#76: Behind the Bima - Nissim Black

From Boca Raton, Florida, Rabbis Ephraim Goldberg, Philip Moskowitz, and Josh Brody are taking you behind the Bima. The BRS Rabbis schmooze about contemporary issues and talk to special guests who give a behind-the-scenes look at how they got to where they are and what keeps them going. Welcome to Behind the Bima. Good evening. What's the name on 9:00 p.m. Rabbi Ephraim Goldberg joined by my colleagues and dear friends, Rabbi Philip Moskowitz and Rabbi Josh Brody, and we're here to take you behind the Bima. We are here to take you behind the Bima. We begin as we always do with gratitude. A big thank you to our generous sponsor for tonight, Ahavat Agency dedicated to the core Jewish value of Hesed, Tzedakah, Tikun Olam. Ahavat is a repeat sponsor. Our dear friends at Ahavat, thank you so much for all that you do, bringing light to the world, transforming the world. You could download the 2022 A Kindness a Day calendar. We'll post the uh link. For more resources, go to the website ahavat.org, a r e y v u t.org, a r e y v u t.org. That's as close as I get to rapping. Uh ahavat.org. Go ahead. Ahavat's really doing incredible things, very very special things. Thank you for your generosity. Thank you for your sponsorship. A lot of people A lot of people don't know that you could sponsor again. Just cuz you sponsored once doesn't mean it's like a one-and-done. That's correct. We will try to squeeze you in if you would like to sponsor. Be in touch with us and we'll let you know which week is available and we'd love to have your support, your sponsorship. Uh not one penny goes to any of us or our guests or any costs of running Behind the Bima. It all helps support the Torah that comes from our community. Um and so we thank you very much for that. Very exciting night tonight. We have on a Jewish music superstar, really a superstar person, amazing life story, amazingly inspiring person, and uh very very excited to be able to welcome him on. But, before that, gentlemen, how are you? I am fantastic. Although, I I will say I would have liked a better outcome after our guest last week. So would I. I received texts directly, and even one person I don't know tweeted blaming us for the Max's loss last week. 50 games in a row, they came on Behind the Bima, and people are trying to coin the Behind the Bima curse, blaming us for the Max's loss. But, here's my response to that. Naftali Bennett came on as a candidate. He won prime minister. Right. Bob Kraft came on, and then Tom Brady won the Super Bowl for another team. But, then Tom Brady won the Super Bowl. Ben Shapiro launched his career after Behind the Bima. So, we clearly have a winning record. It obviously had nothing to do with us. Next thing, you're going to blame us for Betty White instead of People magazine. That we did not create an Ayin Hara. We are all for the Max's, but listen, Jews make it to the 50th level, that's the top. Noon 50. That's it for the Jews. So, they're back, they're going to start a new winning streak, and that's the lesson for a Jew as well. You fall down, you get back up, new winning streak. But, you know what? This is going to be cheesy, but I mean it. They may have lost the game, but they won the hearts and the minds of people all across this country. And if you followed the tweets that came from the other team and their coaches, of just how classy and menschlich, you talk about last week we had this debate, what's a Kiddush Hashem, what's Jewish pride. When you see the tweets, when you see the emails that came from the coaches and the players on the other team, not how the Max's behaved before the big game, but how they behaved after the big loss, and I don't think anyone could argue that it's not a Kiddush Hashem. Amazing, very inspiring, and uh disappointing, but uh as you said, you fall down, you get back up. That's it. What else is going on, gentlemen? Well, there's a lot of talk after the episode also about JEC and that MTA game, and there have been people that have been calling for a rematch right now. They want to say who would really have won? Who was on their way to the garden? Jays Brody and his one friend from high school. I got a call from Rabbi Parnes. talking about it are people who went to JEC. Rabbi Parnes? Rabbi Parnes, he was in the Yeshiva of North Jersey, one of the rabbeim in the honors program. I didn't speak to him much in high school, but I got a call from him. Talking about that game. We did not mention a name that we should have and that is our mutual good friend Chaim Haas. Big JEC proud graduate who might have blamed us for the Max loss, but at least have pride in the JEC basketball team. And I wanted to give a uh take a personal point of pride, shout out to my good friend Menashe Shapiro who was named today Big appointment. of staff of the city of of the mayor of New York City. It's a big appointment. Menashe deserves it. He's a powerhouse. He's a good friend, good friend to our community, was just down here visiting his sister who lives here. One of our great sponsors and supporters, but we can't mention because she didn't sponsor tonight. But Menashe, mazel tov and a great appointment. We're very excited for you. What else is going on that we should be discussing or talking about? That will make for some great schmooze when Menashe comes down. He's always up for a great schmooze, but something tells me now that he has the insider track in New York City, that will make for even better schmooze. No question about it. He has the inside look at what is going on. We have a big event coming up next week, a night celebrating Israel, standing up for Israel. We've got Ambassador David Friedman keynote speaker. We have introductory remarks by Governor Ron DeSantis and by Senator Rick Scott. We have remarks from Rabbi Yitzchak Adlerstein of the Wiesenthal Center, a co-sponsor of the event. Uh we're doing it together with the Latino Coalition for Israel who are going to bring out a big crowd, uh evangelical non-Jews who care about love and support Israel. We can be grateful for their help and support. We got Ben Shapiro, media personality, who's going to talk about uh what it means to stand up and support Israel and the risks involved. So, we got a lot going on. Rabbi Brody, I heard about somebody who's going be in town, we may try to get him too, and we may be giving him like a Defender of Israel award. Let's just say somebody who used to be involved in music went to Israel, lost a lot of followers, and is related to a community leader in our community. I understand that he's going to be in Boca. How do you not know who I'm talking about? No idea. Is it Nesanel What? No, it's not Nesanel Block. Has the same last name as a leader of our community. Is that heavy metal musician with the beard? Okay, now I got you. So, rumor has it will be in town. Maybe we'll try to get him to come to the event as well. He has stood up for Israel at great personal expense, and that deserves our appreciation for that. So, big event next week, super excited. You know, not everyone is as excited. Some people have some question marks about um what justifies working for Israel, but we've consulted our rabbaim, our poskim, we have no hesitation or pause to be able to uh welcome with appreciation non-Jewish support for Israel. And I wrote an article, we don't have to rehash it right now, that describes how much Israel uh increasingly needs evangelical support, and evangelicals, younger evangelicals, are increasingly less supportive. So, if we don't reach out and embrace them, um there's a lot that would not have happened over the last several years, and there's a lot that won't happen going forward that we take for granted. Financial support, diplomatic support, if we don't have that support, no religion, we're not talking religion, we're not talking Bible study, we're not talking what we disagree, importantly disagree about. What we agree on is standing up for Israel, fighting anti-Semitism. We're going to do that as a greater community on Tuesday night. We're expecting a large crowd, and we're we're really excited to stand up with Israel. I know that Israel deeply appreciates it, and it's a Let let's take our listeners behind the bima though. Rabbi, you you yourself mentioned the controversy, some controversy surrounding our event on Tuesday night that you had to an email out to the community. Walk our listeners behind the scene as a leader of such a very prominent community, very actively pro-Israel. And obviously with that, as as many of our members gleaned this week, comes a little bit of of controversy and pushback. What goes on as a leader of the community to come to the conclusion that you came to? You said we referenced our post-game and that you spoken to a lot of people. Walk our listeners through what that process looks like. Who are the types of people that you're consulting? What are the calculations that you're making? And where do you come to the point where you say, I am convinced that this is the right thing to do. I've spoken to the right people. And even though there're going to be the naysayers, we're still going to go ahead with it anyways because we believe it's the right thing. Um I had a root canal today, which I'm not looking for sympathy. It was fine. A great doctor, by the way. Highly recommend Dr. Shapiro. He just called me right before we started to see how I'm feeling. I said, go be with your family. I feel fine. Why am I telling you that? Just to let you know that the root canal might have been the most relaxing part of the day today. So that tells you that tells you about the day. I think I actually fell asleep for a moment in the middle of the root canal, which was Mr. Thirsty was hard at work and I closed my eyes. So that Novocaine is good stuff. Um You know, I we want to focus only a positive light on this event and and not contribute to a controversy where there isn't one. There's just one agitator. But I do appreciate you bringing it up, Rabbi Moscowitz, because I think there's a bigger point that's worth making and talking about. You talked about going behind the bema with it. Um I think Rabbi Brody was with me. I don't know if you were there. We once had a guest and we went out for lunch on Friday, guest speaker, scholar in residence. Person who pushes the envelope himself, is controversial. Um and in fact, I don't I don't think that we I don't think we'd have him again. And I asked him at that lunch, I said, tell me, who do you call when you want to know where those boundaries are if you've pushed the envelope too far? Who's your rebbe? Who do you talk to? How do you know that you're you're inside the ropes that you're doing the right thing? So he looked and he said, "Huh." I guess I don't really call anybody. I guess if I had to think of somebody I'd say it's my wife. Now, my wife is an enormous resource. She is a partner. She's a source of tremendous wisdom. Um sometimes the pushback is their connect though. Sometimes they help me by being opposite. Sometimes uh by being opposite they help me. Um but I I I tried throughout my rabbinate our rabbinate together cuz we do this as a team to stay true to our obey him. So that if somebody challenges us and says, "Look, I think you crossed the line. I think you're out of bounds on this one. You think you're being creative. You think you're being cute. You think you're trying to attract attention. I think you're pushing the envelope too far." So it's critically important to have obey him and to call and say beforehand, "Whatever they tell me to do, I'm going to do." If we have to cancel, if we have to rescind an invitation, we have to change a policy, if we have to do something that's going to be incredibly unpopular, we're ready to do it. Because it's not about what's convenient or expedient or comfortable or popularity contest. It's about what's right and what's true to our tradition. So for something like this, it's it's a big question and it needs a big person. A big person. So I spoke to Shachter. One of Rabbi Shachter Shachter is one of my obey him our obey him I would say for our community. He knows our community. He's his finger on the pulse of our community. And I called him. We've spoken about this issue before and there was no issue whatsoever. Uh he was perfectly comfortable, understood, and was supportive of it. I've called other obey him. Not everybody is as comfortable with their name being used which is its own conversation and in some ways a sad commentary not so much on them but on their feeling, "Why do I want to be public? And then the next video will be about me. The next postcard about me. I want to keep my head down, teach Torah, learn Torah, do my thing." We can debate right or wrong but you got to respect their uh request. Um but let's put it this way. I spoke to enough people that I feel tremendously comfortable and confident. Um I'll tell you also Rabbi Adlerstein is a real Ben Torah Rabbi Adlerstein uh across currents Rabbi Adlerstein at the Wiesenthal Center people really admire including me respect Rabbi Adlerstein as a religious leader as a Torah personality. Not only is he comfortable with this he's a co-sponsor he's speaking at it he believes this is critically important for US Israel relationship even for Jewish Christian relationships which is not the point of this event but something he has an eye on in his work. So you know it's really important it's really really important and there are moments of discomfort when a postcard is put in every mailbox or people make countless videos or even describe that you're deserving of the death penalty and call for your death um which I would wish was hypothetical. So you got to just stay true as long as as long as you can live with yourself as long as you can sleep at night believing that Hashem is proud of you that your family's proud of you and and how do you know if Hashem will be proud of you cuz you have rabbaim who you talk to I think you feel good about it. So that's I'm I'm blessed to have good haverim good friends you the two of you and the rest of our amazing staff that these decisions are made together and collectively and we live it collectively and the consequences collectively although I notice neither of you are willing to stand too close to me lately. I don't know what you are you are afraid of. Just joking. Um So um yeah This clip is going to be on another video somewhere in a few hours so just trying to smile into the camera. Understood. Let it be. I'll tell you the truth is you know our our event took off the registration today blew up closed down we had to expand and address it on technology because that uh hater who who really said it's a statement about him not anyone else um is actually PRing the event um more than we could ever do. So he's the one spending the money and we're the one getting the benefit. You've got some very very important people that have already registered. I mean there's a lot of excitement for this event people want to be there. There's a A of excitement a lot of security a lot of excitement. And listen, it's not worth doing because we're competitive and we're not going to back down. We're doing it because we believe it's good for Israel. You've got diplomats who will be there. Um the Latina Coalition for Israel, our partner for this event, is in the middle of conversations lobbying the president of Guatemala, other South American countries to move their embassy to Jerusalem. And this very group was very instrumental in the past administration's decision to move the embassy to Jerusalem and the Abraham Accords. If we care about this we're keeping our eye on the ball. That's the bottom line. There's a lot of noise. You got to shut out the noise. You got to wear noise canceling headphones as a leader. You got to shut out the noise. You remember when we had Ritchie Torres Congressman Ritchie Torres was going to be actually guest in our shul as well. We had him on behind the Bima. Remember what he said? He was taking a beating for supporting Israel. Yeah. I'll never forget what he said. He said leadership is is about not needing to be liked. You need to be liked, don't go into leadership. You got to stand up for the truth. So, that's a little behind the Bima of it. You're right, it'll probably be another clip, but guess what? That'll just get more people to come to the event, so feel free. Feel free to stream it. But we've got a big guest on tonight. How many songs can you name of Nissim Black, Rabbi Brody? That's great. You know, I happen to be a big fan. He's got so many songs and I can tell you my kids are listening to his music. Everyone's listening to his music. We're so excited to have him on tonight. We are very excited. Rabbi Rabbi Moskowitz, do you connect with his music? Uh it's definitely a different genre for me. You know, it's funny I was playing No, I'm being serious. You know, I was playing some of his music today in the house and my kids didn't realize the songs that were his. In other words, there's a lot of his music that plays in our loop and that's constantly in our house that my kids never attributed to him. So, when they heard them and I connected the dots they said, "Holy cow, this is a great guest." So, it's definitely prevalent in our house. And again, it's different than like you know, we're going to talk about that a little bit. Uh, there you got the you got the Come on. It's different than the Shwekey concert we were at the other day. I'm excited for the Motherland Bounce. Rabbi Brody, the problem is that that's the clip that he's going to use right now. I got to go back and edit that out. Because if there's anything in my life I want to never go viral, it's that right there. That's going to become What do they call that? That's going to be a meme. That's going to be a meme. I got to edit that out. I I wish this were on delay. We got to talk to our tech people. We are live coming to you right now. Anyway, without any further ado, Nesan Black, I would give you his bio, I'd tell you how he grew up in Seattle, his parents, hip-hop artist, his mother died of a drug overdose he was 19 years old, hip-hop star, drug dealer, was shot at, and turned his life around. He'll walk us through his journey through Islam, Christianity, ultimately a Breslover Jew today, still producing incredible incredible music. We'll let him tell his own story without any further ado, what a pleasure to be able to welcome on our special guest. We are joined by music sensation and superstar, much more important, superstar sensational human being and inspiration, the one and only the great Nesan Black. Nesan, thank you so much for being with us and allowing us to go behind the bema with you. Thank you so much, Rabbi Goldberg. Appreciate it. Thank you. And also, Rabbi Moskowitz. We are We're excited to be together virtually, but we're even more excited to be together in person soon. Your Bright Lights Tour will be making a stop finally in Florida and in Boca Raton. We'll be able to draw from that energy and be lifted by that music. So, we're excited. Tell us, uh, why'd it take so long? You're finally coming to Florida. I don't know what's going on. I don't know who uh who who booked everything, but uh it's been taking way too long. Uh, as I mentioned to you before, I just the excitement to come to the last normal place on planet Earth has been It's been something It's been a long long long road I've had to to be able to be in Florida. So, I'm really excited. We can't wait. We're looking forward to welcoming you. So, there's so much to talk about. We're so excited to be together. And And you've been on lots of podcasts. You've done lots of interviews. We've heard a lot about your life story. And we're going to get to that. I want to start out where many people might end because this is I think a really powerful place to be a message you can bring. You have a fire in your connection with Hashem. It comes through through your music. It comes through through your personality. You're sincere. You're genuine. But you live your Judaism with a fire. If you could talk to people who grew up as Jews and grew up with Jewish observance, but they're ice cold. There isn't that fire. They're struggling to connect. They're struggling to be lit up. What advice would you give them about how to live close to Hashem? What is your advice about how to get on fire? Well, there's a there's a few things. One thing is a is really a no-brainer, but nobody ever thinks of it. Can you ever think of a no-brainer that nobody ever thinks of? One of the things is is that I'm Israel's called the people of the book. Problem is we don't spend enough time reading the book. One of the biggest ways of having connection with Hashem is to realize and see the relationship that the former tzadikim and former righteous people had with the Kodesh Baruch Hu. And then once you have that type of connection, then you have an expectation of what it is that Hashem is also supposed to put into the relationship. I'm supposed to see things. I'm supposed to experience you Hashem in a in a completely different way than maybe what I'm able to, you know, get connected with with my limited understanding of what that relationship should be like. So, I think that's a big thing. In fact, there's a book called Divrei Yaakov. It's a very serious like serious sefer on Avodas Hashem written by Yaakov Addas, one of the tzadikim in Yerushalayim. And it was very interesting because I had this thought, but he wrote it. He actually wrote it. He says a person when experiences him like the like the older you have to reread these stories and see and and and really realize that, you know, Eliyahu Hanavi was living with the Shem. Shmuel Hanavi was living with the Shem. It says when he was in the temple and he was there and not even actually in the temple, he was in the Mishkan. Says that that he was growing and waxing day in and day out getting closer and closer to Shem. He was growing What was he doing? He was spending a lot of time with the Shem is what he was doing. So, that's the other thing is spending time with the Shem. Many people it's very easy for us today, especially to to spend time learning and and and not really rid ourselves of all the guy even everything else that can come from being the top guy in the sheer, being the guy that everybody calls the time of Hacham, but when you go to a Shem into feeling you pour your heart out and you talk to a Shem about, you know, what it is that's that's stopping you from achieving what you want to. It's very very hard to be, you know, lifted up and built up to be be something that you're not. And so, something that happens is that a person just, you know, through that loneliness that he has to come to when he comes to realization helps him realize the godliness of a Shem and how big he is and how and it it, you know, I think that that's what really kindles the fire. That's amazing. So, now let's go back because what you just answered what you just told us, which thank you. It's it's really inspiring and it's beautiful. Um, that was not an obvious path or trajectory from you growing up in Seattle, parents who are hip-hop artists themselves. You launched your rap hip-hop career with language you probably wouldn't want your kids to hear today. You stole all kinds of things and you went through a lot including loss. So, let's take that step back, right? The journey from there to here and and and unpredictable. Nobody would have guessed that you'd be the one sitting here with the jacket and black hat quoting the Torah, living in Israel. Tell us about that journey and how you got there. So, as you mentioned, both of my parents were hip-hop artists. I always say they were hip-hop artists during the day, drug dealers by night. And I say like any good Jewish boy, I joined the family business very early on. Um I was running with the wrong crowd. By the time I was nine, I was smoking pot. By the time I was 12, and not only was I in over my head with the you know, my own drug use, but I was also selling at the time. And found myself in a very, very dark place. I was expelled from my from the Seattle school district. They didn't allow me into a school by the time I was 13. And um I see myself going down a very, very dark path. Um my first introduction to religion was Islam. My grandfather was a Sunni Muslim. So, I prayed with him five times a day at least from the time I was eight until maybe nine or 10, I was praying with him. And he ended up going back to prison. And uh after that, you know, there was no actual structure of religion or faith in my in in my life. So, that's when I was getting in more and more trouble. And then when I was 13, I think which was at a crucial and very critical point, I had a friend that invited me to a hip-hop program that was at a Christian uh after-school center. And I started going to this place. It was completely, you know, like a missionary thing, but I will honestly say still to this day that that saved my life. It gave me a place off the you know, hanging out in the streets. And it gave me a place to have some type of stability. And they obviously invited me to a missionary camp, and there I became a Christian. And I would say that it was a it was a solid. I think, you know, really looking back, I really went in chronological order backwards before I came to Yiddishkeit. I sort of was able to to go on this journey, and I think that that time period in my life was so crucial because this is my development years. I'm a teenager coming into an adult. Um so, it started to help me realize, and I think even back then was when I really understood how important it was to spend time with the sham. I would spend a whole lot more time than a lot of my other friends that were in Bible study youth groups, which led to me asking deeper questions in the Bible study groups that I felt like were never really answered. So, as I continued, I went on the music started to take off a little bit more. There was a record label that was interested in me and we started having these very very awesome conversations but which I thought was going to change my life. And it happened that uh they really wanted this gangster persona. Something I wasn't unfamiliar with but it just wasn't the place I was in my life at the time. They offered a lot of money. I went for the bite and I started turning in records that were very contradictory to who I was as a person, who I was trying to become. At that time I had also met my huh? Go ahead. Even then they were contradictory you're saying. Not compatible with today who you are but you're saying even then you felt the tension. Even even then even then. You know it's a very interesting thing how you know the human is you know I remember years ago someone one of my very very close friends he had asked asked our rebbe in the middle of a sheer we were learning I think maybe in the city of Shalom or something. It was a beautiful sheer and he asked him and about about the about about the nations that that were expelled from from Canaan. And he says why did Hashem allow this to happen cuz a prophet. They didn't have a who told them that what they were doing were wrong and whatever. And one of the things he he he he gave us as an answer was that Hashem created us with a certain yashrus. There's a certain yashrus that all mankind has. That was one of his answers and it never left me because I realized that even myself before I was long before I was Jewish, you felt the things that you were doing was wrong. Even though you really didn't have a context to really understand that they were really wrong or in that they weren't based upon my my these things seemed to be permissible, you know? Um, but you still felt something. You felt that it was wrong. And I I think I would say that I always felt like this sort of very close relationship with God even at times when I didn't really, but I always felt like he was with me for some reason. I felt like I was being watched and there was a clock there was a clock that he was going to snap everything and he was going to turn it around. So, I ended up going to this dark hole, making this music, and I started to realize that I got very confused myself about who I was. I wasn't sure who I was anymore. I'm releasing these records, I have a, you know, church girl for a girlfriend. She's very not with this type of lifestyle. I'm over here and I'm, you know, trying to figure myself out. Um, in the midst of all of this I end up losing my mother of overdose. That was a very, very hard time for me and it put me in a very, I would say I was almost emotionally paralyzed after this. It was a deep pain that I you know, was so abrupt and so fast that I you know, was something I would never wish on my worst enemy. And after that, I felt like that was the first thing that really just crushed me so much that I was I was honestly searching, seeking for some type of healing, something at that time. So, what later happened? Listen, I want to interrupt you for one second because I want to go in deeper into this. I want to behind the mic if it's okay. Which is I think many people go through loss. There's a lot of people right now struggling. Right. And that loss drives them further from God. They wonder where is he and why he would he let this happen and if that's what he who he is, I want nothing to do with him. So, many people might have lost their mother at that age, you were 19 years old to that overdose and say, you know what? Forget religion. I'm not exploring that. I'm going deeper in cuz life is too short. I want to make as much money, have as much fun, I'm going to become as famous as I can and forget God. You did the opposite. So, what would your message be to people going through a hard time that you need more God not less than ever? No, absolutely I would say that and I would say that, you know, I I I wish I can say that I knew what it was that made me feel like that, but it at the moment that it happened, it made me feel like God was so big. He was so like in control. Not the fact that like, you know, he did it so it can't be, you know, obviously I wasn't so happy about him seeing people 50, 60, 70 with the mother and the father still around, you understand? So, obviously there is that pain of like, why me? Why did that happen to me? Um, but I think that the the the the whole reason why these things happen to us to some degree at some point is to get us to a place of where we're we're submissive to understanding accept God's sovereignty, even though it's very very hard. But that usually leads to bigger and better things, which this actually did for me. So, continuing with this, you know, this brokenness of and what I did, I didn't have a shiver, right? So, what did I do? I did the exact opposite. I got myself so busy. I didn't leave the studio. I was out with frie- I was trying to consume my life so much with the activity that I that I just wouldn't think about it because if I was alone, I would have broke down. If I was alone, I would have broke down. So, um the music continued and I think it was maybe maybe a year and a half after my mother passed away um that there was another artist who uh made a diss song towards me. And I remember hearing the song. I was in the studio. I was going to write a song back and, you know, send another song out, but that would obviously give him more promotion. So, my friend said, you know, if we, you know, go beat him up, then you know, he won't make any more songs. So, we went with that option and that uh turned into a to a brawl outside of a nightclub, which ended up leading to a friend of mine going up afterwards trying to take the other artist's life. So, since he was a horrible shot and he shot everything except for the guy, he ended up in custody, but the other guys had a big problem. They thought that I sent them. So, I have now a big problem that if I don't go and take these guys out, they're going to come take me out. And that was number two. That was strike two. After that one, I remember walking back and forth in my living room and I started breaking down. I just start crying. I start crying to God begging that there be some other way. Because although you can rap about these things and you can live in that type of lifestyle and I seen a lot of violence. I was around it. I I I was shot at. I've I've seen all these different things. I didn't really have it inside my heart to go and take another person's life and I knew that wasn't who I was. So, I fell into the second place of like complete submission. God, only you can help me. So, he would have it that How big were you in the rap hip hop world at that time? At this time it was right at my right at my edge. What what hap What what What was happening at this time, I was already in a lot of publications, especially, you know, as far as locally in Seattle was very much so well known who I was cuz cuz of also my parents they pioneered hip hop at that time. And so, it was very very like everybody was waiting for the next breakout album for me right there and it was it was very very like uh on the bubble. And what would happen would be was that I ended up after this saying, you know, I got in we got in touch the other artist got in touch with me. We put everything behind us, thank God, which was a miracle in itself. And I changed everything after that. I changed the I didn't know exactly how I did I did it slow and I was praying. I went to go pick up the Bible again. I started reviewing all of these different questions and I didn't know what I was going to do anymore because I was falling in love with the Shem. I was falling in love with the Jewish people. I had new eyes. I'm seeing the book from a different point All these these pasukim that I thought was talking about the church was really talking about the Jewish people. So, all these things start to scale up my So, what happens is that especially as a creative you you start to process all this new information and you want to create. You want to create content. You want to do things that are that are much more true to where you are. So, I ended up recording a record like when I was in this process phase of really not knowing where I was and that was that that ended up being the next breakout record, which at the time I had said was going to be my last album. I actually met with my business partner and I said to him, you know, I'm going to do this last album. The only thing is I don't want to perform on Shabbat, on the Yamim Tovim, anything like that. He said He said, "Okay." And the agreement was I didn't take any money from the album. They would keep everything cuz I obviously I couldn't tour the way that I wanted to before. So, that was my thing. You guys can have everything. And that that album blew up and went all all over the country. It was on MTV, my first single, major radio stations. I was getting calls and having publications. I was headlining major music festivals all this year and I went on tour and I didn't have to perform on Shabbat at the Yamim Tovim. And I and I started working a job that year, right? So, that year I had started working a job, my first real job, and I got four raises that year. Four raises that year. I wasn't even Jewish yet. So, I already got to see like Hashem's hand very, very early on. So, um that was the that was the journey and then from there me and my wife, my brother-in-law and sister sister-in-law um all converted together. It's amazing. Let's talk about that conversion for a little bit because while you were going through it, you you got rid of all music. You split from the label that you partially owned. You devoted yourself entirely to the conversion process and it would be a little while until you came back to music. What's that like when something is so much a part of your life, it's so much a part of you said of your creative process, and then to completely disassociate yourself from that, go through this life-changing experience, and then come back to that same passion that you love, but with a completely different set of eyes. What did you learn about music? What did you learn about yourself specifically by taking a break from that thing that had consumed so much of your life up until that point? So, originally you have to you have to understand I thought I was done. I thought I was slaughtering music, I thought it was over for several reasons. It was very very hard to learn as much as I was learning and be as excited as I was about Torah, which happens to a lot of people. And whatever the field the field it is that it momish consumes you with such a fire itself that it burns up everything in its way. Once once a person latches on to a sham in the it can burn up everything, you know? And I think at that time it was very hard for me to marriage the the arrogance even of the rap sport, you know, with the you know, trying to learn some anivus and learn learn Torah and and and submission I guess I would say to some degree to to sham and what his will may be. It was very hard for me to make these worlds they seemed like polar opposites pretty much. So, it was very hard for me to continue with that and and at the time I really felt like this was my way of of doing my uh my my own my own akeda, you know, and I I was going to slaughter my Yitzchak, you know what I mean? This was this was going to be it. Akedat Yitzchak Yitzchak Yitzchak. And for me this is what I this was my one thing that Hashem was testing me with. This was going to be the final thing. I'd been through so much already in my life. I said this is going to be it and I thought it was over. And as we know how that story ends Hashem sends a malach. I didn't really get to see a malach, but it was very interesting a few years later as a lot of Jewish artists, some more famous than others, started to actually take a turn from the faith and and it's sort of like you know, I guess retrospectively looking at it now, opened up this space of like well, Hashem saying, "Who's going to represent me in this space?" You know what I mean? It was a It was It wasn't just one of the big names that we know. It was other people. They were It was all around the same exact time, which scared me even more to ever make music again. And at this time, I was getting a lot of push from family and friends and people that were around me, rabbis that were in the community, and saying that, "You know, Hashem gave you a gift. You should probably use it. This would be the time to, you know, use it. You can inspire a lot of people." And I was saying, "No, no, no, no, no, no, no." And uh I remember my son, he ended up getting sick. He was It was about He was two He was a four months old. And he was in the hospital for two weeks with meningitis. And during this time, I had got um one of the books Rabbi Shalom Arush when he was talking about, you know, if if you're in the need of a big salvation, you should pray to Hashem straight for six hours. And I went did it. And not only did I have the miracle of my son, but what happened during that time, I really tested God. Now, you should never do this, but Baruch Hashem, I wasn't Jewish yet, and I was I was on my way to the base 10, but but, you know, I don't I don't I don't usually recommend it, but I really asked Hashem to to give me siman. I needed to know that this was real. I was getting way too much push, and and and it was so scary for me to to go back out there because I thought that the moment that I touch music again, I was going to lose everything. I was going to lose Hashem. I was going to lose my religion. I was going to lose everything. So, um after praying and and getting the sign that I wanted, which was an old microphone that was broken. It was verifiable. You can ask my brother-in-law, the most honest and real person. He also makes music with me. And that microphone started working again. I went to my rebbeim, and I asked them. I had a long lecture with my rebbe, Rabbi Shmuel Brody, who was now in Baltimore. He was in Seattle at that time. And for about two hours straight, we we we went over it. We chazered the whole everything what what was going on before. And and Baruch Hashem, he gave me a bracha. I got a bracha from from other rabbis and and uh I went back out. And I still will say that in the beginning, when I got I was still tiptoeing. I was tiptoeing. And and that was up until I was reached out to by friend uh to do Hashem Melech with Gad Elbaz. I don't think I think that was the first time that I really was like, "Okay, Hashem, I'm doing it, you know." It's a great song. So, the truth is, Nissim, that you you become a Jewish music superstar, obviously famous in the Jewish world, you know. Maybe you'll give us a little Motherland Bounce. You know, in my home, when we get a little sad, we put on Motherland Bounce and you can't you can't hear that and sit still. It's impossible. Right. You have to move when that beat when that song comes on. Maybe you'll give us a little bit of that. But so now that you're famous Jewishly, so you went from I'm going to keep the music close, I'm going to shecht it like the Akedah, to it came back to life. Hashem wasn't ready. Sent the malach. How do you stay humble? How do you stay humble? You walk around Ramat Bet Shemesh, you walk around Israel, come on tour in America, you know, you're easily recognizably famous. How do you stay humble? How do you stay real? How do you avoid what you were worried about with those other artists who walked away? It got to their head. That was your fear. How do you make sure you fight it? So, that's that's one of the biggest issues that I have, you know. I I definitely will say I'm not the most famous Jewish musician, but definitely the most noticeable guy. Uh I'm so noticeable that almost every other black Yid that I know has been accused of being me several times and probably could have done a few selfies that he didn't really deserve. But um so, it does put me in a position to where it's a non-stop, always having to, you know, uh sort of be on your game, to so to speak. But I think the biggest thing is because um I never went away from that, you know, on my path, obviously, that that that end up I wouldn't say I chose, but end up choosing me, was a Breslov path and the the the maila of of hisbodedus, of talking to Hashem, is my I live in that space. I I It's not one of those things where I talk about it I read in the safer this this I live and and I and I and I think for me that's been the biggest thing to help me to stay humble to keep my head level to where it happens and you don't even you don't even think about it. I was somewhere I was at the shabbaton this past this past shabbos and I just was like so everybody kept saying so humble. I don't even see it. I don't even see it. Me I think I'm a baal ga'avah. You know, I'm working on myself. You know what I mean? But everybody else thinks I'm so humble and it's because I honestly know that Hashem didn't I didn't work for any of the things that I have. I seen that Hashem gave it to me. By the time, you know, Hashem Elokim came out and it was very popular I wasn't putting on the marketing plans. I wasn't reaching at anybody's door whatever somebody called me asked me if I wanted to do the song. At the time the the video came out I was spending every day with Hashem 6 hours in the in in the forest crying to Hashem. I didn't have money. I didn't know what my next anything was going to be and that song itself changed my life. Not even in the Jewish world. It was number three on the charts even the were listening to it. So you realize that the that nothing when you realize that nothing you have came from you it's only from Hashem then what do you have to be so you know, so arrogant about you know, to so to speak. So Can you walk through for our listener our listener who doesn't know what hisbodedus is? Take us through the mechanics of that, right? What does it mean to to be alone talking to God? You do it every day? How long a day? What do you think about or talk about? Okay. Inspire some of our listeners themselves to when they hang up from this podcast to go do a few minutes of hisbodedus. So the biggest thing is hisbodedus is in the in the most practical term that that I could give it to you it's personal prayer spending time with Hashem. I like to say spending time with Hashem. It's been translated as personal prayer to feel us alone time with Hashem seclusion to to away from the rest of the world and to really reflect and to spend time with Hashem, to speak to him, to get to know him. The biggest thing right now, I think a or a lot of people feel this somewhat of this this distance from Hashem, a lot of it is coming from the fact of of Hashem saying, "Did you consider me? Did you think about me when you when you when you made a decision? When you do other things?" If we don't include Hashem, what is chuva? What is us What is us repenting? What are we returning to? Returning to the fact that the Gemara says that a ruach shtus a a a a a silly spirit enters into a person at the time he commits a sin or any type of error, anything that's against Hashem's will, right? Which is the absence of Hashem. At this point, he's a chelek, he's a piece of Hashem. But at that time that he did something, that Hashem is gone. He had some some different spirit. So, when we make chuva, we're bringing Hashem back to the place where we disconnected from him. And so much of our life, even if we're not even doing anything wrong, we're just living life, we're also not even thinking about Hashem. So, the the whole moment of hisbodedus, to bring Hashem back into my life, to bring him there, to consider him, to think of him. "Tati, do you want me to do that? Do you want me to do this business deal? Do you want me to to to work at this place?" You know, "Give me eitzos on how to how to raise my children. Give me eitzos on on on what to do." So, that is the that is the the essence of really what hisbodedus is. Let me just ask a follow-up to that because I think anyone listening or watching gets very clearly the sense that you're genuine, that you're a seeker, that you're very thoughtful, and that you're you're not afraid of change, that wherever life is going to take you and whatever learning path you're on, you're willing to embrace it. Right. I want to come back a little bit to Rabbi Goldberg's first question, but dig a little bit deeper at this point, which is to say there's so many people that aren't like that. You spoke about learning and you spoke about hisbodedus of connecting with Hashem, and yet there's so many people in our community that hear those messages, and they turn it off with their cynical, uh, "This is the way I've been. This is the way I'll always been. This is my Judaism. Why change? It's been like this since the 1970s. Why do I have to change it now?" So, what would your message be to that person? Let's push that person a little bit more to say that I've always looked to change in my life. I'm unafraid of what that's going to bring. You shouldn't be, either. And so, take it out from the specific learning and just an openness to change. How would you speak to that cynic who's listening and saying, "Ah, that's not me. I've been doing this my whole life. This is the way Orthodoxy was in 1960s. I'm not looking to change." I think the biggest thing is that it may have been that way in the 1960s, 1970s, but as I mentioned to you before, if you go back and read the book, that's not what it was like, you know, the you know, this this what we're talking about, spending time with the sham and talking to him, is more Jewish than Rashi and Tosfos. And and I think the the I think the biggest error is is that, you know, not really just the the ability to change, but of of openness that we never get ourselves to that place to ask ourself, "What do we really want?" Now, we think about these things in terms of career, we think about what we want our children to be in 5 years and how much we want them to either do as good as us or better than us and push them and we'll push ourselves to achieve things for for for success and and and you know, monetarily or whatever else it is. But, when it comes to the spiritual, we never really sit and think about it. Like, what's what's where what what do I want for myself? And those things are that if I am if I if I if I do say to myself that I'm not really so interested in and changing and all the things is then I can start asking myself, "Am I happy? Am I genuinely happy? Am I happy with who I am? Am I really, really happy that, you know, one of the biggest things is like, you know, you have to sometimes and I've done this before, you know, thought about my life and, you know, I think I was going to write a song about it, but I didn't do it cuz I didn't want to make it sound so morbid, but I thought about that, you know, at at my at my eulogy, what would I want people to say about me, you know? What would I want people to really write that What would I want them to say about me when I'm done? So, I think it's deeper thinking about, you know, myself and and who I am and and and my importance and what I'm contributing to to to the world and what am I contributing to myself spiritually. In in Motherland Bounce, you describe yourself as Hitler's worst nightmare. Which is really It's a great description. You are You look at you, where you came from, where you are, what you're preaching, and where we're going, you are the answer. You are Hitler's worst nightmare. So, could you talk to us a little bit about um anti-Semitism? Have you confronted and faced it? And and talk to us a little bit about racism here in America and and I'm sure in other parts of the world. Obviously, you know, Black Lives Matter, race race relations was a big topic, is still a big topic. Um did you confront a lot of that before you were Jewish? Do you confront that still now? And as a Torah observant black Jew, do you confront both forms of hate? Are you having to confront racism and anti-Semitism? So, talk to us about being Hitler's worst nightmare. Uh thank you. Um so, the truth is yes, and I would say like this, um I would definitely say I've experienced far more anti-Semitism than I ever have racism before I was Jewish by far. Um and and it's it's very interesting. A lot of it even can come comes from the black community. So, it's a very interesting thing seeing as how the world is changing and evolves, especially over these last 2 years, everything has gotten crazy. I would like to state that, you know, I've stated as many times I'm a very big non-supporter of Black Lives Matter. I don't believe in that movement. I believe they're shooting at the hip at the wrong wrong issues in the black community. Um but, I would definitely say that that I don't I I do believe that there is racism. I don't think that that's the number one problem in America right now with the African-American community. I don't think that's the reason why African-Americans perhaps are not succeeding. Someone please shut the door. Of course. Everybody knows you're real. Thank you. Sorry. This is the real life. No, exactly. So I don't think that that has anything to do with the success or lack of lack there of the black community right now. Um however, it does still exist. Now I will say that I will also say that they where I didn't have the racism in the in the non-Furm world where I was at, I have gotten my dose in the Furm world, you know, that I didn't that I didn't get before, um which is very very interesting because which is obviously coming from a different place. Uh then the American racism comes from a whole bunch of stereotypes and different things that have happened over the last 400 years, deep-rooted in in those different things that have led to some things systemically that are wrong and that are keeping, you know, certain things down in the in the African-American world and African-American communities. Um in the Furm world when you when you experience those things, you're not necessarily experiencing with all of those things with all those blankets on there. It's just you're different than me, which is a problem that you didn't have with other you that are different than them also. So I think that that's our biggest issue. I'm live right now. You have to shut my door, too. You have to shut my door, please. Sorry. No worries. So so I've definitely had to experience it in there and I think so it was more so even my children more than I have to do it. Um Hashem has blessed me to be a well-known figure, so I don't really get it that much as my children get it, you know, from other kids and and and school systems and different things like that. So it has been somewhat difficult in having to address those things head-on. But you know, I'm such a you know, brings me back to, you know, what we were talking about earlier, I'm such a Hashem guy. And I'm so convinced that I'm on team Hashem that that's just really how I I go through everything. I dabble on things and I go and I in my practical step is always to to know, you know, and just want to bring back I was having some trouble getting my daughter into school and they were very open a lot of the schools were as to the reason, which was the color of her skin. They, you know, it I had to take a break from the curriculum the teacher obviously Israeli and nobody has time for that right now. And so this is the the issue that we're finding ourselves in. Now, during the time so many people came up to me and said, you know, don't you feel like just throwing away everything? How could you continue whatever? And I kept telling her I was getting so much hisuk from David Hamelach, you know, it's reading Shmuel. He was a thousand percent right. Shaul Hamelach was wrong. And he didn't do anything, right? Doesn't take away the fact that this person over here, this min a hell, this min a hell at this way still Hashem's baby. It's not my not my right. I came here and I'm so I'm so grateful to be a part of Am Yisrael. I have no no qualms, nothing against anybody. If somebody feels like they're being shomer Yisrael by not allowing my kid in, power to them. I'm not I'm not going to allow. And the only thing that was giving me strength was I was going out talking to Hashem so much during that time. Talking to Hashem it gave me so much strength to be able to overcome it. And and I knew that everything was going to work out and it did. My kids are in beautiful schools. They're accepted. They're loved. They're they're very happy where they are, you know. So, baruch Hashem in the end everything turns out. In term of in terms of anti-Semitism, a lot of this is coming at the at the expense of TV, television, um a lot of uh for lack of better term fake news and different things that are going on to the world. So it raises head in many different places. People um some in the African-American community, "Oh, you're such a traitor. How could you Now you think you're white. You think you're this, you're that." and whatever whatever whatever else. A lot of it is a really a lack of education and people don't really have an understanding of of Am Yisrael and understanding of of Eretz Yisrael and and what it is and the stories. I was talking to a to a cab driver who was bringing me back, a Palestinian cab driver, and he's going on and on and he's screaming telling me his stuff, you know? And he and they all do the same thing. They go, "It's like you, like the blacks in America." They all say the same thing to me. It's like the blacks in America, it's the same thing. How could you How could you You don't want to be Jewish, but these guys are the same people, you know? It's just It's misinformation. It's misinformation. As we're going into right now, 2022 we're in right now. And look at what's going on since 2020. Depending on which news station you're watching, you go with the mask or you don't go with the mask. You believe in the in situation situation or you don't believe. The whole thing is completely fake news being eradicated and it's and it's put out there for the world. And the only way to overcome it is is serving Hashem. That's it. That's the only answer that's going to be. I don't think all this Some people have to say what they have to say, they have to fight. My thing is not to I'm not afraid of fighting, but the the the biggest thing is that I don't feel like you can talk with somebody who's irrational and don't understand the things that they're saying even when they're saying it. And you know when some people talk, you let them talk long enough and they sound very silly while they're talking. It's like how can you argue against people like that? They don't know the history, they don't know what's going on over here in this land. And I think you think about Palestinians, you know? Look at the you know, unfortunately, the homosexual community. I'm being honest, how much they're behind the Palestinians. If this is a Palestinian state, you can forget it, they'd have wiped them. Not to say that we support it, but I'm just saying this is a government that we have over here that's allowing these guys to do whatever they want, unfortunately fortunately or unfortunately. But the case is is that in Palestinian, they definitely don't support these guys. You see certain things is like irrational. They don't even thinking about anything that they're thinking about. So, I think that that's uh that's sort of what we're dealing with right now. That's a lot of his work for us not to fight. Sometimes let people speak, they don't know what they're talking about and they'll they'll undo themselves. You're coming to us from Israel, you referenced your kids at schools in Israel living in Israel. You could have become a big star in America or you could have just been a simple humble Jew and blended in in America. What brought your family to Israel? Uh there's no way to read Tanakh and to go through Navi and to not want to be in the place where everything can happen, you know? It's like one of those things. It's like to go through it over and over again. I needed to be there. My my feet needed to be there. So, um it was never not a time where I didn't feel like I wasn't coming here. Um it just took a little time and a and a lot of prayers to convince my wife that it was the right thing to do. But, in the end we ended up doing it. And uh my brother and sister-in-law also moved at the same time. You know, I think they were a little bit ready before more ready before my wife. And then after a while we just we we decided that, you know, the best place for us to be to be able to, especially as geirim, to be able to soak up all of all of all of Yiddishkeit in its entirety, to get it, you know, very concentrated, we had to come to Eretz Yisrael. And I always say, you know, for people who you know, want to be in entertainment or or or the arts or or fashion, they either move to LA, they drop everything, they give up their whole lives, they go move to LA, or they'll move to New York or Paris to do fashion, and and they put their whole entire lives on the line. Eretz Yisrael is a place to move for Hashem. When you're ready to move and then you just want to Hashem, you throw everything away and you move there. So, uh that's that's why that's why we moved. I love that. us through what a day looks like in the life of Nissim Black. Obviously, we saw some of your kids coming in. It sounds like a a busy household behind you. Right. Right. is what is your day look like between learning, between davening, between family life, between professional aspirations? Mhm. Very good. Very good. So, I'm up usually very early around 4:00 4:00 something or so or 5:00 I go I go dominate. Usually I'm in the nates minion fiery nates minion. We have a beautiful nates minion here. And after that I learn. So, I learn for about 4 hours and maybe until midday or so like that and then I'm in the studio for a few hours working on projects. And after that I'm helping with the children getting the children back down. In between all of this going out for for for mincha or maariv. And then I'm either back in the studio or I'm having time with my wife or I get to go out into the forest late at night but I should have go spend some time with the Shem and go home and go back to sleep and get up and do it again. That's that's when I'm home. When I'm out on the tour that's unpredictable. It's all day long there's shows there's speaking there's conferences so that's also very very big part of my life. Let's talk music a little bit. So, you said you spend time in the studio. Mhm. Walk us through what it's like writing writing a rap. Does it start out as a poem and then you add the beat? Does it start out with the beat and the rhythm and then you add the words? Are you thinking about it for a long time before you're actually working on that and putting it down on paper? How does the song go from inside of Nissim's neshama into almost 5 million hits on YouTube? So, what happens is is usually there's a um there is a a stirring that happens really and I'm telling you Hashem has his way of doing things that especially I would say definitely on the last four or five songs that were released is it's been a whole project beyond that hasn't been released yet but um what really happens is like during these times of of me you know crying and spending the time with the Shem like they just formulate into songs in my head and they're like stored away you know it's like a file cabinet inside inside my head inside my heart wherever it is. And and usually when I hear music, I usually has a hear hear a good nice beat from either my brother-in-law or another producer or whatever I'm working with. And then usually those words just start to pour out from from the music. And and I would always say that when I write, I usually am writing to music. So I'm always starting with music. But I always go back and reference, you know, what I'm feeling. One of the biggest thing is things about being an artist is is that and and this is a good thing for people to know even when they, you know, those who struggle to listen to non-Jewish music. Generally a person that is writing music and a composer understands what they're able to do with a person's emotions. Understands it very, very clear where those emotions can take a person, how they're going to make a person feel. Um and I really take pride in being able to to pull out and draw out certain emotions out of people when I'm writing. So um whenever I felt whatever I felt, there's been many times, you know, when I write, I'm crying. I'm crying because I'm really, really bound up with with whatever it is that I'm feeling. And uh from there I write, I pace back and forth inside of my room. I usually write inside of this room. And uh I have a I have a I have a cheviti here. I talk to Hashem. I make his kashrus. And uh and then I start writing, I start recording. So that's pretty much how it works. You have a couple lyrics or something that's not out there yet you want to try out on us or share with us? What's come What's come out of your heart? Give us Give us two lines. I have uh I have probably one of my fave One of my favorite songs that's unreleased. It was my favorite until the last few days. I did a few other songs. Now I have a few more favorites. But um but I have a song called Lifted that uh that I'm going to release soon with uh with the artist who I love named Levi Robin. And uh so I'll do a little piece from that. Um goes like this. The hardest thing to deal with is to move without feelings. Seeing signs on all sides, but don't know what your will is. Don't know what the real is. Feeling my back's against the wall. Seeing all of my mistakes and I desire to fix them all, but without you it's impossible. And from my insides I will call, but then it don't even ring. They all say how much you love me, so how could it be that you would let me destroy myself? I need saving from me. And when they write inside my book, use my tears as the ink. So they could testify on me all I did to break free and to glorify your name cuz I gave back what you gave to me. I'm falling down, so can you lift me? Yeah, so that's it. Beautiful. Wow. It's fire. Wow. Powerful. Powerful. So what would you say to somebody who says that the genre of rap, hip hop it is it is so institutionalized and intertwined with degrading women, with curse, with the culture of rape, of hate, of and and therefore it lacks holiness. What what would you say that you're taking something and we give it the holiness? That we can apply the kedusha to anything. What would you respond to that? Well, you know, I was told by by big tzadik in this actually very it's about the sorry Baba Sali's yard site is either now underway. I was told by his grandson himself that all music has its place in kedusha. He was very very and he's actually brought me for three weddings of his his own and he told me very very in fact when I asked him this question he told me all music has a source in kedusha. The issue is is that clippers grab onto things and this is sort of what we have to understand that there's husk and there's and there's coverings over things. I will also say is a very beautiful safer in Breslov like one of those safers is so Breslover they'll probably never translate it into English called Kokhav Yaakov. Inside of there he tells a story of the he talks about the air balloon. This is over a hundred years ago and he says soon you'll see in the future that each person will be able to travel wherever they want to travel to by the air. Each person. It's before the airplane. By the air you'll see this. And he says, over there he says, and just like with any new invention, at the time that it's created Hashem only allowed for it to come into existence for the sake of kedusha. It's the only reason why Hashem allowed something to be brought. He says, but the klipah list is that first the klipahs get it. They get it first. They get to have it first. Apart from, you know, we look at it with the internet. Apart from, you know, the fact that Chabad gets very Chabad's very close after the klipahs, they get it and they get it also. But, you know, it's it's very much so that the rule is it always goes over this. I feel like the whole reason why Hashem allowed rap to come into existence was for me to be able to do what I'm doing with the right now. So, I think that that's we're just sort of being momshik, bringing the kedusha out out from from amidst the darkness. And it's not something that we're adding and we're bringing it there. We're just sort of bringing it out of something that Hashem allowed to come into creation in the first place. And a lot of times people they mix up with with what's what's kadosh and what's holy with their own opinions and their own taste. Sometimes it's a taste thing and we're not really Since we don't evaluate ourselves, we don't realize that it's it's just a matter of taste. I just don't understand it on taste. I don't have a taste for certain type of music also. Um usually heavy metal. I don't understand the music. I'm not Can I Can tell somebody now there's no kedusha and there's no I wouldn't tell a person that. I just I don't have a taste for it. So, it's not something I have a taste for. So. As a creative artist, do you ever Do you ever get stuck? Um yeah, yeah, yeah. There's times There's times. I'm not having one of those times right now, so Hashem With Hashem's help they they won't they won't it won't it won't come up on me. But, uh yeah. you do? What do you do to get unstuck? Um you know what? I I really just It's one of those things, you know, it's like Rebbe Akiva, you know, you got to put your head down with the waves and just go with the tides. It's just I really haven't never found a real solution to get out of it, you know? I've tried like going different places or riding in in the forest and beautiful scenery and everything. Nothing seems to help. It's like sort of like you know, one of those times when when it's uh it's a time to fill up and and you got to take whatever it is that you can and so when it's when it's broken, you know, you're it's not actually broken when you're in a time where there's a same open the cot nurse. You don't have you can't think outside of what you have to sort of just sit and let and let it go. Let the waves go and then eventually then it'll come back again. Are there any Jewish music um people who are an influence on you? Do you style after? Do they influence your music? Have they reached out to mentor you in the Jewish music world as you transitioned in? No, not really. I wouldn't say not really so much as a mentor. Um there's a lot of people whose music I actually like. I respect a lot. Um but I don't know. It seems like um unfortunately, there isn't so much of that. I feel like, you know, really in the Jewish world. Could be. It just maybe since I'm such a khidish, I would guess I would say musically that you know, probably they felt like, you know, I can't imagine like MBD say, "Man, listen, man, I'm going to take you under my roof." There's a thousand There's at least a thousand concerts he does that I'll never be able to do, right? So, it's like um it's just the reality of it that I really haven't had that. Um you know, I did I did myself uh see as as I was, you know, coming into music and I start to see somewhat of the shift in and I I wouldn't say it was because of me at all, but I would say that there was like this openness at the same time. It was like at the same time, you know, the rise of, you know, the Zushas and, you know, um Levi Robin's doing his thing and other people that are kind of coming not the same genre as me, but it's not the traditional, you know, Jewish mainstream music that really I think people are taking to. There's a lot of these kids have been Waterbury also too that are very very very amazing. This I think his name is Jericho. This new song I I heard recently like this stuff is like amazing that there's other opportunities for people to express kedusha from genres that people would have never really listened to. Then I'm I'm very very excited about, but I would say I probably listen to Zusha. Yishai Riboh to me is like wow, one of the greatest writers that I can possibly say that I know. So, so there's a lot of different lot of different music I like. Almost I don't listen to almost any music that's that's like mine or that's up-tempo upbeat. I always listen to very like the opposite of what I make I listen to. I don't know why, but that's one of my thing. I'll give him a shout out because he's going to be an up and coming star. I believe that you've met him, a young man from our community, Yosef Sandler, who's trying to channel his talents and uh Yeah. looking forward to your work and your gift. Yeah. Very very Great kid. Very big talent. Yes, wow wow wow. I can't wait till the world gets a whiff of him. He's very very talented. Very very talented. We're excited. Rabbi Moscowitz, we're going to we're going to wind down, but take us home. Take us home. Do you um Wasn't expecting that. Sorry. Um Oh, my bad. What? No, no, I didn't uh All right, I'll take us home. Nesanel, tell us when when someone's listening to your music, what do you want them to be feeling? When a person gives you feedback on that music, what's the biggest compliment you get that I heard your song and The biggest compliment I get was that your heart what what you said was exactly what my heart was saying. Uh these are these are my exact words that you're giving me the words that I wanted to say to Hashem that I that I couldn't say. The things that I wanted to express. Uh these these comments that I get from people are just like, you know, through the roof cuz you know, I was there and I was there and I dove into Hashem that I would be able to to be used for such a thing that that I'll be able to use my gift for such a thing and to see it happen was like it's like it's like, you know, it's like Hashem it's like open miracle like, you know, Hashem is exactly showing you exactly everything you've been davening on. You're seeing it from the people and and and to know how much people receive a chizuk from the music and the song like it's for me that's that's everything I davened for. I I really literally I said these words to Hashem this is what I want to do and I've and I said it over and over and over again. So, um to be able to see that is just sort of like having your tefillos answered. So, those are those are the biggest things for me. It's also great to hear when people say um you know, because of you I stopped listening to non-Jewish music and you gave me an avenue that I honestly wasn't like my goal. I didn't think of anything about this but it's like it's a great side thing also to that look look at that Baruch Hashem a lot of people able to stop, you know, listening to certain type of music and you're providing something for them. So, that's also good. Well, let me let me jump in with the last question. Hold on because I got to redeem myself on that but um what would you say to someone who doesn't have a natural affinity for the type of music that you sing? Someone who's definitely more drawn or is just more used to the classic Jewish music, hears the genre that you're singing and it's not a natural sound for them as much and they're not I I'd say like as naturally drawn for it. What would you tell them to encourage them to try out the music, to listen to the words, to allow themselves to get lost in the messages that you're teaching? Well, you know, it's a it's a it's one of the things like you ever see people like a lot of times when they want to taste a brand new dish, right? Um the way to taste a brand new dish is not really going like this taking your mouth to the tip of the spoon and going you know, something like that. You can't taste it. You don't know what it tastes like yet. Until you until you eat something with confidence like you know it's good, right? And sometimes you got to eat it with confidence sometimes and know it's good to know whether or not you like it or not. Once you put the whole, you know, soup in your mouth, right? You put the whole soup in and then you can, you know, taste it and then after that you swallow it, you you see if there's an aftertaste and then you go, "Okay, that's either good or it's not good." A lot of people don't they hear something they go, "Oh, no, no, no, no, that's not me. That's not me. That's me." So, I think the biggest thing is, you know, um is to is to really go all in, you know, to to turn on the music, to listen to it, to not be around anybody as much as you can. That's how I used to I I love listening to music when nobody else is around. And to really try to get a grasp and and understand the hochma of it. That's our That's our job really is is yidden is to see the hochma of Hashem in every single thing, let alone in music and niggun. And and and, you know, someone who's who's really pouring their heart into music, I think it's really really uh um um uh much so a necessity to try to listen to it and try to find the hochma in things that we may not understand so well. Nissim, you're absolutely amazing. We can't thank you enough for joining us behind us going a little bit behind the bima. I knew you were a great musician. I love your music, uh but you're an even more phenomenal human being and a real source of inspiration. You said a lot that touched me very deeply and I know everyone listening is going to be rethinking a lot in their life and following your journey and inspiring their own. So, thank you for all that you do. Thank you for being not only a great musician, but a great a great role model, a great human being. We're looking forward to seeing you in Boca on your uh special tour. Everybody should check out the Bright Lights Tour. nissanblack.com learn more, get on. And uh we're looking forward to having you back again, together maybe with Yossi Sidler or others, and to continuing this conversation. It is so so inspiring. Thank you so much for your time with us and wishing you all of Hashem's blessings for you, for your family, continuing doing what you're doing, continuing bringing a bright bright light into this world. Amen. Amen. Baruch Hashem. Thank you so much. you guys. Thank you. Looking forward. Can't wait. The great Nissim Black, one of a kind. He's unbelievable. Skyler, why don't you dance? I already got a minute GIF, what do you call it? Somebody already did. Yeah, GIF. It's okay. I had a brain freeze. So, you danced, I had a brain freeze. We need Rabbi Brody to do something embarrassing tonight. You can't listen to this and not move. There you go, Rabbi Brody. Check it out, that mother land. muted. I didn't realize I was muted. Wow. I was singing. You can't I love that. I love that interview. What an inspiration. Wow, he's special. He's special. What's interesting is when you watch the videos, he's covered in the fur, the streimel, this little like gangster Hasidic a gangster look. And when you talk to him, he's just down-to-earth. I'm kidding. He's earth, he's real. He's humble, he's deep. As uh our good friend, one of our as one of our good friends and avid listeners said, Daniel Oppenheimer, the tagline takeaway from the interview is be on team Hashem. I love I love it, right? I'm on team Hashem. I felt When he describes, he goes, I fell in love with Hashem. Just fell in love with Hashem. Fell in love with the Jewish people. It's like, wow. Wow. Listen, I loved his description of his boat it is about that real, raw, authentic, genuine relationship with Hashem, spending hours just talking to Hashem. Obviously, that's something very refreshing for our generation. And I also loved how he spoke very honestly about the ego, his fear coming back to music, and not wanting to revert back to the old Nissim pre-conversion, but really wanted to become that new person, was afraid what would happen when and leaned back into music, with the with the fame, with the lyrics, with all of that entire genre as you spoke about at the end. And so, um he was very honest about some of the challenges along the way. When he spoke about we talked about racism and anti-Semitism and he spoke about his daughter not getting into school cuz of the color of her skin, this is what blew me away. I began to feel rage on his behalf. I began to feel anger. But then I was listening to his words and he was basically saying, "Look, that's a problem with them. This is what Hashem wants. He doesn't want her there. He wants her in the right place. I can either get distracted and consumed with anger at the person who gets it wrong or I could realize you do you, you be you even if I think it's wrong. I'm going to find the right place." So, his ability to stay calm, to stay focused, to see Hashem even in what was a frustrating situation, it's emunah in practice. Right, but I love how he also describes Sorry, yeah. No, I was just going to say I love how he how he phrased it as like they don't have time for avdus Yisrael. You know, like it's a little bit of a dig, you know, which is He said the the curriculum, you know. I'm saying they don't have time for curriculum avdus Yisrael. I also thought it was great when he spoke at the beginning about people of the book. We call ourselves the people of the book and yet we don't actually learn the book. And you can't expect to be on fire and to fall in love with something unless you study it, unless you envelop yourself in it, unless you dive headfirst. So, I thought that was a a great interview. I don't want to allow the Nissan Black interview to go without thanking first of all our friend Stewie Wax. We really appreciate it. Our dear friend Stewie here in our community. Stewie actually spent his life and career involved in music and made the connection for us to be able to have Nissan on. So, thankful to Stewie. Um check out Nissan's tour, the Bright Lights Tour. He's going to be in Boca. Get your tickets. It's a small venue. So, Bright Lights Tour here in Boca, nissanblack.com. You can find it at nissanblack.com. Another thank you to our sponsor, Areivut, doing amazing things, core Jewish values, chesed, tzedakah, tikkun olam. Go to areivut, a r e y v u t.org. Find out more about what they're doing. Find them on social media and uh big thank you to the ones who represent me some also who got us on. So I'm not necessarily winding down. We could sit the rest of the night and talk. I just wanted to make sure to remember to thank all those people. Let's talk about music for a second cuz we know Rabbi Goldberg loves music. We saw that at the beginning with his bipping and bopping. That's already a GIF that'll be viral on the internet. But Rabbi Brody, you Have you ever regretted something while you were in the middle of doing it? Yeah, it's called the brain freeze I had at the end there. I was like, do I do I try to Anyways, what I mean That's evidence for our for our listeners and and viewers that we're coming to you live. We're coming to you live. We're coming to that's the story of every day of my life. No, but Rabbi Brody, you more than anyone I know are a music guy. I don't think I've ever seen you when you're not tapping, when your foot's not tapping, your hand's not tapping. The songs are going through my head right now. song. So explain to our listeners, what is music? Cuz I'm not like that. I happen to not I like music, but not to the extent that you do. What does music mean for you? What does it do for you? Why is it so much a part of your life? I think it's like what he said. He said all music has a source of kedusha and obviously there different levels and there's different understandings of what that means, but he did quote uh you know, I think it was Rabbi Baba Sali's grandson or someone that was that's obviously uh knows what he's talking about. But but there is there is something very special about music and in the same way that when I watch not necessarily you guys, but there are people that are very into sports and they they get excited. My son, right? He gets looks forward to the next Dolphin game. He looks forward to the next uh you know, Heat game. It's great. And I'm get Again, I'm not putting Torah out of the picture. You should get very excited about Torah and you should be more more learning Torah than than than than doing things like that. But uh you know, for for for a healthy break to get re-energized um you know, in the same way that you can't imagine why someone wouldn't be excited about a football game, I can't even fathom why someone wouldn't want to listen to some really good music. And obviously there's many different types of music out there. I'm endorsing one over the other, but there's something that just music does to you. It's it's it it picks you up. It puts you in a place. Every when when I'm looking to get focused on something, I can't do it without music. And if I can't find the music, like on Shameless, I'm telling you just push play right here. It's it's calling me. I If I'm alone, I'm There's not a moment I'm not singing. You don't hear me singing because it's I'm cuz I won't do it in front of you, but I just love it. I I can't help it. when you're in the car, you could put on a podcast, radio, or sheer, or but music you'd rather you could listen to music. Music I just could because it's not about the music. It's about what the music does to you and the place it brings you to. I can't explain it. It's just like it's a place you want to be. Will you listen to different music depending on your mood on your mood? Absolutely. Absolutely. Your playlists or different artists or different types of music depending on your mood? yeah, but it's funny cuz like I always wonder and you know, the music I I play is obviously the music I grew up with. Um to me that's that's that's a that's like that's that that's all the music and I can't imagine why people wouldn't like that music. But I wonder if I grew up in this generation or I grew up, you know, in the '60s or '50s or if I would like that music better. I don't know. I It's music's strange like that. It's it's you know, even tonight right before the show I was playing I took out my guitar and I was playing two songs. And I just thought it was so interesting. These two songs I love. I love these two songs. I'm playing the same It's exactly the same chords and it's exactly the same chord progression. your genre? What's your What's your go-to genre of of music? That's so easy to tell. I mean, it's like 1985 to 1993. Anything rock, pop. It's right smack in that. Yeah, and And what do you not get? Like do you not get rap? Reggae, rap? Ah, it's so hard. You know, it's interesting cuz rap music owes a lot to rock and roll. There's something called the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. I don't know. It's It's I guess what you would call the Baseball Hall of Fame in in Youngstown, Ohio, wherever that is, you know. Where they put the the rock and roll but but but there was a rap artist that got Isn't the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Lawrence, New York, isn't it? I've seen signs. Cleveland. Cleveland. Oh, so what's in what's in Lawrence off of Broadway? There's a sign to that. Maybe that's a kosher restaurant. Maybe that's like the rock paper rock paper scissor hall of fame. and roll with the sushi place. Oh, that's what it is. Okay. No, but there was something amazing that happened at a recent rock and roll Hall of Fame where you had a a a a rapper that got up and he and he uh he gave his whole thank you speech, you know, thank you to God and thank you to everyone. And at the end of the speech, he said, "You know what? We rappers would be nowhere without rock and roll." And it's interesting if you think about the name, right? The name is the rock and roll Hall of Fame. It's not the rap Hall of Fame. There's no rap Hall of Fame. But yet there's a hakaras hatov because everything that they were taking has been built on the shoulders of the giants that came before them. So it's there's like this this evolution that's been built you feel when we talk about sports? Yes, I get so excited. No, you you relate to this about music. I know I do. Not to the extent not to the extent I've never the carbonas had to be offered with with music, you know, the gemara had Music was everywhere and we shut it out. No, of course I love music. I love singing. Put me in a good shul shuldis. I love that. Um I just I don't even I don't speak the language though the same way Rabbi Brody speaks language and you and I both know that. We'll be giving a drasha and all of a sudden you'll you'll what's that tapping noise? And you'll look behind you at the middle of the drasha and Rabbi Brody is either sitting there with his finger he's tapping or with his foot he's tapping. You know, I know Brody for many years. There's a song going in his head. Brody will tell you. I I know him for many years. We'll find ourselves somewhere where like also that's when he's checked out of a meeting or something. Is that the fingers the tapping? I just turn to my guy. I go I go what song? And he'll tell me. And also we play name that tune. Where I've never seen anything like this. We I don't think we got more than two chords into a song, and you were able to name any song. Any song. With one note. of a certain genre. But the point is, we've all had that experience that music transcends music, yeah. You could be in the middle of like a store and a song comes on and you're back in seventh grade on your Washington trip, or you're back on the bus at camp, or you're back on your Israel program, or you're with your family in the back of the station wagon looking backwards. You know, how it was. But the music transcends time, space. It transports you and and in the positive sense true too, you know. You hear a Jewish song and you're like, I remember that simcha, I remember that dance, I remember that simchas Torah, I remember that that zemmer, I remember that shalom shalom like you were saying at tish. It's very powerful. It can transport you in ways that other things can't. That's why when he was just doing that rap, when he just did those two lines or three lines from the song he's about to release, there's something so poetic about the words. I can't It might not be your type of music, but you just got to look It's not just he's reading. He's not just reading words a couple sentences and and then putting them together. There is there is emotion, there is the rhyme, there is the feeling and it if you didn't see it, then you weren't listening. It's an interesting genre though, the whole rap, because I I was listening to him and I'm thinking like he's basically saying a poem. It's just a poem with a little beat to it, like a little a poem with a little rhyme, which is not a criticism. No, no, no, I'm saying it is more than that, but it was that that's in fact to me sometimes more beautiful than other music, because the rap essentially since it really foundationally I think is a poem, it's direct from his heart. You know, the the like you said, the words and what he said at the end, that it's the most meaningful for him when someone says, "You gave me the vocabulary. My soul's been trying to say that, but it didn't have the words. And now you gave the words. You gave the words." Well, you say that at every funeral. You know, why do you start with the hillum? Why do you start with David Hamelach? It's because like you can't you struggle to find the words and David Hamelach he gave them to you. The first rapper. Right? I'm saying he gave you the word. That's going to be That's going to be quoted later, yeah. Yeah. I'll have to mention that in my class tomorrow. That would have been a mouth. Yeah, music is powerful. Not everybody gets it. Not everybody gets it. We We used to have a member of our staff who since moved who didn't get music at all. He might have run a certain minyan for a certain age group in the community, and there was no singing, there was no song, there was no music. So, I once said to him, "What do you mean, carbonus? I Levi'im shir, we say it every day. Shir shel Levi'im Bais Hamikdash." All right. And he said to me, he goes, "What was that again?" "Hashir shel Levi'im hayu omrim B'veit Hamikdash." It was the song they would say, not sing. So, some people music just does nothing. They're They're tone deaf. They don't hear the music. And you all you hear is music. Right. And then there are musical people. I mean, you got this impression from Nissan, too. He's like, when he walks outside and the birds are chirping and the wind, the leaves are rustling, he's at the ocean, the wind the the waves are splashing, that's music. That's God's playlist. There's music, like the whole nature of the world, it's just it's music, it's harmony, it's all integrated. What's interesting is that you describe that, you know, as a rabbi, when you walk out into the world, you see drashas all around, and you see posts and what can be an article. So, I would imagine that a singer or an artist like Nissan Black walks out and sees poetry, he sees songs, he sees beats, he sees opportunities to engage all of those senses the same way you and I do it. We just channel it towards drashas, he's channeling it towards either poetry or putting it to music. What's interesting is that when you talk about his favorite artist or who influences him, he loved Ishay Ribo cuz Ishay Ribo Ishay Ribo was also a poet. He's He's a modern-day paytan. It's not being delivered through rap, but it's also he he's a poet. It's okay, his child came in during the episode. I'm trying to get AJ. We're live. Sorry. Not a problem. Do you want to a problem. Yeah. All right, closing thoughts, gentlemen, before you wrap it up. Inspired. Totally inspired. Yeah, it's a good Team Hashem. We are on team Hashem. We got to do a better job of talking to him. Can Can I Can I say I guess the one thing that I was just think thinking about the whole interview is that, you know, we all of us have so many unique talents. And you know, sometimes you wonder like how could I use this to benefit the Jewish community or the Jewish world? And you just see something so so extreme that you would say this is never This guy's never going to break in in in in any meaningful way. But it just shows you you can. God gave you something special. Make it happen. True. I also want to acknowledge and thank our new friend Eli Goldsmith who helped organize tonight of Unity Inspires Project. Uh grateful to him and his booking agency Unity Booking. So, thank you for that as well. Again, to our sponsor Ari Vou check it out. Support them. Help them make the difference that they're making. Even the way he just talked about his life was poetry. It didn't have the rhythm of a rap, but but that imagery of He said, "Now Avram at the slaughter Yitzchak, I thought I'd to slaughter my knees in his career. That was my akedah moment." But just like the malach stopped Avram, he stopped me. And I was meant to still play music. Just What What a way to look at life. Yeah. What a way to look at life. You're not going to look at life that way if you're always busy hisbodedus. I'm sure he had that thought on a walk through the forest. Right. So, I would love to talk about maybe in a future episode. I I had a Zoom meeting last week with our friend our former colleague here in Boca, by Adam Englard. And I hope it's okay I'm I'm calling him out, but he's gotten into hisbodedus and he wanted to talk about how we can get hisbodedus part of a conversation and a curriculum in Jewish education in shuls. And um I What's fascinating is that there's a whole world who are cynical, they'll never do hisbodedus, which is what Nisim was talking about, personal prayer, being alone, disconnecting to talk to Hashem. He's right in front of you, your best friend, casually, comfortably. Um There's a whole world who will never buy into it, they're cynical. And there's a world who buy into it and are doing it. Nisim Black and so on. There's a whole world in the middle like us who study a little bit about it, we've even spoken about it, taught about it, believe in it, claim we want to do it every day, and something holding us back. What's holding us back from putting the phone on airplane mode and sitting for 3 4 5 minutes a day? We're not going to talk about an hour, 2 3 hours a day. We're talking about 3 minutes a day. Right. There's no one on planet Earth who can claim they don't have 3 minutes a day, and yet there's some there's some obstacle. There's some there's something clogging us there's something holding us back. Why aren't we doing it? He is doing it. You heard the way he talked about it. And and it's clear that his view vision I think some of the clarity of the way he looks at and views his life is a result of that is part of this. So maybe next time or in the future time we'll talk a little bit about what's holding us back, but friends, thank you so much again. Until next time, stay happy, stay healthy, stay holy. We're going to have Nissan take us out tonight. Come on Rabbi Moscowitz. Anyone wants the GIF, just email me and I'm happy to send it. show us those balls. Go Rabbi Moscowitz. Why did you guys ask the last question? All right everyone, stay happy, stay healthy, stay holy.