Inheritance in Modern Times with Rabbi Mordechai Willig

[Music] so it is covered as we learn through the many and people's minds and hearts are tuned or in tuned to theim of inheritance yusha nla so we learned we learn M that are pretty straightforward simple basic rules and I think we see we don't see that that's the way the the the V the world is actually dividing up their inheritance so we invited on morai willig who wears many hats he's a RV in Riverdale or Shiva in Wu but I think for this presentation we reached out to him as the abz ofz of America and perhaps the r from all these three different angles could take us from the beginning through to what the Min is today why we do this and perhaps how we interlay this how we are able to work aligning what the teror requires with the secular law thank you very much this is a very thorny issue generally speaking we have complete amuna that the Torah is not only absolutely true and immutable but also that the values of the Torah are true and immutable and therefore we are always attempting to maintain to the best of our abilities the letter of the law and the spirit of the law it's clear in the and as en learning knows fully well that is very clear the Torah tells us that if there is a firstborn he receives a double share other Sons re receive a single share and daughters receive zero it's not a question and yet in many of our circles this is not done ways are found and we'll discuss them in detail to somehow circumvent what the Torah exactly wanted which is a a Pella usually we are very much opposed to this and of course whenever it comes to things of this nature we have to be guarded by the G but the Giants of the generations who teach us and inform us when we have to be strict and maintain the law of the Torah as it stands no matter what that the chips fall where they may or when in certain circumstances ways can be found to change things a little bit for higher purpose again governed by gor let's go back to the Rama who is certainly the godor and is the still the godor for ashkanazi Jews who was in some ways you might call him a renaissance man he lived at a time when things were changing in the the Jewish World in the outside world certain liberal winds were blowing affecting Army Israel and what was happening was that if the laws of theha would be followed precisely it would lead to terrible disunity disputes divisions divisiveness within families because the women felt disenfranchised and discriminated against and there was some kind of a device which was introduced by the in his preceded him of course called let's discuss that briefly right now what in those days of the Renaissance in the 16th century if a man would have two sons and two daughters no just to make it easy so by Torah law two sons each get 50% the daughters got zero in order to maintain the peace with something called the what's let's not get too egalitarian give the woman a half of the share that a man gets that'll make us satisfied so if there was two sons and two daughters the two sons would each get one3 and the each daughter get one six that was a which is found both in Evan and how does it work work exactly so just to make a long story short what happens is that a man accepts upon himself a responsibility for an inordinate sum of money more than he has or ever will have and just to make it simple again he will indemnify himself to his daughters so let's say he I guess for most people this enough he condemned themselves to his daughters for 100 million okay so each daughter will get $50 million leave what what does that leave for the sons zero he doesn't want that so he puts in a condition and says if if the sons who are the rightful heirs who were entitled to 50% each will of their own give each of their sisters one six of the total estate then this obligation is null and void so therefore now the young men would call behind the eightball if they don't give their sisters one six they'll left with zero because creditors take priority in any inheritance and they'll left with nothing so forcing their hand to of their own give their their sisters one six of the estate they left one3 of piece that's simple workings of why did it fall into disuse so the m today you know why cuz now they want they want exactly equal that idea is found in the classical Parish from hundreds of years ago and of our time think it's a very important idea to reestablish a in order to see to it that we Al shalom shalom that Shalom that peace and Harmony should dwell in in our midst and let me give you my personal history 40 something years ago asked me to write something for one of the W Publications alumni that people should know that they should have some kind of a document of this type in order to make sure that their secular will is in fact Hally binding the most authorities the secular will is not binding CU a there a very notable exception seems to say that it might be might work on the grounds of you're supposed to follow the words of the person who passed away it is true that in it is stated based that's only true if you actually the money was given in the person's lifetime to a third party to then give it over to the people whom he designates in his lifetime Raa seems to think that that's only needed in order to make it actionable because once it's in the third party's hands and escrow he'll do what the what the decedent what the person who passed away wanted whereas if it's still in this his The House of the person passed away they won't necessarily follow what he wants he's longer alive says ra if you write a secular will which is the government will force the man's wishes to be fulfilled it's the equivalent of and therefore it would work I would say that most authorities are not accepting Ra's opinion if it comes to a Tor it's a very complicated matter who do you follow we don't want to get involved withus so therefore ask me just to write up a brief document basically well the truth is he didn't tell me at the time 40 something years ago what to say all it was as follows I all of my two two daughters $100 million but if my sons who are my rightful Torah HS will follow what is written in my last will and testament whatever is there then the obligation is not and void so then the person can tailor make his will any way he wants he give the money to his daughters he can give the money Tock whatever he wants but typically even at should not be taking the money if there's no such document because the money belongs to the sons not not to the stock up doesn't matter what you wrote in your will but if you have this accompanying document so then you can owe the fortune money to somebody else and the sons who would otherwise get the money would be are stuck behind the eight they better follow the will the rest they get nothing so they're going to follow the will and they give the sisters an equal share typically today and they give ster to whatever the first left with ster otherwise they got nothing this is what he asked me to do 40 something years ago was printed in one of the publications of the fast forward to now this week 17 years ago pasas Noah 2007 he asked me do something further he's seen so many fights in families get up and say the truth that the best thing to do is a just give everybody an equal share even though it's not what it says in the Torah but it's for a higher reason the reason of Shalom to which I wrote something which is called inheritance without a fight writing a will in modern times and it starts with the PK we read two days ago said to his brothers had two sons one killed the other because of the inheritance of the world the problems of inheritance already go back a long long long time a long time it's really a sad fact that there are people who fight over these things which leads to really terrible terrible um results splits in families which can last forever it's terrible there's an expression in you know a famous expression where there's a will there's a way there's an expression in America today where there's a will there's a fight that's a very sad comment but unfortunately I've seen it to be true sadly um and what do we do to overcome this we have to be wise and follow theor who have taught us that nowadays things have changed I refer you specifically to a statement in the famous sa called the G the G wasinski who's from we call him a background from the old yes in he wasn't someone who could be accused of some kind of a modernism or liberalism in any which way and he tells you the following story the story is actually frightening it's a story which took place in the holy city of where there was an individual who wished to be an idealist and a purist and he left in his he's a wealthy man that the money should be divided exactly it says in the Torah and the girls got nothing and what was the result you think okay when the holy city of they're still going to fulfill what it says I read you the words from the listen carefully since the to give for daughters it's also the law of the land someone who has an who was who was a little preent make sure to give his daughter one minut two she'll otherwise go to secular court and get her equal share and they'll come to I quote like this is the sentence one more sentence I was say it in Hebrew and repeat it translate English and he Beque hatred competition divisiveness in his family the people [Music] said it wasn't worth it to leave over property and to bequ hatred he would been better off dying penniless this is the P me you can look at up this is very serious very serious we have to try to avoid such a terrible consequence so therefore the to my view is the only way to do it there are many other ways to have some um measure of fixing the problem without uh basing your on ra which I told you was controversial there is something which is called a trust I'm not an expert in in in this but I think they even call today trust in the states cuz that's the way you get you eliminate paying money so much in taxes to Uncle Sam trust and the revocable trust and irrevocable trust they're not the same in law they may not even be same in now leave it to the attorneys to figure out how you deal with that it seems to me that a Trust From what I understand it uh although in American law it's a what called a barrier it's a an independent entity independent entity and for tax purposes doesn't belong not to the father not to the son it's tax is a separate entity like a corporation most authorities don't accept corporations as an independent entity it belongs to the people who own the company so here too so who who does it belong to so on a simple level one can say that the trust is as follow the you know about this in other words the item itself belongs to the beneficiaries now but the pus the reality the control of it and the the benefits from it only will accur to those beneficiaries after the person passes away which perhaps may be something which is advisable but again I'm very careful not to get involved in in in tax law perhaps a trust would be a way to avoid uh the problem perhaps we know not we're not exactly sure how a trust should be should be treated it may depend if it's revocable or not uh an irrevocable trust which you have no control whatsoever and all the money is already given to your children and you're at their Mercy is not a good idea the is very very upset about somebody who's at the mercy of his children financially it's a terrible thing and a we happen to be learning right now in our Yesa it's a bad thing to do if it's revocable then it may not pass muster in terms of the problems of of of yusha it's a little complicated can't go into every less detail now there are however it seems to me quite a number of things which bypass yusha completely bypass yusha I'll give an example what if jointly owned property typically in America today if I correct a home which for most people is their most valuable asset is owned jointly by husband and wife that's that's typical there's automatic survivorship I believe not only in American law but even in if the house belongs to to to ruven and Ro and one of them passes away automatically goes to the other spouse that's an understanding that they had when they bought the property in effect was a kind of a they're buying it for both of us but the goes to the surviving spouse so then in theory you wouldn't really require any kind of a will or if the only asset you have is is a house what about a bank account again I believe I'm not so sure that most bank accounts that couples have is once again jointly held and is again laws of survivorship if ruen and RL have a shared back account and one of them passes away the other one is automatically the Survivor and it also bypasses the laws of of yusha in my opinion that everyone agrees with me I think it's it's correct and then of course there are the automatic items which go after a person passes away such as pension accounts insurance accounts which all have to have a written beneficiary typically it's the surviving spouse that could also really bypass the laws of of yusha so a person who has not do have too much money in theory doesn't even need not a secular will and not a it just automatically passes nonetheless I would uh think it's a a good idea when a person get reaches a certain age which I've reached already that a person should fill one of these things out both a secular will told us it's helpful for a variety of reasons as well it should be accompanied by AAR Z SH so I will just tell you what happened to my own family when my uh mother passed away my father came he wants to rewrite his will say I'm a wants to give me an extra share I said ABA I've been around the block I've seen too much I don't want one nickel more than any of the other children in the family and so he agreed with me what AAR in his will he brought four children two boys two girls equal shares and and he also gave a lot of M TOA which of course we I believe it was I think he said gave 10% TOA which we devoted up based on his wishes and there was no fights whatsoever as a matter of fact in my own case my brother and I were the executors an Executor I found out in New York state is automatically entitled to $25,000 off the top I told my brother I don't want one penny I I don't want don't you to think that we're going to read this week Lo has sh AR don't I want to get rich from this my brother needed the money more than me at the time but all right it only cost us 12 and a half thousand because we know so we we we took we we we uh gave up on our rights of that that fee we everything split down the middle Shalom that's the way it should be and when I wrote my own I try to follow as much as I can to the uh extent possible to what uh was done in the previous generation I have over here a a typical will which there are those who maintain and Goldberg with whom I consulted about this he printed about this said you should leave something something should be given based upon the laws of the Torah so in the olden days what it something the the house today the house that's that's that's almost the only only asset so they say ,000 and typically it's forign I over here this is just a draft for someone to use I hereby be all Jewish books and the sum of $1,000 exclusively to my Torah HS according to the form for inheritance prescribed in the code of Jewish law other words this is uh to to be y with something and everyone has their own amounts and their own situations how they want to do that the only purpose in their mind should be shom between the children that's the only gold that we have over here otherwise we have no right to tamper with what the Torah says I told you before but there are more in his dayin in his day is that salad now in our days also said the same thing you have to do whatever it takes to make shom if you do that you're not in violation I'm just giving you what you learned about in abant you learned about that a big problem theer how do you do that the gamorra is very upset but somebody who is in certain cases all these are very important considerations but the more most important consideration is shom and therefore that's the way it is you'll ask me why is it that we're not standing up for the Torah said Ron and every generation have to understand when they're able to be purists and idealists and when they're not if the felt they were not who are we to say differently to try to impose the torah's precise prescription on would likely instead of listen to what the Torah had to say rather to fights and fights are a terrible terrible there enough fights in clest without having fights within families based upon upon yusha so now in terms of the details of how one does this so I have it a a document which is it's just a draft people can t with all they want so what is it saying the person obligates himself effective immediately to my spouse okay if if he or she survives me or if not to my daughters this is just a draft okay in equal shares some of I don't know I once gave a share in a wealthy community I said $100 million they started snickering not enough money yeah Al but let take it100 million okay but not payable until one minute before my death so no one come ask money for me now no on the condition I do not retract this obligation any time prior to my death a person change his mind either someone did something someone passed away in the interim and there were all kinds of situations you may want to change this okay and you you I stipulate they given the option The Heirs carrying my last R and Testament Etc trusts and transfers d d if they abide by the terms of my directives this obligation is null and void but if they contest it object to it whether in a civil court or a bezin the obligation is absolutely valid fine now fine the obligations undertaken by a Kenyan sud and that's interesting why that if you learned a little if you're holding before if you remember there a thing called as and as which is a contingency obligation of of a large amount which is exactly what's happening over here would require to overcome the as a matter of fact there's a beautiful beautiful cont called midor by Renu of um and he contends with this issue by putting in in order to the can overcome these uh these issues the whole discussion what is about this this came up in other contexts as well but that's no time to go into it now here's something which an attorney told me to add I'll read it to you no consideration with received by the obligor in exchange for this obligation what's that all about so a lawyer told him if that's the case if there's no consideration in secular law this is D you have to have consideration that's relevant for tax purposes some going to say I have to give more money and taxes to the government because you have this out and your in your court this is meaningless no consideration of course for you don't need consideration h you know you have to be a little cute that's why this statement was put in over here the above conditions are made in accordance with the laws of the Torah and tamic jurisprudents and the man of the conditions which are imposed on the tribes of God and Ru as AR from Numbers chapter 32 there all kinds of if you if you learn this suus you also come up with in the sugus and these masas H love which comes first it's not theice it's complicated it's called a term also from is incorporation by reference you refer to to to that peric pasas mat so all all the laws are Incorporated this is something which the tour has this the tour has this inim with respect to conditions about marriage it says all you can you don't want to put out the condition just incorporate by reference and it works so it works here as well fine and this is a binding and you you sign it you sign it it's interesting the question is well what makes it valid what makes it valid how do you how how do it how does it become valid what what do you do the answer is as follows if I have it and put it keep it in my drawer it may not be valid you know people keep lot of things in their drawers ideally should be given to the beneficiary but you may not want to do that not even wants to know his kids want should know what what's what he's writing what's in his will who you don't have to give it to your children necessarily give it to any Jewish person for whom we apply the principle of the document is given to Ru and he can acquire on behalf of shim so a person has a son who name shim he doesn't want to get involved gives it to an attorney he's a Jewish whose name is Ru and of course the copy should be kept with the person's will with with there important papers you know one never knows how long is she going to live this I believe is the uh appropriate way to handle this otherwise very thorny situation obviously this is just an overview you're learning you're learning there's so many so many details you know a good son a bad son uh you know you learn about those things if you haven't that D is not up to it yet you'll get to it soon and we try not to take things from a bad son to a good son my recommendation again it's only recommendation once again the money should all go to the spouse now in uh if the wife predeceases so the B so you shouldn't even need this on the other hand it's only if you're learning not you've learned those comparison it could be a bank account that's considered to be Roy that's don't really it's just money that the Bank owes you it was a whole din Torah about this years ago so it's it's worthwhile having that the the will and the stars in both directions uh again some lawyer came to me once and said it's a very bad idea why because what'll happen the man leaves all of this assets to his wife nothing to the children and that's a good idea because says it's not good for the Ala should be depended upon her children the other way around the children should depend upon the AL they'll give her the proper respect K requir he was worried what will happen if she will then remarry and then by all the money go to the second husband and leave the children with nothing ah so we have this carat where the the um it it is understood between the parties that upon the P of the first of the spouses that the second spouse will then know have their will which is already crafted in life of both of them the money should go to the children you can never know nothing is five con this piece is a very convoluted kind of obligation in case one child will go along or one child will not go along it's too complicated for me I try in one page and that's why we have uh this type of uh s simple simple uh kind of a document literally fits on one page maybe two sides of a page if you have all the other things involved and it's pretty fairly easily understood I recommend it very strongly I recommend the document in general I recommend the division of property the implies as proper to avoid and you know when I speak about this I quote the famous P we say all the time so we typically translate it should be children your grandchildren and shom on CL says no it means shom on your own family that's what it means if you have their grandchildren there's no there's no problem so here too a person is blessed with with certain amount of money uh he wants to make sure that the shom and the family the greatest wish of parents that the children should get along that's the most fervent wish of all of all parents the worst thing in the world is that children are not getting along with each other so you have to be have a little foresight and do what I'm we're saying now in order to make sure that this peace we hopefully that every parent Witnesses in his old lifetime can continue even Beyond that's my presentation if there questions I'm happy to take them so just in Closing one last one last question as a r so I've listened to this presentation my parents have taken care of this I'm sure there are many people listening whose parents have not taken care of this how would the r suggest broaching this idea and topic to the parents I'm sure it's based on presenting the shom aspect but anything specifically how parents how children with and proper present this to their parents that's a general question not limited to what we're discussing here today when a parents get a little bit older so we hope that they're wise enough to take care of their Affairs generally in an appropriate fashion but sometimes children you know I think that the first prerequisite for any such conversation should be unanimity among the children would not be good for ruven to go to the parents and say B and then shim will say the other way around and then already causing a fight for no reason and prematurely but if the children agree that perhaps the parents are not doing what they're supposed to be doing take care of themselves or or or they're thereafter someone should speak to them on behalf of all the children in a nice way I'm not limiting myself to the to the sometimes there's a problem you know sometimes parents when they get older one of their responsibilities should be be to purchase a grave Cara I believe is is a person gets a little older that's something which you don't want to leave it to your children in in a sudden situation there a scr and here and there what are we going to do that's that's not you wouldn't want that in some SP it's written the person turns 50 that's when they should purchase a Kevin people die before 52 but we hope everyone leaves at least that long today's world that's what I did I felt my wife were turning 50 and should be a school of so far it's working we hope to work for many more years but if the parents have nothing and the child is you know knows about it ABA IMA TTI momy daddy mommy you know something to think about it should be in America should be in Australia or the people have different Wishes the same is true when it comes to um healthc care proxies another topic which I think is important I believe that at some point in time I already signed one it's it's it's a good idea because otherwise a person is not 100% sound mind and what are they G to do what did what did daddy want what did Mommy want she said this she said this I heard this I heard that if it's in writing with the signature it's very very helpful and of course the same thing I believe is true with respect to our topic which is which is uh a will many many people pass away with no will none it's a it's a problem from the perspective of tax law the government could take many more dollars if a person dies in testate and it could also lead in my opinion to a worse result which is a if Uncle Sam takes the money no but if if the kids are fighting about the money that's worse so I believe that a person should approach a parent in this fashion now it could be parent to a very idealist and purist and say what do you mean my dear son the Torah the Torah says I'm learning what are you telling me we know exactly what it says pull out the G page M I think it's an English too G and just tell over the story and say that he was a very respected Jerusalem Rabbi from the old school the old yesu and he felt it was true then it's certainly true now and I would I would recommend that every child recommend to the parents what I just said that the the the the money should go to the surviving spouse and there should be an understanding and she be written in if possible that when the second spouse passes on that the money will go to the children in equal shares not withstanding a and boys girls that I believe is the way to ensure that the peace will be maintained even not only until May but even Beyond May sadly if there's nowhere like that people something jocking position even before the May of Y I've seen that too which is in some ways even worse but that's the way I would approach it but but it shouldn't be with any uh dis difference of opinion within the children themselves that could be lead to a unfortunate conclusion of a fight even in the parents lifetime I believe that most parents today in our society are fairly sophisticated and will agree thank youate it all the best CTO bye-bye