go on >> will return to Israel. >> Well we don't again again again again if you take a look at the first of all it's two it says 400 years but it's not 400 years it's really 210. 210 is potentially the fourth generation, right? If you [laughter] >> right, in other words, >> the the fourth generation of those who will go down, >> the the fourth generation of those who are enslaved, right? Okay. Next, quick take a look at the next pok. This is the first puk in parro. So I'm now getting to par famous statement, right? God appears to Abraham in the middle of the day. The day is heat goes out and Abram greets guests. Do you have any question about those troops? >> But where did he leave? How famous? >> Okay. Seems seems to leave Hashem. We'll see if that's the case in a minute. What what what is missing? What's missing in the >> What's Hashem doing there? [laughter] When Hashem appears to someone in the Torah, there's generally a message. There's generally a purpose. Why is it say Hashem appears and not tell me why he appears? So there are two interpretations. Two interpretations of what's happening here. One interpretation f focuses back on the last paragraph. One interpretation focuses forward. Let me explain what I mean. The paragraph before this at the end of le is the paragraph describing the briso of Aram's family. The paragraph coming describes the angels who are going to appear right therefore there are those who say what was God doing and this is medashik. I think this is the medish. The next one I think is the pashad. The medish is Hashem was right. Hashem was he was coming on the third day to Abraham's brisma. The rabbis say the third day of an oper to an operation is is usually the hardest. And by the way I I in visiting many people in the hospital I have found that to be the case because before then they're out of it more than the third day and then it really becomes tough. Okay. And therefore And therefore when he says when he says let's uh where are you he says who is he talking to. And the rabbis say, "You learn from here that that is greater than you." A a visit from Barak who fails to reach the level of buri. That's that's that interpretation. >> Say he lifted up his eyes and saw. Where were his eyes before? >> Good question. Good question. Why does it say lifted up his eyes? Why is it why doesn't it just say he saw? All right. >> Right. Okay. So the again it the answer lifting up eyes doesn't necessarily mean your head is down. It means you're looking around you. And so therefore the rabbis will say that he what was happening here he was in the middle of the day and yet he was looking for guests. He was searching and therefore [clears throat] v he saw no he looks up and he sees guests. That's what's happening. >> His eyes were down. >> Yeah. Again, literally literally his eyes are down. But it means he's not looking. He's not he has to he's forcing himself to look. Yes. >> That's correct. Correct. So that why does it say why does excellent question why does it repeat in that vo numerous explanations the one that I would suggest is that it vo to see in this case is not just to see but to comprehend. In other words he sees these guests and what does he see? He sees in their need and then he goes. That's what he does right now. Let's let's go on. The second interpretation is not that Hashem is visiting him and and it's the law. The second interpretation is that this is the introduction to what comes next. Meaning Hashem appeared to him how with the appearance of the Malohim. In other words, Hashem and looks up right sees Malohim. That is the that is the explanation of vayarashem I'm telling you how god appear to him how did god appear to him through the angels that I say is pashad that that I believe is the the straightforward explanation of the text now let's go to this is this is really interesting take a look at the bottom of the page is arguing with akadesh baraku for stone and amora Right? And um he offers a very very passionate arguments. But take a look at what he says. What does he say? Will you destroy the righteous with the wicked? Maybe there are 50 in the city. Will you destroy the place and and not allow [snorts] them to survive because of the Okay. Where's the leap of logic? If Aram was a lawyer, I wouldn't hire him. Where does he take a step? Okay. What's his first statement? Will you destroy what? >> The righteous. What's the logical conclusion of that? >> Save the righteous. Right? Will you destroy the righteous with the wicked? Save the righteous. And then all of a sudden he says, "Don't destroy the righteous with the wicked. Save them all." Where does that come from? Right? So, I'm going to suggest to you, and this is uh I guess we're going to have to stop here. If you take a look at the next page, you find a very interesting paragraph that precedes this argument. Now, you you got me right. In other words, the logical argument is why why destroy the righteous with the wicked? The logical conclusion of that argument is save the righteous. How does he get to save? So, what's happening? Take a look at the next page. The first paragraph, something very, very strange happens. The Torah tells us that is talking to himself. [snorts] Right? By the way, I don't know about you, but I find myself doing that a lot more nowadays. Right? Okay. Is talking to himself. And he says, what does he say? Aer anos could I possibly hide from Ara what I'm about to do I know and then he goes on to say a is going to be a great nation etc etc goets what does that have to do with me telling him about stone why why what's the argument here and why is the Torah telling me that is talking to himself to decide whether or not he's supposed to tell and this is the argument look at the English if you want so I'm suggest want to suggest to you that this paragraph is the introduction to the debate and what it says is that a kadesh made abraham two promises promise number one was you will survive and your children will survive you will you will be a god doll promise Promise number two is what? Promise number two is if you survive and you do what is right, who will you save? Not only you but everyone. So therefore he is operating based upon the promises that a karesh who gave to him which is if I'm righteous I'll survive and if I'm righteous I will not only survive but I will what save others and if that's the case and and this occurred to me a number of years ago then hashem has to tell a what's happening to sad why and that's what this is saying Why? Because if he destroys Suda and Abraham thinks there were 50 sadik in there or 10 whatever that will cause Abraham to doubt what his own his own fate. It will cause Abraham to say well you you killed the righteous. You promised me the righteous would survive. You killed everyone else. You said the righteous would save everyone else. And therefore what what is happening here is not only that is telling him because he wants him to argue for Saddam but it's because it underscores he needs to know the truth about his own that there are no sadikim in Sedon and and that's why they're being destroyed. Okay. So again what we did is we took a look at some very very specific events in the life of Aram and his family. We could do more. Unfortunately, we've run out of time.