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Rabbi Akiva Tatz - Does My Free Will Affect You?
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Auto-generated transcript. Not time-synced to the video.
let's think about a subject in Torah
that is particularly demanding one of
the most difficult areas of Torah
thought what we call my shovel or ash
gopher and that's the very difficult
problem of how one person's free-willed
interacts with another that very thorny
philosophical problem Forney religious
problem and that is the problem of how
if I use my free will to do something
that affects you in a way that's
inappropriate what happens in other
words if I use my free will which is the
defining characteristic of the human
being right we know that the way the
Torah puts it is that the human being is
formed but selam aleykum that means in a
godly image and the divine image all our
deep sources say means that we have free
will right that's a very mysterious
thing that we can be a cause of our own
action and not simply a response of
feedback a feedback loop so the most
deeply axiomatic feature of the human
being is our free will and the problem
is one of the problems of free will is
that if you use your free will to affect
someone else in a way that's not
appropriate for their dispensation what
will happen if I use my free well let's
say I do something dangerous and I get
harmed
there's no philosophical problem I got
harmed because I did something dangerous
it's not a not a philosophical problem
but if I put you into danger where you
don't deserve harm in other words you
have a divine dispensation we call that
oshkosh gafas means there's a set of
decrees in the spiritual world that
govern what is your appropriate
dispensation what happens if I use my
free will to affect you in such a way
that goes against what's correct for you
right to put it most dramatically what
happens if somebody tries to kill
someone else who doesn't deserve to die
right somebody who has no divine decree
of death on him at that point they're
not talking about divine knowledge a
shams knowledge God's foreknowledge is a
completely different subject right
that's the classic problem of
predestination or foreknowledge and free
will that's a myth if possible that's a
more difficult subject than the siblings
that's another whole issue that's one
classic problem in Jewish philosophy and
in fact in general philosophy
how does predestination or foreknowledge
impact on our free will that's one area
but the way we put this in informal
Torah terms we're not talking about
divine knowledge we talking about
decrease
just to give it a sort of some sort of
graphic field if you imagine Hashem God
as being somewhere above the ceiling
right out of sight but impinge us on the
world through a mechanism of interaction
let that call at the Zodiac world
whatever you want to call it spiritual
energies impinging on the world and the
channels that come into the world take
the form of what's called Zara's divine
decrease why that is and how it operates
and how they've formed on Rosh Hashanah
during the year is a long discussion but
there are certain things called decrease
and decrease are not strictly immutable
right for example prophetic decrees for
bad can be changed if because they're
conditional as the whole world of
understanding of what these divine
decree saw that the point to make for
now is we're not talking about divine
foreknowledge we're talking about
decrees well but without going to it
more specifically what happens if mr. a
is walking down the street and he has no
divine decree upon him to die at that
time in fact if you interviewed our Shem
at that time and you sell a Shem God how
do you feel about this person and Hashem
would say you know he's cool you know
from my point of view it's got 25 more
years to live do lots of mitzvahs get
married have a family I'm fine with him
and at that point mr. B turns the corner
tries to kill him we have a problem now
because from the one point of view this
person does not deserve to die that
means it rose up to God he wasn't going
to kill him
another had been another human beings
free will and you're created in the
world to use your free will there has to
be very real well we have a problem now
which is going to which will supplant
which will override the other right if
you say is no free will to kill him
because this person's destiny or
whatever the appropriate word would be
the decree upon this person is not to
die now then you're pulling the teeth of
the power of the free will of this agent
if on that hand you say that he could
kill him there's something desperately
unfair about that that means his free
will is very real but the person's dying
completely inappropriately I mean that's
very very strange that's the dilemma
right so let's let's take a look at this
very difficult subject which of these
principles is gonna soften are we going
to say that you don't have free will to
affect anyone else you only have an
illusion of free will are we going to
say that you do have free will and did
your divine dispensation the way I was
dealing with you and what you deserve in
the world is somehow
unreliable or somehow somehow because
someone else put you at risk how do we
approach this subject classic problem in
Torah thought very badly misunderstood
subject a lot of
the stuff you'll read about this is his
miss misrepresented let me give you a
scenario fascinating setting on which to
build this subject
stay with me carefully because in our
logic settings every nuance can make a
major difference to the output and
here's the scenario
long time ago more than a hundred years
ago a certain very learner rabbi
happened to be visiting a an expo you're
not like a commercial fair I think it
was in Leipzig and he found himself in a
very strange dilemma if you'd like to
look this up it's in the Pisco chamber
Greta logic comment on the Shannara in
question mishpat you dress he actually
analyzes this question but I'm gonna
give you some more background that he
doesn't he doesn't mention there and but
look it up you'll find it fascinating
this is what he says this well-known and
major Thomas Holcomb great rabbinic
thinker was visiting this particular
place and the procedure there was that
if people had a financial dispute they
would make a based in they make a Jewish
court that caught up three people to
form a tribunal and the litigants would
present their cases in the tribunal the
judges would issue a ruling in fact the
non-jews their you subject themselves to
the same arbitration that was the way it
was done to Jews on this particular
occasion had some financial dispute and
so they considered based in what did
they do they come up to two Jews who
were happened to be there at the time to
be judges on the westin and for the
third judge they put him on the best and
he was a very accepted knowledgable
halakha figure he happened to be there
there was no where they could choose
somebody else and so the three of them
said you know the rule of a best deals
you have always have done odd number of
people right you can never have an even
number of people one American Jewry has
twelve people I've never never figured
out rights is a recipe for trouble
you have always an odd number so that
can never be a hung decision and
therefore the minimum numbers three and
so they made a based in and the two Jews
began to present their cases and this
rabbi writes as follows he says that it
became immediately apparent to him that
the other two judges were colluding
dishonestly against the innocent party
and they were going to lie in their vote
and he would be carried along with the
miscarriage of justice they were going
to there was clearly they were biased in
favor of one of the litigants they were
going to vote on his favor
the money would change has be complete
miscarriage of justice there's nothing
he could do
because in Jewish law all you can do is
vote well he's gonna vote is they're
gonna advert him and not only that but
he'll be carried along involved in that
because how logically when the best in
issues are ruling it comes down as a
Fiat of the whole base did you know for
example if the three of us are sitting
on the Westin and we judge in your case
and they vote against me I'm forbidden
to go to you afterwards and say I was on
your side but the advert will be not
disclose that in Jewish law in other
words the decision comes as you as if it
was the unanimous decision of the best
thing and therefore he would be carried
along in this travesty of justice and
that was the problem say what could he
do he thought himself he had two options
one option was to vote which means that
he'd vote for the truth now the to
advert him and the vote would carry in
the favor of a dishonest result and he'd
be party yet but yet another option the
other option was to say I don't know
because the the color of Jewish law says
that if one of the judges on the base
Dean says I don't know the case is
closed all you co-opted two more or you
start again but basically the case then
ends because you now left with only two
active judges that's an even number of
judges and that's an invalid based in
and therefore he could have gotten out
of the problem by saying I don't know
but his moral dilemma was that in order
to say I don't know you would have had
to lie because he didn't know say
thought it so what am I supposed to do
and we're supposed to now say the truth
and have a falsehood result
or should I say false to have the truth
result then amazing question see in
Jewish law the question is what is the
truth
very sophisticated question right in he
is the truth the naked technical meaning
of the words or is the truth contextual
so in Jewish law the truth is always
contextual you can't get away with the
legalistic meaning of the words you're
sitting at home the phone rings or wife
picks it up from the tone of voice you
hear that this is somebody you
definitely don't want to speak to so
this is what you do you step out across
the doorway and you say
and your wife says I'm sorry is that
would you say that's a lie or the truth
it's technically true but in Jewish law
it's a lie
it's a worse liar than remaining in the
room and saying I'm not available
because the question is not asking which
side of the doorstep your husband's
Danny that's not the meaning of the
question you can't get out of it when
that technicality right and therefore in
Jewish law if you want to look this up
by the way this is all based on Yaakov
saying that he's a sob when Yaakov said
he was a self right technically speaking
he was lying but in truth he was a SAP
here taken over that persona he bought
it I a mess of your firstborn I have
those rights I've bought there's a very
fascinating area needs to look it up at
a lot of a lucky discussion about that
but the question is here what is called
the truth and therefore to vote for the
truth and have falsehood result is one
option but to cite false which is I
don't now and have a greater truth
result man marry this man that's correct
so he says there and he wrote this
question for biscaia who analyzes it so
he said he's dead he's dead thought
about it he thought to himself maybe
there's a precedent in the game or your
mama says what happens in the following
scenario let's say of the Sanhedrin you
know for a capital trial in Judaism you
need like 23 judges or 71 judges are
many many rules you need many conditions
for the great Sun heavy in their judges
capital cases what happens in the
following scenario let's say you have
someone if this man is on trial for his
life and you are the gentleman of the
Sunday time showing you all duly
qualified a logically and you are going
to sit and constitute this tribunal
that's going to try this man for his
life now you know that the laws of
capital cases in Judaism are very
extreme you know that you have all sorts
of stringencies it's virtually
impossible to get a death sentence
intuitional for example you don't need a
simple majority to convict you need more
than that many many preconditions but
one of them is this they used to sit in
a semi-circle
that's how they set so they call see
each other and when the case was finally
heard and and the arguments were
concluded they began the vote and they
always voted from the junior to the
senior right they voted from the most
junior member of the Sanhedrin through
to the most senior was the reason for
that they didn't want anyone to be
influenced by prior senior opinion so
they voted in order of seniority so
imagine you you
you're gonna be the junior on this I
mean you have to be major to be on the
sanhedrin okay and we're gonna go around
in order and you're gonna be in the
final you don't mind giving you're gonna
be the final black belt tenth den you
know roofless shippers has a great great
genius of a generation they start voting
now there's a remarkable condition here
that the non-jewish world does not have
and that is that you need a majority to
convict yeah not just a majority you
need more than a majority of one to
convict but there's a remarkable quirk
here that the non-jewish world doesn't
have and that is that there's one
particular proportion of majority to
convict that in fact the quits there's
one particular proportion that if that
proportion of majority says guilty right
that unique proportion in fact
paradoxically it cuts the accused what
proportion is that unanimous if there's
a unanimous verdict that is guilty he's
free makes sense well the logic is
there's a lot to talk about here but one
one theme here is this that if nobody
could think of anything is in defense
there's something wrong with this case
first of all all Jews agreeing but all
Jews agreeing I mean it definitely
something wrong with that I mean this no
no okay but the theory is that somebody
has to argue in his favor somebody's got
to try out right say something in his
defense if there's no one to speak in
his defense then in fact paradoxically
he gets acquitted there's got to be
somebody who says innocent enough
imagine this mess on trial for his life
and the voting begins guilty death
guilty guilty execute guilty guilty
guilty every single member the Sanhedrin
says guilty until he's to speak and he
knows that demands guilty do you see the
problem if he speaks the truth and he
says guilty this man walks free actually
technically and halakha doesn't walk
free but he doesn't get one of the four
classic death sentences that they that
the Talmud yeah it requires at the
capital cases he would walk three
murders different but be that as it may
so now everyone said guilty and there's
one vote left if he says guilty which is
the truth this man is acquitted which is
wrong so what should he do should the
last dine on the Sanhedrin should he say
guilty which is the truth and have a man
who's guilty walk free or should he stay
in
sent to have him convicted which is the
truth
the Rambam writes he must speak the
truth a judge has to judge in Jewish law
the female Marcia enough rice has to
judge what is I see and if he says
guilty yes to say guilty this man walks
free that's his problem not ours that's
what he rules so he thought himself if
that's true I know what I have to do in
my case as you said and if I have to
speak the truth and the Pisgah Shiva
says wrong the two K's are not parallel
now to understand why they are not
parallel let's take a little detour and
go through some of the areas of this
fascinating question of whether one
person's free will in fact affect others
there have been two approaches suggested
to this I'd like to try to convince you
that either one of them is correct but
if you look in the modern literature on
this logic literature you'll see two
approaches to this presented and I think
very often mistakenly one of them is
presented as as valid or even the
dominant opinion but there's no question
there are two possible approaches to
this question one approach is that you
never affect anyone else at all all you
can ever do is act but you never are the
author of the outcome right in other
words the only possible interpretation
of a killing B is that B was going to
die then anyway that means a is guilty
for pulling the trigger for making the
choice and pulling the trigger and all
the legal consequences applies go no
question that the legal consequences
apply but he never caused the death it
wasn't going to happen otherwise
that means the truth of the situation is
B was going to die then anyway only
eight chose to be the agent but we have
a principle called a alibi should look
him the mocking Hashem has many agents
and have had not been for be pulling the
trigger a scorpion would have thing he
would have got a heart attack a brick
would have fallen off the building a bus
would have come around the quarantine
something would have happened and he
would have died in that's one possible
approach which means that you never do
something to someone else that's not
fair deserved all you can possibly
choose to do is to be the agent but I
hadn't been you it would have been
somebody else but that's one possibility
and superficially there are sources that
seem to say that for example the classic
source of all is Rosario GaN when you
look his writings he says something
dramatically clearer and as succinct
you know in those days they spoke very
short and very very clear and he says
something
exquisitely cleared he says according to
this approach when somebody dies
all that happens is a death becomes a
murder
isn't it beautiful you can't say it more
clearly than that right the death was
gonna happen anyway
that's called a murder had you not pull
the trigger you would at that know
instead of dying you got murdered but he
would have died then anyway he says two
things he says that if somebody kills
somebody else all that happens is that
death becomes a murder and he somebody
steals from someone else
well that happens it's a lust became a
theft but had you not had he not stolen
it
the person would lost the money anyway
because you can't do something to
someone else that he doesn't deserve
there's no part of his dispensation
Hashem is conducting this person's
affairs in direct response to what he
deserves and needs and therefore and
that is the superficial reading of rape
surgery on the other sources that appear
to same the same thing I'll try to show
you that I don't think it's correct I
think it's a mystery ting that you never
touch anyone else and you only choose
tact and possibly act in the world and
possibly even cause consequences but the
consequences would have been anyway
this of course is very reassuring from
the point of view of the victim because
nothing ever happens to you there wasn't
gonna happen anyway but it's very
problematic from the point of view of
somebody perpetrating it you're using is
free food free well in the world right
because it certainly seems that we are
the actors and imagine imagine imagine
this evening after this talk you get in
your car you're at lost in thought I
hope and as you back out some careless
idiot backs right into you and makes a
big dent in you and you'd say look what
you done to my car and the guy says
you're religious you aren't you and you
say yes he says well you must believe
you had it coming does that sit right I
mean you know well maybe technically was
it on the feel that way we certainly
feel that when we act in the world
we are the authors of what happens in
the world right didn't happen anyway
very hard to I see a lot of religious
conviction to keep reminding yourself of
that but that is one possible approach
however however amazingly there's
another approach and I think this is the
correct one and I'll try to prove it to
you and that is that your free will is
so real and so important you could do
something to somebody else that he does
not deserve one possible interpretation
of a killing B is that B was not gonna
dive in he was going to live for 25 more
years and they killed him
but now this is very concerning and
worrying for the victim this means you
could you could you're at the mercy of
human free will in a way that that
actually unlike any other dispensation
that comes your way
it's very powerfully it's very
empowering from the point of view the
person using is free will in the world
because don't forget if you don't say
this if you said that whatever you do in
the world is only administering to
somebody else what would have happened
anyway it means you can never affect
anyone else at all you can't help anyone
you can't harm anyone else you could
never do a mitzvah for example you
couldn't give someone charity it's
Tucker according to the first opinion
they were going to get it anyway
you get the Mitzvah there's no question
about it it's your merit there's no
question about that but that you
affected this life would be wrong
because you could never benefit someone
else if it wasn't part of his spiritual
dispensation so you got the Mitzvah of
activism in any way all your
interactions would be this way imagine
imagine you're an ideal Jewish husband
ten o'clock every night you make your
wife a cup of tea no matter how tired
you are exhausted I want a bad day you
make yourself a wife your wife a
delicious cup of tea and you bring it on
you feel like a big deal cause humanity
according to this way of thinking had
you not made it for her
someone else would have you know she she
hasn't counted you know had you not done
it she she's gonna get it she gets what
she deserves
kind of takes the teeth out of the you
know the feeling of your interactions in
the world right so so an according to
the second way of thinking the teaching
is and there many sources that say this
that you can affect someone else and do
something you can help somebody and know
that had not been for me they would have
died I saved their life not just
technically fit it into the role but it
would have happened some other way I
actually was the author of that of
course this this opinion doesn't claim
that it's always the case
the second opinion could readily agree
that most human interactions fit into
the first category but at least holds
that it's possible to do something to
somebody else good or bad that wouldn't
have happened otherwise let me bring you
some prisons a very surprising if that
sounds very surprising approach that I
that somebody could kill someone else
who is not gonna die that's that's
incredible
but a very very distressing thought but
let me prove to you that it's true first
of all first of all I'll give you one
very beautiful succinct
proof and then a more formal and better
known one here's the brief one you know
when we say Tuckerman we say value
Oh God David said to God new plan Nevada
sham let us fall into a sham sent key
Robin Rock'em f.cuz his mercy is very
great over yacht Adam Ally Pally but let
me not fall into human hand very telling
very telling
David Emmel our King David is facing two
possible options he's got to face two
kinds of dangers not he can either
choose a danger that is non-human in
fact what happened was a sham said to
him you're guilty of a certain sin and
you're gonna suffer but I'm giving you
the choice of what kind of suffering you
want do you want to go through an
illness and a plague that will affect
you in your people or do you want to
deal with enemy an enemy attack and have
it said I shall take the illness because
the illness comes directly from you and
your hand is kind but it's not trusting
a Philistine soldier very telling that
means it makes a difference where the
justice is administered by a sham
because that the contrary way of
thinking is every bullet has your name
on makes no difference the Ovid should
have set a flip a coin whatever I get
comes from you according to the first
way of thinking right whatever you get
is what you deserve
what difference does it make if it's a
hungry mountain lion or some kind of
pestilence or play or it's a enemy
soldier you're only gonna get what you
deserve if that was the right way of
thinking Davi would have said I sham
what difference does it make
but he didn't do that he said I shall
deal with you and not with humans he's
not trusting a human key rabbi menachem
of your mercy is great you'll deal with
me kindly but a human being might deal
with me cruelly right you see apparently
it makes a big difference by the way
there are so many proofs I thought of
one myself we've been going through the
researching for this book like there's
obvious sources one classic source is
this why with the Egyptians held guilty
for torturing the Jewish people when it
was predicted it would decrease there
was a divine decree hundreds of years
before God said to Abraham
they'll be enslaved in a strange land
they'll be tortured there be enslaved
etcetera etc exact prediction and the
Rambam says when there is a divine
prediction you have real trouble when is
divine foreknowledge it's enough trouble
but a divine prediction openly revealed
in the world how can you move from that
the logic should be an Egyptian should
turn to God and say I had God what are
you punishing us for we only fulfilled
your decree you decreed that the Jews
would be enslaved in our country right
so we did it what do you want from us
you should reward us when Joseph's
brothers sölden remember the story they
felt that he was an impostor and he was
a threat to them and threat to the
Jewish people in the future of the
history of the world and what happen
was Joseph approached his brothers and
they said behold this dreamer of dreams
approaches let's kill him and see what
becomes of his dreams yes let's kill
even areum my here McCollum waist up
let's kill him and see what becomes of
his dreams
Rohan explains at what they were saying
look at something foolish because his
language is very very specific and very
very explicit very clear he says that
they weren't speaking sarcastically
let's kill him and see what becomes
we're talking about people of cosmic
greatness every word is measured and
weighed and what they meant was this if
we kill him not only will we be correct
in our doing but we'll be seen to be
correct why because Joseph dreamed then
at some time in the future we'd bow down
to him right let's say he's born 17
years old and he dreams that somewhere
in the future will bow down to him not
which we believe is a completely false
non not a prophecy it's a false claim
that is complete illusion and he's a
liar at this point well if we kill him
now not only will we be just justified
will be vindicated because the moment he
dies it immediately apparent and will
never bow down to the future because
they're there for justice will be done
it'll be seen to be done so let's kill
him and see what becomes of his dreams
meaning the dreams are now falsified and
because he dies it's patently obvious
that we were correct beautiful plan so
Reuven the oldest brother stepped
forward and he said gentleman you're
making a serious philosophical error
mistake in a scoffer
you think that if you kill him it'll be
apparent that the dreams were false I'm
telling you an amazing novelty in Torah
approach to the world I'm telling you
that you could kill somebody who does
not deserve to die who had valid dreams
of prophecy and you killed him and you
killed the man who was not destined to
die and you mistakenly conclude that his
dreams are false but I'm telling you
that his dreams were true and we would
have bow down to him but human free will
is so important that our shams got a
step back and say free will I'm not
messing on a bird I'm not tearing with
it I created the world for your free
will I'll reconfigure the whole computer
system and the whole plans for history
I'll find another way but I'm not going
to controvert your free will and
therefore although his dreams were
prophetically true again there's a deep
philosophical problem here how could he
have dreamed something about the future
right
how could he have dreamed something
about the future that then doesn't come
true that's very very by the way
can you handle in the side in the
discussion here's an aside this is a
constant problem in Tarot by the way
there's a constant problem in Tarot that
people see a future thing and then it
might not be true but the partials were
going through now think about it's a
very challenging thing my should have
been a seasoned Egyptian beating a Jew
right so it says by FN Kovac I he looked
here and there via RT Amy she saw there
was no man simple interpretation is no
one watching and so he killed him deep
interpretation says Rashi
and the commentary say he saw that there
was no descendant of this Egyptian that
was worthy no good person would be
descended from in the future and because
of Mattie killed him in other words had
he seen prophetically that this Egyptian
would help some outcome some descent in
the future would be meritorious and
righteous he wouldn't have killed him
but since he saw that this Egyptian had
no potential future that means no one
ever came out would come out of him in
the future so he killed him
but the obvious question is this but of
course he's got no descendants coming
out of the future you're about to kill
him talk about it self-fulfilling
prophecy he looks into the future and
since there's no descendant but of
course not in two minutes ago to kill
him well how could you possibly what's
going on you see this problem and it's a
constant issue interim I give another
example yesh mal is dying of thirst yesh
Mel's buying her first hug or his mother
Cydia disease no one's seen the boy die
right s is about to die of thirst Hashem
is about to manifest her wealth that
will feed him give him water and he'll
survive as I'm about to make the miracle
of the revealing the world to hug are
the Angels say to God
the Angels say to God how can you save
him this is a child Ishmael is going to
grow up to be a man he left children his
descendants will torture the Jewish
people the burnished world Arab peoples
in referring to a particular incident
then when the Jewish people went into
the first exile the Arabs came to greet
them on their way out and gave them bags
that looked like they were water perks
to drink but they were filled with
compressed air and as the Jews tried a
drink they exploded and killed him very
crew killing them through water and now
you want to make a well of water to save
this young man he's going to descendants
who are so cruel how can you do that so
Hashem says tell me is he righteous now
and they and they say yeah said I'll be
judge people as they are now and so he
saved it so the Schloss obvious question
the Angels see a future in which he has
descendants of gonna kill the Jewish
people so what do they propose that he
should die now you've seen the future
already you've seen a future in which he
has descendants how can you apply now to
have a prophetically seen future
canceled you just seen it prophecy sees
the future you've seen that there's
going to people coming out of him who
are gonna be evil down the line now you
want God to kill him now but he just saw
that that's not gonna be did you see the
problem deeply paradoxical it's a
constant issue one of the approaches to
this issue the Schloss is he says this
when Moses looked at that Egyptian he
didn't see the future he saw the seed of
potential in him now and right now in
that Egyptian he saw no seed of
spiritual content that could ever
eventuate in to send us down the line
right there angel saw in your smile now
didn't see the future events of those
people in they saw in your smile now
their seed of a cruelty that could come
to expression later in that particular
fashion and therefore they applied to
have it canceled right but they see a a
a they sing an incipient reality of
potential that existed look it up in the
Schloss ox about it by you want
something long long p-paige as long in
which he goes through these types of
cases fascinating goes cabbalistic
explanation but that's a very beautiful
piece back to our subject
let's kill Joseph and see that his
dreams are false
Reuben said now that will not prove that
his dreams are false maybe the dreams
are true but free will is so important
and so potent that you could kill him
and you think you were right and you
were wrong so they said to him what
should we do he said see this pit it has
it had snakes and scorpions throw him in
there because no self-respecting
scorpion he's gonna touch anyone unless
he has decree against him because the
scorpions got no free will and therefore
an inanimate object or an animal and
non-human agent is never gonna do
anything to anybody else that isn't part
of his natural dispensation could got no
free will
the problem is a human hand acting
against him by the way the marled says
that the pit was not full of snakes and
scorpions because if it was full of
snakes and scorpions
if you throw someone in it that's called
homicide if you throw somebody if you
hold someone's head underwater and you
sad and kill him it was just a lack of
oxygen you culpable there that's
actionable in Jewish law not you
culpable for that so if there's a
directly homicidal Act then you are
definitely guilty but the moral says but
they were not snake
and scorpions in the pit that was very
dangerous not guaranteed death but very
dangerous because the snake or scorpions
gonna touch him unless that fits with
his correct dispensation and therefore
Ruben said I'm not against he's getting
his fate that is destined I'm just
against using human hand to do that
because then and it's very beautiful
since I yet see lay who me are dumb and
orihime says he saved joseph from their
hand he didn't save him from his fate he
saved him from their hand his language
is Miyata Beqiri from the hand of human
free choice and that's the message the
messages that a person will get what he
deserves as long as that is administered
by a nonhuman agency but a human being
who has free will could do something to
somebody else that could override the
natural dispensation because human free
will is so important that it is that
powerful in the world and this is a very
dramatic classic demonstration the szura
takes this piece about Joseph and
expands it and talks about it in great
detail the al-sheikh says the same thing
the malbim then then it's if all the
major commentaries say the same thing
about about Joseph and his brothers and
this is the classic demonstration that
you can do something to somebody else
that they do not deserve let's try to
take this one step further by the way oh
and I'm warning you you'll find lots of
sources that say there are two
approaches this is the wrong one orihime
is an outlier and and he's not right and
everyone else is right but but if you
look carefully
take for example of sad you're gone in a
municipal days he says that when a
person dies death simply becomes a
murder look very carefully it's in a
paragraph that begins very specifically
three lines prior the paragraph begins
like this he says when the human beings
walking down the street and has a decree
of death on him in those circumstances
when it dies the death normal for says a
man but he's only talking about a
scenario where somebody has a decree on
him already he that says nothing about a
case where a person is not agreed to die
whether somebody else will kill you so
there's no proof at all from the serve
subject and the higher self obviously is
exactly the same and I don't think I
don't believe there's any source that
says that whatever happens to a person
classic source that says that whatever
happens to a person was decreed already
and there are countless sources that say
you could certainly do something to
somebody that he doesn't deserve
now the next step is this are we
together so far any questions yeah you
said that uh there's a divine decree and
there's very few sources that could say
that this wasn't going to come true
because the freewill choice overrides
divine decree yeah I think everybody if
not everybody certainly must but I
believe everyone who comments on this
says that you could override intercut
divine decree because freewill is more
powerful than the divine decree we have
the example of King yes right he was
marked 77 generations
yes don't you touch it on the seventh
generation you kill buyers so everybody
agrees even the second opinion
Greece richly and clearly that there are
certainly circumstances where decrees
issued and cannot be changed that God
can override free will that there's no
question about that the only debate is
are the ever circumstances in which you
you could give me many examples of
people in Turin where their destiny was
inexorably fixed and nothing could
change that no argument about that again
I would be ready to admit that 99.9% of
events that happen in the world are
simply a human agent fitting into and
predestined the reality the debate is is
the every time where somebody could do
something to somebody else that was not
decreed you understand so even if you
write about a bad kind maybe it was the
greeter maybe couldn't escape that but
the question is by Joseph or some other
circumstance could you ever override
somebody's agree dispensation again the
argument isn't do Utah's human being the
human free will always override no on
the country probably most times they fit
very well the debate is could there be
human free will so important that it
could override in divine decree by the
way all the commentaries say that even
where human free will overrides a decree
it never happens without God's
permission and I try to explain that in
other words when the brothers are about
to kill Joseph God's going to look down
and say one second do I allow this it
will never happen without divine some
does so forced to say without a new
decree being issued in that circumstance
in other words if you found me a source
to say that everything that happens if
it's a divine decree maybe but the
commentaries say but which divine decree
whereas the pre-existing was the decree
now set up in line with this humans free
will that God now decreasing these
circumstances you deserve to die
are we saying that free will is so
powerful it can override anything no
this power of free will
is very constrained and by the time you
see all the constraints you'll see that
it comes much much closer to the other
suggested position and let me speak out
some of the limitations here's the most
important by far when we say that one
person's freewill can override another
we do not mean carte blanche to do
whatever you want we just mean and here
it comes listen carefully this is the
key that when somebody uses freewill to
affect somebody else you affect him in a
way that was not deserved and not fair
but only to the proportion that is
spiritually vulnerable we say he needs
more schools you need more merit to
protect yourself against the human agent
than against the nonhuman agent again if
you have more merit you'll be protected
we are saying that again whatever agency
comes against you has a certain power
against you but to protect yourself
against human agency you need to be
better spiritually or put it this way
you're more vulnerable to human than
non-human action or put it this way
people are dangerous because you hadn't
noticed people are dangerous more
dangerous than non-human now when a dog
attacks you or a scorpion or whatever it
is you in less danger that when a human
attacks you you understand because here
the issue of free will is that we'd not
mean you totally vulnerable with no
protection we mean you're more
vulnerable to humans just give me a
second to explain this to make it plain
take the case of total merit in Hawking
literature this is called sorry gamma
sorry gamma means somebody who's
impervious spiritually classic example
motor high moral highs sits in the place
where Hammond is walking past and he
decides to inflame his anti-semitic
passion to an absolute frenzy and what
does he do he deliberately sits we're
home on his walking past and refuses to
stand to bow down
driving into such an illogical frenzy
that he will self-destruct that's a very
dangerous game very dangerous game the
reason is there's a principle in Jewish
history called Eretz nitin a vineyard
Russia
it's a prosecutor you know if the world
is given into the hands of the wicked
again in case you hadn't noticed the
world is in the hands of the wicked the
world is not being run by benevolent
sweet kind people did what has been
wrong about people who kill you far less
than about no question about it
that's who runs the world and therefore
the world is given into the hands of the
wicked and the principle in Jewish
history at least in post prophetic
Jewish history is we walk patrone the
between the raindrops and we use
strategy we don't meet evil with a full
frontal attack because we will lose
but because the world the power is in
their hand and therefore we use strategy
and wisdom we don't use power and
therefore to stand in front of an
anti-semitism
all-powerful second-in-command of the
world and and inflame his anti-semitism
is a very unwise both but more to Hanyu
that he was invulnerable
for what reasons I'm not gonna going to
now but I knew that it was impervious
and he could use that to a court of
cause the showdown in which the new
Haman would lose so full house means
nobody could touch you no animal not a
scorpion or and no human being the
question is are you vulnerable the fear
was that Joseph might have done
something that made him vulnerable to
his brother's attack not deserving of
death he was genuine in his prophecies
but had he done something wrong in his
past he would have opened a of
vulnerability and on that human free
will Caramba
and therefore when we said that humans
are free will to affect you we mean only
in proportion to a spiritual
vulnerability if you have merit you'll
be protected and by the way it doesn't
have to be all merit it might be your
mother's might be Oh apps you might not
deserve to die
yeah is walking down the street right
and we trust to kill him maybe be maybe
I deserves to die but his wife doesn't
deserve to be a widow well here's some
crimes on the felt I used to ask him he
said he was guaranteed a share in the
world to come
he himself they said rabbi how do you
know he's my wife is such a Sudeikis my
wife he's so righteous for sure she's
going to the world to come they were
never put in there without me I mean no
one doing it they wouldn't do that
so therefore not therefore you better
marry somebody righteous okay because
you know in case you needed but the
point is that the police map your mother
and by the way if you want a practical
output of this question this is why some
people do not buy insurance now
insurance is a very good idea many great
rabbis safe should definitely have
insurance life insurance definitely but
there's a thinking like this mister is
walking down the street
here's not a life insurance policy
mister B tries to kill him it does not
deserve to be saved but a sham looks
down and says but your wife who's going
to bring on the bacon or whatever you
whatever you bring home I was going to
break you she needs you right where is
the mr. Hayes walking down the street
he's got a hundred million dollar life
insurance policy and a trust beat tries
to wipe him out God's look down and it's
gonna say your wife's okay
in some cases she's probably a lot
better off yes there and therefore this
is a very good reason to make yourself
as indispensable to as many people as
possible single-handedly support so many
poor families that when you a and B
tries to wipe you out as God's gonna
look down and say you know it's just too
complicated
I'll put up with you a little longer in
the world because a lot of people need
you right it's not the highest
motivation for stuck about its gotcha
you know and therefore this is part of
the calculation of how your merits could
protect you right against against other
people's removal
so the first factor here limiting this
discussion is you're not saying that a
person's vulnerable to free will and all
costs but only proportion to the lack of
your merit secondly the one acting has
to have free will we're not talking
about a fourteen-year-old arab who is
sent onto a bus where the bomb on his
back not talking about that we talk
about a person who's a bulb of Hira
there's no accident that the Torah
teaches it by those great Brothers of
Joseph who were cosmic figures for a
Shinto to change the whole dispensation
of decrees that were made before and you
need to be a somebody for good or for
bad you need to be somebody who wields
but here in the world so there's a
tassel here between the merits of the
recipient and the power of the actor
that both of us need to be real third
this only applies to individuals the
al-shaikh says it only applies to
individuals we're not talking about a
group when a group is threatened that's
a completely different dispensation
we're talking about a targeted
individual does he of the merit or not
groups are completely different when
groups are threatened there's another
whole calculus the were says for example
for O'Connor has a wonderful piece on
this imagine as ship is sinking with
lots of people on board why are all
those people dying at the same time two
possibilities either those were all
people who had the same moment of death
so they were all invited onto the same
cruise that's called Muslim enamel upon
dark ahead God as if I arrange the
ticket for all of them to be at the same
but possibly only one of them needs to
die now this just happened to be in the
wrong place at the wrong time
that's called Euler Russia le chameau a
very very distressing big difference if
it's the first guys scenarios
trying to escape is not going to help
you you invited there for a reason if
it's the second guys get the heck out of
it you're just going down because of
somebody else so
fourth this does not apply to masses of
people for example for example a war
wars have completely different rules
Mohammad sannyasi sees complete the
differences concession 5 Holocaust type
situations where there's a large numbers
of threatened people the ethic Ramona
says Kevin should Nitin rehearsal
emotionless Lashley's when the
permission is given to the destroyer to
destroy shove a norm of conveyance
article Raja
he no longer discerns between the
righteous and the wicked amazing thing
when a major disaster taken major
numbers of people are destroyed there
the commentaries say the righteous often
go first now the whole discussion about
why there is 5 this does not apply to
major movements in the world water for
example there are man says says is about
parade that major political leaders have
no free will at all this is called lave
melaka by jana shim the heart of a king
is in a sham sent but a major political
figure mayor of a large city a president
of Prime Minister a king they have no
free will at all but you know the irony
in Western society when a man is elected
president he thinks he has real power in
Judaism that's when he became a total
puppet at that moment lost all power of
free will in terms of what the people
need doesn't mean it's not guilty of
course is guilty but the people will
only get what they deserve because
nobody has the authority to move the
lives of masses in that fashion that's a
part of a history's march to its final
destiny and no human as it has so then
many many exceptions to this rule
many limiting factors but in general
there is at least a possibility of in
the right circumstances that somebody
could affect somebody else's free will
let's try and circle back to the
beginning of our discussion about the
three judges try to understand how that
operates one of the major sources of
Canoga speaks about this problem in two
places and appears to contradict himself
so does the surah by the way and
therefore we have to find a resolution
there's no way that on a major axiomatic
principle in judaism like this there can
be it can be the same author taking two
positions that's not that's not possible
let me share with you the two places
where he speaks about this show you what
appears to be the contradiction and
suggest you what I think is the correct
resolution here it is if you look as you
know is a classic work on the myths
right you can get an English today I
strongly recommend you all get a copy
you can learn every Shabbos you can
learn one Mitzvah beautiful but number
of weeks go by you don't know all the
mitzvahs the Chinook has a very classic
approach not only does he tell you all
the parameters of the Mitzvah he also
gives you what he calls me sure sure
mitzvah not only does it teach you how
the Mitzvah operates but why would God
want this for me why does God want you
to give charity why does he want you to
take a look why does he want you to send
away a mother bird what lies behind the
myths as far as humans can understand by
the way it's quite humiliating this is
an absolute classic in traditional
attrition was written for a 12 year old
it was written 800 years ago by an
author who wrote it his son was rushing
from it sir so I thought you know this
would be a good opportunity to cheat the
kids mitzvos so what a 12 year old was
able to relate to a little little
embarrassing for us but you know be that
as it may now the two mitzvahs that he
talks about which appear to contradict
each other
the first one is Reshma Reshma malov 240
241 and those are the prohibitions of
taking revenge and bearing a grudge but
you know in Judaism you cannot take
revenge you can't bear a grudge right
taking revenge means doing something to
somebody that he did to you and bearing
a grudge means not doing it but bearing
it in mind right I got it you got your
neighbor and you're saying can I please
borrow your lawnmower and he says no a
wheat lady comes to you and says can I
please borrow yours and you say no
you're guilty of nakama taking revenge
you're doing Tim what he did to you
Judaism that's not allowed what's
bearing a grudge you go to your neighbor
and say can I please bro you know man
who says no a week later he comes to
says can I please borrow yours you say
sure you didn't do to him what he did to
you but you reminded him that's bearing
a grudge right in Jewish law you say
nothing you given them all know they
tell a story about a man crawling
through the desert about to die first
and on the point of death another man
rode past on horse looked at him and
left him to die it left him abandoned in
today miraculously survived and a few
years later turned out to be the
president of a big business corporation
and one days office door opened and a
man came in begging for a job and he
recognized the face of the man who left
him to die in the desert if he would
have refused him the job he'd be guilty
of like in revenge if he give them the
job and remind him he'd be guilty of
bearing a grudge he said nothing who
gave him the job that's what you
required to visit you of course if you
judge him
to be unsuitable for the job right he's
applying to be the tender gentle
caregiver frail little old ladies and
and and and you feel he may be unsuited
to the task you can say no right you say
no because you know he destroys long
malice right that's fine
but not all of your personal animus
against the person right so that's the
problem now listen to this says the
canook why would God not want you to
take revenge listen carefully it's a
classic piece why would God not want you
to take revenge against other people a
bit taking revenge very sweet feeling
and a tremendously powerful human
motivation somebody hurt you you want to
do the same thing to that person why
would you like you want to take revenge
against this individual says the fellow
Hashem says don't do that you know why
because don't look at him where did this
come from when this person want you and
you want to harm him look to where it
came from
don't look to him when a man hits a dog
with a stick and the dog turns around
and bites the stick cause it's a dog it
doesn't know that a hand wheels the
stick when someone harms you right why
do you want to take revenge against him
look to the author of your problem not
the agent what does this sound like the
first approach well that sounds very
much like a first approach but here's
where here's where he contradicts
himself which shows that we must have
misunderstood this here it comes without
going into all the detail you know
there's a mitzvah called Adam Simon have
you studied that Ezrin very briefly in
torah law you have the following unique
situation
imagine you have a court case let's say
this person is on trial for his life two
other witnesses come along and
contradict the first two case closed
but that's called a kasha year
contradiction in fact all four witnesses
remain culture because we don't know
who's lying that's a classic case but in
Judaism you have a unique permutation
two witnesses come along these dude and
they say this man committed murder two
other witnesses come along and they say
we have no idea about the murder but you
couldn't have seen it it do not confound
the testimony they don't contradict the
testimony they impugn the witnesses you
were with us at that time at another
place you couldn't have seen it is this
clear in that circumstance the Torah has
a remarkable and unique
quirky sounding outcome and here's what
happens that first two witnesses are now
judged to be illicit framers of the
original accused and they because we
believe the second two and the first to
get what they tried to do to the
if it was a financial case they'd have
to pay the money it was a murder case
they get killed okay we believe the
second two
the first two are judged to be illicit
people framing the original person and
they get what they try to do to him but
there are two remarkable quirks to this
case number one why do you believe the
second two maybe the second two are
framing the first two but here comes a
second quote listen carefully and this
is very strange the first two witnesses
say the person committed murder the
second to say that you couldn't have
seen it here's the rule if the person if
these two these two are given the
quarter what they wanted to do that
person only if justice had not yet been
done if he had not yet been executed
means that this person's on trial for
his life these two say I murdered the
court hears the case and they convicted
like he's marched out to be executed on
the way to be killed these two come in
and they say stop a second miscarriage
of justice they're lying we call the man
back we hear them out we convict these
two the accused is freed these two died
but if the man's marched out to be
executed and he's killed dead and then
these two rush in and say they're lying
no case at all scot-free no case against
it is that weird they try to kill a man
and fail they get killed they try to
kill a man and succeeded no problem
is that weird listen carefully
the clinic says I'll give you a
consistent at least a partial reason for
this law and here it comes
listen carefully he says if these two
people accuse the person of murder and
he was taken out and killed do you know
why we do nothing to them he didn't get
to steal because what the guy that got
killed didn't get to see those two died
he would have benefited if he got to see
them like they're accusing him
because he must have had it coming he
never wouldn't got killed unless he had
it coming
these two could never have gotten him
killed if it wasn't right now which
opinion disappeared to be number one as
well
you only get what's coming to you and
here comes the problem he then adds one
line he says you know what person could
never get killed by best if it wasn't
his dispensation and his decree because
God sits together with her based in
Enochian it's of other scale he the way
quotes the verses elokim nitsa a de Sade
only God sits with every based in her
son Henry in fact some of our team cites
the only reason that humans are oven
ever allowed to administer justice who
are you to administer justice how do you
know you're right God says don't worry
about that you go through the motions
I'll assured therefore God sits with
every son Hedren he says it's a
principle of Jewish law it's a verse in
the Torah Hashem sits with every best in
every son Hedren and assures the outcome
and therefore if he died he must have
had it coming so far so good he has the
problem he must have had it coming
because God said to the best him which
means that justice is always correct and
you always get what the decree was but
only in circumstances over based in wash
M is sitting but some individual acting
unilaterally in the street absolutely
not
because if it was always the case that
you got was coming to you he wouldn't
have to quote the verse about our sham
study with the best in this is a
straightforward Duke right gentleman a
Duke Duke means a straight forward
inference it doesn't get simpler than
this in Torah an inference is if I give
you one case I'm inferring that case
only the reason if he got killed there
must be correct he says he's because
this was a base didn't our shame is
where the best in Parrish M is not with
the individual in the street acting you
know naturally clear inference that a
person could die in the improper fashion
in such circumstances which is the
second opinion you see that and
therefore we have to reenter stand the
first and so here's the correct
understand in the film and look it up
yourself the words are subtle we need to
work through the to the text he says
when a person hurts you don't try to hit
back at him out of a simple childish
revenge because he was spiritually
mature you don't look at him you look at
your D merits had you merited more you
wouldn't have been subjected had you
been a better person spiritually he
couldn't have touched
in other words of course we agree that a
person can do something to somebody else
using his free will but only to the
extent that you sleep on and therefore
he agrees as all our sources do that you
could do something somebody that he does
not deserve because free will is so
powerful that you could actually affect
other people's lives at least to a
degree that is greater than non-human
agency
let's come back to original case and
close the circle and we'll stop there
let's have any questions what was our
regional problem three people on the
best age you remember the scenario two
judges are lying and therefore he what
should he do he thought at 100 when the
Sanhedrin sits in the final judge has to
say his opinion what should he say the
truth you know why because this is
Hashem is sitting together with us
there's no way could turn out wrong you
follow the rules he says the truth the
man walks free he knows what he's doing
because I look him nits off but you
sitting on a basting with two jokers two
Liars basted in such a circumstance get
the heck out of this say I don't know is
that correct when you're sitting on a
valid based in and you disagree with the
two judges try to convince them you
can't convince them but virtue that's
what he wants but if you're sitting on a
vest anywhere your conviction is that
the other two are not are not wrong they
lying this is not a vest in a basin not
constituted of two people sitting there
lying through their teeth and therefore
he says this not similar to the solid
case of the Sanhedrin you say the truth
Hashem Stoics cares the result and the
result is guaranteed when you sit with
Liars that is not you have no assurance
of a divine dispensation yet and
therefore and therefore in that
circumstance he says you should
certainly sound on No and that is how he
would resolve the case okay since
summary what we studied this evening was
the very thorny issue of whether one's
freewill affects anyone else you will
find this written in many modern sources
that there are two approaches to this
not only that you'll find that the
dominant approach which is very
reassuring familiar for many people and
maybe that's the motivation here is that
you all you need is total faith in God
and assure me takes care of you no one
else can touch you and therefore you
know no one can harm you right you're
not your mother not your father not you
marry the kind of lady who needs a place
to park a broom
when she visits you neither cuz that's
not your perpend - anyway according to
this opinion not so people could affect
other people at least some degree in
some circumstances proportional to
various factors that could actually
manifest change in the world and this
simply is another expression of the
power and potency of human any questions
and he said that vane was in favor of
sending Joseph into the pit where there
were snakes and scorpions to test
whether this prophecy was true or to let
Hashem rule yeah so we seem to make a
binary distinction between humans having
free will and animals not absolutely is
there any argument to say that you know
naturally the way that the scorpion or a
snake is programmed is to attack and to
seek the pleasure of eating from the
flesh and therefore it's not really a
fair situation for music because they I
know what's follow the program nature
right whatever they their own
motivations are absolutely so you would
situation of dangers will depend on the
animals programming is he hungry Z not
hungry does he perceive and so
threatened whatever the natural rules
are but that's not like human free will
you know there's a very beautiful
example as well I think then it's if
says this you know when Daniel was
thrown into a lion's den very parallel
he got Joseph thrown into snakes and
scorpions Daniel was thrown into a
lion's den they've opened nets a'right
the King threw him into the lion's den
very beautiful it says this look at the
verses it's amazing he used read the
verse of this time he strikes you that
you never noticed this it says like this
that the king through you know what
happened there was a plot by the
courtiers accusing Daniel of being
rebelling against the king they wanted
to get him killed so the King decided
maybe the plots truth so this this Jew
who he actually was one of his central
advisors in fact the commonness is used
to worship Him he felt this Jew was some
sort of a divine figure but maybe he's
an illicit figures trying to ha me throw
him into a pit of snakes and scorpions
if he is all he's cracked up to be it'll
survive miraculously and if he's if he's
a traitor traitor he'll die so he
starved the Lions and he threw Daniel
into the Lions Den and then it says he
sealed the pit with a stone
he covered the mouth of the den of the
Lions with a stone so that the human
standing by could knit sneakily kill
Daniel with his spit with the arrows and
Spears and say that the Lions cuz then
be moved by the Lions and claimed that
the Lions had killed him that's what he
did in other words he was worried that
is that the courtiers whom he knew had
an antagonism for Daniel he knew that
they may want to make certain feel that
he might be protected miraculously
against the Lions and there they would
kill him so to prevent the humans
killing him he sealed the pit so he was
only dealing with lions so the tip says
what's going on here if Daniels not
gonna die cuz he doesn't deserve it
nobody's gonna kill him and he says not
so he knew that Daniel might be
vulnerable to to humans when he wouldn't
vulnerable to lions because he'd be
protected against the lies because it
got not free will they're only gonna
kill him if he deserves it but human
will human being so all bets off and
knowing that the king decided to seal
the pit so that not because he knew that
if humans killed him wouldn't prove
anything and therefore he wanted to see
how he would deal with lions only agents
that have no free will right very clear
very dramatic look at that the versus
clear and obvious yeah and there
countless examples of this I mean that's
just one yeah you were speaking about
about sort of leading up to a death like
Isaiah versus the fear other things but
I'm wondering if let's say we have a
case where we were totally convinced
that there was not a gazebo that this
was a something that shouldn't have
happened that it was from the hand of
man yet we still say Burroughs and Diana
net we still are afterwards
we are we see it in the same way as that
after that right tell you what
yes and I'll tell you why because all
commentaries agree that at the point of
the attack itself at that moment of
crunch is divine permission if not a new
decree that means when the human raised
his hand against another human being
technically what happens is this the
human
puts this human in a situation of danger
that's what you do
now the books are opened and the
spiritual world they say do you deserve
to be safe by the way that's the general
principle when any human beings in a
situation of danger the books are opened
it says when a woman's in childbirth
persons undergoing operation the Talmud
says you shouldn't stand under a ladder
or a leaning wall why not you only can
get what's coming to you
no you put yourself in a situation of
danger the books are
now we need to change the natural order
do you deserve it and therefore when one
attacks another we don't say kills if we
say puts him in a situation of danger
and in that situation do you deserve a
decree to save you or don't you and if
you don't then the person dies yeah some
goes so fast to say a decrees now issued
making you vulnerable to that individual
says now question the final common
pathway is God's will a decree God's
permission argument the question is
could you ever put some in this
situation a Benicia that puts him into
that which he wouldn't have been in
other words that's as far as it goes but
that's enough that's very powerful
that's the way to say it yeah so what
about that moment of the here from the
other agent opens up the books whereas
regular daily living is not so finally
and is only one possibility you being in
a medical situation of risk childbirth
putting yourself into danger that all
opens books by the way even if you
flaunt your good fortune in front of
somebody who doesn't have it he has a
woman who has ten children and she walks
up and down in front of the house of the
lady who's doesn't have any children at
all and the lady looks through the
window and she has a feeling of her pang
of a pain of gotelli see opens the books
the spiritual world when she thinks God
why don't I deserve that does that lady
deserve it the books are opened does she
indeed
yes when you a suicide or person harming
himself doesn't raise this philosophical
question because it could well be that a
decree of death is deserved by this
person because he's put himself in this
is really a by the way even there the
commentary say that if this person is
not meant to die at this moment for
certain divine reasons he wouldn't even
manage to kill himself because that
always overrides right the halacha
debate about suicide is are you obliged
to stop someone trying to kill himself
since he doesn't want to live do you
have an obligation to save his life and
second did you have an obligation to put
yourself in danger to save his life so
wrote another book about that and you'll
see a copy over there that's an even
better book you need to buy three copies
of that but that talks about do you have
EE how much risk do you have to put
yourself there to save someone else when
after all he you know he has values on
life at that point the bottom line is we
do we do do that but an interesting
logic about why we did it but they don't
have the same for this article problem
here we talking about you're putting
someone else in danger that he didn't
deserve when it's you you can say you
deserve that you do that to yourself
that you certainly have free will to do
that yes so anytime someone dies or gets
professing not among another person like
sitting with cancer and dies that's
always they had that coming this way
they were they that's a divinely
ordained we're talking about a situation
that's not due to any negligence nothing
but a long-term smoker we knew that it
was dangerous you're talking with
somebody yes yes not only that even a
situation caused by another human where
it's a child or a group a group thing or
somebody you understand all those
situations we delineated that are not
subject to this power of free will
absolutely and certainly an illness that
came out of it or suggestion or a child
is ill who never got into the whole
category of responsibility in the first
place and so many human situations but
it's clearly the ones that challenge us
more about the ones where you don't see
that where it does appear to be another
human being you know we don't see why
it's fair in yeah just
there's a certain reality because a
domino effect to the body or certain
things you might have done it won't put
your life effect in 50 years on the line
you're saying that we're not called
accountable for that because we can't
have any practical way of the cause of
my presentation there's a very deep
question and just to say one word about
maybe we'll finish with this there's a
very interesting spectrum of opinion on
that on that point and really what
you're asking goes to the heart of how
powerful free will is altogether not
just other people affecting me you've
asked a question I did something now 50
years down the line attest consequences
right all those really subject to my
free will at that time so there's a
fascinating debate about this and the
most extreme position there's a lot to
talk about here but I'll just tell you
one the most extreme position on this is
one of the great authorities Spanish
authority called up has died chriskiss
lived in the 1212 1300s fascinating
figure and he is classically assumed to
hold that we don't have free will at all
if you read superficially some of his
writings it seems that human beings have
no free will at all that's not correct
but if you look carefully what he says
is among the things he says is that
there are many aspects of our lives that
are not subject to freedom at all like
things 50 years down the line where you
are so deeply in the grip of a habit
pattern or a course of events that has
been set up that you could not do you
couldn't choose different if you tried
you might not even aware of an
alternative choice and you have no free
will but you got into that situation
through a deep course maybe many years
before where there was a subtlety of
choice and you and you took that line
and it could be now many years down the
line where the consequences are being
felt and you went out of the category of
free will now but you're accountable
you're accountable because of a deep
root of choice that was made he puts it
in two ways that's one way another way
he says he's even when you deepen the
grip of a situation let's call it an
addiction for one of a better world it
might be a little technical addiction it
might be a habit pattern at me if a life
process where you cannot choose
differently not only could you not do
differently you couldn't even well
differently you couldn't even choose
differently he says this and so you do
the action
anything you're accountable for is when
you do the action what's your other
attitude - do you accept responsibility
and not notify with it what do you feel
I wish I hadn't done that in your
repudiated and rejected as being part of
you that's what you're accountable again
much of your life maybe you virtually
all of it is no longer subject to
freedom of will your habits are formed
your personality is formed many things
in your life have taken a certain course
of action and you do certain things and
let's say those things are wrong and you
cannot be held accountable for them but
you are accountable for is what's your
in that response are you glad those
things do you accept them identify with
him or do you feel that's beneath me I
shouldn't have done that I wish I could
have been different
yeah when you do a mitzvah he says do
you do the midst as part of yourself to
identify with it and you rejoice in it
what do you do it out of a habit pattern
and don't rejoice in it that's what
you're accountable for in other words
the debate chair is how deep how
pervasive is your freedom of law is it
actually in actions is it only an
attitude is it only in some deep root
that was made long in the past it's a
fascinating debate but where this begins
and ends yeah last question tehilim like
so how much does that affect my mother's
sick so how far does that go any
spiritual merit whether it's your prayer
whether it's saying to heal him right
whatever good thing you be doing in the
world is elevating your spiritual
situation and others too if your
mother's saying it for you well you as a
Jew you as you elevate yourself you you
lift everyone we all organically bonded
right not just use the whole universe
organically bonded when when the Jewish
people sinned and where sherburn was on
the mountain a sham said to him you go
down because they went down he wasn't
part of it but he's the head of a body
and the feet step down he goes down -
and therefore any any activity right but
sure Santa used to say that when Torres
pure in Jerusalem so people in Paris
remain Jewish and when you do something
bad here the nerve center of the world
you bring everything else we organically
interconnected right this our
responsibility for each other by the way
ironically the Jews aren't always aware
of that the non-jewish world totally
aware of that the non-jewish world
always holds accountable for each other
right you do something as a Jew there
are no problem identifying us the truth
is they're right there is an organic
interconnect
and therefore absolutely when you
elevate yourself when you do something
wrong in private you harming me Rohan
and says that every sin between people
is also to ascend between you and God
and every sin privately between you and
cars also sin against people because
when you damage yourself spiritually
bring down the spiritual never forget
nobody else - and therefore in that
sense our free will is certainly
professor thank you very much