Bava Kama Throughout The Ages | Rabbi Dr. Eliezer Brodt

[Music] welcome back Rabbi Dr alzar BR we are finishing K sash we on the cusp of beginning a new seder sikin with a brand new for those who've studied in Yeshiva this is one of the classic Yesa for those who have not studied in Yesa it's a m which is fascinating every da from one da to the next is an exciting and invigorating learning so Rabbi Dr BR is here with us once again to do as usual before we start he takes us through the history of some of the and usually focuses on one or two of the classic volumes that were written on the m and usually he has a couple that people may not know about out and focuses on the authors we' like to thank our sponsor Rabbi Dr Michael BR who is dedicating this episode in memory of his father Rabbi Dr Barry Kim Dove BR May the learning and anything we learn from Rabbi Dr BR about this m being El for his so I'm here in America Rabbi Dr BR is Ines we hope he is doing okay and we continue to hope and pray that everybody should be safe around the world and without without any further introduction Rabbi Dr BR take it away okay so we're learning we're about to start is about to begin Bama which is in a new s sikin so before one for sikin and then one or two some broader ideas for and then we'll get through the as follow it's known that when you start learning gamar with children a lot of times they start learning it with either some with some with per some withus so the question is how far back and what's the reason behind it so I heard many times and now one could even see it um my my R rabish David in his book which I spoke a little bit about the warmth and Radiance of says that his Rabbi R salic said that the reason why kids learn Aus or Paran these type of things is because there's a famous gamar it's gar Babas basically there's a unique strength which is um which has developed intellectual and intu intuitive skills in learning these in especially if you learn let's say the all these types of different things um M so the reason is to open up the minds and that's why we start already young kids start letting them learn nikin um um first interestingly enough um Raa had a different thing he said is it's the reason is to sensit sensitize a young child to respect and learn to be extremely careful regarding others people's property and person and this is a very interesting um reason of Raa but both and Raa are explaining the Min which is found by many that they learn gar they start inin this is obviously a conversation that needs to be had at much greater length just to mention rhenen who was one of the great gum of the p in in America before the war already and after the war a contemporary of Raa very close with Raa he held actually and he writes this in a few different places in publish in his daa to start not with um nikin he was aware of what was done in Europe he says in Europe that was one thing now it's more important things that are more in Europe they didn't need it as much because they were able to rely on what the they got at home and this a conversation just throwing out that needs to be had much greater length what actually was done throughout the ages but I'm just throwing this out there just these two Yas about it now one other specifically focused on something we mentioned a little bit about we had an episode discussing some people when we were learning so we had a she and a half devoted to some people don't learn they they want to learn it's uh things talking about death AAS all these things and so they would they stay away they stay away from learning this so we try to trace throughout the generations if people did learn it or didn't learn it and we one of the places we saw um was he would have they would they would fast and and there was other a bunch of other sources about it so interestingly enough I mentioned at the time and the one could find in a article from who is a tremendous expert on where basically it sounds like when he gave Shear one year one basically towards the beginning of someone died there was some death and he stopped giving she after and interestingly enough they discovered a manuscript of materials ofer with a whole a Shear of some sort and even some cabalistic sentences before a notebook of his and in there he talks about that should help him from all different things so sha over here explains this um and this is the um which I dealt with a little bit in that cheer in these type of what I call not for us reg so it got him nervous and it seems he stopped giving Shear um at that time but um and there's other a lot of interesting things about this but but in general even wither what we're going to see today is it was learned throughout the ages it was a even if one doesn't start right away it's extremely important M fundamental sources for much of so number one is when you're learning this is to know very well and learn the very well because this helps a lot it's not only about just seeing theim everything is based on theim a l a large percentage is based on the even a lot of times ran could help who knows what it could help you while learning this is one piece of information and more recent years there's a I'm pointing this out there a from and others a set called M and on the they have a lot of information starting the spring board starts off with the and but goes to the m which we'll start with right now the so I always mention there's something called family here it wasn't published as a book it's only in digital form called many don't like it but I just point out the different um tools out there one does not have to use these tools in play a key role which is but also more recent discovery focusing faster to getting to the gamar we have the gamar we always mention the in the gamar so this the from abama and there was in the in the 1950s there was some type of project with Y and other to publish some type of gar they successfully published which focused a little bit on the GE and aat oriented based on rash um useful tool um but then interestingly enough with manuscripts and this goes to the sh that I gave with kki from B from the Publishing House the shapi Frank Ram came out the Fran on so the part will discuss soon but in the back half of the volume is fascinating is based on manuscripts they got a hold of numerous different manuscripts of the m and they have all different sh and they have from the great it's Andi so here you see even the ultra world of volume coming out of them with okay fasing to see and the and the project behind it going further Oni Bak has a ton of materal just to mention way back leev who one of the fathers in in talmud but he was Aid Ty who it's supposedly said on him he sat and learned with um with TS and film the whole day so even though he was an academic but yes he was uh sh has a whole article all about his greatness he's accepted by everyone kosher um anyway so he put out AI with perim already and later on the introduction to this Yi which is very helpful to read was published from German it was translated into Hebrew and the TU and then a few years back other manuscripts were published with a pish from shman and rebel Professor rosental okay now moving Just One Last you over here is Thea so for me Thea ofama has a special thing because we have a perish from none other than the m a parish of his on on the and yes okay those are just some of the basic tools out there we just like to mention them very very briefly now is a book that's come out very recently in the past few months from shom which has a lot of material in more academic style about the first six now just one more this is a kosher piece of material but from a great um and that is from the the one of the early sugas complicated sugas in bakama is the Su of M extremely Lum complex Su samas actually skip it because it's so complex so the 3D basically published a 200 200 Page saer in the late 1930s called he deals with it's fascinating what he does in all different things in the saer was later on published in the C and more recently published a fancy volume of all the 3's materials called parut and they also they publish this thing so one wants to have some very interesting material in the beginning of bakama 200 pages and get a very interesting Insight in mahab using the standard but also many other of the sources I just mentioned and whatever you want okay now we go back to our normal regular stuff which is as follows we always talk about the so B still has which we spoke a lot about in different episodes but it's supposedly going to be updated um by Professor Brody in in the near future and also over here the especially has an article about it in his okay now we start going to the earlier so open up we already spoke about of the discoveries was one of the things that was published in ch VNA but it's only up to around damad Z I think something like that so this Bine who had just quoted he discovered more materials of since those years this is in the 1940s until today constantly new discoveries of much more material has been published as recent from or ma know they they have a beautiful Edition published by a very good friend y y du fell from B published a beautiful Edition with tons of footnotes with tons of new materials of incorporating everything up till now and New pieces that he discovered even after he published the volume by vaksha he found even more material which could be found in so we have tons of material very enlightening information one one learns okay now we have Rashi so we always discuss Rashi then about Rashi so there has been a little work about Rashi on specifically focusing on all the different manuscripts on Paro was a masters of some sort in in Hebrew University um but back to the Franco gamara they had few different manuscripts of Rashi and they mention in their in the back few hundred Pages um in the back section very relating to the various manuscripts of Rashi also my friend from Lakewood has a few has a nice article that was published in yurin which a PDF if you request for the PDF I could send it to you no problem where he deals with rash as a and and he specifically deals with issues that come up in Rashi babama okay so this is the the first star of we go further on there's a Reon we didn't that he has published on other that we have materials of his published on other Z was written around 1190 it's coined the term when describing this is It's a early a materials from including including R and so it's been published a few times I think even as late as 2010 okay fine so this is the early Rim now um are there a little later we have the Raja and the Raja basically will be will be considered the main reion that the in the Yesa world that that's used from when it was published all the way in the beginning and seems they people had access to this throughout the generations for the most part but is that any other materials of so first there's a that's been published on various including Bama a whole this has been published only in recent years now what's a as far as so we'll just mention very briefly a few of them number one is the rivid the rivid we know the rivid we know the rivid is one of the superar as they call it um professor salv in his various writings has tons of Articles devoted to and his his brother isor tski Rabbi tski um the tbba has lots of material about the rivid and the of the r but the point is a lot of times but the r right on it turns out the r did but a lot of it did not survive but in the late 30s Discovery was made by yid I'm going to call him Atlas schol Atlas SCH Atlas sorry and um actually I forgot if it's SCH or scha so we'll just call him Atlas and you'll see why in a minute that I'm going to call him Atlas just to be y a certain thing in in a minute basically is this person was a l person learned by rabit paner was very close friend of the and in the 1940s in the early late 30s he was working on this Riv from manuscript and he publishes the work with tons of ARs and he has a beautiful as from his good friend this 3 we just mentioned earlier and um tons ofus etc etc now the problem is that this person eventually joins um he comes to America and he becomes a professor in the reform movement um I believe he was not shabis um at some point so the question always is is one able to use such aor on one hand it was published it sounds like when he published it um um I don't know exactly but it sounds like he was a more firmer speak or at least the gave so some people say no you can't use it I was told that in Lakewood there is a copy of the rivid and someone went ahead a can and crossed out in Black Ink all the harus and there's tons of harus on the page of the safer throughout all safer and today there's even a from version where they just print the top and they remove all the harus but the thing is like this the 3 wrote tons of harus on the safer turns out was M close friends with him he knew him personally and he kept up with him even when he was a reformed Jew and they have beautiful letters it could be they weren't supposed to be published but Mark Shapiro published them I still remember late one night when I discovered them um in a Torah M journal in SCH I couldn't put it down I sat there mesmerized from reading these letters and afterwards it caused the whole debate if they should have been published they should have been published but anyway point is what about using this this person's safer so interestingly enough from manasha klin in his Mish says not to use it this gets into a very complex question which is a topic I hope to devote at least one whole she maybe more about using sources from problematic people what's the attitude throughout the ages do we say and what's the parameters of such a thing but anyway over here specifically um this rivid which on Hebrew books one could see with the harus and this harus of and others okay so that's an interesting de but the has one other point with this is as follows the says he has a whole article where he says um that there importance of using new manuscript of why so the answer is like this theid there are pieces of the which we're going to talk about shortly so what do you what's the big deal he found the manuscript to derive it so he shows and he gives a whole example in a whole complex suya that if one just relied on the pieces in the he wouldn't understand what the r is talking about and he shows that he one was learning to was giving sheare about it and he's trying to figure out the riv and he figures out it must be something's going on the was not did not quote it properly everything and he says he to every word of the rivid when the manuscript came out and his good friend Atlas sends it to him he checks this one of the first things he checks up and he sees Tak was and it worked out and that's what it said in the real manuscript so this is a known thing that even though there we're gonna just throw it out there right now has the which is an incredible work of pieces of it's it's published in 1762 and that's how a lot of people knew was only had and has his way before he's a re of um putting him into late 1500s but the point is is's a benefit if one could get the whole region okaya just to mention very fast some thei it's 1950s the first time it comes out but that's it we don't have real ran except we must mention the because this most of these relate to the end of babama this is also only published in 1523 and not till 1928 again in the project of the with which we dealt with much more at length episodes now there seems to be another this can be found in a recent fromit called okay another major Discovery 1969 Professor sh Freeman publishes raish another important what about parot and then the What's called the BL in Thea world I never really devoted a full um about it just to mention over here he has a volume it's called it's an extremely important work tons of material from it's available on Hebrew books you don't have to go buy it so it's excellent material en lightening one for Li of the um okay moving on to the we already spoke so interestingly enough there's another which is called the from a contemporary of the his name is author of If you look on the side of you see turns out he also wrote a work on be but he wrote a massive work on bakama that only came out in the Years 2008 by hav chalom this is a contemporary of razi AAL of the and the it this the safer is very very intense IUN what's known as the Canton from ranton Bas Mish and he has lots of materials it seems he used the same Library according to Spiegel in an article he wrote about as anyway very important work published by Shalom only a few years back okay one other early is yamam from the mar we've spoken also a little bit about him in previous episodes but his work on babama is published um something like 30 years after he dies and laa one learn sh we'll see how often it's quoted and even the mag quotes it it's and is on he manages to quar over 23 times tremendous impact it had on these two great okay that's the first generation of what about the Next Generation so we know we have our Mar who um it's published in 1611 the maram that's published in the 16 19621 then we get to one of my favorite all time also which is the 1624 he also similar to Mar which we have theas and the same thing over there it's on when he's talking about when he's referring to I hope eventually to give a whole sheer at least one sheer all about the significance of the it's on okay interestingly enough a younger contemporary is the so we recent discovery located on about nine that's been published by few years back so so basically we're doing fine but these some of these things are new discoveries okay then there's a which pretty much is unknown called Bas Yehuda he was the azdan and kales in the times of the it seems to be one of the one of the main rabam in that period of time in kales and he dies in 1698 in 1687 a few years after mag dies he publishes the safer basuda why don't we hear about the saer it has extremely from and he's done a lot in and he has also so has a theory he brings down a old that he was sort of the when the M asked him for he gave but he's like why why not in like in learning like my saer no one's GNA hear of your safer and Tak no one ended up hearing of his saer where the mag became the P I don't know so much um if this story is true because if you look at thek that we do have it seems to be a pretty nice um and a lot of times Farm don't make it for different reasons I don't know that that was the reason and it also says in the article that he's a town Mar he's definitely not a tal Mar because he's born he's like a few years old when the mar dies okay anyway another safer interestingly enough at this period of time little little um is the rebba rebes and I call him the Reb reash because that's how we always know of him but he's definitely not a rebba he's definitely predates anyway so in the sa told this Aon published in 1692 two from a tal of his there's tons of material on the first few of babak interestingly enough he brings a lot of what's the significance in episode one of the earliest episodes we spoke about and we spoke a little bit about the mar because one of the farki wrote as as a youngster was about of the mar so I quoted a story that the brings down sort of in the in the mar but here I found that he he definitely deals with Mar and the a few times in this far okay next another the who dies in 1774 publishes a in 1729 on the also available on Hebrew Books the great one of the classic is published in 1756 the same year he dies recent years there's a work called from the who was active in 1767 but it's only published in 2019 okay y this is a work fromstein the brother of the yeshu Yakov it's published in 1827 after he a few years after he dies but who publishes it this is one of the earliest Works published by the sh and his brother his the the his great which we devoted episode way back in the M mat controversy where they ended up finding themselves on the opposite sides but beforehand they wrote a bunch of together such as the m and this was also one one of the earliest works that they wrote about they published their it's their uncle and they published his work from manuscript with and the back has numerous correspondences that they had with the great of the generation such as this was published until 1960 over six times so it's a very popular safer okay fast forward to the yes um to one of the most famous Farm in the Yesa world is theas I had a conversation a few times with people if it's still as popular today as it was way back I don't know I for some reason think that it isn't but I was told that I'm wrong but a person I hope to devote a whole episode to him anyway when I was young my father always used to tell me that when he learned he felt he he didn't he was learning at a time that he didn't have a MAG he had a MAG the that he had that was equal to having a great cheer it's published in 1864 a whole article about him has been published in yes volume 33 um he has incredible drous two volumes that have been published by m of cook and a lot of information not a lot but some nice information could be learned about the going further um one other of this a little earlier than is theik from but this is only published in the in our generation in 1999 okay now what is the the in the world of so this is already from going further to the and then comes along were that even though they're written the starting point to them is definitely not the aspect but this is where the intense happens and these became the classics in the Yesa World these are the Yesa Bibles and a proper episode needs to be to explain the significance of all these far and and the stories behind them okay fast forward 1879 just to mention just some type of unique safer over here publishes a it's cabala he comes already in 1869 he's a kater but a very interesting type of person he was anti the red wrote against him all different types of things a lot to talk about him but um he learned der he all different types of interesting Shas and a bunch of different interesting just I felt to mention it because of the uniqueness about this aspect of cabala okay next is um from so on the historical aspects one could find in the recent book onka from tashin about him but ra epin great that he was so first he was the rabbi of the and the an incredible H that he gave on him published in Le frim he talks about his tremendous Eun that he had and the the it was unique it was it was originality in his that he had and he talks about this in his brief hpit that he gave he wasn't feeling well so he couldn't give a whole thing he said when this far of has become published more people will be able to learn from himan has a beautiful up about his method in and one looks in fascinating you see about the of learning with he emphasizes this in and he also talks about learning which I mentioned is one of the most important things but then he asks so to speak on the times that he argues with in the because or even when he was learning giving she because it was not to be anything against them okay this is just a interesting idea another interesting that came came at in recent years which made a Thea World it caus not sorry the wrong word cause a sort of like ha was they found the notebooks of Bak so first the came out from one person of Jak as they say there's the of ruenitz who's ruenitz so this is um this tremendous yid died without children about 1950 he was born in the same city and he knew raron Cutler well it seems and he was seemed to be some type of Genius eventually he becomes rash and Anor for a few years by Rael and eventually he ends up in America and he sat and learned and the way he would support himself was he tutored people he never got married for some reason and but his brother had kids and what he so he he and basically he would sit in the 42nd Street Library in Manhattan and he learned philosophy and he wrote three books in philosophy in Yiddish the question obviously is who in those years was reading philosophy especially in Yiddish but it seemed seems that these books in yish were it was funded in recent years to be translated by a great philosopher mathematician America in Isel Professor steer who died recently and he did a phenomenal job translating these three books who pfer a talmud of of this oras I mentioned that he was funded um he used to raise money by tutoring children so one of the children ended up paying for it was a wealthy person they paid for the funding the translation of this material and seems according to philosophers today it's amazing even for person who never went to school never went he wasn't academic so to speak in philosophy he just sat and learned in the 42nd Street Library but this was not his main thing he was a yid as I said he was rash ant for a few years and he ends up he wrote a lot on CH his on bamo was published over 200 Pages after he dies and has ASAS you'll see side by side today it doesn't mean as much but maybe some people would say it does mean a lot Rob iron Cutler and ralek side by side as and they both knew him well and they say and they PR praise him very well as I said raron Cutler he learned by um raron Cutler comes from the same Hometown as this person so I'm just mentioning another idea of an interesting type of safer it's available on Hebrew Books Okay and just to conclude with like everything every has tons and tons of recent material if you search on Hebrew books all these hundreds have been published just to mention called which has tons of rashash material and also a volume called tyus rash so these are just a small amount of the materials about this that is an incredible that is about to begin and these are some of the materials available out there to use and learn while you're learning it okay fascinating especially about this last year you said there areas from both of those on these philosophy books no no no no R iron is I don't think is gonna give on his he writes a very nice says he knew him and everything and side by side it's it says one has come from sorry fromon and and salv amazing excellent okay we appreciate that let's be in touch for some other fascinating episodes coming up in the near future thank you best