Chullin Daf 25

All right, daf hay, this is Monday's daf and we're going to pick it up from the Mishnah on Chovdala on base. As we do more of these Mishnahs that highlight comparisons, as we make our foray into Tahara'is. Look at the Mishnah Tahara b'Kli Cheres, that which is tahor by a kli cheres, meaning a kayli made out of cheres, earthenware, will be tamei b'chol ha'kaylim. That same thing will be metamei all the other kaylim. And tahor b'chol kaylim will be tamei b'kli cheres. Now, what are we talking about? So, the Gemara explains with a braisa tanu rabanan aver kli cheres is tamei. The airspace inside of a kli cheres, even if it doesn't touch the walls of the actual kli, it will be metamei the kli cheres v'gabei tahor. But, if that davar tamei only touches the exterior surface of the kli, it'll stay tahor. However, aver kol ha'kaylim will be tahor. The airspace of other general kaylim, that will not be metamei, that will remain tahor. V'gabei but the surface area will be tamei. Nimtza tahor b'kli cheres is tamei b'chol ha'kaylim as opposed to tahor b'chol ha'kaylim will be tamei b'kli cheres. So, that's the general rule. Kli cheres is always going to be tamei from the things that are metamei in its airspace, whereas all other kaylim will be tamei if you touch the surface area of them. Ta'us does point out that once the kli cheres becomes tamei because of the thing that went into its airspace, well, now it can be metamei other things m'gabei by touching its surface. It's only about how the kli cheres becomes tamei, but not what happens after it becomes tamei. That's just Ta'us's qualification in the Gemara. So, m'nayin odi m'nayin? How do I know that a kli cheres becomes tamei through its airspace? The tanu rabanan taichai, the pasuk says taichai, the full context of the pasuk is v'chol kli cheres asher yipol mayhem el taichai, when an av hatuma'ah falls into its taichai, into its airspace, kol asher b'saichah yitma o yisa'i tishbar. Now, anything else that goes into such a kayli will become tamei and you got to break it. So, we see that the airspace of the kli cheres is what's metamei it. Now, at omer, af al pishmay noga, maybe this means only if the sherds didn't touch the walls of the kayli. O in l'm k'noga, or maybe it means only if the sherds touched the actual kayli itself. So, now Rebbi Elazar ben of Tolmas omer, ne'emar taichai l'tamei v'ne'emar taichai l'tamei. There's two expressions of taichai. There's an expression at the end of the pasuk about being metame the food that goes in it. And then there's the word taichei in the beginning that says that it itself becomes tame. So, ma taichei hu omer letame, just like the latter taichei which talks about being metame the food, the oichel that go in the keili, af al pi shelo naga, af taichei omer letame af al pi shelo naga. So, even though the food didn't touch the walls of the keili, it will still become tame. So, too, the keili itself becomes tame even though it didn't touch the walls of the food. Now, how do you know that the food becomes tame even though it didn't touch the walls of the keili. Ve hachasam minulan, omer Rebbi Yonasan, "Hatorah he'id al kli cheres." The Torah says, "This thing is tame moving over to mem aleph, ve'afilu malei chardal." Even though it's full of just chardal. Now, chardal is always the example of the smallest kind of object, you know, like you have by tipas dam nidah, which is afilu kechardal is going to be metame the ishah. So, here you have this container full of chardal, very, very small. The Torah says that the food is going to become tame, and we know that could even be chardal. So, zoch Rashi, zoch the Taf Rashi, since that chardal is not all touching the walls of the keili, but yet it's inside the keili, like in the center of the keili, if you will. But yet still the Torah is metame that it's tame. Vayis dais the avir of the kli cheres is metame. Now, Rashi ba'avarns, maybe it's not because it's in the airspace of the keili. Maybe it's because it's touching the other oichel that did become tame cuz those oichel touched the walls of the keili, right? It's like electricity. Why can't that be it? So, to that Rashi says three important rules why it's not going to become tame al tnei giyah to the other oichel. Because number one, the piece of chardal are not big enough. It's not a beitzei size. And you have to be the size of a beiyah in order to be metame something else. According to Rashi, it itself could become tame, but it can't be metame anything else unless it's the size of a beiyah. And this is mustard seeds, it's much smaller. Also, oichel is not metame oichel. Another rule, food can't be metame other food. And lastly, it wouldn't become the same level of tumah, it would go down a level. So, it would become a sheini, and then the sheini would make a shlishi, and the shlishi can't make a revi'i. So, it can't be metame this if not for the fact that it was part of the avir. Now, Tosafos at the bottom of amud beis says two important points. Number one, according to the Rabbeinu Tam, pachus mikabeiyah isn't even going to become tameh. So, he learns that the karel is actually love dafka and we're talking about a container full of baytzim, of eggs, and they are big enough to become tameh. Which is touching on this important machlokes Rishonim about when Chazal say there's a sheer of kabeh for tumah, does that mean to become tameh or to be metameh other things? That seems to be played out here with Rashi and Tosfos. But then Tosfos brings from the Rabbeinu Efraim that whatever happened to the idea that they're all in the same kayli, the tziruf of the kayli should do it. And we don't seem to be dealing with that. And Tosfos just says cuz it doesn't sound that way from the pasuk. Because midixiv chacha koil mashma feel nitla ba'avir. So, it's just a technical issue of how you read the pasuk. It doesn't seem to fit to say it's the tziruf of the fact that it's in one kayli. Amar lei Rav Adda bar Ahavah leRav. Okay, I get your makor now, but the heykli cheres metameh migavai, let the kli cheres also be tameh al yedei touching its surfaces. Mikol vachomer, umma kol hakelim she metameh me'aviran still metameh migavan, kli cheres she metameh me'avira in it, din she metameh migavai? Same kind of structure as the Gemara has been asking until now that you have a kal vachomer to also include the tumah migavai. So, like the Gemara amar kra, we have a special gezeiras hakasuv to limit the kli cheres because the pasuk says "vekol kli pasuach asher ein samuch pasul olav". Any open kli that doesn't have that sealed cover on it, that's what's going to become tameh. We're talking about in the tumah of an ohel meis. But now the Gemara darshans, "eizu kli she tum'aso kedemes lapischah?" We're talking about this kind of covered kayli. What's the kind of kayli that has a tumah that comes through its opening? Ah, it's the one that has the avir, right? Have you ever seen a kli cheres? "V'chi ein samuch pasul olav" to tameh. And the Torah is only saying when the cover's not on it, that's when it becomes tameh because it goes into the airspace. But "al yeish samuch pasul olav", it's going to be tahor. Clearly, if it's covered, it will stay tahor even though there's plenty of exterior surface area for it to become tameh. Vice dice, the kli cheres will not become tameh from touching it on these surfaces. Okay, now let's go the other way though. "V'hei kol hakelim metameh me'aviran", why can't all the other non-kli chereses also become tameh when there's no av tumah in their airspace? Mikol vachomer, "umma kli cheres she'ein metameh migavai yet still metameh me'avira so kol hakelim She made time of the day to which the mirror says we have when it says we got to declare Harris the call clear Harris as you put me in all the way we say to say she'll say only this and not any other kind of Kelly. I think the mirror we already used it. That is how we say that is how the mirror started off talking that we need to look at the day. So the mirror you're right but there's a day we say there are four drawers as we can make from the day even though there's only two times it says in the word the day but it gives us four opportunities for draw as it says the day as the mirror says the day the day and the day the day look at the day to tell you that to tell you that the air space within the clear Harris is made time of the clear Harris the day we say we shall wait to tell you that the air space will be made time of the thing that now goes into this clear Harris even without touching it. The day we say we shall say that this one is going to become Tommy but not any other kind of Kelly. The way to say we shall say the last one is the day we say the day when one Kelly is in the other one like the Russian nesting dolls. We have a Kelly inside the other Kelly and the inner Kelly might have a lip that is higher than the exterior Kelly. The field clear Harris even if it's a non clear Harris that's what clear Harris means. Any other kind of clear that's not clear Harris will also not be made time of what's inside of it. So like the mirror clear Harris clear Harris made time of the day all non clear Harris should not become Tommy even with touching the surface. Only the day we say we only should be on the inside and all the day we call the day what would be the day we call the day clear Harris made time of the day and made time of the day. So call the day we say made time of the day and made time of the day and they should not become just by touching the exterior surface of the other kinds of Kelly. To that the mirror says the post says the call clear Harris and some of the post all of Tommy who any open Kelly that does not have a cover attached to it is going to be Tommy. Hi who the some of the post all of Tommy but some of the post all of Tommy. If it would take a bit tied on to it that cover be connected it would be Tommy but that's only said by a clear Harris. How call Kelly by other Kelly been she some of the post all of them been she inside post all of them will all be So I advise that the exterior surface of all other kinds of Kaylim will become tamei just from their negiya. So look at the next Mishna. Tahor b'Kli Eitz, that which is tahor by a wood Kayli is going to be tamei b'Kli Matachas, by a metal Kayli. And tahor b'Kli Matachas, and that which is tahor by a metal Kayli will be tamei b'Kli Eitz. Now, what are we talking about? Tanura bar on the braisa says, "Golmei Kli Eitz metamei." Golmei Kli Eitz are wooden Kaylim that are not quite finished. They don't have their decorations on them, but they're a Kayli, they're just a unfinished Kayli. But p'shuteihen, the wooden versions of a Kli pashut, meaning p'shutei Kli Eitz that has no receptacle area, like a flat board, those will be tahor. That's even a lower level than the golmei Kli Eitz. Now, golmei Kli Matachas are tahor, unfinished metal Kaylim are going to be tahor. However, p'shuteihen, like a metal flat pan, that'll be tamei. Nimtza tahor b'Kli Eitz will be tamei b'Kli Matachas, and likewise tahor b'Kli Matachas is tamei b'Kli Eitz. The Elohein golmei Kli Eitz, and what's an example of these unfinished wood Kaylim? Kol she'asid lashav, anything that you still have to polish it, or lashaveit, or you have to make these little decorations on them, or lagareir, to smooth it out, l'charkev, to make these banding lines on them, or l'hatiach b'tunus, or smoothing it with a special kind of fish that would smooth out the wood, or m'chuser kan, it's missing its base, or ya'aygin, or a rim, or ya'ayzin, or a handle, all those things will be tamei. It's a usable Kayli, it's just not quite ungapatchke and finished. However, m'chuser chatita will be tahor, but if it lacks the space of its cavity, then it'll be tahor because it's not a good Kayli. Well, obviously, m'chuser chatita is p'shita fact d'gemara. It doesn't have a cavity, it's not going to be a regular Kayli. Now, l'tzricha d'chok b'pisa d'kava, it has a hollowed out area, but not big enough. You have to finish out that chatita in order to make it into a Kayli that could become tamei. So that's all by wooden Kaylim. Now, v'Elohein golmei Kli Matachas, the following are the unfinished metal Kaylim. Kol she'asid turning over tamei base, lashav, to file it down, or lashaveit, or to put the little gold zachin on it to make it beautiful, lagareir, to smooth it out, l'charkev, to engrave it, l'hakish b'kurnum, to bang it with a hammer to knock out all the little dents, or m'chuser kan, it's missing its stand, or ya'aygin, or ya'ayzin, or a handle, or it's missing its handle, or its rim, those things will all say that the Kayli's really unfinished. However, the key story tell me if the pot is just missing its lid, it's still a pot and therefore it will automatically become a now what's the difference between the wooden cali and the metal cali about this unfinished kite. So how metal cali are for covered. So if you're missing the covered aspects because you haven't added these little pictures, it's not really a cali. But if not with many comes since they're very expensive, since they cost a lot of money, you have to actually finish out all the things in order to achieve its cali kite because of the cost. So it might be now it sounds very similar whether or not it's for a covered or if it's for cuz of the main you come. You can be now clearly at some whether the cali are made of bone cuz bone cali are very expensive but they're not considered for covered. So according to where you say it's all about the covered, they're considered finished even though they don't have the little decorations but according to who says they have to be able to be costing a lot of money, so even the bone cali will still cost a lot of money. The the over of cali at some bone cali are like the metal cali in the sense that neither of them are going to be my until they're completely finished. So you can come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and come and and come and come and come and come bone cali can become tummy. How do I know that other bones from other animals will also become tummy? Everything that's made and the is a same problem that the parts of the animal from the can become tummy but not the parts from the birds that become tummy. Birds and likewise fish cannot have their body parts create cali that would become tummy. So the as we leave and move into things that are of the that's the almonds that are more or bitter which we're going to see means that they're young and they're not fully grown. That same kind of thing will be putter with the sweeter schedule. That which is nicer for the sweet ones we put the what are we talking about schedule these small bitter almonds when they're small and they're eaten those are going to be are going to be putter the larger ones are inedible and therefore going to be putter for mice. 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