The Power of Davening in a Tzibbur | Rabbi Yossi Goldin

now we're uh transitioning we won't mention the next but we're transitioning to a few weeks of uh of a routine of routine before before pesak um and uh and as always in particular this morning for those who didn't pay attention to the to the news so uh so the uh the fighting in Gaza has resumed those who didn't pay attention Israel uh this morning uh uh continued the war so rat our learning definitely our soldiers need our hour fot uh um as the as the fighting continues no one knows what's going to be after today but that's what's happening today um so we continue to DAV that our learning and our should be a protection for our soldiers uh should bring home all all of our um continue to bring Yeshua to all those who have been affected by this war and Hashem should give guidance to our leaders um to make the right decision okay so what I want to do we have um we have this week and next week if I'm not taken these are the last two weeks before before there's a there's a break for p um as I understand so what I wanted to do this week and next week is to talk a little bit about the what I'm calling the power of daving with a Tor the idea of doing with a minion um there is a lot to unpack on this topic a lot of various garot um various garas and and and different things to discuss so it's going to be a two-part a two-part sheer um discussing the power of a SEO the concept of ding with a minion why we need do with a minion what are the sources that discuss is it in fact an obligation or is it just something nice are women obligated we're not going to get to that today but hopefully we'll get to that um next week and so our discussion of ding with the Tor begins really with a number of garas really just I want I as as you have as you can probably tell I feel it's important that you see the the actual primary sources and so we're going to begin really by just going through a number of different garas that talk about yeah you have a question or a comment comment please oh thank you yes thank you thank you thank you for that and for all that you do uh yes please put your phones on silent ah well if but if you at the end of the day but if you put it in between then you have to turn it off again before the next you mean at the afterwards yes afterwards okay um Okay so so we're going to begin with like I said with a number of different goras that really just highlight in different ways the value and importance of DAV with aidion and I think it's also in instructive to see the different language that kazal will use regarding the value of of daving with a medion so look at source Number One Source number one now uh one other thing before I mention it we're going to see a number of sources where the gamarra is going to talk about the value of daving in a b a and it's unclear whether the gamar is actually referring to the bakes because the place of a is important or because it's actually referring to ding with a minion just where do you usually have a minion in sh okay so sometimes the gamor will use the language of sh and it's actually referring to doming with a minion sometimes it refers to the value of davig and a because the sh itself has value that we're going to get to after after we discuss DAV with we're going to discuss the importance of the value of daving in a sh as a sh itself regardless of the minion so sometimes that language is a little bit clear but that's but that's uh that's just something to keep in mind as we as as we go through the sources Source number one the son of says in the name of how do we know that God can be found in a says the hasem will be found in amongst the congregation those who congregate for God okay so here sorry right there sorry Source number one that's that's the source that's a source from is a from yes yes that's a from and again it says God is found in the ad in the Gathering of people who gather for God okay so here by the way it seems clear that we're not necessarily referring to the sh as a place but rather the sh as acting as a place where the minion gathers okay so this is talking about the value of Aion God can be found where where we gather together I'm sorry isn't God everywhere yes that's an excellent excellent question I think the when we we take these different types of sources the assumption is that there's a certain greater power to that obviously we know that hasem is here Hashem is everywhere but we also know that certain places what we could ask the same question about the BET mikdash and all of those I think there's a certain assumption that although God can be found everywhere there are are places that have a higher I don't know the best way to phrase it but a higher uh or no or a higher power higher concentration of K and higher concentration of Holiness but it is it is it is a good question okay then the says how do we know that if 10 people ding together the the Divine can be found amongst them as the says this is the same can be found stands Hashem can be found amongst those who congregate continues the gar how do I know that the three people gather to judge to create judgment we know that a bait is made up of three people so three people GA gather together to create a bait in order to bring out the Judgment of God that the is amongst them amongst God they will judge how do I know that if two people gather together are learning Torah that that the is is found amongst them as the gar says there the talk uh those who are those who fear God are discussing and sitting with each other and hasem listens how do I know that even one person sitting and learning is with him any place where my name is mentioned I will come and I will bless you okay so the gamar here now you could what the gamar then does right after this is ask the obvious question which is well then if God is found with one person so then what's the value of the two people and if two people God is found then why do you need the three people and if you have the three people God is found why do you need dominion and what the gamar ultimately answers or seems to answer it's a little bit of of unclear exactly what the answer the gor gives the seeming answer is there are different levels of course God is found with one person who learns but when one person learns Torah it's not the same it's two people learning Torah that each of these have different gradations of spiritual power and God's presence amongst them and therefore what we see at the very least is the top level that the gamarra is mentioning here is the power of 10 people coming together to DAV to Davin with a Minion Okay so that's what that's the firstar that just sets the tone that if 10 people sit together and they dive with Dominion the is amongst them in the highest concentration at least that we can see uh that is found now I brought for you here just uh as as a side if you look at source number two this is a cute little I found this a little while ago the B B is a yov aser who is the son of the rush one of the one of the one of the name he's mostly known for his saer in called the tour which waser that was the precursor to the sh um and he also has a a a nice little Parish alhat Torah and his Parish Al Torah he brings all sorts of references and and and and and cabalistic and mystical references to different things in the Tora and very often he'll point out patterns within different Pim so if you look at source number two he notes in the in uh in in par if I'm not mistaken this is par where yov wakes up from his dream Source number two the P says Yakov wakes up from his dream and he says says the B if you take the last word last letter of each of these words what does it spell it spells okay says the B that's a hint lar that a person's it's a hint to the idea that true will only be heard if it is amongst a a congregation okay so again I'm sorry sorry oh sure there's T there's tons of different references to that to that to that right correct there's a that's a that's a hint to the idea although we don't know what that's meaning what you're right there's definitely a reference to 10 there the power of 10 he's just pointing out here that Yakov after he wakes up from his dream he DAV to a he was ding by himself he was doing as a Tibor but it hints to this concept of the power of the power of aor just bring that in I I thought it was a cute little uh cute little reference but there are number of other garas that talk about the importance of ding with theor look at source number three the son of says in the name of if somebody usually goes to sh and one day he doesn't come asks about him wonders where he is meaning there is something unique about someone who comes to shav again this refer to sha as a place of Domin or it could refer to the fact that you're coming for a minion that if you come for a minion normally and one day you're not there says where is he so there's some value to that look at the next the next part of the at the moment that comes to visit the and he comes and he sees that there's no minion meaning people are doing but there is no Gathering of a minion he gets upset gets frustrated or upset at us if we're doing without without a minion why did I come and there's no one here I called out and no one is is responding so again the gar is using a different type of imagery here to talk about the value of Amion almost as if gets upset at us if we're doing in the sh without am minion yes oh okay no no so there's no question we're talking about the here again when when referencing a a a here I think what they're basically referencing my understanding of it's not talking about the sh versus somewhere else it's talking about doing without a minion I understand this to be referencing the idea that if people are doing they're doing without a minion then is disappointed in that F now if there is AIC reason or there's a specific situation we're going to see soon what is the level of obligation for a person to be ding with am minion all all these garas are highlighting is the importance of daving with am minion that we have the importance because brings the down has a certain expectation we're going to get to more of the details but yeah it's a good question yes which part the part the gamar you're saying or the or the P oh the P the p what do you mean I'm sorry you mean you mean the actual pusk you mean the actual pusk itself is not necessarily an appropriate pusk for this for for this for the what it's trying to say yes what do you mean who believes it you mean gamar yes well yes I mean it's a statement of Kaz and I think we generally the gar the gar is quoting different areas people who are talking that is 100% I don't want to get into the ver the veracity of of the comments but we see here that there is clearly a statement made by kazal by one of the rabbis in the Gara that there is that there's an importance to to doing to doing with a minion if I understand what you're saying you're just questioning whether or not that's true but true most most of most of gamar most of gamarra most of gamar are statements by rabbis yes but so are many things but I think I don't know if this what you mean to be saying we're going to get to it soon is yeah except yes but what well well you know I don't want I don't want to get into the specifics but most of gumar is is is opinions that are stated based on comments in the Torah but there is something unique here that we're going to get to in a second which is if we look at all of these garas what's missing from these garas is a statement of obligation so far all we're seeing are the gamar talking about this is why it's good to do with a minion or this is what happens if a person doesn't so there is something different here than your classic gar because these are what we call a got these are statements the rabbis are making talking about the value of with Amion what we haven't yet seen in the we have to see if it exists is okay so I don't know if that's what you're referencing but that but that that isn't a point that that that should be made but we're gonna hold off on that on that for a second yeah op this is an opinion but but but again but yes but again most of gar has to do with various opinions state in the gar we and we usually depending on the situation yes that's also true but but again much much much of K are much of kazal are proof from different things and we generally do take those take take those comments seriously unless it's someone who argues or or something of that sort so these are aoic statements and and and and and and therefore there is some you know that we should we should definitely have face value take them take them seriously last comment then we're gonna go Onasis to get people to come no on to start on time God's here's here's here okay okay absolutely we're gonna get we're gonna get to that we're gonna get to that absolutely we're gonna get to that 100% we're gonna get to why meaning what is it what is it so far we're just we're just we're just starting we're starting with the sources Source number fouru says the following a person should get up early to go to so that he could be counted amongst the first 10 people in the minion even if a hundred people come after you he gets all of thear wait a second so if the first 10 people come they get thear anyone who comes after doesn't get any reward so why should you come after you walk get you see there's 10 people walk right out says the could it possibly be that the first 10 they get the reward and everyone else gets nothing no everyone gets but the first 10 get extra scar if you're part of the creation of this minion if you're part of the creation of this adah or this kahal then you're going to get added reward because you were part of what the creation anyone else who comes is already coming and en join in existing Gathering if you're part of those 10 so this is this is uh this is for all you yies you make sure that you come earlier on time this is your Source right here coming on time is extra added spiritual value do they really need to highlight it I mean I understood immediately that the first 10 get exercise they actually is there anyone who actually thought that only the first 10 get sarob El well again the gar when I mean much again I again I I happen to think this is this isn't a gamar that I would have that I would have known if I had not seen this gamarra I would have thought that anyone who comes to this part of the minion gets the idea that the first 10 get extra because they're the ones that that create they created the minion yeah that's no it's a nice idea but it's not something that I would have necessar personally I wouldn't have known that if I didn't have this gar I think each of these gar and even if these are ideas that we might have known Again part of the value of these sources is is is is the imagery that is being used to discuss the value and the importance of of a minion right the gamar could have just said one line diing with a minion but gamarra chooses to use different imagery because it highlights different aspects and speaks to us in different in different ways and to me that's I think the the value the power of power of just because of time I want I want I want to move forward for now uh and I'm happy to take questions moving on either towards the end or or afterwards The gamaran Source number six we're gonna skip we're going to skip number five for now uh scource Source number six highlights another power to the value of a minion m the son OFA says in the name of RAV how do I know that if a decree if a if a community is decreed is gonna have something bad happen to them that will never get signed meaning that it willon ever happen says the what do you mean it wouldn't wouldn't be signed it says that your sins are going to be signed in front of me rather says the sometimes if you have a community at seor that has a decree that is going to be set upon them that decree can get ripped up that's the power of a says the how do I know [Applause] this like Hashem Our God anytime we call out to him we have the potential for him to listen to us so we learn from here that if it seor comes together to Davin they have the potential to rip a decree even a decree that's already been signed and sealed ask the gar wait a second you have one ptic that tells that hasem always is always listening to us says thear there's another and say for yesi that says you should search for Hashem wherever he can be found wherever he can be found implies that he can't necessarily access him whenever you want one PK seems to say that wherever you call him you can find him the other PK seems to imply you have to search him out answers the this is the difference between having access or doing to as a there's one type of power as an individual but then when you D in as aor that power is magnified and therefore That's The Power of aor that even if there is a decree that is signed and sealed it can be torn up potentially it has the potential to be torn up through the power of says the what about the is there a time meaning it says search out when he can be found when is that time when is that time that even a y has the potential to be as strong as a tore those are the 10 days of during the of search for hasem where and when he can be found shows us that whereas throughout the year the seore has a special power there's a special power that the seore has to even tear up a decree that was signed and sealed that is throughout the year a has the special potential during the time of a Chua he's almost on the level of aor and therefore his the power of hisa is that much is that much stronger okay this is probably a gamar that many of us have heard during aara the ROM right over here mentions it mizes this in his own words Source number seven even though CH always great dur it's even better it is received is accepted immediately search out where he can be found that's only talking about when it comes to a community anytime a community comes together does CH and shouts out cries out to IE they're going to be answered okay so here's an additional level to the concept of the power of aor is that when we di with aore we have the potential to impact negative decrees that were decreed upon the people even if they already been signed we have the ability to make sure to have those decrees torn up okay one more gamar that I wanted to do with you that Highlights Highlights this concept of the power of a as well this is a a story a story between two different rabbis Source number eight said why didn't we missed you in sh the other day right the rabbi calls up the congre hey so and so we missed you in sh why didn't you come to sh I couldn't come okay you couldn't make it to sh something happened you couldn't you know you you were injury so get 10 people and gather for a minion at least make a minion it was too much for me it was too much of a bother it was too hard for me to get the minion together so says the he says okay you couldn't make it for a minion you couldn't come to sh and you couldn't gather 10 people but here's what you could have done find out what time the sh is daving and at least during that time let's say the sh DAV shakas at 7:30 in the morning make sure that you at home D at that time okay there's a value and we're going to see this soon there's a value to doing at the same time as the Tor even if you can't physically be there with the really is that really true meaning is is there such a thing and he says what does it mean when it says in when is it whenever theor do that is considered to be a and therefore if you are unable to come to sh for whatever reason and you can't DAV in with a minion you should still try if you can to do at the same time as theor and have in mind that you'd like to somehow tap into the power of of of that seab in fact if you look at source number nine Source number nine is rabu Yona is one of the Reon him and he concludes that this is an actual this is an actual even if somebody is unable to go to or DAV with a minion you should try to do at the same time that that the rest of the Tor is daving and we're not we're not going to discuss the details of this practically today but this is an actual this is an actual now there's a whole discussion doesn't have to be a specific minion could it be any minion in your community what if the minion has 15 what if what what if you live near near near a minion Factory does that can get up at 12:00 you know so it there's a discussion as to what exactly this means but what we see here and this is the most important is that the power of the Tor is not just obviously the ideal power of the tore is gathering together but there's also a power to the tore that it could even uplift a person's individual if it's done at the same time and with the with the with the intent to connect it to the existing of theor one final part for this lastar back going back to Source number eight for one second okay if you look at source number eight one two three four lines from the three lines from the bottom how do I know that hem does not get disgusted IE he's more willing to accept the of the many shalom oh sorry that's one other that's one other final point so that P there talks about hasem not getting upset and right next to it it talks about it in the context of of many people so we see that is more willing to listen to the of the of the then the ends says anyone who is involved in learning Torah and doing said anding with the I make it as if he has redeemed me me and my children from amongst the Nations that somehow the that Torah anding with a minion somehow bring about a certain type of what we would call G a certain type of redemption we're gonna have to understand exactly what this means this is a very nice but what exactly does that mean why does have an what does it have to do with Redemption what does it have to do with G okay so what we've seen today so far is a number of various garot a number of various garas that all highlight in different ways the value of daving with theor that what's what's missing though and this is what we mentioned until now is there is no gar that comes and says everybody needs to DAV in with a tore or men need to D with the Z or women need there's all it talks about is various garas that say this is a nice thing to do this is something you should do there's value to to doing this the RAM does take it a bit of a step further if we look at source number 10 the ram based on all of these garas therefore says there's an action item here the action item is because there's a value to doing with a you should do it Source number 10 the doing with the Tor was always heard even if among the community there are sinners there are people who aren't worthy will never turn away from the now the ra turns this into an actual action item a person must connect himself to a community he shouldn't d by himself if he has the opportunity and the ability to D in with Itor he should dve in with the T and he should not D in as a a person should get up and he should he should get up early for doing and he should stay late in sh at night because his can only be heard in the sh again in my opin my understanding here we're specifically referring to the value of the sh is not necessarily because it's the sh but because it's where the minion is although not everyone agrees to that anybody who has a sh he doesn't in the he is considered to be a bad an evil neighbor a bad neighbor someone you don't want to hang out with okay so we see here that the RAB has taken these garas and said practically that means that we should be doing with a t but here's the question if I were to ask you this question do you think this again I don't know if we can call it an obligation because not everyone's gonna agree that it's an obligation do you think that this suggestion the value of daving with a Tor is that biblical or is that Rabbi in nature Rabin of course it's Rabin why of course it's Rabin because they don't have a single source of to excellent so first of all you're gonna say well they were nice Pim but there was no straight number two let's take let's let's say even more than that the three prayers are rinic right meaning let's take a step back we discussed we discussed we had a question whether or not f is is is biblical or rabic and we saw that most post say that daving itself is rabic who is the one person who claimed that that Ding was was biblical anyone remember who that was which Reon which Reon the ramom the ROM says very clear that he's he was the one who says it's it's biblical but even he says it's biblical only for one person to say whatever language he wants to whenever he wants to it would seem obvious to us that that there is no biblical commandment to DAV in with a minion it would only be at most rinic based on that though just just because of time just because of time um it seems there seems to be a challenging there was a Garra which we haven't yet seen and the gamarra here seems to suggest that maybe do with a minion is on the level of AA let's look at this for a second Source number 11 it's a fascinating says talking about making a minion this is if you have nine men and then you have an evid Kanani you have a canite slave who is not who is not himself is not Jewish he can count as the 10th for your minion says the G really is that true elzar we have a story ofz walked into he couldn't find 10 men he walked at J there were nine men and his slave he said I have an idea what did he do he said you know what slave you're free and the status of an evid Kanani generally is an evid Kanani kept certain mitv while he was an evid that once he once he once he is freed he now takes on the status of a Jew and now he's my 10th Man so says the the fact that he had that he that he had to free him implies that you can't include the evid as the 10th Man okay that's a question then the gar ask another question one second next line says thear how could RAB elzar have freed his evani there's actually a mitv there is a positive Commandment that if you have an evani that evani should work for you forever you're supposed to pass on that evani for generations to Generations anyone who frees his violates a positive commandment the says in they should work for you forever meaning there is an opinion in the gar that says that if you have an EV you are not supposed to free him you are supposed to keep him and set pass him down from generation to generation so says the gar how could you violate a positive commandment just to be able to dve in with a minion answers the Mitzvah shiny it was for a Mitzvah what was the Mitzvah ding with a minion says the it might be a Mitzvah but it was a Mitzvah that you accomplished by doing an a answers the gvahim shiny this wasn't just any Mitzvah this was a Mitzvah that enabled an entire Kila an entire group to D it created a minion a minion is called rabib it's a multitude of people and therefore because of that it was allowed all re asked the same basic question they say wait a second the prohibition or the mitv to not free your slave is biblical is biblical correct we're talking about at most according to everything that you guys all said which made a lot of sense which was at most we're talking about a Rabin Mitzvah even if it's a Rabin Mitzvah of the rabim of the of the masses why how could you how could that override a biblical commandment what's going on here so a number of different answers are are given look at source number 12 the ramban asks this question sure no you're right I'm sorry I I skipped over this because it wasn't as relevant the gar the gamar was asking a question the statement the statement thank you for cying this just understand that the context of the gamar wasn't as important so I kind of glossed over it but you know but you're right you're 100% right the gamar basically gar says and then the gamorra asks on that from the from the story because the fact that in the story he needed he needed to free his evid seems to be a question on the fact that that that the gar answers no there were two he freed one of them and there was one that was that that he that he left I just didn't want to I I don't want to lose what no no no no it's okay you're right you're right in context I think it's important to see it I was just for for in order to not get people confused so at the end so I kind of okay so so the gamar source number 12 The gamar Source number 12 sorry the ran it's ver number 12 says the ran I am flabbergasted I have a question just because of a rabic commandment to DAV with theor we're gonna push aside a a a positive commandment of not freeing your slaves so says the ran yes sometimes and in this case this Mitzvah this RAB Mitzvah can actually push away a Mitzvah in the Torah why because we have a that tells us that when comes to he comes to the sh he doesn't see 10 men he gets upset and therefore again it's hard to know exactly what the ran is sugesting but what the raban seems to be saying is sometimes you have something that isn't just a rabic command rabic Mitzvah but we see the importance of that Rabin Mitzvah we see that the Torah tells us I'm sorry the gar tells us that hasem comes and he gets upset and therefore in certain contexts we will even be willing to override a MIT it's unclear exactly how the ran understands this it's it's not an easy it's not an easy answer the ran gives okay but because of that look at the other answer that the rush okay so the ran seems to say yes sometimes you can even have a rabic a rabic value that's going to override a Biblical a Biblical concept okay yeah again I don't know because that's that's a very extreme type of a concept that sometimes in Extreme Measures you need to do certain things this just seems to be that there he seems to be highlighting that this is an important Mitzvah and therefore an important Mitzvah because of all the G talk about how important it is can sometimes override but it's it's not so clear the rush says something totally different tanan Source number 13 he walked into he didn't find 10 men what did he do and then he he and then and then he he made a minion how could he have done that that's violating a positive commandment answers the shin the Mitzvah of the is different why says the rush fascinating K he says he says the the the need to D in with a minion is only D ran however every time a person doav with a minion he is M he fulfills a Biblical value what is that biblical principle the concept of what we would call something called when 10 people get together and they dve in together and they praise and they dve to Hashem that is called the concept of Kes Hashem and that is a Biblical fulfillment so ding with a minion the obligation is Rabin but when you do it it fulfills a Biblical fulfillment something called Isel every time 10 Jews come together they didn't have to biblically rically they they were obligated biblically they didn't have to but when they do they fulfill something called being mades fulfilling they are madesh the name of Hashem as a community and because that is a Biblical fulfillment that is able to override the Mitzvah or the the the assay of not freeing a Slave What The Rush has introduced ladies and gentlemen is something new to the value of daving with aor aside from all the garas that we saw and aside from perhaps we're going to see soon whatever rabic obligation there might be to DAV with Aion there is also a Biblical fulfillment and that is every time 10 people or more come together to D into Hashem they are being and that has a fulfillment of Kes I'll just take I'll just take take some questions now yes Bas psychological in other words the whole point of Aion is really to help the people to focus better on the ding and to do the work of the doing you can then say well so uh so I I agree with you partially I think I think that psychologically it does help but I also think that there's a value to the meaning what comes first I can't tell you it could be that the reason why who wants us to do with a minion is because of that but I think there's many values to the minions well yeah I don't I I don't want to get the specific specific Min on him it but I don't want to get into the specific specific the spe we don't want to know no I well let's hold off on that let's hold off on that again every every every everything is gonna have price yes uh that's a good question maybe we can get to that at some point they're all about but but but again individual issues with specific Min and the challenges of D with a minion no one there are there's everything has a price there's always going to be a cost benefit analysis in many different things in life doing at home and doing by yourself carries certain certain uh certain values but you're also missing certain things doing in the minion also everyone has to find has has has to make that and just because of time I don't want to spend too much time on specific instances but the idea the value of of of a Tibor is oror is is is a good question yes well we're gonna get to we're gonna get to we're get to that so you're saying wait a second if what the rush is saying makes sense then where first of where did the rush get this from let's say it that way and if it's true why is the government and the answer is gamar mentioned it in in a different context we'll get to in a second I just want to mention that we learn about theing from Kan and Kan by yourself and I I go to the co I see all the women by okay women are not really we're gonna that that's a separate question the separate question we'll get to hopefully next week as part of what we're going to discuss next week will be the discussion about whether about about the obligation SL opportunity we're going to see soon how obligated are men to because it's still unclear exactly is it something I have to do at all costs is it only if it's convenient for me for men I'm asking and then for women is a is a is a different conversation and as always that might also be partially a personal question with men it's not necessarily understood to be a personal question we we'll get to all that hopefully a little bit a little bit next week the sword from KH is is is is a fair point but that might just be certain learn from but other learn from other things that that's the way works woman's again that that were definitely not getting not we're not GNA we're not going to get into but uh but no no again not just just just because of this just just just because in this context we're not we're not we're not we're not we're not going to discuss that that part but the idea of value of doing with a minion and not is something that again right now we we're building we're just kind of starting with the with the main sources and trying to understand the idea the value of it the importance of it and we'll get to more why next week and also where do women fit in with all this it's it's it's a very very good question now your question was wait a second where the rush has this idea that every time 10 people get together at DAV that is a Biblical where did this where did this all come from so there are actually another number of garas that do reference this not in the context of talking about how important this is with Dominion but they do they do talk about this idea the W gar We're not gonna we're not going to see inside the gamar in Source number 14 is the source for the idea of what's called K the idea of being a sanctifying God's name in public there it's talking about it in the context of a what's called what we classically known as Kish Hashem which is the idea of one person giving his life uh rather than rather than uh committing certain certain aot as many of us are familiar I'm going to say this outside just because of because of time we many of us are familiar with the idea of something called y y generally if someone were to come to us and say commit a certain sin otherwise I'm going to kill you so we should commit that sin except for the three what are known as y that you should get killed rather than commit them and they are anyone know killing committing murder committing murder arot and a the gar then says that that's true only in certain cases but if there are times of what's called they are times of persecution so sometimes even in times of persecution even if it's a simple what's called a simple a because it's times of persecution maybe you should give up your life rather than rather than commit that sin and then the gamar adds another level if it's in public if someone comes to you in public and says Commit This a Everyone's Watching so even in that case very often even for something small you should give your life rather than rather than commit again we're not getting into all the Practical details of this right now and then says why because the because there is this concept called that there is this idea of sanctifying God's name in public so that's that's where this Source comes from but the gamarra in Source number 15 and 16 these are the garas that are discussing daving and they say that when it comes to certain parts of daving certain parts of daving can only be said with a minion what's the source what's the source for the idea that certain parts of DAV can only be said with a minion the same is I am Sanctified amongst am is you know just give one example look the gar we're gonna we'll skip 15 for now look at the gar Source number 16 says the following thing how do I know that I can't say kadus and this is true of Kadesh and this is true of a number of other parts of our that they can they can't be said as an individual as the says is I will be Sanctified amongst [Applause] is anything which has a certain level [Applause] of you can't say it for Less with less than with less than 10 people and this is true of another different parts of f so what the rush was basically doing and by the way he's not the only one other people are basically expanding that and saying will we see from here is that any time 10 people get together and they DAV in and they say these even though the themselves are because all are as the as the rush said nevertheless the act of us doing it and saying it together as a community is something called is a fulfillment of and therefore it has a Biblical fulfillment and therefore that's why that GAR the rush said we can override the assay of of that's why that's why the rabbi was allowed to release his EV release release his servant okay so what we've seen right now and we're just going to we have a couple more sources to see what we've seen right now is number one we've seen tremendous value in doing with a minion keshu comes and sees we don't have a minion he gets upset we've discussed how the power of a Tor is that it could even rip up certain decrees that were given upon the Tor more than a yak we talked about how the Shina is found amongst the people of daving with a minion we talked about the value of being one of the first 10 to come with the minion we talked about how if you can't come to sh for some reason you should do it at the same time as the minion because there's a certain power to that as well and then we saw what we saw over here is that in addition to all of that there is a Biblical fulfillment of of be of sanctifying God's name in public every time you dve in you dve in with a minion so now the question becomes what is the actual level of obligation because despite all of these different as we mentioned there is no that says so does that mean that this is something that's nice to do when I can does it mean that it's something that I should try to do but if I have other values I shouldn't have to do it does it mean that I should make every effort to dive in with a minion this is a very interesting question we saw the ROM earlier the ramom said the ramom in Source number I'm just going to read it for you again and might might make you go back to look at it again but the rambam used a language of source number 10 a person needs to find a way to join the that was the language of the ram if you look in interestingly enough in Source number we're going to skip a little bit Source number 19 the uses a different language the who writes the the for us in terms of determining he uses the language of he should try what's the problem with that I tried Rabbi I tried I couldn't get up the alarm clock didn't go off or I got off and I just told I I tried what again it's fascinating to see that the the is clearly using a language ofel because what bothered him there was no statement in the gar that says you're obligated so is this one of those things where this is tremendous opportunity we see this tremendous opportunity but is this is is there obligation so this actually leads to a in theim there are some poim who say based on the language of the and thear that this is an opportunity you should try to but it's not on the same level as a regular Mitzvah there are many MIT that you need to try to do and you should do exert every effort to do this is one of those things that it's a nice thing to do there's a tremendous value in doing it there trous spiritual value in doing it but if you can't do it for whatever reason you can't do it no well again I think sick is even a little bit different because sick often means that you know you can't do a lot of things meaning many mitv that you normally are obligated to I'm talking about some might I'm not I'm not saying this I'm not sanctioning this but some might say if it's inconvenient I don't know I have a business meeting okay or there there's or my wife needs help with the kids okay um there actually is and and no I mention that uh no I don't want to I don't want to uh say anything uh but again no there there I I remember hearing from one of my RAB I won't mention his name that he actually and again I'm not he actually I remember hearing I don't remember if it was from him or from his wife that there were time there were moments where he would not he D in at home um and didn't D with the minion because he was involved in helping the kids and the kids out in the morning now knowing who this G we're talking one one of the one one of the gum of of of of our of our time is we're referring to I'm not qu mentioning his name because I wasn't given permission to I heard it in in an interesting context now to me that doesn't speak to his his leaning on doing but rather his his take understanding the importance of helping his wife out with the children in the morning so so everyone is going to make that and this is somebody who when he could when he could D with a minion would D with a minion and would sit in would sit in base meders and learn all day so we're not talking about someone who you know was going around doing other things but again at least according to the some some some poim say you know what it's a nice thing to do but it's not something you have to do if you look at source number 19 Source number 20 rosi Feinstein very much disagrees rosstein obviously one of the gim one of the great rabbis in the 20 20th century in America he says it's very clear that this is not just a this isn't just like a nice this is an actual obligation it is an actual obligation on the person it's not just a nice thing to do it's not just not just when it's convenient that you should do it okay and he quotes a number of different reasons look now skip to the to the third line the end of the third line I'll him after the three dots the fact that there's so much talk about how much you should exert in order to do this Mitzvah means it must be a actual obligation okay now skip now just just because of time to a couple more lines after the next three dots say of Moshe even though if you look in the gamarra they never mention the word obligation they just talk about the value say of Moshe finds something very we've discussed this before the opportunity that is created through tior that itself engenders the obligation if you read those garas that talk about the tremendous value of daving with aor that CES of Moshe creates the obligation because how could someone read those garas and see the value of aor and not conclude I got a do with a minion anybody who is spiritually sensitive will recognize that all of those garas were pointing to the fact that this is a tremendous value and as a result and tremendous opportunity and that opportunity engenders obligation that itself is what creates the obligation now now go to the to the to the last couple of lines the underlined lines since when a person D with a community he's heard much better if you're doing as a even if you're a great G your might not be answered as much as they would be if you were part of a community it is an obligation on every person to try to die what's the main what engenders this obligation the fact that the fact that your F will be more powerful if you DAV as a that is what creates the the actual obligation so what we see from here in the very very end is despite the fact that the gar itself does not mention the and all the gar does is talk about the value of that opportunity all the opportunities the gamar mentioned that creates the obligation and therefore he says unless you have a very good reason which could be being sick it could be lots of other things a person should strive all things being equal to uh to D to D with a tore okay we'll stop here next week we will cover a number of different other aspects to uh to Davin with am minion