Rabbi Rosner: You Have to Make it an Experience for Everybody

i'm david pardo i run the our initiatives and i am on a quest for the perfect seder join me and we're going to find out how to mask the maggot with the magette of the masters welcome back today we get to talk to rabbi shawn rosner have a rosner is a ram at kvy he's the senior rav of nofe hashemesh in er sistral and for the past eight plus years he's given one of the most popular english language dafyo mishiram in the world through ou torah and then through aldaf now unfortunately visiting him was beyond the budget scope of this particular project so we are going to meet him we are going to travel together to my basement in order to take a zoom call come along and please pardon the mess [Music] rabbit rosner thank you so much i have this image of a rosh shiva type seder looks like this there's an old joke a guy goes into a comedy club and uh he says someone on the mic says 36 and everyone laughs and he's like what's going on here and the guy says oh this this is for professional comedians so everyone already knows all the jokes you just say the number and they and they know and and he gets to the front and he says i'm going to try this i'm 20 and no one laughs and and he's like what did i do wrong he said it's really all about the delivery so i i have this this terrible notion i know it's terrible but i have this notion that you go to arusha you know someone says okay okay the basil levy what a basil lady okay okay inviter but can you tell me what it what it looks like what it feels like at your seder how do you how do you keep people engaged is it new every year is it different how do you prepare again i don't know maybe in great rush yeshiva's houses you know they say that sam so fair the first time that his son-in-law uh was going to be at the seder with him they um they said you can't look at the sphere at the seder you can't look at the the samsung he's like what are you talking about he says you can't look at the share of the seder they're like he's like i don't know what you're talking about see he comes you know the night that samson goes into a study before the seder he comes out and is kittle and his face is on fire his face is bright his face is lit up he couldn't look at the chairs like remotion sofa some silver was like moshe vader come down from rc night so i don't know what some sophie did to prepare for the seder but you know we're all um driving for that i have you know maybe the great rush yeshiva have the seder always run smoothly and perfectly and inspirational the brisker of says it's the hardest mission of the year high of ottomars is awesome yesterday so we try our best and i try just as much as everybody else but um i don't know little things again i i'm always trying to look for um different ideas again depending on the ages of the kids now my kids range from you know mid-20s to 10 and all all in between and uh so the different challenges but for sure uh um giving thought very practical thought beforehand besides during um even the little things as as seating arrangements uh uh who sits where at the say there that's always uh that's always that has to be thought out um i don't sit in my regular spot usually i'm at the head of the table with with everybody around i sit in the middle i said in the middle of the table at the seder i think it's the only time of year so i could be more in the center uh having more kids sitting sitting uh sitting around uh so again thinking who would be good next to which uh which person uh obviously setting the table beforehand um obviously involving as many people as as one can and it depends every seder is different you know last year sata was different depending on which guests you have and if you have guests but uh again preparing as much as can again um you know we we generally again i don't know if you're gonna you're gonna ask about this in terms of uh you know how we say it the debris tore and how it goes but uh the more thought you give uh beforehand and helping the kids prepare just while we're on the topic again i don't know there's a separate question um always um especially the younger kids i always try to help them prepare a game uh before you know to work out um you know one deal we did one of them did headbands one of them uh you know the thing you put the the thing yeah yeah yeah everyone has fun or everybody else has to guess what's on their forehead right whatever it is just just games to try to make it fun for them you know after i i often feel that again maybe as many rabbunam uh out there after spending you know tremendous i mean hopefully efforts on uh ahagadhashir and oshawa sagado russia and you finally come to the say there is you try to inspire everyone else but the rabbi also has to try to be inspired but it's really geared towards the family as much as i can i i talk at the seder but i don't really you know i try to let every everybody else as much talking as possible and um letting everybody uh be more involved and make it make it very experiential you know it's not uh it's not the sheer it's not uh we're not uh the five rabbis in binet brock that are talking to um but we're a family and as many uh you know trying to make it as memorable and as enjoyable as possible you know there are bumps and challenges along the way depending on sibling uh rivalry and sibling um you know regular but uh you hope and prepare and try to psych everybody up as much as possible so that that's fascinating you say you you try to speak as little as possible but i on some level i guess you're the you're you're trying to orchestrate you're the you're the you know the who's that in the orchestra right i i i don't try to prepare i end up talking a lot at the say there but it's not that that's my goal and it's not that i i don't i personally don't prepare as much to say i have to say there i try to encourage everybody who's going to be at the seder we try to give um everybody to prepare at least one paragraph that they're going to talk about so i guess everybody knows at least one time that they're going to have to they know beforehand like we get uh that's me beforehand okay and they own that is that also yeah it'll be their game meaning instead of advertising a game for them whatever it is again different i look online i try to find you know seder games i try to find different uh you know i'm not such a creative uh mind in that way but different you know props and uh going around uh um the house finding 20 different things in a bag and you have to pick one one out and say what it has to do with the seder you know whatever what whatever it is but just everybody knows that's another thing that whether it's tamid and whoever's at the seder everybody knows that this one paragraph that they're gonna have the floor and um you know at least so no not everybody say oh i have something to say about this i have something to say about this again maybe you talk to some of the kids and say what you know there's time at the meal also to have debris torah but at least then everybody knows there's at one point that everybody's going to be listening to them so when also when they you said like the littler kids you have them do games headbands is that tied to a paragraph also or is that like your least virtual norm that's also tied to a paragraph so you encourage them to do a game that's related to the theme of whatever paragraph or right it could be loosely related depending on the age uh you want them to to have fun and and um you know prepare whether it's you know giving out candies to uh they could give out candies to somebody who gets the questions right uh whatever it is to be uh to be involved as much as possible to experiential um you know do things that that are memorable that the the kids know what's coming you know i uh you know walking around by abandonment you knew and and just uh you know certain things one year i had a i had a parole costume that i that i that i that i put on on the head and you know so you just try to make it make it fun as much as uh as much again one has all adults at the same there you know one doesn't have to get maybe you can also i i everybody everybody loves a number of years ago actually i heard it from a friend of mine that did this but i wasn't so popular uh about a year it was a year before corona so we had you know schools have scholars and residents in their shul that's that's often sometimes so in our show we used to have that right in the days of traveling yes so we had ruby akiva once who was a scotland residence on our shoal to be a kiva so i dressed up like gravi aquifer what would it be a keep aware i wore like a turban and a robe and the shabbos was ruby akiva so friday for shabbos morning i told my life story you know you got 30 gemara's very very kiva make get into a story i thought my life story in the afternoon i spoke about the torah verb akiva the different ghazals but they love the dressing up so adults also love dressing up they love the you know it's it's memorable i'm like i could give 10 different sheeran but like they'll remember what i look like there's ruby akiva right so you know the the uh the the the people of the seder you know it's it's an experiential uh ex it's an experience as much as we can and um you know it's not it's not always so simple has to be thought out i can't say everything's always successful uh but as much as one can make it um happy and fun and and to remember it's it's not about uh tell me i've had some meet him over at the you know i usually have you know sometime lead them over those that stay in israel and heritage of pesach this year there's more to say in israel face off uh but um you know try not to have no a few tell me them you know it's also very family oriented but but it's about it's about the family it's about everybody experiencing it's not a sheer haggadah it's not a sheer it's uh just as much about the heart than about the minds um it's the uh the the uh the excitement that one shows you know it starts at the top the parents are into it and are excited and are psyched for it you know it it it uh spills over you know if if a parent is is is more of let's just get this over with and let's just straight up to the misfits and and they didn't prepare as much and they're just exhausted from you know everything beforehand so then you know one has to know exactly what the rest of the people are now are going to feel you know my uh my my children make fun of me i kiss my monsters when i before i have freight them or what are you kissing the monsters for it's uh says it's the only mrda rise of eating that we have is malaza you know the the the virgin you can kiss the esrog now people think it's funny but you know what are you excited about what do you uh you know what do you um you know what do you try it's not just to create memories for the kids but if you feel that you're excited to do to do mitzvos you know sometimes you have to have to show show that excitement they'll only get excited if you're excited you have to show them correct stuff i think all right last week um when he's he's little and he's at rava's seder uh rama pulls the the table this is now we have this thing people pull the tv tray and no one knows another tv tray we pulled the seder plate off and everyone says why are you doing that oh oh so that the children should ask it seems like very self-referential well they did now what but uh in the gemara it's it's almost a beautiful thing he he pulls the seder plate and away says why would you do that and he says meaning that the whole point of manisha the whole point of like all the stick is just to get it doesn't matter what the question is you have to get people asking questions so how do you balance like you're preparing your kids on the one hand how do you give them also a sense of surprise and wonder and asking right so like i said some of the games you try to prepare when this time you know sometimes i've done jeopardy games you know sometimes um you know laid um you know laid uh some questions at the beginning of the say that again depending on the age uh but they you know always have giving out candies and taffys to the kids that could eat at that uh at that age um you know it's um it's it's just for them it's it's it's to keep them excited to get inspired again it's it's you know to get them to ask questions once the older kids it's you know are older and other people at the table they're asking different kinds of questions i think the younger kids are they know what to expect somewhat so it's more of just keeping them interested keeping them excited about for what's to come um and um you know um trying to get them not to fall asleep and if they're you know the that also you know if they could take a nap beforehand that's also a mitzvah some postcards say that this year with their pastor even though the mr bureau usually says you're not supposed to say i'm sleeping now so i could be up on mosey shabbos but that's the zil's a little shabbos so some say now it's the mitzvah it's a sore mitzvah so therefore one can't say that but whatever one holds together you have to try to uh to get some sleep beforehand um but it's um it's a challenge i can't say every parent every grandparent knows uh it's a challenge for the different ages but again like the more you know to err on the side of of fun and and experiential and games but you know sometimes the older people in the family don't want it they don't want to they want more content also uh but there will be time for content throughout has to be uh mixed uh mixed you know through letting them talk obviously is uh is something uh crucial uh but again different parts of the seder have different uh memories i mean just uh just i don't know if you're gonna talk about this but um at least at our seder we the the singing after the meal is is very special you know we try to get uh songs that are song it's it's um again there's some songs that everybody sings and uh and others but um you know the second half after after the meal there's uh there's there's so many songs and the more people that are into it uh the greater experience it is we go outside by uh by the sun you know we dance in the street you know the neighbors are usually out a little before little afters we usually have uh you know i don't know corona friendly circle the past year but um but it also wakes everybody up you go out into the night air um and some people don't want to come you schlep them outside no dancing with the man the women everybody everybody should come outside and uh and and be revived and feel alive and then you come back in and uh you know it's not uh you know it shouldn't be rushed again it shouldn't be dragged out it's late but it uh it shouldn't be rushed against us is important that's that's what we should usually try to most years we make it uh but again there's different situations and you want us to uh try to try to make it the you know the the the more people that are involved like i said some people are singing families some are not so somebody's not a seeking family you know one can't you know it's more challenging but but uh as much as one can do there are so many beautiful well of halal and all the the songs at the end you know everybody together is really something very special people who are watching this now and are like biting their nails that i should have started the headbands i should have ordered it already three weeks ago what am i thinking no all of these things could be done in a day headbands first of all you go to the store we have the old headbands game so you make your own and you don't even have to do that you just uh you know figure something you you get a hat you get a hat and you stick it in the the uh the thing of the hat you pick up ten you know make ten words you know and uh some of them harder some of them you know uh easier or again the macos obviously we have these little all the matches everybody gets a maca one of the one of the puppets on their fingers or or actually we have this bag of frogs of of other things so every again the more the more involved uh one could be uh the better and and and the mitzvos you know one should um you know be my hobby of the mitzvos when one is uh one is eating it one shouldn't be oh the matzah is so heavy so much okay okay joke around but you know just enjoy uh we also try to have um some type of special food in the meal you know last year we had last year my daughters made poppers you know we had poppers and i was like oh amazing i can't wait can't wait so special food also you know keeps kids uh excited about it and and um you know in that way it just makes things special and as much as one uh as much as one could do again it's uh i'll tell you every year you have to think about it more what else what can i add to this year what could i do what worked in the past what didn't work um you know so we try our best we try our best and and uh see after the shimaya the other schmidt to try to give everybody a good feeling um and um you know everybody should make sure also when the kids go to sleep everybody all the adults involved should make sure to stay and clean up and uh not to let it uh fall on on one one person uh at that time no matter um you know i i usually try my father my father is a holy jew and he only i remember growing up he always stayed up and said she rashir me after the uh the after the say there i always try i i clean up i everything i finish everything if i after that i'm done you know it's um i try to make it through cherisher and i say it's either share share my chakras you know so you know i usually uh overrides the uh the minha and i usually go to sleep but uh one year i'll get through shirashiro one year alicia just uh please but one thing i thought of it just like i told me dim over at the say there it also gives an opportunity for a rebbe or for other parents to to show what a family means and to show how to relate to our wife and kids and to show um you know how the integration works um and allows talmud to see a rebbe in a different way to see a rebbe as a father to see a rebbe as a husband which i think is important for tamidim to uh to see because tamidim shouldn't only see their rebbe as a teacher of torah but they should know that he's a husband that he's a father and that's also uh if it's possible to if one has single boys girls over and it's an opportunity to show you know uh how a healthy relationship is um is conducted in a spiritual way so that's also something that i think is uh is a good take-home message um if one could give that to their guests so much more to someone more to ask and so much more to say but i've uh i i feel like we've all gained so much from uh these little pearls of wisdom what is there one last pro tip that you want to share no not no no we try our best but again the the the more that we could think about it beforehand the better the more that we could do shabbos also it's not just for the say there every shop is meal you know there's uh there are so many shabbos books out there are the the the inhibit though the what if questions people like to do the same the what if whether the haram knows in english and they could do it in hebrew that they have ones for kids also called um you could do the test malachi's book there are so many things that that we could uh use to bring to our shabbos table just it's just the parents have somebody has to take some time beforehand not to like come to the table and and then start looking for our torah looking for something at the table because you know that's that's 32 late one comes and right after khala you know one ask the question or one's it's not just about the the shabbos sheets and the shabbos that have to be asked by the child one should do that maybe that's best not to do that at the table sometimes at the table it depends on what the other kids are doing at that time but it's uh the preparation is not just for the say there it's for the seder but it's for every shabbos and young meal the more we prepare the more um and regular rates are also the more we prepare the more we we think about what would keep the kids interested and i just say personally some kids are more interested and some are less interested and we try our best uh but you know as much as we could do you know we um the more we put into it the more we have a chance of getting something out of it and this after the shema we should all uh be able to have successful shabbos meals yanta meals and barakah mashem gives us many chances and if one wasn't so successful there's always another one and if you have even more right you know we're blessing ourselves so many uh makeup opportunities that's all right right um if i'm gonna say such a thing rabbi rozzer thank you so much for for your time you should have a lifting kusher hiroshika thank you so much and continue your evolution