Daf Hashavua - Nazir 11a

Okay, good evening everyone. We're continuing with my head. We're learning Nazir daf yomi amud alef. Zog the Mishnah Mazgu le es hakois. Let's say they poured him a cup. This wasn't a cup of apple juice. This was a cup of wine. Va'amar and the guy said, "No, no, no, no. Hareini nazir mimenu. I'm a nazir from this cup of wine." Hareini nazir. He's a nazir. Even though all he said is that he's a nazir from this cup of wine, that statement is a valid expression of nazirus. Maiseh be'ishah achas. There's a story about a certain woman. She hissah shikorah. She was drunk. U'mazgu lah es hakois and they poured her a cup of wine va'amrah, and she said, "Hareini nazir mimenu. I'm a nazir from that cup of wine." So based on what we said earlier, she should be a nazirah. No, the said, "Amru chachamim, leinis gav nazir elah leimar hareini like carbon." The chachamim said, she only meant to say, "For me, it's like a carbon. It's assur to drink that cup as a neder. However, she's not a nazirah." So the Gemara is going to ask, "The story contradicts the din. The din said that if you have one cup of wine and you said, 'I'm a nazir from it,' so then you're a nazir. Now we're saying, 'No, you're not a nazir. It's just uh you're taking uh you're taking nazirus on yourself. You're taking nazirus on yourself. Okay. So that is um that is the Mishnah. Let's see Tosefta. Masechet the Mishnah is going to ask the story is a contradiction. Fine. Practically tomorrow oh the the Tosefta continues. No, um right to the Mishnah. Masechet the Mishnah the story is a contradiction. Why? I'm ready ratio you said in the ratio I raise a Nazir that if somebody says I'm a Nazir from a cup of wine you're a Nazir 100 times then it teaches Masechet the Mishnah there's a story about a woman I'm a behind with the answer. And the ruling is she's only answer for that cup. I ain't a queen of sorry she's motor in another cup. So the story contradicts the dinner of the Mishnah. The Mishnah says that if you say you're a Nazir from one cup then you're a Nazir it's a valid acceptance of Nazir so then we bring a story that no you're only answering the Nazir that particular cup. The Mishnah is missing words and it meant to say as follows. Most of the glass of they poured him a cup. How many says I'm a Nazir man I'm a Nazir from it I raise a Nazir he's a Nazir. But if he was a drunk if he was a drunk why? Why why if you're a drunk are you not saying you're a Nazir? My time up because commander I'm a hurry like carbon who cuz it's like you're saying I asked for that carbon as a carbon. And if you say okay then he should have said that he asked her that like a carbon. Why would you assume just because he's drunk that he's saying it like a carbon? So it's the there's a reason for that. What's the reason? The reason is so there the guy thinks that even though he's a drunk, he's not a fool. He's drunk. He's intoxicated, but he still has a little say so. He says if I say I'm answering this cup as another, they'll bring me a different cup. And they're going to pressure me. I'm going to say this definitive statement, namely that I'm another from it. This way they won't bother me with any cups of wine. And then we bring them a story to support this ruling that if someone is drunk, it's different. That if you say you're another, what you mean to say is only from it, but he didn't want to spell it out cuz then they would annoy him and say, "Well, if you're only answering this cup of wine, they'll bring him a different one." >> What does the have to say to you? Actually, I don't like that. Why can't we say from the fact that in the story she she was a it's only in that instance because she was a that is alike a carbon. But if she would not be a then yeah, she would be a so I don't like it's not only I saw the star we could use that story to be from it a similar. >> Mhm. I have a question. Mhm. Maybe because support would be too indirect. Since you would have to make a deyak, maybe it's not the style of a Mishnah to say a din and then bring a story that at first glance seems like a contradiction, but then upon careful analysis because of a specific detail mentioned you could infer that it's only because of that detail, but had it not been for that detail, then the din the ratio would have held up. Maybe that's not We don't usually bring stories that only indirectly support um Which in a way is probably the reason why Rebbe left out those words because you could you could you could deduce that it's only under the circumstance that someone's a shiyur. Okay, let's see Tysys. Um The im shiyur who have a middle a lie bicarbon. Paris shiyur Adam bishiyur shiyur. It's a people to pressure drunk people to drink. The outer inner shiyur shiyur. And the guy doesn't want to drink. I know meaning even though he's a shiyur he drinks when he wants to drink. He doesn't like to be pressured. You know, just because somebody likes something doesn't mean they like to be forced to partake of it. So, I'm a Nazirite who he says he's not a Sukkah may love Shmuel Yomer Nazirite who he doesn't say he's a Nazirite Yomar Shaya view like a Sukkah. They're afraid they're going to bring him another cup. Omar Nazirite the Sukkah the Gami. Therefore, he says a Nazirite to just get them off his back. May Allah have a kosher you know Shaker if he's not a Shaker. Ain't Derek love to write. It's not the Derek to pressure with a cup. Omar the Nazirite me coolu. Therefore, it says he's a Nazirite from everything. If he's not a Shaker and he says I'm a Nazirite from this cup what he means to say is I'm a full-fledged Nazirite from all wine. And then we bring a story that if someone's a Nazirite uh it has a dinner of Horeah who alike carbon. Fine. Zack the Mishnah. Horeini Nazirite Amana Shaya hey Shaya say I am. I'm a Nazirite on condition that I could drink wine. Huh. I'm a Nazirite on condition that I could drink wine. It's an interesting condition, you know. I'm a Nazirite on condition that I'm not a Nazirite. Now, he he's okay not becoming Tommy the Mason or not cutting his hair. But the wine thing he makes condi- his Nazirite's conditional on being able to drink wine. Or he says I'm a Tommy the Mason or on condition I could come into contact with a a mess. So, Allah is Horeah a Nazirite. You're a Nazirite. The also the colon and yet you're still also to drink wine or to become Tommy. Sounds like because you're Masna on Mashe cost of a tire. you say you're a nazer and the condition is you want to be able to drink wine or become tummy to masem. So, you're making a condition against the rule of the Tyra. Nazer is not to drink wine or nazer is not to become tummy to masem. So, this is masna amasha casa batira, your statement is valid and the condition is bottle. Next case, your idea anish nazerus, I know there's something called nazerus. When I made my nether, I knew there's something called nazerus. I knew lesha nazer and I never knew a nazer's not to drink wine. I had no idea. I thought a nazer just doesn't take a haircut or doesn't become tummy. I had no idea nazer doesn't drink wine. Haray zeh asur. He's asur to drink wine. From Shimon matter of Shimon says, no, you're you're mutar to drink wine. Let's see Tysus. A manasha eshta biayin haray zeh nazer vasur kulan. Eekal manda amra bigamara. There is an opinion in the gamara mishum d'av masna amasha casa batira. You stipulated on what it says in the Tyra d'chi amra harayni nazer. Cuz when you said I'm a nazer, have a nazer l'chuli, you're a nazer for everything. D'chi mato batnai. And when you made a stipulation ain batnai klum, the tnai is meaningless. D'afilu Reb Shimon may d'baraysha. And we'll see even Reb Shimon who when a guy says, I would make when I made a myself a nazer, I had no idea that you're asur in yayin. Reb Shimon who says you're mutar in the wine would say that if you make a condition, you're asur. D'afilu Reb Shimon may d'baraysha k'ha lishana d'tani kase. In accordance with that version of the Mishnah. As we're going to see, there are going to be three cases in the Mishnah. The the second two cases are guys who say I accepted Nazirite but I didn't know a Nazirite can't drink wine or I didn't know the Nazirite can't become tummy. So, those cases Reb Shimon says, "Okay, so he never meant to accept that." But if you make a stipulation, a stipulation is uh master master because of the Torah and the tonight is bottle. Okay. Um in the second case the guy says, "I know there's something called a Nazirite but I didn't know a Nazirite can't drink wine." Kal v'chomer, "Shahar Halacha is kabbalah to a life assistant." The guy accepts the other Halachas l'vad may as except for the prohibition of wine. "Shul I keep out the that he didn't accept l'fi shul I had a doubt to cuz I didn't know shul Nazirite also be iron." that a Nazirite is not to drink wine. The Rabbanan have a Nazirite. According to the Rabbanan you're a Nazirite. You know why? What? Again, this guy says, "I accepted Nazirite but I had no idea Nazirite is not to drink wine." So, according to the Rabbanan you're a full-fledged Nazirite. Why? Because we had earlier the opinion of the Rabbanan is a guy who accepts only one of the DNA Nazirite is a Nazirite for everything. The Rabbanan say if a guy says I'm a Nazirite from not cutting hair or I'm a Nazirite from not becoming tummy all the DNA Nazirite come upon him. So, here also the guy says, "I I know I know there's something called Nazirite I had no idea that Nazirite is not to drink wine." Okay, but once you accept one DNA Nazirite you're a Nazirite for everything. So, the Rabbanan hold you're a Nazirite for everything. Reb Shimon says, "No, you're if you didn't know you're a certain le'ayin you're not a certain le'ayin." Next case. What's the next case in the Mishnah? Uh you idea Anisha another also be iron. I knew that another is also in wine. I will suffer or you see Shakira material. I thought the rabbis would let me do it. Let me shine in the yellow liquor seller. I can only live with wine. I would nation need waiver some amazing because I'm a grave digger. I work for the cover condition. So I knew another is not allowed to drink wine or I knew another is not allowed to become tummy. But I thought the rabbis would give me a dispensation either because I'm a bartender or because I'm a grave digger. So that I look at it is the time to come and say I raise a motor. You're motor. You never accepted that dinner upon yourself. Cuz you thought the rabbis would not prohibit you. And verb Shimon I said I have Shimon says you're also. Because according to have Shimon if you accept one dinner of Nazirite all the dinner in Nazirite are also this This case is um This is the case is the converse where the guy accept the guy thought the rabbis would permit it him to be uh to drink wine or to become tummy. So the the have a home say you're motor. And have Shimon says you're also. Let's see Titus. You had the Anisha another also be iron. I would nation have a home say Shakira material with nation in the yellow liquor seller. I love be iron. I would nation have a home say Shakira some amazing climb a shiny circle to mass. To my stuff him. I need to become contaminated to them. For the capital be him and to deal with them the scar. For payment mark my stock give because of my pressing financial needs. The camera here but I did cover Australia. I never had a mind to accept the prohibition of wine. I to mass Mason. The hand of a mayor. He likewise says shall I keep a love is right in I to mass Mason. How is a motor rev Shimon oyster? And the guy is going to ask this is the opposite of what they of their opinions in the previous case. Park the let me say so so the opposite. Fine. But we're going to now anchor in the second case. The second case is the guy says I know there's something called the had no idea knows there's not to drink wine according to rev Shimon your motor according to the common your also because once you accept one of the DNA in the zeros you're subject to all the DNA of the zeros. So we bring them a kiss in case two. Would rev Shimon matter even in case one where the guy didn't say I had no idea another is not allowed to drink wine. Where the guy stipulated I want to be another on condition that I'm allowed to drink wine. Would rev Shimon say there also your motor in wine or is that case worse cuz you made a stipulation? You didn't say you're not accepting it. You can you made a condition that your another is will only be if this prohibition is not present. So you're sort of stipulating against the Torah. So the guy says The guy has the following question. The lift like now rev Shimon Aisha why didn't rev Shimon argue in the Aisha as well? I'm rev Shimon Levy holler Kyrie Shimon operation. Rev Shimon would argue in the Aisha. He said his then after he waited until the second case and he said that if somebody says I had no idea another is not allowed to drink wine. You're motor in Yianni and by the same token that would equally apply to case one where the guy says, uh, "I make a condition. I accept the zeros on condition that I could drink wine." But Ravina may know but Reish Lakish and Rav Shimon in the Reisha wouldn't argue if a guy made a stipulation that he's allowed to drink wine. That he's only an authorized to drink wine. Why? My time out. What's the reason? Why do Why would Rav Shimon not argue in the Reisha? Because you shouldn't have messed with the Torah. Cuz you're stipulating on what it says in the Torah. Anyone who stipulates against what it says in the Torah tonight by now. The stipulation is null and void. Let's see Tosis. After Reish Lakish and Rav Shimon matter, call me betrayed by me. It's going on both cases. the Torah. The kiss of a hammer When you say tonight. Tosis when I This is not the authorized part of Tosis. I'll tell you Tosis has a a a shashkasha. There's a rule you could only You're only authorized to make a tonight if the action could be fulfilled through a shliach. We learn out from the Reuven that you could only make a stipulation if it's a maisa could be done through a a shliach. Question though, nazirus you can't do through a shliach. So if that's the case, you can't make a tenai, you can't make any tenai by Nezirus. You shouldn't be able to make any tenai. To which Tosfos says, "There There are elements of Nezirus that you could make a shaliach. Namely, you could have a shaliach bring your carbonos." So, therefore, this wouldn't ruin the You can't say automatically that tenai should be combatto because you can't do it through a shaliach cuz there are elements of Nezirus you could do through through a shaliach. Okay. Now, what's Reish Lakish going to say with what Ravina holds? That Reb Shimon wouldn't argue on the reisha because it's not mashma kasuv baTorah. So, Reish Lakish holds you could be mashma kasuv baTorah. While Reish Lakish says, "Chaluk Reb Shimon acher bereishina." Says the Gemara, "Amar Reb Shimon will say, Hi amana skochutz d'mi." You're not really stipulating against the Torah. This condition here is except. What does it mean this condition is except? What you mean is When you say I'm a nazir, I'm a nazir I could drink wine, you don't mean to say I'm only going to be a nazir on that condition. It means I'm a nazir except for regarding drinking wine. So, he's not He's not making a condition, he's not making a tenai, he's making an exclusion. Look at Tosfos. Hi amana skochutz d'mi k'ilu amar, "Hareini nazir mikol milsa." It's like he's saying I'm a nazir for everything chutz min yayin, except for wine. D'lo ya'avei nazir l'Reb Shimon t'vei einan achshevei d'nazir. Achshevei mikol einan, you need until you're uh make another from everything. So, says the Gemara, Tanna kama said Ravina, we learned in a bris in accordance with Ravina that this is a violation of master mashkus of the Torah. Amar Hareini Nazir, I'm a Nazir, eh shai say yayin, um a tamei l'meisim, the halacha is Hareini Nazir, you're a Nazir. But for us a b'chulam, you're not allowed to drink wine, you're not allowed to become tamei l'meisim l'nasho master mashkus of the Torah. All master mashkus of the Torah tonight battel. Okay. Says Tosfos, Tanna kama said Ravina, the second wide line, d'ha amar amanas, this shows when you say amanas chazvina l'tenai, it's considered like a tenai, and it's not like an exclusion. And therefore, the tenai is battel, and the amanas is kayem. Okay, friends, family, we're going to hold it over here. And uh we'll do we'll try to do yud alef amud beis. The plan is Wednesday evening. Tonight is Monday. Tomorrow is the official Satmar shul for the show. So, people want to know which Satmar, this is both. I do both Satmars together. Okay. >> [snorts] >> Skaya. >> Why would they think or Torah would think that it's allowed that this definition what is Nazirite or definition of animal something like a why would this even be like discussion? Like, okay, I don't feel so right. I I I'm a good Jew, but on once a month I will eat in