Menachos Daf 45

All right, d's daf as we are back into country as we now pick it up from the Mishna near the bottom of meal bay zishna these different animals. So if you don't have them all, you bring what you got. But it's not clear which carbonas we're talking about. But the assumption is we're talking about carbonas of musf. So not having any of the parame of each other. But if the kahan are able to get all the pim because they have the money to buy those musf but they didn't have enough money to buy the as well. And now they're faced with the choice that they could either get all of the pim they need for a particular carbon musf without its associated or get less parm but be able to achieve the nim. do one right bring the single par with the associated and don't bring all of the par but now not being able to bring the you're not doing it completely properly wonders why isn't correct and what would be the actual to argue with as it seems that the tanakama does what are we even talking about talking about the musim from sukus that can't be because the says which says that you got to do it according to rule book it has to be brought and therefore it's all ma so that can't be because the mission says they're not each other must be talking about the carbonus of musf of both and shuis and specifically it's theim in safer because it's another time where we talk about the kipseras and that's in safer vikra moving over to alfam dea so the aim the rams that the mishna said what are those talking about if you're telling me that they're either from the rishes or the kips from the musfan shuis Why are we talking about which is a lot the it's only one is in each one of those musim. So it doesn't pass to use the lotion of aim if you're talking about the carbonus from say for which is a reference to those carbonus that are brought with how can you tell me that they're not of each other which tells us that they always need to have two of these and wouldn't be for the mission said one is not mak the other terrorist terrorist we're talking about those carbonas that are in safer par as well as the aisle of shvas's musf that's in paren this is what the mission means to say loy the terrorist So it's not that the are each other but rather it's the sets of the that are not mach of each other which is a different format than the other part of the Mishna and that's what the Gar is going to Now when the Mish says that the pim are not of each other what that means is they're not even of each other but yet that the pair of in are not mak of each other but in whom but the individual ones that are mentioned in Emor are going to be mock of each other. How can you read the Mishna that the first and the third are going to be read one way but the one in the center is understood in a different way to which the gar mask says the Mishna is structured that way that the two carbonus of the musf of shu are not mak of each other and the two carbonus on shv are nama to the musf shu and vice versa and the specialy that are brought on shama the musf of shv and vice versa and within the musf of shv itself is n of each other meaning the middle of the list that the tan is doing is tak different than the first and third and now we're going to get into some drious of the puka mirin Tomimosim. Now the challenge with this PK is that typically a carbon musf that you have onesh have two pim one is and seven but this pk sounds like it's one par one is and six kvosim. So par the singular of I might think you have to do multiple that if you only have one par that's okay you can do that you can only bring that one carbon why I say six instead of seven I would think that's the only thing you could really bring to be if you don't have seven you bring six And as the ends bring it according to what you got and it's not going to be to bring all of them once it says why do I even need you to say six seems like bring whatever you can and you still bring as much as you can of those amount says how do you know that if you have them bringing them asak of one to the other that you got to bring them all which is of being a next school. We want to sounds like you're bringing this power as a carbon kas. But is that true fractur? It's a carbon because the two par that are brought as the musfesh are carbon. That's not up for discussion. And it happens to be you do bring a katas as part of the musf but that's a not a param. We're not going to be able to nope shot here. We're gonna have to wait for Alio and Nvi to come back and explain to us this difficult shot in this pyask. First of all, it's interesting that should give up and say no one can nope shot in this. Maybe someone can come along and nope. But what's also interesting the Rajb asks for a kasha why does say that we have to wait for iovi to come back and tell if we're talking about this mana. Why don't we ask him himself? He's coming back. He can tell us what he meant. Perhaps this is a that the progression is going to be that will come before there's going to be a full-blown says we're not going to but apparently Ashi was not phased by that. I'll tell you what isra the milu those things that were inaugurating the besdu in the same way that had the in the mbar and they brought a parish and so too when the second mdash was rebuilt they also took the par for as part of their never said to You put me at ease. Next, all these can't eat. Well, who can ever eat things that are eat obviously? Why are we talking about the same kind of thing? There's no way we're going to understand this. But no, I got shot to tell me that the can't eat it because the can eat a bird that was killed alade malika which may have the idea of ne and traa because it's not a that the regular is of no traa also exists for the kahanim. Now the havamina and the mascana of how to understand malika here could really reflect that famous khakira about is malikica the shita of the or it's not shita but it's a heter of the na and the traa that's the asandisa and clalif how do we view malika and this will also exist to other things that you don't do typical like the arifa of an eglarufa or the soy zel or bidbar these kinds of that don't require the classic do we look at them as their namina might be because that's only problem for but let's say you do anifa of an egg can you now the child of that same par because that was considered it okay back to so you're going to do this on the seventh of the month now there is no such holiday on the seventh of the month the requires any it's not talking about the day of the month at all it's talking about when only seven meaning of The rub as you remember from is brought when you have of theim of the when the Tyra says it doesn't mean a month but we read it as if it said meaning something new if they invented a new and said that which is obviously not and they said it is that's when they're going to bring that parallel meaning the people have to actually carry out that a bish that the bez made the incorrect sack about. So now we just typed up a whole bunch of difficult notes and therefore we would not have actually incorporated into. So what did Khan do? Helish me 300 barrels of oil. So he would have plenty of fuel for his light and learn way into the night. So he could explain all these difficult and therefore now we have it as canon as part of our said that if you can do more with the associated that's what you should do even if it's going to cost you having other without the Now you're making it sound like the amount that you need for the carbon for both the pim and the alum are the same. But it's not true because a par needs three is of silus and an isle needs two is so why does the pos seem to say that each one of them requires an apha apha in this context means not a certain amount but it's more of a generic term that means a measure and the drussa should be which is the case of our that the B had enough guilt for a lot of but not the associated don't do it halfway by only bringing the similarly if they also had turning over you didn't have enough to buy the appropriate to go along with the so this is the do it right and don't do more halfway more about the onus and the associated these are the you need to bring meaning if you only have the just bring them without the carbon now it goes in one direction if you don't have the you don't bring the with it but if you don't have the at all then you still could bring the bananas Uhuh. It's the exact opposite. You saw they brought the carbonus. They brought the stars without having the true bananas is right, but not for the same reason because whatever is in paras over there inbar was brought in the midbar. and paramidar it was only that time but once they came into then they brought both so because now you have to explain once now we've schlloged up the mucker here why does say that he's that you don't need the to bring the that you could do with avas to be m itself without any but what do you do with once you break it either they're eat or There's no to do on these to do anything. There's no mater. It's only a mitzvah to bring those with. But then the says which sounds like it's telling us you got to bring them no matter what. Israel did become in the midst of the until the other carbonas that were brought with it could be that those that are in those could be the same seven carbonas that are in but you got to say it's not true because when you get to those you see they're not the same as the ones in pen because in Par when the PK says specifically one par and two alim but in paras it's one meaning the one in paras come as a result of a carbon musf independent of the and the one in par comes the inbar because they're two independent sets of carbonus with the one in paras being independent of the kum the ones in paras were brought in the midbar and there's no reason to think that they weren't but the ones in par which were only coming because of the were not brought in the midbar and they didn't have a mitzvah to do the until they came into it you could be you're right about the parm and the but in but maybe the kvasim which have the same numbers of amounts maybe they are the same in the same way the pim and the alim are for sure going to be different carbonas also We should also assume are different carbonas. Who told you that the par and the were different? If the kay wants to bring he could bring one par and two and or if he wants he can bring two par and one is but they're actually the same carbon and it's up to the kay how many he wants to bring which the gar says no can do since the order in which the tyra brings them is different clearly they're different carb bonus altogether as opposed to the other way around according to where the are not so my time ata makes of those two words and just like by talking about the also is talking about he makes of the exact word which is the exact word as we said many times We're not. So has to be the exact same word. And for the only time we say when there's no other exact word we use the exact word when we can which there is no matana to the so they have that difference. Maybe you could say that they're actually arguing how to understand the PK itself cuz the PK in says what totally goes to the K have aim nothing gets burned it all goes to the Ken as opposed to a carbon schlum when the get burned telling you someone goes to the he is talking about the verb he'll say and therefore you're dividing between and the uh hashem was and he gave it to the kayen. So too means hashem got it and he gave it in to the kayan. We're going to stop here and we'll pick it up at the two dots for