Chullin Daf 6

All right, today's daf of Wednesday's daf, we were talking about the status of the shritas kusi. We said that Rabban Gamliel of Beis Din were nimnu al shritas kusi lo asaruha. Rabban Gamliel and his Beis Din had paskened that shritas kusi is unequivocally assur. And Rebi Akiva bar Idi had clarified to say this is not only talking about where there's a mashgiach of a yid standing over the kusi to watch him schecht, but it's across the board, it will always be possul. This is what Rebi Akiva bar Idi told Rebi Zeira. Then there was a question whether Rebi Zeira was maskim based on a story that Rav Nachman bar Yitzchak said that Shmuel bar Assi, that he saw both Rebi Yochanan and Rebi Assi eat from shritas kusi. And Rebi Zeira had a kasha, how could Rebi Yochanan and Rebi Assi eat from shritas kusi? And he didn't want to say that they didn't hear about the halacha, he rather wanted to say that they disagreed with the halacha and they were not mekabel. And this is where we got up to yesterday. We'll pick it up five lines from the bottom of ches mem beis. De isalka da'itach le shmuelu, ve im shmuelu having mekabel halacha, if you're telling me that they just didn't know that Rabban Gamliel and his Beis Din had made this psak, cuz had they heard that they would have been mekabel, heichim mistaya moshe leichu yisur, how was it shayach they could have accidentally eaten this ma'achalos asuros? 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There's an interesting Rebi Yochanan in Pesachim in kuf yud beis that discusses whether or not that this idea of ein takal ba'al yadim ba mideh da'achila, will that extend also to gezel? If you have stolen food, is that called ma'achalos asuros? It's an interesting question about how to look at the gezel. I would submit that the Shulchan Aruch brings down a Sifrei Parshas Chayei Sarah where the Sifrei has a where the pasuk says that Eliezer Eved Avraham before he gave the nizamin to Rivka, the pasuk says "Acharei she kill the gamalim lish-tos." After the camels finished drinking, then Eliezer gave the nizamin to Rivka and the shidduch went through. So the question is, why did Eliezer have to wait for the camels to drink? As soon as Rivka gave the camels water to drink, he right away saw that she was such a ba'alas middos. You don't have to have the camels drinking. The Zohar says "Sifrei." Since Rivka was a ketana and therefore the metzi'ah of that hefker dikka water in the well really goes to her father Besuel. So Eliezer wanted to see will the camels drink? Because these camels were owned by a tzaddik, whether that's himself or maybe Yitzchak. And ein behemtan shel tzaddikim takalah ba'al yodam. So they're not going to drink from gezal. So "Acharei she kill the gamalim lish-tos." Once the camels actually drank, "V'zeh daas ha'shidduch min ha'shamayim." So you see from this Sifrei nemtza'an that you'll apply the idea of ein takalah ba'al yodam ba'malchus Asura'is where it's only gezal. And just a little bit more on this idea of ein takalah ba'al yodam. Rebbe Yisrael Vinkel in the Beis Ha'Otzar clears whether or not an ones is going to be considered a takalah. So again that machlokes with the K'vegar and the Netziv is whether or not is an ones going to be actually a tzura of an aveira with a petur onesh or there's no aveira at all. And you could hear that would make anafka mina for this shaila whether or not a tzaddik can be put into a matzav where he is forced to eat malchus Asura'is in a matzav of onesh. And lastly, what would be the source for this idea that there's no takalah ba'al yodam? So it's actually a Ramban because the Ramban says we learn from "Kasher zeman v'lo kasher asa." So the Torah is not going to allow a matzav where we can go ahead and re-litigate the finality of a psak of Beis Din and that could be an expression of this idea of ein takalah ba'al yodam. All right, but now we're moving to the top of Vov Mem Daled. "V'isa k'da'ascha lo kabal minai." If you're going to tell me that Rebbe Zeira was not mekabel from Rebbe Yaakov bar Idi to say that kusim are always going to be assur their shchita across the board. "Lishani lei." He should have said that the reason why Rebbe Yehuda bar Masya ate the shchitas kusi is not because they were arguing with Rebbe Gamliel's psak, but there was a chelek in the case. "Kan k'shei Yisrael al mi al gabav v'kan k'shei ein Yisrael al mi al gabav." "Ela lo shma minai." "Kabal minai." Rebbe Zeira was my couple of the over Robin when he already told him it must be there just disagreed with it. Now my time it goes why did come to say this is always going to be he had one time sent her mayor last week to go bring wine from sent him on an errand to go pick up the wine from them ask so mad this which says is often and he only and the said to second which literally means to put a knife by your throat if you're a but by using this it's saying if you're a you don't do what you're doing don't have the wine from the Russia over here points out that the is from and the and the suggests that clearly the didn't have a safer in front of him and he's how should be could be said so says don't worry because it's not in the it's from the it's only from after anyway the told him this so he told him the secret and the and he said okay let's make a that the of the will be my time what see justify the I'm because the had this they were worshipping this statue I guess of a dove they were in the now that doesn't represent all of the that's only that faction of that did this but the time because that's my that you are always going to be worried about the and therefore that's why it's going to all of the and they're also and getting back to the that the said what's the of the talking about the time he says when you eat bread with the been talking understand that which is before you and then the and put a knife in your neck if you're a so we understand this to mean tell me if the Talmud understands his Rebbe's a lot that he can answer his questions then then then you can start up and ask the questions to your Rebbe if the Talmud is concerned that the Rebbe Rebbe might be a but he's not always good on his feet to answer the questions then second by basically keep quiet cuz you shouldn't be your Rebbe. If you just can't be cuz you need to have to your questions so go to a different Rebbe. Okay, back to Rebbe ben Shaddai Rebbe last year half from Kusi. So now Rebbe Yosi was sent by to get this wine from Kusi. Seems like it's the same old man. Let's say the Kusi don't have Torah. Hello Rebbe the secret of Rebbe the whole Rebbe the secret of Rebbe Rebbe and Rebbe and Rebbe they gave the Kusi the status of Rebbe. Now Rebbe, what was the that they were talking about that they gave these Kusi this status of Rebbe that was already handled from the earlier Kufa from Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe. So Rebbe Rebbe didn't need to make new so what's the in their after the in Rebbe Rebbe it wasn't totally also Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe and the why wasn't it why didn't Rebbe Rebbe have more success? Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe says that it was the socially that people were had more to do with the Kusi during Rebbe time and therefore it couldn't be or it could be that the actual numbers changed and it went from being a to a Rebbe and because the changed it became the of the Rebbe. Now my Rebbe Rebbe what does that expression mean when we say that Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe Rebbe that's an idea that references to Rebbe cuz the is houses that open up into a Rebbe however Rebbe Rebbe that we treat like a Rebbe and therefore the only way to take care of it is within a Rebbe that everybody has to be but let's say one person's not and they show up in the middle of the is they can be Rebbe they can kind of succeed from this group and therefore they're no longer a problem that they weren't Mishnah from the ear. Now, that rule of Lavado is only a rule for Yidden not for So, this is the of Kusim that we are talking about. You got the nut from Yid who publicly is Shabbos. That kind of guy is he can still apply this rule that we talked about for the but let's say he is Shabbos before and he is Shabbos before and he is Shabbos before and he is He actually has to rent it. So, that Shabbos before has the din of the that has to be Now, Kate said, how does the Yid actually do this process of giving up his in that area? He tells his neighbor my is going to be to you or the answer and you don't have to make a proper you don't have to make a full sooner. You just be yourself. Fine, that's the end of that. Now, we change subjects a little bit and we go back to the idea of they were visiting this in. They had some kind of food that had eggs cooked in wine. Sounds delicious. The is whether or not it was because we have to assume these things are whether or not it was because we have to assume these things are because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is because is On this and this is has to be Now, there is a problem with this because we don't know that there was anything wrong here. Even if you're going to say there was that he but itself is only a so maybe we're talking the whole is only a and should say that it would was or points this out in his and says you see from this that is not an actual standing of something, not that we don't know if this is mooser because of the initial something made it now that I also so this is my therefore you can apply the claw of the cobble yard and anyway not for the dog he found a hater that the my will not be when it's in because the Tanya the price is in this if you buy wine from to use as an ingredient in these mixtures or lots of or lots of all these different kinds of mixtures I wish you the my because the ingredient was purchased as the my and that's a real problem they obviously if it's not certainly going to be also but they not let's see you buy a finished or one of these finished mixtures from the you don't know whether or not it was already beforehand before it was mixed together that is the place you now buying it as a or more about the of the my and therefore that's why it wouldn't be a for him to have eaten it for the all the my is that really true I bought the let's say if someone gives his neighbor's wife and she's a dough to cook you don't have to worry about that sourdough or the spices that are on it and the point of this price is you don't have to worry that she kept the ones that you gave her as ingredients and swapped it out for her potentially not ones now the guy said to this woman make it for me from your own ingredients well now you got to worry about if she used her own sourdough or own spices but what do you see you have to be for the even though you're only receiving it after it's all in a so clearly we are the my even though you're receiving it as but that's worse once you gave her an instruction to use your ingredients then it's as if you're doing it yourself with these ingredients of the my so it's not really a anymore it's as if you took the wrong ingredients and did it that's one or another Chinese the time of it the sourdough the are actually given for time, for taste the time of the bottle. So we're not going to have a cooler with the time of this because of the fact that these are significant things that you're now. Now that had said that we're not for the to substitute their own ingredients with the ingredients that you supplied. I want none the third pair of there's a mission that says a nice someone who gives the dough to his mother-in-law and we're talking about where the is and also so as you nice and you first that was you give to her. You like to and also you have to that what you get back from her. Why they have to have a cuz she's to swap it out. Apparently back in the day the relationships with in-law parents weren't always so great. So we have to for that she might swap it out. So you see from this mission we are the mission over there it speaks it out that writes a heat the mother-in-law cares very much about her own daughter which is your wife. And therefore she's going to be concerned that she should cook good bread for you and therefore she'll have the heart to swap out better ingredients. But a is not going to be for once people ask them to do this kind of baking. Turning over to the base direct the to the so we're not going to be worried about the for better quality stuff. But it's not a different mission in the third pair of says a nice to put the if you give the ingredients to that female innkeeper as you nice and you first have to be that you nice and also that what you get from her. Why they have to so the mission is that you have to be for the and this is not because of a mother daughter relationship. So the has to also the female innkeeper has a reason to want to give the better food. Why? Cuz she has good intentions. This lady who was running the inn wants to give you the the best so she might swap out the ingredients for something that's not so you have to be careful for that and her may cause this to take place. Okay, but normal we're not for to be so the mission is that you have to be for the and this is not because of a mother daughter relationship. So the has to also the female innkeeper has a reason to want to give the better food. Why? Cuz she has good intentions. This lady who was running the inn wants to give you the the best so she might swap out the ingredients for something that's not so you have to be careful for that and her may cause this to take place. Okay, but normal we're not for to be so the mission is that you have to be for the and this is not because of a mother daughter relationship. So the has to also the female innkeeper has a reason to want to give the better food. Why? Cuz she has good intentions. This lady who was running the inn wants to give you the the best so she might swap out the ingredients for something that's not so you have to be careful for that and her may cause this can grind together with the this munchie to me even when the is to me and is very used to the idea of avoiding touching the food that she is because she doesn't want to be a of when she's and she's touching everything now we're concerned that the issue is might relax her standards cuz she's might eat from some of this not grain while she's grinding it she shouldn't even do it when she's to me because it's a nice and warm even though she's not going to want to take it for herself maybe the his wife is going to give her some of this and she'll temporarily forget and eat some of this grain that was not now I am telling you that the would steal from her husband to give some grain to her friend which is what's happening here because the grain that the wife is grinding up belongs to her husband so to feed some of that grain to her without permission from her husband is other don't like that because the husband wouldn't be a small amount but he's learning if we're accepting the idea that the is going to steal a little bit from her husband to give to some of her friend isn't there also going to be the fear that she would also be food given to her by the so why does the say we're not for the I'm also the can justify the because the actual eat where it threshes meaning my neighbor who came and is grinding up this grain with me she's legitimately entitled to it even though that's for him might be wrong but at least there's a justification in the mind of the but that wouldn't extend to a of ingredients hey Ben Zeros and he was made before he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without being he ate this vegetable in Bashan without so Broke up that not kosher copper snake that we should have been made. You have a young man who had been a strong man catching by. They were actually bringing carbonas to it. They made it into a nickel plated and even gave it a name. So after a while so it is possible that Zada was a man and didn't destroy it himself but and also as a son you should have didn't want to destroy it. As a matter of fact destroyed all the so why did they leave the moving over to this gives us a left him a where he could actually make a name for himself. So I'm within my rights to go ahead and make such a dent. Now of course the idea is that since it's outside of Israel it really isn't in terms of it was a until that point that he was basically lifting. We are going to pause it here. I'll pick it up with this conversation on tomorrow's talk.