Rabbi Yisroel Reisman — Rav Nota Schiller

Welcome to Inside ArtScroll, where the books that we read and the people that write them come to life. Today, Inside ArtScroll is actually outside ArtScroll. We have this awesome and distinct pleasure to be at Agudath Israel of Madison with the Marah D'asra, Rabbi Yisrael Reisman. Welcome to Inside ArtScroll. >> Thank you. Thank you very much. I was inside ArtScroll before you were. That was back in Boro Park. >> I think I think Rabbi Reisman was one of the first authors for ArtScroll. >> One of the an early one, and it's it's just amazing what ArtScroll has done for Klal Yisrael. The when I grew up, there were no almost no books that were written for the frum community, for yeshiva bachurim, for Bais Yaakov girls, almost none. And baruch Hashem, today it's thanks to the influence of ArtScroll, we have a lot to give our children to read and to learn from. >> Definitely true. >> For adults as well, of course. >> So, what brings us together is the really beautiful book, Visionary, about the life of Reb Nachman Schuller, the Rosh Yeshiva of Yeshivas Ohr Someayach. And it's really it's a magnificent read, so many beautiful stories and just the history is fanta- is fantastic. What is the Rav's connection to Reb Nachman Schuller or really to Ohr Someayach? >> Reb Nachman Schuller is one of the most amazing Yidden I've ever met. A very unique He created a very unique yeshiva. Uh Visionary isn't a very appropriate name, and I'll I'll explain. First, my connection, personally, uh comes from the fact that uh in the summer months, Ben Uzman, and primarily, I've been visiting Eretz Yisrael since uh '97, for the last 30 years. And uh the most part, the apartments that I use are near Aish HaTorah. And therefore, I spend my day really from Shacharis very often till midnight in Aish HaTorah during the bein hazmanim. Now, it's a time when it's bein hazmanim for Aish HaTorah as well. But over the years, I've gotten to know Rav Shiller very, very well. And he's a man with a tremendous intellect, a genius of a person, but at the very same time was able to talk to everybody. Many people uh who who are geniuses like that can't identify with the ordinary ordinary person. He had a remarkable ability to identify with just everybody, which I suppose is why I was able to affiliate with him so closely. >> So, did the Rav know him before starting to go to Yeshiva Aish HaTorah, like growing up here from Brooklyn, Heim Berlin, or >> Not at all. Not at all. >> Fascinating. >> His partner, Rav Mendel Weinbach, zichrono livracha, with whom he opened Aish HaTorah, was a talmid of Torah Vodaas, a classmate of Rabbi Yisrael Belsky. Uh but Rav Shiller I had never never known before I met him in the walls of Aish HaTorah. >> And the whole beginning of the book is about the initial partnership between Rav Nota and Rav Nechemia Weinberg from Aish HaTorah. Did the Rav know Rav Nechemia Weinberg, or paths never crossed? >> Uh paths never crossed. Never had the privilege. >> Okay. So, let's take a step back for a moment. When these two young young gentlemen, young young young alight really essentially, decided to have this wild dream of opening a baal teshuvah yeshiva, it was the 1960s. Um does the Rav remember that period of time? Was was was such an Cuz nowadays, a baal teshuvah yeshiva yeshiva is is is very mainstream. Everyone knows about there's in the United States and there's there Was Klal Yisrael at a place in time where that was just considered such an outrageous idea? >> The the chuva movement was spawned by by the '67 war. That was really uh something that changed the trajectory of Clal Yisrael. You have to remember that 1967 was just 20 or 22 years after the Holocaust had come to an end. And Clal Yisrael was beat up. Really was beat up. And the threats that came from the Arab countries prior to '67 uh sowed a lot of fear in people. And the extraordinary rachamei shamayim uh really spawned a a Jewish identity renewal. It brought about a pride in in being a member of Clal Yisrael. And it's really spawned the the baal teshuva movement. That's really the root, the origin of the baal teshuva movement. After the '67 war, it became it became normal for every traditional Jewish family, traditional whether observant or not, to have that trip to Eretz Yisrael. It took a while for the very secular Jews to jump on board. But those that had a feeling for tradition uh came to Eretz Yisrael, they had a feeling for the Jewish identity. And uh that's really where where the the movement began in my lifetime. >> It's very interesting. It's called visionary because they opened their yeshiva before '67. As a matter of fact, it's what's super fascinating is that '67 closed the yeshiva down. Because a lot of the pledges that they got were not realized because everyone was donating money to Israel, which was in a a time of crisis. And many of the people who were coming to Israel just stopped coming around that period of time. They were scared. So, he shut their Yeshiva down. The Yeshiva was called Yeshivas Mir Yeshalaim. And on some level, you could have given up at that point. Rebbe Nachman said, "I did mine. I did But I'm in you know, in in retrospect and in hindsight, it was the best thing that ever could have happened to them because that really like the Yeshiva said, spawned the entire Tuv Tuv movement. When meeting Rebbe Nachman, were you able to tell that right away that he's a visionary or he seemed just like a nice simple person until you got to talk to him, you didn't realize there was that that dream? >> Simple person and Rebbe Nachman don't go together. >> Okay. >> Uh the first time you speak to him, you see his depth. His depth was very very very clear. Uh perhaps when he spoke to people with a limited background, it was different. But I I sensed that it was that way with everybody in one way or another. Uh I recall the first time uh Rebbe Nachman and I had a conversation. Uh he told me something incredible. He told me uh the following vart. I believe he quoted one of the earlier visions of Rebbe's, but I I I can't be held to that. But he said something incredible. He said, "Why is it that the Koisel brings out feelings of Tuv in people in people are not observant and doesn't necessarily create feelings of Tuv in people who grow up observant?" >> That's his question. >> That was his question. Why why don't the Yeshiva boys all get feelings of Tuv from going to the Koisel? Why why is it someone from the distance? He said something which is a vartel, but when you think about it, uh it really it touches it touches the essence, the core of the of the Koisel's influence, potential influence on people. He said that Hazal teach us that if someone suffers from gaiva, from haughtiness, so the Shkhinah says, "Ain an evil who you learn law door by the machos." God says, "The Shkhinah leaves such a person." Uh because somebody who's haughty uh won't won't recognize a God naturally, and therefore the Shkhinah departs. Uh somebody who has taiva, who has a desire, so it's it's not a contradiction to the presence of the Shkhinah. Gaiva means, "I know better than the Shkhinah. Who's the boss, me or him?" A taiva, desires, that's a different story. So, he said that from Yidden who believe in God are basically distracted by different types of taiva, different types of desire, whether it's for honor, uh for wealth, for physical pleasure, for uh jealousy. However, non-observant people are reluctant to accept a God because that's someone sort of above them. It's a haughtiness. So, he said that we have haftacha that the Shkhinah never leaves the Koisel. So, that when these people come, wherever they go, the Shkhinah says, "Ain an evil who you The Shkhinah leaves." At the Koisel, the Shkhinah is there. And when they come, there's a struggle. Do you recognize God as uh uh as the one above? Well, it's not always the same result. But, that's the struggle. No one comes to the Koisel and says, "Okay, I'll struggle with my taivas." But, somebody comes to the Koisel who's not observant and says, "Hold on 1 second. What what's What is this What do these rocks mean to me?" And the idea of Shekinah, the idea of God, now it suddenly comes into conflict with his his haughtiness or his gaiva or his reluctance to accept a power above him. And therefore the Shekinah can overcome gaiva, but it's not an antidote for taiva. Uh it's an incredible insight. It's a vertel, but it's much more. It's an insight and I suspect that the not to say that to many people. And uh a frum person could learn from that. We go to the Koisel and we're all too chummy and friendly and schmoozy when we get to the Koisel and my rebbe Reb Pal told me that when he was at the Koisel, he was shocked. People are schmoozing. People are saying, "When did you come? Where are you going? Where are you staying?" He was horrified. At the Koisel? At the Koisel? It disturbed him. He very neg- rarely spoke negatively. It disturbed him very much. He held up he also held up he held up halacha. Uh divrei bitelim are assur in a place that's meyuchad designated for tefillah, even not during davening. And then anyway he taught us those that were close to him, when you go to the Koisel, it's got to be different. It's got to be different. So friends come over me say, "When did you come? Where are you staying?" And I motion to them that I can't speak and they're very confused like am I in the middle of davening or something and >> Tainus demure. >> Well, but that was really Reb- Reb Nachman's message really. >> Why did he tell that to the Reb? Like where did that come up? >> He met people I can't say everybody. But when he met somebody who he felt is is shiyach to topics that have to do with with meaning he was a wellspring. It shot out from him. It just It came from He was not a small talk person. I imagine he did it sometimes to become friendly with boys, but I didn't see it. He was not a small talk person. He was a talk talkless person. Uh very much his eye on the goal and that's what allowed him to accomplish what he did. >> It's fascinating what the Rov said about the Kisei because a very large percentage of the of the boys who showed up in the Yeshiva and in Aish HaTorah as well came their first destination was the Kisei. They got the tap on the shoulder from Rav Meir Schuster and then he decided if he should send to they say to Or Sameach or to Aish HaTorah or Hashem decided, but he was the the shliach to do that. So it's interesting that that's where it happens. That's fascinating. Did the Rov shmooze with with Rav Nachman learning? >> Never in a sugias HaGemorra. We generally met um We generally met connected to one of the davening or or otherwise. It wasn't that one of us was sitting and learning the other one came over. It was more more that way. I was in his office a number of times um for various various issues that we discussed. But to talk about a sugia in Shas probably, but it's not memorable. So >> Kisei Chaim, what was it? >> Yeah, not so memorable, but um His uh It's funny. His intellect was was gigantic. It was obvious and he wasn't showing off. He was just being himself. >> Um when thinking about Yeshivas Or Sameach just in general having been there for close to 30 years during the summer are there like young you know young fellows and bachurim that come for different programs in the like around the Beit Midrash and outside the Beit Midrash? >> Yeah. Uh for the most part, during the summer, there are the boys from this man that could not afford to fly home or could not afford to uh uh to leave, and they stay. It's a small percentage of the Yeshiva, but uh for the most part over the years, I've developed a cachet with that type of boy, the boy that was there. Uh and and it was individuals, and I've just been I've just been amazed by by the influence of our sameach in ways the Yeshiva itself is unaware of. I know people that were there, and one example, for 2 months, and now it's 3 years later, and he keeps up with me a little bit, and I'm just shocked at at what that initial infusion of faith really really did for him. Now, obviously, not everybody has the same >> experience. >> the same thing. I have many examples of cases where uh people were there, and the Yeshiva is not even aware. It's not uh uh for the better or the worse, it they're not busy being organized and collecting alumni and running after them, and they're they're busy doing their job and teaching and uh like like most most Yeshivas. >> My understanding is that Reb Nuta had a very very distinct uh mahal achor approach when it came to to help connecting people to their heritage and re-teaching them. To him, it was Torah, Torah, and more Torah. And he said >> it says this in the book, that there's nothing that a good that that learning a sugia of Gemara can't solve. And when people would come to him, and they complain, and they say, "I'm having a hard time with this bochur or that bochur." He'd be like, "Did you sit down? Did you learn with them?" That was That's our sameach's approach, if I'm not mistaken. >> Incredibly. His approach is get them to learn Gemara Rashi Tosis. Now, if they came not knowing aleph beis, it takes a while. But those that have something of a traditional back background uh and can and can get into it. It's just the most the most incredible I've seen the most incredible things there, really. Uh there's one young man I remember from Chile. And uh he came there. And I have when I'm there I very often have a Shabbos suda for the boys. I tell them you get up and come to the Koisel 4:30 a.m. We meet in the parking lot. And we'll have a a vasikin minyan at the Koisel and we'll have a suda together. And these are boys that many of them I got to know over the last 2 weeks. And I have them stand up and tell everyone your story. This boy from Chile, I was shocked. He he got up. He said that uh he's the youngest in his family. He said there's only one Orthodox shul in Chile, which is not true. He was only aware of one in Santiago. And uh and his father said he had finished college and was about to start a job. A year later his father said, "Go to Israel and find out what it means to be Jewish." Now, he was raised in a in something of a Sefardic uh home. He knew aleph-bet, he knew the holidays. He knew very little. And I remember I came that year in Rabbi ben Tamus. And the chazzan said Kaddish after Ashrei. He had a Spanish Hebrew siddur. And he was about to start Shmoneh Esrei. I said, "No, we take out the Torah." He said, "At Mincha they take out the Torah?" He was unaware. >> Ashkenazim. >> Ashkenazim, yeah. But the remarkable thing that was the day I came, ben Tamus. He was so grateful to me. He would have made a fool out of himself in the middle of Mincha just to start Shmoneh Esrei. Uh 2 weeks later he had a yellow highlighter and it doing Gamara with Rashi and a little bit of Tices even. It was just just remarkable. The same boy I left on a Monday. Sunday morning I was going to Kever Rachel to daven beseechin. So, Motzei Shabbos I met him. I said to him, "I'm going to Kever Rachel in the morning. You want to come?" He said, "Sure. What time?" I told him, "Fine." Then he says to me "Formal dress or informal dress?" I said to him "Do you know what Kever Rachel is?" He said, "No." "Do you know the tomb of Rachel?" "No." Now he's they're already throwing him into Gamara with Rashi and the Tices. Not the hardest Gamara, but and he doesn't he never heard of Kever Rachel. Isn't amazing? But that was a not a shita. You get them into the learning, they'll connect and it'll be a it'll be a key in. He ended up coming two more summers. I lost track of him. I really should should should find it again. Last time I spoke to him uh he had said that he's looking for a girl that will live in Israel. >> Amazing. >> And uh I haven't gotten an invitation yet and whether if he sees this and sends sends me the invitation, I'll be grateful. >> So, could the could the rub drill down on that for a moment? Like a student shows up and he has philosophical questions. Let's he's a he's a thinker. He's taken philosophy 101 and 102 or whatever it is. And now he went to Israel to find himself quote unquote. And you put them into Aish HaTorah How does that solve his philosophical dilemmas? >> Most for the most part philosophical questions come from an unhappiness with oneself. With a lack of feeling they a lack of meaning in a person's life. And philosophically, you could talk forever. Yeah, there are those who have the ability to draw someone in philosophically, but to every philosophical argument, uh there's the day that that a person starts questioning it. When a person has a feeling in a sense of that that Judaism has a lot out there. You don't you go unaware. You step into the room, it's a room full of swartem and pull up people people bent over the swartem, involved in it, busy with it. And uh it's a whole new world. And for the person who's intellectually gifted, it's it's a tremendous attraction. I remember you asking him when Breuer was came the first time to Yeshiva. Uh I remember seeing where Breuer was in the classroom with about 10 or 12 talmidim. I said to Rabbi Schiller, "Rabbi Breuer was has so much to offer. Why 10 or 12 talmidim?" He said, "When you're teaching Gemara, you got to get them into it. If he'll teach 50 talmidim, he'll impress them with his with his intellect. But he won't to get someone to learn Gemara, you have to have private attention. And that's what I do." That's what he said. His thing was to get them into the Gemara or into the the Rashi, into the Tosis, into the Lomdis. And I I can't say that the same medicine works for every patient. But but it's amazing. It's absolutely amazing what uh what he created. >> And also Aish HaTorah has the foundations classes and they go do go through the Hashkafa, but the primary focus always is the >> are many programs. Aish HaTorah has a beginners program, a Machina program, Machina beginners somehow will sometimes overlap in the laugher building. They have a sentence program, which uh the sentence program very successful. It's turned into uh um students from the United Kingdom, South Africa, from Australia, and many of them. Uh the Derek program with Rabbi Brickman, and eventually the main base madrash. Now, the main base madrash has three shiurim. The highest shiur, the beginning shiur, is the equivalent of a base madrash shiur in in the best of the yeshivas. And the boys work their way up, and usually after his shiur, many of them go on to to the so-called mainstream yeshivas, and um and that's the goal. It goes to mainstream then. >> Is the rav there in the summer when Menachem's mission come, when the ball baton from the United States come, and students come, and >> Uh I uh they don't come in as money. They usually come at the end of June, but I've been there when the Menachem's mission comes, and uh >> Danny Lemberg and the whole chevra. >> Danny is very involved with the yeshiva, and uh Yaakov Kaplan, of course, and uh they're very involved with the yeshiva. The Menachem's mission people think is one big appeal. They don't They don't only ask them for money. They ask them to influence the boys. Of course, many see what our Menachems are accomplishing and become donors. But, it's not a disguised fundraising effort. It's a uh truly an ability for successful businessmen to show them what they may not see in Eretz Yisrael, that there are successful businessmen whose who are Menachem Nachman, who who who are in business, and uh and are are very much involved in learning. Something they never saw. >> Was that Rav Nosson's brainchild, or does Rav Nosson know? I wonder. >> Uh Danny takes credit for it, so uh I'm sure he discussed it with Rav Nosson, and that it evolved in a uh in in a very nice way, but um Danny himself is a product of uh of Rav Nosson, so. >> So, whatever that time that he Rav Nosson Rav Nosson used to say that Rebbi Freifeld always said he was going to open Yeshiva in Eretz Yisrael. And he one time said to him Rebbi, cuz he was a talmid of Rebbi Freifeld, "What happened?" He says, "I have a Yeshiva in Eretz Yisrael." He says, "What's it called?" He says, "Aish HaTorah." That's what he said to him. Beautiful. Does the Rav see a connection between the name Aish HaTorah and the Yeshiva itself? Cuz there's a history there. >> I'm not familiar with it. I guess I have to read the book. >> Okay. >> I I don't know where the name Aish HaTorah actually came from, but the combination of or and simcha is is very appropriate name for the Yeshiva. >> And that was what Rebbi Nachman was going for. He was very connected to the Meshech Chochmah to to remain simcha. But when he when he thought of the name Aish HaTorah, he said it's so perfect. I want this place to be radiant and full of light, and I also want there to be a simcha while it happens. Can I ask the Rav a personal question? If you have 3 weeks to go to Eretz Yisrael and to immerse yourself in sitting and learning, the Mir is not so far away from Aish HaTorah. Why? Wouldn't the natural >> So, I'll tell you a little bit of a secret. When I decided I'm going to Eretz Yisrael to learn every summer, I went to the Mir. >> Mhm. >> The Mir of all the Yeshivas in Eretz Yisrael, the smada, the edius haTorah, it's all in the Mir. You go there bein hazmanim, there's a ruach of hazmanah. However, my derech halimud at my stage of my life involves using many sefarim. It involves a lot of searching. However, it has to be that way. Uh as you're probably familiar in the Mir Yeshiva, there are narrow standers and not much place to put sefarim. So, that first year I was there, uh someone gave me the key to the library, which used to be locked bein hazmanim, and I went into the library. But I'm sitting in the locked library, I I you know, it worked, but it wasn't uh it it didn't I didn't feel part of the mirror. So that that summer I went second side to our seminary. And from then on I I just went to our seminary after the byproduct. I'm very taken aback by the boys there. The masiras nefesh of the young men in our seminary. The masiras nefesh. Call Israel leaves on masiras nefesh. I sure brings from the going that all the atom in the world go away from masiras nefesh. And And that's masiras nefesh. It's masiras nefesh for from from birth person to sit and learn all his life is masiras nefesh. But when you have a young man who graduated with a with a with a not just a bachelor's degree or a master's degree and he takes a year and he goes and he's not connected to his family anymore. Some of the family angry at them. >> Mhm. >> His girlfriend is not interested. And I had one person who was very close with and he said his parents refused to talk to him. He had a master's in journalism happened to be. And he went and he stayed. And they they refused to have anything to do with him. The third summer I was there his mother came to visit him. And I hope he doesn't mind my relating this. I asked him what happened? He said, "Oh, my brother married a Vietnamese girl." >> Mhm. >> For Jewish parents that's not the shidduch even non-observant Jews imagine. So they said, "Okay. You know, this one isn't so bad." At least his mother came to visit. But but a lot of them they're literally thrown out even financially. They don't have uh they don't have any support at all and um the masiras nefesh, the devotion, the dedication it's just incredible. Just incredible. >> And and on some level it's the credit of Reb Nachman Reb Nachman the Rosh Yeshiva Reb Mendel, the Rosh Yeshivas Reb Reb Eibisch Rosenberg who was there in in the beginning who who had the vision to say there are going to be people that are going to be moser nefesh and let's give them the platform or the ability to do that. And today, this is what's so interesting about the book and buy the book and if you're watching this you should buy the book it's it's transformational. They have case files there like different people who today are impacting Klal Yisrael in the most profound way who have children and grandchildren who are talmidei chachamim learning in kollel and giving shiurim and it's all because two young men light left the mainstream moved to Eretz Yisrael when there was no phones not from not in your homes and there was no washing machines and they said, "We need to make sure that we change Klal Yisrael one neshama at a time." That's like on some level it's a machaya for us to I don't know if we have the same mesiras nefesh to go to Eretz Yisrael but we could be moser nefesh in our own avodah like the Rav is saying. >> I don't think their initial vision was to change Klal Yisrael. I think it was uh to to make themselves an asset to Klal Yisrael to help others and it slowly became uh what it became and as I said they themselves at least in Olam Hazeh had no clue how many they influenced. Today there are two Or Sameach graduates who are learning in Torah with us in Beit Midrash and maybe more I'm aware of two. I had them at at my Shabbos table along with uh some of my some of my talmidim. At a Shabbos table and in the course of talking uh one of them said, "Well, my father was an Or Sameach." And they said, "What? Your father was an Or Sameach?" Like they look at him. He's the regular frum from birth brand. Yeah, my father became from an Or Sameach. Like it it just it just so it was a chizuk to them to see the product. But uh Or Sameach what it sent out all over the world that they just they're not even aware of of the greatness that they that they created. >> So if you want to find out a little bit more about that greatness, good idea to probably buy the book, read it, you'll be impacted and inspired. And Rabbi Eisen, thank you so much for taking the time. This was a great for us. >> It's good. It's absolutely my pleasure. And anything I could do to spread the message of Ar Sema, it's a good it's a good book. There's a plug for the Artscroll book. A plug for Ar Sema, come in the summer. Sit and learn there all day. You'll be inspired as well. >> Thank you so much.