Rabbi Shmuel Fox, former Rav of Beth Jacob in Dayton, Oh - Shul Challenges & Success -#2

welcome back for the second part of our interview with Rabbi shmuel Fox uh well for over 60 years in in Dayton Ohio and in our first interview we we spoke about his uh early years he was born in Poland came over at the age of five and uh went to Yeshiva eventually in Chicago and uh then we got a law degree but he chose there are bonus because he loved loved loved that type of work and uh Hashem was all these years and then his son became took over his Pulpit for 18 years and I want to ask you a question that um is probably going to be as we say in English a curveball curveball well that's what people want to hear they want to hear the curveballs was there ever a period in your bonus that you wanted to stop you wanted to give up no never never are you telling me that you had it smooth for 60 plus years and no I wouldn't say I had it smooth but hearing the problems through other rabbis mine were inconsequential and that is because you were in a small City compared to New York and Chicago I don't think so I I don't know because of you because your personality I think so I think because it was friendly I love people and particularly you know right right a people's person yeah you know right so um let me ask you do you what was the hardest issue that you could recall that you had to deal with over the 60 years okay one of them one of them was when our short head the former Reed in Dayton in Dayton Ohio uh when he passed away and the conservative rabbi had had a a guy by there it was a professional yeah and he said they came to me he called me up he took it for granted and I would accept him right and it was this fine person I was friendly with him right but the second he says you know I want him to take over the street to there and I was against it why because it was I felt he was under the rule of the conservative rabbi that the conservative Rabbi would have a lot to say with Scotia what's not Kosher and all that and I wouldn't allow it hmm yeah so that was a very hard yes and I was friendly with the conservative and the conservative rabbit was known who was that actually uh at the moment okay you'll get yeah actually prominent in the conservative Revenue right and then he came to me and he says to me I'll let you uh I'll tell him to come over to you with the sky lips check it test if it's yeah he would round out my members to go against you yes to agree with him wow he says why what are you showing second-class citizenship he said the reason uh I don't acceptance because the member because he's a member of a conservative for sure so he turned that into a first and second class citizenship issue so what did you do huh so how did you deal with it no well I I held fast I said just wouldn't when my members came to me I tried to explain to them it was not I had anything against the Sheikh and all that I said I greetings I think is probably qualified but you know being a part of the conservative synagogue and the conservative movement you know we cannot accept this like that has to be aside from being a talmatography other qualifications foreign [Music] you would qualified so let me write oh boy yeah anyway so they the congregation the Communists accepted it but you had you were working for a board right you you were hired by a board of P of people am I when you were hired there was a board yeah they can hire and fire you that's correct and you were not scared no that's youth right right because some of the members of the board they won over they felt that they don't understand why he can't be the shuttle right they could follow it so then then I had a call here's my rabbi Tomlinson silver I'm a silver I got a big compliment from him he says he heard about what's going on midday he says you deserve a big ass he says it took a lot of strength here to do what you're doing and he says uh we be with you you know it's it's a good thing that you didn't didn't give in yeah in capitulate because otherwise you have trouble from the Orthodox right right uh let me ask you so where did you actually I forgot to ask you for where did you get Smita star uh high in crisis he would call me to go out let's say socially he was a young man when he when he came he was from wasn't he didn't he learned I don't know and I'm sure he really okay I think he did okay you know she would imagine the bleach yeah yeah right the building's still standing beautiful building right yeah they redid it they fixed it but it's the same building I mean have you been there uh uh yes you went back to Poland what back to Poland but on the march on a March no no we went out of room daughter-in-law father-in-law I want a picture of students who haven't been to blend and her father-in-laws is in the picture her father her father's in the picture I don't know my father because she was shocked you know so it's my father there right yeah um that remind that that prompts another question how did you react and deal with the Holocaust during the years of the war from 1940 to 45. do you have any recollection I mean you weren't yet in the rabbin it you were right yeah but still I didn't I didn't have too much information you didn't have much information on what was going on right right so you're 15 years old you were 14 15 16 17. yeah but apparently the information didn't come come to me no no I I met a number and then in the course of uh life I met a number of the leaders there uh and talk about uh you know some of the highlights he mentioned before well some of my highlights was that I was invited to speak before Congress oh twice yeah once before the House of Representatives before the Senate and this time I was taken under the wings of our congressmen you know how did you get how did you who invited you you were close to a politician right right I think I think I got it because I I didn't solicit right for it and I had a congressman invite me there and and uh for Senate there was a Jewish senator from Ohio at the time Jewish senator from Ohio at that time and anyhow I had lunch with them and they you know they knew my menu was kosher fruit plate listen to the kosher uh thing that I had that said that we're going to highlight when I was invited yeah to speak I mean I was invited to give the invocation in both occasions and occasion they would invite an outsider for their location based on their congressmen because they had a professional uh as the permanent uh their their official religious leader permanent base in the Edward that they paid for pay in fact they made a movie of one of them who was there a number of years so but at any rate you know I met their spiritual leaders when was the first time you spoke and what year approximately in the 60s and I love my life is it right because they sent me uh plaques so I I have the years I'd play now let me ask you about another before I forget Rabbi uh green not Greenberg a famous no he just passed away was 97 last year you knew him I'm sure he he was a mile also and he traveled in the hole the rabbi and then I know it was great wasn't it green not PESA Chrome no yeah I'm not talking about him bro don't talk about it but am I know quite well in fact fact in the book he's writing he writes a story the book that just came right about about your congregation I mentioned my son who saved the life of the well-known Rabbi from Israel saved his life and I happened to be at his home at the time and I had something to do with it so my name also appears okay but I'm talking about rabbi he was a personality well he was a personality right and he he is also uh apparently uh he's not a money man I can tell you not a money man very pushed it is an hug it was a big time clock I didn't I knew him very well and I didn't realize how outstanding he was it was it Feinstein yeah it was a leading Tower leading tumbledore move on move up right that's correct I right I didn't know all that at the time we were friends right but he was aware in Denver no not in Denver Memphis in Memphis but that's that's far from you that's far from Ohio but it so happened Memphis Tennessee one of my closest friends it was uh apparently he gave to DACA to to a number of religious organizations so he would contact me consider himself my talby yeah so anytime something important happened in his life whether it was his son's Bar Mitzvah and so on he would call me to speak that so in Memphis you know uh he donated a Torah in Memphis and Rabbi Greenblatt was instrumental getting him to donate a Torah but he told by Greenblatt that he wants me to speak yeah right right as the guest speakers I came there and knowing grabbed by greenfelt Green Block Green Lantern now he knew me yeah we know we knew each other you know right right exclusive knowing him not realizing you know as he said this great stature you know there's some there's some YouTube there's some YouTube clips he's on online that I've I've watched It's fascinating first of all the the he knows the history of things that uh he was quite he knew all the politics and he was around yeah then he went out his room I know he after the moistures Yeshiva he said he went there to slowly so all the good day leave the brisket of and others he'd do them all yeah now in in conversions for instance it was one case of conversion yeah you know others wouldn't take on but he took on and uh turn at his own expense he went he went to see the woman he convinced him to go to make vanilla all that whatever was necessary he did it and he did it at his own expense so I mean he was outstanding remarkable right right extraordinary right he taught in the Tommy Torah basically really it wasn't a rub he was a rubber sure uh let me ask you um did he ever come out to to Canton to to Dayton no no no there was no reason he was no reason for him to do that he he supported the uh religious institutions in his own Community right right right now now um where and how did you deal with energy strong becoming a state and and the follow-up how how is that in your community was that a big deal well and very zionistic yes my particular synagogue yeah we made him the yeah I don't know if we made him or they were and very zionistic very pro pro and you had both uh an Israeli flag and American flags that the type of school you had yes okay right and then we made prayers for the state of Israel right and we made prayers for the house and and did you um were there that always came or not really yeah yeah they said with some wealthy balabatim in the community that they came to apparently yes well you're the rapper you would know you're the right I don't know everybody right I know I know there were some very well wealthy people yeah the schottensteins were in Columbus Ohio Columbus how far is that from Dayton uh 50 miles it's not very far so the shopping he gave a lot of Sudoku yeah I'm talking about the four Arts growth right right and I knew Norman Schottenstein the father oh you knew him yes he belonged to uh in Columbus right Columbus right as a matter of fact I was offered that shoe you're offered a show yeah and that was one of the reasons the synagogues and I had as a student forever they invited me and I was there it was offered to me what about the baron Mr Baron you remember the name Baron remember the name um did you have any any connection with Baron it's not that close because they were also very big philanthropist yes so they gave money to to Tails and Lakewood and there you throw and the Babbage yeah they had like four yeshivas I mean you're talking about the you know large you know large funds right right uh right but you had no even had much connections but with shortness thing you did yeah the times that I did in fact this is his son Jay Jay satinson right he took over yeah he took over the business right I was invited when I was invited to be uh for the omen Iran in Columbus Day was the president ah yeah so I knew that and I knew his wife right right okay so let's now move on so when did you move here after you retired and I know actually my wife came here and came here she liked to climb it and she needed the climate health-wise and so so she came here so in fact years earlier I was actually solicited to be Rabbi initial here here in Boca yeah Miami in Miami Miami right right so why didn't you take it well my wife and he got got some flight from your parents why Why move away you know the grandson children won't know their grandparents right you know and all that so you know we let that that's still a goal right right so um let's find monetarily a lot more money than I was getting in Dayton Dayton Ohio right but you said earlier you weren't a money man you were in the cause wherever you could accomplish more that's where that that spoke to you that's correct you think my wife says you never asked for a raise wow and then I'm gonna um now um did you ever meet the Le Baba uh never I met people that met there that were and that were close to him yeah I would come and visit us it's one that stayed with us it was a big supporter of the theory nothing Rabbi gurari never came out to Dayton you know because the this the brother-in-law of the of the river and also the son-in-law of the previous rapper he never came to with someone to raise funds in that area not in Dayton uh you know I'm talking about the rubbish yes Statesman you know very easy but you you don't you know you never met him no no no you know of him right so so um over the years uh you were helpful to the rabbi kamasin and there are the barbecuers that started Chabad houses yeah gave them safer Torah I told them to use they came one year I remember Gregor's they needed uh-huh yeah we were able to help Supply them and other things you know and Gratis right without without charging them when did you move here well my my wife came here a number of years ago for health reasons right but when did you retire well you just retired recently no well actually when they asked me when did you retire you never retired I never retired right still called me back I'm Different okay you go and you go back I'd gone back really yeah yeah what did you give mostly Sherman gamara hello right right but to you personally what's your favorite uh subject matter-ish like do you have a particular liking I'm saying in your teaching what was the style you used mainly uh seed mainly of course I would quote them and give up yeah yeah yeah but on the partial largely and did you ever learn and teach Musser I did to to group you know when I had when I had different groups in fact and they had me have a group here in this show here they call them oh yeah yeah yeah so I had a little group a little group that I talked are there other other others for a while they had me speaking uh almost every every week here this show yeah the the BRS right Boca ratonica especially when due to the covet they diving in a tent yes outside outside that's where I went right so the rabbi and the rabbi of the shoe used to come down you know brother Goldberg very fine Rabbi yes so he would give uh advantages but but after a while and one time he didn't come down they asked me unexpectedly right and then they asked me regularly so um you did well with covid you didn't get it I got it that one time but yeah but not uh not bad not bad they say yeah you know correct yeah um so here's another question a very important question you see the youth today you see the children you see the teenagers you see the the young adults what's your opinion is it better than the past during your young years as a congregational Rove Rabbi or not no but really what's what's your thinking I don't think it's better at all I think if there's a bigger I need that in which way did you read the remain as far as attachment to Judaism as far as uh well you're telling me that your days people that were not assimilated yes in the 60s in the 50s and 60s and 70s no no no those that did assimilate and all that were were not in the majority group really I mean the 60s you had the Rebellion to Counter Culture the 60s with the Counter Culture the hippies well you had the hippies and all that right right a lot of Yeadon were involved right but not not by members not your member because you had a older clientele yeah would say it already Okay but but but the children and grandchildren of those congregations how many of them are Orthodox today how many are they are Orthodox what's the percentage are you going to tell me that there's more than 50 percent that stayed from I don't think so no I don't think the percentage rents that high you know but but we had let's say a higher percentage let's say the conservative no I understand but my question so why if your congregants if their grandchildren are not Orthodox and it's more than 50 percent why is it worse than what's happening today that's what's happened today because the parents don't impart hear this guy to the children it has to be Hamshire and the continuation right and the parents are not doing their Duty I don't want to accuse the parents for other reasons too right but they don't instill their love of Yiddish guide and the pride of Yiddish guy and their children like we try to do I mean you're familiar you know there's something called the internet world yeah you know it's a it's it's it started fairly uh in your life fairly late but you know what what do you see about that the impact good or bad on today's uh Jewish Jews I think it's good I think the impact is good if the child turns on the right the channels the right places correct the New Year's Theory Musa right right none of that I think it has right to what extent percentages yet I don't know right but you're saying is that you feel that the parents are not imparting a love for Tyra and Mitzvahs to the youth today that's correct I think that's hitting the nail on the head there may be other reasons of course but I think that's the main reason that they don't that's I don't even spend time it's time with their children like uh connected shows not spending time to tell a story about a doctor a doctor that his son came went to an orthodox shoe and the sun was despondent right Rabbi wanted to know why yeah why he was despondent yeah he says he says my my father you know you know after after he divorced my mother you know has a very little connection with me so he says nothing your father support you she says no no I'm the contrary he gave me uh uh what do you call it where I can spend as a Visa where I can spend as much money as I want a credit card credit card right I could spend as much money as long but you know I never get to see him in a minute he doesn't love me right where you see just pouring money on him doesn't necessarily prove that the father loves him in his opinion his mind the father doesn't love him despite the fact that he gave him a credit card and he had no uh problem with Finance he could spend on different things right as much as he wants right so you need more in that you got to spend time right quality time quality bonding bonding what they call right right so sometimes I mean you see where a father this doctor uh let's say uh but he was approached by the rabbi you know spend more time with with your son so he says yes we meet once a week he said something Sometimes some weeks eat once a week to say yeah what do you do during the week they watch television right they don't talk there's no talking not quality time right right let me ask you um what do you do today most of the day yeah what do you do yeah well well for one thing besides doctor's appointments which hopefully is not as much as right for me as much as for others right but you you get a chance to learn well I need to go over go over the power share and then I try to do regularly and uh you know I write I write sometimes the nasty right articles for some have you written any books yeah I wrote one book right and uh and what type of what type of were you on orator what type of Rabbi speaker were you how did you how did you excite your congregation what was your style oh they say they seem to like it if they had a they had you for over 60 years I know I know that but I'm asking you did use any particular style they say stately I don't know that's it somebody here's somebody who's uh from Israel just so my son you met him you met him so he he gave uh he's from Bethel raise money for right himself he recorded to him a message that he heard me in the past week or two I give and he was so impressed I told my son about it and he said he speaks to such a stately Manner and so he used the word stately he used the word right right and says people to people listen they've been dropping them it's wonderful well you said earlier also you were very yeah yeah and you like people that's correct friendly right right um I guess it comes across yes yes well come definitely comes across in the interview let me ask you um what are your feelings about mashiach well I I know some have given yeah I'm just asking you how they're wrong we've had false missions so I said don't say come you know to you yourself and yourself are respond you yourself with your masintovi can bring about mashiach earlier okay and um any final message to Claudius roll that you want to leave us with yeah I want to say the children of our future spend time with the children even if you think you buy them presents and Gifts you know and try to win them over the most precious gift of all that parents can give children is time and as you said before quality time quality time good time right talk to them about Torah ideas and Torah values right bring them closer to my shed that's the greatest do retsona ship not only with offering lip service they have to see you as the example as the shining example you do it openly do it often and do it proudly this is the way you'll bring Hampshire to the Next Generation and you'll help to preserve Yiddish guide forever forever I mean and uh Hashem you have besides grandchildren you have great grandchildren yeah all your great great grandchildren beautiful the wife says that's the proudest thing that's right but the hard work that both of you put in those 60 plus years and she gets the Lion's Share of the credit and instill it the mother Teresa bias um he's pretty good for his age and you do I'm 92 he's 98. it's a brother benches yes that's it it's you know some people 50 60 gone are you talking about a dear friend of ours in fact we're gonna call her in a little while lost the dog lost her daughter 50 years old you might let put you on the screen yeah go ahead go ahead I'd like to put a shirt okay okay okay okay cover my hair but I it's fine it's fine okay yeah so 50 years old a member of our congregation in Dayton a very dear friend 50 years old left a husband and two children 50. right yeah congregation they called us in a member of the country education field that's what happened we're going to call them right we're still in contact see we're people over there your husband told me that because of your father he got the position in in in Dayton your father was in a bit parcheski he and he and he learned to Slovakia Epstein that's right that's right from um no listen your husband told me you have great grand great grandchildren they're all going but there are hotels one has veered away not one and um that's that's the that's the payback that Hashem has given you for the 60 plus years of helping Eden that's the payback it works you gotta tell the young people today it works the Sun that you met the other day the doctor the doctor did you know what he did he has a special uh sweet in this hobby there's a lovely home and for him no no no no it's in the five towns right Lawrence gives them their own key they share some food no I'm just telling you they come and go either they don't even know about it either they're provided they have a special place for them to park a car yeah that's her you see over there that's our 70th and somebody made our wedding invitation when we had our 70th Anniversary that's both of you when you when you were young that's our wedding picture 1952. that's right 1952. that was wow guys a handsome customer color and let me tell you you know who was our massage no Rabbi crysworth and Rabbi Elias are silver wow wow yeah oh we were talking about them yeah they're like yeah very very nice Silva was the biggest activist during the the war and post-war and absolutely I can tell you stories about I look my father worked with Rabbi silver for many many years he was uh he was uh my father was his right hand man I didn't know that so do I know I can tell you stories I oh no I was born and raised in Cincinnati I know Cincinnati yeah did you did you have anything to do with huc the the uh I I well I dated a boy from HSC one time because you're a family from a very from Rabbi Ava hello silver son I dated his son Thomasville was one of the leading right right sure and my father said I race for the Cincinnati and I left Cincinnati he sent me to New York to NYU to New York and base medicine I have a degree from base mattress where was that New York five remember 337 East Broadway you have a degree from that wow and you do it also from NYU NYU what in what field in education education in those days if you wanted to be a show marriage Shabbat you had to be a teacher right because Monday Tuesday Wednesday Thursday Friday you don't have to work Shabbos and Sunday did you know rabbits and Kaplan sure from Williamsburg no I knew rabbits and Kaplan from from Columbus Columbus okay I'm gonna go yeah thank you very much for your time