Modern Masters: Yibum and Chalitza meet Modern Science | Rabbi Sam Shor | Oct 7 2026

Okay. So just before we get started, I want to acknowledge that this Wednesday morning series here at BKS for the entire academic year has been dedicated with Nishmas Danil Ben and Lim Basra and Morai Ben Mosha and Rael Mayor Marcus the parents of our dear friends Judy and Marcus. Also this slot which is normally um normally given by Rabbi Manning this year is dedicated for the entire year Brian Brena Brand Shalom and Zeliga. Also, I want to mention and acknowledge that um the Basani community and really our community here, our Wednesday morning community here suffered a terrible tragedy um just a few days ago during Sukot and there was there was the tragic accident accidental Petira of Deborah Zohar in a in a traffic accidental and our learning this morning should be a pleas for her entire family and for the entire extended family who mourn her loss. Okay. So typically during the slot, Rabbi Manning, Rabbi Manning's topic is contemporary issues in Ashkafa. And my series, my regular series is called modern masters, where we normally um explore a topic or or an idea through the lens of the masters of Jewish thought. So today we're going to try to do a little bit of a combino of the two. And we're instead of focusing on modern masters of Jewish law, we're going to learn from modern halikic masters, modern post scheme, and look at a very very challenging and complicated contemporary issue that was posed uh it's based on a a series of of response. First, a question that was initially posed to mua. If you look on your on your sheets here, the opening the opening sheet. So mua is not mua is the center for pote for fertility and mua gives guidance as well as um networking in terms of appropriate medical treatments for couples who are struggling with infertility. And this was a fascinating shila that came to the rabbanim. A a question was posed to the rabbanim of the institute that they themselves were not as you'll see why in a few moments when we actually get to the nitty-gritty of the shila. They themselves were not comfortable answering and therefore they took this question to numerous gdole yaposki and we're just going to learn from a sampling. First we're going to learn through the original question that was posed together. Then we're going to learn through a sampling of the different answers that they got from numerous modern masters of Gdia. So first just in terms of the context the background of the Shiloh that we're going to learn together in a moment. There is a concept that we're all probably familiar with from that comes from the Torah of Yum. Right? The whole of yamos deals with the the the question of yum. What is yum? If a if a man dies is married and he dies and did not have any biological children with his wife, there is on a dicea level then there the mandate falls upon his if he if that if that man had living brothers, the mandate falls upon okay first the oldest of those living brothers to take this woman as a lever as a lever wife and to procreate with that's procreate with that woman in order that there should be a continuation so to speak of the family line as if those children will live on even though they're not biologically the children of the deceased husband but it'll be as if their marriage produced a continuation of the family. That's the concept. So from the time already of medieval times there was a the we kind of moved away from you for the most part in most of the Jewish community. Today that we insist on what's called khalita that there's a se a ceremony of casting away so to speak that that that yama that in biblical times is maybe more of a a a a embarrassing ceremony but today's has become today's become standard operating practice in such situations. The rabanutes today advis it and facilitates as you can see in our notes khalifa in circumstances that require it. So those are two important concepts that are going to come up in Archuva. And the last important concept that's going to come up in Archuva is related to modern science and and and fertility. Most specifically the concept not only of invitro fertilization but in vitro fertilization using a a sperm donor and Ramosa Feinstein famously gave a heter for this. Okay. on condition on condition that the don that the the the the donor material should be sourced from a non-Jewish donor that there should never be a a question that that one day this this child might grow up and and meet the child another child of a Jewish biological father and marry them and then have a problem that they're really hically siblings and therefore create situations of mamus So Raosha's Tanai in matering in allowing a famous Shuva allowing for a for a sperm donation was only if it was sourced specifically from a non-Jewish donor. Okay. So with that as our introduction, that's the context, the background of some of the ideas that are going to be appear in this chuva. Let's turn our page over to page two and we're going to learn this fascinating Shiloh that was posed together. Okay. And this is first post. Okay. No, this is this is the this is the letter the cats from to numerous. So let's also read Rabbi Katz's letter posing the Shiloh. Okay. The honorable genius the rabbi may live a long life. We are turning to you, okay, in your in your honor and your Torah wisdom related to a very very serious question connected to the permissibility of a woman to her husband. Okay. A few days ago, a rabbi turned to us with a question with a with a shah And he requested that his name not be revealed, that he remain anonymous and from his mouth he posed a very very serious question regarding personal status issues. years, a number of years before a couple came to visit this particular anonymous rabbi. And this couple have been married for 13 years without any children. And they asked of this rabbi. They asked for a for a permissibility to receive a a sperm donation. since after a number of examinations. It was found that the bal was was indeed that the bal was indeed sterile and therefore was not going to be able to father any children on his own. Okay. hotel. And after some clarification that this Rav did in terms of speaking with others and after consulting with a a a a reputable um important authority he permitted that they could take they could receive a a donation a sperm donation from a non-Jew but with a with a number of conditions And one of the conditions was that in the event, please God, they will merit to be able to give birth to a child. that for the sake of that child's mental and emotional well-being that what that they should never tell the child or anyone else for that matter should never come to be revealed that this this this husband was not the biological father of the child. Okay? Don't ever tell the child and don't tell others. [snorts] and Benu and after this initial conversation and I guess their back and forth over a number of weeks after that point after that initial period he never heard from that family again so he met with a couple and consulted with his postage got back to the couple gave them a hat and then after that period of time he was never in touch with them again okay so now let's continue so Okay. A few days ago, this rabbi ran into on the street. I guess this woman together with what? Her daughter who is now three years old. Rav the woman described to the rabbi that about two years before what happened. She was widowed. Her first husband passed away. The husband who had the physiological issue that that did not allow him to to father biological children. That husband had passed away two years ago. And standing before him together with a woman is a three-year-old daughter. Okay. So, and after a year, a year after he passed away, the first husband passed away, she got married again. She remarried. And since they the past years since they've been married, they've tried to to get pregnant without success. So the rabbi gave her a they should be blessed to have children. And with that was the end of their conversation. But then ah wait a minute that's not the end of the issue. And afterwards after he parted ways with this woman he began to think to himself. It could be that there's a very difficult problem here because it's almost almost absolutely certain that that child that three-year-old daughter that he met from the first marriage is not the biological daughter of that first husband that came from that procedure. of receiving the the the don the donation that he is the one who allowed them to accept. Okay. And if that's true, he said he thought that if the first husband had brothers and she did not go through the ceremony of okay, from one of the brothers, she is considered like a okay, who should have gone through the lever of marriage or at least the very least Khalita who went and got herself married so to speak to the random person in the shook instead of what first going through either either the yum or khalita and therefore what's the dean of such a woman is that she needs to get divorced from her husband the second hus husband as learn as we learn and that what that The hak this haka is in place that even if they did it if the second husband married her accidentally didn't know all the involved this is still the same that what they're not allowed to remain married and the possibility that this woman could went through by the way he says before she married the second husband is very very very remote. Why? You have to take into account because other than her first husband, no one else knows that this daughter, okay, that this three-year-old is not his biological daughter, but rather from that donor. And no one almost certainly no one even reminded her that she or informed her that she should go through and he says because this Rav didn't remember okay didn't think to when he gave the to what to tell her that in the event your husband passes away and he has brothers you're going to need to go through khalita pizza before you can marry someone else. Okay, so this is all going on in his mind after he walks away from meeting this woman for the first time in years. Okay. And from all this thinking comes his question that he posed to. Is he required to inquire and find out and clarify if the woman did indeed get married without going through? And if that's the case, did her first husband have brothers? Should he turn tod regarding this? You know, report them to let the pass regarding this. with a poss with a knowing that the very real possibility once they clarify all this almost certainly once they clarify this is going to be what that she's going to have to get divorced from the second husband according to say love. Not only will she now have to receive a get, but she's not allowed to then remarry this person. In other words, have they gone through khalisa? Has she gone through khalita first? Then she can marry anyone she wants once they've done done khala. But because she engaged in an inappropriate, okay, prohibitive relationship, okay, that she should not have engaged in the is that not only does she need to receive a get that she once rece upon receiving that get would not be allowed to marry this same second we'll take questions at the end. The same second husband because we're going to deal with the questions that's going to come up in the in in in the true vers. Okay. So, so continue on as so the qu question does he need to does he need to bring this or oh since he doesn't know this with absolute certainty and all this is just what he's theorized as a potential in his mind based on the the information that he knows up till this point since he never knew if the the first husband did indeed have brothers. Or is it better therefore for what to him let things lie as they lie and let it go and not get involved? We could add he says says Rabbi Katz that all the information that the rabbi had that that first husband was sterile. It only comes from what? The conversation that he had with that woman and her first husband. He was never showed any documentation or confirmation of that reality. Since then was such a difficult question, an important question in terms of the permissibility of this woman to her current husband and we don't feel capable of or worthy to answer questions of this serious nature. to we turn to your the m you our master the honored one in Torah that you should give sage your sage advice in terms of how to answer this rabbi we'll take questions at the end okay because I want to make sure we get through everything that we want to get through okay so very very fascinating and serious question right And we're going to see we're going to learn from four different gala of of our time. And we're going to see that each one kind of addresses this Shiloh with with both dignity and seriousness, but also each one of them comes at it comes at it at a slightly different from a slightly different angle. So we're going to begin with Raikar Nevin. If you turn to page three, Rab Vid Neans of course is the is the senior senior chief rabbi of I think his son is the official functioning chief rabbi of the old city because in his late 80s but um he is absolutely the senior postake of the he was of course the Orbach long. And so was turned to and this is we're going to see first he gave a a quick answer and then he thought about it some more and he wrote a follow-up answer. So we're going to look at the two answers that Ra Nevin um responds with. First of all, he says sadly, regretfully, he says, "I don't see any way to to tell this rabbi that he's exempt from what? Following up with this woman and at least explaining to her the even if they don't, the second husband and her don't agree to get divorced. But at least there should she should do mean on a dissa level. As long as she does, it doesn't matter where in the sequence she does. As mida, as long as she does khalita, she would be permitted to that second husband. Midan, okay? She is still even with since she already married him, she m she must get a get and she's not allowed to then remarry him. So he says even if they decide they're not going to divorce, they're not going to separate. He goes, "At least let her go through." And then it lessens the prohibition from a dissa prohibition to what to that's that's his first answer. Okay? And then he says, "And I ask of you very strongly, please don't don't rely on on my thinking. Bring this bring this question to another." Okay, that's that's his first answer. That's his first answer. And then he thought about it some more and he says, "Okay, with God's help, I thought this this this idea returned in my head that if she did know the Okay, we're going to assume she didn't know the and therefore we're going to say that if she or the second husband did know all the facts and didn't know the thoroughly, she that at this moment they are prohibited and that had they done before they got married it would be perfectly permissible for them to get married there you can't it can't be a scenario if a person knew uh how something could be totally permissible to them that they would what choose a path that would be totally prohibited to them so what is he saying that had the second husband known all the facts before they got married. Okay. Then certainly what would have happened they would have if the woman and they decide they still want to get married the woman would have gone through and then they would have gotten married and according to everybody would have been perfectly permissible for them to get married and stay married. So says, "Oh, so maybe maybe we could say their marriage was what was under false pretense. It was a mistake. It was not a considered valid." And if that's true, then we say a wedding, a marriage that's not valid is null and void. And therefore she they were never married. She could do now. Okay. And then they can get married. Why? Because they were neverly married. If that's the circumstance, says, okay. But he once again he says, but once again, I'm gonna ask you to take this Shila. Don't rely on my my thinking, my sparrow. I'm not giving this as a ruling. take the Shila to another rabbi. Okay, that's the default. But what's fascinating is that is is is second chuva to me in terms of that at first he said, "Oh, it's terrible and I don't even I can't even I can't think of any way to give a header." But then he thought about it and reflected on it and he came up with a creative possible way to allow them to either say they're not married, receive khita and get remarried or they'll find out that it's not even a problem. But even if it is a problem, he says he came up with a creative sara in terms of how you might be able to solve this problem hakically without blowing up this relationship. Especially every person has to take into account when when you're when when you give give when you give up you have to understand who is the show and in this case is a woman who for 13 years was childless and a which couldn't have been an easy mas in the first marriage then she finally has a child through the hectar that probably through the hectar that this rabbi sensitively gave them and then Nebach her husband passed away and now she's remarried and now you're going to tell her that no she she has to not separated from his husband but they can't get married again. So the fact that revital found here a creative hakically viable possible way to solve this issue is shows you the greatness of okay so let's just move on to now the next cha we're going to learn is of course is the chief rabbi of kirat arba in one of the great talidim of kok and the measiva with today lives on onion in and he is his chuvos are called but this is the chuva that he wrote back not in but in the he responded to this question from the rabbis of and listen to what do says There's no pos based on the information as presented in the original Shila. It doesn't seem there's any possibility to say what that this child is the biological child of the first husband. And and there's a question whether or not this first husband had brothers or not. Okay. And therefore we can't say that she is permissible to anyone in the shook to marry anyone she wants. Why? Because she has a status perhaps of being what? Not but perhaps of being. Okay. Therefore says what has to happen the rabbi has to clarify and and get clarity about this doubt. Okay. And find out did indeed the brother did the did the first husband have any brothers or not? Okay. Therefore the does have to follow up and speak to the woman says or with other people. Again, in today's day and age, you can probably Google and find out the whole family history, right? But um he says, "Speak with others. Do some do you have to do some forensic work so to speak to find out the true status, family status? Did this first husband have brothers or not?" In order to what? to clarify and determine and prevent them from committing any further transgressions. If we in in the in the circumstance that he finds out that indeed he had brothers and that indeed she never went through that she's still she is prohibited to her current husband even if they got married without knowing the he says as we learn from soor has a slightly different take than Evansaw. He he recognizes that it's a very very serious problem and that before we jump to conclusions though and and and create a catastrophic circumstance for us. It's a very simple process. speak to either the woman herself and if you're not comfortable speaking to the woman herself in today's day and age between Google and and AI and all the tools available to us do a little bit of forensic homework and find out are there brothers in the picture and then once you find out that there are brothers in the picture then you can have the conversation with the woman and the couple to find out if indeed she had khalita or not if she had khalita nothing to talk about it's fine if she never went through khalita then you're going to have allah problem and but Rod says you have to the very least get that clarity. Okay. >> When when does one share the oath between different theed >> I I'm just tell you again these these these are the world of GDA post game. I I don't I don't just like they didn't just like the posting from didn't feel qualified to comment on on the suga themselves. I don't feel that I'm a baraki that that I have numerous of okay I have the license to ask him but I don't consider myself a a pose certainly not of that of that magnitude. So for me to try to answer those questions, they're fair questions. They're perplexing questions, fascinating questions, but what what part of what I'm hoping to see demonstrate today is just demonstrate the sensitivity and and and the difference the different approaches in terms of and each one even though even though they come to different conclusions, they're still approaching it with approaching this with extreme sensitivity. They're not just saying blow up the blow up the the family. And so let's just go on because now we're going to learn. But I appreciate the questions. Now we're going to learn from Roma Dowski. Dauski was a a a longtime faculty member in both KBY and Shave Mishas. He is a Dian in the Raanun and Tel Aviv and Ash. And this was >> he's also a member of Arv. >> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. Does he live in Arnovale? >> Yeah. Amazing. So this you can tell him you learned his Torah today. Okay. Aim. Now listen to the Dowski says he says there's no reason for the rav for this this rabbi to get back involved and to have to clarify the the circumstances. He says for two reasons. Even if he clarifies it with it is absolutely certain that the woman did indeed receive a sperm donation. It doesn't necessarily prove 100% that that child is not the biological child of the first husband. Why? that even in circumstance when it appears that the husband is not able to produce any any sperm. It could very well be that there's a minuscule okay a minute amount of zera that the husband is able to produce and all you need is one sproma to impregnate the wife. So even though it would seem that statistically it's near impossible, we're not in charge, says brother Kovski, the Hashem is in charge. Miracles have happened and do happen every single day. I can only speak on from personal experience. Many of you know that we I got married in my late 30s and we were blessed after years of taleim of fertility treatments to finally have have our daughter. That's part of the reason why I'm connected to M Pua to to have our daughter who just had her B mitzvah a few weeks ago. And um and so when we were going when we were going through basically the the round of fertility treatment where we were finally successful and from which Alisa was conceived uh we were told by we we had switched doctors at that point after several failed I'll spare you all the details rounds of treatment and we switched doctors and hospitals and when we met with our new doctor our odds were very very minute and Um but her answer was this is not a firm moment by the way but her answer was but I've seen Niss I've seen miracles you know this would have never happened because every tupul is hundreds and hundreds of thousands of dollars but she says we're going to we're going to try one more time because I've seen miracles and that that tipool is Alisa is now 12 years old and uh keep keeps us busy bar every day and um so what Rodoski is saying means that even if the scientific odds seem near impossible, miracles happen. So we don't know for absolute certain what especially since we never saw that this rabbis as was as was clarified in one in in the earlier letter that this rabbi never saw any actual paperwork and documentation. Okay, you just heard that they were told that he can't father children. So we don't know that with absolute clarity and therefore there's a possibility even if it's remote that a miracle happened and that daughter is indeed the biological daughter of the first husband. That's the first possibility. The second possibility says even if that daughter is indeed not found not to be the do the daughter of the first husband. Okay. And the Rav informs the woman that if she hasn't done then she's what? that she's that the brother said that she clarifies that that the first husband had brothers and that she hasn't done and that she has to divorce her husband. He says there's no real validity or reason to do this. Why? Because now at this point any any um ages that this woman would have to go through comes from why it all starts why because the woman herself came to this initially and said that this daughter that we don't have children this daughter is not my biological child and a woman is not allowed to give testimony after she's already been married to her current husband that wants that she is not allowed to be married to him. Okay? Which he says is a beish. So gives two possible creative reasons for why this rabbi should not get involved. Number one is that we don't know that this child is indeed the child of that donation, but rather it could be that it's a miraculous occurrence that she's the biological daughter of the first husband. And second, that the whole testimony bringing this question even into his mind all stems from what? The testimony of the woman herself. And a woman can't be give a doot, okay, on her personal status once she's already married that would possle that marriage. It would oscerate in this last DNA on the little girl. >> He says it's not necessary though. >> He says it's not necessary though. He says you don't have to go that far. one way or one way or another. >> He says we don't want to do that though. Yeah. >> Okay. As someone who knows about [laughter] personally and I heard somebody share in he is absolutely against DNA testing in general because he says what you might find out if DNA is done you might find it worse etc. He is absolutely against >> fact. All right. So let's go on now to to where we'll take questions at the end. I want to >> a woman can't testify that she's now to her current husband. Let's go on. Okay. So we're now going to learn from Mayor Mazus passed away about a year or so ago. He was uh born in Tunisia, great swardy post and Roshiva of Kisiva in Ben. And Ramazoo also rules leniently as we're going to see and he has a very fascinating couple reasons why. He says there's here we have different sides to look at. He says the first possibility is what? It's possible that the first husband did not have any brothers. There's also the possibility what that the second husband even if we do reveal it won't believe that this daughter is born from a true and he won't want therefore won't want to divorce his wife and he quotes numerous sources that say that therefore um if he doesn't want to divorce his wife he because he doesn't have any hard evidence okay then okay then then he doesn't have to divorce his wife. If there was hard evidence, the best can compel him to divorce his wife. But if there's no hard evidence, okay, that's the first thing. Now, now the time and then he says, now here's another question. Let's say which is not the case in this scenario but Ramuz is taking this a step further that if there was another child born okay then you would and you blow up this marriage and say that they're not allowed to be married to each other then you might call into consider into doubt what the status of that new child whether that new child would be what so what's the he says no that we don't that we don't that we don't pass in that that we don't say that there's another child born, we don't possle that child because because of this mistake. Okay? Even though it's us for them to remain married, the child does not become a momser, the second child. And now here's his last reason. This is the one that really is the mock of all this. And lastly, he says, okay. Okay. When since she got married where in the Rabanoot you had to to get married in this country you had to open a teik a formal tik in the ramen and when she came to the ramen they having been involved in cedar kaducian here done officially many many weddings we know that one of the questions the ramen asks is have you been married before do you have children okay who was the father who's the father of those children etc since she was married in the ramen noot and they knew she had a daughter Allah and didn't enter into her heart and none other he says the raan the best has a responsibility today to understand the mitsas of how many many children are coming into this world okay not always through conventional means but through IVF and and modern science all these questions of personal status and and whether it be egg donation or sperm donation etc etc etc and the Raban. Therefore, today when they see a woman standing before them and says, "Yes, I was married before and I was widowed." And we have a child and and they say, "Well, is that they have a responsibility says Ramadus to then ask the follow question. Is this child the biological daughter of your previous husband?" And then they would ask the question, they would have the responsibility to ask the second follow question. Did your biological h did your first husband have any brothers? And then if the answer is affirmative, they would have a responsibility to ask yet another follow-up question. [snorts] And that followup question would be what >> did you go through khalit? And therefore before the Raban should have allowed them to o to go forward with in opening that to get married it was the responsibility of the Raban to clarify it and therefore says at worm at worst case scenario is what that she is considered someone who was compelled to do it a not because she wanted to or knowingly did but because someone else created the circumstances that compelled her to experience that. My friends, I'm it's a little shorter than a Rabbi Manning a Rabbi Manning, but it's a fascinating fascinating suga. Again, I I you can ask questions. I'm not going to feel comfortable probably answering them because again, this is just like the if if the experts of Mua didn't feel comfortable giving these answers. I'm certainly not, but I'll take the questions.