I Just Couldn't Walk Away | Yehuda Lapian | Behind the Bima #192

special edition behind the beimma. This is not only behind the beimma, this is behind the base on nikdash. >> We are in Israel filming this intro to our new episode underground on the pilgrimage road. This is the derakalia regal all the way up. It makes its way all the way up to the base of Mikdash beginning down at your Davidid from the pool. Um, extraordinary excavation. We're here alone. And uh, what has this trip meant to you? >> This the trip has been amazing. But this spot right here every time just it gives me goosebumps when you just you're you know you envision all the people coming from the bottom up to Shalam to the B mikdash bringing their animals, their corbanos, hordes of people. The marketplace is full. Like if you close your eyes, you can envision that and feel it. And I was telling you just a minute ago, to me that's changed my yantiff, going to Sukis, going to Pesak, just to envision what it was like to live in that time and to realize the miracle that we have to be back here, to be excavating it, to finding it. It's a religious experience. >> You know, for me also, you can be down here and this the sadness is destruction. We we were just seeing the area they're still excavating, which is the basement under the shops next to this road. These stones, this actual road are the same stones they walked on 2,000 years ago. They excavated and discovered it. Nothing's been restored. These are the actual road itself. So where we saw the there this >> pottery clay and ashes where the Romans burn the bas there's ash and you can hold the soot the ash in your hand from 2,000 years ago. And as we just heard, imagine October 7th, you know, if if Beer and near if they if they got buried and people would discover it later, they would say this is the destruction from October 7th. So there's sadness down here, but the truth is there's incredible happiness when you think about what's going on just above us and how is expanding in every direction where they are Romans and where we are. >> Yeah. The the people who did this 2,000 years ago are a distant memory. No one's talking about them. The Jewish people are thriving above us. And it's an amazing thing. The traffic in is horrific. >> It's the biggest ever. >> It's amazing because this what we say this desolate city abandoned all by itself. >> It's alive. >> Now you can't get from one place to the other. >> The truth is you and I felt that everywhere we went in Israel. We were on the roof of of yesterday. We had a big banner. And that's the story of our people, right? The story of our people is building up from ashes. And every time throughout history and whatever period you look at where there's been destruction, we've always rebuilt. We we're not just surviving, we're thriving. And that's the story of Israel >> 100%. And that's this episode that we filmed in Bokeh with Peace of Mind. Incredible unit of soldiers came. Rabbi Mascot puts together the most amazing program every year. Nudo works for peace of mind himself. Uh has been serving many of the days of this war. Um incredibly special person from a special background and heading to a special place. just to tell our listeners, I think this was one of the most raw conversations we've had. I mean, there were there were tears. It was very emotional conversation at times. >> Yeah. He laughed, he cried. Um there were there were the people who are deeply disappointing upsetting him and the people that he nevertheless wants to break through and feel a sense of unity to. One of the themes of this trip that we're on that we've heard everywhere we went, aside from the fact that everyone's sitting and waiting if a war with Iran is going to begin and everyone's attitude is not I hope it doesn't happen. and I can't believe what's going to be. But everyone's attitude is not afraid of bomb shelters or ballistic missiles. You're so lucky you're here. You have a front row seat to the miracles that are about to unfold. But it's really about resolve and resilience, the story of our people, and it's about the danger of um with all the existential threats from without. Everyone is speaking to us from left to right, politically, religiously. This morning, a journalist at breakfast. They're all saying the dangers, the threats from without, we can handle. >> It's the ones within. >> It's the internal. It's the internal infighting, the internal debates. We got to double down on figuring that out. How to listen and speak to people we disagree with. Even if we'll continue to disagree with, even if we disagree on enormous issues, where can we find common ground? Where can we be a family? How can we be a people? Anyway, it's a great honor and pleasure to be in this incredibly special place on this special road standing literally on the stones of those came before us. Extraordinary trip and we're honored to bring to you this extraordinary conversation with Yehuda Lapan. Welcome back to Behind the Bea. It's a tremendous honor, privilege, and pleasure to welcome our friend Yehuda Lapan to the behind the beimma studios as part of a very special week which we'll talk about in a moment at Bookeron Synagogue with peace of mind. But first of all, Yehuda, welcome. >> Thank you, Rabbi, for having me. Uh, thank you, Rabbi Masowitz, for having me. Um, it's very exciting and and a pleasure to be here. >> This there's so much to talk about. Um, this week we host the program peace of mind. every year. It's one of the highlights, crown jewels of our community, a unit of soldiers. Ra Moscot does an amazing job putting it together and it's you see him come alive that week. So maybe in introducing Yehuda, just one minute on peace of mind. >> As you said, it's it's literally my favorite week of the year. Um it exhilarates me. It's so meaningful and it's so special. We have the privilege now our fourth time of welcoming a unit from the IDF, from the Israeli Army to our community. they get hosted by our families and and the special part about it is it's not just a fun trip for them. This is real intensive, rigorous PTSD therapy that's happening during the day. Um, and it's a balance for them. And I always find every year that part of their therapeutic process is seeing the broader Jewish community around and giving context to the service. So I hear almost every year when the guys come in and they say, "We didn't realize that there are Jews 6,000 miles away that care about us, that daven for us, that think about us all the time." And once they see that and they feel the love and they realize that we view them as heroes, it puts their sacrifice in a very meaningful context. And I always find that specifically over Shabas, when they really feel that love, it gives it's that breakthrough for them. And and my hope is that they always go back. >> Many of them have never been in religious circles. Many of them have never been to America before. And I hope they go back with that message that American Jewelry loves them and that we care about them deeply and that they're our heroes. >> We think about them every day. We tell them that um some mentioned to me last night they went to one of our schools. They were greeted as they are as heroes and they said we didn't know we were heroes in Israel. We're just regular people. Um and they are and and those who put their lives on the line and defend and fight. And Yehuda, you are among them 300 days in this war. Almost 300 days fighting in this war. But before we get to you, your story, there's a lot to talk about. A great grandson of the great rebellion. Uh your own religious journey and identity journey. your own suggestions and very public stance in navigating some of the differences in the Jewish people. There's a lot to but let's just start peace of mind for one moment your role with them and what this trip means to you. >> Um first of all, Rabbi Masowitz, you should be our spokesperson. That was that was probably you just somewhere really in like less than a minute. Uh you it it really um explains the magic of peace of mind. I've been working in peace of mind for uh almost three and a half years. Um I think I I started as the uh director of community relations where I I speak to the community representatives, the rabbi, we build the itinerary together. It's important for us to make them feel like partners and we're not the Israelis who are telling them this is what has to be done like we're in it together for a long time. Uh after I came and then I went to war and then when I came back from the war a lot of things have changed in my life and um also my position. Now I'm the director of community of PR. I still send my emails and say Yuda and it drives everyone crazy. Um but I am blessed on Mo Shabas to to to be in gratitude to my work to be in an organization that I think is a bridge. I think it's a bridge between hardcore Israelis to American Jews. It's a bridge for men to say um share that they're hurting and to say kashelli it's hard for me. It's a bridge for Jewish identity. When I have secular soldiers, very secular soldiers, coming to me on Shabbat afternoon, saying to me that, you know, what do I need to do if I want to go back and start doing candle lighting >> or if their hosts are inviting them on a Monday morning to go to shu with them and put on fill in, which happens a lot, and the guy's like, I haven't put on fill in since I was 13. And then you read in the survey that he's been putting on fillain for for the last two years there it's a bridge to uh your Zionistic identity where there's so much anger sometimes towards your state and feeling and suddenly for a week you're becoming a a hero and there's gratitude real hakarat and you're a bit more proud again to be Israeli. So I just think it's in one word it's a bridge >> a bridge >> for so many things and um and unfortunately there's work for the next 30 years but when when we have partners like uh uh Bokeh Young Israel of Florida Angelwood you know uh Tene so we're on to something and hopefully we'll be doing this many more years >> this group is an amazing group uh fought together or each fought before October 7th were brought together as reservists and lost four four of their friends in fighting and I know that we you like to begin you've done a lot of podcasts and and Jews get together there's a lot of things that we share Torah hopefully among them but also in memory of those who are not here in tribute to them and gratitude to them to shabas we're going to have an amazing shabas with this unit with you and so let's start with uh yeah please >> so I'll just do my my small ceremony that the first time I went into Gaza so I could sorry the first time I went into gather Gaza I have to say that Um, honestly, I was petrified. It's one of the scariest things. And um, I needed I remember driving and it's on the video. I could show you afterwards, but um, and also I like to break the law and you're not allowed to take the mic and to to put it or to music, but I felt that uh, there are we are we were on a convoy with uh, five hammers, two trucks. I was in charge of the logist logistics truck and I was leading the convo and I'm and I'm my heart and I'm petrified and what do I do when I'm afraid? I go back to my childhood to my good moments and I put the the mic and I have the video and they were so pissed at me but my some of the soldiers thanked me and I know it sounds weird but I like to do alim with um this you know this song. >> Sure. Wow. >> It gives me strength. It gives me hope. And I have a video of us going >> into Gaza with this music >> into go a few hours before Shabas. It's pitch dark, but I have part of it in the video. And it gives me strength. It gives me and just imagine 16 trucks. Half of them are Russian, secular, dati. Uh, and I just took for one minute the mic and and >> almost nobody threw you out of the army. You weren't arrested in the army. Oh, and it it gives me strength and and to overcome fear. So >> in that moment, >> thank you to you to the soldiers in memory of those who are in here and in the hope for peace that we don't need soldiers protecting us anymore that Hashem will protect us. Amen. >> Okay, so let's get into it. Yehuda, there's so much. >> Yeah. >> Let's start with this. No kipa. Put on a kipah to make the braha. Kipa came back off. You got a long beard. I would like to have a beard as long as you. But you don't have a wife who tells you you can't have it. That's why you still have a long I'm working on it. Rabbi >> by the end of people listening to this podcast. >> We we'll give out your phone number if people have good ideas. But on off and is that in some ways a microcosm of your life? Kipa on off on. Tell us what's that about? Um, I'll try to make it short. Um, before the war, um, I'll go to high school. I never felt comfortable with it on my head. >> Go back before high school. It's my fault I didn't ask you. Where did you grow up? What kind of a home did you grow up? Was it a religious home? What kind of schools did you go to? Let's go back. >> So, I was born in the Upper West Side in Manhattan. My parents met through Rabbi Riskin in Lincoln Square. By the way, that book, I don't know if you read it, the first the first half is really special on on leadership and he he >> uh I don't know I'll I'll put in brackets and I'm I apologize for the popcorn, but um I've been calling you rabbi for the ne last few days and also you because I I when I feel that I'm I'm near rabbis, I don't call anyone rabbis. The only person I called a rabbi was Rabbi Sax Moab and Rabbi Riskin who was my the chief of the rabbi of the school. I have an issue with rabbis in Israel. I have an issue with religion in Israel. But when I feel that I'm near people who their religious identity is reflected by how they behave and what they say, I almost want to call them a rabbi. And I and so that's number one. I grew up in a house that is the classic Um if we go into nuance Hartman intellectual pros and cons uh commitment was important but other things were also very important. Um I grew up in Ramote. Most of our synagogue were im American olim English olim. Um good hardworking people who left and did a modern lea like many people in this sh like many people who are doing the army here and it's just unbelievable. But I grew up um with a silent American identity uh because I was born in the upper west side and I was surrounded by such hardcore Israelis. I would almost lie that I was born in Jerusalem and I used to come in the winter with shorts and sandals and I said, "I'm going to learn, the Hebrew language, better than everyone and I'll correct him cuz what's more Israeli than correcting them?" >> But honestly, growing up um in in my house, it was always like Shabbat and taking things seriously, but in the end of the day, I think being a mench, I know it sounds cliche, but that was more important than anything. um respecting the people who built this country even though we don't live the same life that they do. uh the the small which um the secular left always respecting it but but I remember growing up Shabbat Carlbach singing on Friday night after we uh finished eating we would have a left paper a right paper makonit the Jerusalem Post we grew up um in an environment with dati and noti left and right it was important for my parents not to move even though they loved Rabbi Riskin, but to be with Israel and I grew up with Am is and it took me many many years and it took me working for peace of mind and it took me I'm jumping forward a bit uh being in the communities as a guest um and the amount of aid and help and support we got. I'll show you a picture which I don't know you have it but there's a flag of the Bokeh synagogue in Maslul. You were in Masul of course a few times. >> A day after I came out of Aza I see it's here. I see the I called Rabbi Brody there a bunch of I'm like where are you Rabbi Brody? He's like we just had a celebrate last night. Cigars stuff >> and he said where were you? And I'm like I was in Gaza. But I think all those things reminded me the same way it awoken my Jewish identity that I am also American. I was born in the upper west side. Um my father taught me that America um we we went to Normandy after the war to to do kadesh for the heroes who saved the world. And it took me many years to stop honestly lying and and to be proud of I'm I was born in the upper west side in New York in America. American Judaism has brought so much to Israel. Americans have brought so much to to Israel. even the secular uh um Americans. And I have a picture here of the first tank going into Gaza with an Israeli American flag with a very cynical vice commander unit who in the beginning of the war couldn't stand the fact that me and some of the Anglo guys are talking English and after the amount of misvot help me with this >> suitcases >> suitcases and barbecues and so many people coming and saying one word in time after time he took the flag. He's a very cynical Israeli guy and he put it on his tank, Israeli American flag. >> So, I grew up in a very open-minded serious but not um and and when I was in high school, I felt that there's a gap between what I have on my head and what Israeli society reflects to it. Um but to cut a long story short and thanks to Rabbi Sax Alabasham who was I was very close to 11 years my amaka is with me and my Jewish identity is with me and um I still have my doubts but I couldn't be I couldn't be feeling more whole on my Jewish identity since the war. And I know that people give me the eye when I don't have my amic on. I know that it doesn't look good to come and sh on Friday night with jeans, but um it's who I am and I love Yiddish Kite and I love Shabas and I love Carbach. Um and it's been a journey and I tried being a secular Israeli in Tel Aviv for two years. I tried I tried getting up. I tried I said I'll move to Tel Aviv. I had a small crisis when I was 29 and I'll finish in a minute. And >> I'm not going anywhere. You keep going. It's okay. I I tried being is giving it up Friday night, going to a restaurant with my ex, going to the beach Shabbat morning. And I tried and I and I suffered. It's just I'm not here to say that whoever does it is less than me. But for me, putting on a a button-down shirt and to go to shul even if I smoo outside or or or Shabbat morning when the when we bring in the Torah and that's the only five minutes I'm in and you sing I I just feel I can't give it up and I'll find a I'll build a home and find a wife who's a bit more seriously connected. than I am. But I really tried to give it it all up and I couldn't. And after the war, it came back like a tsunami. Chabis, identity, fill in um Yiddish. Um yeah. So, so could we just talk about the war because you mentioned that now a few times as like really a pivotal part that changed your understanding of your identity. We talk about certainly in America how the war changed us and obviously we see in Israel but personally for you what about the war specifically said I need to be more Jewish rather than run away from it. >> It's a good question. Take your time. Take your time. Israelis do cry. >> Soldiers soldiers do cry. >> It's been a long week for them. >> Yeah. Yeah. I just It happens too many times on on like when I finish a podcast and I and I don't cry. I'm like, "Good. Off you." >> But I learned that uh it's it's not >> real. It's raw. It's you. >> No, but it's a question that to answer your question uh Rabbi, I think that pain and I think uh you told us on the bus coming here, I think you know what real pain is. and and and hearing a pain and then still smiling to 22 Israelis who you just met five minutes ago in the airport is um I think something about Jews and pain you know fiddle on the roof always walking on shaking shaky grounds but we'll continue smiling I saw the videos I had to do things during the war that I I remember looking up and like m what do you want what like some of The videos are are it's not even horrible. It's like but week after week, mission after mission, Gaza, Lebanon, Gaza, um funerals, so many funerals of people I know and I don't know. Shivas, so much pain that I I you know, my my heart broke into so many pieces that I felt that I don't think there are any pieces left. And the Katskarba talks about it a lot about a broken heart. But in that broken moments, I just felt this need to to I don't know if it's looking up to Hashem and saying, "Help." I don't know if it's if it's Friday night before going into Gaza singing with a bunch of guys and and feeling it in my, you know, >> veins. I I just my I felt my Jewish identity or whatever you call it was shouting. I think it went to sleep for many years. I think I was my Jewish identity went to sleep for many years. I think I was trying to be something that I'm not. I think I was trying to be a successful Israeli Kilon of Aviv businessman who could also talk about stocks and investments and I don't cuz 5 + 5 comes out 12 but there were so many moments that I just said first of all I am a Jew they came into the the monsters came from the ground and and did what they did because we are Jewish the same way they took my grandparents and put them in Awitz and they came out of Awitz and continue singing I I felt it in a ways that I couldn't have actions to it while I was feeling it. So I'm not here and and saying to you now I'm ding and and putting on and my is still off my head. But first of all me I'm a Jew. That's more important in my life than anything. And Shabas that is more important than anything and doing candle lighting and the sidul and havdala and I still have a long way to go but that became in in the chaos in the confusion and and the state of Israel was in so much confusion for so long I found I can't say the light but I found that in those so much broken moments I couldn't be more wholeer full on my Jewish identity Wow. >> You you shared with me, maybe you could elaborate now. This is what you were just explaining, but it wasn't just you were the same person, but now you also started to do things. It was like you just said, your identity that before October 7th, you were an Israeli and after October 7th, you said maybe also that's my citizenship, but I'm a Jew. So sometimes when people want to change or grow or figure out who they are, it's not only about what they do, but maybe first it has to start with who I am. What's my identity? How do I see myself? >> So I I the the war is not just bad and it brings out also leadership. There are things that I didn't know about myself. There's a there's an article they did and there's a they took a a piece of of something I said and had done. We were attacked by drones. One of our our entries to Gaza, we were attacked by a very serious drone. And one of the guys who was a banish uh had yeshiva uh flew off the tank and got trapnels in his back and I was the first one to under fire and mash came to him and the paramedic was yelling that you have to keep him focused and I'm I'm I don't know how to give aid and I just said I saw he was uh you know kipa and and I said do you have anything interesting to say about the para And he was laughing. >> It's like being at security. >> She was laughing. He was laughing. I was laughing. And that was another fiddler moment on the roof that were we're humiliated. We were punched. We were raped and murdered. And here we're fighting back. Three Jews, a dati girl who's a paramedic, this father of five or six, me, and we're laughing. And and I I know it's cliche, but I just felt another strong Jewish moment of like they'll never win. They could defeat us. They could they could harm us, make us feel pain, make us cry. But we have such a gift. And and and I almost gave it away for free. My parents, the biggest present I got in my life two is one when they made their modern and me being Israeli. But I think being Israeli but not singing the is is something not whole. But being a Jew and not singing a tikvah I think is something not whole. And I think it took me 37 years to feel that the most important things in my life is the ability to sing on Friday night as an Israeli but also as a Jew to sing proudly hatikva. And if you don't know one of those songs and you can't relate to them or things them, sing them with all your heart. I feel that you're missing something as a Jew. How did it change things for you with friends, family, you know, they they knew you with the kipa, without the kipa, now sometimes the kipa. How did your family navigate in friends? Did your secular friends in Tel Aviv you were trying to break into? What happened when you became this uh born again Jew? And when the Jewish friends you grew up and went to school with, what happened when you became the secular Tel Aviv Israeli? >> So, um I think coming back from the war, I think my mother was really happy, honestly. I think she she's she's a real Yid, you know, she she both her parents are Holocaust survivors and Shabas is everything for her. and and and when you're very open-minded and pluralistic and and she teaches biblical she she's very smart but in the end of her day her also identity she's a Tanakh teacher is is Yiddish kite and to see it giving up me giving up was very very hard for her but she let me and I think coming back to it more and more made her very happy um I think my very secular friends in Tel Aviv believe were surprised once I have a a coffee parlay meeting parlament. How do you say that in English? >> Yeah, >> some of them are very secular and left. Very. And um they said to me, they saw me coming out of ship shabas morning >> and one of them said like you're still doing this nonsense. And I said to him, you know, first of all, I was upset. It was the first time I was like I was upset and then I said to myself what brings a 45 CEO smart intelligent Israeli to say that to call this nonsense what happened in the last 20 30 40 years that this is what he says to me cuz if I was going to an ashram in India uh for a men's retreat on spirituality >> he would support it >> he'd say wow you're connecting to yourself to your roots. But but seeing me coming out of Ashul, that's ridiculous. And that set me for another like even a stronger journey of like and this is comes from Rabbi Saxs about am I going to burn bridges with my tongue in Israel? Am I going to build them? And I found that I have a new passion. I enjoy bringing very secular people into shul and to teach and to show them like a like kabad or a or whatever more than myself sitting and and dvening. I felt I I know my but the passion and love I have and maybe my re renewed connect connection is like bowi come see it by yourself. Come for bringing in and a kabad on Tuesday. come for Friday night Carl Bach and I was able to bring F-35 pilots, high-tech people who trust me, and they trust me because I don't wear yamaka. I live in Tel Aviv. I'm not bringing a condescending approach. So, they so they come with me. So, and it's funny, they they tell me, "Don't use plastic, fine. Uh uh maybe be a bit more vegetarian, fine. come do yoga. Fine. Now I'm asking them, come see how I grew up. Come see why it's so special. So some of them have a hard time with me going on my own journey. Tough. So, so let me pick up on that because as you alluded to earlier and I think I spoke about at the beginning, part of the most meaningful experience on peace of mind is watching the secular Israelis come to our community, many of whom most of whom have never been into an orthodox, met rabbis before, been imshed in a Jewish community. And for me, it is so fulfilling by the end of the week when not only are they not threatened by it, but they're intrigued by it and enamored by it and drawn to it. You spoke about your journey in Israel and about how you love that same experience in Israel, but we all know that there are deeper issues that are going on in Israeli society and there's so much hurt and there's so much politics and so much divisiveness and many people are so entrenched in their positions, they're not even open to that. As you said, the the Israeli who said, "Oh, you're going to that stupidity again, that silliness again." How do how do you recreate that on a mass level? And alas, how do you show secular Israelis that religion isn't threatening? How do you show religious Israelis that other religious Israelis aren't the enemy, but they're our brothers and they might view Judaism differently? There's so much hurt in Israel from the war and we're just magnifying it by hurting ourselves internally. How do you take your feelings and express that and spread that in a way that that's healthy for Israel? >> I just before you answer, I would expand on that and put it a little bit differently. You've been speaking about the secular side, >> right? >> But in the other direction, you've got the >> I dabbled in that. Yeah. >> Yeah. I'm going straight into it. You got the and and again, this is something we avoid. It's complicated. It's sensitive. Um and and you weren't quiet online during the war here. You were losing friends, going to funerals, paying shiva calls almost 300 days yourself, holding somebody in your arms, asking what's interesting in the para, and a segment of society wasn't serving. and you were not quiet online about that segment of the community, but yet now you're bringing a little bit of a different perspective. So, talk to us about about that side. Yeah, these are good questions and I'm I'm used to answering fast and short, but this is not fast and short. Um, first of all, Rabbi Mascowitz, I'm going to dedicate my life to to what you just asked. I don't know how to bring I could only do my part and my part is taking advantage of I know how very people think because most of my families are karate. I grew up in Jerusalem. I know how very secular people live because I live in the most secular area in nine years in with them. I I grew up in a datomi intellectual upbringing. I I I grew up in the settlements a lot a lot of Shabbat. I grew up with Israel. Um but to be tak what's happening now with the Kedi community and the rest of Israel is um for the first time in my life I'm I'm frightened from it. Um, I work very very hard, very hard when I put on fillin and I I say modi every day, but I ask I ask Hashem to take away the anger and resentment and and honestly sometimes hate that that I feel that that is is another quote by a chief rabbi who said yesterday something so awful that I I I feel like like and I know religion I have respect to it. Imagine if I'm if I'm not and and they see these quotes of leaving the country even the people who are not studying Torah shouldn't do the army. Um the bereft eight mothers who wanted to meet the chief rabbi and he refused. I I'm I'm I'm asking myself first of all technically I understood and this is a year after the war that my expertise is not shouting and burning bridges. I know how to fight. I know how to fight well. And I used to love arguing, but I found that my added value, and this is also from Rabbi Sachs, is my ability to connect, bridge, make people feel closer. I have a lot of very secular left-wing guys and girls who I took to Ephrat for a Friday, for a Shabbat, for a meal. I have a lot of friends from Ephra who when my I go home for Shabas, I'll give them them my apartment in Tel Aviv and they haven't been there in 15 years and they say Tel Aviv is great. I'm like, I know. And I'm I'm I I my last podcast with was was with Rabbi Avi Hill from JTV. I really give him credit for what he's trying to bring to Tel Aviv. But and and I also think that if someone's going to bring shalom to Israel like we did peace between countries with help from the outside. I think that rabbis or leaders or political leaders from the outside are going to make peace cuz inside of Israel I think it's just not going to happen. That's why I have so much weight and hope for you and and many other Anglo. The last podcast I did was I invited someone I had really really bad beef with online. He's a Karedi, modern Karedi. We really said some horrible stuff to each other and we wrote he wrote an article and I answered back on Times of Israel. Horrible. It's things that if I could, I'd delete them. It's there forever and that's my burden to take with me forever. But cuz there were times that I felt Yehuda Lapian is someone who when the house was burning took a match and and threw in more wood. That's for me to carry and I'm doing I'm trying my best through peace of mind and I invited this guy for a podcast in the merits merits merit >> merit of aloo to do a sulka podcast. >> Wow. >> Wasn't easy for me and it's on you could see parts of it. I'm really trying. And he agreed. He came on. Yeah. And Rabbi Hill mediated it. How did it go? Tough. Really tough. And and and I'm I'm holding myself and and and I'm really trying and I'm going to focus and I'm going to I I I asked the editor of Bamish Baka. I met him. I went to his office and I said, "Let's bring a group of Zaka and Hatalah, the the Karedi heroes who went on October 7th. They also deserve to be called heroes. Not just the green uniform people. I think heroism could be in many many ways. Not just in combat. We're Jews. We're not Vikings. It can't be all about combat. You know, I think people who go through pain and wake up in the morning and do good in the world are heroes. I think people who don't have a lot of money givea are heroes. I think people who went through ash and continue singing the are heroes. It's I I can't that all the Jewish heroism will be about a gun and and green uniform. That's not who we are. We're people of the book and and and uh we sing about shalom in. But I feel that the kari community as a community individually they're the best. My cousins, they're they're so good people and knowledgeable and and they carry the commitment as a group. their leadership. I really feel they're they're not bringing a match into the fire. They're the fire. I feel that sometimes they're they're destroying the essence of the state of Israel of not in words, in in actions. And and I thought that after October 7th, I will see much more of and much more of what do you need? the same way this community has been doing for the last seven days in their fourth year. What do you need? And it's just not there. And I feel that there are many people who won't even come to sh with me on Friday night cuz for them to come with Yehuda to hear is their first step of losing to them. It's a war. There's a silent war in Israel where if you you understand what I'm saying? No, I just you used the word them and to me that was the most painful word you've used this entire time because when when we get into a language of us versus them or me versus them, it's another. And I told you, if you remember on the very first bus ride when I picked you guys up at the airport, I said, "You are all strangers. I've never met you. We're very different. We observe differently." And I said, "But it's not you and me. It's us. We're all part of the Jewish people." And and when you use that word, I almost felt like a pierced through my heart because we could have differences and we could observe differently and feel differently. But the second that word them enters into our vocabulary, it's a very very dangerous word. >> Correct. And it's just getting more and more the gap is being we had 30 days of on for October the 7th. We had like a nice month or two, but but sending to a unit a thousand tit because this is what you want is nice. Know my cousin I I love him. Sent us tit. I said we don't this is not what we need now. We need that our dati our 20 dati soldiers who are finishing at 12:00 a mission on a Friday and have to drive three hours up north to be with their family and then they have to come back moz shabis and don't want to waste time on public transportation. Why can't you take a thousand students in Mir and and do car pools? I don't I don't need you to send us titio. That's what you want to send. I need you to say heni all in. I need >> So what what do we do about this? Because like you said in both directions and that's that danger. The secular friend says I can't let them win and the other side says if we glorify if we celebrate then they're going to win and now like you said the core of the problem is that they've become the other. They've become the them and the same work that you're doing extraordinary and that you're ready to dedicate your life to in the one direction. What can we do in the other direction? How do we heal? How do we solve this? How do we find leadership where there is none or be the leadership where there is none? Um I think new leadership uh people who are in miluim I think spiritual leadership who's not from Israel I think too many red lines were crossed where you see how the guys you're going to see them now in chabas uh one of the therapists came up to me she saw the the and he's like there are things I want to check out about spirituality and chabas And I'm like, are you sure? Why? Why? After six days in five days in Bokeh, thousands of miles away from the land of the the Holy Land, there's an awakening in in a secular, but when he's there, there's fear and resentment. What What's happened? Is it them being sorry? Is it the Karedi community being very involved in politics? Is it those quotes from the Karedi leadership months after month? I don't know. I could tell you that I have hundreds of soldiers in the unit who areal. How do you say that in English? Like >> religious Zionist. >> I used to be so condescending towards them as a teenager. Those people who are doing one year and four months. How dare them? And they're so close close-minded. And they're so they take everything so seriously. You know, when they come into the a room now in in the tent, we all we almost all stand up out of respect. I'm I am so humbled to see how religious these people are that at 5:30 a.m. in Gaza, they walk aside. They put on fill in for five minutes. They always come at round after round. They have a smile on their face. when they have a few moments they're they're studying the rabbi Rabbi the Ley and Matan Matan walk in Gaza these are not combat soldiers they're in their 50s they do not look like combat soldiers sorry they don't look but they have so much courage and so when they do it you have 200 secular soldiers who are in on them and it works and there's serious dati and there's the Monday and Thursday there's creator and then you go home and people are saying oh the religious soldiers in the in in the Israeli army are not really religious and you're like that's such a I'm surrounded by these these realadikim and if you ask the secular guys they'll say how much these people are sadikim dedicated to Torah 24 hours I don't know to give you an answer. I'm nervous. I feel that we are on the verge verge verge of um do you think it would help? Do you think it would take some of the temperature down and soften both sides? You know, you described from the perspective what more you felt they could do, could do, should do. Do you think in the other direction some of the secular have so little value or project so little value of Torah and of religion of where they come from that if the secular side would say you know Torah is also valuable and it's important and we're here for 3,300 years because you've been holding on to it we would have disappeared long ago then that side could say thank you I appreciate you saying that now we can talk now we could talk about what we can do but while each side is like you're the other and neither can and and they should say thank you for serving losing your life going on the front line fighting but each acknowledging the value the other brings and I'm not equating I'm I'm just saying each acknowledging and then each side can soften and say okay thank you now we can talk if we would speak a year ago I'd say 100%. But I think that the majority of the Israeli uh Zionistic uh society, the datomi, the karddal, the secular, the kibbutim feel that they have done so much in the last 50, 40, 30 years to to to uh uh the amount of of being a dati soldier in combat in Milim the freight Torah dvening time like we they we we feel that we have done so many steps towards justad and after October 7th and still we feel that there's a real cold shoulder and that there's a real essence of we are not interested in being a part of this together and I feel that when I do speak to young guys. They want in. They want to be a part of they're proud of their kared identity. They like their yamaka. They're like they their lifestyle. They believe in it and I respect that. They're they're afraid by what will happen if they join the army or start working for a high-tech company because of shidim and I understand and sometimes the secular you know but I think it's time as a group and as a leadership the same way that had to do after the disengagement or after Rabin was murdered reflecting inside and said what have we be doing wrong I think the community I I feel have lost their ability to look inside and say where have we gone wrong? What do we what do we need to do? And we need different leadership. I I I see them in in medicine, in high-tech, in in law, in in politics. They excel everywhere. The you know, they're very serious. So people are saying, "Wait a second. If you're here and and the groups are becoming bigger every year, Hebrew, the Karedi campus, Tel Aviv University, high-tech companies, I every it's working. Why not in the army? Admit people say to me to tell them admit that you have fear in your heart that you have become uh you don't want your your hands to get dirty and you just want to be to to to take and not to give. Can it change one by one on the ground the the you did the podcast with? >> Yeah. >> Could you go out for coffee? Could you say listen with all the differences and all the things we said let's find the things we have in common? Let's be a model. Let's build from here. Let my friends and your friends know that we we got together not just for a podcast. I'm not putting the pressure on you with him. I'm just giving it as an example. Meaning instead of our talking about societies and segments of society and and big could it just be one person and one person >> just you know our Bay just like sitting in >> and the proof is this week. I mean the proof is really this week because first of all what I'm enamored by the unit that we have here this week is that they are an amazing blend of religious and they have such mutual respect for each other and love with each other and so I do believe that once you get to know someone that definitely is and I even saw this week you know you referenced it but people again who would never talk to a rabbi have a relationship with a rabbi but when you sit in front of someone and all of a sudden you have a conversation with them you realize they're a human being like you they have their struggles like you and all of a sudden as you said like it lowers the temperature a little bit of the differences when you realize that you're sitting across another human being. >> Right. >> Yes. That's why I brought him to the podcast. We ended with Alim and I'm working very hard on myself to do the damage I've done in the state of Israel to to the de being in politics writing those pieces. That's going to continue with me and that's my obligation to try. But it's not enough. I'm a I'm a simple Jew who goes on podcasts, who works for peace of mind. I'm not I don't have a million followers. is I don't I'm trying in my to do and to spread the word a bit but I feel like we're we're not even a a wave in the we're there there there may be 50 more like us coin and bombach and and beer and there are people who are trying and and but but the majority and the media >> I feel like it's it's >> so let's talk about another group that's less I think controversial in a sense more clear that you're disappointed in so am I and that are Jewish celebrities outside of Israel. We were just talking you connected online also with some >> Yeah. >> who on October 7th and since then um were fearful of their career of getting cancelled of their livelihood. They put that all ahead of expressing their proud Jewish voice. I could only say that um what I feel towards these people is shame on them. I think that history, not history, their grandkids are going to ask them if they call them Saba, if they know what Sabah and Saft is, but or Bobby and Zi, I think they're going to ask them, "Where were you on October 7th?" or "What have you done for the Jewish people or for the state of Israel?" And they and they won't have answers for them. I think that if someone has a billion dollars and 55 cars and the and he's the director of the best movies in history and made Schindler's List, you know, and nothing nothing maybe he gives money behind the the uh and without us knowing but there are so many people with so much power, real power, power of money, power of influence, power of Instagram, you know when Galgadot or Shapiro, God should just continue protecting him. You know, all these people who are who are fighting for us, not in the front line of combat, but in the front line of lies and media and are are taking a risk and losing money and opportunities and saying, "I am brave. I am I am proud to be a Jew. I'm a proud to be Israeli." and they Galgadote when she did the candle lighting on Friday night, you know how much horrible things were said to her or when Ben spoke at that the last um um heritage. No, >> no. In and the >> look at with his Yarmaka, strong, proud Jew. And then you had this, excuse me, this stupid commercial on the Super Bowl of this weak Jew who's looking for help from look at look at Ben speaking with his Yamaka about about EMTT and so many and then you have these these Hollywood who actors who who God gave them all the wealth in the world and all the power and they worked hard for it. Where are you? Your grandparents were taken from their houses. You you don't think you will get that knock one day >> and they're gonna say, "Oh, you got an Oscar for this movie 10 years ago. >> We're we're gonna move to the next house. Oh, you're you're what happened? Where are you? You think you're just American? You you you made movies and and uh uh what's his name? Leb Triber talking about the Kotkarb and Ma about a holy heart. You you remember uh >> it's him maybe a few more they could help us today. You don't have to say the name, but there was a celebrity who privately wrote you Kola Kavode. >> Yeah. >> Somebody well known in America, accomplished Jew, again, you could say his name, not say his name, who wrote you privately and you shared it publicly. And what happened? >> He we were in LA. I went on a I went on my own piece of mind. Um I needed after whatever it's a a small NGO that hopefully we'll be doing a collaboration with. Um so we spent a Shabbat in LA in like the hardcore LA Jewish community. Very similar to here, but a bit different. uh with with three families and then um and then we went to six days to um horseback riding in Montana and it's documented and um Shabbat in LA. We just met a few celebrities who who came for for Shabbat morning to the to the be there were some really interesting and moving moments. But um we met a Kabad rabbi out of respect for him I won't say his name but when we were in Topena Topena is like a cool chill place to be for a few hours. So this Kabad rabbi was talking to his to this very famous um um actor who's been in movies like in Glorious Bastards who created uh uh some of the best shows uh the office and and I said it was he said such beautiful stuff to us on that video. Beautiful. And I was so happy because a you look up to these people not because just they made money and and are because you know so I posted it on Instagram and saying thank you and not a minute passes and he's asking me to to take it off. I found out that he did the same to my other friend who was with us who we were so excited this this he was he's not even you know physically impressive you know he's but excuse me for saying that he's he's at least not on a on a cell phone but ask him why are you asking me to take it off you you said it so proudly and strongly you know that you're supporting us that you love us that you thank us for fighting for the Jewish people. Why should I take it off? And in the beginning, like I don't like when people tell me what to do. Also in peace of mind or rabbi, you know, a bit we had our and and and my best relations always start um a bit >> you have to break it sometimes to put it back together. >> And he's saying I was like I'm not taking it off. I was like I'm not taking it off. I'm I'm I'm very proud of it. But he was being very consistent about about why it's so important for him to be private. And I just felt for the first time that this is not a successful human being. This is a coward and someone who does not know where he's coming from and has no clue where he's going from. And if after the millions he made and the success, he can't say I am a Jew and I am a Zionist Jew or I love the IDF or this is what I bring to the table after what we went through. So fine, I'll take it off. But I said to him, I I you can't even understand how disappointed you make. I I said, "You broke my heart for being such a like, what else do you need? You know, you need more millions. You're afraid that that that Stephanie and and Mark, your your neighbors won't invite you for their gala." seriously like after what we went through like after I know who your cousins are and not just him so many actors and directors and and >> I don't know if it has to do with woke or not but I think that a a a country or a nation or a group of people who maybe this is not politically correct can't identify by what a man or a woman is I don't think they could also identify between good and evil and I think they have lost a such core of their identity which they prefer to creep it quiet. These people who became so famous and excelled in their careers by not being quiet by putting themselves out there time after time >> are now deciding the worst silent. But there's a there's a beautiful side of American jewelry as well. And that's what I want that's what I want to switch to because >> part of what's made this week unique is that we have embedded um videographers from Khan 11 and uh news station in Israel and they are doing a documentary about the peace of mind and the healing process, the PTSD to shine light on that in Israel. We were talking to them last night and I asked um the director I said what surprised you most about being in our community that you came in with one vision for what the documentary look like and and it's changed. He said the whole documentary changed. I said why? He said because the focus now is going to be on the American Jewish community. I said what about it surprised you? He said we were shocked by every single member that we speak to in your community. The tension that they feel between living in America and being in Israel. He said, and I don't think Israelis know that story. He said, I don't think that Israelis know that there are hundreds and thousands of Jews in America who, even though they're here, feel their heart there and feel like a real tension, a pull, and they're sending their children there. And it's not if we're going to move, but when we're going to move. Um, and so there is that entire segment of American jewelry that has had this awakening after October 7th. Why did that surprise the director so much? Why is that so surprising to Israeli society? I think that the average Israeli who who didn't grow up in Katamon Kashon Raana, you know, >> grew up >> in different parts of of who who who doesn't know that half of this country in Israel is built by good American Jews, some religious, some less. Um, some of them will never be in America until they're 25, 35, or even 52, right? And because I think there's a humble side to American Jews in most areas, I think they they they just want to give, like this week, so many Israelis will go through their life and have no clue about the contribution of American Jews to the state of Israel, to the army. So some things are very easy to measure because when you're now meeting a delegation from Bokeh or from Riverdale or from Tene and they're coming to Masul or to the near the border in Lebanon and they're spending a day with you and giving you not just presents and and and drawing from the kids who I went in with Gaza and every they're in my bag but essential like very expensive material, you the guys see it and it's an eyeopener and not everyone has the opportunity to come to on peace of mind and to spend a week but when they do from the first second they hear you speak on that bus speaking words of EMTT saying I don't live in Israel but my heart is there and I didn't go to the army but my heart is there the opposite of that director you say I I'm here and I'm proud to be here and I will do what I can to to make sure that you always feel safe. And a lot of Israelis have or had before October 7th a very cynical approach to to those Jews who live in those beautiful houses and have a perfect life. And then you go to Englewood and uh very hardcore dati right-wing uh from Duvan who didn't even want to come in the beginning said why do we have to go I don't speak English he says he's like I I and then he says to me on Shabbat morning these these people are my brothers and sisters and I will take a bullet for them >> in six days. I can't say his name. This this he never left Israel. You know, also the they they never leave Israel. So, I think that there's pros and cons to that. But when you arrive at the airport and someone greets you and every single people barbecue, people are saying to you again and again and again, thank you. For me, this week, two people said to me, thank you for your service or thank you for protecting the Jewish people. I I didn't go into the army to get thanked for, but when someone does that, when someone says to is such a nice thing, and they talk about it a lot in the Torah, and I I have done a 0.009% of what the hardcore combat soldiers did. If my platoon commander comes in and I I stand like I stand with rabbis. I've done I barely done anything. I've done my part but it doesn't come close to but to and someone looks you into the eye and he says thank you for protecting the Jewish people. It's just a nice feeling and we've been hearing it for the last 5 days non-stop and not on the like they mean it. >> They feel it. You I'm staying in someone's house. For the first two three days we didn't even have to time to speak and on like a evening conversation he starts telling me that he goes once a month to to to help Israelis with their eye surgery >> th this guy Larry at an October November I don't know when saved people's eyesight this this amazing humble yid who's who's going to the state of Israel Well, not getting a dime for it, he says, "This is my contribution." So the Israeli guys who are secular and more cynical understand that wait a second, we are surrounded by people who genuinely deeply love us and respect us and support us. Not by words, not by fake aud and and my house is open for you. My fridge is open for you. My time is with you. I'm going to take you to the fun the funnest things I can and I'm giving give you the most private room I can. And they see it and that's why it's changed because seven days ago the focus was totally different. But when you meet and when you meet which is if I have to say what this week is about in the end the most important mitzvah the first mitzvah I don't so what if your house is beautiful and your cars are fancy if you open the door without a smile and you don't make someone feel at home you won't feel at home and what happens here and in many other Jewish community the guys feel at home after five minutes and they go home and they say we have new family and brothers and sisters And that's why the connections stay forever. Someone to look into the eyes and say, "I'm here for you. I respect you. Thank you." That's it. It's an enormous privilege for our community and this conversation has been an enormous privilege. Just end with one more question. I can't let you leave without telling us what you think is the legacy of your great-grandfather. from what you've heard, what you've learned, what you've studied, what you've seen, just end by telling us what you think is his legacy for those who are not as familiar with him. >> Do I have time afterwards for one questions to the both of you? >> Sure. >> Yeah, sure. >> Um I think I I I don't my great-grandfather I read parts of his book. Um but the the the legacy of him um I know two quick stories. One is the cat the the famous um picture of Rabbi Lupian uh feeding the cat and that it's in many many house house it's and I think there's something very special about it. Someone so gadul seeing a cat in the street and giving him water. Um I look for that in leadership. I look for leaders who know their leaders but um or or I think there's a lot in it emit >> they don't view what's beneath them to also care about >> and to to lean and it's just an animal but it's not just an animal and there's a lot of mous there talking about mal and I also know from my grandfather Bion Lupian who I had the honor to take to shum kipper for in his last years um he said to me once that Um on one of the Roshash Rab stood for 45 minutes in his spot with his talisan and saying and so many times in life even myself I could feel that I'm something. I'm flying to Miami next week with my work or or or you know I I came back from the war or I swam in ice water a week ago or I very quickly men or or me I'll talk in my name we and and and to feel like I relate more to to you could talk on podcast and you could give speeches, but if it if you behave that way and if you don't give cavote to to to bigger things um and to other people, it's it's not worth it. Uh, so I could relate to my great-grandfather in in in knowing who you are but but keeping it low and and looking at the things that for most people are like the cat in the street and to find to try to find empathy which um I'm I'm also working on. Beautiful. >> Okay. What question do you have for us? >> I have you um >> I prepared one question and >> Oh wow. >> Yeah. >> First of all, I thought the rule was you can't prepare questions. We didn't prepare. I know but but I told you that I don't I have when people tell me rules I I always have that >> okay >> I have that uh mostly because I got to know you in the last four or five days and and I I also feel at home here in the area and but I feel very close to my host and and I I how do you teach faith honestly after October 7th um in a community that or to a nation that is their heart is broken. But it's for the both of you. So, um, Alera by Goldberg, take this first. And then of the three of us, I'm the least positioned to talk about this. But I think it's it's when the heart is broken is when we need the faith the most. And sometimes we reach deep inside ourselves and we realize we're not the first to be broken. And after the brokenness comes being whole. After the darkness comes the greatest light. And like you said, we look at the people before us and you think about your grandparents. You think about our family members who walked out of Ashvitz, walked out of hell. They walked out of that darkness and they maintained their faith and they built what we have now, including the state of Israel. And it's because of their courage and because of their clarity and because of their conviction and because they leaned in deeply, deeply deeply to that faith to know that it's not random and it's not chance and it's not by accident. even those painful moments somehow for some reason not that we'll understand in this lifetime we're in this world they're part of a bigger picture and part of a bigger plan and and who would we be to say that and to say that right now if we haven't been saying it for 3,000 years and we have and that's the only reason that we're still here and after the darkness comes the biggest light that was true after the Holocaust the state of Israel it's been true throughout our history and please God it's going to be true now after the darkness darkness of October 7th if on October 6th I would have told you that kamas US will be on the edge of being disarmed, diluted, gone. Hezbollah, Iran hopefully will be finished off. All of these you would have said never. And some of the light, look at the light in you. Look at your light. October 6th, you were trying to find yourself. And October 7th, the new Jew in you was born again. There's so much light that. So, it's hard. It doesn't mean that we have answers. The questions are better than the answers. And it doesn't mean that we pretend there's no doubt. There's real doubt. But with that, we live like the people before us. Someone told me and I love to picture it. You know the image of sometimes you you have no internet connection. Sometimes I'm driving. I have kids with devices that you know it's not a phone. They have an iPad. Aba, can I go on your hotspot? Can I go on your hotspot? Can I go on your hotspot? What's a hot spot? When you have no connection or a bad connection, you find someone with a great connection. You connect through them. I'm connecting through you this whole conversation because your kipa is not on your head but the faith in your heart the way you talk it's real it's genuine it's raw you're in a real conversation with Hashem you're in a real battle you're a real person Moscow shared with me he recently was at an event of a very very very religious segment of society and one of their leaders said to him you know you're lucky the people you lead believe in God half of my people half your people don't look at the what are you talking about said yeah it's easy to dress on the outside go through the motions send your kid to the right school. Do you believe you've you've been in you've been in a conversation with Hashem since October 7th that most people I don't know have had a conversation like that once in their life. So that's a light after darkness. You are that light. So how do you maintain faith? You lean on the hot spots and you find the high-speed connection through them and you look back at where we come from and you look at where we need to go and who's depending on us and even with the questions and even with the doubts you put one foot in front of the the other. That's the I think the best way That was beautiful. Thank you, Rabbi Goer. Um, my answer is going to be a little different and that is I think that to be a Jew and to be a human being means being comfortable living with contradictions. We do that every time we go on a roller coaster and you feel fear and joy at the same time. You could be watching a movie that can make you cry but also inspired at the same time. We are uniquely positioned to feel contradictory emotions. Um, and I think that part of the way that we handle situations is to recognize that not everything in life has to be binary. It's not this or that, but it could be both. And you could feel pain and joy at the same time. You could feel hope and despair at the same time. And those can coexist at the same exact moment in your heart. I've shared previously here in the show that the Balatana quotes Zohar that says that a person can feel like crying in one side of their heart and joy in the other side of the heart and it could be in one heart that can contain both of those and I think that's a uniquely human condition that each one of us have and so we like to find neat solutions and to put everything into you know neatly packaged uh arrangements but life is not like that and sometimes part of moving on and part of living is understanding that you're going to live with contradictions. And for me certainly post October 7th as a Jew here in America forget my personal life but just as a Jew part of Israel I feel that contradiction. I feel that part of me here in America but my destinies in Israel I feel the contradiction of American Jews. I feel the contradictions taking place in Israel and I realize that the answers are never going to be simple but we live with that contradiction and we embrace it. And that's part of what gives life the color that we're looking for. >> Yehuda. Thank you rabbis for having me and thank you for opening your houses to the soldiers and to the unit and to peace of mind in the fourth time. You are really uh home away from home and I feel that and I'm looking forward for singing tonight. >> I've never been more excited to I I actually wanted to say that I've never been more excited for than hearing the romantic way you talk about it. >> Yeah. >> So tonight you got to come on the beimma tell the We're going to get the we're going to sing. We're going to dance. We're going to sing the of your grandparents and the of your grandchildren and the of all of us. And whichever soldiers, no coercion. Whoever wants to be in, who will be out, who wants to sing, who wants to be silent, but whoever wants, we'll all be together for the most special. Amen. Amen. >> Thank you. Thank you for giving us your heart today for an amazing amazing conversation. >> Shabbat shalom. Or like they say in Tel Aviv, have a nice weekend. I don't I don't say that. I say good chas. >> Thank you for listening to Behind the Beimo. If you enjoyed the show, please subscribe, rate, and review on Apple Podcast, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. We'll see you next week for another Peak Behind the Bea.