Menachos Daf 70

All right, today is DAFF Ain Sunday's DAFF. The end of Shabas is Daf was discussing the Shila of replanting things that were grown. We go buster the ikar as lean or perhaps we go buster the typhus the new growth and the garra had an unresolved shila whether or not when we go buster the ikar is that lisha or maybe we're misopic and it'll only work not weed with teu now we're picking it up on the very bottom line that's how the gear according to the what's going to be when it comes to do we go buster the or the what's the sha moving over Let's say the guy estimated his miser and he made the tenth. But the point over here is they're still in their stalks. So they're still replantable and then he replanted them and they continue to grow. Soimmer that the shila from the end of yesterday's do that you won't go buster when it comes out as a ka. This is learni and therefore the new growth is going to require hiluser butk. What about the original plant that you stuck back into the ground? Does the micer need to be remissered now that it becomes back in the ground the alma you can make the shil much simpler if I ever do any planting what do you plant with right you plant with post micer dick of grain you're not allowed to plant with tel so if you're going to plant with a post micer grain and now new growth comes out of it I'm always going to have that shila do I need to remicer the original plant that when I say plant I mean those kernels that you stuck in the ground to which the says no big doar when you put that seed in the ground it decomposes it breaks apart. So that I don't have any sh about that that's going to require a brand newer because there's nothing there from the old days when the original thing that you're putting the ground like these stocks and even though they grow new grain from them but they're originally there what's going to be there so we can for this from another let's say you have this lit which is a shear of onions that have already been tickno They've already been muer the zar and you replant them. So the hak is miss you make a of messer according to all of it including the original litra and what grows new. Now the matsus says that the onion doesn't decompose when it plants but rashi explains it just expands in its original size. So there you have it. When the er is not going to be cole when it doesn't decompose it requires new micer after it's been replanted. But the gammer is not really a ray from the onions because hamus rials. That's how you do it. That's the derk for the onions. You always replant existing onions to plant new onions. But news for if if you have these ears of grain, replanting them is not the normal way to plant grain. Next shil. Let's say you got a flower pot that there's no meaning it's closed off at the bottom. So it's not connected to the ground. What's going to be the assumption is can I now beer on another similar kind of flower pot? So fractumar elo if it has no hole in it. So big deal. It's not meaning there's no hatra to take messer on such pairs that grow from it. So of course you could take a micer off another dinder bun and so dilma maybe your shil is no you're talking about where you took this flower pot that had no hole and then you punched a hole in the bottom of it and it continued to grow and now you got a more complicated shila because now part of this stuff grew as a durabon because it had no hole and some of it grew like legitimate with the nuts nov that it now is connected to the ground. So really it's the same kind of shil that Raa asked beforehand but in a different application but the gamar is really not the same because still it was one long za one kind of mice of planting it's just you made the hole in it after it was growing time when you made the hole then it becomes attached to the ground and it grows more. So because of that so we don't look at the buster icar and the typhus as one entity but ham by the case of rava's replanting of these years of grain there's really two separate plantings so rava can separate these two things between the ikar and the typhus more justifiably all right let's try another shila boy shibilis you got this grain that's still attached to the stock it had meuaku is the gar that's really mai of the micrus so this stuff is 100% grade a tel visas and then you replanted it after and now once it's in the ground the second time I have now said this is my truma now ma what's the because if you just take something while still in the ground you're not going to be able to make it into truma but this stuff already had me yeah but now I've replanted it so maybe I'm no longer allowed to make it into truma now the gar is going to speak out since it had it became genuine so it makes sense that when you call it truma it's going to work since you planted Now the telkite goes away and therefore you can't make it into truma afterwards. So if you're telling me that the grain becomes truma it will be a case of truma that's to the ground and we learned innum we don't ever find the truma could be attached to the ground. Now this Mishna that says this if you don't recognize it you're not alone. If you look over at the misar sash inside your garmor sash writes I never found any such mishna the mafar tried to explain that it's implicit from other different sugis but there doesn't seem to be such an existence of a mishna this is the though truma cannot be made into truma while it's still but for this case it sounds like it would be sole abas is back this is no what we're saying because kitany that mishna that says that you can't make something into truma when connected to the ground. That's not a blanket rule that it can't ever become trumas. That's just you don't have these punishments for eating truma that's still connected to the ground because if you pick it off and you eat it at that point it is considered tosh and if you try to eat it while it's still connected to the ground you know why it's not going to it's not the normal way to eat food and therefore you're going to be putter because it's even though there is a rashi in suka that says if you eat the rig while still connected to the ground you're shabas of being tish because you're disconnected to it from the ground and even though it may not be the direct to do that way assumes this is but therefore it will not be true to ila. How is this any different that we found in the pinas the ledger of ila of ilfa fame? What was Ila writing about? He got eggs from a kasha bird but the bird dropped dead didn't it wasn't. So the question is the eggs that come from it. If the eggs were already outside of it, well then they're eggs. But let's say it's some of them are still within the bird and therefore the ones that are still within the bird just like the bird that it's coming out of it has a status of aar that it's all the clothing that you're wearing when you eat thear but the eggs that are outside the bird. Now, what's the case of eating these eggs that they're inside the nea of this bird? Rashi learns that you're literally sticking your mouth all the way into the inside of this bird and you're eating the eggs while they're inside the bird, which certainly seems like a because it's still going to have the between the case of the eggs and our case of the because when something's disconnected from the ground like this case of the eggs, people will eat this way. They'll stick their face into a dead bird and eat the eggs that are within there. I guess things that are considered normal or not are all just relative. But if it's still attached to the ground, people just don't do it. And therefore, because it's not the way people eat. Now the whole issue over here of whether or not the nasar is going to be is whether or not it's considered an this is the first and maybe even the most significant that angle brings when he cla in the inalif where he clares how does the toma of work is it a maga and the location of the maga is your throat when you swallow it or it has nothing to do with maga it has to do with a misa so Dr. of angle this gumra is clear that it's all about if it's called a because if it's butler but it's not considered there's a whole ri of the garra so in other words if you want to understand that becomes just touching it there well who cares if it's the considered the der you touched it but because it seems pretty clear from it's all about it's going to depend on whether it so there's no hole in the flower pot and you planted If the point in what you're telling me is that you're going to be okay, that makes some sense. But if you're just telling me you're not allowed to do it, so there's no in that. The whole point is you're telling me that that's called a in a flower pot without a hole. Tanino, we know this already from the Mishna in the fifth peri. So you see it must be that is to tell me that if you plant klay init you're going to get malus for doing this is now the five different kinds of grains wheat barley spelt oats and rye if you make a dough of these things you have to and these different kinds of there's a here in the gear we're just going to read it The way we have it here al to be eaten before the carbon or to cut them. So besides eating the grain, there's also an about harvesting it. And those two isim of eating and harvesting are going to be only for those. And now comes the line that we've been referencing in the past or two. If any of these took root before the carbon that's what the mim but if they didn't take root before the you got to wait another year until the next carbonber we learned in the bryman spelled isimulsum oats and rye are kinds of barley turning over to bay is gulba she dishra which is ted as rye is going to be dishra and shibel shabol tala these kind of oats are Fine. Now the mission said these different sounds like these five. Yeah. But which will translate as rice and millet. Those are not how do you know to be matzah? We come up on over here having matzah references. There's that the definition of the kinds of things are the things that you make matzah out of them. The Tory says it says of eating. So we see the definition of what you can make matzah is the same thing that you're how do you know by matzah mean know that you got to make it out of these different meaning. How do you know you can't just eat a rice cake and call it matzahishmates? So we put together the matzah in the same only things that could be but this is as opposed to the flower of they never actually come to I mean they'll change chemically but not in the same way that would be called they're going to be called whatever exactly that means then you could take different meaning to be these different kernels grain and flour. What is that price referring to? that if you eat a kaz worth of these different kinds of foods meaning kernels plus doe's if you eat a kazay worth of these different kinds of foods together if you eat this combination of these different that together to get to a kaz if you eat it outside of you're going to be lucky you get balas ram token that they combine to become the shear of caba which you need to transmit to this there's a sh of whether or not it itself could become to if it's less than a kabaya but this is certainly to spread the tum it needs to be a kabaya the bre is telling us of the grain and the flowers just like dough by the case of the dough you need you need a pure full amount of this kind of as opposed to the husks and inedible parts that get mixed in together that won't be mar for the shear of the kebe A form vanyita bane kufa bane whether or not it's been peeled from its husk it can bear to get to the shear of aa form but kufesa it depends whether or not it's so the way that we understand is going to be for any edible seeds that are plantable So we the way people actually plant things which is within its huska and that's actually the mucker form even things are not technically food like those husks around the kernels are certainly going to be mitarif like it depends it depends whether or not they are wet or dry because the dry ones don't protect the kernels anymore they just wither and fall away and therefore they're not going to be mitarif and the mission said that's the gear that we're going with that you cannot eat these things before the carpet is brought so how do we know that this is only then said you're not allowed to do the before you know that that is on all now this is that you're not allowed to eat the before the carbon my let's define that Until what point in the process is it user to eat the so it's not the actual bringing of the carbon it's the cutting and the harvesting of the until that happens it's going to be user now of course what we mean is you do the harvesting the night of the 16th so therefore assuming you've done that harvest when the sun rises in the morning you're now allowed to eat your kadesh you don't have to wait for the actual carbon that's according to and I just had the way Rashi learns Tyus learns differently but we'll go with Rashi Omar it's not about the it's bringing the carbon. You got to wait a little longer until they actually brought it in the B mdash. Our said if you're always talking about the actual carbon like said so that's good. That's why these different are not combined together about the two isum of eating and just simply saying it as one. all about the like Rabbi said it's all one because of that says where are they arguing they're arguing at the end of the if that which you planted took root before the so what's meant by the when it says before the what part of that process so this is not the mater we're talking about we're talking about the shear of what is the thing that's considered growing already that the either the or the wukum.