Avraham, Lot, and the Angels by Rabbi Neil Winkler

or at least a topic that I'm hoping to uh share with you today uh is one as I've been showing you before also about the story of individuals here I'm going to go into the story of Abraham which we had gone earlier of course last week but now Abraham and L the story of L are they they are two different stories but somehow they are connected and I think if we're able to look into these stories and again just looking at the text finding something very interesting that perhaps at first glance we would not have seen and so we're going to start with I think I have the um I want to make sure I have that the sources here the very beginning of the sources uh I find we're not going to go through them but I'll I will turn to them and perhaps point out things to you and is the story of Abraham and the and the angels as it's called the beginning of par the uh malim the Angels come uh and visit L and then the the second part of it which uh ends up being the story of lot and the same Angels go there so it is a continued story but I do want to uh be able to share with you much of what I've heard and learned myself uh in my studies and uh a very interesting thing I learned from ra amn bazak who has a lovely approach to this and I want to share that with you hopefully opening up for you little you know one of those things that you said yeah I never thought of it that way and I that's exactly what I want to have that re reaction I'm very much a um a one who really likes to follow the you can't understand what kazal say what our rabis say and why they said it unless we understand the simple shot simple thing I saw before I overheard about the talking the story about the uh the why was we had very interesting say the simplest reason is I would give first as a simple because usually you had 70 and they came with as 120 hence um andal go on and explain exactly that you find that often very often when the K talk about the beautiful thing talks about this about asking that the be destroyed you heard him going through that and it was destroyed for the for Z but not for um morality um and it's a very simple understanding and a very simple thing kaz's trying to struggle with a simple reality of that time they lived after the time of and they wondered why how come it's not a big problem now people aren't so they came with this wonderful tradition that that they destroy it and so on and so forth whereas that's not wasn't true about when it comes to Lous and immorality so that was the approach they took and it's wonderful and yes it has a tradition to it but the simplest as I would say is that at the time they were looking at around them and saying gee this is not a problem here how come what happened and that's how they approach it well when we learn the tanak everything there is all truth so how do we understand when kazal say this or don't say that and I always say you start with aot what do the words say and what do they they sort of uh imply that's what we're going to be doing in the short term that we have and perhaps if need be we'll go on next week also and that's okay you don't have to learn everything at one time and go over time because it's not allowed to so we'll be doing this so the story of the the angels and as you know begins with simply as the beginning you have English Hashem appear appeared to Abraham at Alon M when he was sitting at the entrance of a tent and during the heat of the day right as he looked up he saw three figures standing near him perceiving this he ran from the entrance of the tent to greet them and bowing to the ground he said my lords if it please you do not pass by your servant let a little water be brought bathe your feet reclined under the tree and let me fetch a morsel of bread that you may refresh yourself and then go on seeing that you have come to my way my servant's way and so they said okay do what you said very nice little story and you know the the story and it's clear to you of course we know later on that these that Angels also come to Sone right to Lo the nephew of a as we spoke about last week and that's what we're going to discuss over here but there are two and I started with that first story two basic well more than that actually but two basic difficulties in that that story here and the the the Angels story you know I always use angels with um little quotations on it because malim means Messengers Messengers or God are angels they're not always Angels sometimes the God's messenger were human beings you know is called in the a Mal but he was a man so at any rate um this story of Three Angels uh has two difficulty uh note that the Story begins as Hashem appeared to Abraham man really where where's God in the story talks about three angels that came there and gave God's word and everything how did God appear he didn't say God spoke to him says God appeared to him so where's God where is he right sh tells AB about the promise of Y being born to Sarah and the Torah says V and God and Sarah overhears what was going on well if God was spoken to Abraham why did Sarah overhear what was going on how is it that she hears a conversation that Hashem directs to Abraham that's both of them T see um and then of course was the famous difficulty which the no difficulty because it's clear what it is right it says there there are three angels and after that whole thing goes on then and they go on to S to L house it says there were only two angels so what happened the the common and very certainly logical you know maybe even textually based upon is that um only two when to go to speak to Lo and the third one wasn't needed cuz he had a different mission right that's what it seems um the third right correct is also there also but he ought to tell about the birth of Sarah one of the two correct okay the rashbam you know who the rashbam was I I I didn't know him personally but he was the it was rashi's grandson been May rash had Rashi had no Sons he had daughters I mean they went to M I think they knew a lot you know they really learned well uh and one of their husbands of course uh and gave birth to this mayor Ben so anyway the rashbam always I don't see attacks but always goes out of his way to say no no look at what the text says and if from there we say oh that's why K say this that there was a source in here great but if not he says no look at what the text is saying he does it all the time he and or Andra mostly he at anyway he says he sets aside the view of kazal and he has a completely different approach and his approach seems to really let's say solve the three problems we have over here about what happened he says very simply you know when it says three malim three agent Angels well actually one of them was God he appeared to them as an angel as a thing he was one of the three and that's how that's how God appeared to Abraham because he was appeared as an angel as and as strange that might as it may sound we find the same similar thing at the burning bush with the story of mosenu in the beginning of SEO and they see in the Second Source where we have in the source a messenger of Hashem appeared to him meaning to Moshe in a blazing fire out of a bush he gazed and there was a bush all of a flame the Bush was not consumed Moses said I have to turn around I have to look around to see why it was that the that the um the Bush was not at all consumed and what does he find out uh as all of a sudden it says saw that he turned aside he said he called to him from the bush and said Moshe Moshe so it began with a story that an angel a um sorry appeared to Moshe and who spoke God spoke and and effect was was the wasn't was at any rate um the ran says therefore that one of the Three Angels was actually God himself and the middle one like he said that was God himself yeah and with this explanation we begin to take away our problem first of all where was God in the story he was part of the sto the Angels obviously how did Sarah overheard overhear God's conversation with not God speaking from above and coming into go Abraham's ears it was speaking as an angel who looked like an anashim looked like people and so he spoke like a person which therefore allowed Sarah to over here what was happening and um what happened to the third angel will he asked that question I he gave that answer why we only two went to sadom because when you look at the continuation of the story when they went to St to S it says people meaning the two two angels left left to go to but AB stayed there with god well if the rasham said that one of the Angels was God that's exactly what happened one of the Angels was God talking to Abraham and and they went to very nice so that's a first difficulty but I think it's a very interesting simple type of explanation that helps us say oh it is not so not so uh impossible to understand wonderful good then we go on to the second difficulty that I did not really bring up and that is if we look through safet and we realize and you know we've study it we realize that that uh God already told Abraham that Sarah was going to have a child he said it back in per and that is Source number four I use Source number three when I wanted to show you how the people went to S and God remained with Abraham here in the fourth Source you have how um God had already told Abraham Maz because going to have kid that's what happen you have your wife Sarah is going to give you a child I know you had already Ishmael but she's going to give you a child and that says clearly in the 17th chapter as I said in the fourth Source look at the English and God said to Abraham ask for your wife Sarai you shall not call her Sarai rather her name shall be Sarah I will bless her indeed I will give you a son through her I will bless her so that she will give rise to Nations rulers of peoples will issue from her okay so what is he coming back for you know God check out the seventh peric you why you coming in 18th peric and telling the exact same thing you already told Abraham okay um and the interesting thing is is even those two experiences of talking to um Abraham and letting him know in per Z how he isar is going to give a child for her a son for her and the one saying the same thing here in the experiences seem very very similar for example in both things you [Music] have right Abraham heard that story in in uh and this is again I'm sorry Source number five Abraham fell to his face and he laughed he said to himself can a child be born to a man of 100 years of age or can Sarah give bear a child at 90 years of age so he was shocked right that's what he says and um s laughs sah says the same thing um I didn't you did I put it down here yeah yeah s and she laughed quietly also saying thinking now that I've worn out have means to wear out when says in the that actually that you've been you've been walk walking through the desert now for 40 years your your clothing has not worn out so she say below after I've been worn out in effect that's me beautiful Hebrew you have know um you expect me I it says you know it was translators I've lost the ability that was a translation but he couldn't say I've been worn out you know uh I might have enjoyment the also means I should be re um reborn re youthful again so V said my husband is so old okay so she is basically saying the same thing as he said how can I she falls to his his face laughing as she does he says how can I and my wife get there with who ow a give child and that's exactly what she says so it's not only a repetition of what he said but God said but also the similar uh reactions although from different people it's very very interesting now the truth is that it's not very uh rare that the Torah will repeat certain stories from one or the other but especially in say for bit by the way um but there are always certain differences the version something new and in fact that's also true over here here and I show you something very very interesting now you'll notice and you have it here again I did a good job here in number six also giving you the sources you see in the first time God speaks to Abraham to let him know the good news over there we read that the promise of us having a son focused primarily on Abraham yes he said sorah will give the child but on Abraham and note the repetition of the word as he's speaking to Abraham the word to you I will bless her sah indeed I will give you a son by her you a son nevertheless s your wife will sh shall bear you a son whom s shall bear to you at this season season next year each time it's you you you now given the fact that he already had one son I have too much but he had a son you you and but he kept on pushing it's you I'm going to give it for you I'm giving it to you very nice on the other hand look in the 18 look at the next story of giving a son and here you find that the focus is not Abraham but it's indeed Sarah look what it says you know next year this time Sarah will be bearing a son next year they'll worry sah is gonna have a son um this is this this real really focus now is not on oh you have a son Abraham but now Sarah is gonna have a son it's almost as if it would seem that that God God is specifically maybe talking to Sarah this time and therefore it's out loud therefore she heard maybe it was that purpose of coming or maybe not maybe this purposeful shift reflects a different reason as to why there will be a son very interesting see imper you'll find in that 17th chapter chap the earlier one where God first promises a son for Abraham there it says now I know it sounds a little strange when we always Define one of the other but kazal are very careful and it's clearly true in the text too that Elohim is a word that generally is more harsh it deals with a a a judgment type of thing as opposed to which is more of of mercy so there you have um this thing that Elohim here Elohim means a judgment for example and you have this you say it in the in the Tuesday right you know God sends in the midst of Judges Justice you have that in Mish also Cur judges judges it says also you have a question you have to go to Elohim doesn't mean you're GNA get the bus to God it means that Elohim is is the Jud is is the court the judges you go to the judges so that is um really the same thing one and the other judges are you him and there also is Elohim Elohim I should say meaning not God but judges at any rate um that's the word that's used when God speaks to Abraham the first time as if it's a judgment of sorts what do I mean um because right before that is when God ordered Abram to give a Brit mil to give the Brit mil right that was the institution of the Brit Mila with Abraham and in effect what God was saying is I'm gifting you a son Abraham to carry on the breit into future Generations not because you're a good guy a nice fellow because I gave you a Mitzvah that's the law and because you have the law I have you you have to have Generations you have to have a future they have to have have a Brit Brit Mila that's why I'm giving a son and the guarantee that the son's name will be is because the promise of fathering an eternal family is a very good reason for Abraham to have laughed and to rejoice and even to say I can't believe it I don't believe it I'm going to I have a son and I didn't think I have a God said but I don't now he going to have a son yeah was it incredulity that many do that's why they say why did God at angry at at Sarah and not at AB when he laughed they say that was incredulity well I don't believe it and if we understand it as bazak does that indeed Elohim this was a a tiing a flow from the Brit Mila and you're going to have a son because we have to have Brit Mila and generations that are going to have that that makes sense that his reaction oh my God that's just oh goodly I'm gonna have a son but I can't believe it got I'm G to have a Generations I'm going to be able to carry out this Mitzvah that's however however however none of these details that is the the Brit or that you will have an eternal nation and the name will be that's not mentioned when he speaks to S and ab the second time anderic that's not there and um in we don't use the words Elohim which is Justice you know more of a strict thing but rather Hashem which is R so why is this Mercy or ra him very beautifully because now he's telling Abraham I'm going to give you a child because as a reward for your kindnesses not only your kindness but Sarah's kindness how is that so beautifully um brought out in the text look at how Abraham um welcomes his guests look at what he does I'm sure you've heard this before but live it because I'm saying it now so you know do it first of all look at what he did and and the the Torah goes out of its way to sort of depict and described what was going on instead of saying and told him this he goes on to the whole story right first of all this is the Middle East Sun it ain't that comfortable we have just gone through the summer he sits there not in the evenings of Y it breezes about six o'clock 7 and it's gorgeous but in the midday heat and he sat not inside the but outside to go and and greet the guests that's an act of real Mercy if you want to use that bringing in the guests that's one and then you read uh the words he used and we're going to go on to that more but even though he saw them V he didn't wait for them to come over to him does he he runs over to to to to before they go away before he wants to gave them another act of kindness he approaches these Wanderers and he pleads with them not to do a favor for them but he pleads to them saying you'll do me a favor please come here please let me give you this right now let me tell you he starts with a simple thing right again these Wanderers these angels never ask for anything he goes and offers that kindness then he runs to get them and he says the following you know what that that that phrase means uh well you see I haven't memorized any of the English translations if I have found favor in your eyes if I'm okay with you that kind of thing I'm going to say something really wild that phrase is used 14 times I don't know if you counted it 14 times in all of T 14 times and every single time it's found in the tanak it's always a plea for someone else to do a favor for you please if I can you please do this for me we do it with God offer we ask God that way always please do this to me if it's if I'm okay with you can you please do that to me do this his favor the only time in all of T when here is a man coming and saying do you know that that you're doing a fa a favor of somebody else but you're saying it's for me over here AB is doing the favor really but he makes the guests feel as if they're doing the favor for him that's really a remarkable way of approaching think of your really the just remarkable this is a kindness why is the story so important that the Torah wants to sell the story so what again it was hot again because if this is the reason for having a child because of your kindness the Torah wants to tell us very subtly so subtly we didn't know about it until we start looking over here that look at this kindness this man does and his wife what he she did this is why amazing he says let me bring you you know let a little bit of water brought to you right I'll tell you a little little bit of a little roll you know a little have a bagel something you know a little something right but what does he do first of all hair he hurries and he says M quickly he tells his servants quickly take the finest finest quickly say a bake up of the finest flour you can uh and and then he says to elar Abraham then he runs he runs again he's right the man is old he's hundred years old he's running to get the animal right days after H again you're going into you know yeah understand that as being right after because after all mil is just a one two pro beforehand you know be that as it made that's exactly what kazal see again showing you what carness say there is here but even if we don't go that way just looking at the text he was saying that he runs to give this Animal by my hair yeah he doesn't boil it up and then roast it for an hour and a half he probably put it on a spit and he put it on a grill one two three quickly he wanted to give it to them they shouldn't be that way unbelievable this is just the telling the story and that's exactly the reason for the story when the Torah gives you a story that there must be a reason for it there are a lot of stories that we don't know about let's face it what do we know about this stuff you know 100 years ago and in the last thousand years this happened what you know what do we know happened between Noah and ab I don't know there was a tower very ni and between Adam and Noah there's a thousand years went by what happened I don't know you we don't know it wasn't good yeah there are a lot of generations that went by why is this so important this is why it's so important God wants to impress in you you future children of Abraham what it means kindness how to treat people and the yeah I give you a bagel that wasn't a bagel SL three measures is a large is quite big um and the finest fin meat he talks about and he didn't give he brought milk and and whether that is cream or whether that is butter undoubtedly before before he gave him the meat because you know but he gave all these stuff the acts of the the kindnesses he gives remarkable overwhelming and the Torah emphasizes that over and over and over again and now it helps us better understand the episodes of Abraham and and the and why it was seemingly repeated in now we know there were two different reasons for it and the God wanted to make sure that the first the reason for a child is because I had to give it to him because he's got to do the me love it got it's got to happen but at the second time he said look at this man who do deserves it look at this woman who has gone through this terrible time of of baroness look at this he wants us to understand that and he wants to reward that and let it be known and that's ex everything we have explained right now we can at least help understand also the next story the story of sudo so before I even start with s okay before I start there um we returned to the the Angels who visited in the 18th in and uh we always ask the question why did they come right remember we discussed it before just somebody mentioned it one had had to had to be able to bring this and one had to bring that one had to give them the the um the the um come on come on come on he had to heal Abraham one had to tell him the the promise of a child one had a destruction of of snow that's the three of them right so I want to go a little more into the details again as this is also I think Bak after telling Abraham about the future birth of Y the second time we read very interestingly um that God has decided that I've got to um tell Abraham what I'm planning right didn't put that in because it was a short little thing that's the phrase um um now when God speaks to another it almost says right and God spoke God said this this verse that it says God had um it said should I not tell Abraham uh what I'm planning to do and destroying sedom and the other cities you realize there were actually five cities he plan to destroy he ends up with four okay it says vem Amar now I'm going to tell you something that I have said a number of times in my classes and that um I hope doesn't sound too much like an aorus here but I'm actually telling you exactly what it means andelle know that Hashem Amire does not mean I said I'm not going to God doesn't to talk to himself you know doesn't have to talk to himself he think thinks means in God thought he thought but who was he talking to let there be light you know he will white light to be that's what Amar mean and I have it in many many different areas where clearly am means uh to think have thoughts right so here it is but it doesn't say by hasem that would be more of a speak speak Amar means not only he thought it but he had thought it in other words he didn't say after he told um um Abraham by the way you're going to have a child and he's going to be wonderful you and S are terrific by the way I want to destroy Stow I've decided that's not what happened for hasem Amar means God had already thought before he did anything I had to tell Abraham about this even before he came to Abraham that's why we can very easily understand that one of the Angels came to tell the Abraham that it was going to be destroyed s because God had already figured that out he knew he had to destroy s he knew he had to tell Abraham and before he did that he told him about Y and the whole story here right um so before he uh before he appears to Abraham as one of the Angels if you as we had say um he had said he had thought already that he has to tell Abraham about the destruction of s in other words and this by the way is the Abel who often will go to text as way as well he says um the whole reason why why God my God appeared to Abraham is because he had to tell Abraham about the destruction of s because he already told him about the child and he really had to tell him about what was going to happen to Stone that was a really purpose of why he is coming here that's his suggestion and if that's the truth then why did he not come by himself why did he have to bring the other two angels with him as it were um so the critical word here to help us understand this is a word that um we often just ignore now if you recall in that beginning of the appearance of the Angels coming to Abraham in the middle of the day and it's hot and so on and so forth and he runs over to them he has to run over to them for a very simple thing because it says you know means to stand they were standing there they did not come to Abram that's why Abraham had to run over to them because they had stopped over there almost as if I don't know if we should go there or not maybe we should knock on the on the on the tent and I should be there don't know they stood they stop they paused over there why [Music] because as much as it means to stop there to stand there it's used in another way it means not as sometimes it's it's um translated oh they were standing upon him it can't be that I got be standing upon him and then he runs to get them right that couldn't be mean he' be right there that can't mean that what it means is what it means in other places as I told you before not only the word Elohim can mean judges but n as Source number seven said the um go Nim is judges standing for judgment when they s sit for a court s it's that's the word the Torah uses to N means also to judge as a court would judge and if that's the case not to push a little bit we will but it means that God was now with in a Divine assembly how many people you need for a judge for a court in Jewish how many people he judg three three three men come with Abraham he could just told them one thing but he had three why because they were going to pass judgment I'm what who's being judged or what's being judged good s they're coming God decided he's going to destroy s they were awful they were terrible they deserve death he's God he can do whatever he wants to can't punish but he wants to do this as a judgment and before he decides he's going to have judgment he might make sure so he has three and they come it's a big actually call it's a b that's what it was so and instead of telling ABR right away he delays so that he can reward Abraham for the remarkable kindness that he has been showing him that's that whole story of he's want to do this he's going this prepare that prepare this and now after all of that and after now he realizes and he knows clearly that Abraham is very and Sarah are very um worth worthy of this child now he says okay I have the best in here the bed is here and we're going to judge or we have judged S as being guilty and that's what he tells abam and uh he wanted to hear what Abraham has to say before officially the he and the Angels would pass judgment about Sid and that's when he says as I told you could I keep back from Abraham exactly what I plan is right and so he does that and now another Leaf turns over of the remarkable personality called Ibraham ainu and that is his please and his argument there to argue with God as to why he should show always blows my mind and he uses three arguments does he not as to why Dome should not be destroyed first of all he says this is Source number eight you know it's exactly at its point he's saying far be it from you to do such a thing to bring death upon the innocent as well as the guilty not far be it from you is based upon the word is the opposite of whates so means it's Unholy for you God to do such a thing what a phenomenal thing to say terrible thing God even you can't commit that's what he's telling God you can't commit by doing this that's what you'll be doing wow you can't do that and just simply kill off everybody what are you going to do my God you're going to put bombs in the beepers and just the ones who are guilty are going to get killed not yet he does it other to but you can't kill everybody so that's argument number one argument number two is look right if there should be 50 innocent within the city will you wipe out the place and not forgive it for the sake of innocent 50 who are in there if if they allowed innocent un innocent doesn't mean they're wonderful even sadik doesn't mean the righteous sadik in the Torah means unguilty not guilty when AB says I'm a sadik you're not a sadik Ab you're not guilty true I'm not therefore I'm not going to punish you God says to AB when has the whole thing with but you're not you ain't a saint let's put it that way and that's what sadik means very often sadik or Russia and we see that all the time that means not guilty unguilty so if there are 50 unguilty not bad people you know they're not guilty people like the Russia and if they're allowed to live in the city if they can know if they the city people allow them to live there so it they could be that bad let them go right you should spare the city the very existence of a community of righteous people would prove that the city or let's say unguilty people it would prove that this city is not completely and totally Wicked that's a number one argument a number two argument that was and number three argument is all the way down he goes from you know 40 to 30 to to 20 finally to 10 and what if 10 Innocents should be found there you're going now he bases a plea not upon fair and not Fe there but I understand they only have 12 but here I based it on on mercy God please a little bit spare them have mercy upon them uh they are people are we Wicked yeah you're right they should be punished but please show your mercies and spare them that's what Mercy is Mercy is not mean I'm going to argue that they really are okay I'm sorry Mercy yeah Rel um I don't think so but it it's a good question I I know something about that that I know of that 10 is got Dominion um you know in effect saying you well you know if they have 10 a minion except for the fact that they were ading you know and there wasn't no minion but it's an interesting point I think that you you bring up but again he now says that I want to argue with you not because they deserve it but because you're a as as we approach understand uh yes we talk about and yes we call you know we but primarily what we say is that we don't deserve it God but please you're you're you're my our father have that mercies and that is a third thing I we