Chullin Daf 4

All right, Daf daily. Mondays Daf. And we're going to pick it up at the two dots at the bottom of Gimel and Bet. Now that we figured out how to read our Mishnah, let's talk about this Brysa about Kusi and we get to spend the Daf today about a Kusi. Turn to Rabbonan. Shchitas Kusi Muteres. And again, just to reiterate, in this context Kusi's talking about the actual Kusi, not just a reference to a but a Kusi who we have a shaila whether or not he was Gerei Arayos or Gerei Emes. So we have this Brysa that says that Shchitas Kusi is Muteres. Bameh Davar Mamrim K'shey Yisrael Eino Gavah. Aval B'Uma Sheshochat, let's say you show up after the fact and it turns out the Kusi already did the Shchita. So now you can test it out. How do you test it? By Choteach K'zayis and nice and light, give a piece of that Geshachtena flesh to the Kusi. So Achlei, if the Kusi eats that K'zayis, and we spoke out from the Chasam Sofer that it has to actually be a K'zayis, then it's Mutar Le'eichol Mishchitasah because the Kusi would be Makpid on not eating from an Aveilah. But Bimlav, but if he doesn't want to eat it, Asur Le'eichol Mishchitasah. And as we spoke out from Rashi yesterday, he's not Makpid on Lifnei Iver in the way we understand Lifnei Iver. Ki Eitzah Bei, and in the same way is Zok the Brysa, Matza B'Yadai, moving over to Maseches Alef, the Kuriya Shel Tziporim. If you find this Dekuriya Shel Tziporim, which is a Machlokes Rashi and Tosfos had a Taitch it. Rashi learns it's a string of these birds that were Geshachtin. Tosfos learns it's a basket, but either way, the point over here is the fact that they're different birds. You have this whole collection of Geshachtena birds. K'teir Roshah Shel Echad Mehem and nice and light, you cut off the head of one of them and give it to the Kusi to eat. Achlei, Mutar Le'eichol Mishchitasah. Bimlav, Asur Le'eichol Mishchitasah. Same kind of an idea. So that's the Brysa. So now Abaye and Rava that we had yesterday about how much Shmira needs to be on the Kusi can see their Shitas in this Brysa. So Abaye Dayek Me'reisha. Abaye, if you remember, was very Makpid. You need to have like a Mashgiach Tamidi. You can't just have a Yotzei V'Nichnas. He saw the Dayek from the beginning of this Brysa. And Rava's Dayek Me'seifa. Let's break it down how that works. Abaye Dayek Me'reisha because Tam Yisrael Eino Gavah. The Brysa says if a Yid is Eino Gavah, if you have a Mashgiach Tamidi, it's good. Aval Yotzei V'Nichnas Lei, it's Mashma that if you're only yet if you're which the didn't talk about but we're being that if you're that would not be good enough. But rather be safer about when you show up and it's already the time of the that's when it's going to be a problem that you need to test it out. I will yet if you're sharper dummy. But rather will be that if you're only yet if you're that little mitten dick kind of that's going to be good enough. Okay, but now need to understand the price like the way the other understands it. How come it's not going to see from the safer that necklace would be okay? Cuz I'm going to say it's not going to If you're just showing up intermittently, then that like you just showed up and it's already and will say if I care which implies you need to have that to me I'm going to say well I mean I'll go dummy. If you're then you're achieving the same of an of you've created that you've created that kind of oversight. Okay, now the price I said be added to create etc. So if you see the now has this whole parent. The string of birds, the basket of birds, you can cut off the head of the bird and test to see if the will eat it. Why is that going to work? Maybe this is the head of that bird that he properly. The knows what he did. So what kind of test is that? So we have a over here that you're talking about a case where the puts all of these birds inside his coat. Like I'm imagining the guy back from Sesame Street with his trench coat that opens up and says "Hey, you want to buy a watch?" that kind of thing. He's got all these dead birds inside of his and he takes one of these heads and gives it to the and the won't know which one it was. So from the fact that the will eat it the all of them properly. Of course there's some fun here that you get to clear cuz we get into Vegas. So I can wants to know why don't we say it's going to be right. Maybe the won't hold a bit of the wants to know what which is only according to the but we move on. I think I don't have a yard of labor got a day. when the Kusi this particular bird head that he gets he says, "Oh yeah, I recognize this one. This one is a siman that this is the kosher one that I did." Homer of Misharsha the Yid who has all these different dead birds in his coat squashed the head of that bird and therefore there is no more siman. I guess he had the squashed bird head in his dismembered only jacket. Okay, practically Marvel at the make if you're telling me there's no siman and therefore if the Kusi eats it it's a riot that all of them were go shocked in properly. But the whole Hanukkah here is that only things that are more furious but cry is what the Kusi's going to be mocked with on. The other Halacha of Shahi address of Halacha the Hagroma of the Ekor mix even the five big things which possible Shita we've only mentioned three of them so far. But besides Shahi address of Halacha pausing the Shita karate chopping the Shita cutting from underneath the Simona Shita. Also there's Hagroma which is cutting above or below the Simona more of the Ekor and just tearing at the Simona. Those are also not more furious but cry and therefore the Kusi wouldn't be mocked with on them. Rabbi Kiveger points out that Drossa is more furious but cry but Rabbi Kiveger writes in the Galena Shasha it's a sugar delicious that he's putting it all together. Uncle Panim why are we being same on the Kusi Lagabe the Shita of the Behema the her these things are not more furious but cry Allah Kive and Ziga boo since the Kusi is mocked with and Ziga boo we consider him to be reliable. So how can I mean also Lagabe the bird Shita Kive and Ziga boo and Ziga boo. So what do you got to have the whole test for just trust the Kusi's Shita on these birds. So this issue of whether or not a Kusi who's who's sick to be Naman about Zachen that are not more furious but tire is tonight. That's actually going to be telling my colleagues tonight. Did Tanya as the brice says Matzas Kusi Muteras you can eat the Matza of Kusi and assume it's not Hametz but I mean it's about you need Hametz of Pesach and we can even assume it's Lishma which is what you need for Matza of the first night of Pesach will be a liar I see you can't ever eat the Matza of Kusi Lishia and begin the dick to give it to see sell and therefore you got to be cautious that maybe it is Hametz. Rabbi Shimon Ben Gamlio Limer call Matza Shish Ziga boo Kusim Harbe Madak to give it by Yisa of Yisrael. They look about Shuva that's more mocked with than the FFB. Now on this brice about the Matzas Kusi Omar Mar Matzas Kusi Muteras for all of them yet to be a liar. chavaso b'Pesach, trekt the Gemara shita, if it's muter then why wouldn't you be yoitze with it? Because Mar d'Teima lo b'ki b'shimur, maybe you don't have the maila of that halacha of shimur for matzah, of doing l'shem matzas mitzvah. Kum ash malan, the braisa is telling us that it will also be okay for that halacha. Continued the braisa, Rabi Eliezer oiser d'risha ein b'ki b'dikduke mitzvos. Dok the Gemara k'savar lo b'ki b'shimur, which Rashi understands to mean that we are choshesh that it might become chametz. And then the braisa finally says, Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel omer, kol mitzvah she' chazika b'kusim harbeh mitzvos. Practicing by yoitzer miYisrael. Practicing by Rabi Yehuda bar Nachmani. Why is that a third shita? You're saying it's okay and good matzah. Now, because eeka b'nai d'ktiva b'lo achzika ba. This is the punchline for us. The nafka mina is about things that are in the Torah, but the kusim are not choshesh that they actually kept it. Tana Kamma savar keevan d'ktiva, because it's in the Torah, you're allowed to be sameach on them, a filga d'lo achzika ba, even though it's not known to us that they were already muksak to take care of it and do it. But Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel savar, e achzik in e lo achzik, lo you have to know for a fact that they are muksak to actually keep it in order to be sameach on them. Well, trekt the Gemara yochi, if you're telling me that according to Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel, we're only talking about where the kusim are choshesh, kol mitzvah she' chazika b'kusim, it seems like it's the wrong loshon. Im chazika mi ba'ei lei. You can't say kol mitzvah she' chazika b'kusim, it's always going to be more of a im, an if. Ela, what's the machlokes tanaim here? Eeka b'nai d'lo achzika ba. We're talking about not that it's established, but whether or not it's actually written in the Torah. Tana Kamma savar keevan d'lo achzika, since it's not b'feirish in the Torah, a filga d'lo achzika ba, it's still nami lo. But Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel savar, keevan d'achzik achzik, even though it's not written in the Torah, once they've been established that they are makpid on it, that's going to be good enough. So, come to choshesh from machlokes tanaim kamma and Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel, whether or not you can be makpid a kusi l'gabei something that's not b'feirish b'Torah, just by doing the actual mitzvah. So, the braisa that said that a shchitas kusi l'gabei these birds, you could be sameach on it if the kusi eats from it, is going like shitas Rabi Shimon bar Gamliel, because the Torah doesn't say anything b'feirish about the shchitas bird. But once the kusim started being choshesh to do it properly, you're allowed to eat from their goofa. I'm a rubber mummer and who eats meaning if there's kosher flesh will certainly eat it. He's not trying to be a so in such a case according to rubber you can check the knife give it to him and my time because since if there would be a choice of which have a we're not the going to eat so as long as he has a to do a proper he'll be fine to be he'll be why do you got to be the knife he's not going to do an but not because we're talking about over here who's not going to work hard to get another knife so if the knife is he'll still end up using it so we got to check it first to make sure it's not going to be I'm really that the is now I'm going to cuz the price of says you get these who are not doing the proper of their so turning over to me base me at other cannot eat from that stuff and we're not worried about being over love a cuz we can assume we're going to we're going to assume that the swapped it out for other motor that they got from so we're bending over backwards to assume they're not doing anything wrong because their whole motivation is their him does moment so they didn't want to get rid of their comments but the smaller of a of using their over love a to get new quote unquote kosher comments from the guy that's smaller of a something they would be willing to do and we could be now that you're allowed to take the comments from these less than from you then so the rubber figured how many who's the town of this price it's the comments is the attorney and even though it's the we're allowed to be that these swapped it out for the smaller of a if you will so what do you see even by the of which is a riot to rubber that you can be on the of this as long as you give him a second that was right to go how do you know the braces you distribute Dilma Rebbi Shimon he the armor and that's why we're going to be Michael and the chemical in when are we Michael that's only been there upon the public so let me kill him so you don't have any Raya that you could be saying the sheet of which is the right practice to have you know me let the braces talk to be a real shipment and it's still going to be a riot to rubber why cuz me shiny armor the hell are you does the braces say I need armor which implies I will go out on a limb and say maybe they switched it not by the they did but I'm allowed to be semi they did not that's not the second braces is not playing Shakira they did the weather they swapped out their over for more to take a comment so therefore we can make the same moment upon the carrot so the culture came it's even a stronger riot because we can be so sure that they're not going to want to even be over the Easter certainly if they're only a moment of and you can be saying as long as you give them a second bad luck let me say let's bring a riot from the following braces to also bring a riot to rubber that I call them the feeling all the feeling all the feeling all the highly this all who didn't have a hey that he can share with me what must be the family full of hemophiliacs or whatever and therefore they couldn't do so the braces telling us this legal who was an honest and can't do the Mila he can share well how do you know he's a perfectly good for me and why would I need to tell you that his culture for a guy can't do a Mila what do you want from his life must be that he is a he's choosing not to do the it's the smell and the silver what is the time of this braces saying that he could share he hold over the way have a moment he just has a hang-up about this one particular and therefore he's not considered a moment in the way that that's why you're allowed to trust his over that same braces is that feeling moment is also allowed to be trusted so I moment what kind of moment is that talking about if he's talking about a moment for a different not then I know I really it's It's idea he's picking and choosing which of theirs he is not going to be McCullen. And a lot of Mummer lies to Duffer must be talking about he is a Mummer for the issue of Navela and yet he'll still be kosher to be a shake it or give the rubber that as long as you're by dict the knife you're allowed to let him shake it. So how you arrive from this price like rubber to which the tomorrow says lie the element of a lot of Mummer lies to Duffer lie about it if he tuck is a Mummer for eating Navela then you are not allowed to trust his shake it. Not like rubber my time it because keeping the dodge bay since he's a Mummer to eat Navela it's caterer dumela. So you can't even trust him for anything cuz he Mummer doesn't hold to the whole Halacha. Hey yes, it's only Mummer to tell him but it's caterer dummy. So we're not going to trust anything of this guy. Ella Mummer live is caterer of the price is talking about someone who's specifically a Mummer to a beta Zara or caterer of Anan to Mummer of Anan to well Israel Mummer live is caterer of Mummer live is caterer say which we don't pass it like but we're going to learn more about this that he had who is a Mummer live is caterer of lay lay new according to Anan you could still trust his caterer. That's what that price was talking about. Goof let's talk about this some more. I'm a Anan to well Israel Mummer live is caterer of Mummer live is caterer say. How do I know that chicken and zucchini be high shaft milk you do unanimously he ate from the suit is a half a half of a big Russia over the beta Zara should not be able to use back layer half of saying you back a lot of all the arm I share email the SC say you lie a lot of all the arm you get it and I have a convinced you I should have it to join with him and fight in the war with him. But you see you I should have it eight from the suit is that I have made clearly I have shake it was kosher even though I have was certainly a Mummer live is caterer of for the Mummer who says it's a riot that he accepted the dome of Misbah Zara Halacha. Maybe you should have it didn't eat from the suit is now cuz we see say you accept that he enticed him. So it sounds like he persuaded him with food. For the Mummer of dome of maybe he only was messing him with words and not with actual food and the Mummer gives us a very important you say it for anybody ever making an event in a saucer with warm. You ain't going to convince anybody to do anything with just words. You got to have the challenge in order to actually make a difference to convince somebody. So of course I have fed him. The lie you can't be messing only with the warm box of key you see score a key car by the actual a very in the terror of being a of convincing somebody to do avodah zarah. You're not feeding the guy, you're just telling him. No, you are feeding the guy. It's practically more of a possuk by Iyov. And that's talking about Hashem who's obviously not being convinced which the Gemara says come on. Don't ask me kashas from Hashem. That's not going to be any kind of right one way or the other. Maybe only drank the wine that Achav served. But he didn't eat the flesh. So you don't have any raya that the shchita is going to be okay. To which the Gemara says what would be the chelek between the wine of Achav and his basar? The reason why the wine would be mutar is because you're telling me that is avodah zarah is not going to make him into a well then to which now the Gemara makes a chelek between the wine and the flesh. Achav's wine was only stameinan. There is no yet on the wine of So even if Achav was a his wine would still be okay. So maybe only drank the wine didn't eat the meat. So it doesn't make sense for a melech to be drinking and not eating. So we can assume that he ate the meat also. Which tells like the with what did he convince him? It's with the shchita. So how are you doing that the you can eat from his shchita. And we're going to stop here and pick it up with the of avodah zarah for tomorrow's stuff.