Rabbi Yehoshua Weber - Parsha like you've never learned it - Acharei Mos Kedoshim

Yes. So the motif the the core idea is going to be it'll be focused on this week's para but it's not really this week's para core idea is is that there are plenty of huge mitzvah that we sort of ignore. Now you can't ignore a mitzvah and you can't do an aa but you can make a whole dre and get around it. And then there are some things that we don't dre and we don't get around. And let me give you an example of some of the most serious aoras in the Torah. There's a financial aaria that is considered like the worst ribbis. I mean, I brought down some of the kazals. Lending money with interest is considered the most horrible thing in the world. Um, people who lend money with interest, you're supposed to kill them actually. I mean, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, if they're hanging there and at the edge of a cliff, you you sort of don't save them. They're re they were really considered a menace. But anyone who is involved in the world today is involved in lending money with interest. If you're paying a mortgage, if you you're um if you you're in margin, if you take out a car, if you any any business, if you're involved in credit card, if you're whatever you do, um this financing both in terms of paying and in terms of receiving so how do we get around it? Like you know, you're not allowed to give interest, you're not allowed to take interest only from Jew to Jew, right? >> Only from Jew to Jew, but we do it from Jew to Jew also. I mean, so you'll say it very frequently. leads from N is very I mean I don't think many people will tell you well we'll do business with guy rather than Jews so that if there's the interest valve it'll be with a guy how do we get around it how do we get around it we have a >> yeah we have a haters we have a worker and we say that I'm not really paying you interest I'm giving you money that you're supposed to invest and I'll get a certain percentage of the investment and for you to sort of clarify what the investment is you have to swear in court you're not going to do that and we get around it right but but you know you You could do the same thing with murder. You're not really supposed to kill somebody, right? But you know, if you lock the door and they starve to death, you didn't really kill them. Is that going to be Is anyone going to say there's a workaround there? Like some it's just there are workarounds. >> You pull out the blood, they start reading. >> Right. Right. Right. Right. Right. So So I'm just saying it's like it's a it's like a complicated situation that sometimes we work around things and sometimes we don't work around things. Come schmita, you're supposed to cancel all your loans. supposed to every loan somebody right go ahead and forgive every loan. So we have a workaround and what is the workaround? We um we give sign the loan over to best and a principal and a this and a that. What I really want to get to is is that there are some mitzvah where there are workarounds and some mitzvah that we're aren't. Did we even discuss this? I don't know. Again, I don't know what we discussed already at this point in my life, [snorts] but >> [laughter] >> um at this week's para I think is a perfect example because this week's para and you'll see how there's different sections of the community have taken different lines. This week's para bans shaving. You're not allowed to shave and in sections of the world lab for sure >> shaving is a no no. You're not allowed to cut your beard, >> right? So we say we we do it because we're not doing it put through a razor. were doing with a clipper and a good guy looks at you and says you know and I know that what razor >> right right so you're getting around it right so so what what I'd like to establish is is that neither you nor I know why gives mitzvah but the rishonim grappled with tamia mitzvah they put a lot we've discussed this a little bit the put a lot of effort into understanding the reasons for different mitzvah Now, what I venture to say, and I'm going to use shaving as an example, when there's a mitzvah where the reason for the mitzvah doesn't resonate the way it once did, you can't break it. You can't vi you can never violate a Torah prohibition. But then we allow ourselves to sort of get around it. When it's a mitzvah that is as relevant as it once was, we won't get around it at all. And I'm going to shift um we'll come back to shaving in a minute and I'm going to talk first about interest. Right? In the ancient world and this is not really did we discuss is that um in the ancient world who took loans, right? Did people buy their homes with mortgages? There were no banks. People didn't buy homes with mortgages. Right? So in the ancient world, people didn't take loans. No one invested in the stock market on margin. There were no credit cards. So who took loans in the ancient world? >> Poor people. >> Poor people. And what did they take loans for? Not even. >> Yeah. Not even essentially because they would go to the Tamco for their food. Usually when the crop failed, they would they would borrow money, you know, or borrow grain more to plant the following year's crop. That's that was now poor people were totally uneducated. They were frequently illiterate. They had no understanding of math. So you would start charging them interest and you would charge compound interest. Can you figure out compound interest? The bank's compound interest that you pay that you get. I mean you need an actuary with a with a is anyone an actuary here with a calculator and 50 different calculators with 15 different to figure out. Do you think in the ancient world people were able to figure out how competent interest works? So poor people would take money would borrow money only poor people. They would borrow money or grain. They were the ones who had to pay it back. They would pay with interest. First of all, they didn't have what to pay back with. Secondly, they couldn't figure out what the interest was. Thirdly, they were taken advantage of. [gasps] And so, the Torah banned it. It don't lend money with interest. Usually, he's borrowing grain to plant the following year's crop. He's not borrowing money, you know, to for a mortgage for a house cuz no one could keep track of these things. He wasn't borrowing money for um for anything cuz there were no investments. The only thing people borrowed for was grain for the following year's crop. It wasn't even the daily food because how would they pay that back that there was a tamoy there was a central soup kitchen when people borrowed money it was usually grain when the crop fa failed to following following you that's when people borrowed money >> three soup kitchens back then >> kamar is a full discussion about tempo because how did people survive and sometimes you know when there was starvation people starve to death but you you couldn't borrow for because how would you pay that back you just didn't have money the the money for his food today is not going to have money for his food tomorrow it was usually usually when your crop failed that people borrowed money and you would pay it back. Hopefully the crop succeeded, you would pay it back the following year. It was very uncommon. It was only poor people. So the Torah says he's borrowing it for one year. Don't take interest. And the truth is now if you don't take interest, you lose money. Why do you lose money if you don't take interest? >> Because the system is that way. your the your finan the dollar goes down could have been less but because there's no there's no because it's because and why does the not dollar go down in value >> because it's it's all fake >> it doesn't have intrinsic value exactly >> right money doesn't have intrinsic value it's just aar against gold right but in the ancient world money was gold silver had intrinsic value so money didn't depreciate in the ancient world the only people borrowing were poor people they were borrowing for next year's crop So let the guy go. Don't charge him interest. And what is what is the one year when you're supposed to forgive the loan? >> What is the one year? >> Why do you forgive the loan in the year? Because [clears throat and snorts] how did the poor person borrow when he how would he pay you back >> the next year's crap? >> But he couldn't pay back in the shita with next year's crap because there was no next year's crap. So the is all logical. The poor guy normally would borrow grain to plan for the next year's scrap. this year there is no next year's crap so you forgive him that's the show I was reading it makes sense is not like this crazy idea what null all loans I I lend a guy $200,000 to invest a null it just because he's a multi-millionaire he's investing for me I shouldn't it doesn't it doesn't really it it made sense but these things don't make sense anymore they don't fit so we give ourselves workarounds okay and principal you're giving the money to besten but you know and I know that you know right We just I think we discussed this here a little bit. No. Did we discuss this here a little? Cuz somebody here was someone was giving me a hard time at a sheer. I don't remember what I say. Where? Oh, in the hotel. Okay. Someone was giving me a hard time. Um that's not a hard time like a um shait. Now tell me um does it make any sense for a woman to cover her hair with hair that looks much better than the hair she normally has? Is there any logic to it? Right. um you know when in the 40s the um people weren't covering the hair in pre-world Lithuania Germany and in the big Polish cities people didn't cover the hair my grandfather was but his wife didn't cover here in the house for kiddes but it it just wasn't a thing in pre-war Poland in the maybe yes >> when they went when they were in front of men they didn't cover their hair >> they didn't cover the hair in the street shul they did um the rashiva's wives many I don't want to mention names didn't cover their hair the 40s and 50s These Rashiva's wives did not cover the hair. Big Rashi Yashiva. Um there's no major. It just wasn't a thing. And my mother says in the late 50s people began covering the hair. She said, "Well, all of the women who had once been in their 20s were in the 30s. They were going to the 40s. The shait looked better than the hair. So they began wearing shait and it sort of became the norm. That's not the only reason. But um does it really make sense to cover your hair with a shaitle that is more attractive than your hair? >> What's the reason why a woman? So we have to ask ourselves what's the reason why who covers a year >> the Torah tells you the Torah. So you can't break it. You can't lend money with for interest for sure. So we don't lend money with interest. We have a workaround. And the workaround is we're not really lending. We're investing. Schmita has to cancel the loan. We we we we keep the rule. We give a prisbull. A woman is to cover here. So she covers her here with a shaitle that is much more attractive than her shhatel. Can you shut the microphone a middle >> in the ancient world up until 150 years ago any decent woman covered her here just the way any decent woman wore a skirt that went down to her ankles. The whole idea of wearing a skirt below till your knees is is really post World War II was absolutely unacceptable to expose your lower leg. It was unacceptable to expose your hair and non-Jewish woman. So in that world for a world a woman not to cover her hair was provocative. Today if a woman isn't covering her is not covering here she's not being provocative she's not being spiteful she's not being inappropriate 99% of women don't cover the hair. [snorts] There's a you for sure can't abandon but when the rationale behind doesn't resonate the way it once did we as a community circumvent it. Interest does not resonate. the entire modern um financial system is based in interest. [sighs and gasps] So we get around it and we have a workaround. Um the idea of schmita cancelling loans doesn't make sense because everyone here is paying a mortgage um or or involved in some type of of of mortgage type situation. So we get around it. Uh women who don't cover their hair are not being indecent. They're not being inappropriate and they're not necessarily doing anything wrong. So says a married woman to cover. So she'll cover her here with a hair covering that doesn't really address the issue at all, but she's keeping the law, but she's keeping the um letter, but not the spirit of the law. Just gave the shir at um in a different venue. And the title of the share was letter of the law. Spirit of the law. Sometimes we we really want to keep the spirit of the law. Sometimes we just keep the letter. We just keep the letter of the law. When it comes to mortgages, we circum ribbus. We just keep the letter of the law. When it comes to shmita, we just keep the letter of the law. When it comes to shait, but when it comes to murder, clearly the sin is there of killing somebody. So, if you're just locking somebody in the room and starving them to death, you're not really killing him. Well, I can circumvent it. You can't. It's a horrible thing because you're killing somebody, right? Um, you can circumvent adultery, right? conceptually um a man there are ways to circumvent adultery but we don't we don't I'm not even going to go into the ways that one can circumvent adultery just in a but there's a moral thing I'd like to bring this to issues like shaving shaving is very interesting there are sections of the community in the section that I grew up in the literature community centrist community the modern community where people shave and they consider it not problematic there are sections of the community like the sedish community labavich for sure where it's considered a terrible aera and We really shouldn't. What does it go back to? It goes back to really how you view it. The Torah ban shaving. Why does the Torah ban shaving? Now again, I'll reiterate and it's so important. I'm going to share ration that the reishonum bring down. Do I know for sure that these are the reasons? For sure not. Do they know for sure? Also not. [gasps] But they they sort of make sense. No one is going to say you can break the total law. But when you go through these reasons, they really don't speak to the modern mind. And because of that, we're not going to break it, but we'll circumvent it. We'll find the workaround. We'll say, "I'm not shaving with a razor. I'm shaving with a shaver," which isn't really a razor. It's a clipper. I mean, it it gets as close as a razor. It's almost a razor action. Really very dubious, but we'll say it's not exactly a an absolute affront to the prohibition. We'll give ourselves leeway, but we only give ourselves leeway because we really don't feel it's such an immoral thing anymore because in our lives today, the reason doesn't resonate the way it once did. So, the theory here, and it's a theory, and I may be wrong, is that when the rationale behind the mitz resonates, we're not going to have any workarounds. Um, the Arab community has ways to perform adultery, right? Every time they're with a a man is with a woman of illreute, he marries her and then he leaves the room and he divorces her and 10 minutes later someone else marries her and conceptually there are people would divorce their wives and then all sorts of inappropriate things would happen and then they would remarry them. You could people can do crazy things but of course it's immoral right and you can do the same with murder >> you can't do that in the Jewish religion >> right with somebody else >> with somebody else right right so so so yeah so here it's like such an uncomfortable discussion that I I don't want to go there but you know in in areas that are a little bit odd there are interesting discussions but murder also conceptually you can find a way but no one will say that because it's something that's innately immoral innately horrible innately disgusting but these mitzvah and a they're in the Torah. You cannot say they're given for a reason and I can break them for sure not. But what we do say is that sometimes when it just doesn't seem to resonate so much, we're not going to break it, but we'll circumvent it. And shaving is a perfect example. The Torah ban shaving. You can't say for sure why, but the rishum step in and offer reasons. Not definitive, but we sort of assume that these are probably the reasons. So what are those reasons? So there's a Rambam and the Rambam in the Mora puts a lot of effort into saying that many of the mitzvah that we do are about not replicating things that pagans did within the confines of their um idolatrous places of worship. These were acts that obar did as religious rights wearing shist that was a in their world sort of like anyone remember their their their medieval studies alchemy alchemy was a big thing during the middle ages they would mix things and they thought they would create gold and mix this and mix that so it's it's the way they so in their world when you mix things you could do magic so they would mix garments and so we we banned shotness and they would mix milk and meat And so we ban milk and meat. That's the rami. They would mix things and that was considered very powerful. That's the ram. That's again I I don't think you can say definitively that's why. But that's all the only reason brings down. >> Does he mention grafting? >> Grafting be the same. Yeah. All of that. The grafting, the sewing together, the clim, the klearum, the kairam, all of that. That was like sort of an alchemy. And the Torah wants us to stay away from that. Is that the only reason that god forbid to say that? because we're not dealing with those religions now. So that's what reform said in the in the early 8 19th century. Well, these were all put in place for specific reasons. We're not contending with that. So abandon >> there's so many different reasons that we can't like frequency of wool and luna the same frequency happens to mean they can't see each other. I'm just saying >> frequency I don't >> everything has a frequency piece of paper everything because it's molecules. So I'm just saying frequency wise they both [snorts] have 500 I believe cancel each other whatever it's like it's [laughter] infinite reason. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So so I'm I'm not saying anything is definitive but the Rambam makes a point of bringing down reasons and he actually he doesn't say maybe and he doesn't say there are other reason this is it. The Rambam brings his reason. Rishon would do that. They weren't as afraid as we are. Remember they weren't reform was knocking at the door. They weren't scared of being labeled Kof. So they just said, "I think this is it." They they they were much less guarded than we are. We're much more guarded. Again, for for years, and I may regret being taped because it may come back to haunt me. Um for decades, I was not taped to Lazar, just so you should know. This is like a whole new um experience for me. Um and I hope it's not to my detriment. >> Your mailbox is not full. >> What? >> Your mailbox? [laughter] >> Not yet, but give it time. Um, [snorts] so let's see what the Ram says. So the Ram says that this idea of not shaving beards and not rounding heads, not cutting off palos is because this is what was done probably by priests but as part of ancient ceremonies. Okay, look at the look at the two. Don't um round your heads, which means don't cut your pisk. Don't cut the um your beards and the Rambam. And what's very interesting, okay, is that normally the Rambam brings us down just in the M. Here the Rambam puts us into the Yad. The Yad is normally just his work. Again, the Ram was very very he was a scientist. That's really what he was. He was a doctor. He's a rationalist. He was a scientist. So the the Yad was really what you do, what you don't do. The Mora was esoteric ideas, ration, background. Um um he doesn't normally bring bring reasons into the art here. He does. He says because this seems to be so obvious. This is what the did and indeed okay tells you. So both in terms of cutting the beards and in terms of cutting the palos um it's about the way of the non-Jews. And the truth is it's the um it's the na'vi. Year tells you you know what term do we use for non-Jews. So now we say the term right is not a negative term right those who worship you know idols but you know what term yeria uses for the non-Jews >> look at um five for one section all [clears throat] the other all the other Asians >> yeah that that's just how that's how they did that was their waya right just the way I mean right um so you know um you know in some communities they describe us as black and whites Right? Because some sections of our community are black and white. So to tip, that's the way they comport themselves. That's the way they >> weren't irreligious people. [sighs] >> Everyone, there was no such thing as living without religion. Then you might as well be dead with that religion. Life is too short and too brutal and too structured. Um you had to live with religion. >> Today it's a different world. >> Today you can live with that religion. >> Fit into a box, >> right? And it gave people definition. People were probably happier because they had identity. Today people just live between and people need to belong somewhere but that's another discussion. Okay. So the the yeria tells you that's what they were called pa and indeed this explains why you've probably wondered about this right that at the beginning of paras we're making our way through vayikra. Oh never mind please. Um I'm looking for customers. So the more the marrier. Okay. >> Okay. See, I when there's when there aren't enough seats at the table, then I go home and I tell my wife there there are extra people. So, and if all the papers are handed out, then I get even happier yet. Okay. So, um this is we're about to go here, right? Um we're making our way through the parra and soon we'll approach us and par tells you these are that apply to um the of not um cutting your pose not cutting your beard is given to kuhan. Why in the world is it given to kuhan? It's a general cut all heroes. So a kind god would would would take >> eyebrows and beer everything >> only when they dedicated themselves only during the process of being consecrated but it wasn't like a regular thing you know during the but it did this of not cutting your beard this of not cutting your p is reiterated for why is reiterated for it's not a certain a can't marry a can't become this is nothing to do with being a kayan this is a now it's mentioned for Israel why is it reiterated for Gohan just to give you two prohibitions just to like why what's the theory? Why specifically Ghanam? You can intuitit it. You you know the reason before because because it's bas because it's about temple used to do that. >> Yeah. So it's so again because so that is that's the Ram's reading that that shaving beards and cutting palos was banned because that's what the kohani of did that is one reason. What's Bak's reason 10? Um Tammy Iser. Okay, let's go through a number of reasons. Now tell me this isn't relevant now because we're not dealing with um idolatrous groups that do this. Tells you men have beards, women don't have beards. And if men start cutting their beards, they're going to start looking like women. And what's what's going to happen then? Manhattan >> that's going to happen. Well, Manhattan will happen right now. These things happen all over the world, right? And these things have always been happening. So, it's really about a gender thing that the men who are doing are trying to be a feminite and once they come across as a feminite, they must start doing things that make them like women, right? And these things happened even then, right? I think it happens a little more now than, but it happened even then. So, according to the um it's because of um issues um issues of the flesh. Maybe that's a good term to use. Issues of the flesh. According to the Rambam, it's about a vidazara. But um what does the nitiv say? >> Yeah, but those those two go both hand in hand. They always do. >> Good. Because gileizar mixed well together because one way to attract churches don't do it anymore and they made a big mistake. Um um they you know the churches adopted celibacy and that was a mistake. [snorts] Um they would have been far more successful if they wouldn't have adopted celibacy. But in the ancient world, temples were centers really of pornography. That's really what they were. That's how they attracted people. Um, the way a temple worked is you went to the temple. If you were a man, you had a relationship with a woman on staff. If you were a woman, you had a relationship with a man on staff. We discussed this here, right? The term for um for woman of illreute in Hebrew was not zona. Modern Hebrew uses it, but that's not really what it means. The term is kadesha. Well, why kadesha? >> Because that's what they did. And and and that that's why these of well deserves were so attractive. You had young people. You had a 15-year-old son and and here there was a temple next door that says if you were the designer you're um you're you're being malar right. So it was very very hard to um pull people away from that. This was attractive and that's why they did it and they explained well this increases fertility right. So according to back excuse >> right and and the people who grew up with it though Allah believed it you know when you grow up with something you believe it so they >> now they're against fertility >> right right so they be >> sacrif they probably sacrificed those those kids >> I mean if the woman became pregnant could be human sacrifice was the normal so or maybe they you know they they were cautious right it was it was it was an industry an industry maybe they were cautious not to get pregnant >> right then it s says is um what happens when you cut off someone's beard? You cut off somebody's beard, the person looks like a little boy. You degrade him. And who did you cut beards off? Slaves. You wanted to mark a slave so he couldn't run away. The Nazis makam, right? They put tattoos on people's hands for lots of reasons to um to degrade them, to keep track. But if a person would run away, almost one or two people did escape from Mwitz. There were one or two escapes. um they were markings that they could be tracked down with. Um so um so that was part of it. We we wouldn't do anything the sort. Um in Rome they actually would tattoo slaves also and they wouldn't tattoo them on the hands. They would tattoo them on the foreheads. Um some slaves were tattooed on the foreheads. Um so what many people who didn't tattoo their slaves would do is they would cut the slave's beard and why you could identify him as a slave. And the truth is, you cut a slave's beard, what does he look like? A woman, but also like a like a boy who didn't start growing his beard yet. What do they call slaves in the old south? >> Boy. >> Boy. It's not per chance. You you demean the person. So then it says the reason you um you were not allowed to shave is that they would shave their slaves so that they would look like boys. The rabbaka says you're not allowed to shave because slave um because men shave to look like women to have inappropriate relationships. Um there were things like this happened. Even the Torah bans such relationships because such things happened. The Ramom says it's banned because of these were all idolatrous practices. Okay. Now what is um why is this relevant now? Are any of these reasons relevant now? Are are people so are people um shaving or cutting their beards because they worship idols? I don't think so. Are they shaving because they want to be a feminite? I don't >> I mean many men who are straight and >> could be. So could could be gay men shave more than straight men? I do gay men have beard I don't know. I don't work in the real world. What? >> I don't know. >> What? >> I don't know. I think it's part of the culture. [clears throat] The professional world at least maybe like maybe 10 years ago nobody had beards. >> Nobody beards. Yeah. >> If you were if you're a CEO >> you had to shave. Yeah. To go. You had to look presentable. >> Today it's more. >> Yes. I I don't know the corporate world, right? [snorts] Um >> what a little bit. >> But do gay men are more likely not to have beards? >> I don't know. It's a good question. I don't know. Well, I I don't know. Okay. It's it's it's it's immaterial. But back back to our discussion, we saw the reshi either the beard is about it was shaven so because it was an idolatrous, right? >> Or it was shaven because men wanted to look like women so they can have inappropriate relationships or you would shave your slave to identify him to prevent him from running away and to to sort of demean him. You know, when a person feels demeaned, he's less likely to rebel. He's less likely to run away. You know, when people feel demeaned, they become demeaned and they lose their spirit. You break their spirit. Is any of this relevant now? It's not really relevant. It's not an Odora thing. There are many, many straight men who shave without trying to be a feminite. And you're not shaving somebody because you want to make them a slave. So, the reason isn't relevant. So, no one in a million years can tell you that you can break the hala. But what will we do when hala doesn't seem so relevant? We'll circumvent it, right? Let's get back to ribbis. You are absolutely not let alone with ribbus, but we'll end we'll work around. We'll have this where you're investing and you're not really investing. No one will tell you. Everyone will tell you that is mash maybe likely init but is mashit. But no one here has all of their um um debts canceled. Come shmita. We write a principal. You're giving the debt to business. It's a workaround, right? We have a workaround for shmita. We have a workaround for fort. You sell ktz um you're not allowed to keep. So you sell it and it's a real sale. But you can have a workaround for murder also. You can lock the door and the guy will starve to death. You can have a workaround for adultery. I don't want to go into little discussions that are uncomfortable, but you can have a workaround for adultery, but no one will advocate workarounds for things like that because these are issues where >> where it's where it's relevant. It's still horrible to kill somebody. It's still horrible for a person to have um you know, unstructured, fluid, um uncommitted relationships. So, there are no workarounds. There is nothing horrible about taking a mortgage. There is nothing horrible about not not forgiving alone because it's not a poor person. And there's really nothing horrible about shaving. You're not doing anything immoral. You're not hurting anybody. You're not turning yourself. You're not you're not you're not you're not doing something that is innately bad. There's a you keep the but when when it's that doesn't resonate, there'll be workarounds. So in some sections of the community, people absolutely won't shave. Sections of world for sure not. But in some sections of the community, people absolutely will shave. No one is going to use a razor that Torah bans that will use a shaver or >> interest is a real problem today because it that's what it does. It basically gets a person so >> in debt >> in debt and they can't get out of it. >> But not necess I mean the fact is the mortgage is for the debt. That's what it means. >> The vast majority of people are involved because finance wouldn't function. So there's there are the occasional people who you know food is a problem most because some people will overeat and and kill themselves and but you know Ben more you need interest for a modern society to function. Some people will abuse it and be abused just the way >> it was created for whatever the reasons are but it's not the way >> right but in the ancient world it was really the loans were specifically for the four poor people. um [clears throat] it um the reason to take interest wasn't so relevant because money didn't lose its value. People can compute interest because they didn't have calculators and they were just uneducated. So it was just it was just a it was it was a whole barrel full of problems. But um today for the majority of people it's fine. Well, some people get into credit card debt over their head and then some people are going to overeat and also die of a heart attack. Um you person buys a house and you're paying 10 times the price because they got you for life. >> Yeah. That so then otherwise you can't buy a house because you need I mean just right >> that's how it works. They make it [snorts] that way so you basically have sleep to to >> right or people can save and buy it for cash but then they can't invest their money. I mean, so it cuts both, but there was there was like there was like a a theory that I'm hearing is is that when the rationale of the mitzvah really resonates, we're not going to work around where the rationale does not resonate, we will find a workaround or beard as one example. There's one additional example that I want to bring and again maybe I discussed this on Friday morning, maybe not. It's it's actually complicated because there's a great division. There is a lot of good from people and at this point there are really two basic streams in the from community. There's the Karedi stream which is and yes again it has its own and full of devout passionate people. And then in Israel there's the Datilumi stream the Misrai stream full of passionate devout people too. Is everyone passionate devout? No in either community. Um are there lagards in each community? Of course. [snorts] Um initi the that tieumi community is bigger. The community is smaller. Arts is diverse. Had community is bigger. Tieumi community is strong. Smaller and much weaker much weaker cuz now you know what one of the biggest differences in hashkafa is how you view schmita. What is shmita about? What is shmita all about? What's the point of knowing that hashem? Right. >> So that's what the says. Okay. You know what's interesting? I actually did not bring the ram down. The ram the we went through this one Friday morning. I think um according to the [laughter] schmita is about shabas one day a week to show ourselves that Hashem is boss that just the way we don't work on the seventh day. We don't work in the seventh year. That's what it's about. [snorts] It's a little bit of a big thing not to work an entire year but that's the reading. You know what the Rambam's reading is? >> What's the Rambam's reading? >> The soil to re >> only so that the soil to rejuvenate. Well, why do you need to enact a whole year for the soil to rejuvenate? Well, it takes a year for the soil to rejuvenate. Well, the Torah has to go ahead and prescribe um agricultural practices. Well, remember the people who came terra? They were no in the desert for 40 years before. They had been slaves in Egypt for 210 years. They didn't know agriculture. So the Torah has to enact it. Well, why in the world are you going to enact that everyone keeps me to the same year? Then you're going to starve. If it's all about agricultural practices, I'm going to not farm one year, someone else will not farm. And this way it'll be better for everybody. [clears throat] What do you gain when everyone doesn't farm the same year? What is the big gain? >> Because nobody else. So that would be the [snorts] but practically speaking what did Yseph enact in Egypt? What was Yseph's innovation in Egypt? >> He put away. And why did Yseph put away? Because he knew there was going to be a starvation. I'm going to shift the discussion completely. Um so anyone here any big travelers? Anyone like to travel a lot? You like to travel, right? So in Europe, right? There's northern Europe and southern Europe. Which part of Europe has always been richer? The north or the south? >> Denmark, Scandinavia, Germany, England, or Portugal, Spain, Italy. Which part has been richer? >> The north. >> The north. Which part of the US has always been richer? The northern states. Massachusetts, New York, or Georgia, Florida, Alabama. >> The North has always been much richer. South America. Which part has been richer? Argentina, Chile, or go further north to Bolivia and countries like that? Argentina. Yeah, >> Argentina Argentina Chile as well. Argentina has been having its issues with its but essentially Pab's always >> the most >> but they're the most advanced. It's so strange. So it seems the countries that are far away from the equator, right? The northern part of the US, the northern part of Europe or the southern part of South America is far away from the equator. When you live far away from the equator, what's the climate like? >> Cold. Which means how many growing seasons do you have? One, how many growing seasons do you have in warmer climates? >> Two. >> Two. Um, how much of your um of your income do you need to spend on fuel in in in Alabama, Georgia, in places like this, in Spain, and Italy? On heating fuel? Zero. What percentage of your income goes towards heating costs in in in the ancient world where you have to chop wood? Huge. Maybe a third, maybe a. So in all of these northern places, your standard of living should be a third of what is in the south. You have one growing season rather than two. A lot of your income is going towards fuel. And yet all of the northern societies were places with higher standards of living, places of technological advance. Which countries were were technologically advanced? Where did the um technological advance come from? from Spain and Portugal and Italy or from England and Germany where where were the advances? >> Yeah, Germany, Holland. >> Why these countries should have a much lower standard of living? Cuz what happened in these countries? People in these countries had to survive the winter. And what happened when you had to survive the winter? >> They have to figure things out. They have to store. They become a society of savers. And when you're a society of savers, you just learn to live a better life to set aside to be careful to plan. When it's a big mñana, then you know, you know it's mñana. So [clears throat] by having a world where everyone doesn't farm in the seventh year, how do you survive that seventh year? >> By building storehouses. You become a society of savers. The mentions as being about relying in the Rama mentions no such thing. The Rama mentions for the soil to regenerate to establish fertility of the land. I'm not saying the Rama doesn't accept the idea and I'm not saying the [clears throat] doesn't accept the Ram's idea the Rambam >> that's his reading. Now again how you read into the what is it all of this is discussion. Now all of this plays itself out in terms of how people keep shmar's role. Um well the community here in my works within the karedi framework and the karedi mindset is is that don't farm the land and trust in that's that's how the community lives its life. How does the misrai community live it life in Israel? It says ab the reverse if what's going to happen if no one farms the land every seventh year >> food. >> So in terms of food you know again you food is a small part of people's budget. You'll be able to raise money. You'll be able to import it but you're not going to have people farming the land. You'll have to sell the land to Arabs [clears throat] because if you give up your customers every seventh year you're not going to have customers. Which means instead of Jews owning the farming land Arabs will own the farming land. >> That's a theory. That's not a story. >> Well, again, >> for sure I'm I'm sharing two. I'm sharing two completely disparate theories here. And again, I have no opinion. I'm just sharing two two disparate theories. Two marketkedly different theories. According to and the purchase, the whole point is to build trustem. So don't farm. It'll impact on your ability to farm. Take care. Says exactly the objective was to build fertility of the soil. If you don't farm every seventh year, not only will you not have the land that seventh year, there is no way in the modern world where you can continue a farming business when you can't service your markets every seventh year. So England and Germany and Holland and all the countries who bought Israeli strawberries are going to buy strawberries from Turkey instead. And the Israeli farming industry will collapse. Well, what will happen to the land that is owned by Jews that is meant for farming? Who's going to buy it? >> Arabs. Now what is the point according to [laughter] the the point is about trusting according to the is to have a fertile Jewish land. So according to the Rambam your daf is supposed to have a workaround. Find a solution. You sell your before pes that's an isa. You find a way to lend money with ribbis by giving it to another person. You um find a way to not collect money off the find a way. What's the way? Sell the land to a non-Jew. And this way you it can be farmed because the whole point is to sort of maintain the fertility of the land as a Jewish land. According to the whole point is about creating a year where you just trust. And so these two different communities full of good people have developed hugely different approaches where each is very very devoted to its point of view. One point of view is Yudafa not supposed to farm because they go back to the theory behind it. The other point of view is that Yavapka is supposed to farm because they go back to a different theory behind it. Theory isn't just theory. Theory is also um plays itself out in practice. And on that note, we will concur. There are sort