Inside ArtScroll - Season 4 Episode 13: Reb Moyshe Silk – Kedushas Levi

[Music] Hello everyone and welcome back to inside art scroll where the books you read and the people who write them come to life. Today I am privileged to be joined by Ribasha Silk, the translator and annotator of a brand new three volume set of Kadusha Slavi Alatyra. A groundbreaking breaking work rema 30 years of work with a with a team and here we are celebrating a monumental release. So we're very excited about it. First of all, a tremendous masletov to you. I'm sure it feels like a a burden has been lifted from your shoulders. You've been carrying this for so many years. You you had your eye on the ball. You wanted to do this project. You undertook it. And uh to to see art school misora now release this not even one volume at a time, but three volumes at once, a monumental set that uh will enrich so many people is is really a remarkable achievement. So, first of all, Mazatov Thank you so much for having me and I'm still processing. So, when I wake up in a couple of weeks, I'll let you know how I feel. Tre it really is um it's it's it's amazing to behold the fact that I believe you were the one who told me that this may be the first complete saferis released by art scroll and the misora heritage foundation which alone tells you something about um about the significance of this achievement and also about the times what people are looking for what they want to learn uh what they're seeking talk about that for a moment and what you've seen from being so involved in this undertaking. I'm sure that uh Rabbi Zladawitz and and Rabbi Sherman and Rabbi Brander will correct us if we're wrong, but it is indeed my understanding that this is the first whole saferis that article has put out. And I feel that uh the community, the kalish for titles uh and and works of of this nature uh there's a demand for it. Um there's a demand for and there is a demand for the type of toyra and presentation that the kaducious labor provides and we'll talk about this and I'll unpack it a little bit later but it's uh it's not only a safer of of very lofty and complex thinking um that pers mysteries of creation but much more than that uh and my views have changed. in looking at it over the decades. But much much more than that, and this is what I've been focusing on over the past year, are the very very simple messages in virtually every not every tora, but virtually every stickle that the kaducious levy writes of simple avoida, simple amuna, simple kavana. And there is a a predominant amount of the safer that guides and uplifts the individual in his or her avoida. Simply put, now before we get into the safer, I would love to hear a little about your own background. Um, first of all, where you grew up, who influenced you and whether there was aid element of that influence, especially when you were younger. Yeah, the the story begins uh my connection with what I call himish uh begins with with birth. Um I would uh I would cover three three periods of my life, three major periods, actually a fourth period of Chicago. Um later uh Washington DC and and Baltimore, mainly Baltimore. Um and then Hong Kong where I was for 13 years, but more recently the more recent 20 years in New York. Um I uh was born to first generation parents. Um, all of my grandparents were born in Europe. I was very close with all of them, but I had a very, very special connection with my maternal grandfather. Uh, my my oldest is named after him. He was a Yeid who was very short, very small in stature, but who was an immense giant in my eyes. Uh, he was born in theat of Nada. I I align I'm aligned with Nadasidus. My is the rebarker of Schlleer and uh my grandfather grew up in the uh he came to Chicago when he was 20 years old and I I'm I'm gifted to have a chronicle of his life because he wrote when he arrived in America he wrote a a nolla that talks about his family's life in the I have that and beautiful pictures and letters from between my my grandfather and my great aunt and my alta zed in the heim. So your formative years were spent primarily in Chicago. Yeah. What was the Chicago of that period like? Jewish life was uh as I remember it as a kid it was very single dimensional. This is my my recollection. It was very single dimensional. There were not nearly as many shapes, sizes, uh, colors, gradations between black, gray, and white as there are today. And as far as I understood, at least until I was older, we were Jewish. I didn't I didn't get the the distinctions between uh European, interuropean issues, European, Spartik, uh, you know, everybody was basically Jewish. It was very single dimensional. What I knew mainly about the adish kite was my obviously school but outside of school I I I attended um uh elementary school, public school and I also attended Rabbi Hex uh he he and his wife Alishulam ran a school in Skoi Skoi Valley and that was four public school students like a tomato some sort. Yes. So those were the early years and you remained in public school till what grade? uh basically through through my whole education through high school. Yes. Wow. I I I was holling to switch uh when I was a teenager uh when we had moved to Miami. I I had my eye on the I forget the name of the school, what it was called, the Torah Academy and uh my best friend went to school there, but our our family circumstances did not allow it. Uh financial circumstances and so I I went to public school throughout. This alone I must say is a revelation to me uh for a public school educated child to have even a modicum of of uh of talmudic background and the ability to ultimately go on to to translate and and elucidate such a a comprehensive work. How do how do we get from A to B? Uh a couple of different steps. Uh step number one was drive. uh it was something that I wanted wanted to do and and just to fill in a little bit more about the background of my grandfather he was aim serious uh and I I didn't appreciate it at the time but when I piece together everything today and over the years uh he lived in a simple house he did not have many possessions he definitely didn't have anyurum but when I look at his writings things that he wrote speeches that he gave he had clearly off the top of his head. Gansas Balpe, Gans Balpe, I I I can I can share with you when we get together at my house. Um, and it was a variet uh his father and grandfather were so in the they were aligned with the Nadarba and uh that was a a constant push and a constant drive of my wanting to stay connected to my grandfather and my great-grandfather. Um, as to the the the other dimension of your your question, which is basically the skills and the hard skills, uh, two parts of that answer. Part number one is that I I cannot claim and I will not claim being the translator quote unquote of this work. Uh, I edited every word that's in there. Um and uh and I was involved in every phase of project management. But I had a team of translators, not one of whom either can claim that they translate the whole of the work, but I had a group of very very gifted translators who were with me at different phases of the work. Mhm. Um but in addition to that from uh I would say 18 or 19 I've I've I've had a daily kusa throughout and and I was going to get on to the next phase which is Washington in Baltimore. So I was able to kind of open my eyes and horizons a little bit when I attended Georgetown the school of foreign service undergrad. Uh I attended a sh called Kesher Israel which is at the time where Herman Wuk used to dab in. Uh, and I had a friend uh from Mexico um uh Schlmer Ribinowitz who was a good friend of mine and we we started to learn together. But it was really when I got to Baltimore uh that I I started to learn in earnest to to pick up a little bit of lost time or a lot of lost time. And I'm I'm very pleased to say that uh from 1983, which is when I arrived in Baltimore until today, of the kabusas that I had in Baltimore, uh I'm still learning on a regular basis with one of them of Ramsteinberg. Um and uh he's an Aries robo. Uh his father was one of the earliest helmetum of the brisk uh and we have uh we've covered a lot of ground over the years. And that was at Nerus that you learned with him. He he I was in law school at the time. Uh Ra was in Co at Nerius and I learned with him as a part of one of the city programs that Narius had. So you never formally learned in any of the mistas in Baltimore? Not no. So that's even more more more mindboggling how I guess you're you became self-educated. That's what it sounds like. You were talking about your drive. Yeah. You know, um, what I've learned is we've interviewed quite a few people in this chair and everyone has their story and you hear they they grew up here, they learned in this elementary school, this massa, they went to that pace medish. It it usually follows a certain formula. Um, yours is really an anomaly in that sense. I I would say that every aspect of my life is like that. Oh, okay. I I call myself special. Other people call me odd, but that's the that's the dynamis. Right. Right. So, I I went from Baltimore uh to Hong Kong. I was there for 13 years. Um You were already married at the time? I was married uh two of our oldest children were born there. Mhm. And uh I had I continued the daily shear there uh with mainly with the Baham that uh that worked in various of the mistas in Hong Kong. And it was in in Hong Kong that I actually started this project. Mhm. Um I'll tell you a little bit more about the the the learning uh in New York since I I returned to fill out that whole picture, but maybe it's appropriate to talk a little bit about how the project got started, unless you'd like me to I I want to first touch on the the Hong Kong component. Yeah. And I would be remiss at this point if I didn't mention many many people uh watching this may recognize your your name. Um you held a very prominent position in government in the federal government. I know if I'm mistaken in saying that you you may have been the highest uh holding the highest position or something of that sort for any person or something of that sort. Right. to my knowledge and again uh in addition to Rabbi Brander and others who will correct me but uh if there is somebody out there that knows they could correct me but to my knowledge I was the first uh orid who was nominated by the president and confirmed by the Senate uh for a for a confirmed position and that position was I had the great honor to serve under President Trump as the assistant secretary for international markets which is one of the the largest briefs certainly internationally uh that Treasury has. I was one of the most senior ranking international financial diplomats of our country. And is that a position that changes from administration to administration? It is a politically appointed position. Typically it is politically appointed. uh during transition periods uh career officials within Treasury will will take the position uh on an interim basis but it is uh it is reserved for political appointees and you held that for the duration of President Trump's term. I I entered uh Treasury in October of 2017 and I assumed uh this position on an interim basis, the assistant secretary position in 2019 and I held it for two years. what what was your qualification at the time for this position and what exactly to us layman who don't really know what the under secretary does what what exactly was involved the um portfolio of the assistant secretary for international markets covers I would divide it into four or five main areas uh one large area is trade uh as finance is related one large area is um uh infra infrastructure finance uh which includes development finance and export credit financing which are are covered by two of our federal agencies the development finance corporation and the US axim bank. Um it covers fintech and and financial regulation as it impacts on foreign financial institutions coming into America and our financial institutions abroad. Um, and then in addition, although it was not in my portfolio to begin with, in March of 2020, I got a very, very big present on my desk, um, which was, um, the instructions to set up effectively from scratch, uh, a 76 billion, which later turned into a $94 billion financial institution that implemented uh, financial support for the airlines. ines under the car's act. So through that work, we saved 700,000 jobs and we kept the the the airlines flying during co um and it was the most pressured time in my career. Um uh it was uh certainly the most fulfilling thing that I've done in my work. Um did you did you receive personal accolades for for what you accomplished? I I I received the highest civilian award uh given by the Treasury Department, which is the Alexander Hamilton Award for Excellence um for for all of the work that I did. And um to get back to the to the question of what my qualifications were, I I would like to think of, you know, my my my youthful energy and my good looks is factoring in. But uh the reality is that um the administration recognized uh at the very beginning of the term and even during the campaign uh that China and infrastructure were going to factor very heavily into the agenda of the administration. And indeed indeed they did. And I had um practiced law for 30 years um with uh very large firms. My my last position was senior partner uh which I held for 20 years of um one of the largest global elite law practices called Alen and Ovy. Um the reason why I was in Hong Kong was because of my China expertise. Um and within the law the the sector and the types of product that I focused on related to some shape or form of energy or infrastructure growth. I I did financings. I helped sponsors develop projects. Um I helped uh companies and funds uh buy or sell uh energy or infrastructure projects. So I was basically tapped um to come into the administration to lend my expertise in those two areas. And indeed we we uh we we put some very very serious points on the board. And I was one of the senior negotiators in the China trade negotiations. um and uh drafted the first agreement that we put on the table that later developed into the phase one trade agreement that still governs our trade relations with China. And on the infrastructure finance side, I um developed a program that the United States used throughout the world, but mainly in Latin America and Asia to help our partners grow through uh investing in energy and infrastructure using mainly private capital. Um and my transactional skills that I had developed over 30 years were the reasons why were the reason why the secretary chose me to develop and design the car's act programming for the airlines. Now mo most of what you just discussed about your job and its nature is way beyond my pay grade and I'm sure most of our viewers but but what's what's interesting to hear from you is as a from Jew working for the federal government in a in a fairly high position um again you had to be approved by the Senate for that position did you encounter any interesting interactions in regards to Shmere Shabis um you know general Shmeir's ter mitzvah this, you know, any any memories from those years that you were in government uh that would be interesting to share? Every day, every minute. Oh, really? Uh was a was a challenge. Um and it was a an opportunity. Um I my office um was in main treasury building. I I feel that I had the most beautiful office in the building. Please don't tell the secretary I said that. Um I had a a palatial office with with vaulted ceilings that overlooked the east wing of the White House. It was mamish a stones throw away and there were only two things standing between my proving that um number one the windows wouldn't open for security reasons and number two the snipers on top of the White House were in plain vision. So, I never I never tried it, but that's how close I was. When BB came to sign the Abraham Accords, I saw him and S walk out of the East Wing with their security detail after the signing to get into their cars. I was I was on on the White House premises for the signing. Um, but I went into the building uh which you know, main treasury is on the the White House uh campus uh divided by the East Gate. Uh, I went into the building every day, uh, dressed as as you see me. I wear my uniform wherever I go. It's called it's called the black suit, it's called a white shirt, and it's called a tie. Um, I don't have my hat on right now as we speak. We're a little bit comfy in this interview, but I wore my hat in and out of the building every day. I was in the White House many times a week, if not daily, and I wore the same uh uniform into the White House. um more or less I don't know if you would agree with this statement but I'm I demonstrabably look a little bit Jewish if you know what I mean uh and whether it was the legion of secret service that looked after the building getting into the building walking around in the building who were the the the security detail for the secretary who were on our right on our floor um the secretaries, the admin, the janitors or other officials of my rank or above. I felt the pressure of the world on my shoulders because I knew that people were looking at me. I knew that people were listening to me sitting in the situation room uh discussing a matter of of of high importance to national security. All eyes are on you. And I felt that my every move, my every action, my every word was the difference between and Bashem I think that we we scored many many points on the board. I remember distinctly uh walking over to the White House for a meeting with a number of members of my team. Vice President Pence was walking out and and I got a very vom from the vice president. I I didn't he didn't know me by name, but he recognized that I was a religious individual. Uh he I think he had heard about me. Uh and it was uh all eyes were on me. But on the on the flip side, uh I bring away many many lovely and warm experiences from the job because I feel that I was able to use a lot of learning, a lot of wisdom, a lot of our sources, a lot of our approach and more than a couple of of good humorous jokes um to help lighten things up, to help move things along. Um I had many instances uh with the secretary himself um that I reflect on that were were were uh were great stories. My my wife uh descends from a very distinguished lineage uh many many uh we we always wanted to make a difference. Uh so for every yontiff we would bring I would bring things down from New York. I commuted every week. I went home to Burough Park in Shabas. Every Shabas and um Rashanim Kipper, my wife would bake Leah. So I would bring 20 30 honey cakes down. I would send over to Jared and Ivanka and other people in the White House that were Jewish and friends of ours. And uh every year I would bring the secretary honey cake. Uh one year who is the secretary at the time? Secretary Steven Minutuchin for the whole administration who who himself I believe is an icle of the kaducious levy I believe. Is that right? Yeah. Based on as much research as we could do. Uh and is that something you discovered or is that something he told? I I heard about it. I don't think he knows who the kaducious levy is. Okay. Or the significance of it. But uh I have a very close friend Mosha Rubin uh who is a scholar in his own right of of and a a very solid genealogologist who has looked into the matter. We've not gotten completely to the bottom of it. This is our view. So I um I was preparing to hand over the honey cake to him and this particular year in a meeting that we had with him in his small conference room. We had a a meeting scheduled um for one of the regional deputates to give a report on an issue that I had been tasked to to conduct. Uh so we had a deputy assistant secretary and his chief economist there for the report. The under secretary, my boss David Malpass who went on to become the president of the World Bank was sitting next to me. smallalish room, a rather large table, antique furniture, and other implements that were were owned and used by Andrew Johnson. Uh we get in the room, we're waiting for the secretary. The secretary comes in. Uh it's very formal. We had to place our electronics outside of the room for security reasons. There was an issue, somebody brought their phone in. A little bit of a pause. We finally all waited for the secretary to sit down. We sat down um and we're we're ready to roll all eyes on the secretary waiting for him to look up and give us the nod. As soon as he looked up, I said, "Sec, Mr. Secretary, if I may, I've got one item if I could, very important item uh that I'd like to table before we get started with the agenda." And he looks at me, the under secretary looks at me, and I took this beautifully wrapped honey cake and I said, "My wife has instructed me to give this to you." and I pushed it over to the table. Everybody cracked up. The under secretary kicked me under the table because I shouldn't have done it for the 10th time again. And uh and this uh this economist who was schwvitzing away, you know, twice every year probably gets called in the secretary starts to give his report. You could tell when the secretary was engaged and not engaged, was listening and not listening. And he clearly was not listening because he was fixated on this honey cake on the table. About two minutes in, everybody giving me the the look, the secretary says, "I'm really sorry, but I I have to tuck into this cake. I think I'm gonna use one of Andrew Johnson's knives, which is over a hundred years old, sitting on the on the side table." He keeps going. Another two minutes go by. He's clearly not listening. He says, "Gentlemen, I have to go get a knife." He walks into his office, comes back with a knife, starts cutting up the cake, and uh we enjoyed a little bit of honey cake. And you didn't you didn't have to pay the price for your lack of uh keeping to the etiquette or whatever it might be. I I I was and am always very comfortable to bend uh just a little bit. One always needs to know what the limits are, right? But I feel very strongly that it's interactions like that um that have really truly lent to any successes that I've achieved in my career throughout uh whe whether it's with foreign officials, domestic officials, other counterparts within the government, lawyers across the table, the personal touch, the the var uh kite is uh is is what I think has helped in the success. Fascinating. Now, before we get to the safer, now you you left the uh federal government with uh President Trump's departure from the White House. Yes. What What have you been doing since then professionally? Um I needed uh I needed a good couple of months to uh to unwind, detox. Yeah. Um, and my mission after finishing up at uh at Treasury was to complete seven book projects. Uh, and this is one of them. I I put one out over a year ago in infrastructure finance. Um, we've got three or four more goodies that are coming the art scroll way. Um, another translation of a safer, the Nada safer, the Marra. And uh I've got uh two different projects that relate to the Rebra Mortal himself, stories and lore. Um and one other project about about the policy work that I did. I originally wanted to focus and uh and and make sure that we got these projects out the door. Um it took a long time. We're we're over two years past that point. And uh I was approached by a couple of organizations. David Malpass who was my under secretary at Treasury and and was until recently the president of the World Bank asked me to join him and advise him on infrastructure finance at the bank which I did for two years. I just finished at the end of June. I've been helping uh an infrastructure fund based in Israel with one of its portfolio companies uh here uh in the states and uh most recently I've taken up a position with a a a very um pioneering uh asset management platform called Hudson Sustainable um uh which uh works in transitional energy and uh and sustainable infrastructure. But I would I would say you're you're a reservoir or a repository of of tremendous experience and knowledge and insight in the world of finance. Uh you could almost kind of probably am I right that you could pick and choose almost at this point in your career what you want to do almost like a freelancer. Yeah. I I only do what I like to do at this point of my life. Yeah. So that's the you know having that liberty um is somewhat liberating especially because it allows you to work on on the things that you're passionate about like the kuchious levy. So uh I guess there's a there's a benefit in that as well. there's there's an immense benefit and um I I feel that very strongly that I would not be I would not have achieved the successes in law or in government um without the work that I do in Kaidesh and I feel that I would not have been nearly as successful or even able to complete and continue the work that I'm doing in this arena without my professional side. I I love that you mentioned that. I'm going to segue for a second. Um because I think this is relevant to many people watching and listening. We we live in a world where some people are to spend their their lives in the world of kadesh. Um most people on some level have to engage in for parasa reasons but they want to hold on to the kadesh also. I think that's the aspiration of every good. He wants to really that the kaida should be the priority. But unfortunately, you know this is the way the theam created the world um in such a way that we have to engage the world of uh for parasa purposes and I think you're a great person to provide insight and in how to balance the two. Yeah. So the Israel asked me to speak about this at the last convention and as have many organizations. I have a really simple take on on the issue. I I only live in one world at one time. I that's that's that's the way that I look at it. Um I really don't I really don't distinguish between the two. And I feel that this is the way that I've been able to to achieve uh greater impact in in all aspects in all endeavors in which I'm engaged. in that there is very much a symbiotic relationship between what I do on the koa side and what I do on the on the side of hull. Um there's an interesting gamur and yuma rava. Uh he he has in front of him I forget exactly the lush and kamra um aged wine and and fatty beef. So the question is how how do you how do you look at it right? Um it's obviously something that's there to consume. Yes. Um and uh one could look at it if if you're if you're a certain type of person that you would associate uh words of gluttony uh with those two items that I'm going to scarf the meat down and I'm going to guzzle the wine down. Rava has a different way of looking at it. He views those elements as something that will enrich and enable him and energize him to achieve higher levels of learning. Uh in my case, my job as a partner, a a very well-compensated partner, um afforded me the ability to do a lot of things on this project that I would simply not have been able to to afford or that I would not have been able to do by by way of infrastructure. I I needed a massive infrastructure of Yeetsk just to manage the files. This is a 2,000page book. Okay, it's 2,000 pages. That's in print in manuscript. It was many thousands of pages there. With alladim there are over 70 different portions, right? So each portion was a file that had multiple multiple drafts that was going through multiple systems and and streams of work just to manage the files alone on the computer. I had I had secretaries, the support of my law firm. So, it was um taking what was apparently hull and and using it to energize and to elevate it, right? And at the same time, I felt financially rewarded in my job. Um, I felt a a great ton of of satisfaction in the work that I did uh both for my clients and I I did a lot of proono work as well, which was extremely gratifying. Before uh when I came back from Hong Kong, before I went into treasury, I I uh played a a very significant role in the goods proono legal services network. And so the the satisfaction that I got from my work made me a a happier more fulfilled person that enabled me to to really focus. Now I didn't have 24 hours in the day let alone two hours in the day every day to work on this project but the time that I did have was very very high quality high impact time. Mhm. Now, speaking of this project, let's go unpack the the monumental and daunting undertaking of bringing the kaducious levy to the English speaking public. Yeah. Um, one of the things that I found fascinating is that himself did not write the kaducious levy from what I understand. It was written primarily by his students, his people who heard his Tyra and wrote it down. And that itself presented a a certain unique challenge right in in annotating like every Jewish answer. Yes. Yes. No. No. It's it's correct but it's not correct. Um so the uh the origins of the safer are that the Reb spoke to. He spoke to and just like we we have today. My Reb speak to we we write it down. So Tmidim or his children wrote it down. Uh they were massad what was written down uh and the kadesha sli reviewed it uh before it was published. Um and so it's true that he didn't write it but they are they are his words uh as rendered by somebody else and then reviewed by him. And by definition, because it covered different parishes through the year, and it's not as if they said, "It's a go. We're just going to take the Toyotas from this particular year. It was over many years." Um, so the period over which the content was compiled was many years. I can't I can't tell you how many years it was. I I assume it's it's more than 10. And um you and I speak differently. we have a different perspective uh as we as we as time moves on. And so the the challenges that you pointed out were challenges of consistency in rendering uh uh language and concept over time. uh there were challenges of uh the the the the burd um making assumptions about what the knowledge base of the audience uh would be. So he he had a tremendous bank of knowledge the kaducious of of of nigla and nistister and I'm starting I'm starting first with nigla because he he was not born intoic tradition he he became aligned with the nichlsburgger after he was 20 years old he had already settled his his formal formative years in learning and he was a goon he was known as a goon um but there were there there There are many many deep concepts uh presented in the book uh in this work and uh there are many thoughts uh that are that are not simple thoughts right and so uh and and many of them were rendered in shortorthhand the the work on the book this project I don't want to call it a book uh you'll excuse me uh the work on the project uh preceded over 30 years so we started Ed with a base translation. We we we had no idea. I had no idea. I just ran. I was running forward. So, we started with a base translation. We knew that we needed to refine the translation. And then I had an another person go over it after I reviewed it. By the time that we got to Art Scroll 15 years later, the view at the time was that it's not ready for prime time. So I had to go back and do further refinement and let's call it unpacking until Bashem it was probably about three years ago uh through uh a very close friend Steve Freriedman Howard Freriedman who's on the board uh came with me we spoke with uh Rabbis Ladawitz and Rabbi Sherman and they they reviewed it another time the the more revised revised revised version and they said this is ready for prime time. To get to your point though on on the challenges, once we got into uh working on a very refined product, the team at Art Scroll came to a firm view that there were many convoluted uh challenging concepts that needed to be unpacked. And Rabbi Brander whose fingerprints are all over all over this book, right? He was very adamant that the work the product needed to read like a shear. Mhm. Every concept needed to be unpacked which meant that we needed to elucidate within the the the plain words of the kaducious levy. And where necessary where we hit a concept, we actually would would would unpack that in in our own in our own way like an elaboration. Yes. So that the the product would result in a person who is completely uninitiated being able to pick up this volume and read through it. Now it was I I would say to you that degree of difficulty just on achieving that and Rabbi Brander was very adamant and he was right and we have him to thank for the content on on this particular point the development of this content but in addition to that we we hit a number of major roadblocks I'm talking about traveling 110 miles an hour on the autobon and hitting a concrete all in um in layout and design. Mhm. Because Rebecca Brander was very insistent that the way that we presented because we had original word translation, we had elucidation, then we had further unpacking that it be easy on the reader's eye. Yeah. I think we we could really show show the viewers and people are going to go out and buy it. And this is really where we see Rabbi Brander's genius. So much of what we benefit from art school volumes is thanks to Rabbi Brander's guiness. Yeah. In his field. He's the master of his craft. Um so over here we we get to extol his virtues which we don't do enough. Um but over here what I liked very much is this. Here's the text of the uh kuchious levy as you mentioned. Here's an introduction like an introductory sentence. the text of the Levy followed by the translation with the elucidation where the words of the cousy are in bold. Yes. And then in lighter font you have that what you would call your elucidation. Yeah. Right. So very a couple of very very interesting elements just design elements and also content elements. First of all, uh the old story, I'm sorry I wrote you such a long letter. I didn't have enough time to write a short one. We we took every entry, every entry and we synthesized and crystallized the main message and we used that as the title of every piece. This is our work. But then in addition to that, in addition to that, underneath the title, the framing title, we have a framing sentence which encapsulates in a single sentence the main thrust of what that thought is about. Right? But then after that, what Rabbi Brander's wizardry produced is different fonts that are distinguishable, but that mesh together when you look at them. And so I I I can't begin to say enough how how utterly pleased we are ecstatic with with just the the design element of this. That's right. Besides for the scholarly component of the content, the the presentation that we'll call it the aesthetics is just off the charts. This is uh credit to to Ripshia to Rabbi Brander. I would mention also once we're mentioning the beautiful cover design by our own rebell who never seems to miss a beat and um and of course the the visionary nature of what uh Rabbi Lawitz Sherman and Rabbi Brander do as a team to to be able to with foresight to see what project will resonate with the masses what what people will will connect to and so on and so forth and how to do it. It's just another feather in their cap. That's what I would say this this latest project is. Uh it's interesting what you mentioned before about the nigla and the nistar, you know, the the reveal Tyra, we'll call it, and the hidden Tyra uh which people usually uh associate with Cabala. These are in Yanim that are that are beyond most people's comprehension. How did you decide which of those topics to to to to kind of elucidate? And then there are times when you'll mention you know this is beyond the scope of uh this elucidation and and you decide to kind of gloss over it. So there there are two levels of that uh that question. Um the first level is a very basic one. Uh there were staff here uh Mum uh and it was mainly Rebel Lindski um who I I'm immensely thankful to uh Rabbi Brandon, Rabbi Sherman who took the final view uh about what uh they felt was appropriate to keep in and what was appropriate to take out. There there there are not that many passages uh that were excised. Mhm. In fact, there are a couple of the swarm that didn't have anything excised where there was a decision to excise content. The Hebrew remains lashed is there and it could be that it's a sentence or two sentences. In other instances, there might be the better part of of one thought that that is not in there because it is it is clearly a very deep nature of cabala that deals with brio. It deals with with more mysteries of the world. I I would say that 80% 90% uh uh there are so many concepts in here that I personally would not categorize as as kabola per se as we know it of the type of learning that we shouldn't be engaged in unless we're eminently qualified but rather as more what what what the present world refers to as as General Cassidas. But that gets then to the second aspect of the question which is how did we know what to what to um elucidate and what not. So there's a there's a standard in law which is a very simple one. You know it when you see it. Uhhuh. And uh if our our our standard was very simpler simply Rabbi Brander's basic uh test it has to read from top to bottom integrally like one thought one concept one shear and if we felt that an uninitiated reader would not follow we would add a word we would add a couple of words we would add a phrase phrase and if it required more than that then we have our explanations that are set off in English in between the translation. Amazing. It's amazing. I was just looking in paras it is um I mentioned to you where where breaks down the puk of kipur and every component of the puk he explains allegorically and the way it presented in the cafer it reads so smoothly without that uh you know kind of um deliberate approach it would be very hard to present it in this fashion I have I I have to tell you in in in that regard that um I've been looking at this work for over 30 years in in the English and there were times when I was editing that I was just feeling like I was banging my head up against the wall. It was just so hard. Um and I had one perspective about certain uh parts of the work. Um once we got into this particular layout, I felt that finally the ikar of every Torah thought that's presented in in many instances jumps off the page um because of the brilliant design. Any specific in the safer that resonated with you? I mean you've gone through the entire kaducious levy. You did it over a matter of 30 years. Well, what's your favorite stickle from Oblivious? So, you know, in response to to this question, um I uh in my younger years, I used to I still do a little bit uh I used to infuse my own vodka for shabas and yontiff and I had 30 flavors and people would ask me which one do you which one's your favorite, which one do you like the best and my response always was I can't have a favorite. How could you have like a favorite child? So, you know, on many additional levels, you know, kama vukama, how how could I have a favorite Toyota? There are different days that I have a different favorite depending on on what what confronts me. Um I would on a quantitative basis uh the toyra without a close second that I have uh related to the most uh and one that I have spoken on many times at at many simas but I'm not going to tell you who the balas were because I don't want you to rat me out that I use the same material more than once. um is uh I believe it's the first first entry in in precious vets um where the kaducious levy brings um extraordinary imagery and allegory from traditional sources from the Ramban from other sources from medish um to talk about actualizing the potential of the inadimate focusing on the on the rock that he he slept on which as we know from traditional sources is the ebanu and uh he gives the the the vivid imagery of the whole of the basa mdish he wakes up manaz and this is the shamayim through which all of the and the carbonus are going from the basic that he saw from that rock and and the thought is about role actualizing its potential but to me and I've used this in many practical contexts. It speaks to me that the thought has a a ton to teach each of us on how we could most greatly actualize our own potential. Um, but what I have been focused on over the past year or so and and most intensively over the past three to six months now that we're we've gotten to the end of production is um I'm I'm I'm working on I'm going to let the cat out of the bag a little bit. I' I didn't tell Rabbi Brander, Rabbi Sherman about this, so please don't let the secret out. Um but uh I I want to do a follow-up volume on the practical wisdom of the Kadus Levy. Uh short thoughts of not longer than a page. Each of which brings out the wealth, the wellspring of messages that the kaducious life have that are nega to each of us in our daily belief and our daily avoida because the the the safer is is full of thought and content on on that on that regard what what the importance and the role of truth is in our lives. So that would almost be like the takeaways the takeaways of the kaducious on a practical level not a translation or an elucidation. Yeah. And and I I'm doing that on the basis of um my reading now and I have a few friends that are working with me on it. But I also reflect back on uh actual examples, actual circumstances in my own life um where you know I had the kaducious leviad the mammort with me every day at work. I had it with me. It was on my computer. It was on my on my mind. Um and I was sitting in the I'll give you I'll give you two examples. I was sitting in the middle of the China trade negotiations in Beijing, a very big palatial room filled with a lot of government officials, everybody playing political theater and reading off their scripts trying to push the interests of the American people forward. And we had many many challenging issues. one of which was getting access for United States and other foreign financial institutions into the Chinese market. And the argument that was coming to me from my counterparts was you you don't you don't let our financial institutions into America. You're you're hampering you're limiting them. So So why should we open up to you? So little did this person know, this respected official on the other side, that I I'd spent over 10 years, probably 15 years, representing Chinese banks coming into the United States, getting them licenses from the Fed and from the state banking authorities. I'd done my research on their asset growth in in the in the New York market from 2005 to 2017 which was when we were negotiating 2018 most of those banks were realizing doubledigit growth perom on their assets in America there were no there were no limitation there are no limitations on any foreign bank so you had this information I I had I had an I had a graph and in one year it spiked to north of 100% growth 100% growth in one here. Wow. Whereas whereas the US financial institutions, foreign institutions, financial institutions in China, they they were lucky if they were getting mid to high singledigit growth per year. And I'm thinking to myself, the emis is the emis. And there is a beautiful toyra uh in the in the beginning of paras on this particular thought. The med says how the ibisha through the mid of truth had an issue. is on the Iish when when when the Ira was going to create the world. So the the the the god could not disagree. Aroskar and emis often felt so that truth would would permeate all of all of the world and all of society. All of our relations and it's it's truth. The bottom line everything is truth. Truth is of the essence. That's my punchline on that one. And I was thinking to that to myself. I was I was schwvvitzing for months trying to get car's act relief out and we were under extraordinary pressure. The the world was falling apart. Uh air air traffic dropped 98% in a in a very short period of time. We we had to make the program work, but we had to do it in a way that looked after the taxpayers's interest and was in line with what the statute required. So it was a lot of pressure and and more work than we could possibly have handled. But on this last par on av there's a beautiful Toyota thought there about the importance of simple faith. Uh and and how the the uh the the practical reality is that God never shoulders anybody with the challenge that they can't have. And if we remember the simplicity of that, we can we can keep going. It's just simple faith. Now, there's a there's a long discussion until you get to that conclusion, but that is a beautiful thought and a fundamental one for for Yiddish in general. Sure. That that really helped me through. Wow. We we've discussed so much. I'm I'm in awe of what you've accomplished uh both professionally and uh perhaps even more so uh with with this uh safer which will will inspire so many people and open up uh the doors of duchious levy to many people who would have found it you know daunting to open it up maybe they weren't wouldn't be comfortable with the original Hebrew or we spoke about the esoteric components of it would be beyond them and here it is presented on on a silver platter for them. So uh this is really exciting. Any final thoughts that you would want to share uh with the people who are listening who are watching uh as pertains to your own personal message or to the safer itself. Uh my my simple thought is to is to buy one and and give it a try. It's it's an exceptional it's an exceptional work. Um a a lot of uh energy and effort went into it to produce the uh the product that we have that we discussed. Um many many stages of work. Um it brings the uh the the the thoughts of uh the fumaragra and and kolakavaltova to whole whole different levels. There were times where we just felt like I felt how can I how can I keep going? But we we pushed on in accordance with the standards to produce uh a a product that would be as um user friendly uh in content and presentation as possible in order to realize the impact of getting the the beautiful and the basic messages about that are very relevant to our daily lives out to the readership of art school. We in addition to the the the other elements that we spoke about of how we presented and the and the presentation there's a 50-page index at the end subject and source index that anybody that's using this uh this this volume will find of immense amount I should mention also something that I particularly have been enjoying is the sections interspersed based on where it falls out on the sedar of ka satyra are the sections on yam I saw there's a very large section on Rashana. Yes. Um just recently tuba of a section on tuba of and and very very enlightening. I think people are really going to enjoy that as well. Yeah. We we realized that we could not do the whole of the kaducious levy but we took all and aladim and as you said we put in the the the sections on uh on on yam to in the appropriate places not limited to the major major festivals also minor festivals as well. Um there are uh I think two points that I wanted to come back to. I don't know if this is the right time. So first of all, we we ran through um Chicago. We ran through Baltimore a little bit on Hong Kong. We didn't focus on on New York. Okay. Uh from '05 and onwards. So I relocated back to the States in '05. Um to New York. Um since ' 07 my wife and I have been living in Burough Park where she grew up and um it's been a I I I have been in daily contact with my Reba the Nad Rabba Schlimma um for well over 20 years. Um and when I was in Hong Kong I was in daily contact with him but the um the the physical proximity has allowed me to to learn with him. uh every day and be with you of the network. I I I I will admit and and I'm getting a little bit of muser, maybe more than a little bit of muser. Um we we were a little bit challenged in in keeping going uh when I was in Washington and and during COVID, particularly because of the CARES Act work. I've told the Reb that I I really wanted to concentrate all of my time and energy on getting this out. We we learn, but not as frequently now as we did. But in Mitashem we will continue the daily share. We had the daily share going for 15 years and uh only Gamorra um but uh we will continue it on a daily basis and I I I have him and his family to thank for immense pieces of of this and and this work and other aspects of my life. His uh one of his sons uh who's who's daily uh in with us in Burough Park because he's got a couple of different sons. Um, Raum uh expects my call two three times a day with questions that come up. Um, so uh I I have them to thank a lot. And of course in addition to Dashbove, my grandfather that I spoke about uh a little bit earlier. Um I've been very very gifted um to have a close relationship with the Einstein family of Chicago. This is this he very kindly uh wrote uh one of the actas. Um my grandfather when he first came to Chicago from from Nadvera davenined in the zid zedul the galitan shul uh so the family have been uh connected for over a hundred years and uh and we've we've kept up the contact and it it was it was those me memories of those types of people uh that I carried with me from childhood that uh that kept the push going. Wow. So there there have been many influences. Yeah. Uh people continue to influence you and we're the beneficiaries of that. So and I wanted to we we didn't um we spent a lot of time talking about the project itself the kaducious levy the safer but we didn't talk about the kaducious levy the person and um I spent more than a couple of years writing the introduction which is at the beginning of the project biographical sketch. It's uh it's it's biographical and there is uh there is a a few observations about the the safer itself and I uh I feel that that piece of the project is is very instructive and helpful to to the readers because it gives a very very clear picture of what the Kaduca Levy was all about. Um and you you I think that people will see that there's a very stark contrast between the bradich the kaducious levy that they know from the lore and the stories around him nice stories of Israel and he's he he is the uh the person that's constantly defending to extremes in such elegant simple impactful ways. um they will see a stark contrast between that and the kaducious leak. Mhm. Um and uh they will see the the breath of his knowledge. An interesting point about him is that as I said a little bit earlier he he started with with pure nigla. Um he was a khakum in his own right before he had any idea of whatus was all about. Um and and then he he experienced he lived he was exposed to the the beginning roots of the kidic movement. That was through the magaz of Nicholsburg. Oh sh of Nicholsburg. Okay. Um who he went to when he was in his 20s and it was very interesting because his share did not want to allow him to go to Nicholsburg to the Reb. He went once and he was aruck and he wanted to go again and his share said you you cannot go. I'm not going to allow you to go. Um and uh the the kaduca slave staged a hunger strike. He didn't need until for two days until his share gave him the to go. Um and slowly he became affiliated with and and learned with the Nichollsberger and other of the the sadikim of the time. Um, the interesting point though that I wanted to bring out is that he he f he took his first stellar when the Nichollsburgger left Rickal where the Nichollsburgger was had a had a had a rabinet. He had a stellar in in Rick. He took that over and for roughly 20 years there Jalikav Pinsk he was he he was he was a he was a communal rabbi. He did not get to Berdichev until 25 years um after he took on his first Herbanis. And that period was typified by extraordinary conflict uh extraordinary indignity because of the fact I believe I I I can't say for sure but I believe that the Brdicher felt that he was capable of walking the golden mean. He he did not see the world in in shades of black and white. He saw the world in in very bright and brilliant colors. And to him, he felt that it was it was one and the same. And he could walk that path. But there were many folks that that did not agree. And and the the history is replete with a lot of interesting makers. Mhm. he finally got to bradichev uh and where he spent the last roughly 25 years of his life. Um I kind of look at it as he was in gullis for a period of time and then he finally made it. Um but um even in the beginning of uh of his time in in Berdichev there there was still conflict. Um and uh the kaducious lady could have could have been a a very sharp person, very sharp with the tongue, contrary to what we see in the stories. Mhm. Uh there's one interesting instance that I bring out in the introduction where uh in in Berdich they had many different according to trade, according to line. Each kvra had its own shul where they dav and they had their own rov or maybe a couple of them shared a roof. And um the bakers, the of the bakers and the tailor uh had a sim one morning maybe a a tailor and uh and a a baker were makunim and they had an inicle and there was a bris. Uh the those people and their or maybe they were raon were very very anti the kaducious. They invited him. They wanted to be mabed and they said please we want to honor you with pray whatever. So that Mashiach will come soon. We should be z to see Msiah. What's that got to do with the bris? They asked him. So he says to them, you know, there's a gamura in mabis. And it envisions that in the times of Messiah, bread, baked goods, and malishim, I think made of wool, will will sprout directly from the ground. There's a gamora. And uh they look at him and they say, "So what?" He says, "So if Mashiach will come and we have the opportunity to pick up the baked goods and the malishima, we won't have a need for any tailor or any bakers nor for their raon." Mhm. So he he also there there is that dimension to him. One other very very instrumental figure uh that factored in very heavily in in my life and my learning while I was in Baltimore and certainly after that has been Ravius Bridowitz. He I first got to know him as my first year contracts professor. Um and uh I lived right around the corner from him for three years. Um, I found my way to his shabas table very very frequently throughout the year and regularly attended the shear that he gave uh at the law school um in addition to law classes and and did plenty of uh separate learning with him on the side and he's been a a great inspiration and a great supporter over the years and today is in yeshiva correct yeah and he he's an interesting balance when we talk about this whole issue of combining kitesh with coland and combining a professional life with a rel religious life. During the period that I knew him, uh he was a law professor, a tenure law professor at Maryland. And he was a a RV at the Woodside Synagogue in Silver Spring. Uh a position that he served in for a couple of decades until he retired from both law practice and the Rabinet and uh took up a position as a a senior leader in Orsame in uh in Eritis Roland. one needs only flick on YouTube to see his regular lectures. He's just he's just extraordinary. And you still learn with him today? I'm in contact with him. I very frequently take advice from him. Uh but uh his schedule and my schedule are a little bit harder to sync up. The Reb My Reb has time for me. I It's just It's just a two-minute walk from my house. Uhhuh. You pointed out that the world recalls as the defender of Clusel. um seemingly there's less of a focus on his scholarship which is I think what what you were alluding to um which I think comes across people read the caducious slavery you see the breath of his knowledge both in in in Nigla and look at the index and yeah look at the index so that alone will be enlightening to people who learn the safer especially those who are doing so uh for the first time and I I mean it I brought the story out and I make this point in the hope that if people are very attracted to the Kaduca Levy from the lore and the stories, which they should be, they must be, right, they will see a whole completely other dimension. Mhm. Of scholarship, right? And of direction on basic simple daily avoid perspective on life that is not abundantly apparent in the stories. And that's a very good reason to spend five minutes, 10 minutes, an hour, three months looking through this. There's no question about it. I I people are going to be blown away by what you've done. Three volumes. It's a beautiful set. People should go out, you know, they should buy one for themselves and another one to give to gift to someone else. Or two or three or a few. Um, continue to share from your wellsp springsings of your your knowledge and and your passion and your appreciation for for all different types of and we look forward to uh continuing to benefit from all your wonderful work. to you and to the whole team at art scroll and uh I'm very very remiss in not giving a to my team. Uh it's extraordinary translators sort of laser danziger did the original draftski did did decades literally 30 years of refinement. Wow. Um, Rav Schulen Weinberg was very very instrumentally helpful at the very end and I had a a legion of proof leader proof readers led by a a very gifted and talented woman percal um and a young fellow that's joined the team recently Ben Litchman the extraordinary help and I I I can't express my thanks enough to them. I I I echo that. uh we thank that extraord extraordinary team for their uh crucial contributions to this project and again thank you Rab Mosha I wish you and your rebbit uh continued and all you do thanks for coming out for this [Music]