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Menachos 46
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Today's stuff is Manachos stuff,
Menachos and we are at the last line of
Menachos
the two dots. Today's stuff has been
learned as a school for
a boy who eats
Ben Shiframil. So, the topic of today's
stuff is continuation
of the latter part of yesterday's stuff
and that is the carbonara
that were brought on Shavuos. So, we had
a
interruption of the regular coaching the
here in Manachos. Yesterday, we already
returned to our regular program. Today's
stuff is [snorts] very much a
continuation of that regular program and
that is real coaching the
I think as an introduction to today's
stuff, it's good to go through a few in
the Torah.
Specifically, the
way that the Torah presents the
of Shavuos and the carbonara that was
supposed to be brought on Shavuos in
Parshas Emor. So, this is Gimmel Parshas
the Parshas says
"You should count from the day after
Shavuos."
The Yidden should count from the day
after Shavuos which says means the day
after the first day of
Pesach.
From the day
that
carbonara was brought Shavuos
two months later.
Seven weeks. So, from the day
that
carbonara was brought
two months later,
the Yidden were told to count seven
weeks. Okay,
Shavuos
this
>> [snorts]
>> you should count 50 days. And on that to
do? You're supposed to bring
a carbonara. What kind of carbonara? A
carbonara
carbonara.
The Parshas says
from your midst meaning from the land
from Israel, you should bring
you should bring bread. How many breads?
Two. How many breads? Two. Each one
is going to be made up of two breads.
So, together it's going to be two
breads.
So, they should come from
Shavuos. They should be baked as
Shavuos. They should be brought as
Shavuos.
They should be brought as Shavuos. They
should be brought as Shavuos. They
should be brought as Shavuos.
They should be brought as Shavuos. They
should be brought as Shavuos. They
should be brought
one pair and the two
you
are going to be carbonara
you should
bring carbonara carbonara
you should bring those as well.
Additionally,
you should bring a series of
one goat that's going to be a carbonara
which means carbonara
and then finally, you should also bring
two sheep within the first year of their
lives
>> [snorts]
>> and they're going to be brought as a
carbonara.
The carbonara is then supposed to take
them. Now, what's them? We just
mentioned an 10 animals as an
carbonara one animal as a carbonara and
then the two that were brought as
carbonara.
It's referring to the
these two that were brought as
carbonara you should do now the
carbonara with them carbonara together
with the
carbonara
right on the two carbonara first in the
Parshas.
On this day meaning on this 50th day,
the day that the carbonara is being
brought, so you should declare this day
as a holy day. You
can't do any carbonara. You can't do any
carbonara.
You can't do any carbonara. You can't do
any carbonara.
And then mysteriously, the Parshas just
throws in one idea related to
the idea of madness but either way, the
majority of these that we just read deal
with the carbonara that were brought on
the of Shavuos. And what were the
carbonara? So, if you do a
two breads, what's known as the
carbonara. Additionally, there was an
carbonara and carbonara. The carbonara
was made up of 10 animals carbonara
carbonara carbonara carbonara carbonara
carbonara
>> [snorts]
>> carbonara
carbonara carbonara carbonara
The carbonara was one animal series of
carbonara and the carbonara were two
animals
carbonara.
The Parshas also mentions that there was
carbonara that was done together with
the
and the carbonara.
Now, this carbonara that's mentioned is
generally known as the carbonara.
But really, you see there was much more
than the
carbonara. There was the
carbonara carbonara carbonara carbonara
carbonara and then there were the two
that were brought as carbonara. The
carbonara on
>> [snorts]
>> discussed what
animal is
the
and what is not
the carbonara.
The Parshas
the carbonara carbonara
carbonara
that [snorts] the carbonara
and the carbonara that make up the
carbonara when that carbonara
carbonara
and the
wasn't
the carbonara carbonara carbonara. So,
the and the
were not
the
and the was not
the and the
meaning in the event that you brought
the
or the and not the or vice versa, it's
fine. Meaning the that was brought was a
good and the that was brought was a good
and and the that was brought was a good
so as much as they were all part and
parcel of this one larger this one
umbrella carbonara but in terms of one
being the other, the
carbonara were not the and the
wasn't
What about the
that already the said was a
The said the carbonara and the carbonara
The said that the carbonara
was
the
but the
was not the The is not the meaning in
the event that the
was not brought, then you couldn't bring
the
but the is not the you don't have to
bring the in order to bring the and The
said just the opposite. He said the
carbonara the carbonara
the carbonara
the however was not the The mentioned
two different reasons as to why
would be the way it is but the bottom
line is what emerges is that there's a
connection between the and the
whereas you don't have that same
connection between the
the as in the keep say the
and the
stating that stating that
there's a
between
the and
in terms of practically speaking how
this connection between the and
the play themselves out. According to
the
it's the
that's
the
so there's no if there's no
but you can have
even if there's no According to the it's
just the
opposite. It's the
that the You can't have if there's no
However, the is not the You don't need
in order for there to be
The said that what's the
is
between the
The said it's how to learn the Parshas
that says
So, one of the that we just read
the carbonara
carbonara
and the word we understand means we
The question is is going on the
is going on the Again, this Parshas is
talking about the and the the as in the
keep say
as in the
right the
that's the carbonara
referring to the keep say
The question however is when the Parshas
concludes and says the and
means
is the
saying that the is the
which is
or is the saying that the is the
which is the
One other point that's worth mentioning
before we start the and that is that
even though there's a between the and
the whether the is the and the is the
but one thing is for sure and that is
the was the
So, the is that most that was you
weren't allowed to eat unless something
was first right it's considered and it
needs something to be in [snorts] order
for it to be So, for example in a the is
the as it relates to the it needed the
to be the So, in terms of matter for
sure the is what's the but we're
discussing over here is something else
and that is
one that's
the other meaning I can't have the
without the or vice versa. According to
the it's the that's the and according to
the it's the opposite it's the that's
the On that note, we have another that
continues on this and so the said that
once the and the became one, they have
this energy that binds them. At that
point, they're going to be but that's
only says the Rabbi but that's only says
the Rabbi.
says Rabbi
Yochanan until there's a Zika that's
a them that binds them. Once however
there's a Zika that binds them at that
point for sure the is going to be the
and the is going to be the is a Zika
What exactly is the Zika? So Yochanan
said
So once the was done with the the
with the etc with these two
at that point the two are bound by and
if something would happen to the
everybody would agree that would be
and if something would happen to the
everybody would agree that the would be
I'm not sure what
they had the following
I don't know
is
that something that makes a Zika is that
not something that makes a Zika the said
that one of the that were done on
was the would take the etc and he would
do together with the
So they wanted to know whether the
is a Zika or whether it's not a Zika
with Yochanan you could prove it from
said that the said is a Zika that the is
a Zika is a Zika So you see that is not
a Zika How do you know that because the
was done before the the was done with
the etc while the etc were alive which
by definition means it was done before
the
So the is from the fact that said is a
Zika that means whatever comes before
the is not a Zika because if what comes
even before the is why tell me is a Zika
Say better say that even the
that came before it is a Zika So says
the
you could be
from
who said that is a Zika that is not a
Zika but the says not because
coming by the way What was saying was
the they were trying to understand what
meant I mean
said is a Zika okay fine but their
question was what
meant maybe what meant the is a Zika
What
said that is a Zika and it sounds like
is not Did he mean it direct meaning I'm
telling you for a fact is a Zika and I'm
telling you for a fact is not a Zika
or maybe what to say was that is a Zika
as relates to I'm not sure being that
I'm not sure I can't say it's a Zika I'm
not sure
I'm not sure about I am sure about and
that's why I'm saying is a Zika but just
because said is a Zika doesn't mean that
is not a Zika maybe it's
whether it's a Zika not
either way the says for this we're going
to have to wait for in
order to know
the of this So again we have a in the
between
whether the is the and the is the
meaning if something happens to one does
that disqualify the other or not
said this whole
is until the but once there's
at that point is a Zika
>> [snorts]
>> they were
whether
also holds that is a Zika I said Zika
That was good for their Did he say
because he held that or did he say
because he wasn't sure about So it's
either
wasn't sure about as a result they too
were not sure about
whether it's a Zika or not
the says it's a I'm going to repeat the
Nina the of Yeshua So the says
heard this
and he told
of Yeshua I don't understand the you
know why because the
you
the
The [snorts]
that and argued about their the
whether the the
is the
or whether the is the
was the that says you the
The beginning of the says the
of the the of
the of the
and then it says the of the The is
clearly
talking about after the
right the has a and a
The
is
the of the
the
of the
It's talking about
and then the concludes the of the
Now the
of the is in the of the
Does the mean the and does the mean the
but it [snorts] sounds like this whole
is not the
So
told
I don't understand if you're going to
tell me that is a Zika so how could it
be arguing in what the means when it
said it says
the
That's not the
You're telling me everybody holds that
is a Zika So the this
the
of is not has no
because we know the
and is in the that says the which is
clearly after the because we read the
The is the of the this is the
So you see even if there's a
there's still a
So
told
According to you after
What
you're going to tell me
that this
is talking only about but
but it's not also talking about
It's for sure talking about
as well How do you know for sure talking
about
because the end of the says
the
that the
is
going to go to the
or the etc part of it is going to go to
the
Now when does the carbon go to the
after the after the
after the after the You need the to be
matter which means that the for sure is
talking about after
but also after
Now for
sure
said that [snorts] is a Zika How could
say is a Zika if the
that
and are arguing in is
and that of
is for sure talking about the
and is a Zika
So what do you have to say What
would tell you today if you asked him
this
How could you tell me is a Zika there's
no is is the battleground of this and
it's clearly talking about after How do
I know that because it says and when
does it go to the
It only goes to the
after the
In fact
So
what he would probably tell you is is he
would say
that really the of the
is talking about the
and my of the
I said that was just saying
it means because eventually it's going
to go to the
Meaning
you the of when we say that is
or the is
it's talking about before it's
already
talking about
So why are we saying
because this ultimately will have a
that's going to go to the But we DON'T
MEAN
THIS SECOND when in real time it's it's
something that the
allowed to be from because when we're
saying you when we're saying that one
thing is the other thing is not
we're talking about
So why
is there no
So why are we referring to it as because
the belongs to the the goes to the Are
you telling me you need the
when you do the it's going to go to the
But [snorts] the
the over here is based on the fact that
eventually it's going to go to the
Either way
so too maybe I could tell you that the
of
is referring
to the
because
once you physically would do the
at that point it would be a
and when we say that the
it means
the of again you're going to be the same
way it's something that eventually is
going to go to the The point that the is
just trying to bring out is is that for
sure for sure when it says
the
it doesn't necessarily mean you have to
read it as if the is talking about where
right now it's
right now it's not
That's
from the fact that
and from the fact that
were arguing in this
whether the is
the or the
is the of
What then does it mean when it says
it's something that's eventually going
to go to the but once we're already
being
a little bit as it relates to the
component of it so too we could say the
same thing with regards to the Again
it's a little bit because in the
it says first
and then it says
but at the end of the day there's no
that's the way you have to read
and it could be that once there's a at
that point it would be no
between and
then
the is again what's the the of the
morning
how come
the
the of the is
whether
the also but for sure says the the is
going to ask you a
a from a
Now this is a little bit of a windy
and it's actually discussing not the etc
and the
discussing the Now the
the of
is similar to the etc It's similar to
the etc for two reasons number one the
etc were
the of was also a
they refer to it as
Additionally the etc came along with the
the also came along with
came along with the the 40
So this
is talking about the of
its and the relationship between the the
animal
and the of says the the
is that's true that the
of the of the etc creates a
between it and the
to the point that if one becomes the
other is going to be as well the of and
is not withstanding because that's only
before the but once there's a for sure
there's going to be a
Let me ask you a
a from a
regarding the of
Actually
if
one would be if one of the of the
was
broke before the
of the
Now the is that if one of the of the
breaks so it's a of
Now it happened however before the
shchita. So, the braysa says, "No
worries. You have achana'ah."
F'shoychech, bring another bread, just
replace it. Meaning, until you do the
shchita, the fact that a bread broke
is a problem, but it's easy to correct
because all you need to do is just bring
a new challah. Mishah shochtin nifsal
lachmo, what would be if you did the
shchita already and then it was nifsal
challos? Now, it's a little trickier.
Adam mizoreik, you do the z'rika with
the carbon. V'habasar yochal, you can
even eat the basar. U've'day nidrei
loyotzei, you're not going to be yotzei
your neder. Meaning, the animal is going
to be kosher. You could do the z'rika,
and you could even eat the basar. But,
in terms of your neder, you are chayiv
to to bring a carbon shlamim, a todah,
right? A basar ch'maydis, you're not
yotzei your neder. And the reason is
because you have posul lacham bread. And
now, you can't just simply replace the
bread. That you were able to do if it
broke before the shchita. Once the
shchita happened already, it's not so
simple. In fact, lacham posul, lacham is
a problem. did the z'rika
and then one of the breads broke. So,
then t'rumah sh'leimah al hap'rus. So,
when you give the t'rumas lachmei todah,
right? So, there was a t'rumah that was
given from the lachmei todah to the
kohanim. So, that t'rumah you have to
give from a shalem. That's a halacha.
Rashi says that you were not allowed to
give the kohanim from a broken piece.
You had to give them from a full piece.
So, you t'rumah sh'leimah al hap'rus.
And like this, you're going to go ahead
and you're going to satisfy it. So,
again, the braysa mentioned three
different phases of where it was nifsal
lacham. It was nifsal lacham before the
shchita, just replace the bread. If it
happened noch the shchita before the
z'rika, so then the halacha is you bring
the carbon, but you're not going to
satisfy your chayiv carbon. So, you're
going to bring it like an adavah. But,
you're going to bring the carbon, the
lacham is posul because it was nifsal.
And you're going to again have to bring
a whole new carbon. If you
did the shchita and you even did the
z'rika and then it was nifsal, so then
you were yotzei your chayiv carbon
in terms of the fact that one of the
breads was nifsal. So, that has an
implication in terms of what you give
the kohanim because you're not allowed
to give the kohanim from the p'rus. You
have to give them from the shalem. What
would be if not the bread was nifsal,
but rather it was yotzei? Same scenario.
Actually, shochtin yotzei lachmo. What
would be if before the shchita the
lacham was yotzei? It went outside of
its choymis. And what are the choymis of
the lachmei todah? Lachmei todah was
kosher in Yerushalayim,
so it means it left Yerushalayim. So,
machnisa, you just bring it back in.
F'shoychech, and you shochtin.
Meaning, it was yotzei, so what? Just be
machnisa. I, what do you mean? Isn't
there posul yotzei? Posul yotzei is once
it gets k'dushas haguf, which is once
there was a shchita. But, being that
this happened ad shelo shochta, so
machnisa v'shoychech, it's not a
problem. Mishah shochtin yotzei lachmo,
what would be if it was yotzei after the
shchita?
So, there the halacha is adam mizoreik,
you could do the z'rika. V'habasar
yochal, you could eat the basar.
U've'day nidrei loyotzei, you're not
yotzei your neder. V'lacham posul, the
lacham is going to be posul. So, here
being that you did the shchita, working
backwards, so now already the lacham was
nifsal v'yotzei.
As a result, you can't be yotzei your
chayiv neder because you don't have the
breads. Stating that the carbon itself
is a kosher carbon, so you could do the
z'rika, you could eat the basar even,
RIGHT? THE CARBON'S KOSHER. BUT, in
terms of you satisfying your neder,
that's not something. It's like od lo ba
v'lo shochtin. What would be if it's
nizrak adam? What would be if you did
the z'rika already and then it was
yotzei? So, then t'rumah mashah b'fnim
umashah b'chutz. So, then again, once
you did the z'rika, you're good to go.
The only nafka mina is is that when you
give the t'rumas lachmei todah to the
kohanim, you can't give it to what was
yotzei because that's posul. You have to
give from something that was not yotzei.
Same scenarios. What would be if
actually shochtin nitma lachmo? What
would be if the lacham not it was
nifsal, not it was yotzei, but it became
tamei? And it became tamei before the
shchita. So, maybe lacham acher.
F'shoychech, so you bring new lacham and
you and you shochtin. Mishah shochtin
nitma lachmo, what would be if it became
tamei noch the shchita? So, this is a
little different than the previous
cases. Adam mizoreik,
>> [snorts]
>> v'habasar yochal, v'dein nidrei yotzei.
Now, you are going to be yotzei. I, how
am I being yotzei with lacham that's
tamei? Oh, that's t'zitzis m'ratzah al
hatamei. We know this halacha that
t'zitzis m'ratzah. And being that
t'zitzis is m'ratzah, it's tamei, so
it's not a problem. Aval lacham posul,
you're not going to be
allowed to eat the lacham. The reason is
because t'zitzis m'ratzah that the
korban should be a good korban, but it's
on m'ratzah you should be able to eat to
your door. Nizrak adam, what would be if
you did the z'rika already and then
afterwards one of the breads became
tamei? So, again, you did the z'rika, so
everything is good to go. You t'rumah
min hatorah al hatamei. The only thing
is that when you do the t'rumas lachmei
todah, you give the kohanim his cheilek,
you have to give it from the top. The
bottom line is is we had a a braysa.
It's a long braysa. It discusses three
scenarios and three sub scenarios of
each one of the scenarios. Scenario A is
where the bread was nifsal, one of them.
Scenario B is where one of the breads
was yotzei. Scenario three is where one
of the breads was nitma. Within each
three of these cases where it was
nifsal, it was yotzei, it was nitma, we
have three situations. One is when it
happened before the shchita. One is when
it happened noch the shchita before the
z'rika. And then the third case is when
it happened noch the z'rika. If it
happened before the shchita, it's always
the same thing.
It's always just replace it. Replace the
lacham that broke, replace the lacham
that was yotzei, meaning just bring it
back in, and replace the lacham that
became tamei. Skipping. If it happened
after the z'rika, it's always the same
as well. You're fine. Once you do the
z'rika, you were yotzei your chayiv
neder. You had an obligation to bring a
carbon todah, well you brought your
carbon todah. The only place it has a
nafka mina is when you're going to go
give the kohanim, so you can't give him
from the p'rus, you can't give him from
the yotzei, and you can't give him from
the tamei. So, good. The t'rumas lachmei
todah, that you'll have to make sure you
give him from something that's kosher.
What about the middle case where it
happened in between the shchita, but it
happened
before the z'rika. So, there already has
a nafka mina. In the first case where it
was nifsal after the shchita, but before
the z'rika, so there we say the halacha
is that being that it was nifsal
after the shchita, but also before the
z'rika, so at that point the lacham is
posul. Being that the lacham is posul, I
don't have kosher lacham, I can't just
replace it. As a result, you they you
nidrei loyotzei. Stating that I can do
the z'rika and I can eat the basar
because the carbon itself doesn't become
posul. So, the carbon doesn't become a
carbon posul.
It's a carbon kosher, but in terms of me
satisfying my chayiv, that I can't
because I have lacham that's posul,
right? Became posul noch the z'rika,
it's already after the fact. But, this
is before the z'rika. And I can't just
replace it because
I already [snorts] did the shchita. It
was already kodesh k'dushas haguf. And
as a result, I'm stuck over here. So,
the carbon is kosher, but at the same
time the lacham is posul. You they you
nidrei loyotzei. Same is true where it
was yotzei. Where it's nitma because
t'zitzis m'ratzah, over there it's a
little bit different. Either way, what's
that to do with our sugya?
Tanya is the gemara like this, that if
you're going to tell me that shchita
zoysas z'ika when it comes to the kipsei
atzaros and the shtei lacham, it makes
sense that shchita should also be oysas
z'ika when it comes to the carbon todah
and the lachmei todah. Now, you'll tell
me what shiyachus these are. Two
completely different korbanos. Yes and
no. They both have a a shlamim and
lacham that comes along with it. And as
a result, the gemara feels that these
two things should be somewhat similar
and comparable. So, the gemara asks, "If
shchita zoysas z'ika, if you're going to
tell me shchita zoysas z'ika given the
hechsher k'dushas av,
once the shchita was already done with
the todah, at that point if so the
lacham, the lacham became posul. Is the
posul not in the todah? So, the todah
should also be posul. What's the p'shat
that where if it was nifsal lachmo or if
it was yotzei the lacham, so we say that
the carbon is kosher, but the lacham is
posul. Once you do the shchita, there's
a z'ika between the carbon and the
lacham. Which means that if the lacham
is posul because it's nifsal or because
it was yotzei, then by definition
the sh- carbon [snorts] todah should be
posul as well.
And the reason is because there are
hechsher k'dushas av by the shchita. So,
if shchita zoysas z'ika, how could you
have a scenario where the lacham is
going to be posul and the carbon is
going to be kosher? Now, again, this is
talking about a carbon todah. Rabi
Yochanan said his halacha regarding the
kipsei atzaros, but the gemara holds,
"Hey, hey, it should be the same thing."
And just like Rabi Yochanan says that
even though lacham acher is achfosan,
posul lacham is achfosan, but once the
shchita shchita zoysas z'ika, so if one
is posul, the other one has to be posul.
The gemara assumes the same to be true
regarding the carbon todah. And you see
from this this braysa that it's not the
case. And the gemara shani todah, you
have to say the todah is different. By
the todah, we don't say this halacha
that shchita zoysas z'ika. By the todah,
even if the lacham becomes posul, still
the carbon could be kosher. And the
reason is rachmana k'arya shlamim
because the Torah refers to the todah as
a shlamim. It says, "Al zevach todah
shlamo." A man shlamim crave a lacham. A
todah crave a lacham. Just like you find
a shlamim that generally is brought
without bread, so too this todah can
also be brought without bread. So, it's
true really the shchita should be oysas
z'ika, but there's a special din that
the Torah calls it a shlamim. And a
shlamim generally doesn't have bread.
So, this carbon todah
as a shlamim is not going to have to
have bread either. So, usually you think
of the todah with the breads. But, from
the fact the Torah calls it a shlamim,
so there's like a a tzad, there's a a
perspective that you could look at this
todah as not having any breads. And so,
for that reason in this situation it's
not going to be oysas z'ika. Tosfos is
the bottom Tosfos the Yom it asks the
very very obvious question. And that is
that what do you mean? The kipsei
atzaros
is also a shlamim. Rachmana k'arya
shlamim and the shlamim doesn't have
bread. Kipsei atzaros is also a shlamim.
So, Tosfos has two chilukim. One chiluk
Tosfos says is that a regular shlamim
was kodshim kalim. The kipsei atzaros
was kodshim kadashim. So, this is not a
regular shlamim. Inami, a regular
shlamim was a shlamei yachid, and this
was a shlamei tzibur. Again, it's
different. So, being that the kipsei
atzaros was a different type of shlamim,
so you don't have this inyan of rachmana
k'arya shlamim to compare it to a
regular shlamim. There's no shiyachus to
a regular shlamim. It's called a
shlamim, but it's very different. A
regular shlamim is a yachid. A regular
shlamim is kodshim kalim. This is a
tzibur. This is kodshim kadashim.
Because it's different than your regular
shlamim, so that reason this is not
really a t'shuvah. Zog the gemara.
Moving on. Amora Rabi Yirmiyah. Rabi
Yirmiyah said, "In kipsei atzaros zoysas
z'ika." So, again, Rabi Yochanan said
that shchita zoysas z'ika in Bavel and
in my rubber? What about Tnuva?
They weren't sure. And the Gamara said
the Safed was Gopher and what Yochana
meant when he said Schitt's Creek is a
Zika. Did he mean Schitt's Creek is a
Zika and not Tnuva? Or did he mean
Schitt's Creek is not Tnuva? So Rebbe
Yermiya said on the side that Tnuva is a
Zika.
That if the Lechem would be lost, Rashi
says after the Tnuva critical.
>> [snorts]
>> So the did the Tnuva with the Kipsei
Atzaros and with the Lechem.
And then after the Tnuva the Lechem got
lost. On the side Rebbe Yermiya said
that Tnuva is a Zika.
Then
of the Kvasim. At that point the Kvasim
are done. Of the Kvasim of the Lechem.
The Lechem is going to be done, right?
That's easy because it's a Zika. They're
bound by each other. And as a result you
lose one, you lost the other. Because if
you lose one, you don't have it. So the
males can be empty. Tnuva is not a Zika.
What would be Rebbe Yermiya if Tnuva is
not a Zika? And he view Lechem Kvasim.
And then the brought the Lechem and the
Kvasim for one for and he did the Tnuva.
Okay. Again, Tnuva is not a Zika. But
the Lechem and the Lechem got lost. The
heavy Lechem after. And now he went
ahead and he brought another Lechem
which he could do because if Tnuva is
not a Zika. So just because something
happened to the Lechem and you have the
Kvasim doesn't mean all is lost, right?
So what you do is you go and you replace
the Lechem that was lost. The Rebbe says
that Lechem that you're replacing is it
Tnuva or not Tnuva? Do you have to do
Tnuva with it or do you not have to do
Tnuva with it? So again, if you hold
that Tnuva is a Zika, then if the Lechem
gets lost, then the Kvasim are possible.
Or if the Kvasim gets lost, the Lechem
are possible. So you have to get rid of
the Kvasim, get rid of the Lechem, bring
new Kvasim, new Lechem, do a new Tnuva,
right? Start all over again. The Rebbe
Yermiya has is what would be if Tnuva is
not a Zika? And now something happened
to the Lechem. I did the Tnuva with the
Kvasim and the Lechem and something
happened to the Lechem. So I bring new
Lechem. I If the Lechem got lost,
doesn't that mean the Kvasim are
possible? Not because Tnuva is not a
Zika. So if Tnuva is not a Zika, Tnuva
in and of itself is not going to be an
issue. Fine. So the question then is now
that I go ahead and I bring the new
Lechem.
Right? Do I have to do Tnuva with the
new Lechem or not? I say a Lechem Tnuva
or not Tnuva. Now Rebbe Yermiya explains
of the Kvasim. In the event that the
Kvasim were lost like the law, I would
not have my way Tnuva. For sure you
would need Tnuva. Meaning the fact that
I did Tnuva with the original Kvasim is
for sure not going to help me for these
Kvasim. The Kvasim for sure would need
Tnuva. Keep it by law of the Lechem. My
law is only on the Lechem. Do we say
that being that I did Tnuva with the
original Lechem, so I don't have to do
Tnuva again with this Lechem or no? That
Tnuva was done with that Lechem. I need
to go ahead and do Tnuva now with this
Lechem. Now why was it possible to Rebbe
Yermiya that the Kvasim for sure would
have to do a new Tnuva? But as it
relates to the Lechem, he's not sure. So
Rashi says two reasons. One One reason
Rashi says is is because the Kvasim were
matter the Lechem. And being that the
Kvasim were matter the Lechem, so for
sure the Kvasim which is being matter,
these specific Kvasim which are going to
be matter would have to have a Tnuva.
Additionally,
Rashi says that the Iker words the
Hainiv are referring to the Kvasim. The
Hainiv Koin Oisam is referring to the
Kvasim. And then it says Al Lechem
Habikur. But the Hainiv Koin Oisam is
actually referring to the Kvasim. And so
for sure these Kvasim that ultimately
are going to be the Kvasim would require
a Tnuva. I can't say oh the original
Kvasim that got lost had a Tnuva. This
is going to be fine. But keep it by law
of the Lechem. The Lechem is not the
matter. And the Iker Tnuva was said
regarding the Kvasim not the Lechem. So
maybe as long as the original Lechem had
Tnuva. Even though I'm not using those
Lechem now because they got lost. But at
the same time I did a Tnuva already.
Additionally, the Gamara says Rebbe Meir
says keep it by law. According to Rebbe
Meir, I'm not asking the Shaila of the
Kvasim Iker because Rebbe Meir said that
the Kvasim is the Iker. So again, Rebbe
Meir was is the Lechem Iker or is the
Kvasim Iker? Right? Rebbe held that the
Lechem is the Kvasim not the other way
around. And Rebbe Meir said the Kvasim
is the Lechem. So according to Rebbe
Meir
that holds the Kvasim is Iker, there's
no Shaila. Because if the Kvasim is the
Iker, the Lechem is the Tofa. For sure I
wouldn't have to do a new Tnuva on the
Lechem. Keep it by law of the Kvasim.
The Shaila is according to Rebbe Meir
who holds that the Lechem is the Iker.
What's the law of the Lechem by Tnuva?
Do we say that being that the Lechem is
the Iker, so I have to do Tnuva on this
Lechem? Even though I did a Tnuva on the
original Lechem with this Lechem I
didn't do a Tnuva yet. I don't keep it
in my team in the day Kvasim. Or do we
say that being that the matter of the
Lechem is really the Kvasim? And the
Kvasim
have the Tnuva.
I don't need to do do Tnuva.
This was a Tnuva.
Rebbe Yermiya Shaila. And that is Rebbe
Yermiya wanted to know on the side that
Tnuva is not a Zika. If I did the Tnuva
with the Kvasim and the Lechem and then
I lost the Lechem. So I'm going to
replace the Lechem. If Tnuva was a Zika
I couldn't replace the Lechem. But Tnuva
is not a Zika. So I'm just going to
replace the Lechem. So I'm going to have
Kvasim that I did Tnuva with already and
now I have new Lechem. Do I have to do a
Tnuva with this Lechem? Or do I not have
to do a Tnuva with this Lechem? That's
the Shaila. Do you say I did the Tnuva
with the Kvasim and I even did the Tnuva
with the original Lechem. So do Maybe I
don't have to do a Tnuva with this
Lechem. Or maybe not. Maybe I do have to
do a Tnuva with this Lechem. And the
Gamara just had two qualifications in
the Shaila. One qualification was that
the Shaila was only on the Lechem side
not on the Kvasim side. That's possible
if the Kvasim would get lost.
I [snorts] and I'm bringing new Kvasim I
would have to do a new Tnuva with this
Kvasim. You can't say I did a Tnuva with
the Lechem and I did a Tnuva with the
original Kvasim. No, the Kvasim for sure
would need a Tnuva. The Shaila was only
on the Lechem. And why is the Kvasim
different? Number one because it's the
matter. Number two the Iker Tnuva is
said with regard to the Kvasim.
Additionally, the whole Shaila was
according to Rebbe Meir that the Kvasim
is the Iker. Then it's possible there's
no Shaila. Keep it by law of Rebbe Meir
that holds the Lechem is the Iker. Do
you say being that the Lechem is the
Iker that the Lechem needs a Tnuva?
Or do you say at the end of the day as
much as the Lechem is the Iker as in the
Lechem is the Kvasim. But the Kvasim are
still the matter. And being that the
matter already had its Tnuva, so that in
and of itself is going to be okay.
Again, the law of
Rebbe Yermiya is definitely something
that requires a little bit of viewing.
Either way the Gamara says for this
Shaila we're going to have to wait for
Elijah take two. I'm going to lay a by
Rebbe. One more Gamara. Rebbe told Rebbe
Meir my schnoz snake Kvasim the Kachi
Lechem Akfi. O my schnoz Shiva Kvasim
the Ailim.
The [snorts] Roy Mikachi Lechem the Lo
Akfi.
So we went through the introduction to
the Dof.
The
Avoyda in the Beis Hamikdash on Shavuos
was unique. There was a special carbon
that was brought. Specifically, there
were Shivas Kvasim Tmimim Bnei Shono Par
Ben Echad V'eilim Shnayim. 10 animals,
seven sheep, a bull and two rams that
made up the Oila.
>> [snorts]
>> There was a
Se'ir Eizan Echad Chatos. And then there
were Shnei Kvasim Bnei Shono that were
brought as a Shlamim. That Shlamim was
very unique. It's Kodesh Kodashim.
Ordinarily
Ordinarily Shlamim is Kodesh Kodashim.
Additionally it was a Carbon Tzibur.
Ordinarily Shlamim is a Carbon Yochid.
And then finally together that there was
a Shteiy Lechem. We saw in the Mishnah
the opening line of the Mishnah Ha Par
Ba'eilim Kvasim Im Akfin Es Ha Lechem
V'lo Ha Lechem Ma'akfin. When it comes
to the Lechem and the Shlamim the Kipsei
Atzaros that's Rebbe Meir what's what.
So Rebbe turns to Rebbe
and he says I'm not really sure that I
understand. Why is there this very
special relationship between the the
Kipsei Atzaros and the Lechem in that
they're so uniquely
bound by each other as opposed to the
other animals that were brought where
you don't find that. Now the truth is
this connection that you find with the
Kipsei Atzaros and the Lechem is true
with regard to the law of the Mishnah,
right? One's the other.
What's what? But you see it even before
that. You see it in that the Lechem the
Shteiy Lechem get its Kedusha through
the Shchita of the Kipsei Atzaros.
Something that we're going to go through
in a lot more detail in the coming Dof.
But it's the Shchita of the Kipsei
Atzaros that was Mekadesh the Shteiy
Lechem. It's not the Shchita of the Oila
and the Chatos. It's the Shchita of the
Kipsei Atzaros. And this is all included
in Rebbe's question to Rebbe. My schnoz
snake Kvasim the Mikachi Lechem. Number
one why is it Mikadesh the Lechem?
Number two Akfi. You find this idea of
it of it being Akfi as opposed to as
opposed to when it comes to the Shiva
[snorts] Kvasim and the Par Ailim. The
Lo Mikachi Lechem. It's not Mikadesh
Lechem. Lo Akfi. It's not Akfi. Rebbe
told him I'll tell you why. Ha'oilam
Kulo Akfi Tnuva. You see it from the
Torah because the Torah said that
there's a Mitzva of Tnuva. And what was
the Tnuva? The Hainiv Koin Oisam Al
Lechem Habikurim Tnuva
Al Shnei Kvasim. It's the Kipsei Atzaros
together with the Shteiy Lechem. There
was no Tnuva that was done with the Oila
and the Chatos. It was done with the
Shlamim. That's the Shchita. But Rebbe
followed up and he told him
the Carbon Todah Kulo Akfi Tnuva. Where
there's no Tnuva that was done between
the Todah itself and the Lachmi Todah.
U'mikacho U'ma'akfi. And still you see
it's Mikadesh and U'ma'akfi. You can't
tell me that it's Mikadesh [snorts] and
U'ma'akfi because of the Tnuva. Because
I would
have a situation where there's no Tnuva
at all and still you see it's Mikadesh
and U'ma'akfi. So the reason must be
something else. Elo Todah. So Rebbe said
it must be something else. It's like the
Todah the Shlamim and the Shlamim. Okay,
you're bringing me Todah. And maybe
that's the right answer. He said the
Todah you see that the Carbon and the
Lachmi Todah are Mikadesh and U'ma'akfi.
>> [snorts]
>> And what is the Todah? It's a Shlamim.
Oh, so too here when it comes to the
Kipsei Atzaros it's the Shlamim that's
going to have the din to be Mikadesh and
U'ma'akfi. But he told him don't tell me
like Rebbe Meir said.
The Kachi and the
Shlamim by the Todah the reason it's the
Todah and nothing else because there is
nothing else. All it is is a Shlamim.
But over here where you have a Shlamim
and you have an Oila and a Chatos, maybe
it should be everything. It should an be
the
Shlamim. Lo choir to be everything else.
You can't tell me the mccarter that the
schlemiel is the one is from the tiger
because that's ain't done in actually
right over there all you have is the
schlemiel. Over here you have other
carbonas as well. I look at the mccarter
from the island nasa. The island
[snorts] nasa was also a carbon
schlemiel so the nasa used to bring
different carbonas by schlemiel since
you're right. One of them was an aisle
and the aisle came together with breads.
Now that was a schlemiel that had bread
so my aisle nasa
I forgot the kiss my hero even though
there were other carbonas right the nasa
used to bring a hat is on the schlemiel.
So it's not only the aisle nasa it's not
only the schlemiel there's other
carbonas as well and still even though
there's other carbonas it's schlemiel
who the mccarter media light is
schlemiel that's mccarter there's
nothing else. So
so too when it comes to the kiss of
series loish now it's going to be the
same way. See you want to know why it's
the schlemiel that's mccarter and I give
and it's not the other carbonas we learn
from the aisle nasa. The aisle nasa had
many carbonas but it's the schlemiel
that talks to the breads. So [snorts]
too when it comes
to the kiss of series it's going to be
the schlemiel that talked to the breads.
Says the mara of a schlemiel
the gufa by the aisle nasa how do you
know it's only the aisle nasa maybe it's
the other carbonas the tanya we learn
from the brisa it says the aisle nasa
the schlemiel
aisle nasa
so we learn from here
we shall have all
aisle the talks about the schlemiel and
the talks about the schlemiel so you see
from here clearly that the schlemiel and
the
are totally separate
schlemiel shall have all
aisle and which aspect of the aisle is
it? It says schlemiel which aisle
mccarter that's how I know it's only
so it's the of the aisle the for that
reason
the schlemiel
but the bottom line is the relationship
between the aisle nasa which is a
schlemiel and the breads is
classic classic the relationship between
the schlemiel and the schlemiel and the
breads is classic because aisle the
schlemiel
there were other carbonas there was an
hat is as well but which carbon of the
aisle nasa talked to the bread? It was
the schlemiel there I learned that the
same is going to be true with regards to
the kiss of series even though it was an
and a schlemiel but which is it that's
going to talk to the breads? It's the
schlemiel that's how I know about this
special relationship either way the
topic of the was the idea of the kiss of
series
at series specifically it's relationship
to the breads and the missionary ready
we see that the is not the and the is
not the because of the giver
primary topic of the was
the member and that is this whole of the
member
because [snorts]
this is only up until the
but once you have the
at that point the creates a
the they had it could be the
held that even the of the giver but
[snorts] he wasn't sure about it and
that's why he didn't say it because he
couldn't say it emphatically the of the
maybe maybe not either way the of the
giver of the giver that was the topic of
today's tomorrow's is
very much going to be a continuation of
this now