Daf Hashavua - Nedarim 28b

Okay, good evening dear friends. We're continuing we begin the Mishna on the bottom of let's say a person says these plantings these young trees should be assured should be a carbon if they're not chopped down. If the these trees are not chopped down, they should be a carbon. So simply what is taking place over here? You're assering them. What does it mean you're assering them? You're saying they should have kadushas hagof and you redeem it and the money is used to buy carbon. Um and it's the the Mishna is saying this is a way to be Makdish the uh animal. That's the simplehat how the ram learns. We're going to see on the other page. uh or Dan has an additional namely that it's referring to just a ne and sometimes the word carbon is a way of making a near. So if a person says these nio should be a carbon if they're not chopped down or somebody says talis zoo carbon this talis should also be a carbon if it's not if it's if it's not burned they uh have redemption you could redeem them you could redeem them means that they need to be redeemed and that the kaduca is Effective says the on them until they need the explains why what's the why would it not be the will also explain why does the Mishna teach this that they have and instead of saying that it has sanctity. In other words, if the point is that it has sanctity, just say the sanctity is why say it in this unusual way that okay let's see the end of the Mishna. The Mishna says if you say if you say let these young trees beer until they're cut this should be a carbon until it's burnt. So in in the first case you say these n are should be a carbon if they're not cut or the car the towel should be a carbon if they're not burnt. So then we say it does have a pyion but if you say that it should be a carbon until they're cut or it should be a carbon until they're burnt. So the say then there is no redemption. Okay. So we have to understand what this Mishna is trying to teach over here. Now if you look in the on the second line some say not that they have kadushas but rather it's kadush like a carbon. So then the question is if you're just saying that it's asser what kind of pigon is there? There's no you're not padim. So when you make a nether there's nothing to be um says the how is so the says the mission is who holds that if you make a general that's to everyone like heish there's opinion again. So there is a concept of pion when you're dealing with if it's not just a to you if it's a nad to everyone. Now, okay. So basically the beginning of the Mishna is that you are makers something alai you said if you don't cut it if it's not burnt then it's so the garra says the kadushad why does the mission say there is and there's no the mission to say that it has holiness in the or it doesn't have holiness let the mission just say There is kadusha or there's not kadusha. Since the kadush is that the kadusha is kal or is notal, why won't the say it straight? Says the gammory since in the it wants to teach that there's no there's no py. So the risha says there is okay so now the has another question what is the way that he made this nadar think about it he says if this tree is not cut the this planting should be a carb If it's not cut, what does that mean? Eventually the tree is going to be cut. No tree stands forever. So since no tree stands forever, the tonight can never be fulfilled. The look in the visi um look around. This is the main certainly the main is to teach that even though this is and this even though the so the main is that the and it needs to teach this like the is going to explain why it's a kadesh that the kadusha is if so listening kadusha since the main point is that the kadusha is so just hit the nail on the head that the kadusha is then asks how did he make the nether says the lash of the mishna is difficult to the garra to katanium If they're not cut, they should be holy. Since he was eventually the tree will be cut. We're only asking on the rata. We're asking on the rata. What do you mean? You're saying if this tree is not cut, it should be holy. But that will ne that's not that's not possible. Eventually it will be caught. We don't have a question on the where you say it's holy if it's not burnt is not and it's possible it'll never be burnt. Therefore from now the there are that are where the Garra spells out the question where the Gmorra's question is not just but okay so the Garra says that um if it's not cut today and the day goes by then it's holy. So says if that's the that it has to be cut today then of course the what's the then there's nothing to say it's obvious that the kadusha is kal because it's obvious the kaduca is kal you made aai a very reasonable tonight that may or not may or may not be observed and if the is not fulfilled the kadal says says the case is you know why we need it going there's a big wind so the guy expected the tree to blow down so when it doesn't blow down who says maybe it's like an you know the guy was was dependent the guy assumed the tree would fall down right the garra asks to have a hectish. Anyway, the answer is the guy says if the tree doesn't fall down today, it should be hect. It's pa it's going to be hectish. No, it was very windy. He expected it to blow down says the garra I and says garra proof to this is the safa because we learned by talis that the guy says if the talis doesn't burn down then it should be holy talis of kami is a talis um prime to be burnt of course not. So then what exactly is the Tai? So it must be it's in a case. In other words, what's this guy saying? If the talis is not burnt then then it should be holy. What kind of is that? Why would a tal be burnt? So it must be the case is in there's a fire and it might be burnt. So the case of the there's a there's a big wind as well. the I would have thought you would have thought he he assumes that it won't be it won't be rescued and it will burn down and it won't be holy. Therefore, he made the nether but he never expected that the tree wouldn't burn down and that it's a valid nether. Okay. Then in the safa carbon if these should be a carbonal until they're cut down then it's not uh the kaduca is not. So the gumar asks um the garra asks what does that mean? What's the question of and forever? What does it mean forever? It says you know there it has it has no pion what you can't ever redeem it. Why can't you ever redeem it? Why are you not able to redeem it? You're saying it should be holy until it until it falls down. So why can't you ever redeem it? Especially after it falls down. Um look look at the ran. The ran says with a wonder. How could he hinge the something that it's not we have to be talking about something that okay how is it possible that there's never said you know what it means it means since he said it should be holy until it falls down. If he redeems them, it becomes holy again. If he redeems them, becomes holy again until they fall down. But once they fall and it's enough. So listen to what Barbad is saying. You know what it means? It means since you made it tonight, it should be holy until it falls down. That means it's it should be holy, holy, holy, holy, holy. And if you redeem it, then it's a good redemption, but then it becomes holy again. And if you redeem it, it's a good redemption becomes holy again. So you could redeem it. It's just a since you made it tonight, it should be holy until it falls down. It will just keep on becoming holy and holy until it falls down. Now you would expect that after it falls down you don't even need to redeem it because he says it should be only holy until it falls down and bar says that once it falls down if you redeem it once it's good enough. So when the Mishna says, it doesn't mean never redeem. It means that the redemption doesn't work before it falls. See the ran. In other words, what's difficult here is why doesn't the kaduca just dissipate on its own once it falls down? So Gumar says the ran says when the Mishna says they don't have so long as they're not cut to say they don't have pigon at all meaning that their should not take effect on What does it mean that it becomes holy again? When we say it doesn't have a pigon, it means it won't be permanent because why would then be they don't have a to take them out of their but it could take it out but it will come back in since you said it should be holy until it's cut. Just like you said explicitly carbon these plantings are a carbon from now and it should be a carbon even after you redeem it before it falls. It comes out there if you redeem it. It's kadesh temporarily cuz it indeed goes it just becomes holy again. Now why if you redeem why if it falls doesn't need to be redeemed says why even though you only sanctified it until it falls when it falls the doesn't go off on its own. So two things are saying number one is before it falls if you redeem it it will become holy again the second thing is after it falls you still need to redeem it and it doesn't just the kaduca doesn't just dissipate on its own says since it's cut you don't need to redeem it now one way to learn isola disagrees only on one point. He says in the Mishna of means before it falls if you redeem it, it will become holy again. He agrees to that. He agrees to that. Everybody agrees means if you redeem it, it doesn't take effect uh for good because it will just become holy again. He just argues on one tiny point. He just says that since he stipulated it will only be holy until you cut it. After you cut it, the kaduca leaves and you don't need to redeem it. However, and that's how the rashba learns. If you look in in the two lines down, he's not arguing him. only after it falls the doesn't dissipate but until it's cut everyone agrees they become holy again that's what the says now that's not how the ram learns the ram learns that what forced bara to say that if you redeem it the kaduca comes back he had explained the words they have no redemption why couldn't they have no redemption mean that after they fall you don't need to redeem it because the kaduca goes off immediately no bara cannot accept that idea that The kaduca goes off immediately. So he was forced to say means that before it falls if you redeem it it becomes holy again. But who says that after it falls you don't need to redeem it. He could learn means after it falls you don't have to redeem it. He's not forced to say that before it falls if you redeem it it becomes holy again cuz he has a much simpler way to read the Mishna. means after it falls you don't need to redeem it. So he's not stuck in this that is that means if you redeem it then it becomes holy again. So that if you redeem it that if you redeem it before it falls it doesn't become holy again. And I what does mean says means after it falls you don't need to redeem it. That's how the learns. Look. Maya [Music] kadusha we but according to barada one back again. So quite fine which would mean take a look five lines from the bottom in the great wise man. He argues on the argue on two things but there it's really one is hinged on the other. since holds the doesn't go off which means you need to be he's forced to say is going on before it falls because otherwise why did the guy have to say if The kaduca just goes off by itself. Why did the guy have to say until it falls? The kaduca can't go up by itself. So what exactly? Meaning the starting point is bar holds. Kadusha doesn't dissipate. If kadusha doesn't dissipate, why the guy say it's holy until it falls? It's not going to go off after it falls. So, he should have just said it's indeterminately forever. It must be, you know what he meant until you redeem it. I'm sorry. You know what he meant until it falls? Until it falls, it becomes holy again and again and again and again. So therefore, when it says, it's not saying you don't need to redeem it when you cut it because you do. It's not going to take it out permanently. But argues, says the reason the guy said is because it only lasts until then. So according to you have no reason to say that it will become holy again once you redeem. It's not coming to say that even if you redeem it, it becomes holy again. But it's saying it's only holy until that time and then it's paka. So in other words, this is saying like this. They argue on two things. They argue on whether it will become holy again. Meaning the raja says everybody holds it will become holy again before. They only argue whether kadusha's after it falls down. But the ran says no. They argue about both points. You see, Barbad's starting point is kaduca doesn't just dissipate. If it doesn't dissipate, why the guy say it's holy until it falls down. But it's not going to go off after it falls down because Kadush is now. So he's forced to say that after you redeem it, it becomes holy again. And Py is saying that exactly. But according to that, that kaduca could be paka. That's why he said and that's what it means after it falls. So he's not forced to say that before it falls it becomes holy again. And the raja holds they both agree that until it falls down if you redeem it it becomes holy again. They only argue afterwards whether kadusha's that is and next week hopefully it'll be regular schedule that we should be able to come and return at the right time. Um, we'll continue where the Gar is going to ask, well, what do you mean the kaduca just is paka? Where does it go? Rabbi say, have a beautiful night. Thank you. Amen. Thank you. Thank you. Go to