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Menachos 64
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Today's stuff is Menachot
and we are
in the beginning of a new perek, the
sixth perek of Menachot, perek
Rebbe Yishmael omer. Today's stuff has
been learned as a refuah shleimah for
Miriam bas Malkah Freida, [ __ ] ben
Chaya Leah, Baruch Yitzchak ben Shifra
Miral, and Rachel bas Henya. So, we're
moving along in Menachot,
we're jumping mayan in very much by
Easter Indian within the world of
Menachot. Now, as it relates to perek
Rebbe Yishmael,
the primary topic of the perek is going
to be one of the many Menachot that were
brought in the Beit Hamikdash.
Specifically,
the Minchat Omer. So, we know about the
Minchat Omer, number one because we know
about the Minchat Omer.
Number two, because we're already 60
plus daf in into Menachot Menachot and
literally from daf bet, the Minchat Omer
has been featured very, very
prominently. But, what we need to chazar
for today's daf is that the Minchat Omer
was brought one day a year on tet zayin
Nissan.
What's referred to in the Torah as
mimochorat hashabbat, the day after the
first day of Pesach,
it was brought from se'orim, barley,
which makes it unique as far as Menachot
go, because almost all Menachot were
brought from chittin.
Additionally,
the shiur of the Minchat Omer was an
Omer.
An Omer, believe it or not, is a shiur.
So, the word Omer plays a very important
role in the conscience of the Jew. Think
of Sefirat Omer, the man was an Omer. An
Omer is a the
What measurement is the Omer? It's a
positive in the Torah. In the parsha
Saman, in parshas Beshalach, the Torah
says that the omer is in a serious or
eifah, which in the vernacular of
Masachis Menachos and in Kodashim is
more popularly known as an issaron. So,
the word issaron is very much associated
with a mincha, and the reason is because
roiv minchos, the sheer of silus that it
required was an issaron. And issaron
means a tenth. A tenth of what?
It's in a serious or eifah. An eifah was
a biblical measurement. Thus, an issaron
is 1/10 of the eifah, and the omer is
what's known as the aseres omer. So,
incredibly, every time we've mentioned
the word issaron here in Masachis
Menachos, we could have for the same
price used the word omer. An omer is an
issaron. More specifically, it's an
aseres omer. Now, the way the carbon
omer was brought was you need in an
additional way. And that is that every
carbon, what matters is you take the
carbon, you bring it to the Beis
Hamikdash, be it a zevach, be it a
mincha, and you makriv it
to Hakadosh Baruchu. Part and parcel of
the avodah of the minchas omer was
cutting the barley
from the field that was ultimately going
to be converted into silus that was
ultimately going to be brought as a
carbon. In fact, the Torah says,
"Vayedaber Hashem el Moshe leimor, daber
el benei Yisrael ve'amarta aleihem, ki
savoiu el ha'aretz asher ani nosein
lachem, uktsartem es kitziro. Vahaveisem
es omer reishis kitzirchem el Hakoin."
Part and parcel of the avodah of the
minchas omer was the actual kitziro. It
was the "Uktsartem es kitziro." Now,
it's not just the kitziro, because
the omer had to be brought in the form
of flour, in the form of silus, which
means that just like you had to do the
Ketzira, you also had to do everything
that came in between the Ketzira and the
actual bringing of the Omer. In fact,
many of the first Lamed Tes Melachos
play a very prominent role in the
bringing of the Omer, which means that
in order to appreciate the process
better, we'd have to be farmers. This is
a general disclaimer that we always talk
about. We are not farmers, and as a
result, it makes this slightly more
challenging. But the bottom line is that
the Korban Omer was unique in many ways.
Specifically, as we're going to see,
tying into today's daf, was that the
Korban Omer involved not just bringing
the actual Korban, but the Ketzira and
the Tchina and the Harkada, all the
Avodas that were necessary in order to
take
wheat, grain that's attached to the
ground, and convert it into a viable
Korban, had to be done. Here's the next
and the last Chiddush that we need for
today's daf, and that is the Korban Omer
was Docheh Shabbos. So, if Tes Ayin
Nissan fell out on Shabbos,
it was Docheh Shabbos.
Why is that a Chiddush? Because there
are different Melachos that we just
meant that fall into the category of
Lamed Tes Melachos that were being done.
And there could have been a Hava Mina
that Mechech Teisi, you're allowed to do
these Melachos on Shabbos. Kamash Malan
Esrain Daf from Sukkin, obviously. And
the bottom line is that not only the
bringing of the Korban Omer was Docheh
Shabbos, but even all the Hechsher, all
the Hachana, all the things from the
Ketzira on were Docheh
Shabbos as well. Now, you're going to
tell me, what's the greatest Chiddush
that it's Docheh Shabbos? Isn't it Yom
Tov anyways? Tes Ayin Nissan. So, first
of all, Melachos are a lot more Chomer
on Shabbos than they are on Yom Tov.
Melachos Achal Nefesh is Muttar on Yom
Tov, which is not Muttar on Shabbos. On
Shabbos, if somebody violates one of the
melachos of Shabbos b'meizid with eidim
and hatra'ah, he's chayiv skilah. And on
Yom Tov, he only gets his malkus. If he
does it b'shogeg on Shabbos, he's chayiv
a chatas. And on Yom Tov, he's not
chayiv a chatas. So, our reishon
reishon, no, melachos on Shabbos and
melachos on Yom Tov, as much as they're
very similar, they're not one in the
same. But, Yehudah ben Eitler Kallah,
the more obvious response is Tesah
Nissan in Eretz Yisrael is actually not
Yom Tov. Tesah Nissan in Eretz Yisrael
is Chol HaMoed. So, in Chutz La'Aretz,
it's the second day Yom Tov. It's Yom
Tov Sheini Shel Galuyos. But really, in
Eretz Yisrael, where the Yidden were
told "U'k'tzartem es ha'ketziros", it
was Chol HaMoed. And a Chol HaMoed, you
learn it from ketziros. Now, the truth
is, melacha on Chol HaMoed, that in and
of itself is a big sugya, one of the
biggest machlokes in the Shas,
literally, where you have half the
Rishonim in the world on one side and
the other half of the Rishonim in the
world on the other side. Is the issur
melacha on Chol HaMoed where applicable?
Is it an issur d'Oraisa? Is it an issur
d'Rabbanan? But the bottom line is that
part and parcel of the hava of the
korban omer was the actual ketziros. And
all the melachos of sidur the pas that
followed, they were docheh Shabbos. And
it's because of that background that
Sefer HaMinchos brings us the very next
mishna. Rebbi Shmuel omer, Rebbi Shmuel
said, "Omer hayah ba Shabbos." When the
korban omer was brought on Shabbos, it
was brought misholish side. So, they
would begin with with three sa'in of
sa'in. And then they would sift it and
sift it more and sift it even more until
they got to the shiur of the korban
omer, which is an omer, which is in a
se'ah,
which is in three sa'in. It's all the
same. "U'vachol during the week,
meichamesh." They wouldn't begin the
process by sifting through three sa'in,
but rather they would begin by sifting
through five sa'in. "V'chachamim
omerim." The chachamim say, "Echad
Shabbos v'echad Chol HaMoed, misholish
hayah ba." Doesn't matter if it was
Shabbos. It doesn't matter if it was
Chol HaMoed. It was always brought from
three. What exactly is going on in this
machlokes? We'll see in the Gemara.
Rebbi Chinena bar Chanina omer, Rebbi
Chinena bar Chanina said, "BaShabbos
hayah niktzar b'yochin."
>> When the carbon animal was brought on
Shabbos and they came to do the ketsira,
so they would do the ketsira with one
person. So, it was one individual who
did the ketsira. Ubemagalahat, he would
use one sickle. Ubakupahathas, and he
would carry one kupah. When it was not
during the week, beshlosha, it was done
with three people. Besholesh kupais, it
was done
in three kupais. Besholesh magalais, and
it was used
with three sickles. Vehakhamim omerim,
the hakhamim say, "No. Leshisha sayo.
Ehhad Shabbos veehhad kol." It doesn't
matter if the carbon animal is being
brought on Shabbos or if it's being
brought during the week. Beshlosha,
three people. Besholesh kupais, three
baskets. Ubisholish magalais, and with
three sickles. So, the Mishnah mentions
two mahlekosen amongst the tanaim with
regards to how the carbon animal was
brought on Shabbos. More specifically,
was there a shinui in terms of the way
the carbon animal was brought on Shabbos
versus the way it was brought
during the week. So, we have a mahlekes
Rabbi Shimon and the hakhamim, number
one, and that is with regards to how
many sa'in of se'irim
were used lekhathila in order to sift
from it the omer when the carbon animal
was being brought during the week.
According to Rabbi Shimon, it was five.
According to the hakhamim, it was three.
The second mahlekes is
with regards to how many people, how
many kupais, and how many sickles were
used. According to
the hakhamim, it was done with three.
According to Rabbi Hanina ben Dosa,
it was done with one. In other words,
according to the hakhamim, the process
of exactly how the carbon animal was
brought during the week versus the
process how the carbon animal was
brought on Shabbos was one in the same.
Rabbi
one thing in common and that is they
felt that the process of how it was done
during the week and the process of how
it was done on
was different. Now, they were both
focusing on a different element, a
different aspect of the carbon
was focusing on how many
we began with
and from how many of did we get our e
run?
And the
focus on how many
we used, how many cycles we used and how
many coopers we used. Either way, the
now is going to have a lengthy
discussion
focusing on
the of
but we'll see in the course of
discussing
but they
were very much going to discuss the
of
as well. So, again, let's take this
first the mission is
of and the of says that the carbon omer
when it was brought during the week was
brought with any that the says in the
that came from five of when it was
brought on it only came from three the
say that it didn't matter if it was on
if it didn't matter if it was
during the week it always came from
three. So, the says like this, what's
this this of
this
of this of
this of this of this of this of
this that in order to come up with a
very of
a
an
that's going to be the
and the best of it's going to be the
of
so what you would need to start off with
was three
and then you're going to go ahead and
you're going to sift it and if you're
going to sift three and you're going to
take the best
from it that is going to be great and
being that when you bring a carbon you
want to bring it from the best so
therefore you start with three and
doesn't matter if it's or it's it's
right so you might well do it in the
best way on Shabbos just like you're
doing it in the best way during the
week.
But
what exactly is she doing? Why does
he hold that on Shabbos it was brought
from three and during the week it was
brought from five and
if he holds that if you want a good you
have to start off with five then Shabbos
then even on Shabbos you should start
with five and
that if you want a good you start with
three. After
that even during the week it should be
three. So, what's this business that on
Shabbos you do it one way, you only do
it from three and then on a weekday you
do it a different way, you do it from
five. I'm
that if you want to get a good
without too much work so you start off
with five
and you take the the best of the five
and
and it's worth and you're going to have
an incredible and
Okay, but
if you're willing to work a little bit
harder also
so then you can also get a very very
good
from three.
During the week my
we go with the option that involves
five. We go with the option that
involves a little bit less
and the reason is the
because at the end of the day the
that you're going to get from the five
is actually going to be a little bit
better. But Shabbos however on Shabbos
ironically we work a little bit harder
to get the
and the reason we do it is because
because we'd rather need meaning need to
sit more So, yeah, but it's harder
rather than have to go ahead and do more
malachas. So, it's a little bit
convoluted, but in short, the way Rashi
explains this is at the end of the day,
if you're going to start off with five
sa'in, you're going to end up with
better than you're going to get if
you're going to start off with three
sa'in. And the reason is very simple,
cuz you're taking the best of the best.
So, if I take the best of the best of
five, so obviously it's going to be
better than if I take the best of the
best of three. Right? Let's assume the
the first
fraction of any sa'in that comes out is
the best. And then the next fraction
that comes out is a little worse. And
the next fraction is a little bit worse.
Okay. So, the first fraction of five is
going to yield more best of the best
than the first fraction of three. So,
really, if I'm going and I'm taking from
five, I'm going to end up with better
than I'm taking from three. Which is the
sa'ar why we always say go ahead and
start off with five, because I want to
make it as good as possible. And
apparently, if I take it from five,
that's going to be incredible. Now,
maybe start with six or seven or eight.
If I saw it as Chazal said, this is the
way to do it. But the bottom line is
once you take from the top five, now you
know everything is going to be perfect.
On Shabbos, however, there's a cheshbon
not to do this. And the reason on
Shabbos a cheshbon not to do this is
because on Shabbos, if you're going to
go ahead and you're going to take two
extra sa'in, you're going to have to cut
more sa'in. And then you're going to
have to be toichen more sa'in. You're
going to have to go through all the
different malachas that are included in
creating your sa'in list. And that's not
something that I want to do. Now, the
Gemara Bavara says, one second, you're
going to have to do more sifting if you
start off with three than if you start
off with five. It's going to involve
more tircha, right? You're going to have
to do more of the avoda of hakada. It's
true. But at the same time, in the words
of the Gemara, mutav sheya'abeh
b'malachas hakada v'al ya'abeh
b'malachas harbeh. I'd rather you work a
little bit harder on the hard corner, do
a little bit more hard corner, rather
than go ahead and do
a whole bunch of the additional
malachas. That's a better trade-off. And
it's for that reason Rabbi Shmuel holds
that this is the right way to do it. So
you want to know the side of shita's
Rabbi Shmuel, the side of shita's Rabbi
Shmuel is that really it's going to be a
little bit better if I take it from five
than if I take it from three. And that's
why during the week Rabbi Shmuel holds
take it from five as opposed to taking
it from three. Stating that on Shabbos
is already a different hashbon. On
Shabbos there's a hashbon that if I take
it from five I'm going to have to do so
many more malachas. I don't want to do
so many more malachas. And it's for that
reason
Rabbi Shmuel that when it came to
Shabbos take it from three. I if I take
it from three I'm going to have to do
more hard corner. That's true, but
now just to be clear about one point. It
comes out that according to Rabbi Shmuel
when the carbon was being brought during
the week it was taka a little bit nicer
than when it was being brought on
Shabbos. It was a little bit more
malachas. And it's for that reason they
did it from five during the week. And
they made this hashbon when it came to
Shabbos. But Rabbi Shmuel holds it's
kedai. Meaning as much as there is a
hashbon of hiter, but at the same time
you know sometimes you have to do a cost
benefit analysis. And this is the way
Rabbi Shmuel came out. Now what do the
hold? So from the steamus loshon of the
Gemara it sounds like the there's no
that you're not going to make it any
better if it comes from five than if
it's going to come from three. And if
that's the case even if they
hypothetically theoretically agreed with
all the wonders of Rabbi Shmuel. Now
another thing is that the they don't
agree with the of Rabbi Shmuel. Now
another thing is that the
they don't agree with the of Rabbi
Shmuel.
And they agree that in the event that
you're taking it from five it's going to
be better than if you're taking it from
three. The problem with that obviously
would be then why are you doing the week
would the
hold that you should take it from three.
During the week you should take it from
five. So again, it's it's much more from
the Gemara that the
disagree with this entire premise and
with this entire of there being any
of taking it from five versus taking it
from three. Either way,
and
we're not the same person. But
they said the same thing. Meaning they
both said a halacha
at first glance not related to each
other at all. But if you think about it,
really it's based on the same
if the 14th
day of Nissan falls out on
again a lot of
when the 14th day of Nissan falls out on
you bring the carbon
despite the fact that it's so the carbon
is being brought on now. Now, one of the
things that had to be done with the
carbon like with every carbon is they
had to skin the animal
So
when it falls out on
they would be the carbon but they only
did it
they would only do it till the
of the animal.
They would go ahead and they would be
the entire animal. Now, ordinarily when
an animal was skinned for the purpose of
so they would skin the entire animal.
But now it's and being that it's
so maybe we're sensitive to the fact
that by you going ahead and skinning the
animal you're doing
right? You're being
and as a result maybe we shouldn't do
more than we need to do.
Says
yeah, that's what I feel. I feel that we
should be sensitive to how much we do
and therefore it's only that's
but beyond the we're not going to go.
say no, I don't care that it's
the end of the day you're allowed to be
mashed. So, we're going to be mashed
everything. Bottom line says the
Gamorah, what does this have to do with
Arabishmal?
Just like Rubishmal
said,
there's no reason to go ahead and be
mashed more than you have to be mashed.
So, therefore just be mashed at the even
though ordinarily we'd be mashed at
school but now it's Shabbos. So, Shabbos
we're going to be sensitive. So,
isn't that sheet of Rubishmal? He would
probably say the same thing over here.
Given the
like
being that at the end of the day you can
get your is so line from three sun. You
don't need to get it from five sun. So,
it's for that reason even though
Rubishmal sheet is you take it from five
sun. But when it comes to Shabbos you
take it from three sun. So, the Gamorah
says I see a little bit of an analogy
between Rubishmal and Rubishmal
because there's still
the way to do the
but the
the way to
I'll do it in a slightly but the other
way to go ahead. Rubishmal said it with
regards to five versus three sun in
terms of how much sun we began with when
we sifted for the sun for the
and Rubishmal
said it in terms of how much of the
animal we would skin to be able to pull
out the
to be able to go ahead now and to be
I don't know if it's
could be Rubishmal only said this over
here the
because there's no because
over there the
there's an element of factor of because
animal
in the maybe holds so what's the the
the
is to have an animal just hanging with
half of the skin skinned and the other
half not. That's the way they used to
treat the
so to treat that way that's already a
because and because it's a because
so could be Rubishmal holds that as much
as
high level I agree that there's a
but at the same time as it relates to
this specific detail I'm not necessarily
agree. And now I'm going to go on and
say I can flip it the other way as well.
He said it over there because when once
you skin the animal,
so you really pull out the that you need
to be
so any that you need you already got. So
there's no point to be honest further.
Over here but when it comes to the where
we said there's an
in terms of the
of the actual
depending on whether I take it from
three five
so here you can make the argument that
the
where if all you had was three you don't
have the full
why because you can make it better not
just that
and you would have to be honest to make
it a little bit better so
maybe over here you would all like the
so the says as much as the high level it
sounds like we do the minimum on the
maximum during the week so I am
saying
it's not
I'm not
the says it's not
I'm going to get it's not
that the says
so like went back to the drawing board
it sounds like was trying to to
to another time now this was the first
attempt it didn't work out so
I am going to is going to get him
so
and
he's going to get him they said it so
who's this
is going to get him so this is not a
awesome this is not a
this is already so he's going to get him
so he's going to get him so he's going
to get him so he's going to get him so
he's going to get him
so he's going to get him so he's going
to get him so he's going to get him so
he's going to get him so he's going to
get him so he's going to get him
so he's going to get him
so he's going to get him so he's going
to get him
so he's going to get him so he's going
to kind of Hanan and his
very much when we went through the
mission. So after
me like Hanina's kind of Hanan did
kind of Hanan say over here that given
the absolute
that being that you could do it with one
person. You could do it with one cooper
and one magel. That's fine.
Therefore, even though ordinarily we
would do with three, but here we're
going to do it with one. So maybe we
comes to
the given the absolute being that you
could do it from three sun and you don't
need five like
we're not going to be
so
I'm not selling to
to the over here
but I'm selling to
to
kind of Hanan but the says we might do
it from
maybe when says
over here and we'll do the
there's no of Hanan
I will over there but
with this kind of Hanan
and
maybe holds like the so what's this So
she already spoke out in the mission
that the reason
the zero of the carbon animal was done
with three people is because
as we'll see in tomorrow's daf the by
Susan who were the lesser known
compadres of the Sadducees they were of
the opinion that the carbon animal was
not brought on the 9th of Nissan but
rather was brought on the Sunday
following Pesach that when it says in
the Torah me
that's when you're supposed to bring the
carbon animal it means the day after
Shabbat as in Sunday as opposed to
referring to Yom Tov as Shabbat and
meaning the day after the first day Yom
Tov. But the bottom line is
the by Susan used to be
when they brought the carbon animal.
They did it with a tremendous amount of
notoriety. They wanted
they wanted everybody to know about it
and the way they did it was by bringing
three people right cuz you know when
there's three people there are the most
of
it's
kind of Islam the kind of kind of Islam
it's like you question how
but this is a basic
but the bottom line is so to be my first
the Indian they don't always bring three
and essentially
saying is pure is a very nice
but on
why should you have to go ahead and and
be my first the whole of it so to speak
but what do you have to go ahead and be
my like this it's
better not
time is the that it could be that is
small even though high level he agrees
with
kind of
he is the man of this Indian that when
it comes to
you try to do a little bit less but it's
very possible that he only said it with
regards to five some three some a little
more here there a little less here there
for that little bit of here there you
says no no I'm not willing to go ahead
and do all these
but when it comes to
me so I'm a lot of
about you tell me you know
it's me and the is
one of the most important tenants in
of course these are the from the because
and we have to do everything we can
possibly do to eradicate any sham
a martial of that Indian so it makes a
lot of sense that maybe when it comes to
they would hold like
you can say the other way
maybe when
say his the
so
we are from the carbon of back to really
makes no difference if you use one
person or three people it's all the same
over here the
but over here where if you use three
versus five it actually makes a
difference what's the difference in one
case it's going to be more
so
maybe here kind of kind of holds like
the
so the says that if rather wants to
a kind of
to small this is not the kind of because
as much as high level there's a shaychus
between Rabi Yishmael and Rav Chanina
Sgan HaKohanim, yeah, but to say "Amru
d'var echad", that Rabi Yishmael would
hold Rav Chanina Sgan HaKohanim, and
that Rav Chanina Sgan HaKohanim would
hold of Rabi Yishmael, that's factually
incorrect. That's already not something
that's necessarily the case, says the
Gemara. Ela Amar Rav Ashi, so Rav Ashi
came to Bais HaMedrash, and he said Rabi
Yishmael over Rabi Yosi Amru d'var
echad, that Rabi Yishmael over Rabi Yosi
said d'var echad. By the way, it's like
a little heart, if you want to try to
visualize the d'var Amram Bais
HaMedrash, like what's the objective
here? We're trying to shteiltzu Rabi
Yishmael to somebody. First Rabi said, I
think Rabi Yishmael ben Noson HaYechidi
in Breichos regarding the korban Pesach
that's brought on Shabbos.
The Gemara said, nah, it's not a
tzushtel. Okay, Ela Amar Rav Ashi, so
Rav Ashi said, let me shteiltzu to Rabi
Chanina Sgan HaKohanim. That's not a
tzushtel. Amar Rav Ashi, right, usually
you have this, if you have like a shvere
kasha, and everyone's trying to figure
out, you know, what's the teretz, what
does the Mishna mean, what does the
Braisa mean, how do you reconcile the
Reishah and the Seifah, and Rav Ashi
always gets the last word. Ela Amar Rav
Ashi, what exactly was the objective?
There was like some
urge to shteiltzu Rabi Yishmael. There
was a mesayeh that Rabi Yishmael had a
Tanna d'mesayeh lei, even though he
doesn't need one, but he had a Tanna
d'mesayeh lei. So again, what exactly
the objective behind the scenes was,
usually is a little bit more clear. I
think in this Gemara it's a little bit
sossom. But the bottom line is, says the
Gemara, Ela Amar Rav Ashi, Rav Ashi
said, I'm going to have a tzushtel Rabi
Yishmael over Rabi Yosi Amru d'var
echad, and this Rabi Yosi that
Rav Ashi shteiltzu, this is already a
Tanna sossom. This is a vildah tzushtel.
As a matter of fact, it's a Mishna
Maseches Rosh Hashanah. The time we're
going to the Mishna, the context of this
Mishna is that once upon a time Bais Din
was mekadesh the chodesh ha'peirios. So
two eidim would have to walk in the Bais
Din, they would say that we saw the
molad, and based on that Bais Din would
decide that it's Rosh
Chodesh. One of the chiddushim you have
in the sugiyah of Kiddush HaChodesh is
that eidim going to testify in Bais Din
are allowed to violate Shabbos. So they
can go to trum, for example,
because it's so important that we get
the months straight, taking out my
others. And it's something that's even
doiche Shabbos, stating that. Bain
chinair ba'alil, it doesn't matter if
the model wasn't clearly bain chulain
near ba'alil, or if it wasn't seen
clearly,
you're allowed to be michalel Shabbos.
He says, "Im near ba'alil, if it wasn't
clearly, in michalel Shabbos, you can't
be michalel Shabbos." What's the svara?
Rebbi Shmuel, Rebbi Yosi holds that if
the
model was seen clearly, that means just
like you saw it, the other guy saw it.
Just like the people out of the trum saw
it, the people in the trum also saw it.
So, there's no reason to go ahead and be
michalel Shabbos because everyone saw
it. So, what's the point? The chachamim
say, "No, it doesn't matter. Bain
chinair ba'alil, bain chulain near
ba'alil, either way michalel Shabbos."
What's the svara of the chachamim? Rebbi
Yosi saying, "Good." So, we'll see, the
Gemara is going to mention
the svara of the chachamim, which is
nimtza mach ato machshil on the love of
it. If you're going to say that the only
time you're allowed to go and be
michalel Shabbos is if it wasn't seen
clearly, you know, clearly or not
clearly is something that's very
subjective. And as a result, you're
going to think it wasn't seen it was
seen clearly. So, he's going to say,
"I'm not going to be michalel Shabbos."
Whereas really it wasn't seen so
clearly, and turns out you and your
chavrusah are the only ones that really
saw it. And nimtza ato machshil on the
love of it. There's a big michshol
that's going to come. So, the chachamim
said, "Because we want to prevent this
michshol, there's an inyan of bain
chinair ba'alil, bain chulain near
ba'alil, michalel on all of us Shabbos."
But the bottom line is, that's only the
chachamim shita. Rebbi Yosi doesn't
subscribe to that svara. He holds im
near ba'alil, ain michalel on all of us
Shabbos. So, Rebbi Yosi meelah, Rebbi
Yosi didn't Rebbi Yosi say over there
What did Rebbi Yosi say? Rebbi Yosi is
saying that even though you're allowed
to go ahead and be michalel Shabbos for
kiddush hachodesh, but at the same time,
that's only if you need it. But if
you're not needed cuz it was near a
bowel ill, so if it's absolutely the he
known, you can't be mature. I mean, you
can't go ahead and do a a whole shabbos
over here given the absolute he known.
So this is already a much wider two
style. But at the same time, a little
bit of a two style nonetheless. We are
there is a hillock between is this
something that's needed or is it not
something that's needed? And being that
there's more come to say that I don't
really need it as much as yeah, it's
more who there for every single person
that's all the my word to come running
to the best then. But I hear I'm in
mocking where there's an invoice that
needs to be paid and the invoice by the
way is shabbos. So maybe over here it's
going to be a little bit different. So
just like Yossi says that as much as I
want you to run to the best then, but
don't go to near a bowel ill because I
don't think we need you. So so too, I
don't need the five sign, right? So
Yossi over here
says no, me might do my Yossi over here
says we
over the lack of this action
cuz you don't have the small
of a mission loss of a life, right?
There's no shash that if you're going to
go ahead and use three sign on shabbos,
you're going to have this grace of
mission you're going to use three sign
during the week.
We have the
small and
Yossi
also
says over here
there's no sign of a fire, right? You're
not dealing with sign of a fire, it's
not kosher. Additionally, we were in the
shabbos the price.
There's no hat to be shabbos unless you
need to be shabbos. I will over here the
number one we're dealing with kosher.
The shabbos the price is the second
small. Additionally, you also anyways
have to be shabbos, right? We're being
shabbos regardless. So
maybe here we hold like the
that's the commercial
or the bottom line is says the
Yossi
said and that is
Yossi two style that Yossi over here
that's also something that falls flat at
the end of the day. The Gamorah says
there is no makar. This concludes
the first part of today's daf. So,
what's part one of today's daf? The
Mishnah mentioned a machlokes Rabi
Shimon and the Chachamim. The Korban
Omer, which was brought on Tes Ayin
Nissan, it was brought from an issaron,
an omer, and a se'ah and a eifah. They
all mean the same thing of se'ah.
There was a machlokes how many se'ah'in
of se'ah'in
did the Kohanim begin with when they
started sifting to take out this mehudar
dega issaron? Rabi Shimon said during
the week five se'ah'in, on Shabbos
three. The Chachamim said echa Shabbos
echa chol, it was always three. The
shittas Chachamim was very
straightforward. They obviously hold
three is the right way to do it. And
they hold lo ishna Shabbos lo ishna
chol. Aren't you being over melachos?
Yeah, but ketziras omer, havas omer, and
everything in between is doche Shabbos.
Rabi Shimon clearly holds it's better to
do it with five. That's why he says
during the week you should use five.
Well, if that's the case, then why on
Shabbos are you doing three? And the
Gamorah said it's because Rabi Shimon
holds that as much as it's better to use
five than it is three, but at the same
time, if you're going to use five versus
three, you're going to end up doing a
lot more melachos. And we make a
cheshbon, right? Sometimes you have to
do your analysis and you have to ask
yourself is the profit that I'm going to
get worth the risk that I'm going to
have to take? And in this case, Rabi
Shimon held that I would rather have
se'ah'in, a mincha that's a little bit
less mehudar, rather than have to go
ahead and do all these melachos. And by
the way, even though by using three it's
going to require me to do more harkada,
but mutav sheyavdei b'melacha achas
b'harkada v'lo yavdei b'melachos achas.
That's the yesod of shittas Rabi Shimon.
And for whatever reason, the Amora'im
felt that
it's kedai to try to shteiltzu this Rabi
Shimon
to another shitta. As a matter of fact,
in the The of the Gamorah, there were
three shittas Amora'im that the Gamorah
a little bit of a a tzushta. The first
was the shita of Rab Rab Shmuel ben
Yechiel Breichah, who holds that when
Pesach falls out on Shabbos, and they
would mafshit the animal to remove the
emurim, they would only mafshit it ad
hachatzos, which is not the way it was
usually done. And ostensibly, the reason
Rab Shmuel ben Yechiel Breichah felt
that's the right way to do it, is
because even though it's a little bit of
a bizayon for the katzim, it looks like
it's an aveila, but at the same time,
why should I do more hefshit than I have
to do? Isn't that similar to the shita
of Rab Shmuel? It is high level, but the
Gamara was daicha. The second tzushta
that the Gamara had,
it was Rabba version 2.0, was Rab
Chinena bar Chanina bar Mishnah,
literally the same sugia, which is in
the korban omer alay, where Rab Chinena
bar Chanina said that there was a
different shinui between the korban omer
that was brought on Shabbos versus the
korban omer that was brought during the
week. And that is when it was brought
during the week, it was done bepirson,
lo yitzimi liban shala by susin, and it
was done with three people, and it was
done with three sickles, and it was done
with three kupas. But on Shabbos, to be
mema'et in all the melochos that are
being done, you don't need so many
people, you don't need so many sickles,
you don't need so many kupas. By the
way, what's wrong with the kupa?
Like the sickle is the katzira, the
people are the gavras that are doing the
katzira. The kupa is the heitza. You
can't really say achlo shasaraim. But we
want to be mema'et in in that inyan. So
again, you see this idea that even
though there's a maila of doing it
bepirson, but when it comes to Shabbos,
we'll forego that maila because of the
chillul Shabbos. That sounded like a
pretty good tzushta, right? That was
already the el amar Rabba, which you
knew was going to be better than the
amar Rabba, usually is. But at the same
time, the Gamara was daicha that. The
Gamara said that's not much chiddush.
And finally, Rab Ashi said, maybe you
could still use Rab Yosi in the sugias
of kiddush hachodesh, where Rab Yosi has
a chiddush that in the event that the
mo'ed was seen, quote unquote, ba'alil,
which is subjective, which is a problem,
but to the extent that it was seen
ba'alil, you can't be daicha Shabbos,
even though there's a chiddush that the
yidden that used to go they were allowed
to be Shabbos go
but when it came to this Indian when it
came to near by
holds not and the reason must be because
as much as we want him to come but not
on the Shabbos and the thought that was
a
the knocked that out as well either way
we're moving along now to the next part
of the which is as we'll see somewhat
may Indian Indian but I say Indian it
might really these next 15 lines of a
lot a very very long dish first seder
level
in the event that a coin shafted to
and Shabbos that's the punchline and
and all we need is one so the question
now is is he going to be
for shafting the second or is he not
going to be shafting the second half of
this is just a few things in terms of
introduction number one what's the case
so if you take a look at the child with
the
if you look at the
gears of
sheet of says the case is one or two
things either it's
or it's
part of the
and the that were born in
was a
that is
the carbon it's always Shabbos
there was certain that were brought
Shabbos but the bottom line is it's it's
Shabbos
this coin went and instead of shafting
one half of this he shafted two
so he essentially shafted something that
he really didn't have to shaft he did it
shaft it someone's Shabbos be shafted
he's a and really the discussion over
here in this
is is he a
or is he not
so
they
see where he shafted two
seabirds he did it be shafted the inner
and really all he needed was one. rather
said
something similar The names matters
we're going to see.
He's going to be higher for the second
one.
He's going to be part of the mission.
Why is he higher for the second one?
Because he didn't need the second one.
Once you shock at the first one, you got
your copper from the first one. As a
result, the second one is already the
moisture. So it's a regular
you're going to be higher for the first
one. The first one you must
as a result you're going to be part of
the mission. Right, sounds pretty
straight forward.
Even if ultimately he ended up getting
his copper with the schnitzel. So
something happened to the original.
For example,
something happened to the original. So
the copper ended up coming from the
schnitzel. So they could have been a
habit meaning if you ended up using the
schnitzel, so
this was something that you needed. It
was for sure that you
know I feel
Rashi says we look at the
that's what matters. And being that at
the the schnitzel it was not something
you were supposed to do. That's
the way you did was a
you did the schnitzel. You're going to
be higher for the additionally. The
even if the first one ended up being
so or turns out that the first animal
was a weak animal, right? And because it
was a a weak animal, so it comes out
that really it's not such a
animal to use. It's better to use the
second animal. So again, they could have
been a habit meaning being that there's
a mile to use the second animal versus
the first animal. So based on that, it's
you shouldn't be higher for the second
one. Again,
it doesn't matter. Being that at the end
of the day, you didn't need to use the
second animal. This is an important
point because as much as a
is not
is
so it's for that reason that is that
you're going to be part of the first one
obviously because that was something you
had a chiyuv to do, but you're going to
be chayiv for the second one. So again,
this is very nuanced.
Poter on the rishona, you're chayiv on
the shniya. The caveats are where it
becomes a little bit more much more
difficult. Even if you end up getting
kapara with the second one,
and even even if the first one was
nimtzos krusha. And Rashi says, by the
way, where the first one was nimtzos
krusha even before the shchita. So when
you went ahead and you shachted it, you
chapped already one was a krusha and the
second one you're looking at it and you
see it's a shmeina, it's a chata
shmeina, right? So it looks gishmack. So
is this for sure a maila to go ahead and
do that? I feel like it doesn't matter.
At the end of the day, we look at the
time of the shchita and we ask
ourselves, do I need to shacht another
animal or do I not need to shacht
another animal? If at the time of the
shchita I did not have to shacht another
animal, even if there was a maila in
shachting another animal cuz the first
one was a krusha,
or even if
either of line nimtzos that I needed to
shacht another animal, but at the time I
shachted it, I didn't have to shacht the
other animal, that in and of itself
would be enough of a reason for it to be
considered chill shabbos b'do b'shogeg,
you're going to be chayiv of chatas.
Straight to the Gemara, kashya on Rabba
Chaki. Did Rabba really say this? Now
did Rabba really say this? We don't
know. It was on my Rabba v'ei teima
Rabba Me. But one of its sodden was that
Rabba said this, right? But says the
Gemara, Me amar Rabba? Is there a title
Rabba said this? From my Rabba, Rabba
said, "If one has shchita tois, if
somebody had two chatas in front of him,
achas shmeina v'achas krusha, one was a
shmeina and the other one was a krusha.
Shachat shmeina v'achas shachat krusha.
If he shachted the shmeina and then he
shachted the krusha, chayiv is chayiv
for shachting the krusha. Krusha v'achas
shmeina. If he shachted the krusha first
and the shmeina second, poter. He's
going to be poter. The reason he's going
to be poter is is because when you go
ahead and you shacht the shmeina,
there's a maila in shachting the shmeina
cuz the first one was a krusha, which is
a b'di eved. So being that there's a
maila, there's a benefit for going ahead
and checking the schmenna now. So if you
go ahead and check the schmenna, even
though you didn't need it cuz you could
be yotze with the krusha, but the myse
part because there's a mile of using it
and it's doiche shabbos. So therefore,
it's interesting that's only because of
this toisefes mile, but that's enough
for you to be part of the life.
Rabba and Vaita, he said
if you went ahead and checked it the
krusha already, which I could use for
the yevis, but there's a heicha timsa to
get the schmenna.
There's a schmenna. Go ahead and let's
kill and do it. What's the bottom line?
What do you see from here? What's the
kasha? Umi amar Rabba hachi?
Which pratt? The pratt that if the first
one was a krusha
and the second one is a schmenna, you're
going to be chayev chatis for the
schmenna. Rabba mefurash said not that
way. So again, the etzem idea that two
chatois, you'll be chayev a chatis for
one of them. Yeah, that's the same
Rabba. Rabba said you'll be chayev in
the first statement, he said you'll be
chayev in the second statement. Where
does the steer in Rabba where we have
the me amar Rabba hachi biloshon ditnya?
That's with regards to the krusha
schmenna component where the first one
was a krusha and the second one was a
schmenna. Rabba lichatchila vi iteim Rab
Ami said that
even if nimtzas rishona krusha, you're
going to be chayev on the schmenna.
The second statement of Rabba was
exactly the opposite. He said that in
the event that the first one was a
krusha, you're part of the schmenna.
Rabba amar Rabba schmenna lichatchila
shchait. And the Gemara says two
tirutzim, both tirutzim are in the same
gun that we're so boxed into a steer
over here that only way to get out is by
changing some sort of gersa. Ee by
you're saying that one gersa you could
change is same as krusha mikamai. So
just take out the whole krusha component
of the first Rabba. Never said anything
about krusha. I never said anything
about krusha. What is his opinion about
krusha? Only what he said the second
time. So that's perfect. Ee by you're
saying that here Rab Ami amra, right? We
started off amar Rabba vi iteim Rab Ami.
That's why we said the names matter. So,
it was Amora and Amora. So, Amora
And as a result, as a result, it's not
Amora, it's Amora. Now, does Amora stem
with Amora? No, but Amora doesn't have
to stem with Amora. Look at the Amora.
The Indian Indian
Amora Amora Amora Amora Amora Amora
Amora Amora
But the name Amora Amora, what would be
in the event that the
Amora
Amora was brought.
And then a second one was brought
Amora. Okay, so so far this is a
problem. It sounds like you should be
Amora.
After they were doing the Amora
of the first animal, they found that it
was a Amora. I mean, they found that
after it was a Amora, look at it, right?
No, they couldn't tell from looking at
it that it was a Amora. It was Amora
Amora Amora Amora Amora. It was Amora
Amora Amora. It was something inside its
digestive tract. Something inside the
animal Amora Amora they check for the
Amora and they do whatever they do. So,
that's when they figured out that this
animal was a Amora. Now, once they found
that it was a Amora, Amora Amora Amora
Amora Amora they had every right to go
ahead and uh to Amora Amora Amora,
right? Because according to Amora
anyways, who holds that Amora we would
have told you the Amora to go ahead and
and Amora Amora.
The problem is that at the time that
they Amora Amora,
the Amora didn't know that. So,
from the Amora Amora perspective of the
Amora,
he doesn't have that you're allowed to
go ahead now and you're allowed to Amora
Amora.
He went ahead and did it anyways, did it
Amora Amora by the way, but the bottom
line is he did it and as a result, based
on that you would think that he should
be Amora.
But then again, if you look at
Amora even supposed to do, it, he didn't
have that he was supposed to do it. And
this was the question that Ravina asked
Ravashi. When Niftah S'urishona K'rusha,
but it was Min Hamayim, what's the Sod
Hamachshava he was leaning on? Do you go
B'sod Hamachshava or B'sod Hamayim? And
this person was Listen, this is a little
bit of a misnomer because he did it
B'shogeg. If he did it B'shogeg, he's
not B'mechaven L'eiser. But the point
is, he wasn't careful enough in his
Machshava to make sure that he didn't do
the Aveira B'shogeg. He did it B'sod
Hamayim he was leaning on. Or maybe you
go B'sod Hamayim and at the end of the
day he didn't do anything wrong. So this
is where Ravina asked Ravashi, "Am
L'eiser Ravashi D'Ravina Lav Hainu
D'Rabba D'Ravina?" Isn't this Mamlash
Rabba and Ravina? It matters. What's
Rabba and what's Ravina? Shamma Sh'tova
Tinok B'yam. So somebody heard that a
child was drowning at sea. U'paras
M'tzuda, you can't even read this line
Gemara with a straight face. So there
was a person there and he says, "Oh
really, there's a child drowning?" And
he took out his M'tzuda, his net,
L'halois Dogin, and he decided to go
fishing.
So he heard that a Tinok is drowning and
he decided to go fishing. The hell with
Dogin. And he caught a fish. It was his
lucky day. Chayev D'halacha he's Chayev
for the Melacha of Tzad. Sounds like he
did something amazing. And as a result,
there's no question he's Chayev. What
would be if Shamma Sh'tova Tinok B'yam
U'paras M'tzuda L'halois Dogin D'vi
Meloi Dogin? Okay, again, this is all
the Mishigas you know. O've V'helo Dogin
V'tinok. L'maisa he ended up catching
fish, but he also saved this child.
M'goglin Chusai D'zaka. This person
somehow saved this child. So Rabba Omar
Chayev. Rabba says that this person
is going to be Chayev for catching
Dogin. Why? Because he had in mind to
catch Dogin, he caught Dogin, he's a
Mechalel Shabbos. Rav Omar Patur. Rabba
says that no, Rabba says you're going to
be Patur. So we have a Machlokes Rabba
and Ravina in this situation where the
person's intent was to be Mechalel
Shabbos, but at the end of the day ended
up saving a child's life. Is he Mechayev
or is he to be potter? Rava says
Rava says potter. Now the Gemara adds
one connect before we tie it into our
Sugiva can.
Rava says potter even Rava who said
potter only said potter even the shama
I'm mean and they take Nami at being
that he had heard that the tinic was
drowning
as much as this person is a maturist
it's impossible that in his mind on some
level couldn't be thinking you know
hopefully maybe I'm going to catch this
child. On some level it must have been
a
but let's say you would not have heard
that a tinic was drowning life. It
sounds like even Rava would agree that
he would be
what's the bottom line? What do you see
from here? You see that when you have a
situation where if you look at the
of the person that should be one way but
if you look at the mice of the person it
should be another way you go boss in the
mice of the person. In this case the
person is to go fishing. The mice is
solace in the vices. So is he a
fisherman or is he a solace man? Who
just saved somebody's life. Rava says
you go boss in the mice of the person.
If his mice was to go fishing you are
fishing on shabbos.
Rava says he saved somebody's life. So
solace person is
for what he does.
When even when he does it on shabbos. So
it's for that reason forget
but the Gemara is saying that even Rava
that said potter it's only because we
assume subconsciously he had a stick of
mice of the to do the right thing. But
if for sure the mice of the person was
even if the mice of the person was you
go boss in the mice of the person.
So that means Rava
and
again one of the things of today's daf
is like two stalls. But the bottom line
is is that have a little bit of you want
to go boss in the mice of the person you
go boss in the mice of the person. I
think I have
a right of and that was what he told
them.
The Rava
I think this is literally what it is and
the Gemara is not talking about the two
stalls. The Gemara lies with it. However
the Gemara has another version of it.
Some say I'm a lady where actually told
Rava
was not the Rava but rather the Rava
Plukta Yu De Rava Verava. Hainu De Rava
Verava, in a more nuanced way, means
that I think Rava and Rava both agree
that you go Basar Machshava. Either
arguing, they're only arguing because
Rava holds that the Machshava really was
Atina Gosa. In the second Lishna,
we don't have that second step, but
rather it's Hainu Plukta Yu De Rava
Verava. I think it's Mamesh the
Machlokes Rava and Rava. It Mar, the
same exact case. Shomash Atina Ba Yom
Basar Machshava. Suda, La Halveis Dogin,
Vehelo Dogin Chayev. Right? You're
Chayev because you went fishing. La
Halveis Dogin, Vehelo Tinok, Ve Dogin,
Rava Amar Patur, Rava Amar Chayev. Same
Machlokes. Rava Amar Patur. Not just the
same Machlokes, it's just the repeat of
the words. Rava says Patur Zil Basar
Ma'aseh. Rava Amar Chayev Zil Basar
Machshava. According to this Lishna, the
Shaila is literally this Machlokes. So
either way, we're being Poychet the
Shaila from this Rava and Rava. The
question is, is it Rava and Rava
together both saying Zil Basar
Machshava?
Or is it really Machlokes Rava and Rava
whether we go Basar Machshava or whether
we go Basar Ma'aseh. Another Gemara.
This next Gemara is also a classic. And
by the way, for those that have learned
the first Perek of Maseches Gittin
Be'ein in Yeshiva, so this Gemara will
sound a little bit familiar. Amar Rava.
Rava said, Shita Mekubetzes has the
gears. Amar Rava, Choleh She'omdu Le
Gregas Achas, Acholah that the doctors
assess needs a Gregas. So there was a
Choleh and there's a doctor there and
the doctor says, bring a Gregas. And all
of a sudden Yei Dainu Loish. Everybody
started running to get a Gregas. Asara
Bnei Adam, 10 people ran. Veheviu Asara
Gregas. And all of a sudden he has 10
Gregas. Bevas Achas, if they all brought
it at the same time, they're going to be
Patur. A feelu Bevas Achas that not just
that, even if they came Bevas Achas, so
one person brought a Gregas and then the
next guy, you know, an hour later, the
last guy comes up, he found his Gregas.
That guy's also going to be Patur. Every
person's going to be potted. I feel
called out the Hebrew barista. And even
if by the time one of the later guys
brought the gregus, the first person had
brought it and the already was in a
strap up. And he managed to really have
the issue of the fears. But at the same
time, every person went
in his mind thinking he's saving
somebody's life. Has that is how he is a
mishuba, right? And he's doing the right
thing and it's for that reason every
single person is going to be potted.
Good. By the rabba, so that rabba said
as a matter of fact, but rabba said this
is a matter of
fact. What would be if you have a
gregus? What would be if you have a
with a doctor said not one gregus, but
we need two gregus. The two gregus are
staying and there's two gregus
on two gregus. So,
a gregus grows on a tree and the tree
has an as like a branch. So, you can go
ahead and you can take one gregus of
this branch, one gregus of that branch.
Or there's another option. You know what
I mean? Right? You have another choice
and that is the challenge bucket
There's three gregus on the other side.
How do you know my son? So, rabba wanted
to know which one should you bring?
What's the style of my son? Should you
cut off the two gregus to bring the two
gregus? The that's all he needs.
If you're going to go ahead, you're
going to cut the one that has three,
you're going to cut one more than you
actually need. I don't know the
challenge my son. It's better to cut the
one to bring the three. The common
matter
cuz end of the day there's going to be a
little bit less here. So, which one
should you do? You hear the challenge?
So, challenge is you have a He needs two
gregus. I can cut two branches to get
two gregus or I can cut one branch to
get three. Should I cut the two branches
to get the two that's what he needs? Or
maybe cut the one branch then get the
three. What are the two of them? On the
one hand, if I cut the two I'm doing two
of them.
On the other hand, if I cut the one, I'm
going to end up getting three when I
only need two. Now, I think if you ask
the man on the street who never learned
this matter and by the way never learned
the first part of is after either in the
Shiva, he would say what in the world is
the shala? I don't need to start them.
Of course, you go ahead and you cut the
wire. I it's going to yield three, who
cares? I don't care how many pairs it
yields. What I care about is the mice of
the Malachi Shabbas. That's one mice
exterior. This is two mice exterior.
What's the carrots? There's a lot of it
in the Shabbas called Reba Bashira. It's
a good Allah, but there's such Allah.
And that is that when we factor in the
Shabbas, we don't only look at the mice
of the action that was done. We look at
the output. We look at the
Allah that came about of it. And believe
it or not, if one person cooks a little
bit and the other person cooks a lot,
even though they both turned on the
stove, it was the same mice. But you
have three eggs in your frying pan and
you only have two, you did more Malachi
Shabbas than you did. There's something
called Reba Bashira and that's the basis
of the question. On the one hand,
cutting two oxen is two series. But the
guy who's going to do one series and
yield three is doing a Reba Bashira. So
what's more covered? Is the Reba Bashira
more covered or is the cutting more Now
truth is the huge Malachi is we shine
them where the Reba Bashira is a day
riser or is a day boneless. Malachi is
the run and toys for second. This is
very much a issue with the Sugya. The
run holds that Reba Bashira is a day
riser. He said that's your in the Reba
Bashira. I will suck the run. I'll prove
to you it's a day riser cuz if it's not
a day riser, there's no way to make
sense of this game. This game has no
have on in the world cuz the only way
you can learn the game even that you may
take is with
an understanding of a principle called
Reba Bashira. But if Reba Bashira is a
day boneless, then you can't learn it
because then what's the two star them?
Here you're doing an extra Malachi
Shabbas and over here you're being over
and it's a day boneless called Reba
Bashira. It's a day run. This game is a
right to get over to the concept that
Reba Bashira is a day riser. Either way,
as much as it is a shala and it's based
on Reba Bashira. And according to the
run, it's a right to Reba Bashira is a
day riser. At the end of the day, the
game says still not such a shala. She
told shala is my sin on. It's possible
you would bring three. And the Gemara
says it would be a whole cheshbon and
this is where the sugia comes full
circle. The end. Kind of like come Rabi
Shmuel also. Cuz even Rabi Shmuel in our
Mishnah who said that during the week
five so'in on Shabbos three so'in, he
said it
come in myid ktzira. What did he say?
He said that go ahead and do a little
bit less on Shabbos, right? Even though
you can
yield less so'in and have three so'in as
opposed to five. But why yield less
so'in? It's because I want you to do
less ktzira. I want you to do less of
all the melachos. So it's for that
reason he's telling you to be mema'it
b'achila. Aval halacha over here, the
key come in myid b'achila. Well, if
you're going to be mema'it b'achila,
you're going to say I want two versus
three come av shiktzira. I'm doing more
ktzira. Aval shalah ish my sinan, why
are you going to do three? Meaning, what
was the hava mina to Shmuel to Rabi
Shmuel? Again,
the disclaimer before the last 15 lines
was you need for say that for all these
Gemaras. Not as much as like five for
say the Gemara say. But the
tzushtel of the Gemara posuk shaar is
that the Gemara has a hava mina that
just like Rabi Shmuel says in our
Mishnah, just like Rabi Shmuel says in
our Mishnah, that on Shabbos you try to
be mema'it b'achila. Don't have five
so'in, have three so'in. So maybe here
too, don't have three gragras, only have
two gragras.
Right? You see from the Gemara's
pshitos, a little insight into what the
shaila was.
The shaila was ribba b'shiura, tzayda.
But you see another dimension to it. And
that is the Gemara thinks that shitas
Rabi Shmuel is a little bit of a makor
that maybe you should cut two as opposed
to cutting one. Because in Rabi Shmuel
you see we want less output. Where do
you see it? Three so'in as opposed to
five. The Gemara says what shaikh is.
Over here it's not the three so'in, it's
the three ktziras. It were it's the less
ktzira. It's being mema'it big zero as
opposed to over here where in order to
have less output you'd have to be mouth
so big zero there's no way in the world
that would be the shman either way
moving along we have another Gamora to
do
but the good news is it's actually a
very very light on it so you don't get a
lot of like this in the minnows so
the midst of the carbon number was to
take from the iron that was closest to
Jerusalem so you're supposed to take
from the closest light bigger
let's say what was close to Jerusalem
had not yet ripened so
let's become you can bring from anywhere
else even though there's a mild
to bring it from what's close but it's
not active there was a story in the
one time the came from a place called
so the midst of the carbon number was to
take from the iron that was closest to
Jerusalem so you're supposed to take
from the closest light bigger
let's say what was close to Jerusalem
had not yet ripened so
let's become you can bring from anywhere
else even though there's a mild to bring
it from what's close but it's not active
there was a story in the one time the
came
that it says in the
regarding the Omer
Garis caramel so
caramel is just a way of describing the
kernels right they should be
kernels but we got in the word caramel
as if it said rock Molly that you want
it to be soft we're focusing on the word
rock and if you're going to bring it
from far says the wind is going to cause
it to harden at some point and as a
result it's not going to be caramel so
the closer it comes from the more
caramel it's going to be you buy the
same machine the
space
you have a so you have to take it from
whatever is closest than whatever is
most readily available by the way this
is another in your native another
cuz what's the in your native
right it's learned out
midst but I'll cook
But you could bring it from anywhere. In
fact, there was once a story that it
came from Gagas three fin and the stay
like him once came from the pick of
inside of turn it up so much of this
Hashmonaim
when the family of the Hashmonaim were
fighting and literally killing each
other. So the rest of the story is
actually things that we've spoken about
over the years and really if you learn
safety or see fun Flavius Josephus, he
talks about this miser in very great
detail. The short version is there were
two brothers both descendants from the
mouth of
Hashmonaim. One's name was Hurcanus, the
other one's name was Aristobulus and
they were trying to kill each other. The
bottom line is so what happened was so
Hurcanus
was outside of Jerusalem and Aristobulus
and Aristobulus was inside right
Jerusalem has a it was a fortified city
and Hurcanus was on the outside and
Aristobulus was inside.
Now being that Aristobulus was inside so
he had control over the base of the base
of the bring carbonis. The problem is
they couldn't really import things from
outside Jerusalem because there was a
siege that was being laid by Hurcanus.
So they one of things they had to import
was the animals for the carbon tiger. So
the price is says
every day
they would take
they would take money and they would uh
put it in a cooper and they had this
whole primitive fashion of they would
lower it all the way down the wall down
the
and they would get the dinarim
and they would take the tournament and
they would bring it back in.
There was an old person
who knew
meaning he knew how to communicate with
the that were on the other side.
It was one of these secret languages. He
knew how to communicate. We spoke about
how
is also it's a a royal language, right?
It's the Russian that that could spoke
with to talk to the Naveen with. Like
royals used to have their own language.
That's why lotion is a big deal in
in Yahadus. It's because it represents
uh
it's not just a way of of talking. It
it's a double shawl Hashiva. So, the
Yevanim Khakhmas Yevanis, specifically
the royals amongst the Yevanim, they
used to speak a certain language and
there was a Zaken Echad who was on the
Horkinus on the Aristobulus side who
knew how to communicate with the Khazars
on the other side. So, he was Lo
Khakhmas Yevanis. I'm going to tell you
what he told him. Khaz Manchas was
talking about voida. He says, "You don't
realize. You're literally feeding your
enemy. Because as long as this korban is
being brought inside Yerushalayim, Einam
Sanbe'atchem, you're never going to be
able to conquer Yerushalayim. If you
want to conquer them, what you need to
do is you have to stop giving them
animals." The Macha, the next day,
Shulchan Aruch Magen Avraham Kupa. So,
Aristobulus' guys sent the money, the
Khaz Lechem, and instead of Horkinus
giving them in return the Khaz Lechem,
which is what they used to do every day,
on this day they were Khaz Lechem
Khazir, a pig. Kim Shiga Lechatzi
Khoyma, as soon as the Khazir came
halfway up the wall, Notzi Par Nechayma,
it stuck its nails into the wall of
Yerushalayim. Finis Da Ze'eretz Yisrael
Avameis Parso Avameis Parso, that this
Khayas Meya should do this, it caused
the whole Eretz Yisrael to shake. There
was an earthquake. But Osa Sha'an that
time, Amru the Khakhamim said, "Arishiya
Gadol Khazir, you can't have a Khazir
anywhere in Eretz Yisrael. For Arishiya
Lo Amru the Khakhamim Yevanis." And also
stay away from Khakhamim Yevanis.
Because these were the two ingredients
that caused this terrible Khurban.
Either way, but Osa Sha'an was regarding
that time,
that time when
Horkinus and his army had laid siege on
Yerushalayim, and they destroyed
everything in the surrounding area, that
Shoninu, we learned that Ma'aseh, there
was a story which is about Imrei Megadim
Shreifim Ishte Alechem Bigasei Insechya.
If this is the background, what happened
was, why couldn't they find grain right
outside Yerushalayim? Because everything
had destroyed. Why was it destroyed? It
was because of the siege of Horkinus.
Now, the Gamara goes now and tells us
the rest of the story.
When it came time to bring the carbon
they have a yard
they did not have to bring the carbon
there was no grain there was nothing to
bring from. Akrizus they made this big
Akrizus they said if anyone knows where
there's some grain so we can bring the
carbon please let us know. Asa who
Harsha.
So there was a Harsha that came. Now
this Harsha was Shmaya the
Harsha. He was able to hear he just
couldn't talk. Asa who Harsha Yada Igro.
He put one hand on the roof for Harsha
Yada Igro the other one on a hut. And
he's you know he was trying to like
communicate in this way and tell the
Harsha whatever he was trying to tell
them. So I'm going to mark him. Mark him
was there. And Mark him said me he could
talk to the Shmak Gaga Srifin. Is there
anyone here that knows of a place called
Gaga Srifin? Asa Srifin Gaga is maybe
it's called Srifin Gaga is. Right he he
had a sense that he's probably telling
him Gaga Srif. Right does anyone know of
such a place? But who they did some
Vashka. Who they found a place called
Gaga Srifin and they found the over the
last time they came to bring the
over the
again they didn't know what to do. And
[ __ ] brought seven weeks later. It was
seven weeks later they're in the same
predicament. So again they made the
Asa who Gaga
Harsha so the same Harsha came. Asa in
and he put one hand on his eye for
Harsha Yada the other one Rashi says on
the this is the hole in the door where
they put the bolt where the goes. On my
Mark him so again Mark him was there. He
said to me he could talk to the Shmak in
Asa in. But who for Asa
they were and they found
this Harsha saved the day both times. I
was with regards to the carbon
I was with regards to the
and that's the rest of the story in the
Mishna. Asa in Gaga Srifin the
Harsha in me because Asa in the Gamara
continues. And the Gamara says Shlosh
Nashim. The Asa Shlosh Kinim. in. three
women that walked into the base of
Migdash each bringing kinam. So, what's
a kinam? So, that's tzippor, right?
Birds that are sometimes brought as
korbanos. Khada amra, one woman said,
"L'zeevasi, I'm bringing it because of
my ziva." V'khada amra, "L'yamasi, I'm
bringing it because of yamasi." V'khada
amra, "L'einasi." The other one said
"I'm bringing it for my ein." So, the
sod of me ein, so the oilam that was
there, the kohanim they assume that the
one that said zeevasi is a zava. She
must be a zava. A zava when she finishes
her y'mei ziva has to bring korbanos.
So, she probably came to bring her
korbanos up. The one that said l'yamasi,
it's l'yamasi mamash. Rashi says, "What
is l'yamasi mamash? She fasts kayo." She
must be a zava and she is pouring blood
literally like the yam. And the one that
said l'einasi is again, "L'einasi
mamash." It's also she has her ein,
right? That's a nidda dig lashon and and
this must be what exactly she is doing.
Right, Rashi says, "Hainu nami l'einasi
korban zivasa." Yamish finish The bottom
line is the the animal all there and
they assume that all three of these
women are all zavas and they're all
coming to bring their korbanos up. Now,
what's the korban of a zava? The kul
khada khadas khadaiava. One is a khadas,
one is an oila and that's what they were
going to bring. Amru Mordechai, so this
same Mordechai was there and Mordechai
said, "Shema b'zoyiv zik zik zik." Now,
I'm not so sure you're right. I'm not
sure when she said l'zivasi,
she meant she's a zava
and right now she has to bring the
korban that a zava has to bring. Maybe
what she means was that when she was a
zava, her life was in danger and as a
result she was minadev to bring a korban
as a thank you for the fact that she was
saved and if that's the case, her korban
that she brings is not a khadas and an
oila cuz only oila is brought in a dava.
Khadas is not brought in a dava. All she
brings is a a korban oila. In fact, the
one that said the one that said
l'yamasi, shema b'yam zikna. Maybe she
went on a voyage, she was at sea and her
life was at risk or the one that said
maybe
something wrong with her eye. The cool
way
all they have to bring either way
they did
the
and they found that exactly what
had said was the case
that
this is what we learned in the mission
of
a person whose name was
he was charged of all the kingdom he
communicated with all the that came to
bring the kingdom. And who was it
it was
and
why was it called his name is really so
why call him
because he knew how to get people to to
talk you need to open up something that
was you need to things
and he also knew all the 70 languages so
he would communicate with the people
that would come specifically the women
that came with the kingdom because they
didn't know languages so much so as a
result they sometimes they spoke their
unintended so they come back. And is the
only one that knows how to speak to them
so as a result is the one that's
communicating so when we say was the one
you want to know
is it's really the one second one second
is a member of the Sanhedrin Sanhedrin
didn't all the members of the Sanhedrin
know the 70
don't
you have to be
able to be able to be able to be able to
be able to be able to be able to be able
to be able to be able to be able to be
able to be able to be able to be able to
be able to be able to be able to be able
to be able to be able to be able to be
able to be able to be able to be able to
be able to be able to be able to be able
to be able to be able to be able to be
able to be have stature but
you have to be older but
you have to know
so case there's like a case
that you're dealing with you should be
somewhat
fluent in it you should understand it
the
additional you have to know the 70
and the reason that's important is like
they said but they are totally men so
you should be able to hear directly
shouldn't have to hear from the but the
bottom line is
so
what do you mean I thought everybody
knows this. Talk to your mother. Ella
the Hava bio. Listening now. He,
Zachariah and Mordecai had a very unique
talent. His talent was is that
he knew how to go and unravel the
shyness with Darshan and Darshan it.
Similar to the story that we just had,
right? So we had the the mice and
Mordecai knew that one hand on the eye
and one hand on the bolt, that's iron
seeker. This was a quirk that he had. So
he didn't just know languages like he
knows how to speak, you know, Espanol
and friends French and German and
English and Yiddish.
He he also had this ability to decipher
some of these cryptic ways of
communicating. The Hannah Mordecai
answered for this reason. It says
regarding Mordecai, Mordecai Bilshan.
What's Bilshan? It's this lotion of bio
lotion. He knew how to go ahead and
unravel and to decipher these different
lotions as promised on base on the 5000
was a lot easier and a lot smoother than
almond olive like an hour shorter. But
the bottom line is the bottom line is
what was this last Kamara? The Kamara
told the story
really the rest of the story of my
sister by the street festival and
because of soccer.
And it involved the Harris. A Harris
that was in Madaba and it involved
Mordecai. And then the Kamara digressed
a little bit and talked about Mordecai.
And talked about how Mordecai had the
special choir with the shyness. In fact,
he's Zachariah that's mentioned in the
shyness. He's a lucky name because he's
amazing when it comes to deciphering
language. And even though every member
of the Sanhedrin is, but he's national
card. And the Kamara even told the story
about these three servers that once
came. One said the
Lizzie Vossi, one said Liam Aussie, the
other one said why not see and all the
camera told one way Mordecai told the
other way and he was right. But the
bottom line is is that we had a whole
discussion about Mordecai. So who is
this Mordecai? So if you take a look at
Rashi. Rashi dibra maskan Mordecai,
Rashi says shahu b'me Achashverosh. You
want to know who this Mordecai is? He is
the Mordecai of Purim fame. The Mordecai
of Achashverosh. Take a look at Tosfos.
Tosfos dibra maskan Mordecai pirush
b'kuntres, the who Mordecai shahu b'me
Achashverosh. V'teima hu lo yichye am
kol kach. Mordecai lived so long? How is
this possible? How is it possible,
right? Just to put into perspective,
that Mordecai from the Purim story is
around in the times of the Hashmonaim.
That's fraskworthy, right? Mordecai is
in the Chanukah story. Mordecai is in
the Purim story, right? So, if you
wanted uh, to mish the oitzos a little
bit, here you have it. Here you have
Mordecai in the Chanukah story. What's
going on over here? So, Tosfos says
v'teima hu lo yichye am kol kach.
V'nireh Tosfos has a gishmak'dige
teretz. Al shem Mordecai harishon hoyu
nikra'im hamemunim al sh'mo. V'af isha
ein m'manin ela b'ki'in ba'alei seichel
umada.
The original Mordecai was Mordecai
Bilshan. It has to be that Mordecai.
That's she's coming from. It's that
Mordecai. He knows it from the Gemara.
Mordecai Bilshan. Also, he's a member of
the Sanhedrin. We know Mordecai is a
member of the Sanhedrin, Anshei Knesses
Hagdoloh. And he's p'saki that's
mamuneh. There's nothing to talk about.
But at the same time, at the same time,
every person that got this job, and
every person that was a ba'al lashon,
and every person that would deal with
the kingdom and these things, they took
on the name, the name of Mordecai. And
Mordecai became a name that had a life
of its own. It's a name that's
synonymous with people that are ba'alei
lashon. And that's why this later
Mordecai has the same stellar as the
original Mordecai, but it's not the same
person. Because that Mordecai is
living in the times of the Purim story,
and this Mordecai is living in the times
of the Chanukah story. So, obviously, it
can't be the same Mordecai. Bottom line
is, a very interesting machlokes Rashi
and Tosfos. Also, another interesting
davar b'eita mat'iv, because again,
we're still uh, you know, we're holding
on for dear life, but we're at the end
of Kodesh Adar still. And to have a
Gemara that talks about Mordechai in
Maseches Menachos tucked away, this is
mamesh Dover Be'Ito Motzei. So, we had
everything from the Korban Pesach being
brought to Shma and the Matzos to
Mordechai Bilshan. We're going a little
tzurik tzu veg, cuz we're going a
shtikel backwards, but the bottom line
is
in the spirit of Kodesh Adar and Shlosha
Yamim Kodem LeChag, Dover Be'Ito Motzei.
I know the text that hashtag great, but
it got very late very early or very late
very late. So, we're going to stop here
and be'ezras Hashem pick it up tomorrow.