2023 Chinuch Update. Where are we? - Amudim Unite to Heal

foreign [Music] so excited you could join us we're here on behalf of ahmudim for the United Hill event tonight for the next half an hour we're going to discuss teenagers we love our teenagers of course when they're sleeping but uh our greatest challenge but perhaps Hashem gave us teenagers so we can work on ourselves and do the ratsun Hashem in a different way we can become better parents and grandparents to my right are three amazing humans Menches and rabbis I just like to identify who they are before we take a deep Dive Right In now sitting to my right hands Rabbi Seth grauer he's in the trenches he's a Russia Shiva of not one but two high schools one for boys one for girls in Toronto and he was really seeing day to day what's going on with our teenagers in the middle here is Rabbi krupkin he's the mardastra of Canada's largest shul the buy it a little plug for myself my father-in-law was the architect for the buy it he's the past uh president of the RCA and he comes from the perspective of speaking to parents who are dealing with teens 13 to 19 10 to 25 with all of their issues um and uh on the far right is Rabbi Dr Akiva tatz really a generational Outreach teacher uh this book is I don't know probably the most famous book for teenagers of thinking Jewish teenager's Guide to Life it's the book I give out uh really before I even got give out a homage to kids for the barn Bar Mitzvah this is the book I give out but the grower is a great skier Rabbi karupkin teaches online and Rabbi tatch just told me he has a black belt in Judo now one of those are lying but that's totally irrelevant right now let's go in right now so Rabbi grauer will kick things off uh really we can ask all three of you to answer this question uh things change so much iPhones the the next model is coming out I think we can clearly see the difference between the teenager 10 years ago till today and what's your take on that wow okay huge question to start I'm sure that uh my distinguished colleagues will have what to add as well I would say 2010 was the year that in many ways it was an incredible spike in anxiety depression feelings of inadequacy self-harm among teenagers and there is incredible correlation associated with the fact that that was the year in many ways that social media spiked uh and popularity all sorts of new mechanisms that existed the phones started exploding among our teenagers and again there is so much to say on this topic but just to sort of start off with a small and short sound bite one cannot look past the connectedness between the increase in rise in social media among our high school teenagers and rates of anxiety depression and just feelings and lack of self-esteem and self-concept and self-worth that exists and I think that it took a long time in many ways for many within our community to realize and to recognize the impact that social media here and just the ubiquitous use of internet started having on teens I think now we know and the question is what we're doing about it how we are responding but if I had to sort of pick one point to start us off and to get us going that would be number one on my list um I would um I would only add to what Rabbi grauer said which is undoubtedly correct I remember it distinctly because I came to Toronto to the buy it almost exactly 11 years ago and there was an article that had just come out in the Canadian Jewish news that was talking about a new phenomenon that was manifesting itself in high school children called half Shabbos now what was half Shabbos it was children from Shoma shabba's homes who were allegedly completely shomer Shabbos except for the fact that They Carried their devices with them and would text on Shabbos that was what they felt was an acceptable keeping of Shabbos but it was they called it half Shabbos and it it was a new phenomenon I can only say that if that's what was manifesting back then in addition to what Rabbi grauer is talking about is the psychological negative impact of social media today the the even greater ubiquity of these devices and the perceived necessity and I say perceived because that's the way our many of our children perceive them uh has only made things go from half Shabbos to maybe for some children it's even less than half Shabbos since then yeah I think that's all correct I think the deeper question to ask is really whether the internet and social media are the cause or maybe just one more symptom of something something deeper and no question we see that young people now are if you speak to people who work with the teens they call it baggage baggage the kids seem to have baggage they didn't seem to have for just a few years ago one young lady told me that when the Rama from The Sims came to her City where she lives to interview girls for the Seminary she said well my I think I need to be honest I can't apply for the same without telling you that I'm on medication you know for anxiety and you probably won't take me he said young lady if I didn't take girls through any anxiety medicine I wouldn't have girls in my in my summary so there's no question this is not only teens by the way we're seeing this across the board anxiety depression medications you know I think it's a social phenomenon in general but it seems to be hitting the teens particularly hard some say there's a general dumbing down as well should go hand in hand with the social media again how much of a cause and how much ineffective is not clear I think it's very clear that over the last few years we've seen a precipitous decline in independent thinking and independent self-confidence and these things seem to be manifested yeah uh yeah I am a synagogue Rabbi as well Outreach um my sense though is that some of the teens uh are taking this powerful tool and doing amazing things with it I mean I I've never bought a stock when I was a teenager I didn't know how to handle money I had a velcro wallet that I lost all the time uh I mean I get the sense that kids today they're they're buying stocks they they know what they're doing they're in control and is is there a positive at all twist with a percentage of them that are actually elevating their game because of so much technology it's like letovin Laura like do we see that at all look I'll I'll share a thought um without a doubt there's definitely no one will disagree with the fact that there is incredible Tove that exists some of the websites are amazing you know the amount of Torah that's consumed on the internet uh kids who are able to put together different Torah and prepare they have lists of websites that they go to and they're able to put together wonderful delivery Torah I think that I'm guilty to some extent in the sense that early on years ago 10 years ago even earlier I was a proponent I was a believer of the internet is here to stay social media is not going anywhere we have to figure out how to integrate it within our lives we have to figure out how to teach our children how to use it in moderation we have to teach them how to be responsible we have to do like we do with everything exists in this world where we take what's given to us and we teach our students our tamidam or tomidot our children how to act responsibly with it and I think that in many ways we misunderstood or at least I could speak for myself just how challenging the pull is of what is a billion dollar industry of which you have huge numbers of really brilliant individuals who are curating content building sites whose sole purpose is it to bring our teenagers our youngsters and you know and go beyond that into emerging adults later adolescents young adults into the world you know think about it from the following perspective every product has a buyer a seller and the product right that's how business Works everything has to be monetized in a very very important way when it comes to social media the buyer is actually the advertising agencies the advertising content the seller are the companies the product is actually the people the product of the students the product are the teenagers the product are adults of all ages and the difference is at what age are our kids old enough and responsible enough to be able to consume the material properly in 1998 the United States government set the age of 13 has the age by which consent would not be needed to give out personal information that hasn't been updated since then it's a crazy thing in many ways so yes there is incredible positive content amazing opportunities that exist the question is to what extent are we making a mistake by giving it in an open environment without the proper controls and moderation that really is necessary and I think that in many ways we are still underestimating just the impact of I would add only that I think more fundamental problem is that we're having trouble with kids and adults as well connecting to their Judaism in a meaningful way you know how much the internet is responsible is an interesting discussion but the the problem we're having on the ground as Educators is we're just having a lack of enthusiasm uh concept of a manner where people really feel the Judaism and take it seriously um you know and and and I think I think that's operating on two levels one is General integration as wholesome happy productive people and the second is the Jewish take on that you know which is their attachment to their to their Judaism and I think this is echoing in families so it isn't only the kids having this issue we're seeing it across the board and I think that's the real problem facing us is that there's just a lack of of meaningful attachment to their duties you know okay we're going to springboard the idea of if I could just build on what Rabbi tats just said um I had an epiphany over the last few months mostly over the summer I brought in someone in my shawl who works with children at the Maine Children's Hospital here in Toronto and studies Neuroscience she was talking about the adverse effects of screen time in General on children that's including devices and iPads and televisions and so forth and she said her point was and it really sort of lit a light bulb in my head her point was that when children are over exposed over stimulated on sensory overload from all of these screens that they're watching all the time there's a part of their brain that shuts down it's the part of the brain that's in charge of imagination of creativity because if everything is is being fed into the brain without the opportunity to pause and to be pensive and to think about ideas independently and to create images in your own mind without this external stimuli it it it it it creates some positive things in the brain but turns off other things that are very dangerous and are counterproductive now as it pertains to Judaism or any religion I guess but we want to focus on Torah and yiddishkite look what is our belief our belief that there are two realities there's the external reality of what we call the Olam hagashmi of this world that we perceive with our senses and then there's a deeper reality there's the Olam a spiritual Dimension which includes God and all of the other creations that God created in this world which are invisible including the the way that our are Mitzvah performance and our prayers interact with the cosmos these are all things that if we don't have imagination if everything that we connect with is visceral and three-dimensional and connected to our physical gashmi world then how can we expect our children to buy into it when that part of their mind has not been cultivated to me this is a very very direct reason why screen time the successive screen time is pulling our children away from religious thought in general because religion requires disconnecting from the physical realities and connecting with something higher and the screen time is constantly bombarding our children with the sole reality of this world she she quoted a statistic that I just wanted to share with you and then I'll be quiet um the Canadian Pediatric Society which is very much in line with the American Pediatric Society understanding the um the the the serious uh threat that screen time poses to our children have said that any child under two years old should not have any screen time at all nothing no cartoons nothing under two years old children two to five should only be exposed to less than one hour a day of screen time and children older than five and ostensibly this would I would assume include teenagers as well should have not more than two hours a day now our children if you go there are apps that can tell you how much how many hours a day our children are on the screen that's two hours every two and a half hours since we're lucky it's unbelievable you know and and you know correct me if I'm wrong but I I've been told that that children go during their lunch period during their recess period and and they're they're using their screens they're using their devices look there are more and more schools across the religious denominational spectrum that have started to Outlaw smartphones in schools and this really started in many ways in a private school movement you know take a look at some Silicon Valley and take a look at some of the most expensive schools that exist there the majority of them that I know of or that I've been exposed to or I've seen have a zero tolerance policy in which they do not allow cell phones in their schools these are some of the executives and the companies who are making the most amount of money off of these Technologies and they don't want to send their own kids to schools that allow cell phones in school because of the impact that Robert cropkin is recognizing it's a tool we have that we can use possibly and that is we are a culture that reads and the difference between reading and screen or television time is that as a rabbi said when you look at this television screen you don't need to imagine it's all there for you you can't read without engaging if you watch television you can zombie out and be perfectly happy if you read in Zombie Art nothing goes in you got to read it again and Shabbos is a great opportunity for that because you know for the kids are not using their phones and travels if we can stimulate them to read things and to engage in their imagination uh you know there are a couple of Cleveland Cleveland has a printing you know this I think it's called the most dose press have you seen that Cleveland has a press that puts out books for kids and teenagers secular literature that has been vetted from a thorough perspective all of it calculated to be wholesome good imagination driving you know so there is literature you can give kids apart from voluntarily material as well so perhaps we could put a bit of emphasis on that yeah so I mean I think that many of us that grew up with a TV in their home you had to like there was a room with a TV you have to fight your siblings for what was on the TV screen and now just everyone has their own screen and you don't even have to be in your house so we get the ubiquitousness of it it's a great challenge um but I do want to take a jump off to something uh a little bit different here which is a a challenge that every every parent has whether you're in the fifth century or today but obviously it's a little bit more challenged today I think because kids feel that they're as we say Amanda Amar like every 10 year old says and every I remember telling my parents I'm 15. I know everything like what do you tell me what to do uh as a little bit back then Mom and Dad I apologize for that I mean your other children were worse I was the better one right um but just like to say like so given now like as a principal as a Ibrahim your parents as well what how do you gauge uh balancing giving your kids freedom freedom to make mistakes freedom to do things that are inappropriate versus following the rules how does a school deal with that and you're also a parent how do you deal with that it's different I would say I tend to uh lean a little bit more towards the authoritarian side of things in the sense that I'm fundamentally a big believer that when you have young kids and this question as to what age that ends there's a parent and a parent has the requirement to set rules look I regularly tell our parents in the context of Shabbos that they should have a technology draw and all technology should go natural and it should be in the kitchen or it should be in a public area and all technology include laptops and cell phones should go in that draw um on Friday afternoon and it doesn't come out I tell parents regularly that there should be no technology allowed outside of the living room the dining room main areas of the home including you know adult children if they're in the house and they're under your roof these are rules these are guidelines that you said I tell parents that they should turn off their internet at a certain hour of the evening and um you know I don't know what percentage necessarily heed this advice and we have to remember in all of this and I think this needs to be said at the outset we can do everything right and in the end of the day there's an incredible amount of muscle there is no Playbook you don't need a license to become a parent and you can have all the right systems and have everything thought out and all the right strategies and the end of the day how cold is and there's a lot of Mazda that goes into it but I think that kids crave order kids in general expect a certain amount of sensibility and structure and they look for that and they want that they love consistency maybe I'll mention it later on but they love when expectations and reality meet up with each other when they match each other that's something I see all the time so I would say from my perspective one should not be so concerned on giving too much Freedom Early on it will come there'll be plenty of time to give the freedom as kids get older and what should uh ER on the other side of the coin as much as possible possible I was supposed to go one two three two one we'll go to our vitats and Arabic crop I'm gonna write hats yeah I also personally tend to a more authoritarian view I think it's good for children um I think that one of the rules is that one should say yes to whatever one can you know Judaism and religion in general is rather restrictive we always got a lot of things we're not allowed to do so and I learned this from my wife if I may quote her that um where you can say yes to little kids you ought to but then when you say No it should be very firm as well when you draw the line I'd also like to add that a framework of discipline is not only good for children's characters also good for their minds when you think about it the truth is always Limited falsehood is unlimited truth is limited how many right answers are there to a mathematical question one how many wrong answers many you'd want which means that a creative thinker needs to be a discipline thinker and we're not talking about a constrained thinker creative thinkers can think outside the box and break rules but always in paths that are true so when you set up children with a framework of discipline in an organized and structured environment it's good for their behavior as you pointed out but it's also good for their minds and it's a paradoxical fact maybe that children accept that they need to be rules that doesn't mean they like to obey them when you're when your 14 year old says you know about nine o'clock it's my bedtime I think I'll go to bed you'll take his temperature the kid's got a fever you know not normal but they know that there need to be rules when a child says to you why are there Rules by the time they ask you for rationalization behind the rules it's much too late right and the right answer to that is not because it's religious or because it's right the only answer you can give it's my house when you get married you can come to dinner without a shirt in this house no shirt no dinner whatever the rule is and that they can't argue against so there are these are the kinds of things you learn I'll add one final thing if I may I think the parents who are dealing with kids who are acting out and difficult in all ages but typically in the teenage years I think it's a parent's obligation to assert all the discipline you can get away with and wisely turn the Blind Eye where you're not going to win so if you've got a child doing something on Shabbos in their room behind closed doors whatever it is and insisting on that all you do is lose Authority but I think it's a it's a tragic error to abdicate responsibility where you where you can assert it so I say to parents who having trouble with trouble with teenagers what you can get away with this 13 you would definitely need to do that just because you've lost some other battles doesn't mean you have to lose them all beyond what you can assert and get away with you forced to turn a blind eye because you're not going one of those battles anyway so it's a wise decision you you need to make about which battles are worth fighting which ones are not worth fighting but the ones that you can win that's where you put your foot down you have a voice of authority and children look up to that I would only add and I don't mean to sound cliche-ish but King Solomon said rlp darco that every child is unique my wife and I have been blessed with a number of children and it's uncanny how different each child is from the other there is no one fast and steady rule that we can apply to each and every child there are some children who are simply born with a rebellious streak that the more we try to confine them the more they will Rebel there are other children who very much are parent Pleasers and Authority Pleasers and they want to do the right thing and we deal with each child a different way we're going to be reading very shortly parshus told us where Yitzhak and rivka have two very different boys they have a yaakov and they have an ace of two very very different kinds of children and I don't know necessarily that the Torah is trying to tell us to learn parenting lessons from Yitzhak or Rifka or both or a combination but certainly the way that Yitzhak dealt with asev was completely different from the way that he dealt with the more cerebral and Gent teal yaakov and it it could have been that story could be an indicator that no matter how much we try to work with our children who are born with that very very um aggressive streak we can only do our best to try and lead them in the right direction not necessarily succeeding and get getting them to learn 10 years um in in collo but at least getting them to become the great Community leaders that they are supposed to be that that's just I think that's really just the most important messages our children are unique nishamas and we have to assess them as they are husham and try to Cull the wisdom from our own parents from our peers in treating each one as a unique individual I notice you know thank God I have some adult children I think we all do and I noticed that some of my children raised their children very differently from the way that my wife and I raised ours and of course as a grandparent you have to you know keep your mouth shut that's the rule of grandparenting you get to enjoy them without the work but the price you pay is you can't say a word and I respect that but sometimes I'm puzzled by the way that I see my adult children negotiating with their children to do the right thing and I sometimes in my own mind find myself questioning whether that's the right way because as both Rabbi tats and Rabbi grauer pointed out our children are hungry for structure and if we don't provide it for them they act out in ways that they normally wouldn't so that's just something else to keep in mind so Dr Ed that when we talk about discipline we'd also continue to talk about the love as well you know the turmeric formula for education is a very strong left hand and a very strong right hand who was our teacher in this really who incidentally happened to be childless but when we asked him once about how he became such an authority in child racing he said he did have experience how his parents raised him although he never the opportunity to do that with his own children and his teaching was you need an extreme expression of love an extreme expression of discipline and extreme is really extreme I'll tell you a brief story about him which is not for our viewers not for Our Generation but it sets a certain tone he said there was a rule in his parents home's home that if a child asked for something they did not get it I once asked him now why they have a rule like that he said we didn't have you know it was very poor we didn't have parents needed us to know that if we have you'll get if we don't you don't but he told it to us in a discussion of discipline so I know it had its own value and he told us that one day his mother came through the doorman baranovic back in that generation his little brother Dobby was four years old only the only two of them had survived the war his mother walked him through the door with a little honey and in Eastern Europe you know that there were no candies there was a tremendous delicacy at age four the child knew that if he asked for some he wouldn't get it so he drew a trip to the table said I met aloud bracho and his mother went to the kitchen and brought him a glass of water you know a modern parent would melt in you know emotion and they turned out the people they turned out we can't do that to our children but we can do the equivalent at the level we capable of look along the lines though of what you're saying in the context of parents negotiating with teenagers a colleague of mine who's a prince of an elementary school shared with me last year that they happen to have overheard an incident in which a mother brought their little kindergarten to school to look at the classroom to look at the school and then they walked over the corner and they turned the mother this principal heard the mother turn into the little kid and said so now remember two days ago you went to this school yesterday was this school today you're here which one of the three do you like the best okay and it's a crazy story but it was a true story basically the mother was turning to this kindergarten and asking the child which one did you like the best which toys were the nicest which colors are the best again I don't know what ended up happening in the context of the choice that was made but it could be a bit ridiculous well there is what to be said about empowering children and giving them the sense that perhaps they are in control of their Destiny but it has to be done as you say within reason I want to throw a curveball question here as we're on the sort of topic to just if one or all of you can answer this question how do you deal with the fact that okay now you have a kid that's your 10 year old your 12 year old and you're giving your 10 year old just a lot more privileges because that kid needs it and then the the immediate older kid and the media younger kid sees that hey it's not fair you know I I have to go I have to do that by 11 my younger kid my younger sibling is has Netflix in the house and is going to about three o'clock in the morning so how do you educate one kidarko and the other kids feel it's not fair this is to me uh the toughest thing to do as a parent so I'd like to hear what you guys have to say about that because I have no clue well there is there is this running joke that the oldest child has dealt with the most severely as you said and then as we get more gray hair we get we get more fatigue easily we're tired of running and we we as parents start to slow down and be more permissive with our children as time goes on we have to check ourselves you know with age not only becomes you know we become not as necessarily as physically active but we're supposed to become wiser as well um one of the things that's so important is to learn from older people how to use the power of our speech to be persuasive to our children um younger parents who are inexperienced might Resort too readily to a little potion that took us using some corporal punishment and an older parent can sometimes have the wisdom to know that the right words and the right inflection placed at the right time can actually accomplish more than any kind of physical patch that we might give our children your point yeah so let's say you're 15 year old you let your 15 year old go to a co-ed Camp let's say that's not your Vibe at the home but that's what this kid needs or you let your 15 year old have no curfew and your 13 year old and your 17 year old are aghast and they're like why can't we do that well if they're polishing to do it then maybe there's something to discuss with them usually what happens is that each child at least that's my experience is on a different place religiously you know one child may be really a masmid and is really getting into the learning and you say it's not got nothing to do with co-ed or not co-ed but I want you to go to a camp where there's going to be learning a couple of hours every day because that's what you can handle and you make that child feel privileged that they're going to a more serious kind of camp where they where they're learning more and and this child you know that's best for for that child if the child gives you a hard time I think that may be an indication that they're trying to test the waters to see how far you'll go but you can always turn that decision into something which demonstrates to the child that you have such respect for them in their abilities that that's why you've chosen that path for them there is something you can say to children and that is that when kids say why don't I get the same as somebody else you can say we don't give all children in this home the same we give each one what he or she needs Hashem deals with us that way he doesn't give us all the same he gives us each what we need it's easier when the older ones get the more privileges because then it's more logical as well but when an older one has a bedtime that's different than a younger one and they say why don't I have the same you say he or she is that age it's appropriate for them you get what you need when you be that old you'll get that too so the the ideology I think behind it is not to say you all get the same but each one gets what they need it's a very cogent argument to young people I want to close on that look I'll add two thoughts number one you need to uh to Daven and say to Hellem um in these situations in the sense that um I know it sounds somewhat cliche but these are really challenging questions and situations to be in and you could do all of that and it could work wonderfully sometimes not sometimes it's worthwhile to seek advice from a professional from a therapist or from a rabbi or from someone who maybe has dealt with these types of situations there are certain instances in which a professional will tell you you know what you should be open and honest with your 13 or 11 year old and you should tell them that so and so is having certain challenges and as a result we're doing certain things and there are other situations where the professionals will say under no circumstance should you do that at all and they'll guide it in different direction it's really hard to give instructions in a theoretical case but um these are some of the challenges that exist in parenting and I don't think it's any easy one okay thank God I have my wife take care of everything I do nothing okay so we're after the last question um and then we'll call it an evening um okay so I think that's something we all struggle with uh giving meaningful Yiddish guide competing with the noise and the thought pollution of the world it's like uh that is what we want we want our kids to love Hashem and love tormentsos and they're competing against a lot so I have a crop kind of write tests in order to close I recently had a congregate come over to me and say you know one of the problems that I have in perhaps more of the the the the the the Orthodox rules that aren't so yeshivish is that you know no one's giving Musser I want someone to slap me across the face once in a while and tell me what I have to do uh and I said yeah so yeah he thought that maybe I was uh intimidated because of the politics of the board and I shouldn't give too much Musser I said believe me the show will be doing me a favor I can make Aliyah tomorrow I'd be a happy man the issue is that today's generation I speak only for what I'm observing in today's generation need a tremendous amount of love as Rabbi tites talked about in a prior generation with rep simcha and his parents that there was there was one Derek it was a lit Fischer Derek there was austerity in the in the world not just in the Jewish world and there was one mahalak there was one way of of raising children in today's world where Society is so permissive and so permeated with the message of empowerment um we just have to reinforce how much we love our children I love you I love you I love you and that's why you have to do X and um making sure that our children know that they are loved and at the same time and that they and that we respect their great abilities that we hold them in very high regard and at the same time using that as the as the foundation for why they need to comply with certain things in their lives so that they will become the people they're destined to become I think that has to be the overarching message now for each parent and for each circumstance that's going to vary but that sort of basic structure is I think what our children need most uh two quick ones I'd like to make one is before the Yiddish card needs to be integrated happy thriving kids you know the kids who are pushed on a Jewish level but they're not functional on a personal level everything goes eventually you can't build healthy Yiddish and learning on a frustrated and fractured personality so it and and when a child is struggling that's the dimension that needs to be addressed first when they're thriving happy wanting to go to school wanting to learn the Judaism will probably follow so that's very important to remember and second thing is that Judaism needs to be taught creatively so that when you're giving your Malaysia for example to boys who let's face it why should they be interested you know there's Sports out there there's glitzy glamorous stuff why should they be interested in old dusty you know hundreds and thousands of years of technical you know legal niceties when you're 13 it's not natural so the teacher needs to be creative you know riddles and cool things that they you know be bribe them if necessary what's wrong with little bribery you know prizes and um the other teacher has to have some you know cool challenges here's the question during the next class you'll find discover the answer to that there's a prize for doing it yeah be creative you know to to engage them so if they are drawn by the media which are professionally engaging we need to be professionally engaging too and it's just not good enough to use the old dry you know religiosity you know it sounds trite and we just gotta do better than that so you know it's a good time to plug Torah live my friends uh amazing app yeah you know Twitter lab good stuff yeah uh first of all it is an incredible cover to be with both of you and uh a big thank you to be on this uh distinguished panel it really is an honor um I would say three things first of all I agree so much or attached that it social emotional well-being mental Wellness mental health is Paramount and that has to be looked after first and foremost and I also agree incredibly that we need to make Judaism enticing Far kid I had a review of mine who once said and uh the idea was that you need to figure out a way to get to kids but I'm also a huge believer that we need to make it compelling I'm a big believer in shabbatons in Singing in dancing and adding to the experiential aspects to learning trying to have as many of those as possible kids have to enjoy it kids have to love it the love is obviously essential but don't forget me and as kids are engaged in these healthy activities and as we're able to provide healthy outlets for them that are Kosher and that are exciting they're going to get into it more right the you know you know you have to acculturate these positive actions as much as possible and frankly schools need to work with jewels and need to work with parents in that regard I'll share just one last anecdote I had a parent in my office a few weeks ago who was complaining a little bit about the fact that uh her son doesn't go to uh to minion uh you know days when there's a vacation days where there's no school and I know where we know each other a member of your show but that's okay but I I said no no I said to her I said listen I said we both know that your husband doesn't go to Minion I said it's not a secret we know that and she says to me yes Rabbi but that's why I sent him to archaim that's the reason I sent him to Yeshiva because I wanted him to go to ninja and I said listen I wish we could do that all the time I wish we could solve for that it's just not that simple so you have all of these pieces that come together and ultimately that's what you have to do to sort of overcome a little bit a small piece of the noise and then you need a lot of muscle you need a lot of muzzle throughout because ultimately that uh that's an essential part of it but your but your message though is is that parents should not think that the Yeshiva is the Panacea is the Magic Bullet that's going to cure everything we are partners with our parents our the schools and the shules are partners and if any one of those parties is not willing to be an active partner it's not going to work schools are not spiritual hospitals it just doesn't work that way right you know they play a key role a key component but how the value would be that simple right I want to end off with uh I I was a guild of a game show host so we're going to end off with just a question sort of answer the question because the world is great Hashem loves us Hashem loves the Jewish people so I'm going to start off a sentence and then I'm going to Easter the three rabbis finish the sentence and no this has not been pre-planned so they're actually very nervous right now they're like Robbie putting me on the spot okay okay so we're gonna rub attach Robert kravkin and Rabbi Greer okay we're going to end off with this teenagers are amazing because Rabbi attacks because they're fresh in the world because they're discovering themselves and finding out what it means to be an adult because they push us all to be great people and to up our game in order to be able to figure out how to help them to succeed and how to help them to become incredible adults amazing thank you so much for joining us amuda and please support a great organization helping really everyone and you don't really know about it because they do it privately so thank you so much for joining us and everyone should have a great evening thank you thank you thank you foreign [Music]