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Hello everyone and welcome back to
Inside Art Scroll where the books you
read and the people who write them come
to life. Today we are joined by prolific
author renowned writer Yonas and Rosen
Bloom who's kind enough to join us from
his home in Jerusalem. Thank you Jonas
for joining us. So we're here today to
discuss a brand new wonderful book of
yours called a tap on the
shoulder about the life and times of
Rabbi Mayor Schuster. Let's start off
with your connection to Rabbi Schuster.
Did you know Rabbi Schuster during his
lifetime and how did you get to write a
biography about this legendary Kiru
pioneer? Well, I did know Rabbi
Schuster. I first uh when my wife and I
came to Israel in
1979, we went into Osame. Uh we came
expect expecting to only stay for the
summer and we came into or
uh shortly thereafter they gave us an
apartment and shortly after that Rabbi
Schustster would uh start calling us and
asking us if we could take Shabas
guests. I mean we were very new we were
very raw ballet chuba but he did ask us
to take uh Shabas guest from a very
early stage. So, uh, what would happen
is on Thursday night he would the phone
would ring and my wife or I would pick
it up and there'd be absolute silence on
the line and I learned to say, "Is that
you, Rabbi Schustster?" And then he
said, "Oh, yeah, yeah. How many can you
take on on uh uh Le Shabas?" And I would
think to myself, how could it be that
somebody who can't speak and initiate a
conversation over the phone with
somebody he knows could not could go up
to dozens and dozens of complete
strangers every day, every single day
for 25 years. Uh, and he never really
became that much more articulate or that
much glibber. He never became more glib
in his speech. Now the truth is that's
not the first time I met Rabbi Schuster.
In 1976 I had finished law school. I was
taking a year off before practicing law
and I was in Ulan in Jerus Jerusalem's
Baka neighborhood. And during lunch
break one day the young men and young
women were sitting out sunning
themselves and conversing. And all of a
sudden Rabbi Schustster appears on the
scene. And one thing I can assure you is
that nobody in that group was terribly
interested in having either their
sunning or their conversation
interrupted by a uh a
uh black attired uh individual. And uh
they basically this is one thing I
learned about Rabbi Schustster early on.
You could not insult him. You could not
embarrass him. Nothing nothing deterred
him and the insults that might have been
cast at him. I pray that none of them
came from me. I wish I was totally sure
on that score.
But I do remember that he left with one
young man who 20 years later I read in
the newspaper was a rabbi on a uh on a
moshab in Israel. Within three years of
that encounter, my wife and I were
already taking shabas guests from him.
So I had a an ongoing relationship with
Rabbi Schustster for many years. The
truth is I always expected to write
about Rabbi Schuster. He was always part
of a speech I would give about people
who changed the world not by virtue of
any extraordinary abilities or
self-evidently extraordinary abilities
but because of their sheer determination
or whatever we'll discuss this his siata
desmaya they're able to be major
historical figures and I had a whole
list of people I mean Mike Tress was as
was another example of somebody like
that but I had been drawing up lists for
years of what I thought would be a
compilation in which Rabbi Schuster
would be 20 pages. Um I wasn't that
confident that I could write a whole
book uh about him tapping people on the
shoulder and saying uh would you like to
meet a wise man? Are you Jewish? Would
you like to know something more about
your Judaism? Would you are you
interested in knowing about God? I mean
I didn't think I could get a whole book
out of it. I will tell you there was my
almost my last conversation with uh
Ramir Zadoitz. He told me the book has
to be at least 250 pages and I said uh
Rome I don't know. I mean I'm just I'm
just not sure about that. I can't uh it
brook hashem the book is much longer
than that and it didn't and it wasn't a
problem uh because it is also the an the
book is really an account of a magical
era in chuva that's actually part of the
subtitle a magical era of chuva it's one
that my wife and I were very much part
of so it's it's close to me in a way
maybe that nothing else I've ever
written has been close to me because I'm
writing about my generation, the
generation that came into yeshivas
between
1972 and the mid 90s things started to
taper off a little bit and they were
basically killed by the second inifat in
2000. But so many of the people in the
book are people that are friends of
mine. I've you know we went through the
major changes in our lives together
right now. Now Reb mayor's reb's foray
into Kir began in the early 1970s. He
was nifter in 2014. What prompted the
writing of the book at this point in
time?
You mean in 2021 or in 2014? 2021. The
book slept a well, the book slept a
little bit as my it remarkable how books
have tended to take a lot longer to
finish. When I did the Rebakov book, my
first uh first with art scroll first
book at all, it took me nine months and
I was totally immersed.
Uh today I'm older, lazier and uh and
I'm writing a lot of columns at the same
time. So I can't immerse myself in the
same in the same way. This book started
almost immediately after his passing. I
don't remember whether I contacted
Rebbitson Schustster or she contacted
me. But we had both thought about the
possibility. It was something that you
know arose very quickly. I in fact went
out and tried to solicit the first
contribution uh of somebody I knew was
extremely close to to our mayor and
would want such of such a book. So I
started thinking about it immediately
upon his passing. Uh, and in the end,
uh, somebody had to light my feet to the
fire when it eventually happened. Like,
it was written almost as fast as the
Rebako book when we finally put
everything together and got going. Now,
you referred before to the fact that Reb
mayor was not the most charismatic
person. The book highlights how he was
not necessarily articulate. He wasn't
necessarily the most polished tier of
activist. And yet, he was able to draw
people in. and you recount story after
story about how he would tap someone on
the shoulder and ask them if they would
want to meet a wise man or come to a
yeshiva and he'd literally be 10 feet
ahead of them and he's running away from
them almost. Um, what do you think was
his secret despite his lack of polish to
become perhaps and and I'd love to hear
your opinion on whether he's the
greatest contemporary
modern-day individual Macarv?
Okay, let me answer the last question
first. The answer to the last question
is no. He he was part nobody and he
would have rejected the idea. In any
event, part of his greatness is that he
had no ego. He had no need to be the one
who was going to introduce the whoever
he met at the hotel or at the central
bus station. He had no need to be the
one who was going to be mar of them. He
was content to get them to a yeshiva to
get them. I mean, it's not that he
didn't do other things. He built the
heritage house. He created an Israeli
program in the 2000s, but he didn't have
to be the star. He never made himself a
star. He never talked about himself. He
never used the word
I. He wasn't the He wasn't a marb in the
same sense that Rab Noah Weinberg for
instance was a marb. Somebody who
convinced people to change their lives.
He was the he took a specific role did
it better than anybody else did. Would
you describe him as the facilitator?
Yeah, the he was you know getting
somebody in he was the catalyst. He
getting people into these shiva is
perhaps the most difficult step. You
know, every day when we were in the Orth
Midash, we would see him pull up in a
cab. A group of here's suit young men
would get out looking quite confused.
Where are they? What's happening? And uh
and we called him the pied piper. We
could not understand. And he'd sometimes
show up many times a day. At N Yusha,
the largest women's
b seminary for Balo Chuva. Um, the head
of the beginner's program said, "Every
single woman who came in said the same
thing." I would never get in a car with
a strange man. I would never get in a
car with a strange man. And yet they
did. And here the secret of his success
was his very lack of charisma, his very
lack of uh, you know, glib speech. They
felt, okay, he's not trying to sell me a
line. He's not somebody I have to be
worried about. And plus he would race
ahead of them by 15 feet. He never
walked with them. He walked he raced
ahead of them. One time Dove Wallowitz
who um who purchased the building for
the uh the boys hostel the heritage
house boy men's hostel he said to Raf
Schlommo Fryfeld Zacra who was his rebi
he said I just can't understand how he's
successful. He has no charisma
whatsoever.
And R Fryfeld who was a large and
powerful man banged his head down hand
his hand down and he said charisma never
made anybody
fume.
Caring makes people f. People understood
that he cared about them in a way that
no one else had ever cared about him.
This was a common statement. I felt he
cared about me and my nishama in a way
no one else ever had. There's a woman,
she was a a road scholar candidate, she
was in the steps of the uh of the old
city and she saw how painful and
difficult it was for him to speak to her
and she and she said to herself, I just
imagine how much this how important this
must be to him that he's willing to talk
to me and force himself to speak to me.
And then it ca another thought came into
her mind if he's willing to put himself
through this. She didn't know how many
times a day or how many years he never
took a vacation. He never uh uh for the
first 14 years of his activity never
left there at Israel until he had to
start doing
fundraising. And she said if he's doing
this and this poor
inarticulate somewhat awkward gangly
figure is doing this then he must care
about my nishama more than anybody has
ever cared about my nishama. Now, I
found it fascinating that you mentioned
in the book that it was kind of
difficult to find out information about
Rib Mayor's younger years. Why was that?
And how did you come up with the
information that you did glean as to
Ray's upbringing?
Listen, we really know very little about
his upbringing. There's only one real
interview in the first chapter of the
Milwaukee chapter. the I interviewed
maybe two or three people who knew him
in that period. His best friend Jerry
Glazer. The most important interview for
that was certainly Rabbi Dr. uh Shia
Turski who was his first rebby in uh who
ran the afterchool talmura in his
father's shaw. He knew Romeor at that
age but he was painfully shy at that age
as well. We know very little. Then he
went to to Chicago to the Hebrew Academy
which endormed in the Skooki Yeshiva and
again no one remembers him really much.
They remember very little about him
except his fervor in of his davining
that he always learned with a hat on in
the base midish. There are more people
who remember him from Nar Israel and I
was able to find a number of them. Rab
Schlommo Porter who actually is from
Milwaukee and followed him to Chicago
was somewhat younger and then went to
Baltimore. um uh Rafaim Cass who was the
uh person who who first brought him to
the cotel and whom he went on his first
visits to the cotel but there was really
not much information about his family he
never talked about his family he said
the only thing he would say is that they
were good people but uh it wasn't a
religious family had a religious
grandmother and
uh there wasn't I I glean very little
there's you know with Rabbi Tski and uh
Rabbi Dr. Turski gave me uh Zacra was
able to give me some background on the
on the Milwaukee community of that time.
So I was able to put him in a context,
but I wasn't really I don't know very
much about his childhood. And I know
that it would have been very interesting
either. He's not he was not a person who
who reflected about himself or ever
talked about
himself. Mayor Mayor didn't talk was one
of the lines that his wife said. Mayor
did not talk. He did not talk about
himself. He never used the word I. He
didn't discuss his
achievements. From reading your
descriptions of his years in Israel, he
was described as the ultimate Masmid. He
was very close to the Rash of Rudman to
Rav Chronlass. And anyone who knew him
from that period of time would have
said, "Okay, here's a man who's going to
have a career perhaps in Kyle, right? Is
that would you say that's correct?
I think in his day in in in Ner Israel
that the number of people who went into
Kell was very small. It wasn't Kell was
not a phenomenon in 1960 when he arrived
at Ner Israel. Um he probably he might
have tried teaching in some way but it
would have been difficult for him. He
was artistic. He was artistic and he
thought maybe there would be some kind
of parnasa in doing handcrafted designed
kubot. That was one thing that he
thought about. He had a teaching
certificate from Torah Masaura, but
um it's hard to know. Rabul Bloom, Rabbi
Schmoo told me he would certainly have
been
uh voted the least likely to succeed in
his class. Not because he wasn't
intelligent, not because of any, you
know, any lack of of abilities, but he
was he his ability to to connect to
people was somewhat limited. He took a
tinus dur every shabas and he would sit
in the base midrash whenever the other
bakr went out to their various rebay. He
stayed in the base midrash. He ate and
and then went to the base midish and he
would pass out stellidora cookies to
anybody who would give him a devarator
or pass out some dates to anybody who
would give him a devartor. But he
wouldn't speak he took a tinus dour. Um
I don't know how close he was to to Rav
Rutderman. He was certainly close to
Ravd chron glass. That was certainly the
figure who remained the most important
figure, the most important model for him
throughout his life and certainly the
idea that an idea that Rabd spoke about
a great deal that everybody has a
mission in life. You'll be judged by how
well you you fulfill that mission by
nothing else. It's not somebody else's
mission. It's your mission. Your mission
doesn't happen. describe you describe in
the book how he was shy at
everything except for davening.
Apparently when it came to davining
whatever inhibited nature he had he let
his guard down. Talk about that because
you do highlight that several times in
the book. He was the least inhibited
davener I ever saw. He always davened
from the front in the b when he was in a
base midteraven from the front because
he didn't want people turning around and
staring at him. He simply could not
contain himself as one person put
it. He would look up. He would uh and
and when he finished dabbing, if he was
dabbing from the um you would look
around and you'd expect to see Mashiach
coming. You could not ex think that
Mashiach wasn't coming. People who
hosted him in America on his fundraising
trips, even if they were even if they
were two floors below, they'd hurt hear
him early in the morning stomping and
banging and shouting.
People said if you didn't see him bench,
you never saw benching. I mean, he would
clap his hands before he would bench
because he was so excited to be able to
dab. The hosts talk about their children
still dabbing. They still bench the way
they saw a mayor bench. It was it was a
transformative event. As one young man
said upon watching him dabbing, he he
said, "I learned two things from Mr.
Davin. There's a ribonos alum and this
man knows him well. Now people love
numbers. They love statistics. Do we
have any idea of just how many people
Reb Mayor touched and influenced and
obviously indirectly influenced? Do we
have any idea just to gauge how much of
an impact RER had from when he first
tapped that first Jew on the shoulder in
1971 like you said when he was brought
by Rayim Cass till the early 2000s till
he was unable to do it anymore once his
final illness set in.
Depends on what you mean by influence
because let's say he talked to 10 people
a day and he talked to many more. You
just make a keshbon up until 1984, we're
talking about over 50,000 people that he
had some contact with. And as he used to
say, if they have a better impression of
what of a fru that's also an effect, but
it's so hard to to break it down to
numbers, what Mendel Weinbach, the
Roshibet or said, the Bali Chuba
institutions as we know them would not
exist if it weren't for Ramor Schuster.
But if we talk about sheer numbers,
we're talking in the tens of thousands.
One summer in Heritage House, there were
a thousand people who came through the
doors, I think, of the women's heritage
house. And every one of them went to
seminary at some point over the course
over the course of that summer. They all
experienced the Shabas. How many people
did he bring for Shabas? There were
sometimes between 50 and 100 people he
would be leading as he would disperse
them at one house after another on
Shabas. But you know then there are the
people then there the children of those
people and then there's all the people
that the the the the
uh and then there's the star catches.
Let's not ignore the fact that so many
of the people that he brought into the
yeshiva for the first time went on to be
superstars in the in in in our modern
Jewish world. I mean Lori Patnik, the
founder of the Jewish women's uh
renaissance project uh he met her on a
night at the hotel. She was fleeing from
an Arab hostel. It was raining out a
dreary rainy night. Nobody was there.
There were no passers by. Why he was
standing sentinel at the at the Koto
makes no sense
whatsoever. But she saw him and she
recognized him because her sister had
become religious a year before and had
invited him when he was in Toronto on a
fundraising trip had invited Lori to a
Shabaton and she went up to him and
said, "Do you remember me? I met you in
such and such place." And then he got
that night she went to Na Jerusalem
eventually ended up at IAT another
seminary the Ishur women's
seminary I mean just her impact alone
but you have Schlomma Goldberg a major
Mhanak you have Nakam Braverman who
founded HLA which became one of the
biggest and most powerful branches of
Aish you have authors Shiman Aposdorf
who's written for him that have sold
250,000 copies copies. You I mean Artsko
can certainly appreciate it what it
means to have sold a quarter of a
million copies of books like the
uh you know his his survivors guide to
Roshan or Survivor's Guide to Yum Kipper
things that are passed out in in bulk by
every almost every Kiru organization.
You have a Jeremy Kagan who's won the
national book award and is a runs a
seminary in Jerusalem. This the number
of stars who came through the number of
families who became entire families. One
person came in and then their siblings
came. It's
it's you. It's very hard. I say in the
pre preface I once was at a a a vort for
a vort for a friend of mine Balchuva and
somebody who I knew from Kolo came in I
knew he wasn't a Balchuva and I knew
they could have never learned in the
same base Midrush and I asked him I had
sat next to this the second person who
came in we had sat together at Rabi
Kushalvkis for many years and I said
Robit how do you come to this he said
because the first family that he brought
that Gishin came to was us. So many
people in Jerusalem date themselves like
the first Shabas, the first Shabas host.
Who did Ra Mayor bring them to? He was
an integral part. When I did the
biography of Rab Noah Weinberg, most
people skip the first step. They don't
even say I was brought to the yeshiva by
Rab Noah by by Rab Mayor Schuster. It's
like understood. It's like starting the
fairy tale once upon a time. You know it
already. Everybody was brought by Rab
Mayor Schuster. And when Ravnak would
talk about the power of one, the power
of one person to change the world, his
example was always Ra Mayor Schustster.
He was the example of one person who
could change the world and it had
nothing to do with
anything any particular natural
abilities. As Rab Noah always
emphasized, he always would ask his
students, "If Hashem were helping you,
could you do it? You say you can't do
it, but if Hashem were doing it for you
or doing it with you, could you do it?
So, of course, the answer to to that is
yes. The power what he meant by the
power of one was the power of one. Ramor
Schustster understood that perhaps
better than anybody. He believed in
siata desmaya. He was sure that he would
be the recipient of siata desmaya if he
was Moser himself. if he gave his full
khos to it and he aligned his purposes
with hashem's purposes you know in the
there's a project inspire video where he
says at the end the most important thing
in the world is kiru and that's how he
lived his life he lived his life uh with
total self-sacrifice but for him it
wasn't self-sacrifice he was doing what
theonam wanted of him and he was
confident of his success in other words
the the the amazing thing about This
book in my opinion is is what do we
learn from Ramire Schustster? And in
some ways we learn more from Ramier
Schuster than we learn from a a a great
figure who we talk about who was born
with prednatural abilities who had some
unique talents who knew all of Shas at
13 and so forth and so on. From a mayor
Shuster you have no you have no excuses.
You can't get away from it. Why don't
you do more? What's your excuse? You
can't say well I wasn't he wasn't born
in in a from home. He wasn't a mukas. He
wasn't uniquely gifted in some obvious
fashion other than his
determination. But he shows us how does
a person merit siata desmaya because
everybody saw that about him. There was
once a guy who wanted to start a Spanish
branch of heritage house. He would take
all the fundraising. He would run the
place. So somebody said, so Rab Alber
Melstein who ran Heritage House was the
director said, "Well, so why do you want
to be associated with Heritage House?"
He said, "I want to be part of the SIA
Desmaya that always attaches to
everything that RA mayor does." And I
want to add what was so extraordinary
about Rebor is you're talking about
people having excuses. Many people will
say, "I need to be part of an
organization. I need to be in charge of
some kind of operation in order to draw
people in." For the first decade and a
half of what Reme was doing, he was
merely a feeder to places like a Yeshiva
neim. And like you said, so many people
when they recounted their life story
later on, sometimes they left out that
first step because you know, Reme wasn't
looking for the accolades. He wasn't
looking for the
recognition. And that was extraordinary
in that he wasn't in charge of any
official operation. He was merely the
facilitator bringing these people to the
door so to speak. Okay. There's sort of
a myth about Ramire Schustster which I
do want to dispel a little bit which is
the myth is that he was a onetrick pony
that all the only thing he could do was
tap people on the shoulder
or you know approach he didn't he didn't
tap the women on the shoulder so he had
more than that or ask them what if they
knew what time it was or something like
that. The fact of the matter is that in
1984 he created the heritage house. Two
hostels one for men and one for women
which had a tremendous impact and this
was against most of the Baluva
institutions did not want heritage house
but he felt there had to be a middle
station. And there had to be a middle
ground where somebody could attend some
classes but not fully enter into a
yeshiva or a seminary where they could
feel they could feel things out for a
little bit before jumping in. And he
felt that was important. He created
that. He wasn't the only person who
thought of the idea of a hostel but he
was the only person who went out and
raised the money for it uh and and made
it happen. And it was an extremely
influential uh institution on the entire
on the entire uh kiru mo movement. Also
in in 2000 he created a whole marit in
Israel. He didn't I mean he raised the
money for it but he came to rav mestein
and he said to him we have to do
something for the Israelis. There's
nobody else coming. The inifat has
closed. There's no traffic at the koto.
We have to do something for the
Israelis. So Rabbi Edelstein said to
him, he said, "Romeire, there's just one
problem. You don't speak Hebrew well and
I don't speak Hebrew well. But that
didn't stop him." So I asked Rabbi
Edelstein, "So what did you do?" He
said, "I just hitched myself to him like
I always did and depended on his sataya
that something would would come out of
it." And something did come out of it.
uh it's less known because it was an it
was an Israeli program in 11 different
centers or nine to 11 different centers
uh in his lifetime and some of them are
still going which also had their their
impact too. He wasn't he he thought
about what he did. He had his ideas. He
had his perspective. He fought against
he would not allow himself to become
subject to any uh institution or board
of directors. He wanted to control the
situation because he did not want to be
dependent upon a slow moving. He liked
to do things fast. Rob Edelstein said he
couldn't bear to be even at a at a a red
light. If he was at a red light, he'd
take a right turn and go around the
block rather than stop. He couldn't He
didn't like to stop. He didn't like to
He was always moving. The one of the
things that everybody talks about is how
fast he moved. There was an all-state
basketball player once challenged him to
a race in the old city and he and that
he was wearing gym the the basketball
player was wearing gym gym shoes. He was
20 years younger than Ramire, but Ramire
beat him. He also challenged him to a
arm wrestling match once. If Rob Mayer
wanted to do something, his
determination was was sort of
unstoppable. Uh I think his sense of
urgency was another critical component.
There was he once ran into a group of
Mexicans at the hotel, the Mexican Jews,
Jews vis Jews visiting from Mexico and
uh there was a rabbi running a Spanish
program in Asia named Rabbender
Hakamovich. He's the same one who wanted
to start the Spanish speaking heritage
house. Ram mayor runs up from the coto,
goes up to into the middle of the old
city and he finds this revakamovich. He
says, "Come quick. Come quick. There's a
group at the coto. I can't speak to
them. It's Spanish, but you have to
come." So Rav Hakamovich said to him,
"What do you mean I have to come?
They're gone already. You think they
waited? You think they're waiting down
there?" And Ramire was insistent, "No,
you have to come." And he said, "But
it's pointless." He finally realized it
would be quicker for him to walk down to
the hotel and come back than it would be
uh to convince Rob Mayor to just leave
him alone. So he went down there and the
group was still standing there. So uh he
asked them, "Why did you wait?" And they
said, "We don't know exactly why we
waited, but we saw that it was so
important to him that we couldn't leave.
It was so important to him that we
couldn't leave." uh that's he lived his
life with a sense of urgency which is he
believed in what he was doing. He
believed entirely in in what he was
doing and uh and that's really the
secret of the desay that he had and he
really lived for Keshu and to do his to
do his routon and he did what he did
despite living a life that was not
always easy. who was fraught with
tremendous challenge whether you allude
to some of the financial challenges that
he experienced over the years. You have
a chapter about the passing of his
daughter which is a very trying time.
Talk about that as well his beloved
daughter who was killed in a in a tragic
accident.
This is the story that probably the best
known story about Rabbi Schustster. It's
the one, you know, I talked to friends
of mine who were in or at the time,
people who preceded me by five or six
years and it's the first thing they
always mention when they talk about
Rabbi Schustster. He his oldest
daughter, her nickname was Shotsi, but
everybody knew her as Shotsi. She was
one woman who was lived in Ezra's Torah
where they lived for one summer said
everybody on the block knew her.
Everybody every she captivated
everybody. She said on the way back to
America after that summer, the only
thing my husband and I talked about on
the on the plane was Shhatzi. It was a
she was a captivating child on
Isra.
She asked her mother for a few uh you
know for a few lero to go to the mid and
buy some gum on Isra and she was hit by
a truck Arab Arab driven truck on her
way to the
makit and uh Rav Schustster was
absolutely besided with her. He loved
her dearly. But nevertheless, after two
days of sitting Shiva, he became
extremely agitated. Extremely agitated
because he thought of all those people
who were going to be at the hotel and
that might be their only chance. That
visit to the Kotel might be their only
chance to find out something about their
Yiddish guide. And if he weren't there,
the opportunity would be lost. And he
sent a shila to Raash sacred saddaka and
he said it's picn my being there is picn
that surely is da sitting shiva and
rabalash didn't didn't say his
calculation was wrong he said it was
right but he said no one will
understand and no one will understand it
will hurt you in your subsequent work
you can't go it's it' be marus in with
respect to everybody everybody else it
won't be understood it. And among the
people who didn't understand it was his
wife. I mean, she told me this is the
space
of close to 50 years. She told me how
much it hurt her. She said, "What? You
can't give a week to your to your oldest
child?" I mean, she she couldn't
understand. You have to understand her
situation. and she's a a great lady in
her own right, but because Ram mayor
didn't brag about anything he did and
never talked about it, didn't share
stories, she didn't have any of even the
vicarious pleasure of knowing that her
husband was doing great things. She only
began to really know who he was, what he
had achieved during the Shiva period.
And this book has been you know a
tremendous nama for her too to see to
you know to know whom she was married to
and what her sacrifices were. In many
respects I would say her sacrifices were
greater because she was had to take on
by far the bulk of the parenting in the
household. She had to be the
figure she was a dominant in in the
child rearing. She brought the kids to
America to see their grandparents on
both sides by herself because he did not
leave Erits Israel until he had to for
fundraising. And only now is she
discovering fully what what his
accomplishments were. That didn't happen
so much during uh during his during his
lifetime. But in any event, um, when Rav
Elashv heard this story, urged the
question, he was so struck by the person
of such purity who could think about
going to the Kotel and I I believe he
did go to the Kotel on on the Shabas
because it was no he so because it
wouldn't be morning before and he did go
to the Kotel. He just couldn't restrain
himself entirely
uh from going. But Rabbi Ashv came and
made a shiva call and uh and this was
something very rare for Rabbi Ashv to
leave mashim. He didn't he didn't leave
easily and uh it was a not not mak it
wasn't a small thing it was a it was a
big thing and uh but that you know
indicates how he was totally taken aback
by the question that ra directed to him.
Now, the book has dozens, hundreds
perhaps of fascinating stories and
anecdotes, but there's one story that
you mention was Rabbi Rayor's favorite
story about brother Adrien. I don't know
how much time we have to go through so
many stories, but at least the story of
brother Adrien, take a moment and tell
us about that because you yourself
describe it as Rayor's favorite. It
Well, it's the one he did if he ever
could be forced to speak at at a
fundraising gathering.
uh it's the one he often he often told
this Adrien the father Adrien was a
Catholic seminarian he came to Israel
and
Rav Romero met him at the Koto and he
asked him whether he was Jewish and he
thought to himself would he like to go
to yeshiva so he thought to himself well
that's interesting I'd certainly like to
know something more about Judaism it is
the the mother religion of in his in his
lights so he went
to he did very well there. And at some
point though, one of his parents became
sick. He had to go home. He was happy at
Asian. He was and he went to and he went
to to say goodbye to Rabb Noah. And he
mentioned when he was there uh that he
that he was Catholic, that he was a
seminarian. Rab Noah blew up. He was
furious at him. He said, "You know, I
collect money for this yeshiva to bring
to for Jewish boys to introduce them to
Torah. You stole you. This is this is
theft. You had no right to come here
under false pretenses." He says, "The
only thing that you could possibly do to
be Matakan, to correct what you did
here, is if you ever come across a a
Jewish boy who knows nothing about
Torah, and you can share something of
what you might have learned here, that
might have some benefit." Anyhow, Father
Adrien went back to America. He became,
I think, the principal of a school in
Vermont, and there was a Jewish family
nearby. It was a very uh it was a
private school, a prep school, a
Catholic prep school, but it was known
as the academically superior school in
that area. So when this young man's
parents were looking for a school for
him, and they were executives, they were
highly educated, they naturally sent him
to this Catholic school, and wasn't a
problem for him. He was raised in a very
reformed home.
Um, and as he got through the end of his
senior year, I don't think anybody even
knew that he wasn't, uh,
Catholic, uh, he, the father Adrian
called him in. He said, "You only have
one credit you need. You don't have to
go to classes. Maybe you'll just write a
paper on some religious figure." And
this young man went to his reformed
temple. He went into the library. And he
decided to write a paper on Rabbi
Aaka. So he came back with his paper on
Rabbi Aka. And father Adrien said, "Why
did you choose to write about a Jewish
figure?" He said, "I'm
Jewish." So, Father Adrien remembered
his promise to Rabb Noah. Now, this
could have been 10 years later. It could
have been much later than that. He
remembered his promise to to Rabn Noah
and he started learning with him. They
started learning Mishna. He taught him
Rashi script. He taught him a variety of
things that he would not otherwise have
had. And this young man wanted to go to
near Israel. This is how I know that the
story is true. I I mean I this is the
the the aid the the mccor for this story
is the late Rabbi Tendler who was the uh
principal of the high school in Ner
Israel. I think what happened is that he
went to a camp during the summer. He
worked in one of the camps and Rebbitson
Tendler was the nurse in this camp.
Anyhow at some point he told her I want
to talk to your husband. I would like to
come to Nar Israel as a student as a
student there. And Rabbi Tendler met
with him and he told him he could come
but the boy's parents had no interest
whatsoever in his going there. A few
years later, Rabbi Tendler was in Israel
and he was at the hotel and he met a fy
looking young man and he came and
introduced himself and he said I'm the
same one who couldn't come to parents
wouldn't let him go to near Israel but
they let me come to Israel and I went to
Orsame and so Rav Tedler was able to
confirm this whole story he's a source
of this now the impact from the time
that Rame brought him brought father
Adrien into uh into Asia to the time
that this young man became came from
could have been 15 or 20 years. I mean
there's a there could be a major time
span. He went from being a seminar
father Adrien went from being a a
seminarian to being the principal of the
school and so forth. That took time but
uh as a friend of mine Ravakov Steinberg
who is very close to Rav Schuster and
he's really the central figure in
chapter five of the book when I describe
the the historical circumstances within
which Rav Schuster worked. He said he
believes he told the story because he
was showing that there's a spiritual
conservation of energy where something
is done with pure intent as and his
bringing father Adrian to the to Asia it
will pay off its benefits sometime down
the line we don't know where but it will
pay off its benefits so uh when you ask
me to des what was his impact can you
give us some numbers you don't know the
impact on all those that he touched who'
never went to yeshiva but they may not
have intermarried or they may have
started They may have been more open to
Shabas or if one of their children
decided to go to
yeshiva. It wasn't as foreign to them as
it would have been if they had never met
Rev Rav Shuster. And this was just the
spiritual conservation of of energy.
What starts with a pure intention has
has results. Now you quote in the book
the famed ding of suki and ding musical
fame where he describes that the
well-known song just one chabas composed
and sung by David was actually inspired
by none other than reb mayor himself
talk about that for a
[Music]
second just one shot is coming
with me. Let's sing and dance through
the sky with our spirit so high. Well,
I'm embarrassed to say that I didn't
even know the song. So, when I saw this
in a Mishbaka article, it sort of was
lit up a light in my eye. I know Morai
Bened. I know I know Suki. I know I I
don't know Ding, but I know Suki. And uh
but I really didn't know much about the
song. But he describes there that they
were in Erit Israel together. He Morai
Ben Davidid and and and Ding were in
Erit Israel together and they would go
down to the Kotel on Friday nights and
they would see all the people being
lined up and and and and that Ram would
then walk with them to their various
hosts throughout Jerusalem. He would get
home. He himself would not get home till
about 10 o'clock at night after having
dropped off the all these people at v at
various homes throughout between the
hotel between the Damascus gate and uh
and his neighborhood of Ezra's Torah. So
it was uh uh and that's and that
inspired the song. But if you expect me
to sing the song, I won't be able to
because No, that's quite all right. Now,
Yonison, you've written biographies on
Rabyakov, Rav Destler, Rabbi Mosha
Sherer, uh I don't know who I'm leaving
out. Lieutenant Bernbound and Mike
Tress. Mike Tress, of course, they
called him Mike. How was it different
writing this book on Rib Mayor uh
compared to the others? The truth is
every book is different.
Um every book is different. And in the
introduction to
Rabyakov, I I make a point there. I I
describe what my theory, my philosophy
of Jewish biography was. And Rabyakov
was something of a kittish in the world
of Jewish biography
because it didn't fit. We didn't try to
fit him into some mold of what a guttle
was. I mean, as I say there in the
introduction, the pisqueak that are
quoted here are quoted because they were
raakos. If he's important enough for a
book, he's important enough to have his
pisque halaka quoted, but not because
they necessarily are the consensus on
any issue. Every sing what makes a good
Jewish biography of an important Torah
leader is that you understand something
of his uniqueness. You're able to bring
out his uniqueness. So, uh, Rome was not
a great Torah scholar. He certainly was
a dedicated uh, student of Torah. He
always had kuses throughout his life.
One time he was in the hospital prepping
for a gallbladder operation, was already
admitted to the hospital at night and he
had his kabusa come over and take him
out of the hospital so they could learn
together and then snuck him back into
snuck himself back into the hospital. So
he was dedicated to his learning. That's
that's for sure. But um you know again
Mike Tres wasn't
um Mike Tress also had no yeshiva
background. uh the difference everybody
is so unique in their way. I once wrote
an article about if Rabra Mendelovitz
would have come to America when Rabyakov
did or Rabakov would have come to
America when Ravagra did. So Rabyakov
would not have created Torahas but Rav
Shraaf would not have been able to lead
and already formed to give each one had
his particular role in his particular
time. So each one is absolutely
different. If if you don't feel that
you've never met that that RA mayor is
different than anybody you've met or any
other biography that you've
um encountered then I failed then I feel
I've failed as an author. That's why
it's
so I I I'll share with you that when
somebody says to me the art scroll
biography sometimes I've a friend of
mine once in a Jewish observer article
wrote about the art scroll biography of
Raf Shragoen Fo
Mendelovitz and I called him up I got
his answering machine I left a very
sharp message on the phone I said
Rabbari don't ever do that again
publishers do not write
books authors write books there is no
such such thing as I do not write a
standardized biography whether it's art
scroll or anybody else. These are my
books and I don't want them to be called
the art scroll biography. They are art
scroll biographies and it's you know I'm
deeply appreciative certainly with the
Rebakov the the uh the ability to
partner with Rab Nelson that was my
first book and of course because of
Rabyakov's prestige in the American
yeshiva world our scroll was very
careful about the book but it's my book
uh it's not only my book but it's my
book and uh and I don't like you know I
don't like
to anybody to to like it seems to me
that when you call the art scroll
biography you're saying that there's a
formula and there are no formulas
everyone is now speaking speaking of you
for a moment speaking of you who would
you say over the course of your life
looking
back and for many more years you've had
a very successful career in writing
you've influenced so many people through
your books through your wonderful
columns who has influenced you most
profoundly
uh when you look back both on a personal
level and also as far as your writing
career, a personal level, my father.
Well, I'm not sure. It may actually be
my mother and I'd like to think it was
my father, but they bring very, very
different things to the table. Um, and
I'm coming out with a collection of
essays, many of which are
autobiographical, that I've written over
the years, and my father is no longer
with us. My
mother is and still can take a lot of
joy in what her children do. I would say
in terms of
writing in terms of writing my uh high
school uh my my AP English teacher in
high school and what she did for me was
to tell me that I wasn't a very good
writer. I mean I remember that the essay
that I wrote I thought it was a
brilliant discussion of the Gore vidal
William Buckley debates in the
1968 convention I think the Republican
convention were very vitriolic and I
thought I dissected them brilliantly and
I sent it off as my essay to Harvard and
she flunked me on the
paper so and I guess Harvard wasn't that
much more impressed either because I
didn't get in there either.
So, and then I you know she always I I
learned from her and I don't know if
students today can still get this
writing is a skill. It's not a natural
gift. I mean my father was a good
writer. I'm a good writer. My kids are
good writers. There is some inherent you
know love of
words but it's still a skill. You get
better at it. You get better at it by
doing it. If she hadn't convinced me I
wasn't very good. I brought back my
papers from my freshman year of college
at the University of Chicago and I was
getting straight A's. I gave her a whole
pile of papers and she looked at a few
of them and she said, "But you don't
write any better than you did in high
school." So, and uh you know that's by
the time I'm a junior five beta cap
going to Yale law school and I still
didn't impress my my high school English
teacher. But you know that
is if you get somebody who cares enough
about you to make you better. Uh that's
important. Uh law school, I think you I
did you do pick up some writing skills.
I wrote a long article for the Yale Law
Journal and that you know there's a
certain type of writing. I I wrote a
lot. I preferred writing long papers to
taking tests. So you do a lot of it and
you get better. I hope um and I read a
lot. you get better because uh I always
was a big big big reader and you begin
to see you identify things in certain
writers that that are good and then you
figure out well how did that work how
did they do it and uh
lot I used to have a friend who who's
written a lot of books but he told me he
never read any books I said so don't
expect me to read yours because I'm not
going to um it's you know it's
it I I mean, many of my closest
relationships have been formed through
writing. Um, I'd say the
person who I was probably closest to
over many over 20 25 years was Rob
Nissen Walpen Zak Labra, the editor of
the Jewish Observer and he and Robnelen
Sherman from Art Scroll were best
friends going back to their days in
Toradas along with Rob Mendel Weinbach
is the third one of that triumvirate.
All of them were superb writers and
those relationships with Rev Nusen, with
Rev Nissen Walpin. Uh, you know, they're
the most precious relationships to me.
But I was already a pretty good writer
before Rev Nissen got his hands on me
and a pretty good writer before you. But
but the love of writing, the love of the
power of words was something that
certainly brought us together. has
certainly been responsible
for most of the many of the most
rewarding relationships in my life. I
should say that my mother was a pretty
good editor of of letters from camp and
my wife is a awfully good editor today
and sometimes when she doesn't like a
column one this week I I just say well
everyone can't be the best. It's a line
one of my kids gave me once. Every week
can't be the best.
She said, "But you knew I wouldn't like
this one, and that's why you didn't show
it to me." Well, again, we're very
grateful to you for your timeless
literary contributions to the Jewish
world. Uh, you've been an icon of sorts
in that sense. So, we thank you for your
past contributions. We thank you for
this newest book, which we're excited
here at Arts Scroll to share with the
Jewish world. A book that I'm sure is
going to be very wellreceived. Then we
want to wish you continued inspiring
through the written word. Thank you.
Amen. Amen. Thank you. Thank you so
much.
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