Inside ArtScroll - Season 4 Episode 17: Benny Fishoff – Through the Eyes of His Sons

[Music] Hello everyone and welcome back to Inside Art Scroll where the books you read and the people who write them come to life. Today I am joined by two special brothers, Avi Fishoff and Dovy Fishoff, in honor of the release of a brand new book about their amazing father, Rebeni Fishoff. Thank you, Avi. Thank you, Dovy. It's an honor to sit with you. Thank you. And we are very excited here in art school land with the release of this new book about your father. I know that this is really uh many years in the making. Um, it's what what's unique about it, which I want to get into first. First of all, kudos to the author Rabbis Besser. Yeah. Who's a master at his craft and and and uh took your father's story and brought it to life in such a beautiful way. Um, but what's unique about it is that it's written for the most part as a memoir uh in in first person. Um, talk about that evolution and how that happened and why the book evolved that way. Well, my father always wanted to memorialize his life which was very very unique as a survivor from from Ludge from Poland traveling through Russia to get to Shanghai and then settling in America really a lone survivor and built to his family and his his friends and his whole social life totally on his own. He wanted to convey that to the next generation. He always felt and he has spoken about it many times in speeches about how he felt that the reason that he survived was to teach the gen next generation to kind of be a bridge for the next generation about what pre-war Poland and pre-war Europe was all about and he felt that that was one of his missions in life. So he wanted to convey that and in addition to that to give over his experiences in life and in business to his children and primarily to his children and his grandchildren for them to know what he was about what he felt was important and what he had learned from his from his family from his ancestry. So am am I understanding correctly that when the book was originally commissioned to be written it was really written for the family? Yeah. Yeah. Totally. Totally for the children the grandchildren kind of a leg a legacy book. Yes. Yeah. And what what at what point did you decide, you know what, this this story has so many lessons and so many uh u um compelling there are so many compelling reasons to share with the wider public? Well, at what point did you decide that that was the case? Well, my father was Kayhara. He wasn't a young man, but he was very very healthy. He was totally with it physically, mentally until the day he got sick, which was in 2016, December 2016. He just one more morning he had internal bleeding and he didn't wake up. But until that point he was vibrant, he was he was well and he was working on the book himself for for quite a few years with Shirley and he loved Shirley and I think the feeling was very mutual. So I think the book goes beyond well beyond the you know just a verbal interchange between the two but there was a there was a lot of emotion in the book the way my father wrote it the way thrilly wrote it when the way he conveyed it but my father was really just gearing it for the family and he told a lot of private stories inside the book that even some of them we had to we had to take out eventually but uh you know when he got sick we started thinking about maybe that's this is the time for other people to get involved and to see how other people's experiences and perspectives corroborated what my father stood for and what was important to him and the way his his lessons his life's lessons actually he conveyed that to other people and he and he practiced very much what he preached I I think that above all you know the it says it's a story of dignity generosity wisdom and warmth more than anything actually that I found and I'm wondering how this uh impact acted you as children um was his humility. He was a person who who seemed to be able to relate to every person no matter who they were from young to old from prominent to to not so prominent. He had that that that endearing characteristic of humility. Um what what did you see at home? Because that that at least in a on a public persona we we saw that humility. Um what did you see at home? So I think he was always shocked that he was important and you know he came here without anything without anyone and he did the right things and Hashem benched him and he had a lot of and he was he had a lot of midas that normal people don't have which I hope we'll get into. He really had like a a whole different way of looking at things. I didn't even realize it till much later in my life that things that we take for granted that we would never do or never think of that other people do and think they didn't have a role model. So he really had a really high road just internal way of of dealing with everything. Can you give a practical example of that? What's an example of something that so many of those that he did that was so different than than the the ham? He first of all he he just genuinely liked people. Mhm. So he was interested in he didn't have anything like, oh, he's younger than me, he's older than me. He's he just liked people and um he was very trustworthy, very trustworthy. Um he always he really didn't put himself before any situation. So he really didn't have an agenda. Uh he's very very clear-minded. That's why so many people trusted him in so many issues and making peace between families and and all of that. And um many many many stories about that that are in the book and it's just endless even after the book came out so many people are texting us so many more and more and more stories when it comes that humility really I think my personal belief is he couldn't believe that a little kid from Poland you know could end up being in a new world with a new language and a new culture could end up being really in in that in the 60s and 70s Klaus was much smaller and he was really very prominent and that's every time that he was he was get you know asked to speak or asked to do he always said me said mwah couldn't believe that somebody gave him an honor of something or asked his advice he was really important in very important issues in Kal and also you see you see his tremendous positivity he he was extremely positive person throughout the book and I and I've seen videos of him he was always talking about the future and what Klaw could do and and what we're going to accomplish he wasn't wallowing in the past which he really lived through what what we would consider the the worst period for Kaiser in the last century and he lived through it as a child and he came two elements to what you're saying really first of all in terms of his history he didn't focus on the past so much he always had it in mind but his focus was the future and even in terms of day-to-day life in business and and in other things inconis whatever it was everything was positive everything had had a positive spin on it and we I we I was to work with him for 10 years in the office together day by day and no matter what happened in business we he would always see the silver lining. We learned this lesson and we got this and we benefited this way. He just had an incredible positive attitude about everything that was going on in his life. That was his motto that he got when when he got the brah from the as you could see in the book when he was just gazing with the with the Imrais in Poland and he he lived that way throughout his life. Everything was a positive spin on things. Yeah. I think beyond anything else in the book I think just that alone if people take that to learn from Rabeni Fishov is that that ability to first of all to carry on despite whatever has happened in the past. incredible. Um, and to do so with such an inva and and like you said, a love of people, which is not so simple. Not so simple. People don't always love people, you know. They loved everybody. It's even it's even deeper than that. It's that, you know, we think that you'll be nice to people, they'll be nice to you, and everything will be fine. Like a quit proquo, right? Right. And as long as you're nice, it's good. But unfortunately, the world is not like that. And while he was really nice to everybody, there were people who really hurt him very badly along the years, um, friends of his and and people close to him who did really bad stuff to him. And that's where the the angel part really popped out where we couldn't believe how he would, how do you even explain it? The way he reacted to those people was so dramatic. Many of the people don't even realize that he had a tight on them that they that they did anything wrong to him and they feel they're close friends with him and we know the truth from the inside. We knew what happened and we knew how he felt. But he was so positive in his in his relationship with them and so warm to them that they they totally either forgot what they did or ignored what they did or felt that he didn't care. He just he just loved everybody. He just couldn't. It was incredible and people really like stabbed him in the back and then he would see them and we would be like, you know, oh my gosh. and he would just go over and give a big hug and it's like he had this kind of I I don't even know what to call it but you don't get the reputation that he had if you if you don't also deal not just being good to everybody but also responding to people who are not good to you right in this way which was I mean I don't think anybody else has ever seen anything like it to add to that he could he had many opportunities unfortunately they could involve get involved going to going vow getting involved in litigation. He put all that aside. He said that's not where I want to spend my time and my energy on the past. Whatever it is, it is I want to focus on the on the future and and not worry about what happened in the past. He just Where do you think he got that? Where did he get that from? Who who was his primary role model? Who who he modeled his his personal character after that? It was so sterling. What would you say? What was so unique about him is that everybody that could have been a role model really was was killed in the Holocaust. And he was really alone. He was a young boy. He was at 16 at 16 17 years old. He was already totally alone. That's what makes this so more so much more astounding, right? He had a role model. Yeah. Would you say he was self-made in that in that sense? Just a self-made man. I guess Hashem blessed him to have a certain way of life. I don't know anybody that he got this this from. I said a very interesting thing. Somebody in told me his son was was involved in the kesset and and when my father came to the room there was like some kind of gathering a ga a ga gathering and obviously my father was you know one of the prominent and g and he comes into the room and he sits in the back you know as if they're not going to tell him you know sit in the front to him he was comfortable in the back and the fellow told me and I can't remember his name right now fellow told me I told my son that you know you're going to be a kabakesset look at how Mr. Mr. Fishov deals with people. Look how he conducts himself. Such an important person. Don't lose focus of who you where you come from and who you were. You have to don't think that you're important. You want to learn from somebody. Mr. Fishov is your role model. And then he mentioned about that your father was a person that every good in a person was rolled up into your father. Every every good just natural that that a person could have was rolled up into your father. I remember his expression like that. very special his son-in-law called me to tell me that he needed to collect money for something new and he said we're starting off now to collect money which is difficult process for anybody you wait in those days you would knock on the door in the office and sit and people nice to you not nice to you whatever he said the first person we're going to go is to Benny Fishov he says because he's beta aa his nature is good and he says and I I'm talking about from Shanghai before he was anybody and before he had any money he says so let's start with him we'll have a good feeling wow and my father would walk with people who were 30 40 50 years younger than him and and be be buddy buddy with them and we saw this everywhere but especially in G I mean my youngest my youngest memories growing up it was like it was just incredible how many people loved him and came over to him and there was no difference someone his age someone 10 years 20 30 40 years younger than him and he would sit and talk to them and so many of them consider themselves his friend. I'll tell you a good story about that. My wife has a cousin from from from England from London came over to me after the Petro maybe he was still sick and he was in G with my father. He was talking to my father. He's today maybe 35 years old myself five years ago at least. He was 30 years old. He was talking to my father in G. And somebody calls my father over that it's time you have to go into some kind of meeting. whatever. And my father says to the person who called me, says, "Excuse me, I'm talking to my friend." And I get emotional thinking about it. The young man says, "He called me his friend." It's not like he said, "I'm I'm busy. I'm talking to someone." The fact that he called him his friend just meant so much to that young man. Wow. And he had that ability with so many different people. It's so moving. But I to add on what what you were saying about the Knesseta member I think we could all take a lesson from his life as well regarding success very often people think that in order to get places in business and whatever it is even for great things in you know sometimes you have to push your way around you know and then be a little aggressive sometimes you know you step on people if you have to but that's just the you know that's the path to success and your father showed us totally not not the case the exact opposite is Exactly. He acquired the ultimate and and even financially that he you know people want to do business with someone like him and the sharks or the people who are tough everybody knows who they are. So they they gain in the short term but in the long term they're no beneficial off. And I'll add one other thing. Very often people who are viewed as nice and soft and humble are people who are not so involved and it's easy to stay a nice person when you're not so involved because you don't have to do uncomfortable things. But like you one of you alluded to before about him getting involved in mediating people who were fighting cats and dogs and your father the book describes how he got involved. He was able to bring people together bashulling when they hadn't spoken in so long. Were you were you at the CES show? I was which one? There were two people who were fighting over millions and millions of dollars and he knew both of them and they already spent like a half a million each on lawyers and we're talking about 30 30 years ago. Wow. So that's like at least. Yeah. So that's like spending $10 million now on lawyers, right? And they were at each other's throat. They were really really fighting. And um we went to the CES show together. I saw it happen. And I was walk I was just walking with him and he pulled over the one guy and he just like you know holds him like this and he's like walking with him and he's like this and whatever and so what do you want? What do you this whatever and he said okay. Then he went over to the other guy right and he sat with him and he says what are you fighting you know what do you what is it you want? What do you think you're going to get? It's going to cost so much in lawyers. that. And then like within an hour, they were both sitting at a table outside at the same table, just the two of them and my father. My father pulled out a napkin, took out a pen and on the napkin wrote up the agreement that they both signed. And that was one of the easier cases. I would say my father was relentless in helping people. Relentless. I have many stories. You know this story. We were traveling. There are many stories. We went I went with once with my father to a Sony convention in Hawaii. And on those days he didn't fly directly to Hawaii from New York. We stopped in Chicago and LA. Every stop he went into the phone booth and called the people that he was working on in Chicago then in LA. And then half the time in Hawaii he spent instead of spending on business he spent on the phone with this with this issue. And he eventually solved it. It took him over a year and and emotional it was an emotional disagreement uh in a family and he just he just got it done and he was never satisfied. He said the only way I'm happy is if at the end of the day both sides send me flowers then I know I did a good job and he was very very successful at that. I spoke to a mediator and he told me he said listen when I mediate I want to make sure that each one is equally unhappy. That's a good mediation because with my father somehow each side ended up happy happy. I was in the office when um when Kamitki Zangazont he came in and him and and daddy were were mediating about a shul in South America that there was some fight over the shel and it was pretty intense and they picked my father and was there and Rush was like enjoying the way the way daddy was like dealing with it and so calm you know having let's have a pastrami sandwich let's let's sit down and he like when it came to these unbelievable he knew what to say to each person to make them feel better about their tinyness, how to take away their tinyness. And sometimes it was just a matter of words like I I remember talking to my father once and he he told me what he told this guy and this that and I said he bought that like he you expressed it in a different way. He was looking for, you know, it was a divorce case and he wanted the ring and he wanted the money. They were exchanging things and my father said what he needed to hear in order to feel better that somebody understands him and that he in a way is getting what he needs and he made it work. One time there was a there was dispute in our people came to our office and there were lawyers inside and my father was working as an arbitrator mediator and the lawyer walks out of the office. He comes to my desk and he says, "I don't know how your father takes this. I can't take I'm getting paid for this and I can't take it anymore. I don't know how he does it. There were varmay and al that's what it was from a real people people you know they felt comfortable with him because they knew that what he that he meant the ems he was just trying to help them. He wasn't doing it for the money. He wasn't looking for litigation and he they respected his opinion about what's right and what's not right. He was very good at at picking up in a even in a huge battle at what the what the nuda of this person really cares about. And sometimes it was money and sometimes it was really not money and sometimes they felt whatever it was. So he was able to to give to give each person what they really needed and find a way to make that work in a way that that many professionals and other people couldn't do. That's why they ended up by him which was interesting. It's not like now where a person decides to be an arbitrator and you have a business card. He wasn't officially anything. He wasn't trained in this, right? trained and he didn't advertise and he didn't just people ended up knowing that that if there's someone to go to who will listen to you and will care about you and will work for you for free that was the person to go to and it wasn't just regular people I must say as we we bring in the book called my father the malash whenever he had a difficult case he would summon my father to help with certain or members whatever issue he had extremely sensitive and delicate and had to be handled just the right way. He knew he called my father in and not only just because my father was available. I was once with my father on a trip. My brother-in-law got married in Switzerland where Mosha Sher called my father from Erit and said I need you here. My father took off from the vacation. My mother was was there. She was there with with us. He left for two days and he solved the problem among the init. He was just brilliant at this. I was going to say that Mo, you know, most disputes at the end of the day have to do more about ego than anything else. But, but because your father had no ego basically because it was never about himself, right? You read story after story. It's never about himself. He didn't care about his own color. He didn't care about his own standing. Even when when when he was the bald, he still I mean there wasn't it was really not about himself. I think it's it was worse when he was a bald. We would see in the we would look in the office somebody would come for help to my father's office and they weren't always the most upstanding people you know in business and not not necessarily totally honest or or reliable but they would talk to my father and I literally could see his face transforming to become that person that needs the help. He went from you know trying to help somebody else to trying to help himself. Yeah. He felt so much for the other person's problem that he put his own interests aside and really sometimes it was detrimental to the business but that person had to be helped. Now I saw his face change. It was just incredible to watch and we walked out of there like I said, "Oh no, here we go again." Like he was just unstoppable in trying to help people. He just loved people. For sure that a lot of times people would be like, "Okay, so this person has a problem." And like saying I'm and there's one story I can't really give too many details. You could write a book on just the story. There are many stories that we can't give a lot of detail which you know there was a there was a family that was that stole a lot of money from a bank and they were going to go to jail and they were going to lose their money and my father was very close to the bank. So the banker came into my father and said you know you know this and this person and he was very close to this person and they came to my father to try to settle it. Mhm. So and my father settled it that for much less money and no no jail time and no you know and then they they didn't have the cash. So he himself my father decided that he will raise the money. He didn't have the money. He borrowed money at 10. He borrowed at 10%. But he laid it out. He laid it out. He borrowed for himself money. And this was Friday afternoon. Now you settled at the bank. I remember him coming back to the office. It was time to go home for Shabas already. And I said to my father, I said, "You did an amazing thing for this person. You helped him so much. You you relieved him of all his obligations, but he has a lot of friends. Why did you have to give him all the money yourself?" So he said, "I wanted the mitzvah for myself." And it was a lot of money. And it was an old friend. It was just incredible. So the attitude was not I saved him like let's let's get together the money I want to do it myself after you left. So I was there alone in the office and and it was really one of the few times that he was like in this type of mode and he had his hands like on the desk like this and you never saw him like that, right? He was like this and he said, "Imagine what a I have." He said, "Look at this family. They have children. They have grandchildren. They have kids learning in K. They have a very hasha part of their family rash and whatever. And they they were going to go to jail. they were going to face, you know, jail time literally and lose all their money and have nothing. He said, "What auss that did I have now going into Shabas that I was able to make the deal and give them the money." This was probably the happiest moment of his life. Someone who wants to give this he couldn't imagine of anything more more to feel good for himself. And he said, "Now they can go into Shabas Ruy calmly because their whole family is saved. they're going to be able to keep their business, which was going to be destroyed. They they were giving the bank much less than what they owed, which didn't make any sense. All because my father knew the the the the right person. And I and he said, "And I was the one to come up with the money and he didn't have it. He borrowed it at 10% interest." That's wild. It's really It's unheard of. It's unnecessary, you know, but the but the money thing is is not something that everybody can do. But the ahava and and the the the goodwill that he had from people in wanting to help them and and and trying to help them. Should we say the end of the story? That's no we should can't say the end of the story. We shouldn't but it was very sad and it was an incredible story. But as your father was doing these things he he was he was the consumate vatron. He was mater. Um I'm curious what was the relationship like between your father and your mother at home? Were you were you what did you observe in terms of your mother being there for your father? You know in when I was she got sick when I was 16 and uh passed away when I was 18. Um well my mother growing up maybe a little before obvious time my father used to travel a tremendous amount and in those days traveling to Japan he was away four weeks 6 weeks 8 weeks at a time no cell phone no cell phones because he had to go it took almost a week to get there and he did a lot of business in the far east he had a factory there at one time developing manufacturing electronics but he worked with Sony and Panasonic in those name in those days they were they were big names today it's like Apple and Samsung today I Um but he was away for weeks at a time in the Far East and in South America. So the the burden really was very much on my mother. She was very much an Azer connecti and but but my father was home after the office very often. He was in a gooda meeting. He came home late for dinner because he had to he had to be at the Agura meetings. But he worked all the time building his business Sundays and uh whenever every he was a real he he was a very busy person to give the time. I was always marveling at the fact that he would go to an Aura meeting six o'clock in the afternoon, 600, 7 o'clock, and come home nine o'clock at night because he he was really uh he was a very hard worker. He spent a lot of time out of the house. But when he was home, he was very consistent. I have a memory in my mind when I was maybe 11 years old. I remember I I was going to Yeshiva to Davin every day. And one day my mother wakes up and I I woke up early and she sees me at the back door leaving the house. Where are you going? I said, "I'm going to Shul because my father's not in town now. He's not able to go to Shul. So, I want to take his place." Because he was extremely consistent. I think one of his most most important qualities in his life was his consistency and dedication to doing something. From the day he started Dapoi, which was uh somewhere I think in the early 80s, maybe late 70s that he started learning Daphoy. So, he was in Miami. He had a good friend Kaim Herz who said, "You know, I'm going to learn the DAFF. Why don't you join me?" From that day he did not miss the daf until my mother's petira and he wrote down during the shiva not allowed to learn he had to skip these these few blot that's how consistent he was when he did something he was totally in control the discipline that he had he had to wake up every morning he woke up you know with with with the right schedule everything was exactly according to schedule I think also that he was really always in a good mood like if you if you're working very hard and you you come to an iod meeting or something like that, whatever you're involved with a shul meeting or any kind of function or helping people, you would feel like, you know, tired and went down and and then if someone's hacking you a chic and not making sense, you'd be like, you know, you get nervous. I never saw him get nervous with anybody or be short-tempered ever. And he was he brought to the table just a good vibe. Yeah, I think he was he was the life of the party in most places. Our house was growing up, it was the center of gravity in Forest Hills. Everybody came over. We would sing and we would smoo with people all the time. It took a the shul was around the corner from my house. It would take about 25 minutes to get home because he was you had to stop enjoying everybody's smoozing with him. All his friends he had to be home. I most of my life we always walked home together. I don't know. Today I don't know if kids would do that. Yeah, we used to walk home. But I remember like millions of times as you know coming home as I was growing up I kept on saying walk and talk, walk and talk. Somehow whenever they would start to talking, they would stop. Stay in the corner for 10 minutes. You were resting. We're freezing. I wanted to go home and we I I don't know why I couldn't go a half a block home before him, but we walk in together and I would like, you know, gently walk and talk, walk and talk and he would just like they would just talk and smoo at the corner. Once they got to the corner where they had to separate it would be another 20 minutes. He was a very friendly person, right? And um and he had a lot to say for himself, right? He he could even under stress even under stress very very calm and I think that's why people liked him but he was very trustworthy there always said that when he needed somebody that he can trust be a representative and in those days there was a a very there was a lot of things going on um you know there was the the breakoff between deater when rival he broke off from the agoda so before they broke off they chose both sides chose two people to try to make peace. One from Europe and one from America and the one from America was my father. And he flew to Israel and he worked there for about a week. And when he left there was a hesum in place. They had a contract that they would not break off. Everything was in place. Um and that's why he left and he came home. When they chose him, he probably said like why me? Why would they choose me? Why did they choose me? That was a constant thing. like asked him to speak at a sim. He'd be like me like why would he ask me? I'm like Sher when he made a family simra he had one MCA and one speaker my father at most at many of their simkas and every time my father said me I can't believe they wanted to honor him me so they chose him and he he was always I can't believe it me by the time I entered you know teen teenagehood he was Benny Fish if he was a big name he still didn't have that. Uhhuh. So like when he would say like why would they ask why would they give me he never you say he never took himself seriously right no he couldn't believe it he'd be like me and I would be like cuz you're the guy now like to myself I'd be like cuz who else should they do and he just was always in shock so he went to Israel and he he he he made peace when he left and I was at home when rebellious phase shashiva called to speak to my father to let him know that at the end of the day that they decided to split but that was the the level But it wasn't just, you know, things that nobody can do. It was in shul. It was with friends. I I see a lot of people when there's sometimes friction. People like to egg people on sometimes this certain gishmak out of like you know making you know oh he hurt you this way he hurt you that way. My father was always the center of of of gravity the center of peace. And he no matter what from little to big he was the one that made peace and he kept everybody together. always they're very interesting crowd a labika crowd and different different types after the war Hungarian Impalers whatever he was the the the glue and when he saw somebody insulted or so whatever he he always right away jumped to to be matstick the other person and to try to work it out and to try and that's something like we know we all have to try to do and we all try to do he was successful at it and um I I think there's a reason for it I remember that there was a story with her leech satal and he was like 90 years old and they say that uh a certain a certain shashiva a younger man he asked him he said I don't understand I I speak more clear and I speak more vibrant and I'm a more powerful speaker and I prepare much more you know h how come that when the shashiva speaks you know it's so it's so welld received and when I speak it's like not and if shaman basically said because you're preparing for an hour and I prepared for 90 years and and so it wasn't just you know It's when when you're that person then what you say and when you really mean it. He put a lot he made a lot of things happen that are in the high road and for lots of people that's how he had the reputation that people would even think to go to him. So the way that you live your life really allows other people to feel comfortable that you can help them with their issues with their problems and trust you. So when you say the same thing that maybe somebody else would say, they'll actually trust you and and and absorb it. It was one time that two people came in arguing over a small amount of money and my father solved that case very easily. He just took the money out of his pocket and paid more than once. That was another way to solve problems. He was very good at at at helping people because he really wanted to help people. He cared about helping people. He enjoyed helping people. He enjoyed it. Loved it. Absolutely. There was nothing more important to him when a younger man would start off in business. We didn't get to that aspect of it. How many stories I've heard to help people get off the ground. My gosh, he was he got a kick out of it basically. There are a couple of stories I think in the book, but there are so many stories people came over to us. I would say since my father got sick, Kimat, there's not a week gone by. We're talking about now seven years. Kimat, not a week has gone by that somebody didn't come over to me. somewhere in the world whether it's in Europe in Israel in in in the states in Canada wherever it is in South America in Japan in Dubai somebody mentioned to me how my father made them feel so good how much they miss him people I didn't even realize have shas literally a fellow from Dubai used to be he's an Arab fellow Muslim fellow lived in London was an electronics business he called me up about a year and a half ago I miss your father so much your father was such a gentleman I came to America and he treated me. I was much younger than him. This guy is today about 50. We're talking about maybe then he was 25 at that time and you know not a Jewish fellow in the electronics business. He met with my father. My father offered him a ride to the airport. He said, "I live in Queens anyway. I'll take you to the airport." Like he he couldn't believe it. And then on the way to the airport, my father says, "You know, let's maybe we could do some business or what would you what would you propose?" So he said, "Well, you're going to pay." So he says, "If you ship the goods, of course I'll pay. You'll pay right away." And they did. They ended up doing business, but it wasn't the business. He was in love with my father, a fellow from Paraguay, right? You know, Roberto Agarte, nobody knows him. He's a he's not a Jewish fellow, a real gentleman. Happens to be very well bred fellow in Paraguay. My father was like a second father to him. We're talking about these kind of people, non-Jewish. I have to tell you a story about a fellow around 1995. We we had an office on 6th Avenue and 44th Street. I used to park in the garage for many years. I parked a couple of blocks away because I actually I leased a parking lot and it was my parking lot. So, I parked for free about three blocks away. Then my lease was up. I started parking in the garage next to the office where my father had gone for years. Anyway, I'm parking every day. One day, the the fellow in the garage says to me, um, I had given my father a ride home the day before. He said, "I I see you with Mr. Fishov. You know him?" I said, "It's it's my father." He said, "He's your father." "He's my best friend." This fellow, a young parking attendant, Mexican parking attendant in the garage. "He's my best friend." I said, "What do you mean he's your best friend?" I went up to my father. My father had stopped taking a car to the office about six years before that. He used to park in the garage every day. Then he got a driver when he got remarried after my mother passed away. He got remarried. He got a driver mostly for Sher and they used to drive him to the office. He was hardly in the garage. Five, six years later, this guy says, "Mr. Fish is my best friend." I went upstairs to the office, said, "What did you do to him that he thinks he's your best friend?" My father says, "I was always nice. Christmas time, I gave him a bottle of whiskey or something." That's the effect that he had on. When I went back to Florida, um the guy behind the counter, his name is Benji and uh he's from the Caribbean or something like that. And um I told him uh you know that my father's not well and you know I see him we see him from time to time and and he my friends were with me. He started tearing up like literally and he said I always felt so connected to him because you know Benny Benji we have the same name Ben. And he started like giving a hespid about my father and you're talking about the guy works at the front desk. You walk out we're in the carriage club. In the carriage club. Unbelievable. You walk out, you walk in, you say hello, you say hi, you say now. Everyone does that. Like what? What happened? And he started saying he says, "Your father was different than everybody else." And I'm like, and I was with my friends and with my son. I said, "What? What?" And he started he said he loved everybody. He he he the way he looked at this guy, he felt a difference than, you know, it wasn't just like walking out and give the guy a tip or or say good night, you know, coldly. He like just felt he said he cared about me and he just knew that my father cared about him and my father probably cared about him to the extent that if he probably went to my father and said listen I'm I'm I'm down on my luck and I need money 5,000$10,000 my father probably would have given it to him because my father really liked people and he liked people who most even even when they didn't deserve to be liked and even people who hurt him in the past and they came to him again. So many stories like that and I'm like and I and when we were there it was like you know like the last loan he didn't pay back. Why are you doing it again? Doing it again. There's two things about that. First of all when somebody new came to the office even if my father just got hurt somehow in a business deal or a loan or anything it was a clean slate is like my father never lent anybody money before in his life. It was just like Bren this guy has a he needs help. We're going to help him. There was no such thing as what what he was worried about in the past. The second I forgot what I was going to say. The second even the person himself didn't do it. Oh, that's the second thing. We invested sometimes with certain people real estate when an investment went bad. A lot of different my father insisted to invest with him again. He didn't want that person to feel bad that he lost the money for us. So he would reinvest the money with that person again just to make sure he shouldn't think that my father has some kind of Tina on him. Yeah. Not the best business uh um acumen but but the midas were absolutely it was overflowing with emotion. He was overflowing with with love for people but he was help you know just to understand he wasn't like um this extremely emotional loving hugging you know mushy person and in that thing he just had an inside internally wanted to help people as much as humanly possible and to be there for for them. Um, you know the story of a waitress? Oh my gosh, I met that waitress. You want to say that story? He was a He was in a Miami. There was a waitress there somehow. I don't remember the details. He found out that she was she was a single mother and she was making a bar mitzvah. Anyway, he left her a small tip. I think $1,200. He gave her he paid for a bar mitzvah. So as a postcript um I went with my wife to Miami two years ago in a different restaurant and there was a woman there and uh she she's a she's a guilloris. This this this woman she looks like she from you know from from South America or from Mexico or something and she was a guoras and I see this woman as a restaurant. She looks like she's a she's a waitress but she looks like she's wearing a shel. I wasn't quite sure. And then I heard she went over to another table and she was said a couple of Hebrew words and I'm thinking like what are the odds? We're in Miami, right? I didn't hear from this woman for 5 years. I don't know what happened to her. That restaurant closed up. There's millions of people in Miami. Must be dreaming. Anyway, sure enough, I come to pay the bill. She sees my name on the credit card. She come over to our table and she starts crying how she misses my father and how how much she loved him and she was so special. She thought about him every day and she dabbed for him when she was sick. When when he was sick, it was just and it was that it was that it was that it was that waitress just mish one and one in a million. She happened to I just happened to get her table and it's it's just incredible the love that people had for him. But it's not only people like him. I got to tell you not that kind of tip. There's a a lovely a lovely young lady. Well, there when my father was sick, there's a young boy in Luxer who was roughly at the time my father got sick about seven or eight years old. He said to Hill for my father every day, not related to us, but when my father used to walk home from Shul, they had a home in the same section that we had. And my father would walk him home from Shul and he would talk to the boy how's Yeshiva and how's camp and the boy said, "I I feel like he's my grandfather." And he ded for him every day. And a seven or eight year old boy for years was saying tailing for my father. It's like one after the other. Every person he related to I used to watch him. We used to watch him in in Luxer. He gave out the lollipops to the to the kids. Every kid he would enjoy. He would smile. If the kids said a cute line or a good excuse why he needed a second lollipop, you know, like like he thought he was fooling my father. My father just he just loved every one of them. One of your father's expressions of his love and his passion which I just wanted to address briefly was his music. Oh yes. He was he was a very musical person. He loved music. He composed music. Um talk talk about that because I I I'm sure that music was played a very prominent role in in in the Fishoff home. Very much so. Very much so. You say you're the music and Rabavi is the is the music maven. So well he's much more musical. Doy's being humble. much more talented and much more musical. Um, but he's not a very honest person. So, take it with a grain of salt. No, we grew up with music. First of all, my father actually played piano for Schlumbumber. Let's go back to lunch. Let's go back. We should go back to further. We'll start from Europe. Lunch. Yeah. As a as a child, he as a child. It's brought down in the book. My grandfather his father Dove Dove Barrett um there was a was a local choir and my father even though they dominated the Gerishel but they signed my father up for a local choir and in that choir he taught the boy they taught the boys how to read music and read and write music read and write music. Correct. And then when he was in VNA with the Majba he had transcribed a lot of theum on notes which we still have. Um it's it's really very unique to have that and he brought him over with him and he learned are not like short songs. They're complex. They're complex songs and he wrote out all all the before Ben and Shanker was masjid. There was actually from the Reb and my father wrote them out and we used to practice them every year and when we came to my father no we would practice Rashan and my father was about also and only many years later he found out that his family was killed actually in Yamipra and he actually would right the book talks about which day about which day he would keep the yard. He was actually about filler on Yum Kipra. Mhm. And we used to go over the different he knew the difference between a and sat and heav mostly and that's how that's how we grew up. But there was always singing in our house reviewing those nagun and reviewing the the reviewing all kinds of nagunim in our house whenever a new song came out and we had a very good group in shu was sing with harmonies and and my father was the central central man for everything. He was the point man for for everything for all the practicing and that's how we grew up. It was singing was a very big part of our lives. It's a different a different quality. Um people could sing, people can write notes but to compose is a totally different part of your brain, totally different experience. And um he wrote a lot of nagunim and um what was incredible is that he wrote a ginigan um they call it kadin which they sing it for on the first night of which is called they sing it throughout the year for shakin and it's long it's like 12 13 minutes five parts to it you know as and they sing it in g they so they sing this Kell and Garrett they it's they say as they say Dustaf Mckennon like you know it's not just this it's the way it starts the way it ends it's like really a symphony was it ever professionally recorded so I I did it I I worked on it for him and I I had a Garrick choir come into me into my studio that I used to have a music studio and um I surprised him with it that I did the music and I I had a I had the Garrick choir come to this song that he really put together over over many many years. When did he start? It must have taken him like 30 40 years until he actually you know completed this whole put it all together but he had different file different ideas here and there to him it was a tremendous accomplishment because in g they have gar composers there was uncle Talmed then there was lielkov and there was mosha ernstein and they didn't allow outside they never so one time when manakimstein who was nifa recently he's a wonderful man a sweet man a very close friend of my fathers my father's very close with both um liable gnov who was the Garrick the main gar composer and goof is the father of very close friend of the family and there bala and all of that so he writes writes in aamar now but in those days growing up was was liable and um I used to go to their house for kdes where we used to go all the time I don't even know how he became friendly with I guess when he used to go to gar through g I don't know how and why certain people but so he was very close with both both of these composers and at that time ribbiel was already nifi his son was doing the nagunim together with manakenstein who was a well-known composer he he made hundreds maybe thousands of songs he also had albums in Israel that weren't even g he was and he was a very nice person so I called him I don't remember how I knew he was in America and I arranged for him to come down to my music studio and I played him my father's song which I did the music for and I had a gar choir sing it and he he said it's very very nice I said how about giving my father a gift that nobody in the world can give. Can you sing this in G? Now I I have to explain to you like he said there is no other G composers. It's not like anybody comes up with a song. It was only no suggestions, no nothing. Right? So it was before the war there was um and then afterwards was liable gnaf and then afterwards was the sons and partnered up that was it there were many thousands and thousands of people writing songs it's it's closed and um he really had a lot of accarot types to my father and also it means giving up your spot your your your legacy of composing a a symphony you know just to explain every year they had new compositions that list of compositions like manuka keen If it wasn't Travis and the Kadesh, each one had a different style. Each one was the first song of the year. It's the same as right. But Matoy Manuka was night that introduced all the new year's naguna. The Reb stopped it a few years ago because there were so many already they didn't need to learn. They spent hours and hours learning. All the you're talking about 10 20,000 people spending hours. The Reb decided he had enough for now. But before that happened. Yeah. And in those days they didn't really um give out cassettes and tapes recorders beforehand. So people would come and they would hear the song. Then they would learn it on Chabas by Kellin and they would learn the songs and then by the time after sukus one of the great experiences of G is by then you hear like the certain parts that everybody catches on to and it becomes very haunting. Everybody hums and sings along with it and they get to know the songs and then they would release the the music on a cassette afterwards and but not before. So people didn't learn it. they would be listening to it and learning it as it was. Learning it on the spot on the spot and um it ended up being that he he took he he liked it and he went into the gay reba and um you can tell us the reba of course liked my father. So he asked him is it he said can I can we use this niggan? He said is it a nice niggan? So manstein said yes. He said okay he got the approval. So who who told your father the news because this probably made your father this was this was like incredible. This was a highlight. He was there in in that year. He didn't go every year, but he was there that year. And he knew beforehand that they were gonna sing it. Yeah, I think so. Sure. Sure. Sure. Toughl and again they allowed also the same thing. Another one. Another separate the new also from also a masterpiece. And for my father, he was in Poland before the war by the Imrais. He was a little kid. He was up to 10, 11, 12, you know, and he was there and he saw the Capellia. He saw the choir singing by the Imamis. And for him to be now after Gasidus and Polish jewelry was basically decimated and to watch it regrow into thousands and thousands of people by the rebishita and to stand there while the the new choir, you know, they have big choir maybe 30 strong are singing his song in front of 10,000 people in front of 10,000 people. Incredible accomplishment. It it's there's no words. I mean, I have chills, but for him, this was like it was just unbelievable. It's not like he came from the the music Gara family or any special whatever. He was just a regular guy, but he he was so in order for this to happen, first of all, you have to be a good musician. You have to compose it. It has to be good. Really is a beautiful It's beautiful. Yeah. Hearts. I'm curious. You're talking about the these nagun. I mean, on one of your solid gold albums, you recorded another story, right? You recorded which your father composed but that was the only song that you really composed on any of that you recorded on those albums from him. No there was another one also my composer for one of my kids from our he wrote some regular songs also but has a very haunting very haunting song David sings on on that album and how he wrote it. Um Salv is still yes Apple music you want to tell the story how he wrote no you you go ahead. So my mother was very not well. She was in the hospital for in and out for two years. And um there was a shabas he went to he we were there um in the hospital. He was there in the hospital for shabas and he went to davenin in a shul and he started well great story. No it's thank you. So he started dinging and when he got to these words, he just couldn't move on and he just stood there saying these words, saying these words and this melody just came to him with the words and he he just stayed there till the end of next thing he realized they were they were up the laning or something. I don't know. He was totally in and entranced and he remembered it which is also very hard. But hey, he remembers. This was a song that he wrote while my mother was was really sick and unfortunately passed away afterwards and these words just like came from his core. So when I made my first album and I I had all different people singing different songs. So I felt that it would be a nice tribute to him. It's a beautiful song and uh the number one singer of course the king of Jewish music. I asked MBD to sing it sing my father's song and we have a video of it when I played it to him the first time where he heard it. That was when when you're into music and you compose music, you have a feeling when it's sung, when it's appreciated and that was a very very special moment when when MED was singing it and when it was released and uh we all sing it. My my son just walked down the almost all the grandchildren walked out for that song. It's a song at the and and it's a good song. It's a beautiful song. It's beautiful. By the way, the the niggan that he did in G was recorded was done at a house concert years later. There's a a symphony arrangement on that niggan. They called it the show. The show of symphony. Right. Right. And he and it was a full in those days orchestral beautifully arranged by Israel Lam. And afterwards we also had it sung by Mandy Wiger to the tune of to the words of Kadesh and um Israel Lam arranged it actually. And it's it's No, you arranged that it should be done. Oh yes, I arranged it. And uh it's a big part of his life to have. It's it's interesting how many different like talents and qualities he has. Facets of his life that he has. Yeah. We didn't even cover all of them. Yeah. Yeah. We didn't get to it. Listen, we only have a limited amount of time, but the first word there is dignity. Yeah. Oh, we got to the dignity, the generosity. We didn't even get to wisdom. I don't think we got to the dignity. No, we travel used to travel with him to Japan. He was so respected among the Japanese. Think about what this means. We didn't talk about his innovation, his creativity. Right. He was 16 17 years old living in Shanghai, right? And that's when he developed that's where he learned English. He started getting some business acumen there because he was outside the ghetto somehow and he he made some connections in business just to survive. And then he came to America. So he got married when he was in 1949. He was 27 28 years old. He went back to Japan to do business. Now think of it. 27-year-old Jewish Polish guy walking over to Panasonic and Sony, the giants, the giants of the world, and getting the uh agency for almost every country in Latin America and the country in Israel. We got in the 60s. We were the agents for Israel for 30 years for Panasonic. 30 years. And because Pan the Japanese didn't want to deal directly with the Israelis, so we had an office in Japan. But his, you know, he was so respected among the Japanese. He spoke at Sony. They honored him. When when the when the president of of Iowa retired from Sony, my father spoke at the dinner. We were invited to Sony or Panasonic family gettogethers just like Panasonic family because they he was so respected among all the people that we did business spoke languages. What's amazing is that he didn't speak like a pol with a Polish Polish accent and he had a very distinguished American a little bit European like accent. but um reading, writing, you know, an in English fluent. He spoke Japanese and Portuguese and Spanish, French, Italian. He lived in Italy for for a few months after they got married. My parents it it it's an unbelievable life story. Like you said, we only scratched the surface. There's there's much more to discuss, but before we wrap up, any final thought that you want to leave the viewers with? people are going to read the book. Both people who knew your father, thought they knew your father, people who don't know your father yet, but will get to know him through this book. Any final thoughts? I think I could I could repeat an email I just got three days ago from somebody from Australia, Russia, actually, who was uh had a Tela connection. My father learned in Tels. So, and he wrote he just asked me, you know, he was thinking about my father. I didn't he's one of these people that I didn't realize he felt so close to my father, but he did. and he was telling me, you know, it would be nice to put out a book about your father. And I said, actually, it's coming out this week. We're putting out a book. He said, I'm so excited. I can't wait to buy it because your father is not somebody that was so different or like you write a book about a rashiva. You have to be a rashiva to live like that. My father was a regular person who worked himself up who who lived his life in a certain way with a certain ahava with dignity with the wisdom with the with the caring about and the love for people that he's something that everybody could relate to. He's someone that some everyone can relate to. So I think it's going to be a very good lesson for people just how to conduct your life honesty and integrity. I told someone this is a handbook on how to be a match. That's what that's what this book among many other things. It's a handbook for it's a handbook for the things he built are good and his and his his creativity and his vision for the future. We didn't unfortunately we didn't we didn't touch on that but when Mir Shiva came to America just took over when Rabenes was na zatali was last week the first visit of course they came to my father my father said don't go to my generation my generation is already stretched out we building you know we've been building yeshivas and everything in America go to the young generation he encouraged me to get involved he encouraged them to go to the alumni basically he encouraged he taught them the idea of starting an alumni association in America. He's the president of the whatever. But he it was it was his vision. Everything he was thinking about the future future generations. When he went to G, he had such nas watching the the growth of the new generations. The 20 boxes of oil. That's how Oh, that was his idea about building a building. Go ahead. Yeah. Tell them. Yeah. Well, basically that's it. What was it? What was it? No, it needed a new building. So, they had to raise a million dollars. So my father said the way you do it is not that I don't want one person to be involved. You want to have 20 supporters. Go to each person and each person should give $50,000. You put their name on a plaque. I'll give you I'll give you the first 50,000. Kabakita tells me this was our first visit to America. We didn't know how to ask for money. We didn't know what we're going to do for money. We didn't know everything. Your father put us, you know, he lifted us up on a pedestal and he said to said to Rash Shiva, "Don't be shy about going to Mirisha. You're collecting for a good thing. Mir Shiva is a huge thing. Everybody should have this to be part of the Mirish Shiva." He changed their attitude. He gave them such just because he loved people. It's truly exceptional. Rib AI rebi, thank you for coming down. I know I know it's somewhat of an inconvenience to come down pleasure but but for this book and for your father and for every for really for everyone who's going to learn so so much from his life story I thank you for sharing it and I hope it'll be a big source for him and he should be I give you a bra you should be a meer for both of you for your families for your siblings we didn't mention your sisters and and and and the really the extended fish family we have to thank Basser for doing such a beautiful thank you to him for for the Yahava Benny's my father's this is my father's gift to today's generation. I think it's beautiful. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. Thank you. [Music]