What does Inner-Child mean? How to reconnect with your true self? Nuchem Wosner LCSW

Today we are I am very very very excited to introduce a friend a person that I know for many many years was specialty is life in the life is and bosner very good uh licensed therapist as you're going to get to see throughout this conversation and uh and you know we only bring the best. So let's without further ado I'm honored and privileged to be here to having this to work with you for many years. >> Yes. >> And uh you're doing a lot for show in many different fashions. >> Thank you. And I can say definitely bring Mashiach closer. >> Wow. You know, people that I think that he could heal. He's a real healer. brain selfless authentic in the past many years ago and magic like magic. It's unbelievable. I wish I would have the time to go and uh my inner child and my my childhood you know I've done a lot of work I could always do more and um so I I I really appreciate and um so let's let's dive into this mentioned how long how long are you in this in this field? >> Yeah. Um I'm in this field. I graduated with my masters in 2012. Even before that I kind of was in the field but okay >> officially graduate 2012. So how many years is that? That's uh >> that's new. Yeah. 14 years. >> Wow. >> So yeah. And uh >> I want I want to ask you first you know um conversation I want to extract from you following. So um introduced at that time is given as train the practice EMDR. EMDR is eye movement >> desensization reprogramming. So and it does right >> correct >> is it still the hottest model out there? Is it still like items will deal with traumas or traits, you know, as a therapist is that EMDR or did >> I won't say the hardest model, but it's definitely a tool that's often used and a tool that I use often in therapy. Um, as you said, EMDR stands for eye movement, the sensation programming, what discovered like four years ago that when you bring up trauma and you move your eyes between right and left, left and right, it's called bilateral stimulation. It goes from your right brain to left brain back and forth. It reduces the trauma. Meaning the story stays a story. When someone goes through a trauma, you're not erasing the story, >> but you're taking away all the negative charge, the >> the toxic feelings around it. Um I have a light bar in my office which just makes it easier to follow the light back and forth. So personally, and that's what I heard as well um in my training, what I find it works best is for specific traumas. >> If the person knows what a trauma was, if it was a recent trauma or even a past trauma and we target a trauma and like we do session or after session and it gets reduced >> then then sometimes it works really magic. when you're dealing with more complex trauma, >> right? >> Like a traumatized childhood. >> Yeah. >> It's I often use it also as a tool, but it doesn't work as direct. It's it's a add-on to the therapy treatment. >> But when it works best specifically MDR for if you if you know exactly trauma whatever correct interesting I never knew that. But when it's more complex drama and it needs complex childhood was neglected or abused >> right fields on security and safety security specific very interesting I didn't know that works >> but it's it I mean I've sent people to it's like divorce at the times personality disorder real I don't know your border lines in Narc or something and uh and I got like a visage day traits and he's actually the one that told me about about about you. He was the first person that told me about you and he told me I sent my son to someone >> and uh and and said no this kid does not have a personality disorder. It's not it's just trauma and you you heal them and very successful >> and um so I remember that you know that that's that was actually >> wow. So what you're saying is that EMDR is still very much used and it's traumatifically useful for fears. Um more specific with trauma they are >> right. Got it. I guess you do a combination approach, right? And >> correct. Correct. Um I do a little something called IFS, internal family system. >> Um before going to IFS, >> yes, >> I want to bring up uh inner child work. >> Oh, that's inner child. >> Correct. That's what I bring up. Want to bring up. It's a longer conversation, but let's get into it. >> Okay. >> So, yeah. So, inner child. So, everyone is busy with inner child. You know in therapy when I started it wasn't that popular but when I started working with inner child today it's very popular and workshops people work a lot with inner child but not everyone has clarity what inner child is so what is inner child inner child means basically your true self your true self that you were born with now what happens when a person is born when a person let's start from the beginning Okay. When a person is born their the natural self, hypothetically, if a person would stay their natural self, then they would be the utmost self. They would be in their zone. They would be their their talents, their focused, know exactly what they need to do and just be confident, be loving, like be 100% themselves, their potential. >> Okay? But what happens is and Hashem did it for a reason because everyone has their tough kit and their tick on what they need to do in this world. A child is born into a family into a society into a system into a community. Now the child learns very quickly one thing that I need to fit into this let's start with the parents. I need to fit fit into this family. >> Okay. In order to fit into this family, every family has their rules so to say, unspoken rules. I need to be a certain way. >> So selfish self. Now the healthier the parents are, >> the more freedom they the more they understand to let the child be the child. >> The more unhealthy meaning the parents didn't do their own work. >> Um so there's much more restrictions even though they're not aware of. But there's unspoken rules sometimes spoken but even unspoken you have to behave a certain way. You have to be a certain way. >> Kid has to behave a certain way. >> Correct. So the kid learns he needs to shut their natural self. He needs to hide the natural self and needs to perform a certain way. >> So it creates like a uh separate entity. I have a colleague of mine who calls it LLC. like they they create the LLC like a fake fake themselves >> fake. Yeah. >> Because the real self they need to hide. >> So as a result the inner child the healthy child gets suppressed. >> Mhm. >> And then it gets developed a unhealthy child. Wow. >> Which performs and needs to hide and needs to protect to make sure that you got to behave otherwise you won't be accepted. You won't be loved. You can't behave this way. You got to do this. You got to look a certain way. You got to do certain things. >> So the men basically create a facade. creative whatever naturalis like when I mention is full of life full of energy. >> Yeah, he speaks of correctly. >> Exactly. The sooner you see the baby, the more natural you see. Like whatever >> he wants to cry, he cries. He wants to laugh, he laughs. That's why people love so much babies because they're natural. >> An adult who's behaved natural. The facade in the in the back in the mold was more decided is upset, you know, the the um the uh the narcissistic tribe. The narcissistic tribe like tribes groups, families, communities, right? Standard norm is narcissistic. Well, so >> it's not natural. >> It's not natural. >> It's not natural who you are. >> And you don't let the person be natural because the narcissistic trial, >> right? A tribe >> has to fit into the family system, the community system, right? Right. Right. and both generation narcissistic is a strong word but some in some cases it's probably narcissistic some cases just habit and people like they don't know something else that's how they train that >> there's a certain way I need to be in a certain way and my kids need to be like >> they don't know anything else like and the natural selves get suppressed press more and more and more and more. But you know there's a lot of movement happening the youngsters where correct >> they starting to Hashem has a way we'll come circle back because I want to get to something called inner adult >> but to your point yeah has a way out how to wake up generations and uh we're the millennials um which is way more emotional, way more feeling. They already clashed with the parents. The next generation is Gen Z. >> Gen Z. >> Like, forget it. Like, they're born like with more consciousness, more smartness, and you can't lie to them. >> You can't you can't fool them. They just know the truth. And if you push them too much, they're either going to rebel or they're just going to go their way. But um you're right, the younger generation, >> they're fighting to be >> the inner child, the inner the inner self, in the truth. >> Inner self to live with truth and to live with emas with consciousness with podcast eventually. Isn't >> that beautiful? and and we're gonna formality correct talking about zu I I see this work in general this work is towards gilaputus to personal personal gilla said that gilaputrus needs to come before gilus >> and nim says that every person same concept needs to bring out their part their mashia their part of mashia Um which means that before Mashia comes we need everyone needs to be themselves. You know what >> and when the whole class show is going to be themselves >> and have their own guil then >> yeah automatically the collective is going to be ready from Msiah. >> Wow. But there is definitely a part of doing our work to do our guilt and heal ourselves >> to get ready for for resistance middle healing and healing and it's like regular self works. So basically yeah named after and named after him. Wow. Yeah. Um, yeah, there's resistance. I mean, it's it takes it takes takes a while. It's it's a few things. First, some of the previous generation, they >> they have a different consciousness and they have they have a different tough kit on this life, you know, like >> they started after the war and uh they needed to just bring up a new generation and >> the kids of the war, Holocaust survivors completely suppress their emotions, >> right? It's not blaming anyone. That's how it was. And like they have a different tap kit and from one generation to the next generation, it's not only understanding, >> right? >> And there's a lot of healing modalities. First, you know, like people are so thirsty and they try everything. Not necessarily everything is exactly right. So it takes a while to figure out, you know, exact right healing. >> Yeah. But I want to get back to inner child. Yes, what I find works >> uh what I find works and um I think uh with my experience throughout the years that that's a crucial point in healing and when people get this then it's it's a breakthrough that a lot of people don't get. So we spoke about the inner child. Now you talk about inner child when does the adult start? So people think adult let's say starts by 18, right? But it's not like that. The adult starts together with the inner child. Why? Because as I said before, the child learns that he needs to behave a certain way. He needs to suppress certain emotions. Now, who is on top of him to tell him that he needs to suppress certain emotions? He needs to behave a certain way. Who is the one telling him? It's like a voice in his head telling him, right? >> That voice is called the inner adult. Wow. >> It's like the masculine and the responsible part that says the child behave behave. >> Is that the maybe >> might be? I never thought about that. >> Thought about that. But there's definitely the masculine feminine concept. >> Very interesting. >> The child is more the feminine and the adult is more the masculine. So adult but as soon as as soon as behaving a certain way comes comes unhealthy adult and and like criticizes him >> like don't do this don't do this it's going to be bad for you it's going to be bad for you he learns from the adult in his life and he does the same and even worse you know like the way you talk to yourself you don't talk to anyone so mention that's correct. [snorts] >> I have you know this voice. >> Yeah. So that's why the first step in healing the first step in healing is to stop criticizing yourself. >> Stop judging yourself. It's not an easy step. It's not easy step because people they talk to themselves like they talk to no one like every second of the day like you got to stop judging. I got to be on top of it. Like stop judging yourself. Stop criticizing yourself. Like make it as a habit. Start to be aware when you judge yourself. You criticize yourself. And that's got to stop because as long as you're busy criticizing yourself, you're not going anywhere. >> Because imagine you want to get somewhere and you have someone screaming like every minute of the day. So that's I'm just going to the voice of some of the listeners. >> Correct. So I think that's the biggest misconception what I tell for B for example when like example like let's say you learn one Mishna and you just like compliment yourself or you learn But which boy will faster succeed? So that's the biggest misconception. No question about it. Because people naturally want to grow. >> If they feel good in themselves learn, why should they learn too? And why not learn next? a human being. >> He's going to drain his energy eventually. It's like okay. It's like I'd rather stay in bed than like >> so it's like raising the bar high achievers financ Ed [snorts] with guilt. He's never happy with himself. But I I can imagine this the same issue. And then they inner child and then he just gives up or he gives up or he just Okay. Is is is that okay? >> Yeah. The kid grows up believing in themselves. Kid grows up that doesn't have to be perfection. That it's good that the way he is and he can grow from there. Definitely. Definitely. >> But let's go a step further. So, >> so this is the unhealthy adult. So, we have unhealthy child, healthy child and unhealthy adult and healthy adult. So, how do you switch from the unhealthy adult to the healthy adult? By stop criticizing yourself and start to build a relationship with a child. >> Um, someone that does a love for cl that uh is a loving person really helps people out with his in ask me how come that people love me and people like I gain so much from my from my love from what I give them but somehow I can't benefit from it. I can't benefit from why not like why am I not getting the benefits everyone gets so I told him that's exactly the point because you're used to from a very young age to criticize your child to come from an unhealthy adult to other people you start from your healthy adult like you don't see them as bad you just you're an adult you have a brain you know like what to tell them and that's where you give them now the switch which is not easy switch but as The crucial switch is to start to be a healthy adult to your child. >> Stop criticizing him and start build a relationship. Now the relationship part is is very crucial because you need to get to know your inner child because it was suppressed for so many years. As interesting as it sounds, the child hides himself from you. Doesn't trust you. >> Wow. >> Does not trust you. like he doesn't didn't trust the grown-ups that weren't nicest to him. He doesn't trust you. Why should he trust you? You're always criticizing him. >> He hides himself. He hides his feelings, his deep feelings. He's not going to show you. But but he always lives in a conflict because he always feels the inner child. Again, it's parts, but it's the easiest language to talk to like inner child. your true essence, your inner child feels that he needs to be suppressed. And what you're acting, your fake life is, you don't take him into account, you don't mean his favor. >> Mhm. >> So either he gets very depressed because no one looks at him and no one understands him or he gets very anxious like >> fight of flight, fight. >> Yeah. acts up in many different ways. [snorts] And people can go on for years sometimes, but eventually there comes a point where like the child like has had enough >> and would either like shut the system or like you're not going further until you look at me or which is great havoc, you know, like where you running, you're running, running, running, but you never look at me. So therefore, you need to start to get to know him just like you would date someone literally like I want to know >> adult to get to know you deep apart. How does that look like? How do how do you how can a person practically actually do that? >> Good. So >> my inner child and my inner adult, >> right? So practical way is um there's two main ways which I like. One is journaling. >> So if you're righty, you write with the right hand the grownup and the left hand child. >> The benefit is because you write with the left hand, you need to think more and it comes like more from your heart. >> More from the subconscious. My wife was trained in that. I don't know what it's called. Left hand writing. So >> probably but simple. With the right hand, you write from the adult. you ask questions and uh the left hand answer >> and you'll be surprised. It might take a little bit till the jaw trusts you. >> Or another good way is like to lally role play um with a teddy bear. It might sound funny but >> it works. You take a teddy bear which represents your inner child and you ask it you know like how are you feeling? >> And then you can switch air or like hold the teddy bear and let it ted bear answer you. Wow. >> And it takes time to build the trust. But when a person practice that, they'll be surprised that child starts to answer >> like I feel this, I want this, I want this. Now the first thing usually you'll find is a lot of deep deep buried emotions that you always run away from. There's three main emotions. There's sadness, fear, and anger. And all of them are carried in the body. It's not only in the head. The body carries you trauma and at some point needs to be released from the body. Um anger through like literally expressing the anger, fear like through shaking and the sadness eventually through crying. Um but the first step is to tune into the child and like cons like what do you feel and like literally trying to understand what it feels and maybe it wants space for half an hour to like you should witness the sadness with it. You should feel the sadness. You should be with it and the next day maybe it wants two hours as much as it wants. In the beginning it will want more because you've been neglecting it for many years. >> Yeah. Yeah. But the more the child will see that you really mean his interest, you can't fool the child. That's the thing. >> You cannot fool. No, no, no. >> Actually, exactly. But if the child will feel that you really mean his interest, >> meaning he finally decided to commit to yourself that I don't care about anything else like I want me. I want to know how I feel and I want to know what I want because I want to live full committed whole life. I'm done with playing games. I want full healing of full unity with myself. The more the child will mean will see that you mean serious. It will start to trust you. And once it trusts you, you'll get rewards like 10 times. >> Wow. >> It will start to guide you. You'll get back in touch with your intuition. Because when we're traumatized and when we live this way, we're disconnected from our intuition. >> Wow. >> People think only women have intuition. Men also have strong intuition. >> But they train themselves to operate just from the brain because they disconnect from their heart. But the more you connect to your real self, all of a sudden your intuition will tell you exactly this is what I want. This is what I don't want. This is good for me. This is not good for me. Should I go there? Yes. Should I go there? No. Should I do this now? No. Wait. Should I do this now? Yes. You'll be surprised. Your inner self will give you the guidance. The person has all the guidance in themselves. >> The reason why we disconnect from it because you're not listening. You're not asking. You don't care what he wants. You only care what society wants. what your family wants what I need to fit in to for this job for this to look good to like of course you don't have intuition because it's nothing to do with you ask going what they because they decide for you >> right >> it's not you >> you don't consult with yourself you don't not interested what you really want you're busy to someone else >> right >> but the more you commit it to yourself you get in touch with yourself and that's towards living a more full life so the relationship ship takes a while. It takes a while. >> Relationship between the inner adult and the inner child. >> Inner child. >> So this is this is never >> and and this is this is I'm just trying to think if people listening what what they would want me to ask you. >> Sure. >> Honest. [snorts] >> Yeah. >> So if someone would say he listens and p I need to think into this. This is this is deep stuff. Beautiful stuff. These can make sense. >> Yeah. Yeah, we can elaborate more. Yeah, >> elaborate more. So, I'm trying to think. Okay. inner child. What is that inner child? Why can't I just >> I would say it's it's called non like your your deeper self. >> Wow. >> Um your true self, your essence I think is more emotions. >> The is is the is the is the in the is made the lungs and the liver emotional parts. So is aligned that when Alice is aligned is the serenity. So >> yeah. So I'm not sure to be honest about I what I remember is that there's like in every level there's >> in the level >> so this probably in the inner child but it's the deeper self your your heart. Exactly. [laughter] >> So, but to answer your question, I would say very simple. smooth. There's no way I'm going to able to convince you because this is hard work. >> Yeah. >> Because you know, the person's got to be correct. But the person's got to be ready to look at themselves and to look at themselves. So when a person listens to their spouse and kids >> but look like there's nothing I can do about it. >> When a person comes to me and says my life is stuck. I don't feel I feel sad. I don't feel happy. I feel stuck. Okay. I don't know. So then I'll say the reason for delay but you still connected is an inner child hurt >> for sure. Yes, it's right. It makes sense. >> It's one. >> It's one. The more you connect to yourself, the more you connect to Hashem because the natural self, the natural wants to connect to Hashem. >> Desire. So the desire, right? elaborate. Yeah. You learn to like live life. expressions on anger express. Exactly. Inner child. Yeah. Absolutely. Excited. He was so in love with God. >> Yeah. Sometimes you'll label the child ADD or medicated him or like stuff that fit in the box like but certain was was trying or like this is this is prison for me. I want to live I want to live like I want to feel the I want to confidence. So he loves music. by the neighbor of the piano. Correct. >> For sure. >> If you're not connected to yourself, you can't be connected to your wife. Yeah. Right. Yeah. But mentions, right? fight with the other definitely live more real like >> more real. >> Yeah. I'm not saying the better, but definitely live more real. >> The more emotional you see the way they sing, the way they dance. >> Yeah. >> He's upset, you know. forsake me. Correct. So I want to hear the explanation because we come from the cup systemized and like >> the bank like in the cup >> somehow in the endotal >> and and you feel the you feel like the like it's it's it's hard. It's like Yeah. Reconnect is a human. >> Yeah. There's definitely Right? Love and fear, love and all. And this is emotions. This is feelings. I had feelings. So, I'm sure I know the previous podcast there you spoke a little about spiritual trauma. >> Spiritual trauma. Yes. >> So that's the point when I feel they get traumatized for this. But like I think this tra. >> All right. >> I said the word miz, but some like a mistake. >> Yeah, I know for my [snorts] personal journey when I was reintroduced to to Yiddish, it's it's it's a whole different uh it's a whole different game when you when you learn that it's real. >> It's real. It's it's you're connecting. You feel the mitzvah. You live the mitzvah. >> You're enjoying yourself. That's Yeah, that's how you're supposed to live. >> A lot of lot of movements. >> Wow. >> So, let's go. So, so the inner child we we spoke about. Wow. Such amazing. >> So, the goal is to to to build a relationship. >> The relationship between the inner adult and inner child. >> Now, I called it relationship. relationship meaning like it always needs maintenance until it becomes one but it's like very high maj >> okay >> but until you get there just like the relationship with your wife you can't like one day say like okay neglect doesn't work like that >> doesn't work like that >> you got to be invested but the more you do it the more you get in love with yourself and the more you learn to to listen to yourself and do only stuff that's good for They said you like Is that selfish? >> Absolutely not. >> That word that you just said, do what's good for you. >> Absolutely not. Cuz you got to you can't if if you're working against yourself, if you're working against yourself, it's going to clash. It's not real. When a person say, "I'm going to help the other person that's codependent. I'm going to help the other person on my expense," >> it's going to backlash. When a person learns to be in a whole with themselves, naturally they want to give for others. >> We naturally want to want to give for others. If you're in full with yourself, that's not selfish. That's like you're in touch with your desire, with your essence, with what you want, with who you are. And yeah, conscious decision number one. Number two, let's use example from a wife. Yeah. >> Subconsciously, what happens when you act in this place? >> You expect your wife to give you. You don't give for real. It's not pure. M >> you deny yourself because but subconsciously it's >> because wow >> if the person can fill up themselves they give from a pure place because they don't expect in return they give from pure place and then it gets in return natural is like in Atlantic It clashes. It has to clash. >> Very clear. >> If you're come from pure place, even fulfilled, I know what I want. I know what I need. I take care of my needs. I I can ask for my needs. >> I can stick up for myself. I can make boundaries. I know I'm clear. I'm free to give you. >> That's real. Wow. Beautiful. See what happens is it's not real is pure. inner adult my inner child relationship what's good for me you know and then from that place I decide to also do that's a beautiful thing to earn a present Correct. Definitely right away. It's like it's like keeping resentment and if you're not working on but the initial reaction but somebody otherwise you teach him to suppress his emotions first emotions you need to feel your emotions. Just like we spoke and then eventually correct 100. Exactly. You deserve the basics. Not really the basics. Like we deserve everything. We You're right. Yeah. So deserved. [snorts] The basics. breakfast. Next double for the nine. basics. The basics, but other than that, you deserve it. >> You do deserve it. So, also what I've heard as a gift. Um but I think the where I understood came to deduce the fact that it's was something the way but I think in this generation I don't think it's for our generation especially at least for the most of us rather teach >> but taught us to transform the asal Wow. Wow. That's like says why no restrictions that's the way emotionally mentally physically aligned and straight and and healthy and I get the relationship in the mind inner adult and inner child >> correct >> and and emotions often feels the feels the feels the leap shaft. >> Wow. >> And you get closer to yourself and closer to Hashem. It goes hand in hand. >> They self heal all the traumas and all the pains from childhood. >> Of course. Wow. These difference made healthier made aware of some emotions. >> Definitely. Definitely. What's the difference? >> Our generation like did the the heavy lifting >> because many of our parents were completely shot of emotions. >> Yeah. >> So we had to like momish grind through and like open up the emotional part. Now our kids already grew up like emotions are way more natural. So like they grew up in a more healthy environment easier for them to hunt more space. Yeah, definitely. emotions connected able to articulate, >> right? >> So, so that's that's making them more resilient. Is that making them more resilient, more healthy? Again, depending how healthy the parents are, how they dealt with their trauma, >> right? But if the parents are relatively healthy then the children are have >> so and so he said that you know the four S's safe secure scene suits right I me feel secure exist My kids are the kinder. >> Every child's unique. Every child is unique. And this trauma, you know, it's a bullying. >> Absolutely. neglected emotionally. I feel bullying, divorce, terrible divorce, terrible marriages, traumatizing marriage, terrible trauma. So you could see if the child if that person had a healthy childhood it makes it totally you see that >> yeah absolutely that that is the trauma that is the basis the younger you are the more it affects you if you had like complete healthy childhood then it's it's still work but it's easy to to get over compared to when you had the unhealthy childhood you have no basis of safety >> then your trauma is like you keep on circling with your trauma. You don't have where to land. You don't have like like any support any like >> your systems havoc to begin with. Now add trauma just spins more and more and more. You don't have where to molested right is showing a problem. >> Correct. >> The end of the trauma >> and that's created the trauma >> that's created the trauma >> lines. So, how do you know you're successful in parenting? If your child feels comfortable to tell you anything that happened to them, that's when you know you succeeded. has given him the tools for the men whatever you know correct fear of enough help and I failed something. I am missing something in my absolutely such a big approval feedback. Wow. Maybe in the room. But I remember when I dealt with it, it was very painful. I was so confused. >> And I I remember that. So when when a kid goes through something like that and he that's a problem correct feel. So it boils down to a healthy nervous system. So when a child grows up with safety with love the nervous system is calm. If the child doesn't grow up with safety then the nervous system is the body holds the trauma. The nervous system is is havoc. So we need to heal nervous system. We need to build a safety >> right. >> So it's part of the relationship with the child is you start to soo the child like and you can do it yourself. >> Even though as a kid you need it from your parents but doing the healing you can s you can learn to soo yourself. You can take bats or you can take like heavy blanket or like a pillow like you can soo yourself >> and just >> and the more you're soothing yourself like you're healing the child that's the child that's alone the child that's >> and slowly you're restoring your nervous system. >> Wow. You're sending a message. So it's outside in type of thing not inside out. Inside out conversation >> you come with a healthy adult is the same concept. The healthy adult says you know like I want to I want to cuddle you. I want to feel your pain. I want to hold you. No one held you. Allow yourself to feel your fear. >> Allow yourself to feel your sadness. I want to hold you. >> Like you hug yourself. You're like take a teddy bear. Like whatever it takes. >> Wow. People think it's a great huge physical restoring your nervous system. >> Yeah. >> The child feels finally like someone is soothing me. Finally someone is >> is listening to me and taking care of me and like holding me when I cry. >> But I see in marriage it happens a lot. Uh that's my biggest field, marriage counseling. And so many men get married. They're they're real masculine men in the child, a hug and a cuddle. >> All right. >> Reverse role and confuses the spouse like correct the man will gain the leap shaft you know. >> Correct. The bigger issue is that the spouse will never be able to fill it 100%. You always will stay hungry. >> Wow. >> As long as you don't learn to give it for yourself. >> Wow. The tools and the techniques. >> Now you're an adult. You're not a child anymore. >> Right. >> The the you know the parents have lost their chance. Now once you once you're an adult, there's only one person that could fill it. It's you. >> But I see >> a spouse adds support. It's beautiful. It's loving. But if you depended only on the spouse to regulate you and you can't do it yourself, it's going to continue as being a cycle. >> Wow. >> Wow. Amazing. >> The work is learn how to soo yourself. >> How to soo yourself traumatized, but you can learn. It's hard in the beginning, but the more you do it, the more you get a feel of it, the easier it gets. >> Interesting. >> You can allow yourself to feel your feelings. that was shut down for so many years and you can learn like it's safe to feel when I do this work with clients like I tell them repeatedly it's safe to feel like clients have been through crazy trauma or stationation and like it's safe to feel safe to feel I demonstrate how it looks like a healthy adult to hold them. >> Wow. >> But he can learn to do it for yourself. It's safe to feel. It's safe to feel. I got you. I got you. It's safe to feel. >> Is there Is there a I'm sorry. Is there a Is there a cure? A real long-term cure for a person that was neglected, abandoned physically, mentally abandoned. I know many many personality disorders come from abandonment. We know that, >> right? >> Is there or are there going to be like feels abandoned. I have very [clears throat] common over here like definitely this is exactly exactly and then the last father she got married but she feels abandoned she feel she's a great woman otherwise she feels abandonment is there >> yeah if If a person wants to heal and is ready to face it, that's exactly the point. They need to reach a stage where they're ready to face their feelings, the abandonment, extreme aloneeness. If they allow themselves, they learn to allow themselves to feel the abandonment by yourself. >> Ouch. >> Feel it and learn to suit it. It's going to be tough, but the more you're going to do it, easier it's going to get once you because it has to be felt. It's stuck in your system. And if you just as we said, if you're just going to rely on a spouse, it's never going to heal fully. >> You got to give your space to allow yourself to feel it like ouch and suit it. And the more you do it, it's going to slowly heal. >> Wow. >> Okay. That's amazing. It's amazing stuff. And um I think that wow, there's a lot to digest. This a heavy conversation in the field. >> Yeah. Is there anything else you want to say um about the inner child that that you feel that that that maybe you know I veered over the conversation a few times purposely well but is there anything that that you feel I mean obviously >> yeah to continue build a relationship continue build a relationship and >> between between the >> between the let's to simplify it between the feelings ings [snorts] and the the one that can hold space for the feelings. >> So think of it as if you have a child, right? The child is is natural. It feels something. It wants to do something >> and you as an adult you know like can listen and understand the child and guide the child and >> right >> but the first step so as you said the first step is stop criticizing yourself. >> Yeah. >> It's very important to remember because as long you're criticizing yourself you're not getting anywhere. Stop criticizing yourself and start to get to know yourself simply like what do you feel? What do you want? >> Wow. start to get the >> word should be what do you want or what do I want should be the thought >> first what do you want because it's still fully separated >> talking so so so a person should see himself like two parts this I mean obviously there's a million parts but we're talking about not the IFS parts >> right it's it's >> especially in the beginning >> eventually becomes more and more one but in the beginning it's not enough like that's why it's important to role play because if it's just in the head it gets confusing >> in the beginning keep it separate you know like to understand >> what is it I want >> Mhm. >> like the >> unhealthy adult and what is it the child wants and let's start communicating. Let's start to to work together. >> Wow. Interesting. Let me ask you another question. Um if someone was molested and betrayed, molested by uncle, by and it stopped for some reason. and the parents found out and and he's 18 19 years old. Do you think do you think he has to go for therapy? Like how do you deal with or or even bullied like this is unfortunately extremely common. >> Well, if someone's already married um I would say the same answer as before. If you see life going straight, no one molested bullied friends other >> definitely because marriage can trigger definitely trigger it right you know I don't want people to get phobias no that's definitely worth check it out you know right so What I do want to add is uh since we're dealing with Yiddish. >> Yeah. >> So it's important also like what I find and what's obvious that the real healing for let's say doesn't work without connection to hashem and connection to sadik. So it needs to real you know like asking Hashem for healing and sadik and sadik are powerful sadik and sadikum they're connected they're they have their channels there's sadikum in our generation and there's we have here my we have the rim lucky >> saday said the reason why there's so many of them in my because the rim doesn't have oil so his light spreads and all >> wow Yeah. >> But mama loving father he gives graciously. >> I just came back from >> besides uh also must be a deep healing >> must be a deep healing. So like and there's many more famous story. You know the story. like very angry, broken, whatever. No. Wow. Slowly obviously like the power of expressing because people are afraid to like express anger toem or like can handle it express be real and like >> that's how you build a relationship. Right. So there's many different ways connect. We can light a candle. But there's so many generations. Every person can find their tadic like because we need it's >> to get to real healing to to the core to all the way to >> you need you need help. I'm going to ask you the biggest question. >> You need help and yeah, the ability to change Allah >> in the what would you change? One or two or three things that the kids should grow up healthier, right? I haven't thought about it because I like to like uh [laughter] to come from within you know like uh create the change from within but now that you're asking me the first thing comes to mind is like to focus on like the sole focus should be like where can you find like what can you enjoying the learning like the focus should be how you can enjoy make that a project make that priority vis creative is enjoying because that's a >> yeah right so I know. So you would say that focus. Wow. He realized they recognized the he can learn to enjoy Shabas. You can learn like shabas is such such a light such a connection like you can literally learn to connect to connect to the shadows to feel the shadows. It's one example but with but >> yeah that's going to do the real healing. >> Amazing. So obviously >> teenagers and adults you don't work with little kids. >> No I used to not teenagers and adults and >> Sure. 845 558 2938 >> 84558 >> 2938 >> 2938 Okay, >> put it in description. So it's very important. >> Yeah. >> And as you said before, you grew up in Montreal. >> Yeah. >> Definitely special. Definitely just picked someone mentioned his name. Yeah, someone mentioned mention definitely like the way he listens to people, the way I can say. >> Yeah. the way >> no doubt healer >> and wow and then this is something connection All right. Amen. The only reason it's difficult is is because you earn it. It becomes yours. It becomes yours and then it lasts. >> Yeah. And the way you need to work it through psychology is every page. >> Yeah. It's it's it's real. It's it's real. Sure. Sure. [laughter] >> Um, [sighs] when it comes to >> Yeah. >> Many times people say, you know, I did all the work, my spouse is not doing the work. How can we get someone to get, you know, it's like the question, how could I get my husband or my wife to go for help? >> I would say [clears throat] I would say you can't. >> You can't. Keep on doing your work. >> You do you. >> You do you. Keep on growing. >> If the child has if child if the spouse has any willingness to grow, they'll eventually grow it. If they really don't, it will come more apparent, you know, like what you're dealing with and it's going to be your choice. But you can only do your work. You can only do your work. But the hope is that if you ta do your work, taka focus on yourself and let's say it's you know the husband and the wife and the wife is going to sense like a new sort of safety you know like he knows what he wants she's solid he's like she's going to able to trust you and she's going to >> able to grow it but >> all the miracles will happen >> all the miracles will happen when you do your own work >> yes >> you can't force someone and you can't like convince them, manipulate them. It's >> no because I've seen so many this is like the common issue of their couch like the common issue and and it's like >> but my first question is you know like I know like let's say you do your work and like but there might still be blind spots like if I'm busy looking at my spouse what is it that's triggered in you that you see in your spouse look even deeper >> you are what you hate >> correct Everything's projection. Like said, everything is projection. Everything is a mirror. >> If if something really triggers you, what is it? What is it in me that triggers in you? >> Mhm. >> And when you going to work out that part, you're going to see miracles. Somehow it's going to change. >> Yes. Yes. Because >> so look even deeper like what is triggering him? But but sometimes people become more a narcissist or something a relatively man just was hurt. You're just creating the victim to become even more of a victim. >> Meaning well abused abuse. >> No no no. Part of working on yourself is to learn to make boundaries and of course not to let to abuse yourself. Okay. So, >> part of working on yourself is like I know what I deserve. I know what I like. I'm I'm not letting himself being abused. For sure not. I can put my healthy boundaries. >> That's part of working on yourself. >> And then and then if they're healthy enough, the spouse, then they'll also go for help because they'll see how beautiful you turned out. They'll also, you know, they'll they'll want to >> correct >> mimic and also won't feel blamed. So, that helps them go for help. If they feel blamed, they're not going to go. So, >> exactly. >> Yeah. That's that's uh another question. >> Yeah. >> Uh which is very very common. um people that are living with someone that's on the spectrum and uh is there something that you've seen throughout the years was be like with the spectrum meaning to say >> the question is have you seen anything work is it possible for a person that needs a lot of love and affection to live with someone that's halfway on the spectrum. >> So, as you said, it's a spectrum. So, first you got to make sure it's like a spectrum and it's not just like shut down emotions. >> Um, which can sometimes be the case, >> right? >> If you clarify that it's not shut down emotions, it's it's for real spectrum. >> Mhm. >> You got to accept where the person's at and you got to learn to work with it. You can expand a little bit, but >> it is what it is. You got to work with it. expect where the spouse is at. >> No, because I've had the husbands was on the spectrum, let's say, or the >> and then end up getting divorced and and and they were very blamed and shamed by people around them. And and you know, like it is no. She she says, "Yeah, he does everything, but I still feel alone. >> I feel alone for a woman to feel alone." And so so do the sunrise program. son s o n not s o u n with mto that's dealing with the kind I'm a little bit familiar with that how how you know they train parents how to how to train their kids that are on the spectrum in marriage >> is that a good idea like >> it's up to the spouse if that's enough for them but the spouse got to ask honestly like what am my choices and what am I willing to do? I miss you. I miss you. So, and and and and she felt it was fake. She didn't know about it. She didn't know that program, right? >> And you can't fake it. It's there's something. No, [sighs] >> it's yeah, it's up to two of them how they want to make it work. >> But people that that divorce someone that's on the spectrum, >> they should not be blamed or hurt. They should be understood and they should be, you know, >> no one should be blamed. >> No, no one should be blamed, but they should be >> No one should be blamed. You can't, you know, tell from someone else, you know, like it's their life and they got to look honestly themselves and see >> what works for them. >> Wow. I I we're going to have to make part 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10. But for now, I tried to keep it within an hour. I think we're a little more than >> because because mentioned, you know, the the you know, >> um it's just it's just so exciting that you came and you know, I worked on you a few months to come. >> It [laughter] took a while. took a while and uh do and uh I I really hope people are going to reach out to you and and and just just >> definitely >> just you know >> and learn to build a relationship with your child. >> Yeah. In a child and and he gave me so much information like thank you. I was like wow this is this was amazing and we should be very soon because only to be healed. >> Exactly. [laughter] Exactly. >> And and uh >> yeah thank you for having me. It's an honor as I said and uh yeah I want to wish everyone that we should get closer to our gilaputras and to be in full and whole with ourselves and find ourselves with so we can give for others for spouses for our kids and get closer to Mashia. >> Wow. Thank you so much.