Hiring Superstars - Dr. Richard Roberts 77WABC Mind Your Business Host-Yitzchok Saftlas

when i would hire people any level of company i would see what they look what they look like in the interview are they sitting back in their chair talking like this or are they they're sitting forward maybe when the arms are on the desk bright item bushy tailed ready to go high energy dr roberts we're going to talk about tonight if it's okay even though you could you know take us wherever you want to go but in particular we would love to talk about hiring superstars building a dream team building loyalty corporate culture and the very delicate conversation of moving people off the bus when necessary firing with that intro a very special warm welcome dr rich roberts thank you so much for joining me here on 77 wabc thank you for having me gitzhak for those who are going to watch this one video i'll just note that you have your cichlid fish tank in your background i have mine in my background this is the the war of the sick battle of the cichlids the battle of the sickness that's correct my secrets are there his cichlids are there and because of social distancing they're not getting near each other i knew you'd love that i do like that i like that that's a good one that's good uh let's jump right in hiring uh it's such a big area and you have so much experience in this area perhaps we could start with the journey of hiring a superstar the criteria for a job how important is that how important is it for a company to be clear in the job description perhaps you could shed the light and explain and by the way this is going to be a youtube episode this is being videoed besides of seeing our fishies we're going to have some great content so this will be up on youtube yes dr roberts all yours okay um there's a lot to talk about so and in the hiring process uh first we can even get there uh i do i do want to say that we have spoken a little this some of the very sophisticated areas of business you want to save to another show yes you know in the future yes and sorry for interrupting yes we've we've actually had dr roberts on twice before and we plan on having uh the honor of course he he graciously agreed to being we're going to have a series covering many different areas management advertising product selection there are many areas that we're going to be covering over the in the upcoming months we're paying me at least minimum wage right like can we discuss that off the air please right right yeah the list check bounce um anyway okay let's go on so yeah so the more sophisticated areas of business you know we're not going to tackle right now right ones where where you know we would we would have to integrate all the different areas all the different expertises um such as you know research formulation research and development medical and clinical research and development um operations regulatory affairs legal marketing analysis uh and this finance finance and you bring all these expertises together when you're doing um a product selection in the pharmaceutical industry whether you're doing um planning you know business planning for one two three four five years out and um we're not going to discuss those concepts so far and i guess in the series the third show let's talk about when it comes to hiring people this is one of the most critical areas of a business if you have if and you know dick vermeel was the coach of the philadelphia eagles a lot of years ago he went on to actually win a super bowl with the rams but he said that inst when he would go to the draft instead of drafting for the particular position he needed he would try to trap the best athletes and there's a lot to say for that you know it depends what kind of position you're looking for and there's obviously very different qualifications that are needed and then you need to try to to sort through all the applications and figure out if you're actually getting that right person if you make a mistake and you get the wrong person it could be a whole lot of headaches and potentially legal entanglements and poisoning of the well of the of the student body so to say so hiring is is really really critical when i first joined the company we had about 110 employees the company was not very sophisticated at that time much more distribution the tiny little bit of generic manufacturing going on and then as the company grew and eventually including with our contract sales force we had about about 800 800 employees as we grew from about 35 million dollars in sales to to over 600 million dollars a year in sales then the the quality of people the capabilities that we brought in change dramatically and i can tell you a lot about that but let's start first basic hiring yeah you must know what you're looking for and you need to write a somewhat detailed job description don't bypass this if you're looking for someone who's going to work in your warehouse and is going to be able to pack boxes that's one skill set if you're looking for someone who's going to run finance it depends even what area finding what level of finance if you're a smaller company your sales are half a million a million three four five million a year that's going to require more of an accountant as you start to grow bigger and you're going to get and and massive amounts of cash are flowing through then you really need an expert in finance um and by the way if you're doing manufacturing manufacturing itself is an entirely different um accounting or financial expertise because there you need to be able to know how to allocate labor costs raw material machine time and allocate all these things in terms of reserve um absorbing overhead right and and dropping the bottom line so but let's just talk about the basic hiring of people you're gonna you have to put get out your job description what you're looking for then you're going to get in a resume you need to start with the resume first of all look for how long this person has stayed in jobs if you find someone has changed jobs every six months to one year to two years and they've been in five different jobs in the last 10 years or the last seven years or five years that's a real warning sign now they're going to tell you all the reasons this management team didn't know what they were doing and i left and then that managed this company was going into business so i left everybody's got an excuse but it's a real warning sign do they knock it along with people did they talk a good game this person in getting hired but then when it came to performing they really didn't perform um are there other skeletons is there a barren behavior is there theft uh is there fraud so um i'm not saying it can't be good and there are some people who leave switch jobs every couple of years because they are on an upwardly mobile path and you'll see that they were a supervisor then became a manager they became a director became vice president but even with that with the switching every two years now know that if i mean my company was based on loyalty i was truly loyal to our employees in front of them behind the scenes a lot of pressure i thought of myself was because of my love for my employees and my caring about them and their families um and and my employees were loyal back to me but if you're someone's jumping jobs all the time there is no loyalty and if they're gonna leave for another one dollar an hour five dollars an hour or another 150 000 a year um depending what their salary is the bonus you need to that's one warning sign when you see them changing right changing jobs a lot um another thing to do is question them on the details of their resume now as especially as you get to higher levels of of capability or expertise um if you don't have that expertise yourself have someone in the room who does so if you don't know research and development and you know make sure you have somebody from r d in there again give you a great example there was this um a mistake i mean sometimes by mistakes i made you know but uh uh an executive i had the idea well if worse if we're let's say at that time 300 300 million your company and this guy was an executive in one of the big pharma companies that does a hundred billion dollars a year well thinking to a hundred billion dollars a year of work he can certainly do our 300 million dollars one would think yep yeah no no maybe but probably not if they were very high up in that company there is a very good chance they were they were political they were politically talking type of person and what you do is look at what they put on the resume so if it's a finance guy and he says under him they were able to uh improve their manufacturing processes and save eight million dollars a year so they're great right okay which manufacturing processes did you improve oh the making of tablets okay what method were they using to to granulate the blood the materials for the blend uh i don't know what was it wet granulation was it dry blend was it extrusion was it water based alcohol-based did you use fluidized bed dry he doesn't know anything because then you because if he does anything when they ask well how did you improve those processes right and you'll find out he doesn't know anything he happened to be the cfo at the time that the manufacturing and quality or r d people made those improvements and he's taking credit for stuff he doesn't know um remember we had a one guy who came from one of those big big pharma companies oh boy was he good at finding the statistics that showed how great things were we were losing money hand over fist we're heading towards bankruptcy but he could show you well you know the packaging lines efficiency improved by 15 last year okay but he had nothing to do with it he doesn't know anything about packaging lines or packaging efficiency or switching over the lines to a new product or new level and the level and and the um the cleaning and and the inspections that have to go on and and the label checks there's nothing about this so ask them what's on their resume but dig into the details of it and if you don't if you don't know those areas make sure you have if and if you don't if you don't have someone in your company who knows it um have a hire a consultant who knows that area to come in and join you for the questioning so they click they claim these things so go find out if they really know what the things are they're claiming another question that has to do with the resume what's your take on the references that someone lists on a resume superb question um generally the references on a resume are worthless if anybody if sorry if someone is applying for a job is even mildly capable they're going to make sure that they spoke to those people first and these are their friends these are their supporters so when you look at the references of the resume it's helpful because it tells you who not to call i remember one guy i was i was looking at hiring potentially and uh you know i don't mean to pick on finance having to be you know guy for chief financial officer okay we never hired him and he worked at a certain company and he gave you know a couple of the vice presidents on the resumes fight i tracked down the ceo of that company and he said i'll tell you the truth but it has to stay here he can't tell anybody i said absolutely he said the guy just locked himself as in his office from the moment he got in until late at night he didn't do any leading nobody knew what he was doing in there he was he was just basically he was a number crunching accountant and not a financial leader was going to get out there when the budgets are out and say after every couple months you know to the different vice presidents why are you spending this amount over budget or if maybe research development why are you spending this amount under budget right is this the project fully so um yeah definitely when it comes to references you must references you must must check references and understand the references on there just go you have to go to the companies that the person worked at and you can't call the human resources department right because the human resource department have no financial incentive to speak with you right about anything except give me some just very general land generic feel good feel good basic stuff yeah yes or you can speak to people the references and they ask them the names and telephone numbers of other people who work with this guy and then you go to them and that's they get referenced i just want to say one other thing sure a little off this a little references there are laws against discriminating and hiring against veterans and i got to tell you to in my experience it's like when the craziest law is around because every veteran that we ever hired were just the absolute most superb employees um and there was a uh i remember i saw an interview by a movie director uh making a a and they hired uh uh real navy seals for the movie and he said he couldn't believe it he would generally before he when he has the set going he says this person has to be there you have to be there to be here he's used to actors where they're acting up they're not there on time and he said we'll look up and the navy seals they're rolling their spots you're ready to go immediately in my experience military training is i mean it's it's it's it's great for the society it's great for um teaching people how to perform right it's great for teaching people how to organize in their lives and in my experience when it came to veterans they were the absolutely wonderful employees great for the company i mean great for the company because of their training their rigid training that they got and then they apply it in the workplace it's just a dream for it's a boon for the business veterans are disciplined they're hard-working they understand self-sacrifice um they understand deferred gratification um and they're very responsible they communicate upward and they're really really great dr rich roberts thank you again for joining me here on mind your business thank you i would just want to make a couple more comments about hiring then we go on to whether you're whatever your loyalty is okay loyalty fine um when i would hire people this was any level the company any level i would see what they look what they look like in the interview are they sitting back in their chair talking like this or they they're sitting forward maybe with the arms or on the desk bright item bushy tailed ready to go high energy um you know you don't want that guy telling you how great you want someone who's ready to charge forward um remember i had a vice president senior vice president of sales and marketing you sometimes he'd be talking and while he's in the chair he would jump up out of the chair he was like full of energy ready to go that's great so proactive yes no matter what no matter what the job is you uh you really do want to get someone who's bright-eyed and bushy-tailed and um that was actually taught to me when i was in medicine by a physician mark kelly was headed at penn university pennsylvania of the um house deaf training program um so he was he was great at that the second thing i want to say is when when i would hire people at higher levels including at the highest levels they could be making 500 000 a year base salary and bonuses they might have 30 or 40 years of experience um the one question i would ask them is what jobs are below you and if there's anything that's below them i didn't hire them now i'm not hiring somebody at that level and paying them that amount of money to mop the floor of course but let's say we have a big customer coming in and the floor has to be mopped and nobody's around if they're not willing to do it i don't want them it's not because i need that floor mop it's because they have an attitude right the principal the principle that's right yeah so it's it's an it's an it's a we call it in hebrew meadows or a meet-up right a bad personal characteristic right they might be gaudy um um you know self-righteous i don't know that's below me i mean of course i'm not going to make my own phone calls my secretary is going to keep me from people on the phone for me no pick up the phone if you can't pick up the phone and dial it make a call then you're not the type that i'm looking for i'll tell you by the way it's very funny a little little tangent but yeah we once had i think it was a united states senator coming to visit the plant and i just took a quick walk through i walked into the granulation department and i saw a little bit of water on the floor in the hallway and there was a mop so i picked up the mop and i started to go to the puddle of water those guys ripped that mop out of my hand so beautiful because that for them it you don't like the ceo president ceo dr rich roberts dr rich mopping the floor to me wait i would go home i would change dirty diapers i would throw out the garbage um you know and ridiculous i'll give you another example um i know this happened a number of times when the uh in the um uh in the factory part of the of the company when the ever the workers were in the break room and then the bell went off and they'll be coming down the hallway and to go back to their you know their manufacturing machines so i saw them coming so i pulled the door open they held it open for them nobody wanted to walk through it i said please come on no no no it's okay you go well i said no please just you're just being a man it's okay it's just me go through go through um that also sends a signal that's right i hope i'm i don't know if i don't know if i'm allowed to mention uh you know torah and judaism when they could imagine sure sure okay we have a fundamental concept that every person has itself a king every person every human being has a spark of god in them there is an intrinsic value an intrinsic dig an intrinsic dignity to every person so everyone deserves to be treated with respect um now some people say oh that's good for business okay maybe it's good for business but i do it because that's what i believe so treat everybody with respect um and and that's something i look for when i'm going to hire people at senior levels to make sure i don't want anybody there who thinks they're greater than everybody else now let's move on to loyalty now of course for uh those out there with common sense they understand just like dr roberts was saying beforehand if the ceo it starts at the top if the ceo is being a mensch most people will be a mensch because they it starts at the top but that said let's dig in building loyalty to the point where people stay they're enthusiastic there's low turnover all those issues this big topic of loyalty dr roberts i hand it right back to you okay there's so much to say i'll tell you a little story in in 1997 our company was facing potentially facing bankruptcy late 1996 and 1997. and at one point we were we were three weeks from bankruptcy and we and you know and everyone knew everyone in the company knew we were in bad shape they knew that the facility was in a state of disrepair um i had been communicating with people which is from a human resources perspective very critical tell people the truth tell them what's going on except in certain circumstances where senior management has to be willing to take the anxiety and take the heat and protect the people from being too too worried but um you know but yeah i tell people was going on and they all saw it and they knew that we had people coming and looking potentially to buy the company and investors nothing was working out things kept getting worse and worse so when we were just about three weeks from bankruptcy uh we had this this uh two groups came in two investor groups one of them um is i'll tell you it's elliott associates which i think is the largest hedge fund in the country and they had a their representative on our you know representing them in this deal uh to buy into the company give us money and cash and who would also be on the board of directors and um at one point i told them i said look listen look i got to tell you something this is in a closed meeting the employee's not around i said we everyone here knows that we're in severe financial strains every all the employees here know that i love them and that i care about them there's the unions have come around several times trying to you know try to you know trying to unionize the employees and the employees totally shut them out and i pledged the employees that i will not get a raise until they first get a raise and i also told them i don't know if they'll survive or not but i'm telling you if we do survive and if we become successful if eventually we can sell the company or go in the stock market and and get money that way every employee must get stock options now so that they will experience and they will profit from that from their loyalty to me and and if we have success fine this group agreed they they ended up buying in fine three years later and by the way the deal was done 24 hours from bankruptcy that's when we finally got the deal done wow three years later the year 2000 we got back to break even and the representative for elite associates said rich i want to tell you something the ultimate reason why we did this deal is when we when we saw how you stood up for your employees behind closed doors we knew that we could trust you with our money when we're in manhattan and in wall street and you're here in philadelphia running the company now i didn't tell them this because i thought it would help them to invest it didn't even occur to me and i really had no experience at that point dealing with billionaires or multi-billionaires no i have lots of experience with that but um i know experience and wall street had no experience at that point but um this is just a case where the race really just show loyalty you you can expect your employees to be loyal to you but you must be but if you're going to be loyal to them and by the way it's not enough just to be loyal to them and to care about them you have to tell them that you're that you care about them you have to tell them that you're loyal for them when the health care comes up for renewal each year and the company has to dish out another six hundred thousand eight hundred thousand one point two million a year or have their co-pays go up and i decide the company's going to pay it i would put out a memo i would have a bulletin board behind glass now since everybody has cell phones and computer screens maybe you would communicate that way i'm not sure um but you could also do the bulletin board be mixed maybe it's not maybe it's an electronic bulletin board in the lunchrooms but you you and to all employees from me telling them this is what the cost went up we every almost every company asks you to pay x dollars more each week in coping but no we're going to absorb this and you tell them along the way you communicate with them um so i can tell you also i once once joined a group of presidents of companies not pharmaceutical companies as a matter of fact the rule was uh any president could only could not have a president in that group from the same industry as any other president yeah because the compensation right and that we could speak openly and confidentially it was shocking how how often many of our problems and challenges were the same problems and challenges you just changed the name of the widget or the name of the company but similar challenges so um it's such an important point yeah and i've heard this from many ceos that any time in the room it's it's kind of the same problems just a different different set of people different set of circumstances but life is life wherever you go no we had our unique situation i mean we have we're dealing with fda we're a highly regulated regulated pharmaceutical company they weren't we also had controlled drugs we had to deal with dea they didn't we're also as a pharmaceutical company you're in the crosshairs of the media of of congress um and you know everybody they just don't want to go out and make a name for themselves so you know um any trust division so all these things um which i check i can talk about that more if you want to take a little break uh but um i just want to say quickly that i left the group because these presidents were all out for themselves their main one of their main desire was how to get more money from me and how to give less for the employees and that was so much not the way i viewed my employees i viewed i felt like like they were family members so i left the group because of that so this segment which focused primarily on loyalty which of course today the trending term is corporate culture many key points one of them of course is to communicate without communication you can't out of sight out of mind without communicating it to the team you can't expect them to appreciate everything the company is doing because it's just like oh oh they really did that which is which is why also it's very important if a company is doing something for its team communicate it let them know don't just you know don't just assume that people will uh will get it on their own we're going to talk about the very sensitive topic moving people off the bus when necessary the one word firing it's not a pleasant subject but it's something that uh all too often companies struggle with and they hold on to the wrong people for too long and the as dr robert said earlier on the show it they poison the well etc dr roberts perhaps i'm just gonna you know you could be as open as you could be about the very delicate subject of when a company has to fire someone an employee okay again there's many many issues when it comes to terminating an employee now some some stuff some cases are very easy you know weird cases one guy was dealing crack out of the men's room um so okay that wasn't so hard um and there are a couple there are a few other times when uh great stories i could tell you but uh some people were stealing narcotics and we had to run undercover investigations one actually in coordination with the drug enforcement agency dea so those are not complicated although i mean running another i would run the undercover operations and you'd have you know ex-fbi or xcia type people who would have they have companies they're out there and they're availably hired right and there's all kinds of surveillance and all those things so those things are those are easy now you can have an employee who is just not doing the job that they're supposed to do um coming in late leaving early uh not coming back from lunch break one time performing poorly if they're supposed to do you know 50 things they do too now you would need to have if you don't have an experienced human resources manager director you need to work the human resources attorney because you need just to sort of line things up you first give the person a verbal warning they called in you always want to have two people on your side to witness it you call them in the office um maybe if you have human resources department it'll be the human resources director that will do it with someone else there to witness it you give them a verbal warming look you know you're supposed to do this and this and this you're not doing them or you keep coming in late uh here's all the days came in late you know we we can't have it you if we let you come in later everybody else will say there's no consequences to it so um you give them first a verbal warning but you must write a memo uh a memo to the file detailing who was there who was there you and that person with the employee what you told them the issues were then if they don't correct them you have to give them a written warning and the written warning needs to say if you you know you need to get the stuff this stuff fixed if you don't get it fixed we're going to have no choice but to terminate your employment if they're really just not up to getting the job done for whatever the reason is you could you then go to either a final warning or a performance improvement plan where you say we're going to give you three months or two months or six months whatever it is and you need to achieve this and this and this and this objective in that period of time and if not then you're going to be terminated from the company now you would you would do this always in consultation with an attorney you will not send any such memo without the attorney reviewing it first um and you and you might have to accelerate the process depending on how bad the employee is in in many cases some cases you find an employee is bad mouthing the company they're stirring up discontent among the employees and now they're kind of really poisoning the environment and in that case you may just have to terminate their employment anyway now different states have different laws but you know our company was in pennsylvania that was a you know a um they were at will employees so you can terminate them for no reason whatsoever the trouble is if you do so many employees will come back and sue you claiming that you sued them for some kind of discrimination this way or that now if you discriminated them if you if discriminated against them and hiring them i mean terminating them well wait a second whatever that discriminatory category was they still had it when you hired them right so you didn't discriminate when you hired them that's right but they're claiming discriminating fire them and in most cases they just want five thousand ten thousand dollars and they'll go away uh it's just a quick thing but if they do want to make a big case out of it you do have to you know you might have to fight it and you do have um you have to weigh how much legal expenses are going to cost you uh you know versus um you know let's say it's going to cost you 80 000 illegal expenses plus you don't know the outcome you may end up settling with them for twenty thousand um but of course anytime you settle with them you're going to have a severance agreement which which requires them not to say anything bad about the company um and if anyone calls about how their job was you're gonna you're gonna agree what the one line is you know we simply don't discuss previous employees whatever it will be um don't lie we never lie so if you do end up paying this person money then then it will only be again with a lawyer guiding a human relations labor lawyer guiding you and there will be a separation agreement in which there will be things like non-disparagement clauses where the employee agrees not the same thing bit about about the company the employee agrees not to go to another company and try to hire your key talent away or those types of things um if and by the way a very good way to pay these things out is at their normal um rate of pay so in other words if you're going to end up giving them three months of salary let's say and they get paid every two weeks you're going to continue to pay them as this severance ev once every two weeks until the three months are up that way if they do start disparaging the company doing something to hurt you that's against this agreement you just stopped the payments great point you hold on to the level the whole sum of money yeah and the leverage is lost yeah yeah you don't have the leverage um now when you deal with much more senior people many times they will have employment agreements in which case they'll be it will be already explicitly in there that if they're severed you don't give them any reason whatsoever they're not going to sue the company and you're going to give them x dollars and then they're gone and i have i have used those agreements a couple of times um the other thing is you can um you can sort of push someone out but you can only push them out if it's based truly based on their bad performance so there's something called destructive termination if you tell them okay your vice presidents and now your new office is the bathroom and your job is to stand is to sit in this bathroom stall the entire day okay then they quit right well you will you will quickly be sued and you will easily lose that as what's called constructive termination in other words you created an environment which was equivalent to terminating their employment because they can't they can't have that job right um but on the other hand i remember somebody i had at vice president level and this guy again came a big company he was power hungry he kept wanting to take over areas outside of his area of expertise and and unfortunately i was listening to him for a while and and then i started to realize what was going on so when we had a problem in one area i don't want to say what the area was for fear that you know you know it'll identify him but i wrote him i said a memo i said uh this has gone wrong in that area please send me the standard operating procedure that you had established to assure that this wasn't going to happen now he was just a politicrat he was always just talking backstabbing trying to get more stuff underneath him but he didn't know how to actually run anything there was no plan and then i started putting the pressure on him that way then all of a sudden one morning um my my uh i see he's calling me he's calling me you know uh on my phone calling calling calling i'm not answering i don't have to be in such a rush to answer the phone now my secretary calls me and she says she's hearing rumors that he's about to quit he got another job so right like like oh no he's leaving i held him i held his feet i held his feet to the fire legitimately for his bad performance and and now he's getting another job so he's fine he tells me got another job i wish him make much success i put out a memo to all employees he's found another job in another company we miss you much much success wish him well and then by the way i just have another vice president we're hiring now because i've been interviewing you know not the ducks i've been interviewing for the last two months for his replacement um but you know but you get never back stab never yeah just you know don't do that you don't do that let them go let them be gone um i'll even give you another example of this now be careful what i say there were two employees at very high positions in the company very high not the top and very high positions making a lot of money and i had great relationships with employees all through the company um we had a lot of employees from india um that for some reason in india they trained there a lot of schools in pharmaceuticals and they teach people in pharmaceutical manufacturing you'll find many people as immigrants from india working for work in pharmaceutical manufacturing really good people hard working honest and i some of them told me that once one of them is in management he said these two guys spoke to him about coming with them to another company and then i did more research and i found out it was true so i suspended these two guys pending an investigation we got in lawyers questioning everybody including questioning them and i found out it was true i actually found it was true when the the those details anyway um and and what happened was some of the vice presidents said to me if you terminate them now don't give them any severance give them nothing they've been totally disloyal they've been treacherous i love these guys i even took them to like some from football games i paid for you know i'm a nfl fan um and i still like these guys but they were just i think there is just unsophisticated in this regard there is sort of the fantasy of of the great advancement god sort of got away from them so i could have terminated them they each were married each have young kids left them with nothing then i thought you know is this what you want you want guys do you want guys in in the pharmaceutical industry running around clear badmouthing you going to fda making stuff up causing fda come in that just an inspection they expect it a lot of time anyway but it's money it's time it's money it's aggravation um so i gave them each one year of salary as a severance wow but paid out but paid out every two weeks and they had to sign a severance agreement um and they left quietly they left happy they felt terrible they felt terrible they did feel terrible because they had really betrayed me and i got to tell you internally i was crushed i trusted these guys i loved these guys i was internally crushed but you know yeah at some point at all points you're you have a responsibility to the company right you need to do what's best for the company and even if even if you're angry and you say i'm not giving these guys anything they were treacherous you still have to think well do i want these people running around unhappy even that's not what i want to do you have to take care of them the role of the ceo a lonely spot lonely spot on top dr roberts we have roughly one minute left any i i it's that's an unfair question i'm going to ask but perhaps just a final 60-second takeaway be very careful and do the work as you hire and you have to manage people remember if you're the president of a company a ceo of a company people are going to look at you for the example i was determined that i would be the hardest working person in the entire company nobody would ever work and you set that example you set the example for honesty you set the example for loyalty and your employees will emulate it and if you set the example in the in the opposite direction expect your employees to emulate that also you don't do it because it's good for the company you do because it's the right thing to do i love the honor of interviewing c-level executives and sharing their great advice and perspective on mind your business i'd love to get your feedback post it in the comments 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