Mixing Meat & Milk With Chanukah Candles | Rabbi Dr. Aaron Adler | December 17th 2025

Okay to boke to >> this week's shum are dedicated by Rifka and J Rifka Roseberg des Shapiro and this is in memory of Jakob Ben and Ben Abraham Hakohain right parents whose yard sites are near reviek is tonight it's tonight and I just say parenthetically that I had the news on in the morning that is at 5:10 in the morning cuz we go to Davin at 6:15 6:05 today. So the broadcaster, she said, "So today is the um third candle and after sundown will be the fourth candle." And I told my wife, she holds like the Rambam. That's pretty good. We're going to get to it in the year. She holds like the Rambam. The question is, what time do you light candles? from sundown or from which is when stars come out and that is approximately 20 minutes after sundown. So there's a on this but apparently on Israel and they hold like the Ramb because she said that said you know in my house that's the case there's a minimum which emanates from this neighborhood Shahid right next door and that's the Minn of the Vagin who adopted the Rambam's min for candle lighting from sundown. So today it's uh it's uh 4:37. So that's where it is. Bes liked when your grandfathered lit, you know. >> Excuse me. Would like to say something. >> Yeah. >> I just want to do you mind if I just make sure >> just two very quick announcements. Uh first of all I want to wish condolences on behalf of the >> and amen >> and uh please do remember to switch off your phones for the duration of the year >> and happy Khan to everyone. >> Thank you. Thank you. This morning's learning is also dedicated in loving memory of user zelicans Eisenberg passed away on the third day of Khaneka and this is sponsored by Rif and Sami Mark the share as we know for the year is dedicated by the Frist family in memory of Alishima Zman. Okay. So last week was supposed we had here at the center at the shul the yomun for Kaneka and uh unfortunately I was not able to attend u so I figured it's Kaneka today I'm just going to do what I planned to do last week. If anybody here can guess what mixing milk and meat meat and milk with Kaneka candles is you know that's a $64,000 question right? Um but I will end with something about Moisur that we did last year for our Khanekashir and we'll see if anybody remembers because I didn't remember everything. I had to go back to my notes and um just to say something we'll try to get it in towards the end of this year. Let let's see what we have here. Shayot chuvot responsoral literature is the corpus of literature of people asking questions to raanim and their responses to chuvot um actually begin I would take a guess and say from the days of tan when at the beginning of bayeni the question was asked now we're building the Second beta mikdash. What do we do with tishab that we've been fasting for 70 years? That's a sham. Of course, the answer was all of these fast days are going to be well. What was the answer? Yes or no? That we don't know. That that has happened to me. My wife can testify. Somebody called me with a shila and after 20 minutes of me explaining the issues I hung up and forgot to tell the person what to do. So I actually called back. So so you have to give a bottom line. You have to give an answer. Beda in the Gmorrah here and there you have episodes of Shayot Chabot. But our corpus literature of shalot shabot begins it's about 1,200 years old from the end of the period of the gonim certainly in the days of theim the middle ages and certainly after the printing press and the modern days until this very day shot trouvote today you have shot truvot on WhatsApp you have shot in emails and so on and sometimes people still print the books of shay trouvot the obvious importance of shayot trouvot is to know the answer. Now, not always the two does does a question which may appear later on in history which may seem similar but may not be identical. So the answer may not be the same thing. So also it could be that some other RV had a different angle on the way to approach a particular halaka. So the same question arises and you get more than one answer. So should we say go after airplanes? That's a shear in itself. So the answer isn't yes or no. It's yes, no, and maybe. So there there are three different opinions on how to handle this and and and that becomes an exciting study in Halaka of how each pose approaches a particular modern era problem based on the sources and how they understood the sources. uh RA professor Salvik the Raf's son who's a great Tom and also a remarkable historian wrote a whole book on use of response to literature for history for historical purposes what we can learn and here we're not looking at the answers we're looking at the questions the shilless because people ask questions not because they woke up in the morning and had a dream and they fabricated some type of scenario The scenarios are real. They're real life scenarios. There was one particular pose who wrote a book Shayo to Chuvot where that was his style. He he knew what he wanted to say. So he introduced it with a question. So we knew the ground rules. He wrote it in his introduction. So you know that that's not a historic book. That's his fa fascination. But most 99.999% of Shayot Travot reflect some aspect of history. So >> what was the truvot doing? I was very good. So the shot chot during the holocaust specifically I'll mention chot mimakim from oshri who was the rv 30 years old he was the rv of the kovna ghetto if you want to know what was going on in the kofna ghetto you read the questions my brother would use that book for the yoma shawah community get together in ten new jersey where he didn't read the answers he read the questions and he could sit and cry and rip ka just by reading the questions and they weren't questions like you know I forgot to say yalov in my you know onesh those weren't the questions these are heartbreaking questions where you s you clearly learn what was going on in the um in life in the kag ghetto so here we're going to see something about life which is so far from reality what we're going to see here is maybe something you'd see in in a museum not necessarily next to the dinosaurs but um but let's say history of let's say 2 3 400 years ago go of life. Now, today when when um you have bins for uh recycling, which is a nice thing because people just threw out garbage and the garbage was just useless at the end. And then they found out they can use glass from bottles, they can use plastics, they can use paper and all this stuff can be recycled. So, we have these recycling bins now for everything. In days of old, people also didn't throw things out, but they tried to make secondary use from something. So, if I had a pan and um I was going to fry meat and I put oil or some type of parva, some type of fat that that would make it uh you know, whatever, you know, be able to fry it. Fine. So what happens afterwards is that fat that was used to to uh for for for the frying process congeals. When it cools down it congeals. So you get this we call it schmaltz. And everybody know what schmaltz is in Roman go there's a store a meat store that's that's called schmaltz except be careful because you slip when you walk in you know schmaltz all over the floor. The um schmaltz a Jewish m a Jewish food is most probably the most unhealthiest thing that you can put into your blood cells. It's artilliocerosis on rye but but Jews like it. I mean rights tasty rights. So, so the schmaltz, this congealed schmaltz, if you put a wick in the congealed schmaltz, you can, it makes a candle, makes for a candle, and people would be able to illuminate their homes. So, they had these oil candles to illuminate their homes. You've seen it in, you know, Roman plays and things like that. But here, you've got the fuel for the homegrown candle, and it's just reusing the schmaltz that was used to fry meat. But what if by accident the schmelts came from butter? And I'm not talking about margarine. Butter by accident. Butter was put into a fleshic pot and they cooked up a steak of some. They fried, you know, some meat on it. Okay. So hopefully the problem was caught before uh people ate that meat because if they didn't then they ate basar. They ate meat and milk. Fine. So let's assume somebody you know rang the bell and said whoa whoa one second can't do that that was butter. So they throw the meat out. Why did they throw meat out? Because basaral meat and milk not only cannot be eaten but you're not allowed to derive any benefit from it. So that means you can't go to your go neighbor and say hey you want a piece of flesh? You know I can't eat it because I did this and that but it's tasty and everything and you can eat it. So you might be able to do that for other non-coosher foods for for pork for for most of the forbidden foods. It's just a prohibition for Jew to eat it. But it's permissible for Jew to derive benefit from it. And one of the benefits is financial benefit. So you can give it to a non-Jew. The Tawra says it. You have to feed your dog. So you can feed the dog. you know, trafe food. I mean, this is the famous uh story of 150 years ago in the where uh a guy was far away from his city and and only twice a year he saw his rough and he asked him, "Give me an idea. What do I do when I have tray food? I have no no telephones obviously. Who what do I do with it?" He said, "Very simple. If you have a Shiloh on the on the meat, just put it next to the dog. If the dog eats it, then you know it's strafe. If the dog doesn't eat it, you know it's kosher." So a guy comes back six months later. He says, "Rabbi, maybe you have a better." He says, "What's wrong with the first?" He says, "Yeah, yeah, it was great at, but the dog is such a mahm." You know, he had everything. You know, the the uh the idea of of um giving it away. The Torah says it in parhatra a you can give it uh to a or sell it to a That's called hana. You're allowed to have benefit from it. There is a handful of forbidden foods that not only you're not allowed to eat but you're also not allowed to have benefit. A classic example is fruits from the first three years of orah. So not only are they forbidden to be eaten but also forbidden to have any type of benefit. So let's assume it's an edro tree that has a nice fragrance to it. So you're not allowed if it's or it's the first three years. You're not allowed to smell it. You're not allowed to enjoy the aroma and the fragrance of a of a fruit of the first three years. You're also now to give it away as a gift. You're not allowed to sell it and so on. That's called assur. So basal the cooked product of meat and milk together is not only forbidden to be eaten but also forbidden to enjoy benefit. So there actually three prohibitions in Basalav. One is the act of cooking meat and milk together even without eating it. That's already a probation. The second is the eating of the cooked product of because the eating of meat and milk not cooked is only rabbitic restriction. But the biblical is not eating a cooked product of meat and milk together. And the third is not enjoying the benefit of the cooked product of meat and milk. So now I have this scenario. I have a frying pan and I by accident used milk butter and I fried meat in it and I threw the meat out cuz somebody told me it was it was butter. Fine. Can I now use the schmaltz for lighting illuminating my home? That's question number one. And question number two, can I use it as a Kaneka candle? Here we got the Kaneka. So let's look at it inside. Source number one. Chuva is a type of anthology of responsive literature printed on the yora sim. This section of yadea of the second of is studied intensely by anybody studying for and these are the laws of those doing are going to get to it in a few months when they learn the ethic of basar. So here it says and what this pit chuva is it gives us different uh insights into what's going on or I call it highlights responsora literature highlights. It doesn't give us the whole thing. So if you're if you're not lazy you go to the real book and you check it out what's saying you'll see why that's going to be important here. The the opening word is it's quoting the words from that is forbidden to have benefit. Check out Ephraim Sim. Who is Mr. Shah Ephraim? So his name was Rabi Refraim Hakohain. He's from the 17th century. He was a RV and Rashashiva in Hungary. And I can tell you just by checking Roberto Google Schlita that he had a grandson an illustrious grandson from his daughter. So it's like um Ben Shelbito from his daughter who was the rabbi Ashkanazi the father of the the ivitz rack of so we're talking about somebody who's uh very very very important in his generation. Now most people today never heard of the Shahim nor did they hear of the and I always quote the z from parhatal au everything is a masle thing even which kaidesh we're going to use which safer from the great became popular which became less popular talk about that you know sometimes there are real historic economic social/political reasons why a safer makes it and another safer doesn't make it. So the sha fry wasn't all that well known but he's he is referred to here in the what is the sha he gave up butter that was cooked and I'll use the word here fried cooked in a pot kadra is a cooked pot of meat bomo that means the pot was clearly fleshek because not maybe the person didn't even cook fleshiks now with this but fleshik basar was cooked in this pot within the last 24 hours so if something is cooked if it's meat or milk in a pot so the first 24 hours after the cooking it maintains its gender so if I cook meat on 2 p.m. on a particular day so up till 2 p.m. tomorrow. It's like there's meat there. The flavor of the meat is still embedded in the walls. And therefore, if such a pot existed in my house and now I put butter in and melted it down. So basically what I did was I cooked. Where's the meat? The meat's not there, but the flavor of the meat that's there from within 24 hours is called meat. So this is what I did. What am I left with? I've got the melted butter sitting on the bottom of this pan. So the frame says it is forbidden for me to recycle the schmaltz to simply illuminate the house what I mentioned before just to make a homebaked um can lamp. What the reason is you now have benefit from and essentially I cooked and then he says maybe you want to suggest all right for lighting up the living room that's no good but to use it as a candle perhaps perhaps this is going to be okay why might I think that would be okay because there's a principle in There is a principle in that says that Torah was not given for you to benefit from the mitzvah. Food was given to benefit. Other things were given to benefit. The fact that you enjoy a mitzvah is of no significance. The Torah didn't give us the mitzvot. So we should enjoy the mitzvah. If a person was eat is eating matzah on sed night, you may enjoy eating the matzah, but that's your problem. You don't have to enjoy eating the matzah. You're doing it because the Torah says you should eat the matzah on the night of the sedar. Sov. So if the mitzvot weren't given for purposes of enjoyment. So who cares if this schmaltz now is stuck with the tags forbidden to have benefit. I'm not having benefit by lighting the khan candles. I would have a benefit if it was my homebaked lamp because I want to read the newspaper. But if I'm using it for kanuka candles, there's no hana. So I should be able to use it. He's saying even though the mitzvot weren't given for purposes of having benefit nevertheless nevertheless it's still going to be pro prohibited because there's another problem. What's the second problem for there's a need a requirement for a minimum quantitative value. How long does the kanuka candle have to burn? So we all know it's about a half an hour. Okay, we'll get to where the half hour came from. But there is a type of quantitative value which is measured by the quantity of oil in the cup or the thickness of a candle which if I take a birthday cake candle which you know you put in the birthday cakes right Jay had to have 90 candles in the birthday cake. >> No silver, >> right? Soon you have to add another one. I'm going to have 91 candles in the birthday cake, right? So that's a heck of a lot of candles, you know? So, but these candles, they're small candles like a toothpick, like a toothpick candle. So, you can't use that for Kaneka candle because um you know, it's not going to give you the requisite amount. It's not g the requisite amount. Although, I'm just going to interject for a second. Remind me where I'm up to. The uh I heard once from a hol holocaust survivor who was the director general of Yadvashm that they this was Kdesh Hashem for a month before Kaneka they they took whatever little butter that was on the half a slice of bread and scraped it off the bread stuck it under the bed bed. It wasn't a bed. It was a piece of wood. And they used that for an candle. They ripped off from their pajama, you know, a wick. And they all got under the bed and they lit it for 10 minutes and they blew it out and everything. I don't need Hakadoshu's, you know, uh, appribation about it. I am sure that there was a credit there if not for at least for kdeshm >> and the kids in the minhar also. Right. Right. Exactly. These were acts of keshm. So acts of keshashem have its own context. But a birthday candle you can't use. There's a minimum quantitative value of how long the um the candles have to burn. So what's the issue of minimum quantitative value? So now I'm just going to jump to the second source. The second source says if you have a lulaf later I'll talk about the connection between sukas and but if you have a lulaf that comes from a tree that was used to serve idolatry init the says and it's aim rather you have to burn it. Okay. So you have to burn a tree that was used the asher was usually a date pump to be burnt. Fine. Now a lulv has to have a minimum quantitative height four theim and have to be three. So is like a fist. So if you just measure out three or four fists you have three or four. So our lul are usually longer than that but that's the minimum height of a lulaf forim. Fine. So the question is if I have a lulv from this a well shouldn't I prohibit it because it was used for abodaz. So gumar tells us that the real reason that is prohibited is because if I burn it because I have to burn it. I didn't burn it yet, but if I burn it, then it becomes ashes. And ashes can be crunched to the palm of my hand. I could take the ash of four worth of lulaf and just put it in my hand. So what don't I have? I don't have the minimum forim value. The sh and that's called we'll see it inside. The shear is quetched. The shear is quetched. Which is an interesting concept because I didn't burn this lulaf yet. It came from a palm tree that was used for Abu Darit Israel. Yeshua Benoon comes in Israel. They come to all kinds of beautiful palm trees and it's going to be sukus and the guy rips off a a a branch from a palm tree that in all likelihood was used for Abu Dar. And the answer is no. You can't use that lulaf even though it's a beautiful lulaf and everything. Why? Because the is if they're going to burn something, the looks at it as if it was already burned. Yeah. >> What about regular lul? If you burn a kosher will go, right? Both have the same. >> Correct. But here, but but before you burn a kosher lul, you can use it. Here, you can't use the lul of the asher before you burn it because it's going to be burned. But of course, it's going to be burned. Your your lulaf you want to burn. That's your problem. But it's a kosher. It's kosher. That makes no difference. Here the says that it's going to be burned and therefore it's already considered burned and therefore it's missing its quantitative value. And that's why the this schmaltz that's from comes originates from butter but it was cooked in a pot that was fleshik and now has meat flavor absorbed into this h butter and hence has become forbidden from h forget about the h the fact that it's I have to destroy it and if you have to destroy it it has no quantitative value to it even Though physically this schmaltz will give me more than a half hours worth of a kaneka candle halically there is nothing there it's already burnt and therefore you have nothing. Let me just read it inside now in the end of source number one. Even though there's a of four lines from the end of source number one that I would say if I'm allowed to have benefit from it so then I can use it nevertheless is forbidden because requires a minimum quantitative value with milk because it's forbidden to have benefit. This is the concept that the the monetary the quantitative monetary value is fetched is squeezed together and I because it's going to be burnt or destroyed and therefore I don't have the minimum sh and then he says in parenthesis there's another p the pagadimo quoted the same who said that sh that actually it's permissible for so what do we have now two versions of the same posim. Will the real Shah fryim please stand up? So we don't know and the primagod quoted the this and then he says with with you know you know with apologizing the primag didn't look carefully enough because I'm telling you that even the shapim said it's assuran it's assur So what do we have here? We've got two opinions as whether you can or cannot use this schmaltz. This is a burning issue for us tonight, right? >> It's burning issue. You got it. It's a burning issue. It's a burning issue. Are you going to use this schmaltz tonight for your four candles? Well, no. We're not going to we don't do that. But this o this discussion this Shila with the two possibilities opens up the whole discussion as to what exactly is this half an hour all about. So let's look at source number three. Yeah. >> What about the reverse? Right. Now if the pot had milk in it, if it was a milk, >> right? Okay. So milk pot and then I you know put so again and it was cooked milk for last within the last 24 hours and you put meat in it. You've created even if the milk's not there, the milk flavor is still in the pot for 24 hours. So then you've cooked. Look. Oh yeah. So the reason that our great rebby did not see favor in cautering a dishwasher because he believed that in the pipes, the drainage pipes, there's always residue food that gets stuck in there. And let's assume you did you had a milk, you have fleshic, you know, cutlery and and pans, pots and pans, and some particles may be stuck there. The next time you run the machine and you put in it. He says, "You're actually cooking meat and milk." That was his bigra big, >> right? Okay. So, look, Raosha Pin has a different take on it. So, you know, if you want to know about this, ask somebody else. Okay. Let's look at source number three. This is the beginning of the laws of Kaneka in Shabbat in the so I'll just say a word that some have suggested you know there is no Mishna that deals with Kaneka and some thought that this was political that the house of Rabuda Hani had a running brogue with the descendants of the Kashm descendants who eventually morphed into Hordard. and Herod and obviously they didn't see favor with him at all. So maybe it was censored out of the Mishna. It's not true at all. It's not true. There are eight references to Kaneka in the Mishna. It's true. There's no particular and my humble suggestion is based on something the Rambam wrote in his Mishna commentary to was that those areas of mitzvah performance that were so popular didn't have to dedicate time for and he says take a look the how you davin is not mentioned in the Mishna because people knew how to den what's mentioned in the Mishna are things that may have differences of opinion or things that ordinar the ordinary person may not be aware of but things that were highly popular there was no need to talk about it. Apparently Kaneka was pretty popular already in the days of Kazal. But all right, there are eight references in different contexts. U the list of read Torah reading on a Yam. So it talks about Pesak so Kaneka and Purum. I mean it's there's no excommunication of Kaneka as a YT in the mission itself. But the laws of lighting candles it waits for the So what happens the editors of the you know the game pin the tail on the donkey they like sometimes pin something on a topic that's related so where could be a good place in the to talk about the lighting of khan candles the lighting of Shabbat candles so you have the parrot the second chapter of Shabbat we say Friday night in Ashkanaz lighting of Shabbat candles and there it tells us about all the oils and the wicks that are kosher and not kosher for Shabas candles. Then in Shabbatar says, what about Khan candles? So there's an opinion that says whatever is off limits for Shabas candles is off limit for Kaneka candles. And then the qualifies not necessarily the case because on on Kaneka you're allowed you're allowed to um uh you know relight the candle if it gets blown out in Friday night. If it blows out you can't relight it. It's already Shabbat. And that disqualified some of the bad oils. But on Kaneka candles, it's not such a terrible thing. It's a weak night. So if it blows out, but then the says that you know what, even for Kaneka candles, you don't have to relight it if it blew out as long as when you lit it, it had the potential to go the distance. So that's that's where this kamar opens up. You mean to tell me that if it blew out, the kan candles blew out? You don't have to relight it. I'm going to ask a question based on the following. The mitzvah of candles from sundown until people have left the marketplace. Which means because there's a mitzvah to publicize the miracle to the public domain. So once people are off the street, that's the end of the mitzvah really. That's the end of the mitzvah. So says, "My love, apparently the if it blew out, you have to relight it until the time that people are off the street." Gammorra says, "No, your in inference is wrong. The e the com the idea is that you should begin lighting candles from sundown, right? Tonight 4:37." But if you didn't light candles until from the moment of sundown, you still have to light it as long as people are still on the street. If you didn't light yet, so go ahead and that's one response. And the second response in the is if perhaps you'd like to suggest that this business of from the sundown until people are off the street it teaches us an amount of time that Kaneka candles had to be lit. Which means that even if let's assume at at 5:30 just just throwing out there's nobody on the street and and it's after sundown and you didn't light yet but at 5:15 there was still a guy or two on the street you'd still have to light it for a half an hour even though because it's a it's a it's a quantitative value. What you see from this two possibilities here? Two possibilities. The possibility number one is that this of when the sun sets until people are off the street coming home from work or from the marketplace technically is a in the person lighting the candle. He has to do it exactly at sundown. But if he was faulty and it's five minutes later, okay, so the people are going to come home when they come home. So let's just use the term half an hour. And he lived five minutes late. So he has to light for 25 minutes. The next guy was 10 minutes late, so he has to light for 20 minutes. The next guy was 25 minutes late, so he has to light for 5 minutes. The idea is that's it. There's no more, according to the way we're reading the now, there's no more candle lighting after that time. But how long does the cand have to burn? From the moment that you lit after sundown until regular. So for one guy it's 30 minutes. From the yes guy next guy it's two and a half minutes. Whatever it is it is. The other opinion says no no no no no. This has nothing to do with you the lighter. It has to do with the amount of oil or candle that you're going to have. The duration of the light the sh the quantitative value. It's two different aspects or two different things. If you want to turn on your lambdan from brrisque the way the the the solvatrix would think one is the gavra and one is the kza. What's a gav andza? You got to go to yeshiva and and and learn these terms because this is oxygen. This is brisk 1.1. Um and it's derived rapim salvic the rough and brisk the rough's grandfather didn't invent the terms. It's straight out of first page, right? What's a nether and what's avu? What's a nether and what's awah? Right? We have we have so what's the difference? So says a nether if I make a nether not to drink Coca-Cola today, I'm not drink Coca-Cola today. If I make a not to drink Coca-Cola today, I'm not to drink Coca-Cola today. Sounds like the same thing. The difference is in a neair I've created the Coca-Cola to be a piece of pork. It is for me, not for everybody else. For me, it's private pork. It's trafe. It's strafe. And why am I not drinking Coca-Cola? Because it's not kosher. In even to myself, the Coca-Cola is still kosher, but I'm distancing myself from drinking it. Now, you might think, but this is crazy. It's the same thing. No, the same thing is that both cases you're not drinking it. But the definition of nether and one is that the object or the word or in Aramaic and in the second it's the person. Gavra doesn't mean man. It means person, man or woman. And it's the prohibition is on the person. I'm not I'm distancing myself and not drinking it, but it's still kosher to me. It's still kosher and so on. It's it's a world of a difference if I view it as kosher or not kosher because if I drink something that was only avu it's going to be less serious than I drink something that was nether because in the nether I'm drinking non-cooser it's not kosher for you it's not it's only non-coosher for me but I created a non-cooser scenario in I'm not supposed to drink it but if I drank it I didn't drink non-cooser there are two full mto mc just explain all the ramifications of the difference between but the opening number found on the first page in is and is an issue this means that when the tells us you have to light candles from the time of sundown it's referring to the ga the person Who's lighting the candle? If that refers to the amount of oil, that's the it's on the object. It's on the candle. It's a different nature. And this is going to be very important for our frying pan because if if there is a problem with the object itself, if we want to say that the object of the oil is the half an hour, then I can introduce the concept of the sh the quantitative value. now gets fetched and I don't have a half hour's worth of oil because in a bus of situation where the congealed schmaltz has butter and meat embedded in it I have to destroy it. So in theory I don't it's like lighting a birthday candle where I don't have enough filament to give me a half hour's worth of a light. So that would be that and therefore I would say sorry I can't use that schmaltz for my however if I say that when the talks about has to do with the person lighting has nothing to do with the minimum quantitative value I step back and say okay the only thing left is hana I'm now to have benefit but a mitzvah was never given for benefit and this is a mitzvah and therefore I would be allowed to use it. So we've actually done here was we've analyzed a >> it's really a >> it's a it's a to analyze the two possibilities in the chuvot shim whether you would be able to I'm sure you were losing sleep over this already. What are you gonna do tonight? And now you know that it's well depends how you see the in Shabbat. Now let's take this a little further. Source number four. So we have the answer already with the schmaltz. Okay, it's a depends how you look at it, right? If it's then you can't use it because the quantitative value is going to get fetched. But if it's only an isogra or an obligation of the person, then it's gonna be fine because I don't have to deal with this anymore and all I'm have is the problem of but mitzvah weren't given for benefit and therefore I'm doing a mitzvah even though there's a isur on the meat and milk schmaltz that I have here but I'm using as a candle that doesn't affect me. I'm allowed to use it for a mitzvah. Fine. Source number four. So number four is the tovo tovote right middle ages in the yeshiva they refer to tovot in the singular tovot asks tovot answers tell the rebi tovot is 200 years it's a conglomeration of different people it does start with rashi's grandson raenutam and his kav the ria zakim but it to goes for almost 200 years all the way up to Maram Rutenberg at the end of the 13th century so That's the way you should say the bal the authors of the tovote say because it's plural the say on the phrase and if you didn't light yet so go on lighting but seems to say only until the last person leaves the street says and that's it you missed if you if you didn't light according to this line invot if you didn't light candles and there's nobody body on the street. We'll see you tomorrow night. But tonight, you missed it. Omare hari harat. Rip parat is not the reason why parat was his family name. And we know people by that name and they may be descendants. Reporat you should be careful immediately at the beginning of the time framework. you shouldn't delay because it's not a long time framework here. Nevertheless, in if you were late, you were delayed for whatever reason. Doesn't mean you were in the emergency room, God forbid. For whatever reason, you got a phone call, you know, you you were talking and talking and talking and talking and talking and talking. So, you you realize, you know, people aren't on the street anymore. To say the riat says, Lick you should light your name. Say you know what mis means without a braha means without a bra. Why? Because the gives the alternate understanding the responds a secondary answer and that was that the when the garra says simply teaches us a quantitative amount of time. So even if you light at 10:30 at night, you still need the quantitative. So because that answer exists in the so you can lie but it might not be correct. So therefore don't make the bra. And then it says this is from the earliest balot in in northern France. It appears the today which means now now 12th century 11th century 12th century France. You don't have to worry about when you're going to light. We only have to consider our family indoors. We light indoors. Why do we light indoors in France? >> Afraid of the >> Afraid of the Afraid of the Sound familiar? You know, the first time I ever saw people light Kaneka candles like the Gomorrah says by the outside door opposite the side of the muzza is here in Erit Israel. I lived in a Jewish neighborhood, right? Benet Brock West. It's called Burough Park, right? Ben Brock West. Nobody ever Maybe today you have it a little bit, but I don't know. No, I never remembered it. People lit by the window. >> It was too cold. >> It was too cold. Okay. By the window. By the window. People let that. That's what they did. But not uh outside. I mean, you'd never find your kanukia the next morning, right? It would take had >> found in the >> in my box. >> In the box, right? Okay. So, maybe my didn't see it in New York. But here, Toss is telling us something that Digara says as a possibility. you know in the times of danger you can light inside that's all you don't have to be you know to have you know rocks thrown in your windows even the windows they would light indoors and once we're lighting indoors so the people outside becomes nonrelevant yeah >> that's true even like whether now it's windy outside >> they would blow out right blow out okay so you can light it next to the window already but let's see what happens now in with all this in source Number five, don't light candles before the sun sets. And I'll just say parenthetically that there is what's called you can light in an emergency situation from plaga which is about an hour and a quarter before I think it's 3:30 and and in essence that's what we do Friday night. We have to light before sundown obviously. So we like have to plug them in the and there are those who say right here it is if you are busy and you know you're not going to be around for sundown. So today is about 3:30. That's if person's in a crunch means there you can't just have a small candle. You got to have a long shabas candle or you have a lot of oil because it still has to burn until a half an hour until people are still on the street. Now the business of half hour on the street to just jump down to source number seven. The Rambam what I just read almost is word for word from the Rambam. Don't light candles before sundown. Light it with sundown. Not early, not late. Question is, what does the Rama mean? What does he do Friday night? But that not our issue right now. He forgot or even in deliberately and he didn't hit the 437 time to light exactly at sundown. He can light until there's no people left on the street. How much is that time? It's a half an hour or more. The ram doesn't say it's a you know grave it's it's engraved in stone 30 minutes it's you know what we call ber right in Frankfurt the raom would have written that >> right it says oh right could be a little bit more in others basically with rahams opening up and saying check out your local scene and see to people our d in New York City when he was there for Tuesday and Wednesday nights giving shir in the week of Kaneka he light lit shabas candles because he said it's means rush hour and rush hour means uh 2 hours from 5:00 to 7:00. So he wanted the candles to be burning for over two hours every single night and he actually asked the question what about the theater crowd and he said we don't have to worry about the theater crowd. Okay. So he said about that's what he said about two I know I said it before but not everybody was here. So this I'm looking at my wife she was already saying you said this already you know said that according to the Rama if you lit 10 minutes after sundown. So you don't need a half hour's worth. You need as much that's left for people to outside if you lit and it blew out. You don't have to relight it. If it's beyond the light candles are still lit and there's just nobody out there, you can do whatever you want. You can blow it out. You can remove the whatever you want to do with it. The mitzvah is over. According to the Rambam, the mitzvah is over. But if you go back to the now to on where it's in source number seven, but the second paragraph and here's where says it says second paragraph of source number seven of source number five. I'm sorry. Source number five. If you forgot or even deliberately you didn't light with sundown. Keep lighting until people are still out there. It's almost a quote from the people are still out there. And there's still publicity for the miracle. As long as people are out there, the amount of oil will be determined by how much time is remaining for people who are still out there. If you put more than that after that time has elapsed, you can blow it out. You have extra oil and and and there's no longer people on the street and you want to fry some schnitles or use it for the extra spare oil, you can do it. It's yours. And that comes the ramo. That's Ravio Caro. That's Ravio Caro. But now we jump from to Krakow is solister raiml is the switch track to the rafim others say today we light indoors 16th century crocow we light indoors you don't have to worry about it's as we say in Chinese in Israel It is not relevant any longer. You have to be careful. Nevertheless, it's good to get used to lighting at the original time. Even though you're lighting in your living room or your dining room or your kitchen and has nothing to do with the outside people, it's good to get used to lighting at the original time, which is the beginning of sunset. However, that's what you should do. You can light the candles the whole night. You didn't light a particular night. There's no makeup. You can't light another candle the next night. Forget it. We'll see you tomorrow with the next night. That's all. And and and Mishura basically goes along with with this idea. I I Okay. So, we have we have a clear understanding of what happened. Am Israel were in a situation that they feared repercussions, anti-semitism. I know not everybody in the world likes that word to you, you know, use. Right. in in in Sydney, Australia, it was a uh security um situation and then it became a hate crime until they came around. It took a few days because they're slow took a few days till they realized this was an anti-semitic attack. At first, you know, it was near attack was near, you know, some some Kaneka get together, whatever. Okay. In Israel, it was reported from moment one this was a pigua at Khaneka. We knew it. We unfortunately knew it, but the world it took a while for them to come around. So, you know, Jews have always been worried. I actually heard a um a a a a woman from England um interviewed on Sky News, who Sky News is, I mean, in relation to CNN, much more pro-Israel. I mean, pro pro you're never going to get, but certainly not anti-Israel, not anti-Israel, Sky News. And this woman was interviewed and they said, you know, what's going to happen? And she said, you know, Jews might take off their muzzas. Jews might remove their muza. Now, I remember visiting years ago in Antworp, uh, where people had their muzas inside the house, and they told me two reasons. One was they didn't need possible anti-semitic attack, and it also prevented the Schnuras from Israel to know. And I wasn't sure which was the real reason, which was the secondary reason. Yeah. Yeah. They weren't even embarrassed to say it, you know. Yeah. Mazou is supposed to be outside, right? But all right. They said that in in an emergency situation, you can put it on inside also. The um the idea of uh and then this woman said people may just have to go to the only safest place for Jews in the world and move to Israel. She said it and I'm glad she said it. This is a woman sitting in London interviewed on the Sky News. She said it. So having said that, let us just take a look at um source number three. The last two lines. The last two lines, two and a half lines. It quotes the until the people leave the marketplace. So how long is that? So here the never said a half an hour. The first one to use the word half hour was the Rambam. That's 12th century you know North Africa Egypt. The Gmorra doesn't say that says in the name of Raan said the until the feet have left the shook left the market. Who is the tmuda in? Raji says it's a Persian. They were who used to be the last ones to leave the marketplace to close up the marketplace. The last ones there. So most people understand that if these goyam are closing up the markets there obviously no Jews on the street anymore for pursuanes. comes and says from here you see that the mitzvah of pum is also to go >> is also to go that we have an obligation to broadcast the story of purim to the world to the world as opposed to purim where it's indoors you read the migill indoors you read the migill at home as the migilla says it's an indoor thing But Kaneka is an outdoor thing, right? As Labavage, right? It's it's an outdoor thing. And it really is an outdoor thing. And and and you know, people now, Davka, because of the Pikua, people are explaining on these news shows what Kaneka is. I mean, it has received more publicity than than ever before. Unfortunately, with unfortunate circumstances for sure, but the idea that the Kaneka candles are lit until the last go is off the street because we have something to say to the nations of the world as well. And the remember the rough saying and the message is no matter what you do, you know, we are still going to be here. We we are here to stay. We are here to stay. So my wife and I were last month in London when I um spoke in Henden and we went to the British Museum and and there was the statue of Ramsees II. So I looked at him and I said I know you from somewhere. I meet you every year at the sedar that's the parro that we talked to. And I looked at him and I said, you know, you're going to stand stay here as a goam in this British museum and I'm going back to Shallay because Amil is alive and kicking in. You can stay there. You know, I told this to Ramsey straight in the face. I mean, no, it's very important. You had to hear it. >> No. >> I'm sure he heard it. You know, >> he made you. >> What did he say? >> He he acknowledged. He wked. He wedded. I'm sure Ramsey is the second. Sure. I mean you know it's all stolen goods over there in the British Museum. All right. But but this is I just want to on this subject say just a word about what we did last year. Just we have just a few minutes because the mosur follows the acrostic of Morai. We don't exactly know which Morai although it might be the paran the the one of the great rishonim from the days of the moramutberg. the morai as many people know about it in the but the last stanza which doesn't have the morai you have mo the me the racho is the dalid kumat is the kanimiku is the yud but then it says zero that spells out and many times many times they would spell out the word the last idea was we ask to like roll up his his strong stretch out his strong arm, his holy arm, reveal it and bring the Yeshua closer. God should take revenge from the nations of Russia. It's taking such a long time. It's unending. This was written at the time of the crusades in Europe and they felt it. And they started they said it started there was parro and it went to the days of Bayeni. We had trouble and it went to the days of Hmon and we had trouble. We had trouble in all these times and we had trouble with the Ivanim all these times. We're not we're not out of the Torah. We recognize that they were partial Yeshua. Partial but not out of it. D said all the others were Yeshuaote is Yot Mashiach. He should push. Who is the admi? It's as direct reference to Christianity. Salmon in the shadow of the Talem is the crossim. He should establish for us the the the shepherds. The seven shepherds. The seven shepherds is mentioned in the book of Mika and they are says per shalom ashobenu vakimonuavim. Who are the seven? It's Abrahamov. It's all theen all the names of Moshe Aron and Davidid and um >> and Yseph and Yoseph. all of the seven they are the seven we ask kadesh that the spirit of the shivim should um should come back to all of us today and will give us this great yeshua so I think that's a fine word to close the share next week in mashem we'll get back to some uh poem of some sort I