CHAZARAH - Chullin Daf 4 | "Nothing but the Daf" with R' Eli Stefansky

[music] >> GOOD MORNING RAB BOYS. WE'RE GOING TO SMASH HIM IN THE ass with a small just a test to see if he's alive and knows. Tell the rab bonum. We're holding three lines in the bottom of the gimel base. >> [clears throat] >> Shita's kusi muteres. The shita of a kusi This is a nation that came to eretz yisrael and there's a machlokes throughout shas are they gary emes gary eyes are they true garym are they fakers? They shecht you eat. Bashgacha sabadats im shochtim yochlim kusim. No problem you eat. The whole day you could eat. But the few There are a few what? conditions Mametzvah mamurim kish yisrael oimed algabov. You have this This guy remember from that video? Yisrael oimed algabov. He has to be the imam is watching the kusi. Avol oh so let's let's see this. Here. This is the ratio. Yisrael oimed algabov is great. Avol bo matzoy she shochat. But if you have this case the seifa bo matzoy you come and you find a dead animal that was shechted already. Now what? Choitech kaza'yis benois you do a taste test. You take off a focus eyes. Anything less than kaza'yis he might eat. Why? Cuz it doesn't really say in the torah something about kaza'yis about the shiur. So they don't have chatzi shiur and they don't have any of these things. So you give him a nice size piece and if he eats it, I call him if he eats it you could eat it. If he doesn't or if he he's on a diet, whatever excuse he gives, it's treif. What's missing right over here? If you look at this chart right over here, what's missing? We have a case that's 100% great. It's the straw standing there staring. That's the best hashgacha you can have. And then you have after the fact he finds a dead animal, he finds a shocheted animal. What's missing is the in between case. The case of comes in, comes out. One day he comes, one day he doesn't, one day he comes three times, one day one week he doesn't come at all. That's the in between case. So yesterday we saw the Gemara explains why we have this case. Similarly Similarly he finds a dead bird. You find one of these rings with smaller birds. What do you do? You chop off a head. Then nicely you give it to them. You do a taste test. Interesting, I don't know do you cook it first, do you eat it raw? You give it to them. There's 10 birds on this ring. All you do is give him one out of 10. And then you can eat all 10. Feeds one, it's great. The Gemara is going to question that. What's the reason? Maybe the one you gave him, he recognizes and he knows he shocheted it. The other ones he didn't shochet. If he doesn't do the taste test, he doesn't he refuses to eat it. You're not allowed to eat from a Says the Gemara Abaye and Rava disagree. >> You could you could go both ways. You could either learn from the ratio that is not good because the ratio says only the top picture in the world is good. Only if you have a 100% of the time standing there watching then it's okay. If the guy comes in and out no good. Or you can be when do you need a taste test when there was never at all. You came so then you give him a taste test. But the guy says that the guy comes in and out then it'll be perfect. You can go you can learn from the ratio you can learn from the safer the opposite things. So here now this is the case we're looking for. What's not mentioned at all is the case in the center. says Let's learn from the ratio that what only when you have a full-time is it good but no good. He puts under the ratio. So he comes out with something completely different. That's why yesterday we learned that holds is not is not good only the avid. You do the taste test of it. is going to go the other way. He's going to learn from the safer. It says that if you found the guy time to go why do you have to give him a taste test because you can't have you found it after the fact. is good at all. Like many restaurants today they don't have the comes in and out. That's okay. You know it's not the avid you can eat there. Well cash safer. And some people say no even if he's very good we I don't have such a whatever. Okay. I'm not getting into it ask your local rabbit. Well cash safer so we have a we have a problem each one is going to have a problem with the other one. How come you can't be from the ratio? How come you can't be from the safer? will say so again what's the going to do with the Robert says? Robert says look it says in the end of the if you come and find them then you give him a taste that's that if you have a guy that constantly comes in and out then it's perfectly fine. That's what I was saying before. That what's the difference? I come in come out. One time I happen to find it. It's the same thing. What's the only time you can eat it is when you have a guy standing there and staring at him the entire time. It seems that the only time you can eat it is when you have a guy standing there and staring at him the entire time. It seems that the only time you can eat it is when you have a guy standing there and staring at him the entire time. It seems that the only time you can Anything less than that you can't eat only if you do a taste test. No, how long have you been speaking when a guy comes in and out it gives the guy the guy gives the same fear. He's he's concerned not to mess up not to pull out a a tray chicken from the refrigerator because he knows that he can get caught any second. The guy comes in and out. It's the same thing. It's the same thing. It's the same thing. It's the same thing. It's the same thing. Similarly if you find a with a whole ring or a place it says it's a basket full of birds. What do you do? You chop off a head give him a head smack sounds like something very very with the eyes with the tongue with the eyes with the tongue with the eyes with the tongue with the eyes with the tongue with the eyes with the tongue Maybe it's the one out of the 10 that he recognizes. The guy with a with a black feather on his head that's the one I I checked it that so I'll eat it. Three things he says. He doesn't show the what he's giving him. He puts all 10 birds underneath his jacket It off a head? I think maybe maybe maybe he recognizes that head. He crushes it. Oh, here's a problem. If you think about it, Look at the positive. What does it say anything about in the Torah? It says it says the chef a cow or a sheep. It doesn't say anything about in a bird. So since it's not the first in the Torah, once again, the might not even want to the bird. I think about it. What she here? What she here? Taking the knife, shutting up. I have actually we have here also a knife for birds. She here. She here is you pause. You wait a certain amount. We're going to learn in the how much. You don't You don't do it's not fluid. It's not back and forth. At least go. You go for a coffee break. You come back to the rest. Draw so we said means pushing downwards a downward force instead of a slicing force. Hello there. Explain that it goes in between. We had this nice thing. Let's see if we have it still. By the way, it's all No, I don't have it today. This is Lisa. Going downwards. Um This is all our stuff, right? We uh >> [snorts] >> We designed this. This is how I grow my voice. The next one we didn't have Hello there. Hello there. You go in between the two of them and then you cut down with so at a one point the knife was covered by the That's also. How grow my day and they're not putting on all of this. How grow my means you go In our In our family just became a thing. I I made a thing out of it because I let my sons cut the color. So I said, "Wait wait, you're not cutting it straight." So it became a whole thing between the boys who could cut straighter, like that the the the pieces should be even, each one should have the same size, and none of this sideways business, you know, just nice straight cut. >> [snorts] >> The less less back and forth. We make a whole thing out of it. Hagromis when you go sideways. You you start going into the wrong place. Instead of going straight down, you go like this. So, here you'd have a little bit of a That's the best Elion. If it gets to it goes it goes in the wrong in the wrong area, okay? We'll see what it is. We'll get to the Sugya. It goes in the wrong area. The equal equal means if if let's say the knife has a big and it has a little neck, it could pull the instead of cut the simanim, it'll pull the siman. So, now we're getting into a topic an interesting topic. A Kusi, we learned if it says in the Torah and they keep it, then it's solid, you can rely on them. Shkif it says in the Torah, they keep it, you can rely on them. But, there are things, think about it, there are things that are not in the Torah and they keep. And the things that are that they don't keep and are in the Torah. >> [clears throat] >> There's three things. Something that's in the Torah and they keep. Something that's in the Torah that they don't they don't keep. And something they keep that's not in the Torah. Yeah? It's very possible. Some they have some minig that they keep. It's not in the Torah. Could I could I eat could I do could I rely on them? Could I be soimakh on something that they they're makpid that's not in the Torah. Are they rabbonon? Could we be makpid on the rabbonon? Could we be makel and eat from the the rabbonon? Could we rely on the the rabbonon that they're very makpid on it? On the flip side, something that none of the Kusiim keep, but it's a furious in the Torah. Let's say, let's just for instance, Basar B'Chalav. They don't care. They're saying it's in the Torah, they don't care about. But this Kusi says, my restaurant, we're not going to Basar B'Chalav. It's in the Torah, so let's go. Let What's in the Torah? So, that that's the Sugya coming up now. So, over here it says that Hag'rama, Chalada Shehiya, all these Halachas of Shechita is Kivan D'Achzukei B'Hu, since you know that they keep it, Achzukei B'Hu, you can rely on them. Achana Ami Kivan D'Achzukei Achzukei, so too by us in our Sugya of Shechitas Ha'Of. So, where does it say in the Torah that you have to Shecht a bird? Doesn't say. You know what? It doesn't have to say it in the Torah. Sometimes a Kusi, he's Makpid on something, we go with it. V'Achzukei V'Lo Achzukei, like She'iva D'Nai. So, we're going to get This is what the Gemara is going to discuss now. Something that they do, like Shechting a bird, doesn't say it in a verse in the Torah. It's a Machlokes Tana'im whether or not you can rely on them. So, now we're going to go through until we get to it. First, we're going to do the other part, the Torah that they're not they don't keep, and then we're going to go to the keep and not in the Torah. D'Sanya Matzas Kusiim T'eirah. Listen to this, it's crazy. A Matzah, Matzah bakery. The Kusi Matzah bakery, Mamash Mutar. V'Adam Yotzei B'Yedei Chovaso B'Pesach. He could eat Matzah on the night of Seder. Rebbi Elazar says no. He says no. Why? L'Fi She'Ein B'Kei'im B'Dikdukei Mitzvos Yisrael. Yeah, they're Makpid on Chametz, but they don't know all the little Dikdukei Mitzvos. L'Fi She'Ein B'Kei'im B'Dikdukei Mitzvos Yisrael. They don't know know, they really don't know all the the nuances, the different things within uh maybe I'm not going to say 18 minutes, cuz 18 minutes, that's probably Chametz Gamur, but whatever it is, then no, that's something else we're going to get to. That's not [clears throat] a dik mitzvah. That's That's in the Torah. That's a Rebbi Shimon bar Yochai omer, Kol mitzvah she gizik ba kusim >> The problem is he says they don't know ba'al teshuvah options. Yeah. They don't know all the little the little the the the Right, the seed of that it looks like a kinyan hagavah things. They don't know they don't know the the the little things. Kol mitzvah she gizik ba kusim says Rebbi Gamliel, kol mitzvah she gizik ba kusim harbeh ba yotzei min Yisrael. Don't read it like I used to read it in the seder. I used to read it kol mitzvah she gizik ba kusim harbeh medakdek ba yotzei min Yisrael. No. Kol mitzvah she gizik ba kusim kamah harbeh medakdek ba yotzei min Yisrael. So, when they're When when a kusi does something, it's harbeh medakdek ba yotzei min Yisrael. He's much more machmir than a Yid. Omer Mar, matzah she kusim muteres ba yotzei min Yisrael ba Pesach. We're going to get there. We're going to get to the What's the machlokes? We're trying to find the machlokes on something that is not in the Torah like shechting a bird and they keep it anyway, can we rely on them or not? So, we just learned matzah she kusim muteres ba yotzei min Yisrael ba Pesach. So, we have a little bit of a problem, says the Gemara. Pshita. What does pshita mean? If you tell me that the matzah of a kusi is allowed to be eaten on Pesach, in other words, it doesn't have any chametz in it, so why can I use it on the seder? What's the problem? Nu, what's the answer? Reb Boaz, what's the answer? >> [clears throat] >> What does that mean? Who says it's a mitzvah? Says the Gemara, mal de same al libi ke ba shmur. It says in the pasuk, u'shmartem es hamatzos, this is a key of deoraisa. To say, to think lesheim matzos mitzvah, it's not enough on the night, the first night of Pesach, just not to have chametz in your matzah. You have to have in mind that it's the master. I thought that they don't know how to do that. The and the and the Torah says yes, because it doesn't really say in the Torah you have to say the same master Smith for when you say the same master Smith for but at the end of the day yes, the market on it. Robin Jimmy so over here be key be shima. What does shima mean? The same master Smith for. Oh sorry, sorry. But the same key be shima commercial they do the same master Smith for so what does shima mean? The same master Smith for. They also I said if you say to give me Smith for they don't know the the nuances in the master like when does it become comments when it starts cracking cause so by the key be shima. So over here the word shima pay attention put it in your pencil pencil it in. Over here shima means to make sure that it doesn't come comments not the same master Smith for they said two lines on top. Over there shima meant you have to say the same master Smith for the same master Smith for. Over here means shima that you don't let the comments come in. So commercial the cousin however you say it the doctor more. As the commercial >> [snorts] >> what's he adding here? When when a cousin does a Smith for he is better than a than a Israel than a regular Jew. How do you that's what the you allowed to eat his master. You give me an idea so now we're starting. We're getting there. If it says with first in the Torah to do a Smith for and they don't do it all of the cousin don't do it but he does can you rely on him or not? That I got to tell you the Siva. It says in the Torah the cousin ball. Like like she maybe shima. Even though they don't keep it you can rely on it. The shima you have to again no if it's something that they keep then you can rely on them. If they don't keep it, you can't rely on it even if it says it in the Torah. Yochi, see what he tell me? That kol mitzvah, every mitzvah that a kusi keeps, he's better at it than the Jew. So, the the word kol is not good. What it should say is im. The the the the keyword is if they are mazikin, then we can rely on them. Not all mitzvahs, it's not true. Not every not mitzvahs in the Torah, it's only the 50 or whatever mitzvahs that they keep in the Torah. So, it's im. Kol mitzvahs im mazikin al gam an idol and so what's the nafka mina? Our case, this is what we're looking for. It's not before it's in the Torah, but they keep it like shekting birds. They keep that one even though it's not before it's in Torah. Since it doesn't say it, it doesn't help me that it doesn't help me that they keep it because it's not before it's in Torah. It's not strong enough. So, by shekting since they keep it, even though it's not in the Torah, it's very strong and you can eat chicken that comes from a kusi factory. We just learned that can eat nevelois. I'm sorry. A mumar who eats nevelois in other words, he only he's not a he's not a bad guy, but he has a problem with his yetz hara and he likes a good treifa pork So, he could actually [clears throat] be a So, let's remember this is the rabba that we're going to be talking about. Rabba says, even though he eats cheeseburgers, but exactly you you check the knife, you give it to him, and he's a perfect shochet. My ta'ama, what's the pshat? If there's in front of him that the two options, the heter and the issur, he will he He not abandon the heter. At the end of the day, he comes from a frum mishpacha. He's makpid on most stuff besides cheeseburgers. Now, if you have a a cheeseburger and a and a Ken's Diner burger burger right next to each other, or what was it called? A butter burger buddy, also from Great Chicago. You only eat at the Great Chicago. If it's far away, whatever, then he okay. What do you see? At the end of the day, even over a vera, Hashem will consider them from Yidden. Just take Just take what I have. You go right there. Yochi, can we borrow your knife from me? So then why do you have to check the knife for him? Forget He's not going to use a bad knife. He's not a bad guy. He just has a little yaitzer hara problem. Yeah, but such a yaitzer hara guy that that breaks so easily for a cheeseburger, mitzvah like Torah. He's not going to go out of his way completely to make sure that the knife is good. So you have to give him a good knife. So I have a right to you, Rova, that what? A guy that's off the derech for one thing. He just eats cheeseburgers with everything he he wears tzitzis and he keeps Shabbos the whole day. He just eats bittul Torah. He could be a good tzaddik. Why? Cuz it says if a guy who's over a vera, he has a little bittul Torah person, muttar meyad, you let him eat his chometz after Pesach. Now, the Israelis got this cuz they they they speak it. I wonder if the Americans also. Mibnei Shahein Machlifin. What does it mean? That they change out their chometz. They'll switch it out with the guy. They take the chometz over Pesach, all chometz that stayed the entire Pesach, and they give it to the guy. And they get in return brand new chometz from the guy. Shahein Machlifin, does it mean they do it 100% or they sometimes do it? Is it a safek or a vadai? What does Shahein Machlifin mean? Vadai. Good. Shahein Machlifin is vadai. That's what the Gemara is going to say in a second. Shahein, it could have said Shani Oimer Machlifin. No, Shani machliffim, they do it. This is what they do. So, what do you see from here? You see that in a case that the guy is going to fear us, but I'm just stopping here to point out. See that if it's easy for them to do something, they'll do it. They're not They're not They don't do a virus deliberately to get you upset because it's convenient for them. But, if it's easy for them just to switch out the chametz with the the next door neighbor, they go to the store. Here, take my chametz, give me new chametz. You You could You could rely on them. Savru. Who money Rebbi Yehuda? This goes according to Rebbi Yehuda, the famous Rebbi Yehuda omer chametz after the rice. Rebbi Yehuda is of the opinion that chametz that remained the whole Pesach, after Pesach you're not allowed to eat it. Uktani. Maybe they should have machliffim. It says that even though it's the rice according to Rebbi Yehuda, eating that chametz would be the rice. And it says you could rely on him. Why? Because they switch it out. Amora shami avli sura. You see that a guy that that has a yitz hara problem, he will If it's easy for him, he'll switch it out. So, over here also, if it's easy for him, he'll do a good shchita. Ask the Gemara who told you that goes according to Rebbi Yehuda that says it's the rice. There's another person that argues. Dilma Rebbi Shimon Rebbi Shimon mamesh arev. Arev like boehm Rebbi Mamesh Rebbi Shimon. Dilma Rebbi Shimini. Maybe there's Rebbi Shimon tomorrow, who knows? That one year with the Yisrael Goldstein, there's four Rebbi Shimons. Dilma Rebbi Shimini. The omer chametz after Pesach the rabbonon. He says only rabbonon. And that's why I could rely on this this baal aveira. Why? Because he does the rabbonon. It's only the rabbonon. So, you allow him to eat his chametz. Says the Gemara, no, no, no, no, no. I still have a great raya. But, they have it Rebbi Shimon say it's only the rabbonon according to Rebbi Shimon. But, listen to this. Miktani Shani omer chalivu. Does it say the words Shani omer? And that would mean maybe he switches, maybe he doesn't. It says mifne she machliffim. A guy that eats cheeseburgers 100% switches out his comments. No, you see that even a guy that does a few of theirs, you can rely on him 100% even in the rabbinical makes my my right even stronger because I'm saying the bottom of the 100% switch it out and then I can say if it's a simple the rabbinical Shimon. That you're not allowed to eat the comments [snorts] after Pesach. They go ahead and they go to the store and they switch it out. Cuz it's not too much of a certainly by the right. So let me say so another right what a guy who's over a very I can eat a pizza. Everybody is not it's a bracer. Everybody could check. But I feel even a person. Even listen to this even a person who doesn't have a I can eat it from a pizza. And even a guy that's off. We'll have to see what kind of off. So first of all what kind of person doesn't have a he two of his brothers died previously. People die from you. You die kick you die from you. Now if two brothers die from the then it's not the miles fault. It's something in the maybe the the blood doesn't congeal who knows what if he cannot perform if he can't perform a person two of his brothers died. So it's not his fault. He's a complete Israel. There are some that you know you can't go to the whole thing but He's a regular Israel. So why can't he do he could be a regular person. He's a guy that makes fun of he doesn't he he He's anti breast. That's why he he doesn't have it. Okay, so he has a he's a stickle problem with breast milk. So because of what famous person. >> So we're talking about a guy What do we see from him? A guy that's he's over one aveira. He doesn't care about one thing, about bris milah. You could rely on him for everything else. He could be a shochet. Amos Let's see what it says in the end. A Yisrael who's who's off the derech, he's allowed to be a shochet. What are you talking about? He's he's he's a mummer for one thing. He doesn't keep Shabbos. Sorry. Not an aveilah. Means we're talking about Our Our sugia is about an aveilah. No, not an aveilah. So what's the difference? He doesn't keep Shabbos and he doesn't keep bris milah. They both don't keep one one thing in the Torah. So if it says in the reisha that you could be some on a guy that doesn't keep bris milah, you could be some on a guy that doesn't keep Shabbos. We're talking about a guy who doesn't who eats treif. When it comes to the parsha of treif, he's not makpid on and that's a big chiddush. Yet in treif, we can rely on him to be a shochet. He eats treif. He doesn't care about treif. So how can you rely on him about shchitah? It's not like oh, far-fetched thing over there. He doesn't keep Shabbos but he's doing shchitah. Within V'chiddushah d'Rava. And that's Rava's big chiddush that if a guy eats treif, but it's l'teiyavon, he only eats treif not because he's against treif. But because he's about ta'avah. He likes the way it tastes. So I could rely on him on shchitah. So it's So it's a great raya to Rava. I'll tell you that over there when it talks about a mummer Yisrael, it's talking about a guy that if he's a If in fact he's a mummer in treif, you cannot rely on him. May ta'ama? And I'll explain to you why. K'vein d'dash bei k'teirei d'ami. D'ami lei. Good day to my life. When a person does the same aveira and over it becomes like a hazard to him. Hello. This is a tremendous question. If I would have asked you maybe in the beginning of the year a guy who does a lot of stuff, you know, goes to college the whole day, but at night he goes and he does a lot of stuff at his house. Could could he be your husband? I don't know. From the three the worst of the worst. You basically saying I don't believe in the I believe in in somebody else. I don't know. Not a problem. Because I don't know if you allowed to eat the food. Go find some more women who don't know what to do. I don't know. Why? He was a king. He's a king. He tried to get rid of him. He was a big king. But he understands that all is only problem was and in those days we know the type of was so great. And when they came together to go to war against him it says over there he benefited from the food he ate. He ate his meat. This guy is a bad guy. He ate his meat. Tremendous amount of steaks. He brought with him. What did he say? I don't know. So tomorrow how do you know? Maybe he maybe he did for him. It says he made him a lot of steaks. He says the officer he he he enticed him. He manipulated him. Whatever the word is. So in other words he actually ate. He maybe enticed him with words. So tomorrow as he said any boy Where are you? What's the difference between eating and drinking? What's the difference between eating and drinking? I'm not nothing. Oh. He'll He'll uh He'll manipulate you. He'll seduce you. He'll uh whatever the word is. Says the Gemara, "But he over there also he also he'll get you off the derech over there in the pasuk." But he that's with with Actually, you have to explain. It was with food and drink. But he what does he say in Eiyov? It says about what does he say in Eiyov? And can't eat. It's obviously without food. So he says, "You're right. What First of all, you're right. Then you're right. It's not about food. But with human beings, the way to get them today also in business, bring a guy to a restaurant, sit him down, good meal, then he eats more, he eats more inclined inclined to it. Going with the word. >> [clears throat] >> Says the Gemara, "But he maybe he drank. Maybe he Maybe he didn't eat." But he drank the over there. Says the Gemara, "Says the Gemara, but he that he allowed to drink his wine. Why? Because he's not a moment for the old So what's the big deal? So he ate because he's not a moment So that just because he didn't have a desire doesn't mean he does bad shita." Says the Gemara, "What's the difference between eating and drinking? Drinking wine is drinking wine. But at that point in time in history, it wasn't But he maybe he Maybe from the fact that he ate is a that Maybe I could say that by once you do one thing like that, you it's also for you to eat it. It's impossible that he just drank. We boys a bottle. We'll just finish this. He did he and he convinced him. Except I may see you did he have a wonderful day. Merit the source of spreading Torah throughout the world. Sponsor a shear today. mdy.sponsor.com [music] or sponsored.mdy.com