The Question of the Rishonim, Maybe the Reasoning of Beis Shamai is Bari V'shema

okay dear friends whether whether that's destined to be collected is it like it's collected already the brings an example from where do we see or not the gar talks about a situation where a woman is accused of infid and the problem is the husband dies so there's no one to bring her to drink the sa Waters B says well she's going to drink the so Waters I'm sorry Bai says she will not drink the S Waters this is on B says she will not drink the S Waters but she'll collect herba B says no either she's going to drink or she's not going to collect theba thear says according to B Hill how could she drink but you need the husband to bring her so therefore B Hill says since she doesn't drink she doesn't collect theba the gar asks how could B say she collects theba but isn't it a suff maybe she was mazana and it's a suff whether she was maana or not one thing is for sure how could the sa Bey the mine that the husband is holding she wants to extract theba how could she extract the Cuba but the husband is is holding the Cuba how could she extract the so it must be yeah that's that's the uh whether whether that's destined to be collected whether it's considered collected or not so in other words Bas hillo says she definitely doesn't drink but she can collect theba because theba is in The Possession of the who's in theba in the possession of is in the possession of the husband but says she does collect theba why fine that's what the makes dependent on in other words even though it's a suff whether she deserves it or not but it's considered like she's the on it because it's like in her possession CU AAR designated to be collect it's like it's collected remember this that we have whether she was or not she does collect the fine so the ask an unbelievable question who says that is whether maybe really everybody holds AAR that's destined to be collected is not like it's collected and that's why B says that she can't collect theba but let's let's get what what the players are saying here what does the husband say does the husband say I saw you were M no the husband says uh you went into seclusion maybe you're M he's a sheema what does she say she says bu yeah she says I was a m so why don't we say maybe the reasoning of is not because but maybe the reasoning of B is now another question is don't we see from that she doesn't get the that holds so shouldn't that be a question on theun who says that is against because clearly says I mean it's a you hear is isn't there a more basic interpretation of this is whether or not that's the question of the reim let's get it on the screen recording stop no I want the recording to continue recording in progress um but here is the let's see okay um oh this is the to you ready for any day you learn is a good day maybe is based on whether the husband died so the hus maybe the husband knew whether she was ma or not there's no way the Y know they're saying they're saying maybe she was Ma you hear the question how do you know that the reason of a sh why she takes the is because she's Maybe so the it's a weak bar you know why it's a weak bar because she knows they can't they can't contradict her she says I wasn't M of course she's going to say that because they have no way to prove that she was whenever you aari knowing that the other person can contradict you it's a very um it's a weak bar that's not a a strong bar and also it's a good sheema why because very likely she was maana cuz she was warned and she went into seclusion what did she go into seclusion with the guy for they went in to learn unlikely that they went they were warned not to go into seclusion with the woman that they were learning mus so it looks suspicious so he warned V and they went into seclusion so the answer Rush is it's a weak bu and the Shema position looks pretty uh pretty good that that they were maana we're going to focus more on the question by the way and asked the question a little bit differently T asked the question on raun raun holds B who says that she doesn't get the seems to contradict that says this is let say I say you owe me a hundred bucks and the other guy says I don't know says so here also where she is saying I was not so it's that she doesn't get the when she's that she was is who says that when somebody says you owe me a 100 bucks and the other person says no I don't know you're so T says no it's not B it's it's very likely she was M why if the T treats it as a suff until she drinks she can't can never say why cuz if she's a bar why is she drinking the sa Waters why do we make her drink the the S water why do we make her be obviously her bu is not sanctioned or recognized according to meaning the fact that we make her drink means that she's not a b why cuz if she was a bur then we wouldn't make her drink a little different than the to rash the to rash says that it's a weak bar because she knows no one could contradict her tus is saying it's not a real bu because obviously we don't treat it that way because we treat it like a s the proof is we make her drink but the question of the is how you know holds it's because maybe it's because maybe holds like run and goes like okay you ready for the million dollar question that all the ask the ask why are the saying well maybe the is whether in this case everyone would say why if I say you owe me $1,000 and the person says I don't know I'm not sure if I ever borrowed the money or not then and would say you know if the person say I don't know if they ever borrow the money but what if I say you owe me $1,000 and the person says I don't know if I ever paid back I agree there's a v loan and I don't know if I ever removed it everyone says because I'm admitting that there was a there was an obligation and the only question is if I ever paid it back in this case the husband is V to pay theba he married a woman she's not saying I don't know if you ever I'm sorry so he she's saying you definitely owe me money he's not saying I don't know if I ever owed you the money he's saying I don't know if I if I still owe you the money he's saying not he's saying any of them I don't know if I paid you because isn't a loone of responsibility so she's not saying you owe me money he's not saying I don't know if I ever had an obligation he's basically saying I don't know if I still owe it so then why are we only asking that maybe everybody should agree under these circumstances because this is not any idea or is [Applause] it in other words if a woman is mazana is it that he owed her the money but now it's like he paid back or is it somehow she forfeited the whole thing to begin with so it's like not I don't know it's not like he's saying I don't know if I if I paid you back he's saying I don't know if I ever owed this to you if you were maana I don't know if I ever owed it to you to begin with the [Applause] uh and see if we can find it let's see in the how do you like that on the hardest blot Inus we're doing a he says that even though the of theba when does a man he's at the time of but he's not considered to be until she is RO to collect it when he dies or divorces her so regarding suffix the suff is is he or not so it's like any perhaps see here he quotes T sa that asks that b Hill seems to be against Runa who holds which is even if he had no way of knowing but if I say I don't know if I paid you back why is he only asking in other words what the is intimating is why is T only saying that run and rud don't fit into B but doesn't wouldn't every everyone say in this case bar cuz this is like saying any and here if she was ma it's like saying I don't know if I paid you back so let's see what he says he says that since cannot be collected and the is not borrowed until he die until the husband dies or divorces her so even though the and is from the but it's not called until it's Roy to be collected so therefore we don't say what in other words meaning why don't we say in this case shouldn't everyone say that he has to pay theba cuz he was definitely owed theba and now there's a question whether something happened to allow to uh remove his obligation but it seems like we don't say that because even though the began at the time of the uses a of the is not ified until the bow dies so therefore we don't say we don't say there's a because right now if she was maybe there isn't a I want to share with you one more possibility rear says very interesting idea reer earlier in the M says when a woman is maana why does she lose theba is it that really the husband was but now we punish her in that case this would be a case of she's saying you owe me money and he's saying I don't know if I paid you back meaning maybe you did something something and I don't owe it to you anymore or is it not that it's a punishment that she can't collect it dissipates that if the Bal never obligated himself in a to begin with if he would have known that she would be ma meaning until this morning we thought what happens a husband marries a woman he rides her a he commits to give her a he's obligated to give her a and if she's so it's like she forfeits it so then there's a and there's a suff whether it's been relinquished so in that case the question is shouldn't everyone say it's like says rovski according to this RAR we learned that if a woman is mazana it's not that there was a vad obligation he definitely obligated himself and now did something come up where it would exempt him no the idea is that a man obligates himself so long as the woman Accords herself properly but he never obligated himself to begin with if she's going to be mazana in that case he's not saying I don't know if I paid you back he's saying I don't know if I ever I was ever to begin with so that's that raun and would argue on and on the other who was so in other words this would be a classic again the that maybe is whether you say on this wouldn't everyone say in this case because there's a v obligation and a suff whether it was fulfilled so we're trying to come up with ways of explaining why if the woman is maana it makes it not I don't know if I paid back but I don't know if I was ever to begin with okay thank you very much for uh joining us today andem uh hope to see you tomorrow night for the last blot of this beautiful perk that we're learning of um the last blood ofu and then we start the next parak next week uh we will begin okay have a great day everyone thank you very much again but we're still don't know for sure if she was or not so the doubt still exists so but what let's think about what kind of doubt is it in is it a doubt whether he paid back or is it a doubt whether there was ever a so if there was ever he didn't pay there was ever a but it's only going to go on once he has that certification that she was Miss out of it as long as she's not it's not sure you know it's not he's not going to pay I already paid you said okay if you then I this all better they off but I still don't know we don't know okay so the question though was if there is a if there when there was a definite obligation and the question is just if you paid back then everyone agrees bur wins so the question is would that be this case would should everyone agree that bur wins in this case so we saying no because the suff is not if I paid back the suff is whether I ever obligated myself to this Cuba to begin with that's a bu that not everybody agrees to only Runa would hold that bar so in other words then we're really so well we're reinstating T's question in other words maybe would be but we would't be able to ask everyone should say in this case okay thanks a lot have a great day