Daf Hashavua - Nedarim 12b

okay good evening friends we're continuing in we're dealing with the of on where if somebody says and we know that so what do you mean do you say that your matf in the essential status of the carbon the essential status of the Carbone is or do we say you're being now so let's start again from like the of is regular Kal now that is not a even though the r says that it becomes but it's not user to everyone it's not user so it's called or likewise truma is effective with an so it's when you say it should be or then it's but it's not to everyone to eat it so it's not a but we're making a but like the of the L the to requires 40 loaves 40 loaves the by the way there's a beautiful that that explains why do you have to bring so many loaves with the carbon because if you have to bring so many loaves you're going to have to invite people and the inion of H is necessary to be so therefore um if you say and want to be M like so the is that it's effective now in general when when is a person in terms of it's relative to the carbon the don't become M until you sprinkle the D you hear this the now you could be M earlier but typically you can't eat it until so um typically the are separated the separ after by the way the you give you have 10 of each of the four types of breads one of each goes to the so if you're now is D why is it D because it's K you see truma is not K truma is something that once your M it it's m to the butum is the isim that becomes so the after you sprinkle the blood since do not become permitted to eat until after you sprinkle the blood why would you take off the truma before you can take off the truma there could be such a case where you take off the chuma it's just that why would you why would you you so the fact that it says we see from here that your mat in the um thear okay says thear so this is your mat in the essential state says the gar no don't be m rather say like the trumka what's the trumka says the is the ti that they took off from the money in the chamber and they filled up three baskets that means like this by the way I don't know usually every year about either 30 or 60 days before PM we start Milla either we do a BL day or an day so I gave the signal okay we start today today's yal yal T in any event in talks about that every Jew would contribute a towards the public carbon they would put in a special chamber but that was more than enough to cover the carbonit and three times a year the K would come in and with like a basket and take off like a separation and from those three baskets that they would take out three times a year they would be of the so that is like money that's that is um money that is pledged it's so if you are on that and you say then in fact it's but would be so says really but then you'll say since it's after so then it's m because your M right now then why would the say that why don't we say a bigger not only is regular not only if your mat in regular chuma which is is it not a but even if your mat in in other words L Theos why talk about a case of truma talk about Trum and certainly regular truma says the ran would be much bigger the would be that even though essentially is but since right now it's m so the is not effective so um says the is when it says it doesn't just mean regular Trum that you take off you know 150th includes in other words when the BR says Trum it doesn't just mean truma it refers to Trum as well that's answer number one answer number one is that the do is not to be for is to for it would not be an effective and if you want you could say the case of is where you were before the so right now it's you don't have it's talking about a case where your before this for example for example you separated it while it was still being needed thean taka says that it could have said you separated it after you baked it before you sprinkled the blood but it picked a case where you separate it while you were needing it what what's an example the continues like remember we said you have to bring 40 loaves 10 of each of the four types what if when you bake it instead of baking it with 40 loaves you baked it with four loaves basically you combine the 10 loaves of each type into one big loaf so you baked with it says 40 and you only did four 40 is preferable but it's not TR but you need to take off Trum and if you baked it you see if you baked 10 loaves you could just give one if you baked 10 loaves of each you could give one to the co but if you baked just four total loaves how you giving one to the if you're going to say well you took one loaf for everything so out of the four loaves you baked you you took one for the truma that you required to get for all for everything we learned in the one from each carbon which we interpret to mean you can't take from one loaf for the other type of loaves there's you can't take from one for the others El you say well I took a stickle of I baked four big Loaves and I took a from each of the four if you're gonna say he took a piece from each one but we learned in the mishna it says one you can't take a stick can't take a piece you have to take one whole thing so you know what you did you separated it when you were needing it meaning when you were needing it you needed 10 Do's for each and then let's say 10 mat 10 10 you gave one of the do to and then you took the other nine and you you rolled it together as one big loaf okay so that means you were the even before says you took one of and one from and one from and one from let's see the r there four types of they're four species of bread from each and every speci we learn out from means we learn out from one out of 10 and they're 40 meaning the round is bothered that what does it mean that you need to take truma says you need to take truma and it can't be you took one of the of the whole thing cuz we learned in the mishna each from one from each carban you need to take one from each Min and one from each Min we learn Out means one out of says you made 10 loaves come in after you separate one from each men shall come you needed nine of each made one each group of nine says the gamar let us say it is let us say what is let us say whether the intention is you whether you mean or not we just said two answers answer number one is is Tak and the case of the ofuma is the would be but would be because he probably means or the case is let us say this is and we're going to explain what this means exactly that it's let's say somebody says I want this piece to be like a and now what's the case if you say explicitly before the my timeand what's the reason of the opinion that it's m and if you say explicitly after my time so it must be there's a piece of in front of you and and there's another piece of meat in front of you and you say this should be like this and the question is it's talking about but do you mean that it should be like the status of the right now after or do you mean let's see the Run let's see if we can figure out this run let us say it's if the truth is it could have asked if you say what's the reason of the that it's permitted because even if you want to say your not meaning like this even if you didn't say we would still ask why would anybody say it's m meaning if you say I want it to be like of course it should be but the r is saying even if you did didn't say explicitly you want it to be like uh the status of the K before Zam also we feel it should be user if you just say this should be like a carbon then you definitely mean before if you say after mean what we're trying to say is when a person says that something should be like a carbon how do we interpret his words does he mean that it should be like a carbon before the or should be like a carbon the ran just explains and the ran clarifies that if a person just says this should be like a carbon before this it should for sure be user even if a person just says this should be like a carbon and he doesn't explicitly say before Zam it should also be AER because we're going to see we're going to say in an upcoming mishna if you say this should be like it's even though you didn't explicitly say before because we assume when you say carbon you mean the essential state of the carbon the Shila is where you don't refer to the carbon you don't say the name of the carbon you just say this permitted meat should be like that meat over there which happens to be a carbon and by this case of we find it's whether do you mean that it should be like its essential state or like its state now and that's really the shil of r r sh is where you have a piece of of M and a piece of and you say this should be like this so saying because seems to say you go like the essential state of the and rabuda matters CU RAB Huda says we go like its current state but that's only it's not talking about where you say the name of the carbon like thear started off on if you say it's not going to work and if you say like a the is being it also would definitely be CU we see in a later mishna that when you label the name of the carbon if you say my permitted meat should be like a should be like an Asam you definitely mean like the essential state of the carbon namely before the so at this step we're setting it up that the and ultimately the is going to say no um everyone says that you could say you want to see the gar just quickly the gar says everybody agrees it's before the or by the way either you said before the Zam or just St so then why would matter cuz it says only works on the type of that you have to activate but if it automatically comes because it's a that's not considered a even though the is is a meni wants to say that he was thinking that he knows it no so what's the the other what does that mean that's a because this whole we're talking about the the whole only works so the basically is going to introduce the idea that maybe works I mean how much can we do nextar you know okay I guess the there's yeah okay we'll hold it over here ra say record make