#145: Behind the Bima - Ari Harow

from bartone Florida this is behind the beima on this episode Rabbi Goldberg and co-hosts Rabbi Philip MTZ and Rabbi Josh Brody are joined by Ari Harrow former adviser and chief of staff to Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu Ari discusses his experiences working alongside the Prime Minister provides insights into key moments during his tenure and shares thoughts on current events don't miss this engaging conversation filled with personal anecdotes expert analysis and Reflections on Israel's recent history all this and more behind the Bea welcome to the newest episode of behind the beima privileged honored grateful to be joined by my dear friends and colleagues Rabbi Philip mosquit and Rabbi Josh Brody we got a great guest great conversation I had this one alone when I was in Israel recently with Ari Harrow we'll introduce uh as we bring him on or that interview but I recorded it also in Dau I was telling Rabbi moscot and Rabbi bro about it Dau is a studio in modin my sister is involved in you can rent it out to record podcasts and they'll produce the whole thing publish it for you it's a incredible Studio great people really easy and grateful for them so if you've ever wanted to try you want to interview one time only you want to interview your Zeta and get his story on record or you want to record with your friends or it's a goof for somebody's birthday you want to do it regularly or just one time Dau in modan is a maybe I'll go my next trip I'll go interview your sister with you talk about it's it's the behind the Bea satellite in Israel so either either one of you whenever of us are in Israel grab someone go to the duu studio and and record get something on there very good we have to go together to record well listen we're in you know we spoke about wrote about recently it's hard to not go to Israel right now for some people it's hard to go to Israel some part of people it's hard to not be in Israel right now go back as off we got job responsibility obligations but to go back as often as we can that is that is the plan how are the two of you doing Robbie mosquit had a very busy week he did incredible event at the sh Rabbi talked to us about yeah we had a uh we had a very meaningful Tor on Sunday that was a that was um made in memory of SD and um you know every Goldberg you know I was uh I was very nervous about it beforehand obviously very complex emotions very mixed emotions and I wasn't really sure how exactly the day was going to play out how I would react how the community was you know it could have gone a lot of different ways but one thing I can say it was it was extraordinarily meaningful I thought it was very inspiring and and there was a real tangible palpable sense of kadua in the room almost an Indescribable kadua you know way in even outside on the way in for the 20 minutes that you're escorting it that outside as well it it was just it was very befitting and I also found it was just it was an enormous kides hasem there were a lot of people there that that weren't as religious um you know guests that we had invited and each one of them I received the most beautiful texts caused them to think about life the meaning of life the connection to Torah the values that they live by what are they passing On to the Next Generation Um and that was definitely gratifying you know it definitely was uh mixed emotions uh Bittersweet I don't even think touches it but I would say like painful and beautiful at the same time um but uh I I felt I really felt a real strong sense of gadha and I felt we did it justice because STD deserves the best and I I felt Sunday really was the best you did you know I will tell you having been there and and been up front there that you did it was that it was that Duality and that balance between being festive it's Torah it's a new Torah it was greeted by the toras and danced with the toras and and a festive atmosphere and a Time cats was incredible also and and I know you designed all of it pivoting it to to a kumzits and also be reflective and introspective and and to be in memory of EST and to be uplifting her Nish and so it was that balance of like ruts of aov you know excitement pump off festive to a little calmer reflective and and in memory and it was it wasn't Rabbi bro you you commented afterwards it felt like a Nila you know there we're lucky if you have one Nila a year sometimes you have Nila moments during the year but you said and and and the three of us have been people don't believe how close we really are that was one of the comments I got afterwards when you spoke so kindly about me or people heard what I say like that we that that relationship is real not only on on behind the Bea online but much more even offline the three of us have been so many places so many circumstances so many things but when we were arms around each other dancing to that Aron with with the estd Torah with estd there RAB bro you comment like how emotional and it was for you like an ELO why did you say that what did that mean to you so first of all there are many times we've taken photos the three of us together and I can tell you that usually I'm the one that's messing up the photo just because we don't talk about what we're going to do in the photo we were in Israel recently and it was like no one gave me the the memo that it was a serious moment that whatever we were at and the two of you were looking very serious and I got this big goofy smile on but you can't redo the photo it's we just took the photo and then someone I guess sent rabbe Moscow it's the photo we just happened to be uh I guess escorting the Torah into the into the shul and then all of us we just happen to have our eyes closed and I think that was really a significant uh moment just because that's the reaction it's like you just felt something you couldn't see it but you could feel and yeah and I'll tell you you know I've gotten other pictures also and in almost every single picture everyone has their eyes closed people are like you you could sense it just on the looks of people's faces there's almost this like Angelic glow on people's faces with their eyes closed but to me you hit upon this um the most powerful moment was the most unscripted one was what at the end Aon cats transitioned from a slower more kumit feel to a slightly more festive feel at the end and you and I kind of look at each other Abbi go we're we knew that he wanted us to dance Aton wanted us to dance but no one really knew what I wanted I didn't know what I wanted and you know we got up and we were about to dance and I said to you I said do you mind if we open up the Aron and you said of course and we ended up opening up the Aron and it started off with Miu and Moshe and then rabie Brody you joined and then rabie newberger joined and then before you knew it like the beim was full of people in the most dignified and respectful way dancing with respect for the Torah and uh it was totally unscripted and it was the most beautiful moment for person it was because it wasn't like the torah's now in the Aron and now we have SIM dancing in a circle somewhere else it was just you know going like in a line to and from the Aron two and from the Aron like people dance in front of a and kala it was dancing in front of's Torah the Torah and it was it was again that balance and the music was fast but the dancing was was intentional and to the Torah honoring the Torah lifting the Torah lifting EST it was it was one of the most extraordinary days but maybe that for me personally that was the Nila moment where I know you handed out cards or maybe people had things that they were doing for at your home when you're finishing the the letters and at that moment it was kind of like uh you know I wouldn't call it scripted but like it's like okay that's what some people do other people aren't feeling it but when we're in front of the YN I don't know about you but I was it wasn't just singing it was doing it was it was doing like never before more than because again to Eli it's like you want to feel it but sometimes you just don't right here you were just overcome by whatever the emotion was and you're like well what do you do in that moment so you're doin yeah yeah again thank you guys and and obviously I I appreciate all the love and he definitely felt a lot of support in the room which was which was very meaningful for me and um you know you guys also saw at the end a lot of people didn't know this but at the end um I noticed that the quarter my eye towards the women's section there was a sat there and I went over and uh many people don't know the story behind this and maybe we'll have him on behind the beam at some point because he is a special special Jew but uh a dear friend of mine ASAT mariva from London who recently lost his daughter as well made uh surprised me and came in for the for Torah and it was unbelievable that just to see him there and and he spoke a little bit afterwards and just to hear the the love that he has for me and that I have for him and um it's really beautiful and you know there are certain things that transcend how a person looks in the background that a person has or even the language that they speaks his you know his mother language is yish and mine is obviously not and um there's just there's a certain there's a certain connection that you're able to develop with people that is so meaningful and so transformative and it was very very meaningful that he was there with us that day as well when I saw him I said wow I can't I can't believe you're here and he looked at me like surprised why would you be surprised even though he was in SCH he said to me he said Mas I spent eight months in in the hospital together and in the hospital every day is a year so we spent eight years together eight really deep powerful painful years together of course I'm here just even expressing that like one day in the hospital is a whole year for people who haven't been in that situation it's it's eye opening and it's a tiny Glimpse it's nothing but but a little bit but those those connections are the the deepest and the most real and it meant the world to you but anyone who loves you meant the world to us too just to to see him there yeah not sure my family EX knew what to do with him when he spoke and he called me his brother and called me his Elio Anvi my family was kind of like like who is this Sid who feel so close to to Phil but that was part of the kesem part of the kides AEM was helping people realize exactly that that like those connections that you make along this journey that you don't know why you end up in places that you do but the people that you meet and the connections that you make and the share the stories that you share um they they're deep and they're real and they're genuine and they're sincere and they're Everlasting and I think it was a big Kish hasem for people to see that as well you know to zoom out that lens for a minute and and really Bry what you're working on what you work on all the time is is yeah in any other world the SAT and the mus of yes University you know you probably described yourself as a proud Zionist wouldn't necessarily have that closeness that friendship there's no reason couldn't but it probably wouldn't and and you see that sometimes it takes those times to be able to peel back those those layers or those barriers and that's I think what's happening with am just right now in general is the October 6 things that kept us apart as October 8th those barriers those walls have come down and the connection You Know reab M you and I met yesterday Ellie P the owner of mishak magazine mishak magazine much bigger and more he's has a k Think Tank Institute and he's involved in so many Cutting Edge important things happening in Israel we were talking with him about that yesterday how in Israel so many of those walls have come crumbling down and and that doesn't mean the differences aren't still there they're there and they're there strongly and vociferously but you realize in those moments of Crisis how how much more you have in common that separates you and how much stronger you are when you're together than you are apart and like Brody that's you're you're working all the time to leverage model we're working on that was there was there something that happened at the at the uh tour dedication like you said you kind of had an idea what would happen not really sure what will actually happen was there something that ended up happening that that that just uh you you know you're kind of happy it it it happened you know was there something yeah again I think that moment at the end with the Aron I think obviously you know Aon C graciously um flew down for the day to be there together with us and um I didn't know how that would work either you knowon kept on asking me what my vision was and I kind of said I don't have a vision my vision is you you know I said if there's I don't trust anyone to do this other than you like you are the guy who I really trust is g to find that balance of emotions you'll be in the moment and you'll figure out exactly what we need and and he hit it every time even to the last song when he went to it was like such a beautiful fitting appropriate conclusion to the Torah none of it was scripted and and if you asked me in advance and again or by Goldberg knows because I was I was a nervous person and I really didn't know how it would be and I was very nervous that it would become too festive and you know and and that could also set us off and I was really nervous about that but Aton hit every note perfect and you know just back to what you said RAB Goldberg and rabie Brody what you're working on you know you spoke about the connection that I have with the marash Shiva and and how you know we're able to to go above those in certain moments what he spoke about and what he's 100% right about it wasn't just like oh you're a Jew I'm a Jew he and I connected over Torah like we have a Common Language with Jews around the world and that is Torah and he and I were able to share di Torah we're able to share thoughts we're able to share inspiration we were able to give each other and strength and that supersedes anything that you look like on the outside like if you have a connection to a Timeless Tor something that has kept the Jewish people going for 3,000 years during the most horrific Exiles and persecutions and oppressions and and Crusades like we have that tool and the fact that he and I every Friday and multiple times during the week we're able to share Torah thoughts and Torah insights and to each other like that transcends anything else it's the beauty of dafi right why does dhomi work is because RAB Gober you can get on a phone with any je around the world who did the do today and have a common shared language with them and that's something that I think people who don't have that who were there on Sunday were writing to me that that they almost like felt jealous of they felt they they wanted that it touched something inside of them that said like I need that language that I'm able to tap into in moments of difficulty that allow me to transcend what it is that I'm going to to be able to connect with people on a deeper level beyond the superficiality um something that's bigger than myself and that was something that was very powerful only we had a program that brought Jews together through that ched language of Torah only just took some notes there on what you just said only common language Timeless Torah you'll be able to rewatch that yeah you might you you might see that in a few places now it is a great it is a great program that you are that you are running I had the privilege this week to interview Ari Harrow who was born in America he's a fellow uh I think Boston oh no he was born and raised in Los Angeles I'm sorry I'm thinking about our beloved we know we know a lot of haros but then he served in the the age of 12 his family moved to Israel in 1985 he served in the Golani Brigade and then he came to the US to study at Brooklyn College and earned a degree in political science Tel Aviv University and he ran americ friends of leud from 2003 to 2006 and he started working for Benjamin Netanyahu and ultimately became the chief of staff to the prime minister of Israel during some very very uh powerful moments the three boys were kidnapped and the war in Gaza he was the chief of staff to the Prime Minister and that's what we talk about in this conversation his front row seat to making some of those decisions those impossible decisions that are being made right now hostage release deals do you go in do you risk soldiers lives what did he see what did he learned those are some of the things that we talked about I'm really grateful to him grateful to Dau studios in modian Israel and I'm super grateful to both of you there's nothing like when the three of us are together and back on behind the beima which is amazing and we know we have some upcoming incredible guests and conversations that we're going to be having and sharing and bringing so thank you RAB mcats for sharing I know that's not easy to talk anything estd but to talk about that Torah dedication it's it's important and it it inspires all of us so thank you for that and RAB bro always for all that you do without any further Ado Ari Harrow Ari Hara thank you for letting us go behind the Bea spending some time together this is our first time here in Israel in person behind the beam is usually online but taking advantage of this opportunity and didn't want to miss this opportunity with your new book literally just out my brother's keeper which tells the story of your role as the chief of staff of prime minister Netanyahu in 2014 2015 none of us can ever forget the Abduction of the three boys and the large man hunt to find them and the ensuing Gaza war and to understand that better and apply it to today we're so grateful thank you for letting us go behind the beo thank you for having me Rabbi it's a pleasure to be here and it's a pleasure to see you here in Israel it's great much better to be here to meet here than anywhere else and I add you to the list of of Harrow I'm privileged to know of course all the eve and and Kan our neighbor and Gabby and what a family that are connected to Israel and doing so much to Israel so much for you to be proud of so we'll go back and I want to talk about your your childhood in LA and what inspired you and 12 years old when your family came here and serving in in the Army and therefore appreciating what our soldiers are doing today we'll go back and do all that but let's fast forward right to today as you're watching things unfold and you're no longer in that position is it hard to feel that you're not having access to the same intelligence the same briefings do you question they should do that differently I wish I were there I wish I was able to give them this advice or to be this sounding board or to tell them to think about doing that differently so I think that there is uh a very prevalent feeling uh amongst all Israelis that they want to do something more and those that are serving those that are in Gaza those that are serving up north and elsewhere obviously are are paying a personal price they've left their jobs they've left their families um but every Israeli that I know every home looks for ways to contribute during a period like this and I'm no different from that perspective um obviously having come out of the governmental system out of Politics the desire to impact uh on that level is is definitely there um and I'm trying to find my way um to have an impact even though I'm not in the office anymore right and watching from the sidelines I I always think about in America the president the day after they leave office the swearing in of the next president that that radical transition from knowing the nuclear codes the finger on the button having all the briefings knowing everything to just being an ordinary civilian what was that like from being the chief of staff of the Prime Minister who I assume has clearance and access access to everything to becoming a civilian and in this war being on the sidelines of course you're finding your way and will and do make your contributions but just personally speaking what's that like what's that like I I you know for me personally I think there was a realization and I I actually said this to the prime minister at the time I said everybody leaves the prime minister's office including the Prime Minister it's just a question of when and how and for me um I served when I could I I did what I could to contribute the country to the country I I continue to look for ways to contribute to the country um but uh it was an amazing period in my life um and I'm grateful that I had it um but um it was time to move on understood so the book and its timeliness obviously you wrote it before October 7th October 7th really just made it even that more important to tell that story but also to extract and learn the lessons for for today did you hesitate to put it out now given what's going on did you feel like you wanted to write a whole new new set of chapters to it to to update it based on what's Happening Now there there's no question I mean first of all it took me there was a little bit of a of of a delay on on my front to recognizing how relevant and how important the book was going to be I mean obviously all of us here in Israel on the morning of October 7th um so I I personally woke up um very early um I don't know if if your family here had the same experience but I heard the explosions overhead of the of the rocket fire it was a Shabbat morning it was hog and I went outside and initially thought okay you know this is out of out of the ordinary but it does happen every so often it took a little bit of time and when we were in SCH that morning um U my daughter uh who was serving uh up in the north was called and had to go into uh back into the army and SL but surely the minion sort of um dissipated as everyone had to go do what they had to do um it took probably at least a week for me to internalize that uh the book would have such relevance today and as such there's no question that there's certain things that I would have loved to have added to it uh maybe uh Focus the the title a little bit more but uh ultimately I think that it is a tremendous uh road map to how we got here um and there's a lot of lessons that can be learned from what happened in the past yeah so tell us a little bit about what people don't appreciate the theme of the book The Essence of the book and and the lessons for today you know we were talking right before we started that I experien this in the tiniest way as just a Rabbi of a community that everybody at their shabas table has all the answers for everything everything's black and white everything has a simple solution everything is clear what you should do and when you get in the seat behind the desk and you know what others don't know and you can see the consequences and you feel the weight of the responsibility of the decision making so what don't people appreciate go back to when the three boys were were taken and that Manhunt and the uncertainty or maybe what you and what the Prime Minister already already knew long before anybody else knew and and its applications for for today there's so many different lessons um I think that number one is that events don't just happen uh I mean October 7th clearly uh surprised everybody but the finger on the pulse of Israel's intelligence services and Israel's defense Services is always active and as such the Prime Minister spends a significant amount of his time on security and defense issues I would say it's by far uh the most timec consuming responsibility that the Prime Minister has and as such when events do take place it's not a complete shock and you know who the players are and you know what your response in in in general is going to be uh what people at home probably are not as familiar with is the fact that every decision is extremely complex not in the debate whether you should or shouldn't be doing doing something but the intricacies that tie it into so many other different facets of decision making that the person at home uh is not aware of so for example um you know take one of the issues that's being debated in Israel today which is uh the attempt to free uh the hostages that are currently being held by Hamas everybody in Israel wants them home but what type of deal do you move ahead with is a very big question and a lot you know it's a very complex issue that uh that that that is you know that that's on the table right now let me ask you about that I'll interrupt you for one second because you know just watching not from the sidelines obviously we care deeply and passionately but but watching um I wonder does the Prime Minister and his staff the more that they really feel it personally the more they get to know who the hostages are the more they meet with the family the more it pulls on their heartstrings then the more compelled they'll feel to go fight to bring them home to do what it takes to take necessary steps that's the upside the downside is the more emotional they get the more emotional the decision-making could be and that may not be what's best for the country as a whole so does that go into the mindset of the Prime Minister and the staff let's be involved let's be invested let's connect with the family but we also need to insulate to a certain degree and we need to how do how do you keep emotions in check how do you not feel that plight because a parents job a parent's job is to go to the ends of the Earth to move Heaven and Earth to do whatever it takes to bring a child home but that's not the prim Minister's job the prime minister's job is strategically do what's right for the country so you want a prime minister who feels and who emotes and a staff and a chief of staff but you don't want them to have too much emotion that they're not making the right decisions so how how does one navigate that I think that that's one of the great complexities of any leadership position and even more so in the state of Israel where it's a country where everybody does know everybody where everybody serves in the military where everybody's affected by every decision on a personal level on an emotional level and it's not just a decision that's taken in a vacuum I'll share one story that I that I talk about in the book um and that was the moment that the Prime Minister was notified uh that the bodies of the three teenagers were found um so uh what ended up happening is that the the head of the shinb at the time yoram Kon came to military headquarters in Tel Aviv where the Prime Minister was sitting uh during the war and um he comes in uh alone needed that moment alone to tell him the Prime Minister called us in his senior staff to update us and after he updated us he said okay guys I need a I need a minute alone and everybody stood up and started walking out of the room and I was the last person um to uh exit the room and he uh called out my name and asked me to come back in so I was sitting with him alone in the room and I mean I'm I get emotional even thinking about it he turned to me and he said Ari I have a son pretty much the same age and he got emotional and this is the prime minister of Israel right this isn't this wasn't some event that took place and you know he's making his decisions that were completely disconnected from what the country was feeling he's part of that country uh no matter what your feelings are uh about this prime minister any prime minister uh I think that it's a very tough balance that Israeli leaders have tough and we shouldn't envy that position to to be behind that desk and to have to make those decisions um you know interesting one of the slogans that's come out for the hostages have been bring them home and my mother's when I first pointed it out to me it's really it's a terrible slogan um because the the burden shouldn't be on Israel bring them home as if anybody is hesitating or doesn't want to the real slogan should be let my people go or let them out or let them free and so the pressure seems to be in the wrong direction and and the families of course we can't begin to imagine and we're right by their side and like they we want their their families home but how how do how does leadership make that decision about what what price do you pay is is are the hostages lives more valuable than the soldiers who who are giving their lives it's it's very difficult I think firstly from a historical perspective the country of Israel the nation of Israel is scarred by the ronad uh uh you know uh story that took place the fact that we sort of knew where where he was there was some intelligence for a year or two or three and then he disappeared off the face of the planet has left a very deep mark on Israeli society and as such the fear that we will never hear from these hostages again has driven families not just now this happened in the past if you remember in Lebanon it was uh regiv and goldwaser uh Shalit and Gaza where the parents and the families have taken their plight and their fight public in order to make sure that it doesn't disappear off the uh public radar so I think that that's part of where it comes from uh as far as you know the price that needs to be paid you're 100% right that the leadership ultimately needs to do what's best for the country and there are prices that no leadership in Israel would pay having said that um there there is there is a difference in the current situation and the current story and that is that many of these uh you know hostages are civilians that were taken from their home on a Saturday morning uh these are not soldiers who you know were captured in the line of duty these are people who the state of Israel failed in protecting and as such the responsibility of the leadership is much greater than past events an interesting perspective I thought about that do you think the fact that senoir who was the the person who who choreographed all this atrocity was released in the shal deal does that inform any of the Israeli Public's approach or the prime minister's office because you know when you think about what it took to bring a soldier back and of course his life is invaluable as it is of every human being every Jew and gilich deserved to be brought back but the price that was paid was 1,200 on October 7th and and a war Beyond because sinir was one of the P that people that released is that at the Forefront of people's minds in this there's no question that that is one of the points that is raised uh in the public debate in Israel um I shared with one of the leading journalists uh a few weeks ago who reached out to me what because it was ultimately prime minister Netanyahu who's the current prime minister that uh that released those uh those you know those murderers those uh those uh prisoners and Netanyahu initially Rose to fame based on his Doctrine for dealing with terrorism he wrote a number of books right it was after his brother was killed in inbi um and that truly is what propelled him into public life uh it was mosha aens who first recognized him brought him into the embassy in in Washington and and the rest is history but uh his you know his purpose in entering the world of public uh service was based on a doctrine of being tough uh in dealing with terrorists and he said to me before the Shalit deal that there was something different about this deal and mind you most of his senior staff at the time opposed the shal deal and his base his political base in Israel uh overwhelmingly opposed it as well um but he felt that and he tied everything really into the Iranian nuclear threat uh the possibility that Israel was going to strike against Iran and the possibility that we may send pilots and other soldiers to to fight that fight so far away that he wanted to send a message that no matter what happens we will do everything we can to bring you home it was more of a psychological message for the next generation of Fighters and less about the actual deal itself yeah which is interesting because that morale Cuts both ways right you increase the morale by saying no matter what happens to you we're going to bring you home and we also might hurt your morale when we say that we're going to risk your lives and go into a war when we may not even successfully be able to bring people home so it can kind of cut both ways the morale question and when you potentially lose soldiers capturing those prisoners that you're releasing um so there's no question that it's a very complex issue um you know it's funny how history has reversed Israel's role in in dealing with hostages we all remember and TBI and other attempts Sabina Etc where Israel would not negotiate and Israel would act militarily to try and uh release hostages uh and now we're on the Forefront of negotiating uh to release them but the situation now is unprecedented in Israel's history and probably in the history of the world let's pivot one of the focuses of the new book is the relationship or difficult relationship between BB and Obama at the time I actually as a small Rabbi in Florida just because we are a swing state that w we were at one point our votes matter I was invited to several meetings at the White House with Obama staff and with himself during that difficult time they were trying to do some damage control with the with the American Jewish Community um the lessons we extract from that for today in terms of the importance of keeping America happy do people grossly underestimate in Israel not only the military aid not only the military superiority not only the billions of dollars that enable us to replenish the the thousands countless bombs that have been used that seem to be slowing down and and wonder why that is maybe for this very reason but the diplomacy you know colleague of yours Ron durmer was in bokeh a couple years ago and and and was saying over over dinner that people know the aid packages they know the money but the diplomacy behind closed doors that people don't know about is even more valuable and it's even we can't risk it it's even more important you know when when when America on Israel's behalf will call another country and say you know you do that we're pulling this or you don't even think about doing that Israel benefits from that in ways that we don't begin to appreciate so how important is it to keep America happy because there is a little bit of a macho attitude that says Israel is independent Israel is thriving Israel is a startup Nation Israel's listed on the NASDAQ Israel invented all the wonderful we don't need them anymore who cares do what we have to what difference does it make how important is it to keep the whoever the American president administration at the time is happy well I don't know if happy is the right word and I think that um there's no question that if you look back at Nan's years in office and Ron durmer who's a very close friend and and is is a tremendous um uh asset for the state of Israel um if you look at the years that netan dealt with Clinton and then in the Obama years the relationship between the prime minister's office and the White House was not was not great um the US presidents were not that happy so while the diplomacy and the relationship and the access is extremely important ultimately the state of Israel when they live by uh our virtues and values uh those are respected by the White House um you know one of the stories that I like to share um is when um you know President George W bush writes about it in his autobiography how um Israel Israeli intelligence uh found the nuclear reactor in Syria and shared that intelligence with the United States and Israel tried to put pressure on the United States to deal with the reactor um which uh culminated with prime minister olmer at the time calling President Bush and act asking them to act uh President Bush responded that they were not going to act militarily and they're going to try and deal with it in diplomatic uh through diplomatic Chann channels uh said okay well thank you for taking the call and 2 weeks later Israel bombed the Syrian nuclear reactor in his autobiography President Bush says that it was his most proud Mo moment as a supporter of Israel the fact that Israel did what they had to do to protect their citizens even though he said that he was charting a different course so I think that it's important to manage that relationship it's important to remind our friends and our supporters that we share the same value uh that we have the same goals um but we do live in a region that we understand a little bit better than those that don't live here not just the United States and I think that most US presidents respect uh a leadership that's able to tell them where our red lines are so it is a balance the relationship is important but we need to be able to stand up for what we believe in if the Obama BB relationship was frigid cold how would you rate the Biden BB relationship how do how would you rate what the administration in America is doing right now over the last three and a half months four months during this war so uh because we're entering a you know an election season in the US I don't want to get too political on the on the US front but I do think that the first the first couple months uh the the White House and President Biden's support for Israel were tremendous um and it was felt by all Israelis from right to left um you know not only did he come out very publicly and very clear where his support was he flew to Israel which is unprecedented unprecedented during a time of War um and there was no you know fictitious balance in his statements to try and appease uh anyone else uh I think that this has been a very clear cut from his perspective I understand the pressures that he's under within his party uh from other members of the International Community and as such we're starting to see uh that that support slip um but that that's to be expected um I don't think that anyone in the prime minister's office office uh is complaining about the attitude and the approach that we've received from the United States Administration just come back to you spoke about how we attacked Syria even America took a different route but how important is that relationship if Israel is it even a possibility right let's get this out there for the people listening if Israel ever decided you know what we don't care we don't care about their opinion we don't care about world opinion we're going to take care of ourselves even if it means we'll lose diplomatic support Military Support financial support is Israel in a position to do that no uh I 100% not um we do live in a global society America is our closest Ally our greatest friend and a beacon of light and democracy to the world and that's where we want to tie our horse to um I don't think that that is a consideration that any Israeli government has ever seriously um contemplated I think that prior to the foundation of the state David benon had uh a path to choose uh and he chose the western United States orbit and that's the path that we're we have stuck to and we're going to continue to stick to just because we share values and we we share ideals um as such it is very important as you stated before to maintain that relationship to have an open line of communication our work within Congress is very very important one thing that prime minister netan has tapped into extensively more so than any other Israeli leader is a deep understanding on what drives the United States leadership as opposed to many other countries including Israel the United States is not centrally uh you know the power is not uh doesn't reside in one central place Congress uh does have tremendous influence the public and the media have tremendous influence uh the pro-israel community has tremendo tremendous influence and as such he has spent a lot of time developing and nurturing the relationships with each of those uh Avenues and not focus just uh exclusively on the White House I remember APAC policy conference you probably were there when the Prime Minister spoke and BDS was really a threat and a danger at the time and a lot of people were very focused on it and the Prime Minister got up and he boldly of course encouraged combatting it standing up to it but basically said the technology The Innovation everything coming out of Israel BDS won't and can't be successful because nobody's going to hurt themselves for a cause that isn't that important for them and that's born out in many ways right so is probably guides even now that it's important to hear our allies listen to them consider them work with them but in the end of the day as long as we continue to produce innovation technology and strategically are in their interest in the region nobody's going to walk away or abandon Israel I can completely agree um and I and I do think that it goes beyond the economics and Beyond the technology we really what's happening here really is a preview of The Clash between you know I don't want to I you know I guess we can call it the clash of civilizations really between Western liberal societies and others uh dictatorships radical Islam Etc and Hamas is a proxy of Iran Iran has these proxies around the region and around the world there are other countries who have developed strong bonds with Iran that are extremely Troublesome not just to Israel but to the global society and you see what's happening in the Red Sea with the with the houis out of out of Yemen uh that's just an example Le of where the world is heading and the Coalition of the just and the Coalition of the moral is a coalition that Israel has to be a member of and at the same time the International Community that that that defines themselves as part of that group has to welcome Israel as well why did Israel participate in this ridiculous trial in in in the ha of Isel said genocide are you kidding me we're not even going to honor it by by participating and responding why did they have to show up well I I think that there are international ramifications to not participating and as as you started our discussion touching on there are a lot of complexities with any International issue and all International fronts uh the legal front is one of the battlefields that Israel finds itself uh you know playing a very active role in and it's something that we can't just walk away and and and abandon having said that I completely agree that the the the stain the you know the really the disgust is on the rest of the world for even you know uttering the word genocide when it comes to an Israeli people who are more careful in protecting Palestinian lives than the Hamas is themselves yeah it's it's beyond disturbing and the News out of unra about the seven employees were part of the October 7th and yet the administration in America simultaneous ly is withdrawing funding from unra but also saying that unra has to be involved in whoever will oversee Gaza in in the future and it's sometimes so so maddening how the world doesn't get it doesn't see it doesn't understand it no matter how much Israel has proven through videos and through the data that we found the weapons underneath the hospitals in schools un was aware un were complicit un were more than complicit they were accomplices as as was proven now with unra and yet you know don't defund the police and America defund the UN it's like absurd and should be replaced with some more meaningful body that's got to be incredibly frustrating no question no question you know the the the the Mantra in Israel or the terminology that's used here in Israel is you know that's an O October 6th mentality we're now you know October 8th and and and onwards um and that has not seeped in to the United States or to the rest of the International Community yet um unfortunately it will uh we hope it doesn't uh we're praying that it doesn't we're doing our part to make sure that it doesn't but if the West doesn't recognize that the the challenges are such that you can't have it both ways you can't be funding them on one hands and defunding them on the other you can't uh passively uh prove their type of education their actions while at the same time trying to stand with Israel and that's going to be the challenge of Western Civilization moving forward do you see political shifts happening as somebody who was the head of American friends of leud as somebody who was a chief of staff of leud prime minister do you see Israel Moving significantly to the right do you think I could tell you from outside of Israel um particularly outside the Orthodox Community there's been a real crisis for whom so much of their Jewish identity but even politically was with a segment of the liberal Progressive woke I don't want to use those terms unfairly but who on October 7th abandoned the pro-israel community black lives matter and others who turned their back abandoned stabbed prois Israel supporters in the back and it's caused this crisis of people to reassess who are they who are their allies where do they stand do you see the shift in Israel as somebody who's represented the political right worked for the political right is is the Israeli public moving to the right so we're seeing a very interesting phenomena now and that is that uh from a uh ideological perspective from a policy perspective the Israeli population has moved to the right obviously there's many many people who were you know let's call them in the peace camp and after October 7th have changed their views and want to take a different approach moving forward at the same time all the polling since October 7th has shown the right-wing parties's losing uh tremendous support and I think that there's two main reasons for that uh and we'll see how it they play out between now and election day number one is uh that they were in office uh the government that led this country and that ran this country on October 7th was the right-wing and religious government so many of whom ran on on defense and finally confronting terrorism and providing security uh correct and if you look at Prime Minister Netanyahu himself he has you know adopted uh the uh the title of Mr security uh for the last 15 years and yet here we are with the worst tragedy that the state of Israel has seen uh and definitely in in a 24-hour period um so that is something that is extremely damaging uh to the right on the on the political map uh and the and the second is what uh what what preceded the October 7th attacks and that was the tremendous divide that existed here in the country around judicial reform and I think that there is a feeling definitely amongst the soldiers and definitely amongst the reservists that it the issue of judicial reform whether you supported it or against it the fact that we or I should say the leadership allowed uh the society to come to the point where there was serious talk of a Civil War uh is a place that nobody wants to go back to and as such people look at the current leadership and say we need something we need something different so I think that while it's wishful thinking to to assume that all of the current canessa members are going to go home there will be somewhat of a shift you're going to see someone like naftali Bennett who's been out of government for a couple years now or a year and a half um return to the scene and try to be the newcomer um and then there there will be other new players and new initiatives that that uh that that Sprout um one group that I've uh been helping is a group of bereaved uh uh families um people who lost their children their their husbands um on October 7th and in the war in Gaza and um they many of them come from the right side of the political map but they want to see something new they want to see something different and I think that that will have its expression in the next Israeli government when the dust settles we don't know exactly what will turn out one of the powerful stories um in the book I know is of general kavi who in the Gaza War pulled you aside and said AR you got to find a way to end this war and you're right about it wasn't motivated by politics or polls or media but by a military person just looking and it was unclear what the endgame is that it wasn't going anywhere so at some point you got to you got to pull the plug and we got to end the war so taking that that conversation that experience then and and fast forwarding it to now how does this end I mean for you to be watching where you were Chief of Staff of a prime minister when Kamas was a guy how many times are we going to go back to Gaza how many times are we going to pledge this is it we're getting rid of Kamas is that a realistic goal can we get rid of Kamas we can kill thousands of their Fighters try to take out their their leadership but that pernicious terrorist mentality that drive that Doctrine to destroy Israel and Destroy Jews is it even achievable and at what cost and for how long how how will how will they know when it's time to end this war what will signify the end so I'll share another story with you when when Natan was running for prime minister um in uh 2008 2009 he he returned to office after 10 years in uh in March of 2009 and prior to those elections Israel was fighting its first uh battle in go after the disengagement and I traveled down south with then head of the opposition nany and and I asked him just as we were sitting in the car on our ride back home um what would you have done uh what is what what what is happening now that you would do differently and he answered that he would not be sending in ground troops mer did send in ground troops back then he would not send in ground troops without a very clear defined goal that is attainable and achievable and um that returned to the surface again as you said in 2014 and I asked him the same question again and I reminded him that we had this conversation number of years earlier and I said well you know what's your what's your definition of the goal now and and ultimately it was the terror tunnels that had penetrated Israel and Israel in 2014 did send in ground troops for that purpose alone after October 7th um all bets were off and as we all know and as we all see Israel not only did they entered did not only did we enter Gaza but we entered in mass and we've been fighting there ever since uh the goal that was clearly defined at the beginning of this war was the dismantling of Hamas as a political and Military entity to your question IDE ideologies cannot be defeated uh you can't stamp out somebody's belief um so there will be Hamas supporters there will be radicals and extremists in Gaza after we leave they may even have certain military capabilities we're not going to find ourselves um you know as was one streamed uh with the Singapore uh in Gaza but the ability to finish this off is critical uh when I say finish it off finish h as a military and political entity Hamas can have no political role mov moving forward whether it's uh from a from a leadership perspective or even from an administrative perspective they cannot have significant or any military capabilities even if that means that Israel has to retain a military presence or if Israel has to go in and out like we do in Judea and Samaria but that is the defined goal and that has to be the goal and I'll just add one point to that and that is that it's not just for the security security and safety of the residents of Israel which should be enough right there's no way that we can send 100,000 residents of the South back to their homes unless we are certain that we're going to do a much better job protecting them in the future but it's more than that it is the future of the re of the region um part of what brought about the Abraham Accords and the piece that we have today with the UAE and bahin some of the other countries Morocco Etc was the uh tenacity and the strength that we projected in previous rounds with Hamas and with Gaza they want to side with a winner they want to side with a country that's going to be an asset to them in their fight against similar fundamentalism out of Iran and elsewhere in their region and if we end this in a way that leaves them doubt as to whether or not Israel is that partner then we're going to not only prevent ourselves from future agreements like Saudi Arabia and some of the others that are that are talking to us but you're going to see the current Abraham Accords unravel so the victory that brings a decisive end to Hamas is critical for our citizens it's critical for our security and it's critical for regional peace Stakes the bottom line is the stakes are very high takes are very high in this war and to know when it's going to end will be very difficult let's go back a little bit if we can to to your life story to your background because growing up in Los Angeles family made OT at the age of 12 growing up in La you probably never dreamt you would one day be the chief of staff of the Prime Minister of the state of Israel first what is that job most of us all of us will never be in it or have access to it what does the chief of staff of a prime minister do easiest way is to tell people do you watch West Wing well you know I was that and that character I was you know so I mean the chief of staff ultimately is is both the gatekeeper and the person who influences all of the other uh senior staff members and oversees other senior staff members around the Prime Minister uh you're with him when he wakes up in the morning you're with him when he goes to sleep at night uh and you're involved in every element and every aspect of the prime minister's uh day-to-day responsibilities which include everything from as I said earlier security is by far uh the most Central and most important piece of his you know weekly schedule uh but it's everything from you know social welfare to politics to international relations to media and so on and so forth um so you live and breathe the Prime Minister um and yeah it it was it was the greatest uh honor that I had in in my lifetime what did the Prime Minister what did what did prime minister Nan see in you that he made you his chief of staff what qualities do you think that you have that he saw in you that he wanted you by his it's funny because um I actually entered his office when he was head of the opposition I I'll save your listeners the time of you know I I won't I won't go through the entire uh the entire history of how I ended up there but I will say that um my my first position with him was Foreign Affairs advisor when he was the head of the opposition I dealt with uh anything that uh wasn't in the Hebrew language so it was International media it was speechwriting it was travel it was diplomacy Etc and the chief of staff at the time was naftali Bennett uh the bureau chief at the time was AEL chaed uh and so on and so forth um so it was a very uh talented and very senior staff and when they left the office he came to me and he said okay I want you to run the show and my answer was no uh I said I'm very happy with what I'm doing I'm very comfortable in my little niche and uh he he laughed and he said okay Ari I wasn't asking you and and that was the end of it so I started off as his bureau chief um and then into the prime minister's office as a bureau chief and at that point we had developed a very very close uh personal relationship and I think that um at that point he valued my input um I did what I could to stay out of his way and just be there to help uh it was never about me it was always about the country and it was always about him and I think that that was something that he appreciated how do you think he's misunderstood what what did you see that the public doesn't have access to that they should know more of about him again whatever side politically whatever the history whatever their opinion overall is of him but as a person uh first of all he's an easy person to work for um I never found it difficult to work for him if you're willing to work hard then then you got along well with him he wasn't demanding in a in a vocal uh you know or a temperamental way he was demanding in the way he worked and if you kept up with him if you were able to put in the time and the energy and the effort uh then you know then then he was happy um I I think that he isew viewed as a cold individual and I can understand how that is his public perception as I shared earlier you know one emotional moment that that that I had shared with him obviously there were there were many others he he truly is somebody who devoted his life to the well-being of the Jewish State and the Jewish people and for me to be around someone like that who as I said earlier every moment of every day is dedicated and devoted to that um I think that that's a very special um and unique uh you know talent and special and unique purpose in life and uh something that we we have to be appreciative of My Brothers Keeper where can people get the book and more importantly or as importantly what do you help people take away from the book you're not just telling the story of those years and of that relationship Obama and BB it's more than just providing history facts what what's the message of the book if if a person puts the book down finishes reading it what do you want them to think differently feel differently what do you hope gets across so I think that it it really gives people a window into the complexities of decision-making on the one hand and how fragile that relationship between the United States and Israel can be I think that it's important for people to understand and I talk about this in the in the book President Obama and prime minister Netanyahu just their their starting point their perspective on the future of the Middle East and uh civilization in general was different um it wasn't a personal uh disagreement it wasn't a personal hatred it was truly two leaders that just saw the world uh through very very different uh set of glasses and as such um they LED their countries in different directions I think that SI citizens and people on the outside looking in are only um you know they they only get a very narrow glimpse of what truly happens behind the doors policies and politics and media are really only what uh they want you to see and there's a lot that goes on behind that and ultimately as long as the goals are goals that we as Citizens can stand behind then I think ultimately good things will happen um the book is available on Amazon it's uh available on you know Barnes & Noble's website and other online sites and uh hopefully in bookstores soon as well looking forward thank you so much for going behind the be for sharing your experience your knowledge and thank you for your service to Israel to the Jewish people to Jewish people around the world thank you Rabbi it's a pleasure thank you for watching behind the Bea catch us next time for another Peak behind the Bea