Menachos Daf 59

All right, Daf Nunes Wednesday's Daf and we get to pick it up on Dafunes at the mission at the top as we actually break down the components of a carbon ma. But as the mission is going to explain, there's going to be different flavors of carbon ma. Some require both shemen and levina. There are some that are she leav There are some that have lava she and some have leav four different permutations. Now we break them down. The alo shea what requires both she and Levina. Well, the classic one is going to be a minus. As Rashi says, if someone just then you bring it with both the she and the as the actually speaks out and continues the mission of the other ones that are going to require both she and are commonly translated as loaves versus wafers, different styles of baking, which we've learned already has to be burned in Gansen. They don't eat it at all that we talked about at the end of the minimum which is interesting that we even single out nim as an independent min car and I was bothered by the actual there and which incidentally is the only that requires both she and continues the is there is no in the is the opposite aim to for different reasons because the tire doesn't want you to put or into the so it shouldn't be muddon is just like the does not get any sheas papa whenever we learn about the list of we list it as a list of 10 this is how rashi in his second shot understands it which we'll go with whenever you have a list it's always going to be a list of 10 like our Mishna but that's Let's say if a person's to take upon themselves to bring hold that you can bring both within that same kind of ma. So according to that would be number 11. So kamash delight. So our pap is telling us that our Mishna is not going like and therefore if a person's to bring it's got to be either one or the other either from or the says you're supposed to put on it and we need the to say that because I would have made but still yet so therefore certainly you should need the she on the lur comes the says only on the you put the sheon continues the price of the says you got to put on the there is no on as our mission said because I might have made still so You should have to put on your put the on it on the then the says by the when they brought their it required on top he the says that it is a carbon it's a as opposed to the that doesn't require either she or going back to the beginning of the Bryson that says that doesn't need any but why don't we say that comes and tells us that why are and now the government is going to do a few of these where we're going to try to figure out where the should apply and it makes more sense that the Tana would be with she from the written by because I'm going to show you more parallels between and then because you have isarin both of them only need and a flower cle both need a clearis you do the avoid outside of the bas they'll both have a if they're left overnight they both have a and both are put on the fire of the so there's more parallels between that of having more than why both are carbon as opposed to as opposed to which in a da to because it's a carbon where the shim of the after the k is taken off is eaten by the kayan also the are eaten as opposed to the kim which is completely burned pigula there's shak piggle on them because there's a mater which you don't have by the kayan and both the and the are done on shabas there's a bit of a difficult rashi over here where rashi says the issue is bashab is shabas now why would that even be the rash is bothered by that could have said even better. Dr. Rashashi could have said it's the burning of the which is done by the upon him which for sure should be. So why don't we compare the toon nephesh? It makes more sense to include the more than because the Tyra says the word nephesh when it comes to the nephesh of and nephesh is always a reference to an individual person a like that those are the ones that need she as opposed to which is not reflected well by nephesh. Moving on now to the next part of the Bryce Omar you put on the now why don't we say and now we do the similar kind of a thought process I might have thought because it's more to say that of should be from because you have the same similarities it gets mixed with a single of sheman it has the both the are brought on their own as opposed which has only brought that you're bringing as we said it's not the once again says it makes more sense to say should be more than because it says nephesh which is a next part of the min that even the on the eighth day of the mishkun's initial use by those below him you need to put on levina now maybe the terrorist coming to the min of that day rather than be marbitt says why would you say that rab I get why you would want to be marba that for levina because wouldn't have known that the ma required lava if it wasn't specifically included but if you're telling me the tires coming from that from needing ly why would I even need such a mus I never would think we're going to learn a unique from that time from a that's leyus so it must be it's aui and not a mi and then the last part of the braa he is that the doesn't require both and now and not because you have to bring it as brought because turning over to they both get eaten. They both have piggle because of the mater both the mater on the second day is madesh and that new khadesh is not going to be mut to use in the b mikdash as a carb until the is brought. So both of them are amat tanufa they both have denufa both the and the have to be brought from the grains that are grown init as opposed to other carbon that do not require that bisman both the are brought at times second day pes or shuis but is not and both of them are brought from the that's the whole point and the has no such and I'll tell you even and all those similarities to the that the has is more than you have by So that should be for that of that we see by the and the mute of would therefore be said by the which the says mistabra again because nephesh so therefore we're going to be as opposed to the despite all those others because of the nephesh we had learned in the last and the doesn't get either she or it's not just optional It's so by putting either of these ingredients that will itself beer and let's say put the oil on illegally on your ruined it. But if you put on the levina which doesn't absorb into the flower you can collect it and therefore be once again if you put the she on the of the if you put a cle that has the she in it on another cle that has the not the carbon it's only going to be when you add the oil into the silus talk to gar says don't put the shemen by And if you put it there, you've ruined it. Now, I might have thought that the next part of the Puk talking about the lev is going to have the same den meaning limer. It's not true. The tyr still classifies it as a carbon kas even after the lev is on there. Maybe I can even give it the classification of a carbon kas after the she's put there. No limer. He that it is a carbon kas only it that carbon that you added the leva but a ma that oil was added. Now it's game over. So why is the oil the problem and the is not the problem which the B says you can't take back the she once it absorbs into the flower you could take out the little pieces of levina and therefore that's why we're going to understand it to be kosher once you take it out let's say you put this finely ground into the so now I can't take it out practically is it because since the is finally ground I can't actually take it out practically it's not really absorbed into the flower and therefore it stays somehow uniquely separate and this ground up levina is not going to be absorbed so maybe it's not going to possibly cover I could bring you a ray from our Mishna because the mission says you got to collect it take out the pieces but you got to actually collect it out that's no first of all never really gets absorbed into the flower also you could take it out but either way all right I'll bring you right from aa because you can take it out only because that it's not really the reason. So what's the bottom line? If you have this ground up that you can't take out, is it going to Before you actually collected the lev you had that because you've already passed the because of that was in there and therefore as we know from hilk pigle it has to be that the plea is the actual but since this was ple already it won't be a pig but after was taken out then you had your so it seems pretty clear from this bracelet that by pulling it out you've actually the min and therefore it's all about actually taking it out fractur but to have a p let it just be like oil that spills into a carbon ma where your machev pickle does not pos so why should the bry when the levina has not yet been taken out why did he do the lev is on it the ma is and because of that decoy you should never be able to have any kind of machev pickle even after you take out the lvina the terra called it and therefore you could be mafagal it once you take it out harmony this whole concept of it doesn't go like as we've had earlier because we know by the even if the dam is inside that when the dies that's the case he's talking about before you had the chance to do the avoid died what do you do maybe you take out another one without having to do an you pair it up and then you could do the avoid with the auz so since holds the d of the katus is still usable after you chosen this new sawyer clearly he doesn't hold since I can do something about it. it won't have the den of so the carbon here is not because I could take out the idea of that and who's the one who actually holds the says and similarly if the dies before they did the you got to spell it out so that there is a but where it's possible possible to make that change as it says that mixed up on the floor of the even though it's not on the floor of the but don't mask him because it's to do that. So we know from the balashita which is about that when it's not going to be an actual problem. So Ashi is correct and this is where we'll call it and we'll pick it up with for tomorrow's