Why Did R' Chaim Answer So Many Letters (Part 2) & R' Dov Landau Shlita

[Music] welcome back Rabbi Dr leazar brat it is a pleasure to be with you once again last episode got lots of feedback um I don't know if you want to share it it's prepared to share yet um but people were fascinated by the conversation whether Rim was a p and when he was writing that nothing that he writes is we should Pas like it and the history of other that were written with that type of of warning was a fascinating conversation and we're going to follow up a little bit um on that and a little bit more on rim responding and writing so many letters to thousands upon thousands of people and we're also going to have something a little contemporary letters and conversations that had back and forth with CA Inka so we're looking forward to this we once again thank our sponsor Anonymous sponsor for season two of R which I'm told this is the second to last episode that's what I've been I've been told um and then we're gonna have some more topics and different areas people have ideas they're welcome to write in um sponsorships are always available BR spends incredible amounts of time preparing researching these works so please reach out to myself at sched M ou.org or Rabbi br elzer br atgmailcom once again if you want to be added to any one of his lists Rabbi BR sends out fascinating material specifically before Y purm is coming up today is is already preparing what his perm send is going to be so feel free to reach out and be added to that list as well with that too long of an introduction here is R BR no not too long it's fine you have to listen to me for much longer so it's perfectly fine um okay so basically last week sorry the last episode we spoke about we moved into kanski's vast letters that he published um that ended up getting P some of them are getting published or are being published also in the works and we and we discussed a question that many asked in his lifetime and people asked spoke about during the SPM is why Doki spent so much time every day answering dozens and dozens of letters for years and years I don't I still have not found when he exactly started um answering so many letters daily but at one point it seems it was over 80 letters a day um so question question is why did he feel it was so important and the the complaint was this took away from him writing other great works such as he began his work on Kim and because of this he was not able to finish it he he told this to people so as I said already last week this was a question that rski was asked like everything else that he was asked he was also asked this so we don't have to speculate whyi felt so important and he basically said um at different times he said these three ants to other people but the person that we quoted from was raer who was like to have a very close relationship Toki over a period of 20 years so one was held it some form of because we know he wasn't he didn't have a so this was his way of being through these letters okay another thing was we said um that he was mentioned was he wanted to give um because it it caused by getting these letters the senders would get as raous feel very good and they would be inspired to learn further and the third thing was simply R they send them letters um and they want it was more some type of a type of thing now so these were the these were the three answers Ki said so what we spoke about in the previous episode was amongst other things was is that there's a that I was tring trying to locate um where this comes from and I my suggestion was we spoke by was there a piece from brings down that his father used to tell him all the time that you're not creative for yourself but what to help people whatever you're able in your your strength to do so I spoke about that concept now and I gave some sources and um in the in thean World about this nuda so I so I want to just um mention very briefly not to go full force into this topic but just to mention some other prum about this I was so um one of the books that have quoted numerous numerous times throughout the is the book about written by his son so inter ly enough a GLE that I when my reaction um every time I read the book of on his father each time I get more and more to the and one of the things I take took away from when I read the book again and again is you see is what does it mean is he wasn't let's say Mish Brewer right so he wasn't out there to go put out he's gonna work on on and he's going to put in all hisus and everything no he felt he was a tremendous need he actually tried to hire people or to get encourage other gim to put it out no one was no one took the bait to do it so he he had to do it himself and he realized and he felt that there was a need for this work at the time what that is um actually middle of working on um what was the need exactly why what he felt about it he deals with it a little bit in his introduction and he went ahead and he goes and spends he devotes 25 years to put out this massive work Mish breur which today is is unbelievable what the payers from this work now what happened is he held that this is what this is important but on the other hand he doesn't go and put all his into these six volumes it sounds like it would have been much much bigger work what was important and what was necessary is what he what he put together and even told his son re different times it's not about putting it's not about to show off you and to just St right and everything it's it has to have a major so everything was what was included in the safer so so basically saw a need and he went ahead for the and he went and gave himself fully fully 25 years again it's not 25 years of 24 hours learning Justice he was involved with many other things but what when you see all of a sudden other things did when a different need would come up if it was necessary he would write a safer about it he would get involved he would travel he would go he was he was is he didn't just sit not that there's a problem if someone does just sit as we'll see shortly but was a doer of things and you see this certain type of mus of this nuda that I'm throwing from now okay this but interestingly enough as I was um looking about this so I I for I actually forgot about this is the there was a conversation specifically about this between and his son was it seems like from this book um was a tremendous tremendous he was in we've already discussed he was involved with the writing of the mishna and all different things and he lived with his father a lot of the time and it see so he writes at one point in time when when he was younger he was he was helping this and and it there's actually reasons behind what was going onone and that one confine when you read the book and and told him it's not that you're being I too much what will I do say I write if I see there a problem I write and then through that people get better but and he and um then and then writ in parentheses which is what I quoted last week from valner that even says such a thing of doing and doing doing for other people but if you look in says it has to be things if it's things that's so he was sort of giving his son who was being is in in um which is a tremendous thing but he was giving a mus that you have to be careful when and there has it has to fit guidelines okay so all I'm saying is even though he was doing this we're going to see actually shortly through what I'm going to say in the next um say today was being even with this mus that he was giving her BL okay we got that a second now interestingly enough I saw that the the writes about his father in was also against C he doesn't say who um that he felt there being too okay so interestingly enough we know different they were very um again each is its own story and needs to know what the parameters are and each one was able to pass in and know what they were doing and then some was was very involved daily in a hospital um and this is a whole fascinating discussion when it comes to talking about RAB salant we know from accounts he gave up a lot of his own learning he was a but because he felt the tremendous necessity what the world what was going on in the world at the time and and and so much so that when it was brought to his attention about someone that was just sitting and learning um the talus had filed the whole day and and he and he talk was learning and he said no wasn't impressed he was saying is that sometimes there's of worry about the D so kki according to what I'm trying to bring out is this is his way there was a necessity for this so he felt yes it has to sacrifice his on this expense okay now I've quoted a bunch of times um numerous times actually the god Min the book about the God Minsk so I I quoted it endless times I I was very ready through the inspiration of Rabel gapin always hearing always quo these Ando and conversations that was written by this year R Halper R Halper I mentioned was a tremendous Tam who was the tutor of the children of the Godin so and he through this he spent a lot of time in the house of the Godin and he had many conversations with him so at one point they have a series of conversations and it seems that he um he he was telling him he was giving him sort of like complaints that people were saying that uh you know you're too busy you only answer that you only answer shus you're not involved in the cber you don't go visit the even the T you don't go give them um um visiting them to check to make a and he has a few pages fascinating fascinating conversation back and forth between him and the god sort of saying complaints that people in the city of Min it's not a small little is a big city had about the this godal who is the the chief Rabbi of the city and um and the god Minsk answers him up beautifully and talks about he says yes it's true there is a mer of we find throughout of being is an important thing but it's not for every person he says the problem is and and how he writes this out um one of the fascinating things about this safer is that this author as I just said was tremendous so he knew had a right unbelievable um anyway he says he like this people and this is a for people out people um read a lot of different things about a lot of different people or they hear different things a lot of different people so they Envision themselves a perfect R that's able to be multi-talented and have all types of skills and all every he's able to do everything he's the best in learning but he's also the best in this best in this he's also the biggest in and and says this is far from true it's not realistic you want a r and he said L when the city of mince they took me they knew they checked into me I W I didn't hide anything they checked my place where I was before I was who I was I was a pisc that's it I wasn't a person that's going around to be involved with all the things and then he also again but anyway the point is um it's a fascinating conversation well wor one reading um the pages about it I'm not going to quote all the aspects but you see here again that there's this different and different people even have different jobs in and there's definitely room and necessity for people that are's highest ugh butki was TR was doing in his way for the he felt the necessity for the Tira but there's two other aspects and and that's why I feel it's not only the of as he said or feeling bad for the people and everything is like this number one is that which he does whichi said in these answers is also for the this is his way of being so there is a question and this question has been asked and discussed by many people I I I um which is as follows people it comes to talk and we and I already mentioned something a little bit about this which is as follows sometimes people are not sure what um what career they should take should they remain let's say learning in K or um or and they get a job they get a a job offer to become a whatever it is so they feel it's going to it's a sa it's going to be a tremendous sa and they're able to obviously this is talking about people that financially at that point they're still able to continue learning but they feel but the main concern is they take the job it's going to come at a sacrifice for their own Ty learning so I mentioned already um um in the previous episode um he was learning k for 19 years ra and everything and then he got to Stellar offer to be a stellar rash and he had a big should he switch career so to speak he wasn't sure and why he was told yes so but part of the question which many raban have asked um at different times in their lives to their ranim so to speak is what about what about this I'm going to go down and learning because I'm I'm now have to be ISC and preparing for my Tam so there's a concept which I don't even know how many people say it but the one Mar that I have that say says it often is in a few times he says this and that is don't ever worry about it the a rebbi gets so much from a talud that he can't even imagine that even though it appears at this point in time you might be thinking oh I'm going down no you it's unbelievable what you are getting from being a rebbi this is what that FL writes to see it inside in the incredible of his on he also says it in I think and other places also where he deals with this thing I I I I I once said is it turns out that the we don't even know most for years and years and years but we don't know most of but we do know one tal of his if you had theal known as the it definitely in these words of the actually happened now interestingly enough there's a letter um um published in dark from the great God zberg so this is a fascinating work a that had to do with um all types of others and was asked a in a letter which was a similar type of question which was asked um by the fact that it's gon it's going to affect your your Shay or your and learning should you should you be concerned about this and he said shom no not at all and he writes and he writes beautifully in this letter also he was giving eight I think to his son um about pursuing some type of career and he also said the same type of nuda that we that I'm quoting from the um I'm not not as not the same wording as a but a similar type ofuda which is don't worry about it makes it that that with VI you're not you might think you're gonna go down but you're not going to be going down at all the interestingly enough just two other Mar clim on this there's AO the ch um said such a thing also people have to know this from the you gain unbelievable amounts um I also saw recently he was nervous when he got his Stellar to become a rashash Shiva um if it's possibly gonna go affect his learning um I think he even had a conversation with it about his wife he Saida they say that it's not going to affect it okay if if it's true or not I can't say now but but now the question is but what is there any more to this nuda with this concept of from and so I feel and this is what I feel is even more in the Godless of these letters ofi on one hand someone looks at these letters and there are so so many of them you're like okay what's the point of these letters because a lot of these what what do I mean a lot of these letters are asking simple questions um um they're not um they could be a 12-year-old B you know whatever a 10-year-old B had some question he's learning a thing you know Mish he could ask his rebi and he taking the time to answer the answer is I think like this um and this is built on another nuda back to this book with the Min there was a complaint to the m another such complaint that that was voiced and was like this why the ranim back in the day and even today it's n why do we find that they write truis they write truis to people not in their cities they're hired to deal with their cities so what are they doing going and answering questions to people outside that they don't know they never met what are they doing getting involved let them be busy with their city and their city alone then another another similar complaint was people walk in and they see the RV he's learning Tyrus or he's learning IIs or or different things that are not like make sure you know the the or the what are you doing learning all these things what what's going on here as that complaint they had to the obviously this is fascinating this this person had such a tremendous relationship with the Min he was able to bring this up I don't know how many RAB today if some R some guy Bal andil would start talking to about these things how we go over but anyway the point is like this the Minsk said what are you talking about that's the whole point of a RV that's how a RV remains a RV he has to be ick in all areas that's how he learns that's how he knows how to answer you want him to know the answer for everything that's how he keeps his skills going and by the fact that gu he's learning even kach and Tyrus because K Isa to answer everything it's not enough to learn and just know as I quoted already in season one withi points this out how you pasing aun Shas from places that you never would think that and that's what what we see from fascinating stories with all different that we have throughout the generations that their knowledge and was what helped them and it wasn't enough that they just were an expert in let's say arai now so this is what the said and he said and he furthermore this is an A in the truis is a way that they keep in touch they it's like a speaking and learning and I'm going to I'm going to add to this in much more in this shortly when I discuss the letters between one more over here like this to add to this with the is like this the best type of kar one will'll find is is it was what got meki had a s we discussed this a million times already called that every day he was being um he he he had a set amount of material that he would learn and he would be Messi all areas of literally callula every year so now how does one keep on their toes and make sure that they know it the best way is by all being asked all types of questions under the sun now you'll ask a RV an honest RV and I'll tell you how does he make sure that he knows what the answer is because he spends before pesak um a few weeks preparing and learning mishura it's not enough there's a there's it's known there's a tremendous I I I might have mentioned this in the past the says it Frank goes with this that a has tremendous when he's when he's answering a but but there's another nuda when a r is constantly tested so his best K of p is when he's asked the whole time all the questions so he so first of all R he wants to make sure he keeping his job he wants to keep his gahal happy he wants to give them proper answers but all this is helping it's it's a it's a cader Kazar so kki every day he's getting let's say 80 to 100 questions he's literally C the tons because people it became known after a certain period of time especially you could talk to this you could write to this person about anything so he's being tested so to speak about everything so it's it's it's not only it's it's similar to what the Minsk God's answer was which you have to read very carefully how he writes it out beautifully in this book on the on M um there's obviously different CES but the point is that VI talking and learning and being asked questions that is the best Kazar I once remarked a comment and that was like this at a certain age Yeshiva guys get um um are very proud of themselves that they know how to learn and they tend to mock or make fun of their their Rim what I mean Rim they're high school they get to B medish they think they're sometimes they're world's greatest ldim they were they already learning a year or two ldas and their High School have no and they or other have no and the point is like this so I I put it in perspective I say like this in many high schools what happens is a rabbi besides for preparing the material he has to um spend a lot of time because he has to break it down for all levels of the class I'm talking about a good RBI in high in high school so there's different levels of boys in the classroom but more than that what happens is and I made a simplein from my own experience there's a test every few weeks the amount of times the rebi had to say over the material every suya was at one point the was like 30 40 times so he's haing all the ra everything the BL the he's eating being ass on every single rash so now on a mass scale is getting tested on a crazy amount of yeah no one's checking if he's right or wrong because we knew we assume that he's right but the point isi didn't even have a problem to answer these letters yeah we're all nervous kki he's not putting out his work on kach tirus the answer is he was able to put out and I'm going to demonstrate um in in in future episodes in certain swarm you could see this uniqueness came from he was being asked such questions because they knew who else could you ask you ask I don't know so he took the information that he got from his learning and he was able to apply it and think and use it for everything so he was also gaining this nuda similar to I'm saying building off the FL and others ultimately he gained also and that's why I feel is that he was he he was able to answer questions now this is this is withi could be I'm right could be I'm wrong I'm right that it's a true concept but if if it's true forki who knows and the point is just to bring out the LI for us also that sometimes people are nervous learn with a guy that's not as the same level as you especially in Yesa World is's always a thing you know yeah the B the guy you learn with has to be a and whatever and the point is no a lot of times if you learn with a guy as long as the person's interest and learning it forces you to have to explain the things and you get a CL a much greater clarite in the thing this is a cabala I actually have from my father he's always tell me get AA it's better to get a guy that knows less than you because it's going to force you to have to make sure to know what's going on and you have and you're and this and we see so this is an AUD I'm taking out fromi with these letters so it wasn't only that he's doing a and it's not only thisa of that he's it's a of being but it's of the that don't worry about you thinking you're going down in levels you're going to remain just fine now there's another which relates to all this which relates to this which was like this how did Ram write all these Tris to other people sort of a let's say so my my claim that I've made um in researching CH of is as FS on one hand we find a is asked the question so you can answer him all of a sudden you see if you look sometimes at some truist that pages and pages long what's going on over here not only that in certain Tru F you'll see they're not even about question it could be about it could be about it could be pages and Pages what's going on here so my my claim was and others make this claim also is basically is in those days a was a r and let's say a small little a small little or something he might not even had anyone to talk to a learning so his way of keeping up in learning and discussing learning was through letters today the world is a whole different way the world is there's a telephone there's emails there's all different things the the speed that everything goes it's it's hard for us to imagine but in those days there was no telephones when someone wrote a letter to another person it took forever till you got the response and everything so there was an so there's a term in the academic world Republic of letters but basically the way raban kept up and built and and remain top of their game was goofa through writing letters so Aila wants their R three writing letters because this is the way of him speaking and learning and keeping his skills now with that in mind SOI okay so he could say he's answering These Guys these letters and maybe it's keeping him not maybe it's keeping him up I said because it's keeping on his toes because he's getting all these exotic questions also okay on one hand that's true now I'm going to go back now to discuss Way Way Back kki we know is born in 1928 there's a fellow bener who's today one of the great of Cl he was born 1930 so he's only two years younger thanki he's 94 years old now what's fascinating is he lives in B and I believe he lived in B at the time around 1958 which would mean Rd was 28 years old now it could be really the letters started earlier but they start a correspondence which spans from 1958 till 2008 of letters what was published was 123 letters between these two giants now re in recent years in recent months actually um reua Inbal prolific writer of today a contemporary writer of today tremendous put out work called and the back he has a a whole nice section of hundreds of pages devoted to the and his b Med and he has a whole section about on these letters and he has interesting points as he learned through these letters differents that things that he was on in the correspondence between the two this book recently arrived in America um even though I think internet it seemed like someone want attempted to put it in some type of but any anyway a very interesting book which I'm working on the um um different aspects to discuss about this about this work but he has a few pages devoted to this CER between Andi okay so as I said this begins in 1958 um and and just to give a little sense of what we're talking about here there is um what causes me to be a spell when I picked up these letters the letters came out in 2022 while was still alive volume one and then afterwards volume two came out start looking at these letters and I'm just you literally want I once heard that met and they met so the letters it's interesting thing they met they live in B they don't live so far from each other but the people the way someone once told it to me years and years ago was they just spoke marus they say oh gar that yeah gar this to answer like they knew the RM that each one was referring to and you just watch two giants ping pong back and forth callula but okay that's a story that I heard all of a sudden now I see these letters 120 letters and you see this is exactly what's happening we're talking about I'm not talking about we're talking about over here we're talking about P letters not one that he punked open up no a bunch ofs a few letters this is this is crazy I'm saying how many people even okay people know that to is found the back of the gar but that's usually about it I'm say look at to forget about then you have in okay again this is going back and forth between the two people normally it's famous writes very in these letters he really writes out what he's saying and sometimes says don't understand what he's saying but the letters are incredible to see two Russ to see two handling somewhere in tanak that it's also you know not in the in the regular standards of of what you're learning okay um of course they're both um um heavily influenced by the great Kish many hand and all different kishes in all his farm tons and tons of back and forth about Mish which again in B is a very important saer based on the which we've already discussed but then you have like exotic things such as the saer of the all of a sudden it seems got a copy he had a few harus and he's like this doesn't make sense this doesn't make sense so who does he write to who even knows what to say for is we're not talking about we're talking about the BR M now if you listen to season one we actually devoted a few minutes episode to discuss this but most people I don't really think know anything about the M but is learning it and he has he has questions on it who does he ask he has pages of answering it back and forth and they don't L up at one point um um starts starts out with a r he moves to he ends up with a tar he ends up with the tki writes him back handling again it's just it's just simply kalish had to watch these two Giants going back and forth and just turn the pages without even knowing what they're talking about one is just blown away to see just what what's happening over here okay just to pull out a few very quick Nas um from the from these things is like this one is wrot the various curious dozens of also dozens of and answers them and what's fascinating to me also was is that not writing in some of them is writing real answers a few lines discussing handling handling even a or any or the other things of the come up and it's just you're watching it's like with such a like not it's like it's not again it could be I'm reading into this this last sentence I'm about to say is like ready whatever you want to just throw at me I'll have an answer for you but it's it's an incredible thing um you also see throwing I found that fascinating okay anyway as I'm going through the letters he was working on so who does he ask to look through the letters of he asks sorry not the letters he says to could you please go through one of the most complex areas of does do so at because of the request of okay at one point um he writes about the and he says um that it's it's a very important safer and I also I'm going to be to go through it it's a tremendous that you have by writing this saer and this is on the which we've spoken about also that some people are like okay what's the big deal what was the great what's the great story behind the safer why you why even write it okay so this is another nuda that um that was um came up in these letters about the sh okay one second now so the question is like this did what was going on why was he writing these letters the answer is asked him to write themi was appreciative of this and so much so that at some point it seems didn't want to write sirki says please continue writing don't I it's unbelievable and again why am I what I think is is because this nuda of it was a talking and learning type of thing so when you talk um um B basically at one point he says writes at the end of the letter you think that the letters are me your words are so important and nice to me I answer you right away and and cader one will findi saying this to him early on in their ear in their correspondence as it began uh about these letters okay I'm GNA I just want I just want to share with about three four things from these letters hold on I just marked off the pages all messed up sorry um let's see okay one in one letteri says to this is par B parous in 1960 okay so he writes something like this sorry you have to M me I got your letter between yipper and sukus and we already know that you have to be busy and then he says I couldn't write I guess he held even writing not to write which is was was okay so this is just in a letter you see writing and excusing himself why is he not answering him right away okay um then um when he writes to um he writes this is in 1960 this is we not you know we're talking about way way back okay then he to do it he says please keep on sending these letters and and he and send he did he wrote 123 letters he would go through all theki whether it was and as I said different many any they back and forth about this okay I'm just going to hold on I have over here marked off there's too many different things to quote we're not going to give five sh just to discuss all the fascinating things in here but let me just see if I was able to find another time he writes you don't I'm wondering why you being that you're writing me these letters I already wrote you again the same concept okay one second but I'm being repetitive wait then at one point it seems was wrote a bunch of ARS about time the and then he he says he apolog apologizes that he's writing a little sharp um so says what are you talking about from your letters okay so basically yes you wrote to me and you don't have to apologize this is how um um this is how learning is okay so now just to be M with three NAS from these letters three more takeaways from these letters one was um DAV so interestingly enough in the course of a correspondence over here writes what about basically saying the great importance of then they handle this m that they will handle but then in the in the course of some other letters he also um discusses again about the importance of DAV I think wrote them something about it responds about this okay so this is one such letter that another fascinating d reading through these letters okay another interesting thing was as follows I'm reading the letter and has a question in there was a and the person wanted to know if he could sit on the floor um like an OV so um is asking what does he know about it okay says so for me this was a fascinating find and I'll explain to you why what's going on who's this ra and the answer is very simple and why is this fascinating I'm just going to be Mak just say two points over here many many years ago I was looking into the ofin as a work do we rely on it or not so a friend of mine told me that his father had learned Inka and he heard that said you want to know what to do look in the and do the exact opposite so here I found fascinating is asking what is say look um the author of The fascinating Mar for me and we see that even now what's so significant is is a person that's so be quoting we know he's the M he's the pis that argued on the with the dayline and here we see he's he's saying don't worry look at now this is obviously part of a great story relating to the relationship between thein the the what the the newer generation of thei this is a topic I'm actually in middle of of working on um which we'll discuss shortly tiny proud about it and then a lot of times they'll be handling something not a lot of times but sometimes you know something it's we just had PM so I'm going to tell you relating to pum and this is what I will be M with this is like this he was answering then he says it's was like he answered this on Tinus Esther so he says like this I was asked a question um which I was always wondering and is as follows we do we say why so everyone knows because they all died at once so first of all what's this nce or not what's the what's the big deal that they died at once and what's going on um how do we even know this but but more than that what's this thing of doing it we don't really find this anywhere else okay in the story he says like this from the fact if you look at theim and you read theim right it sounds like they were killed one after the other but we know they really died at once now the point is it's impossible to say 10 names at once so you have to write it one after the other so how in the world are we massing this m that at once this great is by saying so it comes out that says that sometimes and we find this other places also that the TR and the T is what helps understand something and that's it's not but there was no other way to get so that's why it's only found over here such a thing of why because we want to bring out this that it was Tak that they died all at once now what's the significance of why they died at once that we have to discuss in but anyway the point is here was a thing that was handling something with him so he right away says oh it's let me just tell you that it came up with for this question okay in a different letter is also around per time where they were already handing let me you buter the point that I'm trying to bring out is like this kki had this correspondence of which spawned years and years and years earli years was much more often later on there could be one point there's a gap of 10 years and this is probably when they both got much much busier and they didn't have the time but this is a way that I'm claiming is to see if someone wants to see of of Jews even who still alive today in this is a we're talking everything with but it's also which is behind letters this is a way of talking and learning or handling and learning or keeping one on their toes so rki appreciated R's letters and I'm not saying that rki was happy and was running after letters because there were letters that he didn't answer for whatever but the point is as a whole these letters even though we might think that they take away from his learning um um I'm claiming that they kept him on his toes and and just to mention it's known had these tests which we might discuss a little bit more at a later point but the point is these tests would be these type of things like weird questions like you look at the M how do you know this thing and the answer is his mind kept on being trained he was basically his his as we called through these questions and through these dealings with people incredible incredible fascinating information one point perhaps you alluded to it a little bit kki and land were probably within like a 10-minute walk of each other yeah but maybe even less that's what I'm saying that's that's what I find so interesting about this whole thing it's not like okay they both didn't have telephones or use telephones I understand but the and the young if you know they start their correspondence in the 75 okay say they we're talking about they started this when the 28 and 30 they they they're able to walk so the answer is there was there's there's a over here which I didn't go into which I might go into is in writing and that's another is a very important thing but we'll deal with it a different and there probably someone who could track with today's historical information that they met when they met how they met they probably were meeting each other all the time also yeah I I as far as I know they did meet uh me say even in the letters there's times oh we met we discussed and there's times in the letters you could see it's something they had a conversation about so they met they met they met enough times qu and you have to also understand we today me at least the way I'm growing up is I'm by Me was not accessible pretty much for most of my the time that it would have been again and you watch all the videos and there's thousands of people but there was a time not so far back that there wasn't anyone driving him crazy he was able to sit thinking there's pictures of him you know his 80 sitting at a regular table in a public place learning there there are such things so we're talking about when he's 28 and it's B BR as big is today we we we saw last year you know but saying it's not it's not it's not what that was not the ne of when they're 28 and 30 okay you want to show us safer yes so one thing just because I alluded to it is sometimes the war comes out which is which is a game changer in understanding a lot of different things and that goes back to something I just spoke about a few minutes ago I mentioned so everyone knows he's famous for the know from and others know from different works of his and he's famous for being in the date um the person that argues with thees anyway a few a few months ago right after suus a beautiful work comes out also including topics on and these type of stuff tons of su things correspondences of his with and some of the letters over here are Fascinate this fascinating things and one of the fascinating things about these volumes is he get to behind the scenes of of the development the also besides all the many other things this this is only and other different fascinating materials about different controversy evolved there's also some that he started to write the controversies relating to his Lu all could be found in these two volumes that these two beautiful volumes called um it's called hagit it looks like this two beautiful volumes available in Isel and I believe in America at this time that just came out and because we just spoke about him we able to kill two birds with one stone okay thank you very much looking forward to what could possibly be the closing episode the finale season two of r kayki